Develop Bugs

General rooting question

Hello all, I'm new to smartphones, Android, xda and rooting in general, but I understand the concept, value and associated risks. I'm following the thread by toastcfh in the EVO Development forum about how to root the EVO, but I don't want to clutter it up with such a basic question, so I'm posting it here.
I want to have root access in order to get rid of bloatware, play with custom roms and just generally have full access to my EVO. I do NOT, however, want to get in over my head. I want to develop a better understanding of Android before taking full advantage of what rooting offers. My concern is that if I don't root it as soon as I get it, HTC will patch the holes and I won't be able to do so later.
So here is my question: Can I root the darn thing when I get it on 6/4 and continue to run Sprint's delivered ROM? Then, as I accumulate more knowledge and experience, start to dig deeper into the OS and make use of what root has to offer? Also, can Sprint or HTC "un-root" a device via an OTA update or something similar? Sorry if these are noob questions, but as a noob, they're all I've got.
Oh, and thanks to all the folks who make this site so informative. It truly is a great resource.

You can root and remove your bloatware and even continue to use the stock ROM if you want. You can flash custom ROMs as you see fit. Remember, flashing a Sprint update will most likely unroot your device, so you should always just get a custom ROM based off the latest update instead of flashing the official updates. If you need to send your phone to Sprint you can always unroot with one of these official updates so they will never know about your root.

TheBiles said:
You can root and remove your bloatware and even continue to use the stock ROM if you want. You can flash custom ROMs as you see fit. Remember, flashing a Sprint update will most likely unroot your device, so you should always just get a custom ROM based off the latest update instead of flashing the official updates. If you need to send your phone to Sprint you can always unroot with one of these official updates so they will never know about your root.
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Thanks for the info.... I'm a noob as well, and am counting on you guys with your wealth of experience to show us the way.

TheBiles said:
You can root and remove your bloatware and even continue to use the stock ROM if you want. You can flash custom ROMs as you see fit. Remember, flashing a Sprint update will most likely unroot your device, so you should always just get a custom ROM based off the latest update instead of flashing the official updates. If you need to send your phone to Sprint you can always unroot with one of these official updates so they will never know about your root.
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Thanks for the speedy response! Regarding Sprint updates, is this something that you must accept discretely via a keystroke or check box or something similar? Can you set the phone to not check for updates until you tell it to, or will it prompt the user on some sort of routine basis?

erikivy said:
Thanks for the speedy response! Regarding Sprint updates, is this something that you must accept discretely via a keystroke or check box or something similar? Can you set the phone to not check for updates until you tell it to, or will it prompt the user on some sort of routine basis?
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If it is the same with the Hero, OTA updates won't work on a custom ROM. I'm also sure that you can decline an OTA update on the stock ROM.

TheBiles said:
If it is the same with the Hero, OTA updates won't work on a custom ROM. I'm also sure that you can decline an OTA update on the stock ROM.
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Perfect! Thanks again.

[Q] HTC EVO Froyo 2.2 Root???

How do i root froyo 2.2 cause i am at stock everything I need to know how to flash a recovery, how to flash radios, how to flash wimax???

Please tell me this is for lulz......since you've been a member since Jan.

I'm assuming you mean "Root" your phone so that you will be able to flash and load the various things you mentioned, in which case you will just have to wait patiently until the developers figure out how to root the phone.
2.2 has been rooted (not sure if using the correct term here) so that it can be loaded on a phone that was previously rooted on 2.1. If you applied the OTA updates from Sprint to get 2.2, then waiting is in order.
If you have stock 2.2 from the OTA Sprint updates, then you already have the latest Radio and Wimax...
-kp

kperry1911 said:
I'm assuming you mean "Root" your phone so that you will be able to flash and load the various things you mentioned, in which case you will just have to wait patiently until the developers figure out how to root the phone.
2.2 has been rooted (not sure if using the correct term here) so that it can be loaded on a phone that was previously rooted on 2.1. If you applied the OTA updates from Sprint to get 2.2, then waiting is in order.
If you have stock 2.2 from the OTA Sprint updates, then you already have the latest Radio and Wimax...
-kp
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Just to make it clearer, 2.2 has not been rooted on the EVO yet.. There are rooted 2.2 custom roms available, but they require you to already be rooted or you will have to root your 2.1, before flashing..

Neewwbb
Yea sorry im new to this site.. anyone have a ETA on the 2.2 root? this su*ks shouldnt have updated.. another thing what does "ROOT" access do really?

Root access basically just gives you administrator access to all parts of the phone. It's not like Jalibraking an iPhone, because the truth is Google doesn't really try to stop you from doing it at all.
You could root your phone just to give yourself the ability to do a backup, and keep everything stock. I was surprised when I bought my Evo, and saw that Google didn't have a way to do a full image backup. Root gives this to you.
You can also use root user access to replace ROM's, and use certain apps that only work with superuser access, or administrator access to put it another way. Examples would be wireless tether from theory of evolution, and titanium backup.
I use a root app called Rom Manager. It's a great way to try new Roms and flash back to stock if you don't like them. I know everyone warns about bricking your phone, and causing damage, but I wouldn't worry about it. You should be fine with anything you find in these forums, or from Rom Manager.

bradleyw801 said:
Root access basically just gives you administrator access to all parts of the phone. It's not like Jalibraking an iPhone, because the truth is Google doesn't really try to stop you from doing it at all.
You could root your phone just to give yourself the ability to do a backup, and keep everything stock. I was surprised when I bought my Evo, and saw that Google didn't have a way to do a full image backup. Root gives this to you.
You can also use root user access to replace ROM's, and use certain apps that only work with superuser access, or administrator access to put it another way. Examples would be wireless tether from theory of evolution, and titanium backup.
I use a root app called Rom Manager. It's a great way to try new Roms and flash back to stock if you don't like them. I know everyone warns about bricking your phone, and causing damage, but I wouldn't worry about it. You should be fine with anything you find in these forums, or from Rom Manager.
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Google doesn't try to stop you, but the manufacturer's do.
It's more like jailbreaking than you think. Both rely on exploits in the software to gain root access to the system. That's why when you do an OTA update, you lose root. Because that exploit is no longer taken advantage up. That's also why it takes so long for people to find a root to the OTA versions. They need to haxxor through all of the code to try to find an exploit.
Though I admit, unRevoked rooting method is far more closely aligned to jailbreaking than a good old fashioned nand unlock.
2.2 I hear is far more secure, so I have a feeling we'll be having a bit of a waiting game.

It's laughable that we have yet another thread discussing this, but while we're on the subject, my personal opinion is that developer efforts would be better devoted to polishing a full EVO-compatible AOSP ROM from the source code up. But then, how would we flash it . . . ?
Oh well, never mind.

My phone is fully rooted with 2.1. I rooted it using the simple/easy 1,2,3,4 process.
If I were to install the ROM Flipzmode provided [ROM] 8/3/10 | Fresh Evo 3.1.0.1 | FroYo | OFFICIAL 3.26.651.6 OTA + fresh goodies Would I still retain my root if I flashed the device?
I'm pretty n00b here too.
Thanks in advance,
- Mitalis

I'm new here too....I have a fully rooted Moment (that I learned how to root @ SDX) but I finally broke down and added an Evo to the stable because of the screen's vastness....I purposefully held off on doing the 2.2 OTA because I plan to root my EVO any day now from the things I've read here @ XDA. This site has a lot of great tips on how to root the Evo....but if you need any more just do a bing.com search on "how to root an EVO" and you'll get plenty more. I love my Moment because it's the first phone I learned to root but I like this EVO too!

Mitalis said:
My phone is fully rooted with 2.1. I rooted it using the simple/easy 1,2,3,4 process.
If I were to install the ROM Flipzmode provided [ROM] 8/3/10 | Fresh Evo 3.1.0.1 | FroYo | OFFICIAL 3.26.651.6 OTA + fresh goodies Would I still retain my root if I flashed the device?
I'm pretty n00b here too.
Thanks in advance,
- Mitalis
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes you will be fine. Make sure to wipe before flashing.

Mitalis said:
My phone is fully rooted with 2.1. I rooted it using the simple/easy 1,2,3,4 process.
If I were to install the ROM Flipzmode provided [ROM] 8/3/10 | Fresh Evo 3.1.0.1 | FroYo | OFFICIAL 3.26.651.6 OTA + fresh goodies Would I still retain my root if I flashed the device?
I'm pretty n00b here too.
Thanks in advance,
- Mitalis
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
if you were rooted with 2.1 then yes you can flash the new fresh 3.1.0.1 and still have root.

Thank you guys for answering my questions.
Much appreciated. =)
- James

Mitalis said:
Thank you guys for answering my questions.
Much appreciated. =)
- James
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Shut up, jerk.
Oh, wait . . . sorry, I'm just not used to politeness. You're welcome.

Im sure the DEVS will get us that 2.2 access here soon...

yes as long as u don't do an update to 2.2 ota.
u will be good...

juanrgon00 said:
anyone have a ETA on the 2.2 root?
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When the sun has begun to ride through the sign of the Crab, and the river increases until it passes into the Balance. And as the weight of the waters decreases, the plains that before were navigable for boats will then be suitable for riders on horseback. Then, and only then, will you have root.
or not. Just keep your eye on the stickied thread in Q&A - it will be updated as soon as root is found.

Root After Update?

I've been considering rooting my phone at some point. I read in one post that the new OTA update might make rooting impossible. Is this true?
As a follow up question- Seems from the forum posts that some people end up with various problems after flashing. Is it really worth rooting and flashing? What are the most important advantages and improvements?
Thanks
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

Dude just root your phone. Having complete control over your device is reason enough to do it. Some programs don't even work without it. Rooting is simple too btw with Unrevoked3. Make sure to get unrevoked3 because unrevoked forever will void any chance at a warrenty claim.

I'm a total noobie to rooting and flashing so please excuse me if I have this wrong.
I would be fine waiting for the official OTA update and then rooting and flashing a cooked ROM but I read on some posts that rooting may not be possible after the update. The advice seems to be to run unrevokedforever to get "s-off" and gain permanent root access. My biggest concern with this is voiding my warranty. I already had to return one of these for a bad speaker.
Can I just refuse the OTA until unrevoked gets s-on?

Before you do any rooting; consider the reason you want to root your phone. If you want official OTA updates then don't bother. IF you want to have the freedom and take on the responsibility of doing whatever you want to your phone and the consequences of not fully understanding what you're doing, then root your phone.
Rooting is not for everyone, decide what you want from your phone first, then consider what you'll gain from having root.
You can re-root your phone, but like anything else it carries risks, be ready to buy a new phone for $600 when you blow this one up. Then you are ready to root for certain.

Good advice DIC. I certainly don't want to shell out the dollars for a new phone. My main reasons for rooting and flashing would be:
- Better battery life
- wifi tethering
- having control for reasons I might realize later
- fun
Will the OTA update address the first 2 issues?
Will rooting still be possible after the OTA? If so I can just enjoy the benefits of that and then root and flash if I still want to.

Rooting after the 2.2 OTA
I ran across some older Unrevoked comments that were in the vein that all of their exploits had been plugged in the 2.2 OTA so finding new ones might take time. That was a few weeks ago so who knows what they have now. So if you accept the 2.2 OTA without the S-OFF mod, then you will have to wait for Unrevoked 4(?) to find a new exploit.
S-OFF on the other hand will let you accept any official, locked down update, load you own recovery (ClockworkMod) and from there load su/Superuser.apk.
I happen to be a Linux developer, so I'm interested in unlocking the phone so I can understand the lower levels (below the Android java machine). But I am also cautious, so I would prefer to start with stock and mod the system in bits and pieces as I need and understand it.

S-OFF on the other hand will let you accept any official, locked down update, load you own recovery (ClockworkMod) and from there load su/Superuser.apk.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So are you saying you recommend applying forever and s-off now before accepting the OTA update?
As a "cautious" linux developer what have you done with your phone at this point?

I think I will root the phone with unrevoked3 and just install wireless tethering from the app store for now.
I would also like to update the radio for better performance. I read I can only update to 2.05 without applying s-off and that it can brick my phone if I install it twice. Is this a good idea?
If the official OTA shows up can I run it on a rooted phone? I assume I can. More importantly, do I want to?

marcmarshall said:
So are you saying you recommend applying forever and s-off now before accepting the OTA update?
As a "cautious" linux developer what have you done with your phone at this point?
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I applied the S-OFF mod specifically because I want to use stock as a starting point rather than relying upon a rebuilt or reconstructed MOD from someone else. Not that I don't trust the developers - they do a lot of great work. But with so many files flying around and very little source code behind those mods, I rather build the pieces myself (as much as is feasible). Koush has a lot of his work available on github, for example, and you can see exactly how he goes about replacing a kernel. I've also been able to recompile the kernel from the HTC released sources - now if I can find the configuration files that the Hydra Kernel developer uses, then I can roll my own kernels - again from stock sources.
To address your second question - I've done a network port scan on my phone to identify open TCP or UDP ports and found an unidentified UDP port listening. I posted a thread and some deductive reasoning from other XDA users narrowed down the source to the new Chrome to Phone feature. I'll be able to verify this after the stock 2.2 OTA comes through, but the phone is really a little Linux system under the Java machine that "traps" most of the Android apps. Root privilege bypasses the Android security and the hardware security (NAND lock) and could allow a "root" only app to install something under the hood. The phones are trapped in Verizon's network, so they are hard to get to, but the standard firewall (iptableS) is down by default.
So as Spiderman's Uncle Ben says, "With great power comes great responsibility". If you root your phone, but do not compile your own apps/mods from source, then you must rely upon the integrity of the community and file sharing systems for the mods that you install. S-OFF will let you install stock images and then as a minimum you need a replacement recovery (ClockworkMod) and the superuser package. But from there, you can work as you see fit.
It may benefit the community to have some form of central "Modding integrity verification" system for example where source codes, update zips and md5sums are fully documented so that if you pull down a mod from a file sharing site, then you have a good idea that the file is from the original developer. Then if the developer is good with changelogs and source, the user can feel reasonably good as to the integrity what's running on the phone. It would slow down innovation however.

I like the way you think Starfire. Last night I rooted with Unrevoked3, no s-off. I've only added a few root only apps and removed a couple bloats so far. I'm concerned about not being able to root after the OTA update so I think I will stop worrying so much and apply Unrevoked forever, update the radio, and apply the leaked or a custom ROM.
I like Sense and I would like a kernal with the adaptive cpu clocking, or whatever it is called, so I can improve battery life. Any suggestions?
Thanks much............mm

If you wait for the official ota its gonna be a while until a developer group like unrevoked finds a way to root it. If you want wifi tethering and froyo now I suggest rooting.
youtube.com/user/mejdam
^has several guides on how to root upgrade to baseband 2.05 and downgrade back to stock. Most roms can run on 2.05. If you want to extend battery life I suggest installing a hydra kernal that is undervolted or kingxkernal (if you want more control in oc). Also only way to get true wifi tethering for free is through rooting.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

marcmarshall said:
I like the way you think Starfire. Last night I rooted with Unrevoked3, no s-off. I've only added a few root only apps and removed a couple bloats so far. I'm concerned about not being able to root after the OTA update so I think I will stop worrying so much and apply Unrevoked forever, update the radio, and apply the leaked or a custom ROM.
I like Sense and I would like a kernal with the adaptive cpu clocking, or whatever it is called, so I can improve battery life. Any suggestions?
Thanks much............mm
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Click to collapse
I played with SkyRaider 2.2 Sense and liked it a lot. 2.5.2 sounds even better although I have not tried it because (1) I have my phone S-OFF, rooted stock 2.1 with the stock 605.2 recovery waiting a few more days for the OTA and (2) there was a lot of back and forth with boot loops, sound fixes, Hulu fixes, etc. so I'm letting it settle out a bit. The SkyRaider dev does a great job with extras and themes available through ROM Manager. If the OTA takes too much longer, I may give that one a shot again - and keep looking under the hood.

I think I will play a little wait and see also. I was also leaning to skyraider based on what I had read. I might use it and then patch this kernal http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=760050&highlight=cpu+rom+battery . It is optimized for battery usage. I need to do some homework about it though to see if Skyraider is not already using the same optimization and that it is stable.
Thanks!

Basic Unrevoked Forever question.

I have been reading threads non stop for about 4 days now. Great forum.
Quick question about Unrevoked Forever.
Q: If I apply Unrevoked Forever to my Evo and then apply some future Stock, non-rooted OTA (which may have radios, etc) and I loose root because of it, does having the low-level S-OFF from Forever allow me to run Unrevoked32 again and get root back no matter what the stock OTA did?
I am trying to figure out a best practice for myself so that I can apply stock OTA's and then easily re-root WITHOUT having to wipe everything and redo my settings or even use a backup/restore. I like that the stock OTAs don't require that I clear off everything.
Thanks for any help.

mbwesner said:
I have been reading threads non stop for about 4 days now. Great forum.
Quick question about Unrevoked Forever.
Q: If I apply Unrevoked Forever to my Evo and then apply some future Stock, non-rooted OTA (which may have radios, etc) and I loose root because of it, does having the low-level S-OFF from Forever allow me to run Unrevoked32 again and get root back no matter what the stock OTA did?
I am trying to figure out a best practice for myself so that I can apply stock OTA's and then easily re-root WITHOUT having to wipe everything and redo my settings or even use a backup/restore. I like that the stock OTAs don't require that I clear off everything.
Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is one thing I dont understand and that is if you root your phone why would you run OTA updates. Someone in XDA will have that update and put it in a form that you can use on your rooted phone. People updating after they root really baffles me... <-----Sorry bout that
Now to answer your question - I believe your best route would be to root your phone with this method here and this way you lose nothing and can just get an update.zip file after an update comes out. The problem is you never know what will change in future updates and a OTA may unroot your phone. Since none of us know for sure thats a risk you will have to take although unrevoked forever is suppose to get around that.

Do Official OTA Updates and Factory Resets Work After Rooting?

Maybe someone can throw a new guy a bone here? ....
One thing I had on my jailbroken iPhone was free tethering. My Xfinity went down the other day and I realized I couldn't tether my new Android without paying AT$T. So from what I understand, like the iPhone I need to root it and then download a third party tethering app?
If I root now, I'll probably be tempted to give Black Jelly or Frost ROMs a try. I know with this 'Odin' program or 'Nandroid' backup with CWP (still figuring all this out) I can switch between ROMS pretty easily. It takes me about an hour though to download all my apps and reconfig my phone after a reset though. I think Titanium backup or something solves this, but seems to me using something like that with custom ROM, as opposed to a 'clean' install and just start installing/configuring from scratch may pose higher risk of having issues?
So my question is, if I root and install custom ROM, how hard is it to get the official update installed, or any more official future updates installed if I decide I don't want to stay on a custom ROM?
Being an experimental person and my first time to Android, I'm sure I'm going to eventually cave (for sure root) and try a custom ROM. I see SO many posts though in these ROM forums with all sorts of little issues. I want to go back to stock and get official updates if I need to.

When the official jb drops there will most likely be some debloated version on here in a day or so. If you're rooted with a custom recovery it will take no time to install. I would also seriously consider titanium backup, it makes the process much easier.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using xda app-developers app

OTA after Rooting - Yes and No....
jazee said:
Maybe someone can throw a new guy a bone here? ....
So my question is, if I root and install custom ROM, how hard is it to get the official update installed, or any more official future updates installed if I decide I don't want to stay on a custom ROM?
Being an experimental person and my first time to Android, I'm sure I'm going to eventually cave (for sure root) and try a custom ROM. I see SO many posts though in these ROM forums with all sorts of little issues. I want to go back to stock and get official updates if I need to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are two issues you mention: 1) Having a custom ROM and doing an Custom OTA, and 2) OTA with stock ROM and after you you have rooted your phone.
Stock ROM and OTA after Rooting
In times past, there have been vendors that look for rooting and refused to OTA the phone. Citing it violated warantee, contract, whatever. AT&T use to do it, but with current ROMs, especially with the S3, they simply turn off the SUID bit on /system/xbin/su during the update.(They turn off the Root modification, of sorts). The current OTA of 4.0.4 does this trick. Making near impossible to root afterwards.
Usually it is always best to flash back to stock to insure you get a clean OTA.
Some versions of rooting will allow you to keep root even after OTA, but I would not count on it.
The other issue that some forget is any modification to the ROM may trip a counter which may cause OTA's to fail. In the S3 there is a counter on how many times the ROM has been flashed by custom software. Once it is tripped, any warantee you have on the device is voided. You can see the information when you set your phone into flash mode.
There are programs to reset the counter, and other methods, but it gets pretty ugly and you can hard brick your phone in some cases. Just use them with care.
Custom ROM and OTA after Rooting
With custom ROM's rooting is the norm. OTA's will usually not affect them. In fact some OTA's will include updated 'su' programs. There are some custom ROM's that are not able to OTA.

So it sounds to me like if I plan on rooting to get the free tethering, I should always wait until there's a stock ROM available here and manually install it? That way, I don't lose my root and I don't increase the counter unnecessarily?
Thanks for your help.