Develop Bugs

Upgrading from the Dash - Ideal phone?

I've had my Dash for close to 2 years now and I really like it. I'm using Ricky's ROMset and found that a huge improvement.
Despite this, I feel the need to upgrade to get 3G data speed and be able to use my phone in Japan when I visit. It feels weird to be using old hardware but I've tried a bunch of new phones and always come back to the Dash. In order:
S710/Vox - didn't like the keyboard and the "cursor" was on the wrong side for me
Touch Dual - no WiFi and no full keyboard
Pantech Duo - nice enough, but no wifi and I didn't like the keyboard feel.
Nokia E71 - it surprised me after thinking WinMo was a difficult experience to go to this new Nokia phone and find the s/w to be a complete disaster! Great h/w design though - just about perfect.
Palm Pro - nice enough but I was surprised to find that WinMo Professional was a pain - much harder to use than Standard
HP iPaq 910 - just pathetic - terrible keyboard, lots of bugs, and WinMo Professional
Samsung Omnia - a disaster - terrible UI buggy hardware
I've also tried the iPhone - which is great - but I really want to stick to a device with a keyboard.
So, all of this leads me to ask about what device can possibly be an upgrade from my beloved Dash. What better place to ask but on this Forum of Excalibur lovers?
So, here's my ideal phone:
Must have:
1. Full keyboard like the Dash - no sliders
2. Quad band GSM
3. Tri-band UMTS
4. WiFi
5. Windows Mobile Standard - or at the very least a high focus on usability with one hand without resorting to the ridiculous stylus.
6. Charging and connection to PC via mini-USB, no special cables
7. GPS
8. Good camera 3M or greater
9. Display that works in bright sunlight
Nice to have
10. Scrolling dial on the side like Blackberry
11. Big battery
12. Led for camera
13. Video cam on front
14. Wifi on/off button
Does such a phone exist? I doubt it! To many companies chasing iPhone UI and doing a terrible job of it, and forgetting the basics.
Interested in your thoughts on this. BTW, I don't want to go Blackberry because key apps are not available for them.
Thanks,
D

what about the g1? has a few of your required features.

possibly blackjack III (AT&T though) should be rumored to be coming out soon.
Sadly, you're asking for too robust of a machine. maybe one of the blackberrys has all that but i dont follow them.

Palm Treo Pro? I'm not greatly familiar with its specs but it looks pretty solid, might be worth checking out.

I do not recommend the G1, I prefer the dash over the G1 because its sorta boring now the G1... However, I really like the 3G feature on the G1...

jdoggraz said:
I do not recommend the G1, I prefer the dash over the G1 because its sorta boring now the G1... However, I really like the 3G feature on the G1...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i've only read/heard reviews. not actually had one in my hand. i think the potential is amazing. i'll most likely be in the market for a phone in september, hopefully there's a new version by then.

Samsung Epix?

Thanks for all the replies.
Samsung Blackjack III is a WinMo Professional phone, which in my opinion is an inferior OS from the usability standpoint.
I tried the Palm Treo Pro and returned it. Nice device but WinMo professional. It had almost everything I wanted though.
G1 is a big keyboard slider and there are likely much better Android phones coming along.
Haven't heard of the Samsung Epix...will check it out (Edit: Ok, looks like this is just the Blackjack III).
I am leaning towards checking out the old HTC Cavalier too. While I ignored it because of bad review before, it turns out there is a WinMo 6.1 cooked ROM available. This will give me a Dash experience, but with tri-band 3G and a faster processor.

darkfinger said:
Thanks for all the replies.
Samsung Blackjack III is a WinMo Professional phone, which in my opinion is an inferior OS from the usability standpoint.
I tried the Palm Treo Pro and returned it. Nice device but WinMo professional. It had almost everything I wanted though.
G1 is a big keyboard slider and there are likely much better Android phones coming along.
Haven't heard of the Samsung Epix...will check it out (Edit: Ok, looks like this is just the Blackjack III).
I am leaning towards checking out the old HTC Cavalier too. While I ignored it because of bad review before, it turns out there is a WinMo 6.1 cooked ROM available. This will give me a Dash experience, but with tri-band 3G and a faster processor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The BlackJack 3 looks like a really sick phone, I would love to get that...

i moved on to the iphone.. it's the best phone upgrade i've ever made.

the htc tyten2

I am waiting until Feb-March for the Android phones coming out. The G2 should be coming out around that time. It will be the HTC Touch HD w/Android. Should be sweet. IF you have a little more patience, wait for the nuvifone or nuvifone w/android .

kr33mo said:
I am waiting until Feb-March for the Android phones coming out. The G2 should be coming out around that time. It will be the HTC Touch HD w/Android. Should be sweet. IF you have a little more patience, wait for the nuvifone or nuvifone w/android .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol the g2 bro? no......
u think there actually going to come out with a g2 less then a year after the g1? there not even done updating the bugs....
I THINK you should get the HTC Fuze A.K.A. touch pro
att phone but unlockable *like mine* for tmobile

Universal!!
Even is not new but can beat more of the newest devices

Doesn't cover every one of your requirements, but the HTC S740 comes close.
http://www.htc.com/www/product/s740/overview.html

The new g2 phone??
Comments and rumors about a g2 already in the works a floating all over the web, the're also saying that they will be getting rid of the slide full querty key board but this was the only thing that I found with pics of an actual device called the dream/g2 phone, if it's true or not , that's up to time to say, cause eventually we'll see if an official announcement is made.
check it out. http://www.wikio.com/article/85876255

roloracer said:
Comments and rumors about a g2 already in the works a floating all over the web, the're also saying that they will be getting rid of the slide full querty key board but this was the only thing that I found with pics of an actual device called the dream/g2 phone, if it's true or not , that's up to time to say, cause eventually we'll see if an official announcement is made.
check it out. http://www.wikio.com/article/85876255
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol, I don't think that will be the official g2. Looks like a chinese rip-off with android. And its absolutely nothing like the touch hd, like mentioned earlier. Nice find though

Time for Conjecture

As we all sit waiting patiently for our new devices, let's kick off the new forum with a little conjecture.
I am from the U S , always last on HTC's list. What carriers do you think are going to pick up the TP II. What carriers do you think it would be most popular with ? We got screwed out of the Touch HD and The X1.
Do you plan to upgrade to this phone from the Tilt , or Raphael ?
Do you think that it will be the most popular phone ever for HTC.
What else?
Oh yeah FIRST ! ( I know how immature )

The specs dont really shock me to be much better then the Fuze/TP. So i might be holding back on this one.

A 3.6" WVGA screen isn't an update to its specs?

jonnrb said:
A 3.6" WVGA screen isn't an update to its specs?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see this as the main advantage over the Tilt/Fuze (that speakerphone options is such a scam). I wish the they included a 5mp camera along with more RAM/ROM, however i'll be coming from a Tilt if i get this phone, so seems like it's well worth it.

I see people are already comparing the TP2 to the TP/Fuze. Folks, it's not actually a touch pro 2. THATS ONLY ITS NAME!!
It's way more like an HD with a keyboard than an upgrade from the touch pro. Almost everything about it is different from a TP; bigger screen, different screen resolution, no nav buttons.. just to name the major obvious diff's...
Since I have an HD now, I kinda like it, except it has no USA 3g freq's...
Cheers...
--Jesse

I , myself was on my way to a N97 until HTC announced this. If you marginally upgrade the specs, but take away my tilt screen ( Fuze ), that is not an update to me.
I don't like symbian all that much, so the TP II is definitely the upgrade I was looking for.

i'm using a hermes and i've been waiting to get a new one since the tytn II. now i'm gonna take a brave step and buy the tp2. you could be waiting forever saying "its not that much of an improvement".
their probably doing the same as apple, in fact more generous, throwing in little improvements in to newly released devices. i

SomethingWicked said:
I see people are already comparing the TP2 to the TP/Fuze. Folks, it's not actually a touch pro 2. THATS ONLY ITS NAME!!
It's way more like an HD with a keyboard than an upgrade from the touch pro. Almost everything about it is different from a TP; bigger screen, different screen resolution, no nav buttons.. just to name the major obvious diff's...
Since I have an HD now, I kinda like it, except it has no USA 3g freq's...
Cheers...
--Jesse
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HD didn't have TV out!!

denco7 said:
I , myself was on my way to a N97 until HTC announced this. If you marginally upgrade the specs, but take away my tilt screen ( Fuze ), that is not an update to me.
I don't like symbian all that much, so the TP II is definitely the upgrade I was looking for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The main disadvantages the TPII has compared to say the N97 is the fact it is heavier and weaker on the multimedia production front with a weaker camera and video recording abilities.

the tp2 isn't worth for me to buy.
I will wait another year and a half when the more demanding devices will be coming.
With more demanding i mean devices that can run WM 7.
So a little bit patience, and if you want some stuff like tf3d2 or some other thing you like. just cook it and you can have what you want.
my 2 cents

denco7 said:
As we all sit waiting patiently for our new devices, let's kick off the new forum with a little conjecture.
I am from the U S , always last on HTC's list. What carriers do you think are going to pick up the TP II. What carriers do you think it would be most popular with ? We got screwed out of the Touch HD and The X1.
Do you plan to upgrade to this phone from the Tilt , or Raphael ?
Do you think that it will be the most popular phone ever for HTC.
What else?
Oh yeah FIRST ! ( I know how immature )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are not the las on the list, here in Mexico and Latin America we are the las of the list! even later than you and more expensive!
I´ll try to get one when I travel to Europe...sacrifing the 3G conectivity
I´m plannint to upgrade from Universal, but to be honest the actual specs of the phones does not are much better in some aspects than to my 2005 Uni...
Shazad.K said:
the tp2 isn't worth for me to buy.
I will wait another year and a half when the more demanding devices will be coming.
With more demanding i mean devices that can run WM 7.
So a little bit patience, and if you want some stuff like tf3d2 or some other thing you like. just cook it and you can have what you want.
my 2 cents
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are wise mate!
That is the best decision!
I`ll do the same I think...
4 years waiting to upgrade and nothing really amazing has apeared till now...
I´m still loving my Uni!

I'm from the US too and I'm sick of HTC not coming out with phones supported the US's 3G Bands 850 and 1900, and now 1700 with T-Mobile. From HTC's website, it looks like all the neat new phones (the ones with the big screens) will be debuting in 900 and 2100 3G frequencies for Asia and Europe. I simply cannot understand why HTC doesn't continue make phones that will work on both 3G in Europe and the U.S. The TyTn (Hermes) and TyTN II (Kaiser) both worked on 3G networks in the U.S. and Europe (this is where I travel mostly).
It cannot be that expensive to include a few more 3G frequencies in each of these devices. I wish someone would explain to me whey HTC is taking this route. I have two theories. First, the U.S. carriers want to sell the phones directly and lock their customers into 2 year contracts. So to prevent us from buying European versions of the phones, the U.S. carriers have colluded with HTC to limit the 3G frequencies in the phones.
The second theory is that IP Whore Qualcomm doesn't want to pay royalties to Broadcomm over the patents Qualcomm has been violating for years. As you all know, Qualcomm is making most of the boards for HTC phones (such as the Kaiser, Touch Pro, Blackstone, and Touch Pro2.) To avoid the patent royalties, they just don't offer the offending products in the U.S.
Neither of these reasons seem like good ones. The U.S. carriers are finally waking up to the fact that they need to compete by actually offering more services at a lower price. AT&T is finally offering the I-Phone without contract. T-Mobile is offering some good month to month contracts also.
If the Qualcomm patent mess is the problem, Qualcomm should just pay Broadcomm the fracking licensing fees and charge HTC a couple more bucks per phone which can be passed on to the customer. (Yes, we will pay $5.00 more per phone to get a decent one).
If HTC doesn't get its crap together and take care of its U.S. customer base, I hope that Acer or Dell or someone comes along with some great WinMo or Android devices and cleans HTC's clock. I've been waiting for years for an HTC device with a larger screen. I love HTC but the love is fading fast.

I have given up on AT&T getting anything cool in a timely manner. You pretty much count on a new HTC phone coming out atleast 6months or more after Europe gets it.
I have been running a Touch HD on Edge with ATT since it became available online. I love the Touch HD much more than the Touch Pro I had. 2.5G speed internet is fast enough for me and I don't live in a 3G area anyway.
I value screen size and XDA support the most. The Touch pro2 seems appetizing, because I miss my hardware keyboard, but not worth going from a 3.8" screen to a 3.6" for the same hardware and keyboard.
I am holding out for the Toshiba Tg01 with the 4.1" screen and 1Ghz snapdragon processor. Finally will be able to play divx and movies smoothly, plus an even bigger screen. As long as XDA has plenty of ROM support for this phone when it comes out..I am so getting it! I'll just have to settle for Edge speed again.
I will never go back to a 2.8" screen again just to have 3G speed. 3.8" has spoiled me royally and its so much easier to read text/emails with.

T-Mobile!!
thank god the touch pro 2 is coming to tmo. laksjdf. its about time we got an upgrade to the wing. :]. as for the other services, good luck, hope you get it too.

utvol06 said:
I have given up on AT&T getting anything cool in a timely manner. You pretty much count on a new HTC phone coming out atleast 6months or more after Europe gets it.
I have been running a Touch HD on Edge with ATT since it became available online. I love the Touch HD much more than the Touch Pro I had. 2.5G speed internet is fast enough for me and I don't live in a 3G area anyway.
I value screen size and XDA support the most. The Touch pro2 seems appetizing, because I miss my hardware keyboard, but not worth going from a 3.8" screen to a 3.6" for the same hardware and keyboard.
I am holding out for the Toshiba Tg01 with the 4.1" screen and 1Ghz snapdragon processor. Finally will be able to play divx and movies smoothly, plus an even bigger screen. As long as XDA has plenty of ROM support for this phone when it comes out..I am so getting it! I'll just have to settle for Edge speed again.
I will never go back to a 2.8" screen again just to have 3G speed. 3.8" has spoiled me royally and its so much easier to read text/emails with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally agree with your sentiments. I hate that damn 2.8" screen. I've been using my old Blue Angel with a great WM6.1 ROM at home. It still rocks. I prefer using it over my Kaiser just because of the large screen. I just hope that they will get these devices out to the U.S. fast. I'd love it if I could buy a Rhodium or Superstar which would work on either T-Mobiles or AT&Ts network (I.e., 850, 1700, 1900 bands).

I would love to get this phone but I guess im just indecisive.. or am I?
65k screen.. 3.2MP camera with no flash.. 512MB Internal Memory.. No real upgrade on the processor = Real let down
Does this phone have the tilt control like the ipod? or just the accellarometer for screen rotation (i know it has that).
It looks beautiful with the metal band around to side but the more I look at the specs the more im starting to be put off by it. Yeah they bumped up the screen and gave it better conferencing functions but does it really do enough to outweigh the downsides.
I think we should all chip in our pocketmoney and build the perfect phone
Mine would have a 1GB processor, 3.6inch WVGA 256k touchscreen, 32GB Internal memory, 8MP Camera with xenon flash, Windows Mobile operating system, slide out and tilt keyboard. Err cant think of anything else right now but that would make me pretty happy, if anyone wants to add to the list then feel free and we will get right to work on it
Ohh btw Denco I know you like mixing it up in the threads haha

I don't think that this will be released on ATT any time soon if at all, however, it should be coming up on T-Mobile due to something found in one of the ROMs.
The TP2 is pretty nice, but not much of an upgrade to the Fuze I have right now, just a bigger, better screen, a better keyboard, tilt, and official free WM 6.5 upgrade. If it was the best phone on the market then I would get it, but I think im going with either the Omnia HD, the SE Idou (If it comes out within 3 months ), or the TG01. Hopefully XDA will support the TG01.

adeltaY said:
I don't think that this will be released on ATT any time soon if at all, however, it should be coming up on T-Mobile due to something found in one of the ROMs.
The TP2 is pretty nice, but not much of an upgrade to the Fuze I have right now, just a bigger, better screen, a better keyboard, tilt, and official free WM 6.5 upgrade. If it was the best phone on the market then I would get it, but I think im going with either the Omnia HD, the SE Idou (If it comes out within 3 months ), or the TG01. Hopefully XDA will support the TG01.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OOO the Omnia HD looks SAWEEEETT!! OLED screen with 16 Million colours but no keyboard and a symbian operating system puts me of it..
Love the 12MP camera on the Idou but again the lack of slieout keyboard and the symbian OS lets it down for me.. I might be able to get over the operating system but I NEED my slide out keyboard for writing documents on the go.
Ughh whats a man to do haha

utvol06 said:
I have given up on AT&T getting anything cool in a timely manner. You pretty much count on a new HTC phone coming out atleast 6months or more after Europe gets it.
I have been running a Touch HD on Edge with ATT since it became available online. I love the Touch HD much more than the Touch Pro I had. 2.5G speed internet is fast enough for me and I don't live in a 3G area anyway.
I value screen size and XDA support the most. The Touch pro2 seems appetizing, because I miss my hardware keyboard, but not worth going from a 3.8" screen to a 3.6" for the same hardware and keyboard.
I am holding out for the Toshiba Tg01 with the 4.1" screen and 1Ghz snapdragon processor. Finally will be able to play divx and movies smoothly, plus an even bigger screen. As long as XDA has plenty of ROM support for this phone when it comes out..I am so getting it! I'll just have to settle for Edge speed again.
I will never go back to a 2.8" screen again just to have 3G speed. 3.8" has spoiled me royally and its so much easier to read text/emails with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. 2.8" I can totally understand and I'm ACHING to get rid of my Titan for a nice large screen. However, is the difference between 3.6" and 3.8" really that big? Now if I had a touch HD I probably just wouldn't see enough difference between the two to switch. However, the screen wouldn't be the reason for me. Also, I'm wanting bigger and bigger screens too. 4.1" might be a little overkill for the pocket, but 3.8" is deffinitly fine.
2. Is the hardware on the HD (same as TP2 as you said) really not good enough to run full res videos smoothly? Is you device optimized through all the known XDA-Dev ways? This makes me a little nervous because I'm really hoping for this on the TP2. Does the TP2 have proper Hardware acceleration drivers? I'm hoping the TP2 will.
Edit: After thinking about it some I take back my comment about the 4.1" screen. That might actually be the perfect size once they get the edges of the device right up to the screen. 4.1" WVGA is actually the same width as the iPhone (2.1"), but it's a full .7" longer. I wouldn't be surprised to see the next iPhone with a 4.1" WVGA screen. That would be positively sick! I guess I'll still be constantly looking to the future even after getting a TP2

mskip said:
I think we should all chip in our pocketmoney and build the perfect phone
Mine would have a 1GB processor, 3.6inch WVGA 256k touchscreen, 32GB Internal memory, 8MP Camera with xenon flash, Windows Mobile operating system, slide out and tilt keyboard. Err cant think of anything else right now but that would make me pretty happy, if anyone wants to add to the list then feel free and we will get right to work on it
Ohh btw Denco I know you like mixing it up in the threads haha
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Personally, I'm holding out for one of these.

Upgrading from Titan... Should I get a TP2?

Hey,
I have Verizon and currently have a XV6800 (Titan). I have loved the phone, I got it the first week it came out and it has never let me down. I flashed it when the ROMs first came available, and I use all the features the phone has: keyboard, touchscreen, bluetooth, GPS, Wifi, etc...
My contract expires on the 11th of this month, and I've been due for a phone upgrade for quite some time now. I can get the TP2 for $99 with no other fees, because I work for Goodyear and we have a corporate thing set up with them.
My question is: should I get the TP2? It's obvious that there's a lot of custom ROMs out there and the hardware looks great. I just don't want to buy this phone and another one come out a month from now that's better. I understand that phones are always being released and they become outdated weeks after their purchase, but I don't want to miss out on anything cool.
-Randy

If you love your Titan that much, I don't know what's stopping you from upgrading to the TP2. It's the Titan on steroids with a gorgeous 800 X 480 screen. The keyboard is much improved as well (I had that keyboard with the grid layout on my Mogul, and I barely used it). In fact, the soft keyboard even much improved and usable. Battery life is also improved.
The only real drawback from the Titan is the lack of a DPad (VolDPad does a pretty good job of turning the volume rocker keys into a DPad).
BTW, video playback on the TP2 is outstanding (TP2 does full DVD resolutions). Totally kicks ass over the iPod.

There will always be something better/newer coming down the road. Could be a month... could be 6... couid be 12 months. I don't think we'll be getting really new in the short term.
The TP2 is far and away the best WM phones I ever handled. I ver glad I moved to it from my Kaiser. Heck I'm glad I skipped the original TouchPro and waited for the TP2.
The HD2/Leo looks nice but not being able to use a stylus and lack of a keyboard just might keep me away. I like writing hand written notes in my note pad.

The other thing too is that the Touch Pro 2 just came out, so it should be quite a while until it is surpassed (but 3 months ago if you were to ask to buy a Touch Pro, I'd easily tell you to wait b/c of the Touch Pro 2...that and Verizon nubbed up the TP1 with locking the GPS and removing RAM). I'd say go for it!
Jason

Thanks for the good info.
Does this phone have a dedicated graphics accelerator?

I went from an XV6800 (titan) to a Tilt2 on AT&T...
Network sucking issues aside, the TouchPro2 is a GREAT phone and an amazing upgrade the the Titan.
I stayed away from the original TouchPro/Fuze phones because I didnt think they were a massive upgrade, only more RAM which helped run TF3D, but no WinMo6.5, and not much in terms of real improvement.
I love WinMo6.5, I love the TF3D 2.1, and the ram and speed of the new Tilt2 is noticeably faster than a Titan.
Oh, and did I mention the AMAZING screen improvement?
Upgrade. You wont be disappointed.

I was on a mogul, which then i went to the touch pro, and now I'm on the touch pro 2. The single biggest upgrade from the mogul, to the touch pro was the ram. Running Opera Mobile on the mogul was hell. It's a great browser on the touch pro although i preferred the speed of opera mini. The other big improvement was the resolution/ lack of recession on the screen. Notice how it's rather difficult to hit the task manager button on the top right of the screen? That was fixed in the touch pro.
The biggest improvements from the touch pro to the touch pro 2, for me, have been the increased screen size and the keyboard. The Keyboard is ****ing amazing. No more of those little bubble keys that were present in the mogul/touch pro. I still haven't heard anyone talk about the change from bubble keys, to actual keys that depress when you press down on them. Sure the offsetness and size of the keys is great, but the fact that they are actual buttons that depress when pressed sold me. The speaker phone is much nicer as well.
Don't forget that you also will get all the latest TF3D stuff as well until a new dominant resolution comes out (or we simply can't run it because of lack of clock speed). I'm currently running TF3D 2.5 and it adds loads of improvements over TF3D 2.1. The only problem currently with 2.5 is that it's sluggish in some areas such as the landscape transitions on music/pictures.
All in all I'd say hell ****ing yes to a mogul-to-pro2 upgrade. There was a big enough difference to ditch the mogul for the touch pro alone. Ram was always the biggest pain on the mogul, and now I can't find myself ever running out of ram even while leaving everything open. I don't have to fight with the device to have it do what I want it to do.

See.... I get all these good reviews from you guys here, and you're all saying "Go for it!" Then, I go in the Verizon store too look at it, and they don't have it. I guess none of the stores have them on display, and I have to have it shipped. On top of that, the sales guy convinced me to come in Friday morning to see the new Motorola Droid when it's released. They're gonna be the same price.... so I don't know what to get now...

No Vzn stores ever got the new phone. Yea the Droid looks like it can be quite nice, but at my heart I'm still a WM user at least for now (Android is probably my 2nd bet, then maybe WebOS, and the OSX mobile isn't an option for me).
If you want to play with one, go to a T-Mo or AT&T Store. My sprint store near me (and its a big one, with a repair center and everything) still doesn't have TP2's yet either :-/
Jason

myrandex said:
No Vzn stores ever got the new phone. Yea the Droid looks like it can be quite nice, but at my heart I'm still a WM user at least for now (Android is probably my 2nd bet, then maybe WebOS, and the OSX mobile isn't an option for me).
If you want to play with one, go to a T-Mo or AT&T Store. My sprint store near me (and its a big one, with a repair center and everything) still doesn't have TP2's yet either :-/
Jason
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know what... I'm ordering the TP2. Windows Mobile isn't perfect, but there's a huge community on here for it, and Android is new and still isn't quite perfect.
It's just like running any distro of linux on your computer. Sure, there's a lot of great versions out there, but none of them are perfect, and when something screws up, there's not always an easy fix.

One more thing about the TP2:
If you want to run emus, the offset keyboard gives you a reasonable rendition of a Dpad. Diagonals won't work, but it's more than adequate for JRPGs or any game that doesn't require twitch action.
I use W,A,S,D as a Dpad.

just wanted to update everyone who gave me their input - I got the TP2 and I'm in love with it. There's nothing I've tried to do thus far that I haven't been able to do. I've tried a few ROMs on it and I'm on the latest MightyROM right now ad it's great. Thanks again for the input guys!

Please help me decide HD2 or Touch Pro2

I would appreciate if anybody could give comparison between HD2 and Touch Pro2 because I am torn between the two models. I am now using Dopod 838pro (Tytn)
and want to upgrade coz my phone is "dying". Basically I like the HD2 for the speed and the screen but it don't have video call or macro mode. I like most of the spec in touch pro but it lack speed compare to HD2. So i guess someone who have used both of these models would know the pros and cons. Especially the speed of these two processor in real life. Any input would greatly appreciate

You should go for the HD2. The speeds of the TP2 is getting really anoying. And the fact that android is running very smooth on the HD2.
And there is the possiblity of a WP7 rom for the HD2 in the future.

The biggest decision you have to make is how much do you value a physical keyboard? If it's a big deal for you, then go for the Touch Pro2. If you don't care about a keyboard, then the HD2 is a far superior choice in terms of hardware as well as software development. HTC's website lists the specs of both machines. Keep in mind that the T-Mobile version of the HD2 has 1GB of internal storage as opposed to half of that on any other version of it.

my own opinion, go for TP2, it's qwerty hardware keyboard are valuable things to have, just like Your Hermes, it make different easy way related for daily working usage

Thanks for all the replies. My problem with HD2 is there is no secondary camera for video call. Then if I choose TP2, how bad is the speed, is it acceptable if compare to Hermes (Hermes is quite slow to me)?. Or is it just about the same?.
Well.... I think I have to choose TP2 for the secondary camera. If HD2 come with secondary camera that would be a dream. I have also look at other WinMo device such as Omnia Pro with the slide keyboard, secondary camera and 800MHz but not so good UI, and I like HTC more.

dx3me said:
Thanks for all the replies. My problem with HD2 is there is no secondary camera for video call. Then if I choose TP2, how bad is the speed, is it acceptable if compare to Hermes (Hermes is quite slow to me)?. Or is it just about the same?.
Well.... I think I have to choose TP2 for the secondary camera. If HD2 come with secondary camera that would be a dream. I have also look at other WinMo device such as Omnia Pro with the slide keyboard, secondary camera and 800MHz but not so good UI, and I like HTC more.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you are in the US, the second camera makes no difference as it will not work for video calling here. Video calls on the TP2 only work in Europe.

Ok dx3me, here's my personal opinion. I had previously purchased the Touch Pro2 because of its keyboard form factor as well as the front camera. I came from the Xda Exec/Htc Universal phone and this greatly influence my choise for the Tp2.
-->First complain edited since the TP2 can play smooth videos provided you know how to convert it with this tool--->http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=467112
Second complain is that the internet experience is not that great and after using a hd2, I really prefer its bigger screen as it delivers a new approach on how you can easily browse, email, chats and so on. Very stylish in the hands and its look is simply amazing - it will surely not go unnoticed by people around you due to its huge screen + "slim" size.
Third and last one is that some softwares are so damn slow to run on it and the lack of extra RAM suffers greatly.
So I am definitely planning to switch to a HTC HD2 in the coming weeks as compared to the TP2, the HD2 has specifications of a new generation phone where as the tp2 is very very far behind. Now that many phones are coming out equipped with a 1ghz proccessor, I bet that most people will follow the trend and get similar powerful phones unless keyboard is an absolute must or money is a key factor...My opinions only...

Okay, you want an opinion? I'm a person with both a Touch Pro 2 and a HD2.
Well first, I loved my TP2. I thought it was the best phone I've ever had. Loved the physical keyboard, it seemed to be running fast, and it can run Android on it, although not quite so well. The resistive touchscreen was very accurate, even though it could sometimes be one big pain in the arse. That's when the stylus came in.Pop it out, use it, pop it back in, simple. But then after a while, the darn thing felt so slow. Pages took a long time to load, no Flash support in browsers, my battery drained fast. One day I went to the T-Mobile store in my area. What do I see sitting in front of me? A live working HD2, hooked up to their security system. So I try it. So fast, I have to have it. So I h'whipped p) out $500 bucks from my pocket a few months later, and I had my HD2. It can run Android 2.2. It can run Flash videos perfectly. Hell, even Windows Mobile was fast. Then I thought, oh shucks, the keyboard. I flipped the phone into Landscape mode and that friggin keyboard is amazing. Now I have big hands - my fingertips are about as big as the keys on my keyboard. This keyboard won't make you miss your Touch Pro 2. Since then, my Touch Pro 2 has sat in a corner, neglected. I feel sorry for it from time to time and use it p), but then I go straight back to the HD2.
One disadvantage of the HD2 is the BATTERY LIFE. Heavy use - 4 hours (constantly on)

HD2...I really like the hard keyboard on my TP2, but it just doesn't have enough Ram, My older Samsung Epix ran better, the TP2 just sucks away ram, I end up soft resetting a couple times a day, just from text messaging or checking my calendar or weather, it's a pretty big disappointment in that area. Just think, the HD2 will have a processor about twice the speed of the TP2 and twice the ram, plus half a Gig to 1 Gig of internal storage, for pesky programs that won't go on the storage card. If you want specs just check out: http://www.htc.com/us/products/compare/104-65-61?view=1-3&sort=0

I think I know which one to get!!
Thank you everyone for the inputs.
Well, I'm changing my mind. I have tested a demo HD2 in the shop and like it. I think I have to get the HD2. I also can't consider any of the WP7 devices at the moment because I think I would not buy the WP7 devices until it become better devices. That could be a year or two. Well if I could not live without the video call (on HD2), I have to fix my Hermes a bit as a backup. So I can use the video call on my good old Hermes. Hopefully this could work. (The only bad thing is I have to carry my Hermes along if I intend to do a video call)

Hi Mate,
I Have both the Touch Pro 2 and HD2 and I would only recommend the HD2!! My personal opion is that I would not waste your money on the touch pro 2.
Col

Hmmm, I've been using the HD2 for 1week now and my previous excitement has a bit vanished for this phone. I used the phone a lot for business purposes (especially using emails and chat a lot) and the lack of a keyboard suffers GREATLY. Though the HD2 screen is large for typing, I ended up in making mistakes couple of times when typing fast and I was really frustrated having to constantly correct my mistakes. This is time consuming especially when I have a lot of emails to respond on the way, and often gets my nerves to the limit.
The touch screen though is very responsive but I feel that the TP2 resistive screen has a bit more precision. Speed wise, the HD2 blows the TP2 and it is definitely great to watch your pictures/movies on the large screen. Apart from the mutimedia use, I am going to stick back to my TP2 and return the HD2. Nothing feels better than a physical qwerty keyboard and...a resistive screen for selecting a specific word easily when typing (...my opinions only).

Final5k said:
Though the HD2 screen is large for typing, I ended up in making mistakes couple of times when typing fast and I was really frustrated having to constantly correct my mistakes. This is time consuming especially when I have a lot of emails to respond on the way, and often gets my nerves to the limit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have big hands and I only make one error out of every hundred words.

Hi there,
I'm hoping to help you with my story: Using my father's old WM device (MDA Compact III) for about one year, in the beginning of this year I decided to go for something new. My most important requirement for the new device was a QWERTZ-keyboard (here in Germany). So, there wasn't much of a choice I had and after scanning through some device's reviews looking also at those without a QWERTZ to get to know the current standards (among them the HD2, "old" TouchPro, G1, BlackBerry 9700, Xperia X1 and some of the Samsung and LG devices) I bought the TouchPro2 as it seemed to me the best choice concerning specifications and my demands. And I was really happy about it! It was way faster than my former MDA, had much better graphics, loads of software to use and so on...
When time passed by, I started to pick up on some custom roms, as I wasn't satisfied with the speed (everyone know about the upgrading his personal requirements). Found the roms of NRGZ28 very good, stable and fast.
However, I was constantly getting more and more fed up with WM6(.5) and the phone as there are some constant (to me unknown) freezes and hangs. And as WM7 will not be seen on this device I decided to go for another change: I ordered the Desire Z, which is (finally) on its way, maybe arriving today.
My advice for you: take a look at Android or WM7. And try around with those keyboards and decide, if you *really* need a physical one. There is a whole bunch of good devices, that will be released with WM7 and Android.
Cheers!

OP got the HD2. There is no longer any reason to try to convince him of anything.

cajunflavoredbob said:
OP got the HD2. There is no longer any reason to try to convince him of anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ah, too late... well then, have fun with the hd2

abprie said:
ah, too late... well then, have fun with the hd2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmm I would be curious to hear your opinions on both phones - may you share?

I'd vote for the HD2 because of it's specifications. Like it was said earlier the HD2 blows the TP2 out of the water. But also pointed out is the problem with WinMo 6.5. This stock ROM is a dinosaur in age and just doesn't hold a candle up to Android or WM7. I also was fed up with it on my HD2 so I made a complete change and switched my device over the Android via custom ROMs found on these forums. I've never been happier!
So the debate really is between Android and WM7. Considering the future I think getting android would be a better deal. It's going to explode in popularity due to Microsoft's and Apple's security lockdowns on their devices (they aren't very customizable, WM7 and the iPhone etc), and because of Android being open source.
So before I get going on a tangent , I'd recommend getting the HD2 if you like customizing your phone A LOT. It can be kind of a scary procedure. But if you're not up to that kind of stuff I'd recommend looking at HTC's Android phones. They're very stable and fun to use. The TP2 will become a very average phone in the next while with all the new and cool stuff coming out.

Where to upgrade after the Touch Pro 2?

I've been using the HTC Touch Pro 2 since last April with T-Mobile. I've absolutely loved the functionality, including ability to customize the ROM(<3 Energy), simple to use web browsing, texting, email, wifi router, bluetooth ability, and many other features that come with the smart phones. I'd die right now during school/work/personal stuff without the calendar.
When I bought it last year, the HD2 was sitting next to it, and the reason I went with the HD2 was the hardware keyboard. Software keyboards annoy the heck out of me unless they're well done. I could type 5 times faster on my TP2 than an ipod touch. But, what is getting to me now after using the TP2 for 10 months?
- Camera: Quality isn't high enough compared to other shots I've seen taken by phones. I switch the lighting settings to tweak it, but it's still grainy. I as in a dark club the other night, and watched someone take pictures that were noticeably clearer than mine.
- Lack of 3.5mm Headset Adapter. I have to use the HTC USB -> 3.5mm adapter to listen with earbuds to music. Annoying.
Like I said, the hardware keyboard is almost necessity, but I could learn to deal with a software if it's not the kind that can be easily fat fingered.
That's all I can think of right now. Any help with the phone upgrade process would be greatly appreciated.

i think your first decision is probably are you going to stay with windows phone 7, android, iOS, or webOS.
Almost all of these software has some nice phones with physical keyboard. 3.5mm headphone jack (it's pretty much standard now with most high-end phones). If you want a good camera, go with the phone with led flash support then you probabaly will be fine.

PUTALE said:
i think your first decision is probably are you going to stay with windows phone 7, android, iOS, or webOS.
Almost all of these software has some nice phones with physical keyboard. 3.5mm headphone jack (it's pretty much standard now with most high-end phones). If you want a good camera, go with the phone with led flash support then you probabaly will be fine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I liked the TP2 after I got it because it was an operating environment I was used to and familiar with. I haven't used any other one, so I can't comment on it. What are examples of phones with hardware keyboards that have the same, if not better functionality than the TP2, including the things I listed of any OS? The HD2 and HD7 look enticing, but if there's something similar that might suit my needs better, I'm just looking for suggestions.

raz1337 said:
I liked the TP2 after I got it because it was an operating environment I was used to and familiar with. I haven't used any other one, so I can't comment on it. What are examples of phones with hardware keyboards that have the same, if not better functionality than the TP2, including the things I listed of any OS? The HD2 and HD7 look enticing, but if there's something similar that might suit my needs better, I'm just looking for suggestions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If the keyboard is what you care about, then perhaps you should simply wait for the HTC 7 Pro to be available. It is basically the Touch Pro2 on steroids. It is the successor to the TP2 and runs WP7. There's a thread with a bunch of useful information HERE.

I'm in same boat as you, trying to figure which phone next. Still cannot decide and will give it another year, mainly because 3G networks are in a state of flux where I live (now still using EDGE). I will likely either go to Android if I can get the sync with MS Office to my liking or WM7 if the apps take off. No interest in other phones.
As for headphones on TP2, I have a nice bluetooth set by Jabra that does away with need for jack.

I was in the same boat as you a couple months ago when my contract ended with my provider. I had been looking at WP7 since the first whiff of it came out, but the more I read about it the more I disliked it. Long story short I greatly dislike all of these current operating systems for varying reasons.
So eventually I decided that the TP2 was as good as it was going to get for me for now, and bought up a couple extra of them. They're relatively cheap, and they all should last me until I cannot physically use them anymore (carrier doesnt support for some reason, or I can't find any good batteries, etc..) or until some company makes something desirable for me.
My advice is that you research at length all of your options before you end up with something you don't like using. It took me a lot of time playing around with android and WP7 before I decided I didn't want any of them. The TP2 is an excellent device and Windows Mobile is an excellent OS, don't let anyone fool you into thinking otherwise.
As far as your complaints, 3.2 MP is enough for me and my carrier's TP2 includes a headphone jack.. So I guess we're not in the same boat in those regards...

maybe an evo shift 4g?
http://www.htc.com/us/products/shift-sprint#overview
and i dont know where you live, but in europe we have an HTC Desire Z

Check out my review/comparison of the Desire Z (T-Mobile G2) to the Touch Pro 2:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=955526
A friend of mine works at T-Mobile, and can have any phone he wants (that T-Mobile carries). His weapon of choice is the G2.

redpoint73 said:
Check out my review/comparison of the Desire Z (T-Mobile G2) to the Touch Pro 2:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=955526
A friend of mine works at T-Mobile, and can have any phone he wants (that T-Mobile carries). His weapon of choice is the G2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm in a similar boat... I love the TP2 for it's design, had a Tilt before so this was a great upgrade. But there's nothing that's coming out from HTC that I've seen or heard of that looks like an upgrade. The 7 Pro is kind of an upgrade, but not the same kind of amazing upgrade like the Tilt to Tilt 2... I would like a slightly larger/better display but also keep the physical kb... I've been lookin at the Atrix (even tho they say you can't put custom roms on it yet), just cuz it sounds pretty sick but I keep hoping a phone w/ a kb comes out. Looks like Dell is gonna bring something out but not til the end of this year I think... I really hope HTC brings out a Tilt 3 w/ a 4-4.3in screen, better camera, runnin android since I don't really like WP7 & a dual processor...lol

rkub said:
I'm in a similar boat... I love the TP2 for it's design, had a Tilt before so this was a great upgrade. But there's nothing that's coming out from HTC that I've seen or heard of that looks like an upgrade. The 7 Pro is kind of an upgrade, but not the same kind of amazing upgrade like the Tilt to Tilt 2... I would like a slightly larger/better display but also keep the physical kb... I've been lookin at the Atrix (even tho they say you can't put custom roms on it yet), just cuz it sounds pretty sick but I keep hoping a phone w/ a kb comes out. Looks like Dell is gonna bring something out but not til the end of this year I think... I really hope HTC brings out a Tilt 3 w/ a 4-4.3in screen, better camera, runnin android since I don't really like WP7 & a dual processor...lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Atrix concept looks very cool, but I've been pretty underwhelmed by the recent Motorola handsets. They just feel cheap and clunky compared to HTC phones. But maybe they can step it up a notch. Similarly, the Dell Streak seemed like nothing special that just about every other manufacturer couldn't match or do better. And there were some things, like the proprietary dock connector, that were outright inexcusable. Again, they are going to need to kick it up a notch to get me remotely interested in their products.
I agree that a slightly larger screen (maybe around 3.9 or 4.0 in) would be really nice for watching video, and make the on-screen keyboard easier to use (for the times you don't feel the need to flip out the hardward keyboard). But I think a 4.3 in display with a hardware keyboard would result in a really big, thick, heavy phone.
But I have to say, the Desire Z is a pretty sick upgrade over the Tilt2. Maybe not in terms of form factor, but in terms of just about everything else.

I have no upgrades available for a long time so I'd be buying retail. The 7 pro looks quite interesting. Maybe I'll stop buy the T-Mobile store and see how the desire z feels. Is there much of a change over the TP2 to go to a Desire Z?
I've somewhat fixed the no 3.5mm jack issue by buying a bluetooth headset that supports a2dp. I guess that'll hold me over until later this year if I upgrade.

raz1337 said:
I have no upgrades available for a long time so I'd be buying retail. The 7 pro looks quite interesting. Maybe I'll stop buy the T-Mobile store and see how the desire z feels. Is there much of a change over the TP2 to go to a Desire Z?
I've somewhat fixed the no 3.5mm jack issue by buying a bluetooth headset that supports a2dp. I guess that'll hold me over until later this year if I upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The keyboard on the Desire Z is smaller than the Touch Pro2, but most people who own it say that it still feels very nice. I would miss my dedicated number row, though. I've gotten very used to it.

i have loved my touch pro 2 for the past year or so and all the devs, everyone at XDA made me love it even more. my girlfriend has an iphone and ill never ever trade my phone for iOS and theres not any other phone carried by ATT that is any better than the touch pro 2 i think..but then the Atrix came along. its a sad realization but you cant compare the specs of our touch pros to any of these new devices. sure im sacrificing the full qwerty kb we all know and love and moving on from winmo 6.5 (that ive grown with since 5.x) but i feel like its for the better. especially with all the wear and tear ive put my phone thru, sure is one hell of a trooper thats for sure, its time to set it down and ive made my decision. expecting my atrix to arrive this coming monday. so with this goodluck to all with whatever you decide!

Phone after TP2
I'm also investigating new phones (although doing so would also require me to give up my sero plan, which seems unlikely at the moment).
For me on Sprint, there seems to be a few major choices that include a physical keyboard that I was looking at:
Android:
-HTC EVO Shift
-Samsung Epic 4G
WP7:
-[upcoming] HTC 7 Pro
The EVO shift has a similar sized screen to the TP2, while the Epic 4G goes a bit larger (4") and has a faster processor (1 Ghz vs. 800 Mhz on the Evo Shift). Nonetheless, I'm still pretty turned off by the touchwiz UI on the Epic 4g -- a bit to cartoony for my tastes.
Since the 7 pro is essentially the successor to the TP2, the dimensions are pretty similar albeit with an upgraded processor (1 Ghz).
I'm currently running XDAndroid on the TP2, so I have a sense of how android works, but I've never tried WP7 -- after classic WinMo I'm still kind of hesitant to go back to Microsoft.
To anyone who has been using WP7 -- any thoughts on the disadvantages/advantages over android?

I guess the most obvious phone would be the HTC 7 pro closely followed by the Desire Z.
Personally i decided to keep my TP2 after 2 years (i can pick a new phone @ my provider in june). The phone does everything i want.
The only program i miss on Windows Mobile is WhatsApp/pingchat

FeareX said:
I guess the most obvious phone would be the HTC 7 pro closely followed by the Desire Z.
Personally i decided to keep my TP2 after 2 years (i can pick a new phone @ my provider in june). The phone does everything i want.
The only program i miss on Windows Mobile is WhatsApp/pingchat
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I get the Desire Z. I went to T-Mobile hoping to find one to even hold and play with, but didn't see one. I'm just really hung up on the hardware keyboard when considering an HD7. The hardware keyboard makes me want to pump out paragraphs of forum posts on the phone. The software keyboard makes me hate texting.

Same thougths here, and same conclusions, just like some people wrote: I tried some phones, but the only possible choice would be the Desire Z (7 Pro w/o card slot is a NO GO!). I ended up buying an new display to replace the cracked one in my TP2 (via ebay, from HK), saving LOTS of money, and still having the device I like and am used to.
Someone wrote about TP2 being cheap(er) now, where do you get them and at which price? They're still above 50% of the price at introduction around here in Germany. If they were cheaper, I'd buy one as spare, too.

mwrsa said:
Same thougths here, and same conclusions, just like some people wrote: I tried some phones, but the only possible choice would be the Desire Z (7 Pro w/o card slot is a NO GO!). I ended up buying an new display to replace the cracked one in my TP2 (via ebay, from HK), saving LOTS of money, and still having the device I like and am used to.
Someone wrote about TP2 being cheap(er) now, where do you get them and at which price? They're still above 50% of the price at introduction around here in Germany. If they were cheaper, I'd buy one as spare, too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They go for cheap in the Marketplace forum here in XDA every now and then. There's also eBay. I've seen them as low as $120 recently.

That's an incredible price! They're still well over 250€ new on Ebay, almost 400€ in the cheapest onlineshop I found in Germany! WOW.

I will vote for HTC 7 pro, as you've been used to using a keyboard, it's hard to go back to the on-screen one, and BTW HTC 7 Pro is really amazing