Conflicts of interest with Android supporters helped kill Google's Nexus One project, but that is not stopping the search giant embarking on another bid to keep Apple-style control of the Android platform. Google is reported to be planning a unified user interface that will be imposed across Android products, ending the fragmentation that dogs the system, but also restricting partners' development of their own user experiences.
Full story HERE
if the UI makeover is any good then I wont mind but I do hope they dont make it harder on HTC to make sense for gingerbread as I quite like Sense UI.
I'm not that fussed on sense to be honest. I could take it or leave it.
I just hope that Google don't start to push people away by trying to monopolise everything. I can't imagine that HTC would be happy if they were having their lives made difficult by Google.
HTC have made an excellent phone in the desire, and if things like this make them think again about a new release using Android then it can only be bad for all of us.
True.
Android is open source so Google cant ban anyone from making thier own UIs so in that sense should be fine. if they do start to monopolise then yeah I will get worried as thats going the apple way.
This depends on the implementation if we (at least I) should take it as good or bad.
Good: google unifies the UI but also allows others (developers) to make their own UI and doesn't make hard the implementation of personal UI. In the end, after Froyo, google needs a nice and unified UI. Froyo brings many things which are needed, now the only thing lacking is nice and unified UI.
Bad: google unifies the UI and doesn't allow nobody to make their own UI. Then they will become like apple and I will personally refuse to purchase anything that has to do with them. To speak the truth, I chose the Android (Desire) device only because of Android openness. If someone takes that away from me, I will take my 500 euro from them. Simple as that. That is the least I can do.
I know this sounds terrible but to be honest I have no problems with Google semi 'monopolising' Android. Unity is so important for a mobile OS IMO. Look how far Apple has got with theirs.
Unlike Apple however, I trust Google not to go too far with it all...
If the UI is good, I dont mind.
I hate everytime Google released a new version of Android and I have to WAIT to get it.
Kill that fragmentation ... please ... please Google?
Whether we like it or not, it seems this is the direction that all OS's (i.e. Microsoft WP7) seem to be going in although Google has under gone more radical changes with it's new versions due to being so new and having developed so fast. Despite what that article above said Microsoft with WP7 are stopping (having stopped development of WM 6.5) OEM's from adding custom UI's so that they can roll out OS updates without OEM's getting in the way or delaying them. This means they can have uniformed releases of OS updates across the whole platform and them not be device dependant.
It's not a bad idea as long as they do not completely lock it down and still allow 3rd party enhancements to be added to the core OS with custom launchers and widgets IMO, as we don't all want or need to have our devices all looking exactly the same. But if it means new OS updates reach users faster as long as the hardware is capable that has to be good for both us the users and Android or any of these OS's.
Also remember Google has said after Gingerbread their will be a slow down of core changes to the OS as it just won't be so necessary as it starts to mature and should only require minor tweaks or fixes from then on. That's not saying development will cease just that it won't need to be so rapid and if by then there are a minimum spec being used with less custom UI's any new features should be easier and faster to apply to all the devices.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App
i think that what should be done is a unified UI by google which many users like but it will be awsome if their way of customizing is on top of the main core files and can be customized bu 3rd parties too. so there will be faster updates and the possibility of customizing it. something like a folder with the customizations that will be used instead of the system defaults......
Yes....What should I say????......
If(google==apple)
cout<<"**** THEM BOTH";
else
cout<<"Long live google!!";
That has to do it!(c++ style comment)
Is this project treble?
No
halleyrokz said:
Is this project treble?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is the security patch level of android. You can get more info about project treble here.
For everyone getting excited over Treble should keep this in mind
"Project Treble doesn’t necessarily mean that all handsets will see updates instantaneously, as Google is not handling them directly. OEMs are still free to tweak and skin the OS, as well as embed their own software into the Android OS release. So there’s still going to be some time taken for OEMs to build and test their own particular take on Android."
zelendel said:
For everyone getting excited over Treble should keep this in mind
"Project Treble doesn’t necessarily mean that all handsets will see updates instantaneously, as Google is not handling them directly. OEMs are still free to tweak and skin the OS, as well as embed their own software into the Android OS release. So there’s still going to be some time taken for OEMs to build and test their own particular take on Android."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Spot on. Treble just eliminates the need for new drivers, so OEMs don't need to wait for part manufacturers (like Qualcomm). But OEMs (Samsung, LG,...) are still the main culprit when it comes to wait times or not getting updates at all.
If community can make a custom ROM for a 5+ year old device, so can an OEM. Drivers are obviously there, they're just not interested in updating anything for more than 2 years (even less in case of low and mid range devices). Treble can't change that.
The only real solution would be "one size fits all" system, that gets pushed directly by Google to ALL devices - like desktop systems. But that would probably be way to big for available storage on phones ...
Sent from my OnePlus 3 using Tapatalk
Explorer23 said:
The only real solution would be "one size fits all" system, that gets pushed directly by Google to ALL devices - like desktop systems. But that would probably be way to big for available storage on phones ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We're going very offtopic here, but the topic interests me so, eh.
If we're talking about size here, we can follow a method that has been used in Linux live systems for a while now: a tarred (.tar) or squashed (squashfs) images. These provide a small yet ”fast enough” images that can be smaller than their uncompressed counterpart. Size is not of the constraint nowadays with these at developers disposal.
Alternatively, you can have a system that Treble tries to achieve: a base image (AOSP), OEM-specific changes and drivers, and abstraction for said drivers and changes. This system still relies on OEMs (and SoC manufacturers to an extent) to actively update their changes to the base system (and we know how lazy some OEMs can be with their updates).
But this is very offtopic, so let me offset the talk a little.
------------
To OP: No, that is not Treble. Treble isn't something you can quite see in user space (i.e Settings app). What you're pointing out is the security patch level, that is, how "updated" your current system are to the security patches Google are providing.
The level is laid out in date, so "November 1 2017" would be a fairly recent update. These patches get updated monthly, and seeing that you're using OxygenOS, means that you'll have to wait for OnePlus to push the security update after Google pushes them.
F4uzan said:
We're going very offtopic here, but the topic interests me so, eh.
If we're talking about size here, we can follow a method that has been used in Linux live systems for a while now: a tarred (.tar) or squashed (squashfs) images. These provide a small yet ”fast enough” images that can be smaller than their uncompressed counterpart. Size is not of the constraint nowadays with these at developers disposal.
Alternatively, you can have a system that Treble tries to achieve: a base image (AOSP), OEM-specific changes and drivers, and abstraction for said drivers and changes. This system still relies on OEMs (and SoC manufacturers to an extent) to actively update their changes to the base system (and we know how lazy some OEMs can be with their updates).
But this is very offtopic, so let me offset the talk a little.
------------
To OP: No, that is not Treble. Treble isn't something you can quite see in user space (i.e Settings app). What you're pointing out is the security patch level, that is, how "updated" your current system are to the security patches Google are providing.
The level is laid out in date, so "November 1 2017" would be a fairly recent update. These patches get updated monthly, and seeing that you're using OxygenOS, means that you'll have to wait for OnePlus to push the security update after Google pushes them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There never can be a one size fits all OS. Even Linux can't really pull that off for every device.
See this is another thing that will never happen. Oems will never upload their code changes to aosp as Google intends. Most of the time due to the fact that they don't write the code for the different parts like BT, Wifi chips etc. This code comes others which is closed sourced and paid for.
Treble will most likely never become much. Already too many people misunderstand what it does. That i can't blame people for. Things like the xda portal that are giving out bad info is gonna cause a huge amount of drama over it.
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
My 2 cents!
Inviato dal mio Redmi Note 8 Pro utilizzando Tapatalk
jshames said:
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Though I do agree this phone works best on stock rom, what's your point?
Custom ROMs are useless and it should be like producer intended? That sounds like iPhone.
The beauty of android and custom ROMs comes with the ability to try and pick your own favourite one and customisation. But indeed with this phone's mediatek chip it's not the best choice for custom ROMs.
Personally miui 12 is working and looking fine by me, I just like rooting and debloating it.
But I highly appreciate all development here on XDA.
If you don't, just ignore all development and enjoy your phone out of the box.
I don't mean to demean anybody's choice.
I'm just trying to understand concrete advantages at this point, if any.
donkyshot said:
Though I do agree this phone works best on stock rom, what's your point?
Custom ROMs are useless and it should be like producer intended? That sounds like iPhone.
The beauty of android and custom ROMs comes with the ability to try and pick your own favourite one and customisation. But indeed with this phone's mediatek chip it's not the best choice for custom ROMs.
Personally miui 12 is working and looking fine by me, I just like rooting and debloating it.
But I highly appreciate all development here on XDA.
If you don't, just ignore all development and enjoy your phone out of the box.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
jshames said:
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I' m quite satisfied with miui12 global, the only thing that's bothering me is the themes store. It doesn't allow changes of caller,sms of status bar,. I'll hope they fix it soon .
Just one simple question: Are you sure that debloating stops the stock rom from constantly sending potentially private data to China?
If you're using Facebook, WhatsApp, GApps and all that stuff it probably won't matter - as you're constantly surveilled anyway and don't seem to care much for privacy - if your data gets sent to China as well.
Can you be sure, custom rom doesn't have backdoors / data leaks by design (call it as you like) installed? Not at all. But with the stock rom I know for sure they are there.
jshames said:
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. There is no difficulty in unlocking your phone, it takes 168hrs and that's it, be patient. Installing custom recoveries will NOT brick your phone whatsoever, but not following instructions will. The issue with the CFW ROMs is due to MTK processor and lack of monetary motivation for developers that own this phone.
2. My Netflix and banking apps work fine, safety net passes while rooted on a Android 10 GSI ROM.
3. The camera does work, I can record video with EIS (amazing!), shoot 16mb photos, use HDR, astrophotography, and a bunch of other features I don't use. While the camera is a work in progress and did require a lot of testing/comparing, I have everything working, feature wise, that I had on MIUI.
4. Bricking only happens if you don't fully read. MTK processor phones have a lot more "traps" than Qualcomm. Are you going to avoid a classic car because of all the required maintenance on it versus a new car? No. I only ever bricked my phone when working with CFW ROMs. What does that tell you?
5. OTA? Are you're referring to keeping up to date with security updates? The ROM I'm running now has the latest security patch? Or are you saying flashing ROMs is too involved and you rather just tap a button and be done, which is nice too. Xiaomi publicly said they're not issuing updates for this phone next year, so where is your OTA then?
Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're comparing apples to oranges here. A refrigerator is not a smart device, and while a TV can be considered smart, there's nothing to upgrade or remove. Do you run stock Windows on your home computer or do you replace the OS with something better with less bugs? And in fact, I do swap engines from different cars into my car. Upgrading parts and wiring and software for the same car.
At the end of the day, if you want to flash ROMs and have ZERO chance of bricking, go with a GSI ROM. Zero bloatware/spyware, no notification issues, no battery drain, and infinite customizability. Start with Quack and go from there. If you want something that works with zero effort, stay stock.
XNyle said:
Just one simple question: Are you sure that debloating stops the stock rom from constantly sending potentially private data to China?
If you're using Facebook, WhatsApp, GApps and all that stuff it probably won't matter - as you're constantly surveilled anyway and don't seem to care much for privacy - if your data gets sent to China as well.
Can you be sure, custom rom doesn't have backdoors / data leaks by design (call it as you like) installed? Not at all. But with the stock rom I know for sure they are there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can never be sure, on any rom.
Bloatware is not all about safety or privacy, it's more about removing unnecessary files to save memory and disk space.
For instance, my root storage on miui 12 is just over 70%, where it used to be somewhere over 90%.
Ram optimised is 3 GB out of 6.
Besides removing, freezing apps is helping too.
OK, I understand you have dealt with the negative side of the equation, in terms of overcoming the obstacles. But what are the actual benefits?
In the past stock ROMs are stock android were fairly restrictive. This is no longer the case. Can you give a few examples of things you can do with a CFW that are exclusive?
wang1chung said:
1. There is no difficulty in unlocking your phone, it takes 168hrs and that's it, be patient. Installing custom recoveries will NOT brick your phone whatsoever, but not following instructions will. The issue with the CFW ROMs is due to MTK processor and lack of monetary motivation for developers that own this phone.
2. My Netflix and banking apps work fine, safety net passes while rooted on a Android 10 GSI ROM.
3. The camera does work, I can record video with EIS (amazing!), shoot 16mb photos, use HDR, astrophotography, and a bunch of other features I don't use. While the camera is a work in progress and did require a lot of testing/comparing, I have everything working, feature wise, that I had on MIUI.
4. Bricking only happens if you don't fully read. MTK processor phones have a lot more "traps" than Qualcomm. Are you going to avoid a classic car because of all the required maintenance on it versus a new car? No. I only ever bricked my phone when working with CFW ROMs. What does that tell you?
5. OTA? Are you're referring to keeping up to date with security updates? The ROM I'm running now has the latest security patch? Or are you saying flashing ROMs is too involved and you rather just tap a button and be done, which is nice too. Xiaomi publicly said they're not issuing updates for this phone next year, so where is your OTA then?
You're comparing apples to oranges here. A refrigerator is not a smart device, and while a TV can be considered smart, there's nothing to upgrade or remove. Do you run stock Windows on your home computer or do you replace the OS with something better with less bugs? And in fact, I do swap engines from different cars into my car. Upgrading parts and wiring and software for the same car.
At the end of the day, if you want to flash ROMs and have ZERO chance of bricking, go with a GSI ROM. Zero bloatware/spyware, no notification issues, no battery drain, and infinite customizability. Start with Quack and go from there. If you want something that works with zero effort, stay stock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
jshames said:
OK, I understand you have dealt with the negative side of the equation, in terms of overcoming the obstacles. But what are the actual benefits?
In the past stock ROMs are stock android were fairly restrictive. This is no longer the case. Can you give a few examples of things you can do with a CFW that are exclusive?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To clarify, you don't need to be rooted to use non-stock ROMs, and CFW ROMs are not GSI ROMs. Also, using root with the stock ROM works just fine, but then you don't know what else is going on behind the scenes, no matter how much you disable.
I guess I mainly use root for backing up apps/OS/partitions in the event of a brick or data loss. Certain stock apps you can't remove without root, should you choose to remain on the stock ROM. Have you ever spent hours setting up your phone/apps and then lost your data? Doesn't happen with a rooted phone as you can backup both apps (with data) and even the entire ROM with settings. This allows you to test new ROMs, new tweaks, all while easily returning to your previous save state with no ill effects and within minutes. Click a button, get a coffee and it's done. I tested 6 different ROMs and then returned to my current, all within an hour. While I don't necessarily keep the tweaks and ROMs I test, they do shed light on features that I never knew I wanted or even just inspire me to go down new rabbit holes.
On multiple occasions I have been locked out of my phone after an OS update or tweak . Without root, only option is a factory reset and loss of your OS settings. With root, fixed within minutes. Forgot your password on your back up phone, no problem with root.
I think with data harvesting being so popular/rampant, more and more people will leave spyware infested ROMs for vanilla AOSP ROMs.
jshames said:
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I get your point, this is an MTK device, technical difficulties are obvious, but now its easy to switch to custom ROM without downgrading from Android 10, moreover steps are pretty simple if you get it right, not too different than other devices, bricking was already solved with the leaked Preloader and LK, moreover if it weren't for Xiaomi putting Authentication in EDL the device was unbrickable without any hassle, though I get what you want to say, the device gets hard-bricked on most stupid things.
I guess you haven't tried out the CFW 2 and newer builds, they've fixed offline charging, Netflix 1080p and other things, and I personally never had problems with camera, ANX works fine and GCam too, photo quality is obviously better on GCam but 4k video recording is amazing too.
Every device's Custom firmware and ROMs comes with specific difficulties, if you're willing to look beyond this and appreciate how you're going to get Android version updates even after official support ends, the stock, beautiful feel, better performance and battery then I think you're gonna understand why Custom ROMs for this device is so important!
Peace
And by the way I love tinkering with anything that has an processor and runs Linux hehe :silly:
jshames said:
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
did you know what you talking about , did you try by your self some of Custom Roms ,spend some time modifying it, tweaks..
every single stuff that you have on MIUI that working, from first rom that come out with 80% we are now on 99 % of stuff that is working, especially NFC, that for me working on My Bootleggers ROM , with Gcam Bural 8 and 64mp working, Astrophotography that is better than MIUI pro mode that you need to searching for best ISO and SEC to get the best star pic, Gcam do that by self,set congif and make amazing photo.. then, XML modules.. thats another long story..
also , full customization of system , Customization of UI , so many options, so many ideas that developers with hard work and great work modify it..
Some of the features that are included on this ROM are:
Code:
* QS Rows and Colums
* Volume Keys: Wake up, skip tracks and switch according to rotation
* Show song album cover, visualizer and battery info on Lockscreen
* Power Menu Items
* Battery LED light settings
* Suspend Actions: Make your device disable GPS and switch to 2G when you're not using it
* AppOps: Manage your apps permissions in an advanced way
* Recent Styles: Dig the new Pie Quickstep recents, go back to the classic layout or use the Android Go layout
* Network icons: Show or hide the cross, switch between 4G or LTE
and the most import thing is NO BLOATWARE !
No Xiaomi application that you force you too use and the second most import thing is NO GOOGLE SERVICES that drain your battery..
you have,smooth ,fast , stable ROM and free hands to make you to look like you want to ,to make it like you want..
this is mine, one week without single crash of any app or random reboot, that is one of thing that blown my mind.. unofficial ROM that is amazing ..
https://youtu.be/Nc7eHRUYGkI
I get it guys.
There are many technical advantages which allow useful tweaks.
All I am saying is that for the typical user, who uses his device for internet, phone, email and Play Store apps, the ability to use these tweaks are not worth the trouble (unlike in the past, when the gap between stock Roms and customs Roms was HUGE).
You cannot tell me that it's easy-- there are scattered threads with advice all over the place, for all kinds of different setups (like what version of MIUI and phone you have, that require searching and putting together multiple posts and threads, figuring out what is up to date, in to figure out what to do, to avoid bricking and other bugs.
This is not criticism of anybody here or the developers. This is just the situation.
I think that some of the highly advanced users here, who perhaps spend hours a day on these forums or in development, have an easier time technically. I must admit that besides Xiaomi's 168 hr wait, the process looks daunting and risky. On this forum, is there a single unified guide that is up to date and reliably takes you through the whole process, even if I already have MIUI 12 installed?
The only point for me is Android update + security patch update in custom ROM.
jshames said:
Following several of the threads here there are recurring themes:
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
4. Bricking, etc
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Although I personally have not gone through all of these on this phone, I have done so on previous phones I've had.
I appreciate the abstract principle of "it's my phone and I should be able to do with it what I want!". Yet we don't have these expectations of any other consumer devices that we buy. For instance I don't expect to be able to custom modify my television, watch or refrigerator. We certainly don't demand that the manufacturer make this easy for us to do. "Hey, why doesn't Toyota let me change out the engine for a Chevy?".
Practically speaking, especially in light of the latest android versions and development of MIUI which are so feature rich, customizable and flexible, IMHO there seems to be so little to gained with unlocking versus the risks and endless time wasted related to the above mentioned issues.
With the factory stock ROM you get, without fussing:
1. SafetyCheck (ie pay apps, Netflix) that just works.
2. OTA
3. All built in hardware that just works. No "BT not working in the latest version", etc
4. In MIUI 12-- the excellent stock camera app which has improved photo performance dramatically, eliminates the need for GCam and all of the fussing with that.
5. Minor bugs that you can live with
I welcome comments here with convincing arguments in favor of custom ROMs, other than just enjoying the tinkering, which in my opinion doesn't justify the disadvantages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll try and directly answer + add my own stuff.
1. Endless technical difficulties with the process of unlocking, installing custom recoveries and ROMs, downgrading and bricking.
With CFW (Custom Firmware) you can be even safer on custom ROMs, as unbricking will no longer need a Mi Authorised Account. Some users have reported their devices bricking just from updating from MIUI to MIUI, which gave me another reason.
2. Various features of the RN8P not working properly with Rooted/unlocked/ customs ROMs, such as camera, Netflix, bank apps etc.
Camera works even better on custom ROMs, thanks to buffer fix module (can be applied to rooted MIUI). Magisk hide + magisk props will mostly have you covered in terms of banking apps. Netflix is a weird issue, as you either have it crash or Widevine L3 but it works so
3. Endless tinkering with GCam with ambiguous results at best, regarding performance and quality of output.
Nope, not at all. Stock cam was absolutely trash (80% of scenarios) and speaking from an XML creator's point of view, it's just us that has to do the tinkering. You just have to update and pick which XML you prefer. I haven't even bothered to download ANX cam, as GCAM already works well enough for me.
4. Bricking, etc
CFW has you covered here, even when going from A10. Just flash LR TWRP 3.1.1 or 3.3.1 and flash CFW + CFW ROM via recovery and safe.
5. Loss of OTA ability.
Honestly, I don't trust OTAs on MIUI after hearing people were bricked by doing that.
I went to custom ROMs for a peace of mind solution to...
- Better battery.
- Better support.
- Freedom with magisk.
- Trying out new features.
- Less bloatware with NikGapps Omni.
- Sometimes better performance.
So far, I've never felt the need to go back to MIUI.
Stock (global) ROM on my RN8P did not support (or allow) call recording. flashed Indonesia ROM to get that.
I still want to root the phone in order to:
* Backup apps including data with Super Backup
* Add folder shortcuts (for call recordings) to home screen
If there is a way to accomplish these without rooting, I'd love to know how.
When I started installing modified ROMs a few years ago on my devices (Galaxy Y and the Nexus 5) it was to have more options than what the factory system didn't have by default.
Having all those apps that manufacturers install and Google's suite of apps didn't suit me either. Especially with new research revealing how various companies use apps to mine user data.
At the time of the Nexus 5 there were several ROM's available and if I wanted the Google applications installed I needed to install a "GAPPS" package. Otherwise I was free to use the system only with the essential AOSP applications.
Time passed and between the Nexus 5 and the Oneplus 9 Pro some movement happened and now most of the ROM's already come with the GAPPS package included in their builds.
Apparently on the Oneplus 9 Pro the only two actively supported options are LineageOS and crDroid and those that don't include GAPPS packages by default.
What happened? Why already include GAPPS in the build?
Is it for technical reasons, convenience? What is the reason for developers to take this attitude and not delegate the choice to users?
...
I hear you! I'd like to get away from Google as much as possible. I don't trust them.
I think that the way Android is nowadays, the AOSP ROMS are limited in the services they provide and many apps are written for the Google API's included with Gapps. If you don't install Gapps, many apps will not work with vanilla Android alone. You almost have to conpletely divorce yourself from all the Google API's and any apps that rely on them just to get away from Google.
What it amounts to is a spartan living on a phone that's de-Googled. You can only install apps from F-Droid and a couple other places if you want Google-freedom. It's a choice that you have to decide to live with.
I prefer installing MicroG to get around part of the problem with apps that need Google's api's. I'm currently using crDroid with MicroG and the bank apps have been working great. Just like the GPS that in other times was very difficult to use. But now with osmAnd+ it's much easier.
I also have my own Nextcloud server installed on a cheap VPS that I use for various services such as: synchronizing contacts, calendar, notes and newsreader. I also have a mail server. All with the help of the YunoHost project.
crDroid is an excellent ROM but it has some features from other projects that I would like to try out. But as now several developers decide to provide the GAPPS package already included in their builds, it becomes more difficult to make the change.
You just have to search around and find special builds of ROM's that meet your needs.
I'm on a shoestring budget, myself. I have a few Android devices/phones, and an Odroid XU4 SBC with a 4TB hard drive as a server. It's not much, but it covers my needs. LOL
Edit: OsmAnd is a great offline mapping app.
Nouty said:
When I started installing modified ROMs a few years ago on my devices (Galaxy Y and the Nexus 5) it was to have more options than what the factory system didn't have by default.
Having all those apps that manufacturers install and Google's suite of apps didn't suit me either. Especially with new research revealing how various companies use apps to mine user data.
At the time of the Nexus 5 there were several ROM's available and if I wanted the Google applications installed I needed to install a "GAPPS" package. Otherwise I was free to use the system only with the essential AOSP applications.
Time passed and between the Nexus 5 and the Oneplus 9 Pro some movement happened and now most of the ROM's already come with the GAPPS package included in their builds.
Apparently on the Oneplus 9 Pro the only two actively supported options are LineageOS and crDroid and those that don't include GAPPS packages by default.
What happened? Why already include GAPPS in the build?
Is it for technical reasons, convenience? What is the reason for developers to take this attitude and not delegate the choice to users?
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's primarily for user convenience. Not many people are willing to use MicroG services because of it's unreliability
Nouty said:
When I started installing modified ROMs a few years ago on my devices (Galaxy Y and the Nexus 5) it was to have more options than what the factory system didn't have by default.
Having all those apps that manufacturers install and Google's suite of apps didn't suit me either. Especially with new research revealing how various companies use apps to mine user data.
At the time of the Nexus 5 there were several ROM's available and if I wanted the Google applications installed I needed to install a "GAPPS" package. Otherwise I was free to use the system only with the essential AOSP applications.
Time passed and between the Nexus 5 and the Oneplus 9 Pro some movement happened and now most of the ROM's already come with the GAPPS package included in their builds.
Apparently on the Oneplus 9 Pro the only two actively supported options are LineageOS and crDroid and those that don't include GAPPS packages by default.
What happened? Why already include GAPPS in the build?
Is it for technical reasons, convenience? What is the reason for developers to take this attitude and not delegate the choice to users?
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
in my opinion it doesn't make sense to build a rom without google apps because all roms have google services in them (since these are also used in the background for updates "project mainline") since android 10
If you're truly into de-Google-ifying, I'd start with /e/ OS.
ArmashOnXDA said:
It's primarily for user convenience. Not many people are willing to use MicroG services because of it's unreliability
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ChrisFeiveel84 said:
in my opinion it doesn't make sense to build a rom without google apps because all roms have google services in them (since these are also used in the background for updates "project mainline") since android 10
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, that's more convenient. But it is also not difficult for the user to add one more .zip or a reboot-to-recovery to perform just one more installation. Many already do this to install Magisk.
I think not including GAPPS in the build provides one more option for all users. Users who want it can choose which GAPPS package to install. From "Full stock" to "Core".
primarily for user convenience = care for user inability
romchefs dish-up what users want
If you care about deGoogle and hardening a ROM called DivestOS is also a choice https://divestos.org/pages/devices#device-lemonadep Never tried it tho ur on ur own
Tom Mix said:
primarily for user convenience = care for user inability
romchefs dish-up what users want
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TrumpXi said:
If you care about deGoogle and hardening a ROM called DivestOS is also a choice https://divestos.org/pages/devices#device-lemonadep Never tried it tho ur on ur own
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand the good intention of the developers to want to include and facilitate the integration of lay users in the world of custom ROMs. But you can already see that it is better to teach how to do it than to "deliver it ready".
I took a look at DivestOS but the point I want to make is that not including the GAPPS package opens up a much wider range of options for all users.
DivestOS also doesn't provide many of the features you might find in other ROMs.
Every individual learns at a different rate and level. Trying to teach one message at a time is not the most efficient way to teach. If someone is interested in installing a custom ROM, they should start with Google search and get questions answered one at a time. When you put forth a serious effort to learn how to accomplish something, you retain more in memory and don't have to ask the same question again. Then if you don't like the first ROM you installed, you are more prepared to flash the second one.... Thinking out loud here.
once the idea of a custom rom was a very different one:
have control and the freedom of choice.
nowadays so called 'custom-roms' already include gapps
what a farce
[OFFTOPiC] i try to analyse if licenses are violated by
distributing 'custom-roms' including gapps.
[iLLEGAL] [LEGAL] GApps including Custom ROMs [QUESTiON] [DiSCUSSiON]
hello world unfortunately one sees more and more so called 'custom roms' including GApps by default 🤷♂️ this brings up a question: is this legal? as an example reading: Google apps are the proprietary Google-branded applications that come...
forum.xda-developers.com
but no one is interested at all
and so far i can understand the licence
it is not allowed, maybe can someone from
this topic help to clarify[/OFFTOPiC]
Nouty said:
When I started installing modified ROMs a few years ago on my devices (Galaxy Y and the Nexus 5) it was to have more options than what the factory system didn't have by default.
Having all those apps that manufacturers install and Google's suite of apps didn't suit me either. Especially with new research revealing how various companies use apps to mine user data.
At the time of the Nexus 5 there were several ROM's available and if I wanted the Google applications installed I needed to install a "GAPPS" package. Otherwise I was free to use the system only with the essential AOSP applications.
Time passed and between the Nexus 5 and the Oneplus 9 Pro some movement happened and now most of the ROM's already come with the GAPPS package included in their builds.
Apparently on the Oneplus 9 Pro the only two actively supported options are LineageOS and crDroid and those that don't include GAPPS packages by default.
What happened? Why already include GAPPS in the build?
Is it for technical reasons, convenience? What is the reason for developers to take this attitude and not delegate the choice to users?
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What happened? Mostly quality went to quantity. Back then ROMs were actual ROMs instead of these trash copy paste propaganda called AOSP.
Cant wait for the reports and triggered people.