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Anyone seen the article at PPCGeeks.com about Windows Phone 7??
I cant believe the crap Microsoft is trying to pull...
-At the Mobile World Congress event on February 15th, 2010, Windows Phone 7 will be unveilved, although at this time plans are only to unveil the user interface of the new platform . Specific indepth functionality of the device will most likely not be shown.
-The User Interface is based upon codename “METRO”. It will be very similar to the Zune HD User Interface with a complete revamp of the “Start” screen. The UI is “Very Clean”, “Soulful” and “Alive”
-Unfortunately there will be no Flash support at the get go as there was not enough time to implement these features.
-Windows Phone 7 will only support application installation through service based delivery. (i.e Marketplace). Application installation via storage card will not be possible.
- No Multi-Task support. Applications will “Pause” when in the background, however will support notifications via push notifications.
-Marketplace will now support “try before you buy” as well as an API
-No NETCF backwards compatibility. This means the original rumor of no backward compatibility for applications holds to be true. That being said, there are high hopes of porting the NetCF to the newer platform easily.
-Microsoft is confident that devices will be ready by September 2010
-Full Zune Integration
-Windows Mobile Device Center will no longer be used. Zune software to take over syncing via PC.
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device. Say goodbye to Sense UI / SPB Mobile Shell / Point UI / Infinity, etc, etc
-Full XBOX Gaming Integration (Gamer tag, achievements, friends, avatars, merchandising, etc)
-Full support for social networking
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looks like I will be making my next phone purchase based on WinMo6 and Android... Prob wont ever go to WinMo7...
i wouldnt believe any rumors that come out until microsoft confirms it. there have been so many different rumors from respectable sources and they all contradict each other. who to believe? no one
I don't want an iPhone from my Windows phone!
lol. I may use Android but I was looking at WM and thinking "That is a way better work phone than a Blackberry." but after reading those new rumors I am starting to doubt that.
I hope they are wrong since we don't need another iFail on the market but I can tell you one thing. HTC won't stand for that. They will mask all the ugly with their gorgeous HTC SENSE.
Yes but if u read that
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device. Say goodbye to Sense UI / SPB Mobile Shell / Point UI / Infinity, etc, etc
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Click to collapse
So? I think we will see, because HD2 is running with sense, and i don't thing that official update to WM 7 will be something like that.
Oh whatever!...
honestly, why are you surprised?
Look at the success of the other companies and OS's who use similar strategies.
Lock down the device = enhanced and specific support for hardware, and etc., specifically hardware.
ZuneHD is a perfect example. I thought about getting one (for about 5 minutes) because of that sweet'n'sexy little tegra chip. MS couldn't have made that run as smooth & efficiently on a CE5.x base.
I will probably not get one of these phones either (unless they've not leaked some amazing feature like a free MS Surface Table with purchase of every WinPhone7, haha).
Though, I do wish MS the best of luck trying to deliver Proprietary content and software in a prettier way than Apple. I mean lets face it: Apple tends to slap handcuffs on it's customers and they still wanna dance. Hope MS's mobile department has been talking to the Xbox360's marketing Dept.
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One of the many things I love about my phone is that I can change interfaces, get unique interfaces, and duplicate other phone's interfaces. lets hope this is only one version of Windows 7. It looks they are taking the iphone direction - make the phone idiot proof and lock it down
Haha sounds like someone is making fun of us and posts all that sucks on the iPhone OS:
-Unfortunately there will be no Flash support at the get go as there was not
enough time to implement these features.
-Windows Phone 7 will only support application installation through service based delivery. (i.e Marketplace). Application installation via storage card will not be possible.
- No Multi-Task support. Applications will “Pause” when in the background, however will support notifications via push notifications.
WM7
Hmm.. I see Microsoft Iphone
Well if that is true then I will be staying with winmo 6.1/6.5 and Android forever The HD2 is such a powerful beast, I hope Android will be fully ported to it...
Imagine dual booting WM6.5 & Android on the HD2 with it's powerful cpu & large clear capacitive screen!! Then WinMO 7 can go and die a slow death, I wouldn't care
UGH
I fear the future also, as many do. (of the wm os) Microsoft ~ Windows Mobile has a niche for getting things wrong pretty much all the time. I read a rather creditable article that the new sync software was to be the Zune software? WTF my Zune syncs wrong almost all the time especially this last time and the other last time...UGH I fear the future of Windows Mobile and hope they get there heads out of there A$$ and step it up. I've had to call Zune support multiple times and also have to yet to date. (again ugh)
~Windows Mobile Device Center will no longer be used. Zune software to take over syncing via PC.....?????
~DJyoSNOW~
~PLUR~ Peace Love Unity Respect
If it becomes true, then I will stick on WM 6.5 on the HD2. However, things may change, it could be fake, it could be hackable.
this looks fake... in fact i agree that someone listed all the things that suck on the iphone and wrote "windows phone 7" all over it.
these points look like from an US-centered point of view. i mean - marketplace?! it's crap all over the world and nearly empty, EXCEPT in the US. zune?! it has been released only where? exactly, again the US.
no OEM-gui allowed? if that were to be true, htc would've already announced to stop making winmo-phones.
nah, this is fake...
Just a Rumor
We still need to wait and see, this is a rumor. I think most people on here would not stand for an Iphone like OS and would move to android instead if Windows did that. I kinda believe they will have a duel os model and this description would fit the model for the media targeted devices. A professional-like version would keep alot of what we love alive and give us some of what we are hoping for.
Look what Apple did and how successful they are with those iPhone and iPod Touch.
But I doubt it is true, those rumors are (at least half of them) fake .
omg!!! no multi-task..
I don't think Microsoft will do this.
They must be crazy to.. If they do this, the 'enthusiast' users (the people currently still holding up Windows Mobile on their hands) will drop the new OS and MS would have to start all over again. Why would users choose for their OS while there are no advantages any longer?
Maybe this is the spec of some limited media/Zune version of the OS, not the PRO version, if these are actually true.
Might aswell be some bashing done by an iPhone/Andoid fanboy that got picked up further down the pipe.
I don't believe all of it. I think those are just rumors from the anti-MS people.
If MS ever wanted to make Windows to be like a MAC OS, they would have done it long ago. I don't think they will do such thing in the Mobile branch neither.
I would think(hope) it will be something like:
Windows Phone = Windows 7 Home (for the grandpas)
Windows Phone Pro = Windows 7 Ultimate/Pro (for the enthusiasts/geeks)
i doubt that there is not going to be any Multi-Tasking. thats what "Windows" is all about. probably all BS
OndraSter said:
Look what Apple did and how successful they are with those iPhone and iPod Touch.
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Yep, but just take a look why ppl are still sticking with the pretty outdated windows mobile. Because of an open system, not this closed sh*t. Seriously, why should anybody pick Windows Mobile 7 with the same shortcomings as the iPhone, when the iPhone got perfected for 4 years prior to the new MS OS ... with a whole more of useful apps.
But since android is a nice alternative with lots of customization-options and multitasking, I don't really care about MS f*cking up Windows Mobile 7. Would be nice if they didn't though ...
well now that windows mobile 7 is coming out there wont be anything left fot the old phones (softwares -rom develpment - ect...) i was extremely happy when i heard its coming but i was extremly pissed when i found out it will have a diffrent installing system no more cabs . i have a a blue angel (imate pda2k) and this is why i hate the new windows 7
what do u guys think
Im the same mate, seems very iphoney,.......... can see everyone switching to android or buying windows 7 phones and installing 6.5 on them (like people where doing with xp when vista came out)
8 posts and already pissed? And the no cab installation thing is nowhere confirmed so far!
I think the lack of backwards compatability is overblown. It was time for MS to change their entire structure and get back to developing software...which HTC has been doing for them for the last few years. Here's a longer posting I did on it earlier: http://www.mobilitydigest.com/windows-phone-7-is-leap-forward/
Windows Embedded CE 6.0 features a completely redesigned kernel, which supports over 32,768 processes, up from 32 process support of the previous versions. Each process receives 2GB of virtual address space, up from 32MB.
Sina™ said:
Windows Embedded CE 6.0 features a completely redesigned kernel, which supports over 32,768 processes, up from 32 process support of the previous versions. Each process receives 2GB of virtual address space, up from 32MB.
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So what? It doesn't matter one bit how many trillions of processes the OS supports, when third party developers are not allowed to make their applications run in the background!
The way things are going with Windows Mobile 7, I can't see it lasting as a platform.
I understand why Microsoft wants to do this. The real money is in the marketplace, like how Apple is doing it. The problem is, the iPhone is a success not just for it's features or UI, but because it's an Apple product.
For example, there's been way better players then iPod, but people bought it for the status symbol it gives. Just like the iPhone.
If Windows Phone 7 isn't as open as Windows Mobile 6.5, then my next phone will certainly be based on Android. I expect a lot of other people to make that decision as well.
You can't expect iPhone or Windows Phone 7 to succeed? No Flash support, not allowing emulators, and complete control of what software you can install.
Dont panic guys, we still dont know much about the application side of WP7 ... Wait till next month March 15 for the MIX10.
Me personally, I dont mind "rebooting" myself to use WP7 new OS and app scheme.
I have no problem with semi-multitasking or no-cab as long as it could get the job done and has tons of very good useful applications.
Android is nice, but being in Europe, I feel pain to not having Nexus ... to not having Google Voice ... I feel not complete. I know, I will get that eventually (Nexus, but dont know about Google Voice), but if I have to wait, then it would be long due before I got WP7.
Yes true, we also dont know if there are some US specific services for WP7, I hope not.
Apple? No, I dont like it ... it is too common nowadays ... I am Windows and Linux user
Dukenukemx said:
The way things are going with Windows Mobile 7, I can't see it lasting as a platform.
I understand why Microsoft wants to do this. The real money is in the marketplace, like how Apple is doing it. The problem is, the iPhone is a success not just for it's features or UI, but because it's an Apple product.
For example, there's been way better players then iPod, but people bought it for the status symbol it gives. Just like the iPhone.
If Windows Phone 7 isn't as open as Windows Mobile 6.5, then my next phone will certainly be based on Android. I expect a lot of other people to make that decision as well.
You can't expect iPhone or Windows Phone 7 to succeed? No Flash support, not allowing emulators, and complete control of what software you can install.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am also afraid that Microsoft will take away to many of our beloved freedoms (open for everybody to write programs, multi-tasking, customizing...). I have always looked at WM as a pocket computer rather then a simple smartphone. I fear this will not be the case with Windows Phone 7. There are just too many things threatening the mentioned freedom.
For example the leaked documents state that to use full multi-tasking you will have to let Microsoft approve your program. Given the history of MS I dont think they are going to approve anything without charging a fee. And why would someone even think that any of the many developers that have contributed freeware for Windows Mobile will be willing to pay for beeing allowed to use certain features of Windows Phone for their programs?
But sure we dont know everything yet. Lets just hope that future unveilings will bring some positive facts to daylight.
Well in those leaked docs, it looks like you'll only be able to install apps through the marketplace. I can understand how that will help developers and their security.
But if those developers are still charging ~$14.00 for programs, then that makes it totally pointless. I will not dish out that kind of money for a game that will finish in one sitting. No matter how great it is.
If they implement this, I hope they think it through. 0.99c releases, and if they allow cab installation (which I do hope), then downloading the cab from developers website would could cost the normal ~$14.00 instead, because it's a fact that it will be broadcast everywhere.
Marketplace is way too overpriced. Fix that, and you'll have a winner.
freyberry said:
So what? It doesn't matter one bit how many trillions of processes the OS supports, when third party developers are not allowed to make their applications run in the background!
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Click to collapse
a completely redesigned kernel
i dont get it ..
i dont understand what the problem is.. WinMo7 will be great for microsoft..
if everyone thinks multitasking and the ability to install cabs are so important.. iphones wouldnt be as popular.. and NOT everyone buys an iphone for the STATUS symbol.. it's popular because it has a lot of useful APPs.. and the UI is logical and useful.. unlike the current WinMo 6.5
I am currently using a diamond 2 and if WinMo doesnt have all these non finger friendly feathers i wouldnt have to tweak it. So i dont see such a major issue with WinMo7 not being as customizable, because if it's functional it will be FINE.
Another issue i see people having is not being able to multitask.. it's not like there isnt any at all... and plus what type of multitasking are you doing on your phone anyways...? it's not a computer, as long as you can listen to music when your doing other things isnt that fine..? and plus if i were to choose between UI speed to multitasking .. SPEED would win in a land slide... it's no use to have multitasking ability when your phone isnt moving...
i think the general population will welcome this change in WinMo7. It will be finger friendly, have more useful apps, and better UI.. this alone will win back the most important sector to microsoft.. which is the GENERAL public...
skg22086 said:
i dont understand what the problem is.. WinMo7 will be great for microsoft..
if everyone thinks multitasking and the ability to install cabs are so important.. iphones wouldnt be as popular.. and NOT everyone buys an iphone for the STATUS symbol.. it's popular because it has a lot of useful APPs.. and the UI is logical and useful.. unlike the current WinMo 6.5
I am currently using a diamond 2 and if WinMo doesnt have all these non finger friendly feathers i wouldnt have to tweak it. So i dont see such a major issue with WinMo7 not being as customizable, because if it's functional it will be FINE.
Another issue i see people having is not being able to multitask.. it's not like there isnt any at all... and plus what type of multitasking are you doing on your phone anyways...? it's not a computer, as long as you can listen to music when your doing other things isnt that fine..? and plus if i were to choose between UI speed to multitasking .. SPEED would win in a land slide... it's no use to have multitasking ability when your phone isnt moving...
i think the general population will welcome this change in WinMo7. It will be finger friendly, have more useful apps, and better UI.. this alone will win back the most important sector to microsoft.. which is the GENERAL public...
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Click to collapse
the only thing that i want is: porting wp 7 or android 2.xx to touch pro.
skg22086 said:
i dont understand what the problem is.. WinMo7 will be great for microsoft..
if everyone thinks multitasking and the ability to install cabs are so important.. iphones wouldnt be as popular.. and NOT everyone buys an iphone for the STATUS symbol.. it's popular because it has a lot of useful APPs.. and the UI is logical and useful.. unlike the current WinMo 6.5
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Click to collapse
See this is part of the problem here, most of the iPhone users got it for a few reasons like because they wanted a smart phone but, didn't know better, it's a cool looking apple product or their friend has or talked about one. The iPhone had coolness factor, so that is why people grabbed them. A good chunk(most) didn't have a clue about a smartphone. I am diehard WM but, I'll admit the iPhone has some coolness factor and features I have been dreaming about for WM for a long time....
Now we move to Windows Mobile, there is tons of people who have these phones, why ? Because we can do what we want with them, tons of 3rd party apps, we can install them as we want to, on our time, taking after the model of a Windows PC. It allows us to make them our phones, not what the provider gives you and you have to deal with it.
The MarketPlace was a great idea and WM has needed it for a while. It also needs a way to manually install apps, like WM has always done to make everyone happy. It wants to hit the user market and the corporate market, it will need both. This will make both people happy, the people like us, who want to play, do what we want and the people who want a easy to use phone with the marketplace to get all there apps.
In this model, if the marketplace is kept up (always getting new apps), a newbie user would NEVER have to even install a cab for the entire time of owning a phone. This will allow a developer to be able to sell an app on media or on their own website for users to download and install as well as the marketplace.
skg22086 said:
i think the general population will welcome this change in WinMo7. It will be finger friendly, have more useful apps, and better UI.. this alone will win back the most important sector to microsoft.. which is the GENERAL public...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, WM needed a major overhaul, no question about it. Most experts think this is it, if they don't make it with the next version, they should get out of the game. The finger friendly thing is HUGE now, the iPhone showed it and they started some of it in 6.5, something that has been needed for a long time.
They have a good chance with this to bring the public back in, let's see if they can but, lets not abandon the people, like us, who made WM what it is today (we on here and PPG make good % of WM owners).
Time will tell and it will be interesting to see what happens here...I do look forward to the change but, still want it all, like it is now but, a lot better...
Dukenukemx said:
The way things are going with Windows Mobile 7, I can't see it lasting as a platform.
I understand why Microsoft wants to do this. The real money is in the marketplace, like how Apple is doing it. The problem is, the iPhone is a success not just for it's features or UI, but because it's an Apple product.
For example, there's been way better players then iPod, but people bought it for the status symbol it gives. Just like the iPhone.
If Windows Phone 7 isn't as open as Windows Mobile 6.5, then my next phone will certainly be based on Android. I expect a lot of other people to make that decision as well.
You can't expect iPhone or Windows Phone 7 to succeed? No Flash support, not allowing emulators, and complete control of what software you can install.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except the iPhone is already a success! I think Windows Phone 7 takes the best of the iPhone and the best from Windows Mobile.
You don't seriously think Microsoft should have left Windows Mobile in the same path as 6.5 do you? or even Photon? It would have left Microsoft stagnant with the same marketshare at best.
Remember, the iPhone hasn't stolen from Windows Mobile (its market has actually stayed the same to a slight growth) but the iPhone has brought so many more people into the smartphone market.
It also amusing that you judge so quickly when nothing has been said about development except for leaked documents that do infer multitasking. Perhaps you can spread more judgement after MIX next month.
DavidinCT said:
Windows Mobile, there is tons of people who have these phones
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Click to collapse
If this was true, you wouldn't be saying
DavidinCT said:
Yes, WM needed a major overhaul, no question about it. Most experts think this is it, if they don't make it with the next version, they should get out of the game.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft's market share was plummeting, yet everyone here on XDA acts like it was all good and now is when it will fail after their "freedom" is removed
Oh, and as for
almaster said:
i have a a blue angel (imate pda2k) and this is why i hate the new windows 7
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Click to collapse
I don't understand that sentence at all
why microsoft will continue with wm6.5
is they not satisfy for wp7s or the partner ( HTC, SAMSUNG, ...) not like it?
does WP7S made only for microsoft phones? same strategy of iphone?
like they say spain restaurant not have all the data on the net, who have?
i think WP7 not finished yet but they announce it early.
sjouni said:
why microsoft will continue with wm6.5
is they not satisfy for wp7s or the partner ( HTC, SAMSUNG, ...) not like it?
does WP7S made only for microsoft phones? same strategy of iphone?
like they say spain restaurant not have all the data on the net, who have?
i think WP7 not finished yet but they announce it early.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
2 pathes, 6.5 is for business business users (Pure business & no fun) while 7 is for having fun and doing SOME work done.
No iphone strategy (vertical strategy as steve ballmer said) "We sell software to people who make devices".
This is a good time in MWC10 (FEB) to announce WP7 so they can announce the Development tools in MIX10 (MAR) and release the stuff to develop with VS2010 (APR)
jaxouk said:
Im the same mate, seems very iphoney,.......... can see everyone switching to android or buying windows 7 phones and installing 6.5 on them (like people where doing with xp when vista came out)
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Click to collapse
I think you need to get over it if Microsoft didn't make this move, Windows Phones would be stuck in the same state they are now: old, retarded, slow and inconsistent.
This change is NEEDED and people like you are the folks that'll hold it back. Buy a new phone.
burnblue said:
If this was true, you wouldn't be saying
Microsoft's market share was plummeting, yet everyone here on XDA acts like it was all good and now is when it will fail after their "freedom" is removed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WRONG. They needed to make this move. The iPhone hasn't got much freedom and look at the HUGE adoption there.
on my opion, WM is my top choice, android? may be in the future
the no.1 advantages for WM is the register, however it is fat, and it is contains hard understanding digits, but this is the way we can modify the system, even something on the base. only WM supports modify register by handset users.
someone says andorid is open source, but i dont believe it is the keyword. WM is brother of WINDOWS, every app developer could use their tool to develop WM apps. For example, Visual Studio has WM compiler.
WM supports modify desktop themes, includ background, tool bars, and soft keys, i think almost handset users could use WM as normally without manila.
WM has too many levels of menu on system setting, but we always find what we want in the end, but android doesnt give us this.
on other hand, android's app is developing very fast, because it is open source, absolutely free, but android has too many things should learn from WM. app market and open source are good idea, but operating system is the keyword.
why WM still losing market? 64k color screen, tardy in app market, expensive handset especially in developing countries, no multi-touch and so on. but WM is the best operating system ever i used, sybian is very silly in touch screen, iphone os doesnt support multi-task.
may be android is my future choice couple years later, but now, WM is my choice.
this is my personal opion, i hope everyone discuss with me as a gentle. thanx
......yeah, the day that AT&T drops an up-to-par android device, I will never own another WM6.5 device again. Now Windows 7 Phone... hmmmmmmmmm
dressanderc said:
......yeah, the day that AT&T drops an up-to-par android device, I will never own another WM6.5 device again. Now Windows 7 Phone... hmmmmmmmmm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
windows phone 7 disable install by cab and external sd is worst idea, large pre-installed ssd should rise handset's price, will loose huge market in developing countries.
windows phone 7 is closer to stupid iphone os, no external sd, no cab, no modified desktop. so sad
froyo is next generation android, i haven't try that, but i hope it will be more tasty.
bestfan said:
windows phone 7 disable install by cab and external sd is worst idea, large pre-installed ssd should rise handset's price, will loose huge market in developing countries.
windows phone 7 is closer to stupid iphone os, no external sd, no cab, no modified desktop. so sad
froyo is next generation android, i haven't try that, but i hope it will be more tasty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, I believe android is the OS of tomorrow. I mean, eventually Google will own everything right? I've got my eye on the Dell Streak.
dressanderc said:
I agree, I believe android is the OS of tomorrow. I mean, eventually Google will own everything right? I've got my eye on the Dell Streak.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
if android supports modify register (or something like register), my next handset should be that...hah
i hope VODAFONE NZ will release more android or WM handsets, they only focus on sybian and iphone,......... bloody hell
Android actually has a future
I love WM, but this is the last of the operating system as we know it. As a noob, I have done more with this phone than I ever thought was possible. Window Phone 7 won't allow us to do the things we have done with 6.5. Also, now with Microsoft changing the game, there will be no new apps developed for 6.5. The iPhone offers no freedom. Microsoft is following Apple in suit, limiting freedom. I don't understand Symbian. Palm is dead. So, my next handset will be an Android. I'm sure next to Apple, Andoid will be #2 system to develop for.
dressanderc said:
......yeah, the day that AT&T drops an up-to-par android device, I will never own another WM6.5 device again. Now Windows 7 Phone... hmmmmmmmmm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only problem with that is they hafta get apple's tit outta their mouth first and as long as they are pushing the iPhone you can forget it.
Just my 2cents
03hdfatboy said:
The only problem with that is they hafta get apple's tit outta their mouth first and as long as they are pushing the iPhone you can forget it.
Just my 2cents
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
iphone is too expensive, some of my friends are using iphone now, i tried that, looks like handy gameboy.
tekgurl said:
I love WM, but this is the last of the operating system as we know it. As a noob, I have done more with this phone than I ever thought was possible. Window Phone 7 won't allow us to do the things we have done with 6.5. Also, now with Microsoft changing the game, there will be no new apps developed for 6.5. The iPhone offers no freedom. Microsoft is following Apple in suit, limiting freedom. I don't understand Symbian. Palm is dead. So, my next handset will be an Android. I'm sure next to Apple, Andoid will be #2 system to develop for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sybian is stupid as well, i tried 5800XM, bull**** touch screen UI. also i hate the certificate about app installation. S40 is good os, but s60 is bloody silly.
dressanderc said:
......yeah, the day that AT&T drops an up-to-par android device, I will never own another WM6.5 device again. Now Windows 7 Phone... hmmmmmmmmm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah..me too..hah
TP2 is my last WM handset, sure it
tekgurl said:
... Palm is dead. So, my next handset will be an Android. I'm sure next to Apple, Andoid will be #2 system to develop for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Palm was purchased by HP for several hundred million. Rumor is that WebOS will be used on a tablet HP will put out later this or early next year.
Had N1 for 3 months now. Decided to stop by my old TP2 forum.. hehe.
I'll be short. I'd gladly spend another $600 and sell my last pair of socks to go from WM to Android device.
If you're still on TP2.. I dunno what to say not to make you feel bad... but seriously, throw that **** out the window and get an android phone, even G1 is better than anything WM-based.
I'm saying that as a guy who had WM phone since 4.0, back on Cingular 6125 (or w/e it was).
P.S: and trust me, the xdandroid that runs on TP2's flimsy hardware is nothing in comparison to a proper android device.
There. My $.02.
windows phone 7 disable install by cab and external sd is worst idea, large pre-installed ssd should rise handset's price, will loose huge market in d
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, I believe android is the OS of tomorrow. I mean, eventually Google will own everything right? I've got my eye on the Dell Streak.
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Click to collapse
Nah, I've got MY EYE on the Dell Streak. Lol. Find ur own new ultimate tech device. Juss kidding. We on da same page. I can't wait till it drops. There's nothin out there touching it at the moment, That's a tablet and a phone and has dual cam ;P
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Sent from my AOSP on XDANDROID MSM
demandarin said:
Nah, I've got MY EYE on the Dell Streak. Lol. Find ur own new ultimate tech device. Juss kidding. We on da same page. I can't wait till it drops. There's nothin out there touching it at the moment, That's a tablet and a phone and has dual cam ;P
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Sent from my AOSP on XDANDROID MSM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm looking at the Samsung Galaxy S (if it gets quickly rooted and can flash custom roms) or the Aava Mobile dev phone with the intel moorestown soc (which runs Meego and Android natively. WIN!).
I think both of these phones have advantages over the Streak.
Speaking of tablet/phones, have you seen the S7? Makes the streak it's lil biotch. lol
I wouldn't get either personally.
bestfan said:
if android supports modify register (or something like register), my next handset should be that...hah
i hope VODAFONE NZ will release more android or WM handsets, they only focus on sybian and iphone,......... bloody hell
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, it's called Linux. If ADB, recovery, SU and Busybox are working on a rooted Android phone, there's an amazing about of customization, fixes, etc (like regedit kinda) that can be done in Android.
There's even desktop apps that will let you modify android apps and let you push them back to the phone.
bestfan said:
the no.1 advantages for WM is the register, however it is fat, and it is contains hard understanding digits, but this is the way we can modify the system, even something on the base. only WM supports modify register by handset users.
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Click to collapse
LOL, I find that hilarious, because I find WM and windows's largest DISADVANTAGE/disaster is the registry. *nix is fully customizable/editable like windows, and arguably much more logical/less of a clusterf**k than the registry. I think WM is all but dead at this point. WM7 looks pretty weak, and android has already surpassed WM6.5 in a short time.
I have a tilt2, and there's no doubt my next phone WILL be an android phone. WM is a walking zombie at this point in my mind.
When you get right down to the ACTUAL subject of this section, the clear winner TODAY is WM. While Android may be the future, WM is far more capable out of the box than Android; case in point, Exchange Sync. Granted, there are a growing number of apps available which help to level things a bit, the question was about the O/S's not them and app support. And the comment about the difference in hardware, well look at the EVO and HD2.
Now, I have no idea what the future will bring, but I do know that today, as a business user, Android does not meet all my needs. Those that will argue this will start with the apps available, which actually serves to make my point.
I am in this forum because of this question, but will make my own determination which suites me better and won't get caught up in any of the hype.
hvbelton said:
When you get right down to the ACTUAL subject of this section, the clear winner TODAY is WM. While Android may be the future, WM is far more capable out of the box than Android; case in point, Exchange Sync. Granted, there are a growing number of apps available which help to level things a bit, the question was about the O/S's not them and app support. And the comment about the difference in hardware, well look at the EVO and HD2.
Now, I have no idea what the future will bring, but I do know that today, as a business user, Android does not meet all my needs. Those that will argue this will start with the apps available, which actually serves to make my point.
I am in this forum because of this question, but will make my own determination which suites me better and won't get caught up in any of the hype.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know how "more capable" somehow equates to simple Exchange support, but if that's all that matters then RIM > Everyone else.
How about pointing to some other areas where WM is the "clear" winner? Because I can definitely point to many areas where Android trumps WM. Thanks for playing though.
Hey Guys,
just starting a new threat to look for info and ideas about the next subject:
I am going to get a new phone in the next few months. Probable looking for an HTC with WP7.
I dont know if I will like it and I am wondering if these new phones could be flashed back to WM6.5.
Of course I would be willing to help with all kinds of WP7 ideas an tests, even though I am not a developper myself.
So, the statement for the new threat:
--Would it be possible/worhty to make 6.5 roms for WP7 hardware?--
Possible, sure. Likely, no. WM6.5 is, for most intents and purposes, dead. Highly unlikely that anyone puts in the time and effort needed to hack the bootloader, etc of specific devices in order to backport the old OS.
Sander101077 said:
Hey Guys,
just starting a new threat to look for info and ideas about the next subject:
I am going to get a new phone in the next few months. Probable looking for an HTC with WP7.
I dont know if I will like it and I am wondering if these new phones could be flashed back to WM6.5.
Of course I would be willing to help with all kinds of WP7 ideas an tests, even though I am not a developper myself.
So, the statement for the new threat:
--Would it be possible/worhty to make 6.5 roms for WP7 hardware?--
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think u can buy a 6.5phone now
If you're looking for backwards compatibility Windows Embedded Handheld 7 (based on WM6.x) is scheduled for the second half of 2011.
I've been following the conversations backstage and I don't think WM6.5 is dead at all. WP7 has a lot of shortcomings when it comes to business use. No copy/paste, less customization, etc. In fact, it is a dumb smartphone which is more geared for the iphone type consumer...those who would gladly trade endless customization and features for simplicity. Those who look at phones as fashion accessories and toys rather than something designed to get work done more efficiently. Sadly, the market for this is much much larger than the market for serious smart devices. Steve Jobs figured this out which is why the iphone is such a big hit, but most of us here have been looking at these folks going "wow, you can copy/paste now? Neat. I've been doing that for years!".
I had a list at one point which detailed all the things that WP7 does NOT do that 6.5 does and I can tell you that enterprise customers will not accept WP7 as a replacement to WM6.x. Many large companies out here are Microsoft partners with exchange servers, sharepoint, Office suitefor all employees and as a matter of IT support, they only support Windows Mobile so that their IT departments only have to manage MS products. If hey were to cut off SM6.x entirely while rolling out WP7, purchasing departments across the country would make a huge shift to blackberry. I'm certain that this is why RIM decided to go forward with plans for a new OS and why HP purchased Palm with their WebOS. They are both counting on MS doing this.
However, through conversations with various insiders at MS, it appears these fears are unfounded. Windows 6.5 is expected to continue being developed even into next year with possible future upgrades to the OS itself. WP7 will not support skins such as the HTC Sense interface, and because of the business users with business devices - particularly full qwerty devices like the Treo, Glisten, etc - they do expect to continue development.
I have heard rumors that there is actually a long development cycle planned for WM which involves the next iteration of Windows Mobile which will be renamed Windows 7 Professional. This would be in line with MS and their way of doing things and matches up nicely with Windows 7 and Windows Phone 7. I don't know how much of this part is true and how much is just rumors floating around backstage, but it makes a lot of sense.
kfreels said:
I've been following the conversations backstage and I don't think WM6.5 is dead at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
..not dead....dying. The next iteration of 'WM' is BASED on 6.5.x and then in 2011 a version (based on WP7) with XNA and silverlight support is due.
Here's some info on the next 'WM' release....~note...this is not a 'WP' release so doesn't fall under the 'Windows Phone' umbrella, it's a new version of Windows Mobile - Embedded and it;s backwards compatible.
http://www.fiercemobilecontent.com/press-releases/microsoft-outlines-commitment-future-enterprise-handheld-devices
..also mentioned here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=6917106&posted=1#post6917106
Moving to General .
I will delete this post with in a week or two, so it doesn't clutter.
kfreels said:
WP7 has a lot of shortcomings when it comes to business use. No copy/paste.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
God, I'm so tired of hearing this. There will be copy&paste, they said it often enough...
I had a list at one point which detailed all the things that WP7 does NOT do that 6.5 does and I can tell you that enterprise customers will not accept WP7 as a replacement to WM6.x. Many large companies out here are Microsoft partners with exchange servers, sharepoint, Office suitefor all employees and as a matter of IT support, they only support Windows Mobile so that their IT departments only have to manage MS products.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All the products you name (Office, Sharepoint, Exchange) are natively supported by WP7. Have you seen ANY WP7 demo video lately?
Ok now... we all have heard whats bad, or not so good or what can be improved with WP7.
But on the other hand anyone has good news for all of us to contiune with windows and not jump ship to android or iPhone. At the moment I dont see the why I would want to buy an WP7 yet! maybe in few years when it matures as an OS.
Windows phone 7 gives you a lot of choice in hardware devices, unlike the iPhone, unless you don't mind being stuck with one manufacture (see how that turned bad with the iPhone 4 reception issue). I think this is a big point especially for people who like physical keyboards and different shapes or colours.
Now you are thinking "Android offers a wide range of hardware as well, so what is the difference?" One thing if find bad about the Android ecosystem is OS fragmentation. I know being open source is a big plus, but in this case it backfired because anyone can put the OS on any device, so we ended up with a lot of devices not getting upgraded by their OEMs/carriers rather than let Google handle updating devices.
Microsoft is tackling this problem by putting minimum device requirements so that any update Microsoft releases, it can be easily pushed to all kinds of devices.
So overall, I think Microsoft is approching this market in a balanced manner, they are not extermly closed (think Apple) nor very open (Google). Which is a good thing for developers and end users.
There are a lot of other things, like Windows Live and Xbox integration (if you care about those).
From a developer point of view, it's also the most attractive mobile platform that ever been made. It's amazingly easy to make complex apps and games, and it's a standard way of doing it, opposed to iPhone and Android's "lets reinvent the wheel" technologies.
Plus, it's the only phone development environment that have a visual editor (Expression Blend), which is a big plus for rapid development.
(Not to mention, you don't have to buy a Mac to code for it!)
From a consumer point of view, it's a strong phone, works with all existing services, specially all Microsoft ones, but also all the others. It'll be the first phone with Windows Live Messenger available on, and Zune integration.
Basically you get all the power of Microsofts platforms, in a single device, without the limitations of Apple. Everybody who's used to using Windows will get a greater experience with this phone, than any other phone on the market.
So it's a win/win/win, situation
I'm getting one just for the fact it has Zune on it, this alone makes it worthy of a purchase if you use multimedia heavily.
Also I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the things the OP consider "bad" is what the majority considers "good"
Windcape said:
So it's a win/win/win, situation
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahaha.
Good points.
The biggest thing is the UI. Frankly put; it's innovative, attractive, intuitive, and just works really well. When you get your hands on one and play around with it for a few minutes you'll see.
I'm stoked about Window Phone 7. I know if won't have as much freedom out the door as Windows 6.5 but I've seen the demo's and from what I can see it looks great. Here's my top 10 good list:
1. Actual Xbox Live integration with achievements
2. Finger Friendly
3. Sharp modern UI
4. Hubs that bring in a multitude of information that covers the work of many apps, but all in one place.
5. Good minimum requirements
6. Easy and well thought out development tools.
7. Everything about Zune all in one Hub.
8. Great Social networking integration
9. Multiple exchange accounts, emails and calendars.
10. Great use of Office on mobile.
What draws me to WP7 is really metro. I've tinkered a lot with windows phones over the years leveraging different UIs, skins, themes, etc. But really my favorite UI for my phone thus far has been titanium. I prefer the typography. Being that wp7 is a titanium enhancement, it suites me very well.
darkmurder said:
I'm getting one just for the fact it has Zune on it, this alone makes it worthy of a purchase if you use multimedia heavily.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should be able to use Zune with any windows phone. I have zune pass and use my omnia II to play the drm music, so you don't have to wait for wp7 to have a "zune" phone.
WTB Zune Pass in Europe already!
Windcape said:
WTB Zune Pass in Europe already!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's great, my only compliant is that you have to backup your mp3s if you purchase them or when you use your credits. It doesn't let you redownload them, probably because of some legal nonsense.
It's not too bad with 25GB from Skydrive, and using the Gladinet client to map your cloud drive to a physical drive.
let's stop being "real" and start being realistic
I have a vague feeling that people on this topic are working for the Microsoft development team...
as a faithful user of the most advanced pocketpc ever built ever since it launched (htc universal or jasjar) I'll just reply to those "strengths"
First ond foremost, the windows mobile had its success because users were able to hack it and expand it BEYOND of what they payed for. if we limited ourselves to what M$ provided, this site wouldn't exist and the HTC would have gone bankrupt.
1. Actual Xbox Live integration with achievements
You have Xbox and yet you are going to be playing on a phone?
2. Finger Friendly
in addition to every single SW company having developed the touch finger application keyboard, there are devices with their own keyboards, which actually work MUCH better then the touch mode ever will because you can feel the keys and you're able to predict where the next one is, at least until they invent the physically morphing touch screen.
3. Sharp modern UI
simplistic doesn't mean modern....ever! there is a FLAT SQUARE and Arial TEXT on it...that's a post-it for retarded. SPB mobile shell for instance gave the smooth design and modern hi-tech look to 6.1 phones. their only limitation was the processor and the memory. but that's how the digital revolution started - microsoft made ever more demanding OSes and Intel made processors to match. If you start spinning in circles around an antiquated graphics and limited applications, why would they innovate?
4. Hubs that bring in a multitude of information that covers the work of many apps, but all in one place.
apps that cannot be made by anyone else without a license by microsoft. and no one is using microsoft products on their pocketpc's because they are inefficient, large and expensive.
5. Good minimum requirements
nokia's s40 phones require even less resources, and offer greater UI, usability and stability. and they are as customizeable as the win 7, and yet people don't seriously consider using them as a PDA capable to integrate with the market's dominant and upcoming applications.
6. Easy and well thought out development tools.
We'll see...
7. Everything about Zune all in one Hub.
Zune is a MUSIC PLAYER! PERIOD! it's function is to play music! what everything?
8. Great Social networking integration
if you're referring to that travesty of facebook integration, I used the Windows Live Messenger Beta and let me tell you how it works: the system makes assumptions that videos and most popular items demand our attention, and they are in big, while the rest is small, so it's not about keeping track of your friends, it's about flashing content to a moron public.
9. Multiple exchange accounts, emails and calendars.
Will we be able to activesync our device over the wi-fi or via internet??
10. Great use of Office on mobile.
I would gladly pay good money to see a microsoft developer use a touch-only phone to create and modify a corporate-standard excel or even word file...
Dude you are in the wrong thread.
This is where you should post -> WP7 is complete FAIL
vk2000 said:
I have a vague feeling that people on this topic are working for the Microsoft development team...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Take of your foilhat.
vk2000 said:
I have a vague feeling that people on this topic are working for the Microsoft development team...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not, but I'll apply for a position in 2 years time when I'm finished with my second bachelor.
vk2000 said:
if we limited ourselves to what M$ provided, this site wouldn't exist
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Funny, I thought that Windows Mobile development was the original topic of xda-developers. It's not like the name itself says so, no no.
vk2000 said:
1. Actual Xbox Live integration with achievements
You have Xbox and yet you are going to be playing on a phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. Welcome to 2010.
vk2000 said:
3. Sharp modern UI
simplistic doesn't mean modern....ever! there is a FLAT SQUARE and Arial TEXT on it...that's a post-it for retarded. SPB mobile shell for instance gave the smooth design and modern hi-tech look to 6.1 phones. their only limitation was the processor and the memory. but that's how the digital revolution started - microsoft made ever more demanding OSes and Intel made processors to match. If you start spinning in circles around an antiquated graphics and limited applications, why would they innovate?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see you have zero experience in usability or design. Go read some Jakob Nielsen, and come back when you find yourself in a suitable position to discuss usability design on phones.
vk2000 said:
4. Hubs that bring in a multitude of information that covers the work of many apps, but all in one place.
apps that cannot be made by anyone else without a license by microsoft. and no one is using microsoft products on their pocketpc's because they are inefficient, large and expensive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Clearly you been living in a cave for the last five years. The developer license also grants you the ability to host your applications on the marketplace, and is common practice for all mobile developers. Even Google have it for Android.
vk2000 said:
5. Good minimum requirements
nokia's s40 phones r equire even less resources, and offer greater UI, usability and stability. and they are as customizeable as the win 7, and yet people don't seriously consider using them as a PDA capable to integrate with the market's dominant and upcoming applications.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See again you completely misunderstood what the customers want. And the minimum requirements is so you don't get ****ty phones like all Android devices from 2009 / early 2010.
vk2000 said:
6. Easy and well thought out development tools.
We'll see...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, we already seen. Visual Studio and Expression Blend goes years back, and is popular and known development tools. Microsoft have the largest developer community on earth (MSDN), and they are so far the only who managed to actually create so much community around their technology and tools. Even the Linux community can't follow here.
And most of the developers in MSDN are professionals, so it's used for solving real-life problems. And if you're a consumer, and not a developer, you won't understand the importance of this.
Also XNA available on WP7 means it's the first phone with a gaming framework available from day one.
vk2000 said:
7. Everything about Zune all in one Hub.
Zune is a MUSIC PLAYER! PERIOD! it's function is to play music! what everything?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, Zune is a online music-service, a desktop music player ,and a music-player device. And in WP7, the online service and desktop client will work along with the phone. A lot of us like to use our smartphones for music, for example, while biking to work or studies.
vk2000 said:
8. Great Social networking integration
if you're referring to that travesty of facebook integration, I used the Windows Live Messenger Beta and let me tell you how it works: the system makes assumptions that videos and most popular items demand our attention, and they are in big, while the rest is small, so it's not about keeping track of your friends, it's about flashing content to a moron public.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft don't make assumptions, they got detailed statistics over the functionality people use in Windows Live Messenger. Just because you don't behave like the other 300 million users, doesn't make it wrong.
It's designed for the average consumer, and they done a very good job with that. More consumers = more people to buy our apps = more money for us.
vk2000 said:
9. Multiple exchange accounts, emails and calendars.
Will we be able to activesync our device over the wi-fi or via internet??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Both
vk2000 said:
10. Great use of Office on mobile.
I would gladly pay good money to see a microsoft developer use a touch-only phone to create and modify a corporate-standard excel or even word file...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Phones are less meant for modify, as for accessing the information in the said data.
It's handy if you're on the road, and want to pull out some data to compare with people you're discussing with or similar.
vk2000
3. Sharp modern UI
simplistic doesn't mean modern....ever! there is a FLAT SQUARE and Arial TEXT on it...that's a post-it for retarded.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You nail that one!
Actually the font is Segoe WP. And the flat squares will be replaced with images and partially display icons among others.
Which makes it even better than just a bunch of techno-color icons.
clearly you guys are either very young or like to suck up to your (hoped) employer a lot
quoting the only author you know, doesn't make you smart, it makes you a charlatan. you should find a good dictionary if you don't know what that word is, since you clearly don't understand what I am saying anyway.
If you're going to play games on something small, you should buy a PSP
and
I've been following the IT development ever since I was 8 and computers ran on Windows 3.11
I don't require a degree in design to state clearly as a user who is going to pay 300-1000 euros, that a PDA should be
1) USABLE
2) reliable
3) USABLE
4) customizable and upgradeable
the fact that people are buying does not mean that the product is good, they're either poised with offensive marketing, like apple does, or they don't have any better choice! Statistics are meaningless more often then not, and you would know their significance if you studied statistics, 4 different types of sociology, macroeconomics and international financial relations, on your way to your M.Sc., like I did
games on the phone existed since Sun decided to make Java for mobile markets, so... a decade of "nothing new" to you . if windows 7 was able to reach the sophistication of the mobile gaming consoles, it would have been something, otherwise it's a child's toy, not suitable for business!
given you know nothing about the mobile market before you learned to talk and talk-back, I'm not surprised you would be satisfied even with yet another shade of "solitaire"
and as for my design capabilities, my photographic portfolio and web-design are always a winner what do you got to offer besides a big tongue and lack of arguments?
Windcape said:
Actually the font is Segoe WP. And the flat squares will be replaced with images and partially display icons among others.
Which makes it even better than just a bunch of techno-color icons.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
we went from 3d transparent and interactive icons BACK to a SQUARE 1, junior...
you should familiarize yourself with the hard work of so many people on this forum who are trying to change the OS from "default to outstanding" for free and for the benefit of everyone
So you think your personal preferences makes up for the 300 million target users that Microsoft have in the Windows Live and Zune cloud?
You think you can invalidate a business-model just because someone done something similar before? You think the phone sucks because you don't like it, even you haven't got the slightest idea how it works, how to develop for it or how to sell applications for it (or for phones in general).
From a consumer, business and software-engineering point of view, WP7 is damn near perfect.
So how about you let us know how old you actually are, and what you actually study, if you absolutely want to include personal attacks in your qq'ing.
vk2000 said:
we went from 3d transparent and interactive icons BACK to a SQUARE 1, junior...
you should familiarize yourself with the hard work of so many people on this forum who are trying to change the OS from "default to outstanding" for free and for the benefit of everyone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And do you have any idea why they did this? Have you ever read a usability study of a smartphone? Have you ever done a usability study of any device, or interface at all?
Or could it be that the professionals know more than you do.