Develop Bugs

US TP2 up on HTC website. :D.

just found this. dont know if its been up for awhile or not, but i didnt see any other posts about it. Sooo i thought you guys might like to know. :].
http://www.htc.com/us/product/t-mobiletouchpro2/overview.html

I just looked at this, lol. I was wondering why not buy the T-mobile version to use on AT&T since they are painting it some stupid colors and taking longer to release. Since they are both US versions I would think I could unlock it and use it on AT&T.

iceman4357 said:
I just looked at this, lol. I was wondering why not buy the T-mobile version to use on AT&T since they are painting it some stupid colors and taking longer to release. Since they are both US versions I would think I could unlock it and use it on AT&T.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that's fine if you don't wanna have full AT&T 3G capability

I love that the TP2 is coming to the US, but why did TMobile change it to look like some crappy LG dumb phone? The european version looks so sleek and elegant, but this is ugly. Oh well, at least it's coming to the US.
Dave

DaveTheTytnIIGuy said:
I love that the TP2 is coming to the US, but why did TMobile change it to look like some crappy LG dumb phone? The european version looks so sleek and elegant, but this is ugly. Oh well, at least it's coming to the US.
Dave
@iceman4357, you should be able to get AT&T 3G if you get it from TMobile USA and unlock it. (It indeed supports the 850/1900 MHz used by AT&T 3G)
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Are you sure they are for the 3G bands and not just the GSM/EDGE bands? I beleive this version is only 1700/2100 for 3G speeds. AT&T 3G is 850/1900.

Raspster said:
Are you sure they are for the 3G bands and not just the GSM/EDGE bands? I beleive this version is only 1700/2100 for 3G speeds. AT&T 3G is 850/1900.
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Straight from the specs on the link in the OP:
Network
HSPA/WCDMA
* 1700/2100 MHz
* Up to 2 Mbps up-link and 7.2 Mbps down-link speeds
Quad-band GSM/GPRS/EDGE
* Quad-band 850/900/1800/1900 MHz
(Band frequency and data speed are operator dependent.)

SoberGuy said:
Straight from the specs on the link in the OP:
Network
HSPA/WCDMA
* 1700/2100 MHz
* Up to 2 Mbps up-link and 7.2 Mbps down-link speeds
Quad-band GSM/GPRS/EDGE
* Quad-band 850/900/1800/1900 MHz
(Band frequency and data speed are operator dependent.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
aren't those quadband frequencies for EDGE? that's why unlocked euro phones only get EDGE in the states. the 3G bands are the HSPA/WCDMA bands listed above the quad band.

Oops, guess I didn't read it right, thanks for catching my mistake.
Dave

sooo.. this is what then.. an uglier version of the European phone? minus the front camera and, apparently, internal radio? Doesnt even have the added 3.5mm jack.
Meh, im glad i got the other version. it looks way better imo.

T-Mobile US TP2 in Asia

Finally decided to get a T-Mobile US TP2
Q0. Other than the looks, what else is different between the International Unbranded HTC TP2 and the US T-Mobile TP2
Q1. I've been told the US 3G bands are different from the Asian / UK 3G bands. The Asian bands if I'm not mistaken are "HSDPA 900 / 2100". Can anybody cite the US bands? Also I know that 2100 is common for both US and UK... will that be enough to use 3G in Asia?
Q2. Obviously I would need to get the phone SIM unlocked. For once I couldn't find anthing on XDA to unlock the TP2. Any light on that would be great
Q3. I noticed that Hard-SPL is now available for TP2. I'm assuming that means I can flash it with any ROM. Would doing that automatically unlock the phone to be used with any SIM?
Need answers to these real fast guys... got a good deal on eBay.

0. mostly looks and 3g bands
1. tmobile 3g is strictly for tmobile 3g. anywhere else and its edge for you
2. no free sim-unlocker yet
3. Hardspl is for flashing roms...completely separate from sim cards

Oh man... that sux. I was really hoping that atleast one of the T-mobile bands would be compatible with the Asian 3G bands. Do you have any idea what bands T-Mobile operates on?

HSPA/WCDMA
1700/2100 MHz
Note the 2100 band is part of AWS which means it's not compatible with Asia 2100. T-Mobile 3G requires both 1700 and 2100 to operate. One band is upload and one is download.
Quad-band GSM/GPRS/EDGE
Quad-band 850/900/1800/1900 MHz

What exactly is the AWS?

leepriestenator said:
What exactly is the AWS?
Click to expand...
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Advanced Wireless Service, which utilizes band IV (1710-1755 out; 2110-2155 in) for CDMA, UMTS, and LTE

American T-Mobile Touch Pro 2 and travel

Will I be ok travelling with this phone to Europe and Canada and getting 3G? Will the bands work? If not, is there something that can be done to make it work? I'm abot to get one and would like to confirm.
Thanks.

tinpanalley said:
Will I be ok travelling with this phone to Europe and Canada and getting 3G? Will the bands work? If not, is there something that can be done to make it work? I'm abot to get one and would like to confirm.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the t-mobile rhodium supports UMTS 1700 and UMTS 2100 so if canada and/europe use those bands for UMTS (3G) then yes it will work. If not, the device is quad band GSM so no problem using voice and EDGE for data.
Also make sure the device is unlocked if you plan to put another carrier's SIMcard in the device.

tinpanalley said:
Will I be ok travelling with this phone to Europe and Canada and getting 3G? Will the bands work? If not, is there something that can be done to make it work? I'm abot to get one and would like to confirm.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure about Canada...but TmoUSA 3G bands are different than Euro-3G.
Unrelated, but worth mentioning: the T-Mobile USA international roaming charge for data is steep -- $15/megabyte.
If you got a Euro sim card that would fix the $, but not the radio (for 3G).

The T-Mobile version supports AWS and 2100 3G so works fine in Europe and most other locations. Had 3G T-Mobile and 3G Orange in the UK, but I would suggest a local SIM too. For the UK, both T-Mobile UK prepaid and Virgin UK prepaid work in a locked T-Mobile TP2 or get it unlocked for more choices.

jamssx said:
The T-Mobile version supports AWS and 2100 3G so works fine in Europe and most other locations. Had 3G T-Mobile and 3G Orange in the UK, but I would suggest a local SIM too. For the UK, both T-Mobile UK prepaid and Virgin UK prepaid work in a locked T-Mobile TP2 or get it unlocked for more choices.
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Click to collapse
You used a T-Mobile USA version of the TP2 in Europe and had a usable 3G data connection?? Hmmm...that's the first I've read of this.
If this is well-known (and if so, maybe I'm just clueless ) can you provide a link to more discussion, that is...uhh...evidence...of it? Not about what bands the USA version supports -- I know that part -- but other reports/disucssion of it actually working.
On the other hand, are there any reports of a Euro-TP2 that can work on 3G bands in the USA?

USA TMO TP2 will work on TMO 3G in USA. It may also work on WIND Mobile for 3G data here in Canada, not sure about voice as they are using some strange network setup.
As the phone is UMTS 2100 capable, it will get 3G data and voice in most places in Europe and Asia.

quid246 said:
USA TMO TP2 will work on TMO 3G in USA. It may also work on WIND Mobile for 3G data here in Canada, not sure about voice as they are using some strange network setup.
As the phone is UMTS 2100 capable, it will get 3G data and voice in most places in Europe and Asia.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you tried a TmoUSA TP2 in Europe or Asia -- yourself -- and accessed 3G data?
I'm still doubtful, but I actually hope I'm wrong 'cause I'd love to be able to get 3G data on my TmoUSA TP2 while traveling in Europe...as long as I get a Euro sim card. Otherwise, faster data just means more roaming-$$.

MCbrian said:
Have you tried a TmoUSA TP2 in Europe or Asia -- yourself -- and accessed 3G data?
I'm still doubtful, but I actually hope I'm wrong 'cause I'd love to be able to get 3G data on my TmoUSA TP2 while traveling in Europe...as long as I get a Euro sim card. Otherwise, faster data just means more roaming-$$.
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Check the specifications. It supports both 1700 and 2100 UMTS. That means it will work in Europe. ALL Touch Pro 2's have 2100MHz UMTS and quadband GSM, every single one of them, including the CDMA ones. The carrier specific ones add certain bands.
European Touch Pro 2s have UMTS 900
CDMA Touch Pro 2s have CDMA bands
T-Mobile USA has 1700MHz AWS band
AT&T has 850/1900MHz UMTS

TP2 overseas vs versions
I believe, as I've use phones often in the US and overseas, that T-mobile uses 1700 UMTS in the US, but that their TP2 is also 2100 UMTS. Just as At&t Tilt uses 850 & 1900 UMTS (At&t requires both frequencies), but also has 2100 UMTS. As such, both should work in most European, African and Asian countries (verizon and sprint you,re mostly screwed).
I believe the older Tytn II (tilt) was sold world wide as a 850/1900/2100 phone, so you could basically buy it anywhere and use it here on At&t only for 3g or T-mobile Edge only. Unfortunately, the TP2 is sold mostly as a 900/2100 UMTS worldwide outside the US, so you are stuck buying the US versions that correspond to the US networks. The bonus of the At&t tilit 2 version is that it is 850/1900/2100, so it will work almost anywhere. The drawback of the T-mobile TP2 is that 1700 is used by almost no one and while you can use it in most of the aforementioned places, you can't use it in the Americas outside the US & Canada.
Check out this handy wiki UMTS page: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Deployed_UMTS_networks
Just a note, I almost always pick up a pay as you go sim in other countries- much cheaper and very little hassle. Worth it for anything over a week stay. Maybe not as much so in some of Western Europe.

drjby4 said:
I believe, as I've use phones often in the US and overseas, that T-mobile uses 1700 UMTS in the US, but that their TP2 is also 2100 UMTS. Just as At&t Tilt uses 850 & 1900 UMTS (At&t requires both frequencies), but also has 2100 UMTS. As such, both should work in most European, African and Asian countries (verizon and sprint you,re mostly screwed).
I believe the older Tytn II (tilt) was sold world wide as a 850/1900/2100 phone, so you could basically buy it anywhere and use it here on At&t only for 3g or T-mobile Edge only. Unfortunately, the TP2 is sold mostly as a 900/2100 UMTS worldwide outside the US, so you are stuck buying the US versions that correspond to the US networks. The bonus of the At&t tilit 2 version is that it is 850/1900/2100, so it will work almost anywhere. The drawback of the T-mobile TP2 is that 1700 is used by almost no one and while you can use it in most of the aforementioned places, you can't use it in the Americas outside the US & Canada.
Check out this handy wiki UMTS page: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Deployed_UMTS_networks
Just a note, I almost always pick up a pay as you go sim in other countries- much cheaper and very little hassle. Worth it for anything over a week stay. Maybe not as much so in some of Western Europe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is correct. Apparently they are only able to have 3 3G frequencies (though NTT DoCoMo is currently working on a chip that can handle 8 frequencies!)
At first Europe only used 2100MHz 3G and AT&T had set up on 850MHz/1900MHz. Since those were the only 3 bands, HTC would put all three of those bands in its phones up to the Tilt (Kaiser). Once they made the Raphael though, there was 900MHz 3G in Europe and T-Mobile had chosen the AWS band.
Since they can apparently only put 3 bands in, and Europe now needed two for 900MHz/2100MHz, they could no longer put but of AT&T's frequencies in. So they must have just dropped them.
The AT&T version (FUZE) has 850MHz/1900MHz and also has 2100MHz, which is the dominant band for 3G in Europe. I am not sure if they are using 900MHz there yet, but they decided that was more important to put in the European ones than AT&T's bands.
T-Mobile's 3G phones get AWS and 2100MHz. I think AWS might use 2 of the bands because it is split on 1700MHz and 2100MHz (but a different 2100MHz apparently, maybe low 2100MHz vs high, I'm not sure)

petard said:
Check the specifications. It supports both 1700 and 2100 UMTS. That means it will work in Europe. ALL Touch Pro 2's have 2100MHz UMTS and quadband GSM, every single one of them, including the CDMA ones. The carrier specific ones add certain bands.
European Touch Pro 2s have UMTS 900
CDMA Touch Pro 2s have CDMA bands
T-Mobile USA has 1700MHz AWS band
AT&T has 850/1900MHz UMTS
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't just support 1700 and 2100, it uses both to work: 1700 for up/send and 2100 for down/receive. So, how does the Tmo USA radio cope without 1700 band for up/send when it's expecting it?
petard said:
T-Mobile's 3G phones get AWS and 2100MHz. I think AWS might use 2 of the bands because it is split on 1700MHz and 2100MHz (but a different 2100MHz apparently, maybe low 2100MHz vs high, I'm not sure)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, the full story (?) is that T-Mobile uses 1700+2100 (up/down) in the USA (which is what I already understood/knew) and in addition to that pair there's a separate slightly-different 2100 band that's used outside the USA? -- That, I didn't know.
If that's the explanation, that makes sense. But confusing that there's 2 different 2100 bands...
I may have to use some frequent-flyer miles and go check it out...

MCbrian said:
So, the full story (?) is that T-Mobile uses 1700+2100 (up/down) in the USA (which is what I already understood/knew) and in addition to that pair there's a separate slightly-different 2100 band that's used outside the USA? -- That, I didn't know.
If that's the explanation, that makes sense. But confusing that there's 2 different 2100 bands...
I may have to use some frequent-flyer miles and go check it out...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
According to Wikipedia, UMTS Band I (commonly known as 2100MHz) uses 1920 - 1980 for uplink and 2110 - 2170 for downlink while UMTS Band IV (AWS, 1700MHz) uses 1710 - 1755 for uplink and 2110 - 2155 for downlink.
Band II (1900MHz) uses 1850 - 1910 for uplink and 1930 - 1990 for downlink and band V (850MHz) uses 824 - 849 for uplink and 869 - 894 for downlink. The uplink and download for these are close, unlike bands I and IV.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS_frequency_bands
I just assume they are only able to have 3 different frequencies since I have yet to see a UMTS phone with 4 frequencies. But as I wrote this, I'm not too sure because there were phones with Band I, Band II, and Band IV which would mean that there are chips capable for 4 different frequencies? Who knows, maybe someone with actual technical knowledge about this can say.
Also according to that page, there are five different UMTS bands deployed across the world. A bit of a pain. That is more then GSM ever had and who knows if it will grow to even more. LTE also will be coming in before GSM is phased out, so we are going to have to have phones that have GSM, UMTS, AND LTE. GSM will be no problem, quadband has been standard for a while, but having a phone that has both your carriers UMTS and LTE frequencies is going to be tough unless you buy it from your carrier.
What they should have done is just used the band names, and not their frequencies. It would be much easier to know that Europe runs on band I and T-Mobile USA runs on band IV and the T-Mobile Rhodium supports both Band I and Band IV.

[Q] Which (global) WP7 phones work on TMobile US with 3G?

Right now "officially" there are only the HTC HD7 and Dell Venue Pro available on TMobile USA.
Does anyone know which other phones would work (after unlocking) with 3G on TMO US?

er...none?

I think so far only these two WP7 devices supports AWS bands.
On other platforms is different, as in the case of latest High-End Nokia devices (but Symbian OS):
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=2823&id2=2599&id3=2601&id4=2574&id5=2475&id6=2379
However it is a fact that the multi-band support, increases the cost. Is better to invest in features that do will be use
Best regards

Many WCDMA devices support the 1900 band, if you don't care the 1700 band.

but he asked about 3g...the phones don't offer 3g. Sure 2g works
3g nope

And consider 1700 AWS band with no longer be T-mo 3G after merger (AT&T needs the AWS band for LTE), you will be insane to spend $$$ on your own handset.
Even on AT&T side, there have been a lot of markets switched over to 850 band for 3G. So, even with a phone that support 1900 band 3G is no longer safe even on AT&T.

foxbat121 said:
And consider 1700 AWS band with no longer be T-mo 3G after merger (AT&T needs the AWS band for LTE), you will be insane to spend $$$ on your own handset.
Even on AT&T side, there have been a lot of markets switched over to 850 band for 3G. So, even with a phone that support 1900 band 3G is no longer safe even on AT&T.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends where you live. I have Omnia 7 on AT&T so it only has 1900 band, and I don't even notice a difference in 3G from my last phone. I'm sure it's probably worse, but I get 3G almost everywhere.

DatDereX1 said:
Depends where you live. I have Omnia 7 on AT&T so it only has 1900 band, and I don't even notice a difference in 3G from my last phone. I'm sure it's probably worse, but I get 3G almost everywhere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In my area, all 3G towers were 1900. Then AT&T switched all of them to 850 last year. This year, they switched back to 1900 again. AT&T has indicated in the past that it intends to deploy more 850 band 3G to improve coverage.

I thought the 1900 towers would stay 1900, and new ones would be 850

Virtually all 3G-850 american handsets, also have 3G-1900 band. In other hand, the carriers such as Telstra (Australia) and Telcom New Zealand have also 3G-850, with 3G-2100 band (not 1900); but these last are a minority.
The AWS bands with WCDMA technology (3G), are only used by TMoUS (as we all know); and fatally these bands will be used by "new" Latin American carriers like Nextel Mexico and others like VTR and Nextel Chile.
No larger carrier exists than TMoUS, that use AWS bands, so that all developments in AWS bands, should be first implemented in TMoUS ...until now

DatDereX1 said:
I thought the 1900 towers would stay 1900, and new ones would be 850
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Aparently not. Install new towers cost $$$.

iusauser said:
Virtually all 3G-850 american handsets, also have 3G-1900 band. In other hand, the carriers such as Telstra (Australia) and Telcom New Zealand have also 3G-850, with 3G-2100 band (not 1900); but these last are a minority.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's true but most ppl who buy unlocked/unbranded handsets buy the European models which typically only come with 1900Mhz band 3G for NA. Those handsets rarely ever supports 850Mhz.

If I use unbranded ROMs on TMO I have gotten 4G on both my HD2 and 7.

thuddome said:
If I use unbranded ROMs on TMO I have gotten 4G on both my HD2 and 7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not the ROM but the actual hardware that has the limitation although sometimes ROMs can have band limits as well.

foxbat121 said:
It's not the ROM but the actual hardware that has the limitation although sometimes ROMs can have band limits as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On both my HD2 and HD7 I will get an "H" signal. I was talking to T-Mobile support and they told me that was 4G and I was getting it because of the ROM. I asked why they would restrict the 4G if the hardware would do it and they said it was to control the number of devices on each network. I can only get it with an unbranded ROM. I'm not arguing, just telling you what they said. HD7 according to T-Mobile is NOT a 4G capable phone but mine gets an "H" signal all the time.

thuddome said:
On both my HD2 and HD7 I will get an "H" signal. I was talking to T-Mobile support and they told me that was 4G and I was getting it because of the ROM. I asked why they would restrict the 4G if the hardware would do it and they said it was to control the number of devices on each network. I can only get it with an unbranded ROM. I'm not arguing, just telling you what they said. HD7 according to T-Mobile is NOT a 4G capable phone but mine gets an "H" signal all the time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HSPA --> 'H' indicator on your handset (with custom ROM)
HSPA+ --> what T-Mobile advertises as "4G"
The H does not mean 4G. It means you have HSPA. In the carrier-specific ROMs they overwrite the H bitmap with one that shows 3G instead, to "help" their customers and avoid confusing them.

tai4de2 said:
HSPA --> 'H' indicator on your handset (with custom ROM)
HSPA+ --> what T-Mobile advertises as "4G"
The H does not mean 4G. It means you have HSPA. In the carrier-specific ROMs they overwrite the H bitmap with one that shows 3G instead, to "help" their customers and avoid confusing them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to know...thx

Will LTE 1700Mhz work on HSDPA+ 1700MhZ

So I heard LTE is backwards compatible with GSM and HSDPA + My carrier supports AWS band 4. Will this work? Has anyone tried it?

So you're basically asking if the AT&T Optimus G will work with T-mobile's 4G Network, right? The answer is NO. Or at least not by default. That's because, even though the phone has the correct band (1700/2100), you would still need the correct radio to be able to use that specific frequency (again 1700/2100) with your carrier. Much like the AT&T Galaxy Note I717. It supports the 1700 frequency, but in order to have that working band with Tmobile, we had to flash a Tmobile specific baseband/radio from the Galaxy s2, Galaxy S Blaze 4G and/or Tmobile Galaxy Note to be able to use the phone on the 1700 freq. So in this case, Unfortunately, Tmobile won't be releasing the LG Optimus G, so there won't be any radios available to use. But, the LG NExus 4 actually has the exact hardware specs or SOC as the LG Optimus G, so a radio/baseband port might be possible.
I hope this post made sense to you.

So what is the difference than taking a locked phone, unlocking it to another network that shares the same GSM frequency?

Nuxtux said:
So what is the difference than taking a locked phone, unlocking it to another network that shares the same GSM frequency?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually the two networks don't share the same GSM freq. Yes the AT&T LG Optimus G does have the AWS 1700 band in the hardware, but it is not enabled by default in the software. In order to enable the AWS 1700 freq, you'll need to use/flash the correct radio that carries the AWS 1700 freq. Like i said in the earlier post, one might be able to possibly port the a radio/baseband from the LG Nexus 4. Since it supports all pentaband frequencies.

So why would they disable it if the carrier uses 1700/2100 for LTE? I'm still not understanding its limitation
The carrier I want to bring it to uses AWS 1700/2100 3.5G.
Are they selling a phone that doesn't work with LTE on there network? Or can the phone only do 1700/2100 in LTE ?

Nuxtux said:
So why would they disable it if the carrier uses 1700/2100 for LTE? I'm still not understanding its limitation
The carrier I want to bring it to uses AWS 1700/2100 3.5G.
Are they selling a phone that doesn't work with LTE on there network? Or can the phone only do 1700/2100 in LTE ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not that the 1700/2100 bands are disabled. They are very much enabled but the radio is set to use them for LTE.

So you are saying even though LTE is backward compatible the band installed is software limiting the hardware to only allow LTE 1700/2100?

Nuxtux said:
So you are saying even though LTE is backward compatible the band installed is software limiting the hardware to only allow LTE 1700/2100?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LTE phones are backwards compatible because they support other bands for HSPA and GSM. For example, a carrier using 1700 MHz for LTE may use 850 and 1900 for HSPA but the 1700 will only work with LTE.

Nuxtux said:
So you are saying even though LTE is backward compatible the band installed is software limiting the hardware to only allow LTE 1700/2100?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You somewhat got it. It is the same problem with AT&T's HTC ONE X. The phone as the 1700 band for LTE, but when used with Tmo it only picks up 2G using the 1900 GSM. But with Tmo merging with Metro PCS, and partnering with Ericsson and Nokia Siemens Network, the H+ 1900 Spectrum will be available everywhere very soon. I read an article on tmonews.com that it should be done by the end of this year.

maybe the Canadian Telus version would work with T-Mo's AWS

it'll work you'll have to use the modem firmware from the N4 in order to use hspa+

vdub804 said:
it'll work you'll have to use the modem firmware from the N4 in order to use hspa+
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'll buy the att optimus g once this is confirmed working :good:

Any one got this one working? Got my Att OG, but edge is very slow. the T-Mo refarmed areas are OK though