Hi,
I'm the developer of Open Camera, and looking at the OnePlus 3 as a potential new phone and test device, but I'm curious as to its support for Camera 2 API. I was wondering if people could share their experiences of using third party camera apps with Camera2 API enabled - either in Open Camera, or others like Snap Camera and A Better Camera (all these have options to enable Camera2 API)? In particular:
* It seems a lot of devices have problems with flash and Camera2 (either flash doesn't fire, or misfires so pictures come out under or overexposed). I finally managed to get Open Camera flash working on my Nexus 6, but no luck on a Samsung S7 (precapture doesn't seem to trigger). How does the OnePlus Three do with Camera2 and third party apps?
* I see some reports that manual exposure times don't work (e.g., http://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-3/help/camera2-api-broken-oxygenos-3-1-2-t3400886 ), though they mostly refer to the "more than one second" times (which most Android devices don't even offer). I'm less bothered about that, but does manual exposure time (and ISO) work at all (even for less than one second) in Camera2 API on the OnePlus Three?
* Around a year ago I see lots of reports that RAW didn't work on the One Plus devices (either not at all, or pictures were wrong). Supposedly this was fixed, but can anyone confirm that this is working properly on the OnePlus Three?
Thanks in advance!
mark
I use CM 13. So the following observation will most probably differ from Oxygen OS. I hope someone else using the stock ROM provides their input too.
1. Flash is unusable with Open Camera. I tried with Camera2 enabled and disabled. When its enabled, the overexposure is less but overall the picture is still horrible. CM's Snap camera that comes with the ROM works fine however.
2. I have not tested manual exposure yet. Will report back later if no one else does it.
3. There doesn't seem to be any problem while saving RAW files using Camera2 API. Opened it in Ubuntu's image viewer and the image is the same as it's JPEG counterpart (without the flash)
Manual exposure settings work fine. I increased the ISO and exposure time gradually using Open Camera. It let in more light and captured the image without any issues
mdwh said:
* It seems a lot of devices have problems with flash and Camera2 (either flash doesn't fire, or misfires so pictures come out under or overexposed). I finally managed to get Open Camera flash working on my Nexus 6, but no luck on a Samsung S7 (precapture doesn't seem to trigger). How does the OnePlus Three do with Camera2 and third party apps?
* I see some reports that manual exposure times don't work (e.g., http://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-3/help/camera2-api-broken-oxygenos-3-1-2-t3400886 ), though they mostly refer to the "more than one second" times (which most Android devices don't even offer). I'm less bothered about that, but does manual exposure time (and ISO) work at all (even for less than one second) in Camera2 API on the OnePlus Three?
* Around a year ago I see lots of reports that RAW didn't work on the One Plus devices (either not at all, or pictures were wrong). Supposedly this was fixed, but can anyone confirm that this is working properly on the OnePlus Three?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've got a OP3 and a bunch of camera apps. The flash is overexposing with Open Camera, but in e.g. Footej (which I believe also uses Camera API v2) the image is exposed similarly to the built-in camera app.
Changing ISO manually seems to work as expected.
RAW files that I've tested from the stock app in Lightroom appear fine.
Let me know if you want me to test something else (PM or email works too).
The biggest challenges I have with Open Camera is that the manual focus (at least in video mode) is somewhat jumpy and not as smooth as e.g. Cinema 4K when you drag the slider, so it is only useable when you're not recording, and then it lacks focus assist (zooming in 2x or 4x automatically when you adjust focus). And then, of course touch focus is also broken (it always focuses at the center) when using APIv2.
Oh, and I'm on the mainly release (3.2.6 atm).
Thanks for both your replies!
Regarding flash and Camera2 API, the newly released Open Camera v1.34 has an option under Settings/Photo settings/"Use alternative flash method". Does that work any better? (Interesting that you mention Footej, that's also the only other 3rd party camera app that gets flash working with Camera2 API on my Nexus 6 - I think it's also using the "torch method" that my new option enables as a workaround.)
Another question I have please - does HDR in Open Camera work okay? (Note it won't be the same as the stock camera's HDR, as these will be different algorithms - but does it at least seem to work? In theory it should if manual exposure is working, but there may be additional issues with burst mode.)
A shame that touch to focus isn't working (this seems to be a known issue with Camera2 on the OnePlus 3?) I note from http://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-3/how-to/oos-3-5-2-comunity-build-t3461648/post68764646 , comment 329, someone says that touch to focus is fixed in the community build 3.5.2 (they tested Open Camera and Snap Camera HDR), so hopefully this fix will soon be rolled out.
I'll take a look at the jerky manual focus, and focus assist.
Wrt flash: Compared to the built-in camera app and to Footej and with/without the new flash setting enabled, then yes: It works with the work-around enabled. Before enabling it, it overexposes (and has an incorrect color balance), but after enabling it, the photo looks almost identical to the Footej one.
As for HDR, then yes, it also works As you say, it's not identical to the built-in camera app, but there is a difference between a single-capture shot and an HDR one: Shadows are lifted and highlights become somewhat subdued. Comparing an OpenCamera HDR shot to the same scene taken with the built-in camera, I'd say the shadows are similar, but the highlights are less compressed with the default app (i.e. OpenCamera makes the highlights darker, and maybe also darker than need to be).
As for touch focus, then we can hope it will be fixed -- I guess it's a problem with the Camera2 API implementation/driver in OP3.
Thanks for your efforts!
Just to say that I got the OnePlus 3T in the end. It's an excellent device - but I've made a new thread at https://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-3t/how-to/camera2-bugs-t3569283 which details the outstanding problems that I seem unable to fix (and seem to affect other camera2 apps too).
Interestingly, touch-to-focus works fine to me (even when I first got it when it was on Android 6), possibly this was something that'd already been fixed.
UPDATE: Used hide tags to organize this post better and make information easier to find.
Alright, so you've got a shiny new Moto G5 plus, which supposedly has a similar Sony imx sensor as the one found on flagships like the Galaxy S7 and Pixel2. Yet, you are somehow disappointed by the camera's quality.
YOU ARE NOT ALONE!
Turns out the camera sensor on this thing is actually pretty darned good, and the f/1.7 lens is no slouch, however it is being held back by poorly designed software from Moto/Lenovo.
Before I got into the solutions, let me specifically point out the problems I found with the camera so we're on the same page (click to reveal content, or just skip the fixes below):
1) Overzealous Sharpening and aggressive Noise Reduction are the biggest culprits. It almost looks like a bad filter is being applied to your images, turning fine details into mush and contrasty lines like text into something bizarre and artificial looking. The camera is doing this as part of the internal capture process, so this happens no matter what application it is taken in.
2) Highlights clipping earlier than it should. I'd say this might be a function of the camera's sensor more than the hardware, but analyzing RAW data from the sensor (more on that later) in my admittedly unscientific half-hazard naked eye, I'd go out on a limb and say it seems like we're not being shown all the DR the camera is able to see. To the layman: this means brights turn completely white effectively overexposing parts of the image that should otherwise still look OK.
3) The preview/viewfinder mode is even worse at #1 than the captured image is. That is, the preview mode (the video feed you see before you capture the full resolution image) is still applying the sharpening and NR at the same level as the captured image, however since the resolution is lower for the preview, it looks more exaggerated and ugly. This means two things: A) Its hard to tell what the image you take will look like, as the preview is ugly (and you have to hope the final will look better), and B) some apps use the preview feed as their capture method. For example, snapchat and augmented reality apps like Pokemon Go. It just looks terrible.
The good news is that there is a lot that can be done to improve and fix the camera.
The bad news is that almost all of it requires modifying system files. That means those with locked bootloaders (Amazon ad users or those who are afraid of voiding their warranties) might be out of luck.
You don't necessarily need root access, although some of this can be more easily performed with root. I needed to unlock my bootloader and performed most of this within TWRP, but chose to keep my phone otherwise unrooted. I'm going to split this into sections, fixing and improving.
A) FIXING THE IMAGE PROCESSING ISSUES
If you want to remove/circumvent the aggressive sharpening and NR issues (so that apps like snapchat or other camera applications don't look over-processed, including the stock Moto cam), try the following:
1) Chromatix mod. Shout out to @defcomg for finding and adjusting the values that control sharpening and NR in the system libs. See thread here:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/g5-plus/themes/modcamera-aggressive-sharpening-noise-t3604458
There are two sets of files to replace in your system. Chromatix and LIBMM. NOTE: I don't recommend the LIBMM / binning part. Binning is combining pixels together into an averaged single pixel value, effectively reducing resolution to combat noise on the sensor. In other words, instead of having a large possibly noisy image, you get a smaller less noisy picture. But you can always choose to resize the image in post after you take it with the same resulting effect, so I don't see why this would be desirable to do. I recommend just applying the chromatix mod to remove the sharpening and NR. If you're comfortable using TWRP, there's actually a flashable zip in post #9, which is what I personally did (again, remember I'm not rooted, so I needed to flash/overwrite/etc within TWRP).
After applying this mod, even the stock camera app looks better, and apps that use the live preview (Snapchat, Pokemons AR view, etc) don't have the shadow ghosting from excessive sharpening anymore either. You might want to apply some sharpening and NR in post yourself if the image requires it, but thats always something you can choose but at least you have control over it and even without doing that it looks far better and more natural than stock to me.
2) Enable camera2 API. This doesn't have a direct effect on quality, but will allow other apps to have more direct access to the camera. If you want to improve beyond the results of #1 above, you'll need this.
The stock rom, surprisingly, has Camera2 API included, however it is disabled by the build.prop file. Again, no idea why Moto/Lenovo chose to do this, but the good news is you can enable it again easily. To do this, you need to add the following line to the build.prop
persist.camera.HAL3.enabled=1
Or if rooted, via terminal / shell:
su persist.camera.HAL3.enabled 1
Once this is enabled, you can use apps such as the modified freedcam to shoot RAW, as found here: https://forum.xda-developers.com/g5-plus/how-to/how-to-enable-camera2-shoot-raw-root-t3582392
I found RAW from this app particularly difficult to work with, so I'm keeping it for experimentation purposes but for practical real-world usage, I'd recommend the next item below.
B) IMPROVING YOUR PHOTOS (or, how to install Google Camera!)
Section A was all about how to avoid the crummy filters that get automatically applied to the camera. But your device is capable of even BETTER photos by using Google's magic HDR+ algorithm (the special sauce that makes the Pixel phones so awesome). Here's how to do that:
1) If you haven't already enabled the Camera2 API, you need to do that first (info in section A above).
2) Get a working version of Google Camera with HDR+ for your phone. The last available 32-bit version with HDR+ is Gcam 4.2, so if you're on the stock ROM like I am, you're stuck with only the 32-bit versions (all the new versions with the bells and whistles are 64-bit only). The image quality is remarkably better, both in sharpness and dynamic range in almost any light. I have to admit, I'm in love with the images from this, and have even printed some for my wall.
You can get the APK ported from the Nexus 5x version here:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=74081041&postcount=3
UPDATE: New version from Savitar on post #44!
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=75483974&postcount=44
Problem is, our cameras use a different focus system than phones like the Nexus and Pixel. So, in photo mode, it doesn't really work correctly. Switching over to video mode, however, DOES work (likely using contrast detection focus, which is slower but more universal, especially for video focus). So the workaround is to swipe over to video mode, focus, swipe back to photos and press-and-hold to lock focus. It's annoying, but HDR+ is that good that I still try to work with it much of the time.
For times that it would be frustrating or not necessary, I'll just resort to the stock camera app or Footej camera, since the chromatix mod makes them mostly usable now. Just not ZOMG AMAZING like the Google HDR+ does.
OPTIONAL #3) Install a 64-bit custom Rom and use the latest Google Camera HDR+ app floating around (v4.4). The recent versions B-S-G released based on the Pixel camera has options to change camera modes in settings, some combination of which supposedly focus properly. You will likely get a more stable camera app experience with this as it requires less modification to work, but you'll have to be committed enough to go off stock.
Check out the app and suggested settings to try here:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=74999182&postcount=19
Thanks @shanks125 for the info!
Update 1/3/18: I just heard there is a port of the new portrait mode feature from the Pixel2 that is sort of working on 64-bit roms, but I think some modifications will need to be made to avoid focus drift like previous modded gcam versions.
There is also a 32-bit version of the new v4.4 that @Aby lad came up with in this thread:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/android/apps-games/google-camera-4-4-arm-device-t3666090
In order to make it more compatible with other devices, it looks like he has disabled the Hexagon DSP, which I think is what makes HDR+ work, so while we can now change settings and focus, HDR+ isn't working. The app still has some Google goodies like Sphere and Blur mode, but without HDR+ the real benefit of Google camera is lost anyway. Might as well use stock with chromatix mod at that point.
Hope some of you find this helpful/useful!
UPDATE 12/28/17: New GCam with 6P features on post #14.
There actually may be some alternate versions of the gcam apk with benefits the one originally linked above doesn't have. I will try to update when if/when I find them.
Dishe said:
There actually may be some alternate versions of the gcam apk with benefits the one originally linked above doesn't have. I will try to update when if/when I find them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would be useful!
So if I apply the chromatic mode, do I still have to enable the Camera2 API?
It's my bad. I would like to know if there is a way to disable Camera2 api. I am on Linage 14.1 and I edited my prop.build (yeah, I know). I switched back to the original line of code, but camera app still crashing. How to revert without reflashing the rom? Thanks.
edit. reflashed.
iBART said:
It's my bad. I would like to know if there is a way to disable Camera2 api. I am on Linage 14.1 and I edited my prop.build (yeah, I know). I switched back to the original line of code, but camera app still crashing. How to revert without reflashing the rom? Thanks.
edit. reflashed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you try clearing data+cache for the camera app?
iamsonal said:
So if I apply the chromatic mode, do I still have to enable the Camera2 API?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, but it doesn't hurt to so why not? Some apps will have more options in camera2 if enabled.
iBART said:
It's my bad. I would like to know if there is a way to disable Camera2 api. I am on Linage 14.1 and I edited my prop.build (yeah, I know). I switched back to the original line of code, but camera app still crashing. How to revert without reflashing the rom? Thanks.
edit. reflashed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is another way to enable camera2 api if you're using a custom ROM. You need to flash a magisk module.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=74081041&postcount=3
Which Google camera works in a complete stock g5? I keep getting a praising error with every one I try.
eemgee said:
Which Google camera works in a complete stock g5? I keep getting a praising error with every one I try.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Parsing error means you are probably trying to use a 64-bit or one made for a different version of Android (7.1 instead of 7.0). The one linked above will work.
However, all recent versions of Google's Camera require the camera2 api to work. That's one of the primary reasons to enable the Camera2 api in my opinion. It comes in the stock rom, but it is disabled for some inexplicable reason (G5S model has it enabled, so some people are hoping that we'll get it enabled with an update or at least when Oreo rolls around). The good news is that it only takes one line of text in the build.prop file to enable it on the G5+. However, the bad news is that build.prop is part of the protected system partition, so editing it requires root-level file access. Doesn't seem to be any way to do that without unlocking the bootloader, so either way you won't be able to do it on a 100% stock g5+ as things are right now.
Thanks i managed to get 2.7 working.
I will unlock the bootloader at some point in the next few weeks....
There is also a Magisk module in post #54 on that Chromatix thread. Really helpful!
Hi, so in search for better images from my g5+ camera I stumbled upon this place and rooted my phone to add the chromatix mods and edit the build.prop file .
I downloaded the google camera port v4.2 for the hdr+ but have been unable to install it as I get the error that package may be corrupted.
So could someone please link me to one which is good or upload it.
And BIG thanks to this community.
New gcam from savitar
UPDATE: Better gcam version from Savitar/Defcomg
http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=00826724446841525700
Features:
Burst Mode (hold shutter button)
Focus doesn't drift when switching from video mode (this is a huge fix IMO- old app would drift after setting focus in video mode).
Selfie cam now has HDR as well (with caveats)
RAW image capture with each photo!
Instructions for use are largely the same as the old app, but it works better / more reliably now:
WHEN USING APP FOR THE FIRST TIME, GO INTO SETTINGS AND CHANGE VIDEO TO 4K. This will prevent FCs.
To take a picture:
1) Swipe left to switch to video mode, tap to focus
2) Once focus is achieved, swipe right to return to photo mode. (Focus should not drift in this version)
3) Tap the area again in photo mode, and hit the shutter button.
NOTES:
It appears that you no longer need to press-and-hold to lock focus in photo mode before shooting. I believe this is because the focus system doesn't adjust anymore in photo mode (I'm guessing Savitar/Defcomg removed it to combat that focus drifting problem). It is already locked at wherever you put it in video mode. You DO however need to still tap the screen as if you are focusing. I think this is because the camera needs to think it is focusing, but it is anyway helpful to tap somewhere for metering / exposure reading purposes. Skipping the press-and-hold to lock focus makes it a lot more manageable.
This version of the app is setup to shoot RAW+Jpeg, so you will find your camera roll will have both a jpeg and DNG file of the shot. Be aware that the RAW DNG files are multiple times larger than the jpeg, so you may want to keep an eye on storage if you shoot a lot of them. They're really useful if you want to adjust WB and exposure afterwards, quality is astoundingly good.
Selfie Mode was broken in HDR+ on earlier builds because for some reason the front camera on our phone doesn't return an ISO value to the app (says iso is zero). The HDR+ algorithm would fail. Savitar/defcomg fixed it by setting it always return a value (he picked 100, otherwise it would overexpose in daylight). The catch is that in lower lighting, the selfie HDR+ comes out darker than expected. Thankfully you can take the RAW file and adjust the exposure in post if needed (snapseed, Lightroom mobile, etc). But there might be times it is just too dark to be useful. The difference when it works is big enough that I recommend it trying it at least once to compare.
ENJOY!
Big shout out to @defcomg for this and all his awesome mods!
Landscape gcam 6p
A modified version of the APK above is available which starts the camera off focused at infinity.
http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=31694573387513766779
This was made for people who want to shoot landscapes and/or things far enough away that they don't want to deal with focusing (swipe to video mode, etc). See a beautiful sunset for example, open this app, tap the sky and hit the shutter. Its already focused in the right position.
Otherwise identical to previous post's apk. Can be installed side-by-side, as each app has its own ID.
can't use gcam because it crashes at first run
marcol87 said:
can't use gcam because it crashes at first run
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do u have camera2 API enabled?
Dishe said:
UPDATE: Better gcam version from Savitar/Defcomg
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for sharing this.
Add this, BSG GCam MOD with working HDR+ and Touch to Focus for 64bit roms. Settings as per attachment! https://androidfilehost.com/?fid=889964283620770378
Dishe said:
Do u have camera2 API enabled?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, I added persist.camera.HAL3.enabled=1 to build.prop and rebooted
Dishe said:
persist.camera.HAL3.enabled=1or
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ps: the string persist.camera.HAL3.enabled=1 is wrong in the OP
It has been four weeks since I received my device. One of the reasons I purchased this device was the nice features around the pro mode of its camera.
After I saw the comments from the reviewers/press regarding the standard Camera App and the Auto mode, I was curious to test the AUTO mode myself.
In this post I will try to share my findings around the AUTO mode, explain how I interpreted the different apps around the camera and share some thoughts. I hope you will find it useful.
Device Software (Build number): 58.0.A3.39
Thoughts around AUTO Mode
I have noticed that many reviewers kinda refused to use the Photo Pro app when they did compare this device with other devices. Their explanation/reasoning for that was that many times the users (even the pro users) will need to capture something fast and straight away without spending five mins in the settings or using a tripod. Now, If you check the comments in any of these reviews/videos, you will find at least ten guys screaming about the fact that Photo Pro has AUTO mode as well.
Personally, even I do enjoy the program mode etc I do agree that having a decent AUTO mode (no matters the app) it’s very important for any smartphone.
I took multiple shots with the standard camera app (which provides only the default mode, the AUTO mode) and the Photo Pro AUTO mode. I think I managed to understand what's the main difference between these two.
(for the rest of this post, please assume that any reference to the Photo Pro is regarding the AUTO mode unless I specify a different mode)
Standard Camera App vs Photo Pro AUTO
As long as you don't change the focus point by touching on the screen, the results from the two apps (standard camera app and the Photo Pro in AUTO) are almost identical.
Both applications will use HDR when it is required and they will provide decent results. You can't control whether the HDR will be used or not, you can’t turn it off, but it's there, fully automated.
In order to prove my findings around the HDR, I compared photos taken with AUTO (both apps) with photos taken with the P Mode in Photo Pro with everything in default settings(auto) by setting the HDR OFF. I did that as it’s not possible to control HDR in AUTO mode.
For the Photo Pro you can go to Menu -> Exposure/Colour -> DRO/AUTO HDR and set your preference: a) D-Range Optimiser, AUTO HDR, Off but this is applied only for the special modes (P, S, M).
For the AUTO mode the DRO/AUTO HDR is set to AUTO, which it seems to be a special config just for the AUTO mode. I guess that it will apply the D-Range Optimiser, or HDR or none of these depending on the scene.
Quick test for the HDR in AUTO modes:
Standard Camera App: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/2FgY1d
Photo Pro AUTO: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/08z99k
Photo Pro P Mode, default, HDR Off: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/1rf185
As you can see, the results from the two apps are similar for AUTO and in both cases HDR was applied. If you compare them with the third image where the HDR was set to off, it’s quite obvious.
Things are getting interesting when you touch the screen with the aim to change the focus point - lets use Sony’s term for now on: “touch to adjust”.
For the standard app, it's not possible to configure what will be happened on that action but it seems that it adjusts the focus and the brightness/exposure. In the Photo Pro you can choose whether the application will adjust only the focus or the focus and the brightness (Settings -> Touch to Adjust). That choice will be applied in all modes including the AUTO mode. Btw, adjusting both, the focus and the brightness is a common/expected behaviour and you will find it in other apps by other manufactures or developers.
Based on the above, someone would expect that if you choose for the Photo Pro to adjust both the focus and the brightness (as the standard camera app does), the results from the two apps would be identical when you touch to adjust. The reality is: not always!
The reason is that the HDR gets disabled in the standard app when the following two things happen at the same time: a) you touch to adjust and b) there is enough light in the scene so no special mode (low light or night mode) is applied. This is not the case for the Photo Pro AUTO where the HDR remains on auto (only if it’s required as described above). I have to add that the standard app provides you the ability to adjust the brightness/exposure for the focus point once you apply touch to adjust. This is not possible in Photo Pro AUTO - If you want to have this kind of control, you will need to switch to P mode. Based on that, it's obvious that the two apps follow different approach for the particular scenario.
Before I continue with further analysis of that scenario, I need to provide a clarification for the low light cases: you should expect similar results from both apps (AUTO) no matter if you touch to adjust or not. Low light or Night mode will be applied in both cases.
So, let’s discuss further the behaviour of the standard app for the touch to adjust and when it will result to a different outcome in comparison to the Photo Pro.
Based on what I mentioned above, if you “touch to adjust” and there is enough light in the scene (so the app can achieve correct exposure for the focus point without applying any special mode), the HDR will go off. The application adjusts the ISO and the shutter speed in the attempt to achieve the right exposure for the specific point. The truth is it does that correctly most of time. However, the outcome depends on the scene (basically the light) and on the user’s choice regarding the focus point.
Usually it is a photo with the right exposure for the focus point but with blown highlights for the brightest parts of the scene e.g the sky. If you understand the concept around the exposure, I guess it’s quite clear why this is the case. The focus point becomes the reference for the right/correct exposure, so anything brighter than this point will appear over exposed. In the case of really bright parts - light sources e.g sun, clouds etc, that over exposure causes blown highlights. A possible solution to mitigate that effect is to adjust the exposure manually for the focus point in an attempt to capture some of the missing highlights.
Quick example/test:
Without touch to adjust: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/bo9TL6
With touch to adjust: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/8eZ4ZX
In the Photo Pro AUTO mode, just because the HDR doesn’t go off during the above scenario, the outcome will be a photo without blown highlights. However, the reference for the exposure will still be the focus point (assuming you selected the touch to adjust to adjust focus and brightness), so the result won’t be the same with a photo that was taken without applying touch to adjust. It’s usually a brighter photo and this is because the HDR is applied with the provider point as a reference for the exposure.
You can observe all the above in the following test I did: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mlqKaFObgkV6ZyV2X7B1y1kYzmpNBrtZ/view?usp=sharing (pdf file with the photos)
I tested the touch to adjust for both, the standard camera and Photo Pro in AUTO.
You can see from the results that the photos from the Standard Camera are similar to the photos taken using the P mode with the HDR off, while the photos from the Photo Pro AUTO are similar to the photos from the P mode with HDR on AUTO.
When it comes to AUTO mode, I am not convinced what would be the right thing to do around HDR for that particular scenario - the touch to adjust. Both options/behaviours (HDR to go off but be able to adjust the exposure vs HDR on AUTO) can be valid depending on the use case. My personal preference would be to have the control around the HDR.
We can’t say that there is an issue or a bug with any of the two AUTO modes. It seems to me that the two apps were developed separately and different decisions have been made. Atm, If you would like to have some control around the HDR but you don’t bother about anything else, you can still use the P mode with everything in the default config and adjust DRO/AUTO HDR, as I demonstrated in my tests.
Just for completeness: In Photo Pro, If you select the touch to adjust to adjust only the focus, the results won’t be similar as the tests above. In that case, when you touch to adjust, the exposure doesn’t change based on the focus point. As a result, the exposure of a photo taken with that setup will be identical to the one taken without applying touch to adjust.
I will close this part around that particular scenario with a quick tip/advice: if your aim is to have everything in focus and have balanced/correct exposure across the whole photo, there is no reason to try to focus on something in a distance (e.g the mountain in a landscape, a building etc) using the touch to adjust feature. Due to the fact that smartphones camera sensors are small in general, the depth of field is large/wide so everything will be in focus (this is applied for any smartphone, it’s not only for this device). Use the touch to adjust for things in close distance unless you intentionally want to adjust the exposure of the photo based on a particular point.
Overall, I would say that the AUTO mode is decent and I can trust it, especially if I want to snap something quickly.
I saw comments from reviewers mentioning blown highlights and this is the reason I spent some time to explain the touch to adjust.
If someone experienced blown highlights in AUTO mode without applying touch to adjust, I am really curious to see that.
Thoughts around the camera apps
It’s more that obvious that Sony targets the enthusiasts with this device. You can see in the product’s page that they target photographers, cinematographers, cinephiles etc
When it comes to camera, they want people to use the Pro apps. However, I am not convinced that the Cinema Pro can be used by everyone.
So, this is how I interpreted the three apps:
Standard Camera app (video): that’s easy. The default app for video for most of the people.
Cinema Pro: 100% for people interested to shoot mini projects and happy to use tripod, gimbal, maybe filters etc and they are happy to spend reasonable time to take the right clip. There is a room for improvement, mainly around the fix exposure after starting recording, so more people can use it.
Standard Camera app (photos): I saw people saying: forget about this one, use Photo Pro only. I kinda disagree. If this device is your daily driver, it means that you take a lot photos with that camera beyond the nice shots of different memorable scenes. I believe that this app is intended for the moments when you want to take a quick photo without thinking too much. Possibly this is the reason they chose to have all the special modes be applied automatically (HDR, low light, night mode etc). If you don’t have time, you don’t want to mess with settings, just point and shoot. It does provide decent results.
For the daily stuff this is a no brainer. Examples: random photos of items that you need to show to people , a meal you cook etc
For more “critical shots”, between missing the shot, and having the perfect shot after 3 mins in the settings, I choose to take the shot.
So let’s say you have spent some time taking photos of a landscape using the Photo Pro. Job done, phone in the pocket. Suddenly you see something nearby that you want to photograph. What do you do? Photo Pro is in M/P/S mode as you left it 5 mins ago with the configuration for that scene. Yes, you are 2 clicks away from setting it to AUTO but you may miss the shot. Standard camera is your friend in that case.
Photo Pro: My default option if I want to shoot anything and I have reasonable time. It can be AUTO mode, it can be the P mode and taking multiple shots by experimenting with HDR off/AUTO etc. It can be any other mode. It depends on the amount of time I want to spend on taking the shot and my mood
General thoughts
HDR
I do like the convenience of computational photography, however I am not a big fun when camera apps end up over-processing the photos. The usual example: taking a photo of a landscape during a cloudy day and the HDR makes the photo looks like you are in the middle of a hurricane.
Fortunately, Sony’s HDR appears to be not that aggressive and I really like that part.
Having that said, I still believe that there is room for improvement/optimisation with:
a) the algorithm that calculates whether the HDR will be triggered or not.
b) the HDR algorithm itself on how it blends the images and what images should be taken (how many stops above and below)
It’s really good but not perfect. There is no perfect anw.
As mentioned above, it would be nice for Sony to provide the users the option to adjust HDR in the auto mode.
Portrait Mode
I still try to understand why Sony chose to add that mode in the standard camera app. I don’t see the reason of adding a non well optimised mode to a device that is advertised so much about its photography capabilities.
For now, If you want to take some portrait photos, switch to the 70mm lens and that’s it. Nice natural portrait photos with decent bokeh effect. That bokeh effect is not comparable to any portrait mode that uses computational photography, but it still look good enough. The nice thing about that is that you get consistent results cause it's 100% natural effect by the lens (no issues with hair etc).
Not the best example: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/m2152a
Night Mode - low light
These modes are triggered/applied automatically. I took some decent shots under low light. I can see that Sony didn’t follow the path of the other manufactures. Similar to the HDR, the night mode algo is not that aggressive. Sony tries to remain close to reality and avoids over processing. Maybe this is not something that everyone will appreciate but I think it's nice to have different approaches by different manufactures. It results to more options for the consumers, more competition and innovation etc. Personally, I don't really understand why some reviewers are giving credits to manufactures for over processing.
Back to Sony, It would be nice to provide the users the option to enable/disable night mode during the auto mode or provide a dedicate night mode.
Some photos:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/5fZ25B
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/0rfGPZ (I was a bit surprised looking that one)
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/vK61N9
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/A4U34R
Macro
At Auto, both apps are able to recognise a macro shot and actually in the standard app if you enable the photography hints, the app will guide you to "move further away" in case you are too close. Photos look natural, there is not any kind of computational photography processing in that mode. The blur parts in the photo is a natural outcome from the lens and it happens when parts of the scene lie outside of the depth of field.
Some photos (main lens - 24mm, standard app):
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/BM00v8
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/s6p1Sh
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/257gts
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/H75112
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/396Ac0
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/Z83oh4
Hardware
Through my tests I did notice that the zeiss optics help a lot by reducing reflections and flares especially when I was pointing directly to a source of light (e.g sun, lamb etc). I compared it with Pixel 2 xl and Samsung s9 (whatever I had access) and the difference was obvious.
However, I noticed that when there is light coming from a particular angle (it's an edge case), there is a specific type of lens flare only for the main lens, 24mm.
Example: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/vp48Jd
The album with all the photos in the post and some additional photos: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/K343dG
Sony released an update while I was writing this, I will try to update the post if they changed anything around the stuff I covered.
Update: added macro shots.
Very nice review of the cameras! Wish tech reviewers could understand 10% of what you wrote here
Great post and write up. After coming here and just browsing for a couple years I literally signed up because of your post. Thanks for taking the time.
great detail and time spent, very much appreciated, post of the year IMO
it is obvious that certain reviewers didn't quite understand what simple PAS is
and I agree totally with your night shot comments - who wants a night shot that doesn't look like night and is way over exposed and processed
again many thanks and looking forward to further experiences from you my friend as the phone receives a few updates going forward, I am now hoping Sony don't change too much as it seems perfect as is
thank you so much!
@stsdema28 Great post! Do you know how I can calibrate white balance in pro mode? I have seen the adjust button in P mode for white balance but how do I get it right? In Photo Pro auto mode, photos look red-ish to me.
mehdi_s82 said:
@stsdema28 Great post! Do you know how I can calibrate white balance in pro mode? I have seen the adjust button in P mode for white balance but how do I get it right? In Photo Pro auto mode, photos look red-ish to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not sure what you mean/expect when you are saying "how can I calibrate WB". White balance can be different even between two clicks in the same scene when the light changes significantly. So there isn't a concept of calibrating the WB of the camera once so it can be right every time. What you can do is to adjust WB every time based on the scene. Another option is to adjust WB in post processing (this is what I usually do when I shoot with my DSLR, but I shoot RAW).
Back to the Xperia, I usually use AWB but I tried some of the predefined options (cloudy, daylight, incandescent etc) and they were quite accurate. Did you try any of them? It's important to choose the right option for the scene.
short article about WB: https://www.nikonusa.com/en/learn-and-explore/a/tips-and-techniques/setting-white-balance.html (it's by Nikon, but it doesn't really matter)
If you are not happy with the predefined options, you can try to set and use one of the custom options but you need to remember that it would be valid/correct only for the scene you set it for. Check the following video how you can do that: https://youtu.be/ehK8zJ2up98?t=454 (I set the exact moment he describes the WB options)
one of the reasons I was looking at this phone is because sony mentions its supposed to be good at capturing motion shots. How is it in your experience? Is it as good as the pixel in being able to capture a motion shot with one snap in auto?
billybobjones said:
one of the reasons I was looking at this phone is because sony mentions its supposed to be good at capturing motion shots. How is it in your experience? Is it as good as the pixel in being able to capture a motion shot with one snap in auto?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The motion feature of pixel has nothing to do with burst shooting.
The Xperia 1 ii can shoot up to 20fps with autofocus and auto exposure. It's all about capturing the right photo. You can see the burst shooting in the following videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQEXla29P9A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVJtmP8Ckfg
The motion feature in pixels (or similar feature in other apps) captures several frames or a short video with sound before and after you take a photo. The idea here is to capture additional material to accompany the photo for future reference with the aim to help the user to recall that moment.
So, it depends what you are looking for. There is no other phone that is able to shoot 20fps with autofocus and auto exposure (as far as I know). But given that you referred to pixel's feature, I guess you are looking for "motion" photos.
stsdema28 said:
So, it depends what you are looking for. There is no other phone that is able to shoot 20fps with autofocus and auto exposure (as far as I know). But given that you referred to pixel's feature, I guess you are looking for "motion" photos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the difference is video frames vers 20 actual full res photos
and there is a huge difference
stsdema28 said:
The motion feature of pixel has nothing to do with burst shooting.
The Xperia 1 ii can shoot up to 20fps with autofocus and auto exposure. It's all about capturing the right photo. You can see the burst shooting in the following videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQEXla29P9A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVJtmP8Ckfg
The motion feature in pixels (or similar feature in other apps) captures several frames or a short video with sound before and after you take a photo. The idea here is to capture additional material to accompany the photo for future reference with the aim to help the user to recall that moment.
So, it depends what you are looking for. There is no other phone that is able to shoot 20fps with autofocus and auto exposure (as far as I know). But given that you referred to pixel's feature, I guess you are looking for "motion" photos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sorry i meant a moving object. for example a dog running or a bicyclist or a kid running. with a pixel you can take 1 shot and get a good photo. With other smartphones when you take one photo you usually get a blurry mess. How is the sony?
billybobjones said:
sorry i meant a moving object. for example a dog running or a bicyclist or a kid running. with a pixel you can take 1 shot and get a good photo. With other smartphones when you take one photo you usually get a blurry mess. How is the sony?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check some real examples from reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/SonyXperia/comments/i9kbox/burst_mode_is_the_killer_feature_especially_if/ (it contains an animation as well)
https://www.reddit.com/r/SonyXperia/comments/i634x9/ive_complained_about_focus_tracking_while_doing/
https://www.reddit.com/r/SonyXperia...ng_with_professionals_burst_shot_on_xperia_1/
https://www.reddit.com/r/SonyXperia/comments/i9687m/testing_the_high_continuous_shooting_mode/
https://www.reddit.com/r/SonyXperia/comments/i7m08k/20_fps/
anyone notice that with Camera Pro, raw and 70mm lens ... it produce a 13,8mpx photo?
if you save it in jpg it's a 12,2mpx, if you select raw, it produce a 13,8mpx with 4288x3216 resolution
I'm on XQ-AT52 HongKong with 3.88 firmware
my thoughts
This is very faithful review by stsdema28, great job thank you.
I have come to the same conclusion as stsdema28 while testing it.
I have my xperia 1II for a week now and after testing it I'm sure that I made a good chose buying it.
There are some things that are important to me while taking pictures with a phone and I like to share them with you.
First of all I think that main camera app does amazing job in recognising scenes, focus, white balance, it's reliable.
It's fast and convenient; for me, I don't see s reason to use Pro app.
In my opinion using Pro is good for RAW output if someone needs it.
I personally have used raw in cameras for years but I consider it a waste of time for me right now.
Main camera app also in my opinion has flawless noise reduction, jpg's from Pro mode have different noise reduction; more looking like "alfa" camera output.
So, what is important for me with this camera phone:
-all 3 cameras output same resolution 12mpix photos
-colours are true to life on all 3 cameras and they remain the same on each one of them
-auto white balance is correct in different scenes where I had problems before with my Huawei p30pro
-pictures have natural look, not overprocessed
-there are no artifacts when the light is to bright on a shiny surface and around red light sources in the dark
-glow around light sources look natural like from a real camera, don't know if this is due to good optics or the lens coating
When it comes to video all that I can really say is that I have no complaints and find it very high quality.
What I need to point out is audio quality which is on par with video quality.
Wind noise filter does awesome job, all that is left of wind in strong wind; is something like old low bitrate mp3 artifacts but very faint.
Sound positioning is very good too.
Selfie camera take sharp shots, no artifacts in bright light, I almost never use it, but if I did; I would be happy with the results.
Thx
Paweł
Thanks to @stsdema28 and @starepiernikowe for the excellent real life reviews of the phone. It is so helpful and so much better than watching the YouTube reviews.
---------- Post added at 09:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:25 AM ----------
Thanks to @stsdema28 and @starepiernikowe for the excellent real life reviews of the phone. It is so helpful and so much better than watching the YouTube reviews.
ISO3200 PRO and default app
Just wanted to show the differences in jpg from PRO app and default camera app noise reduction.
The exposure is different on those pictures, so the colors are too.
Left is PRO right is default camera app.
https://
freeimage.host/i/26zkCJ
Sorry I have problems with putting links here since i don't have enough posts.
Thx
Pawel
stsdema28 said:
It has been four weeks since I received my device. One of the reasons I purchased this device was the nice features around the pro mode of its camera.
After I saw the comments from the reviewers/press regarding the standard Camera App and the Auto mode, I was curious to test the AUTO mode myself.
In this post I will try to share my findings around the AUTO mode, explain how I interpreted the different apps around the camera and share some thoughts. I hope you will find it useful.
Device Software (Build number): 58.0.A3.39
Thoughts around AUTO Mode
I have noticed that many reviewers kinda refused to use the Photo Pro app when they did compare this device with other devices. Their explanation/reasoning for that was that many times the users (even the pro users) will need to capture something fast and straight away without spending five mins in the settings or using a tripod. Now, If you check the comments in any of these reviews/videos, you will find at least ten guys screaming about the fact that Photo Pro has AUTO mode as well.
Personally, even I do enjoy the program mode etc I do agree that having a decent AUTO mode (no matters the app) it’s very important for any smartphone.
I took multiple shots with the standard camera app (which provides only the default mode, the AUTO mode) and the Photo Pro AUTO mode. I think I managed to understand what's the main difference between these two.
(for the rest of this post, please assume that any reference to the Photo Pro is regarding the AUTO mode unless I specify a different mode)
Standard Camera App vs Photo Pro AUTO
As long as you don't change the focus point by touching on the screen, the results from the two apps (standard camera app and the Photo Pro in AUTO) are almost identical.
Both applications will use HDR when it is required and they will provide decent results. You can't control whether the HDR will be used or not, you can’t turn it off, but it's there, fully automated.
In order to prove my findings around the HDR, I compared photos taken with AUTO (both apps) with photos taken with the P Mode in Photo Pro with everything in default settings(auto) by setting the HDR OFF. I did that as it’s not possible to control HDR in AUTO mode.
For the Photo Pro you can go to Menu -> Exposure/Colour -> DRO/AUTO HDR and set your preference: a) D-Range Optimiser, AUTO HDR, Off but this is applied only for the special modes (P, S, M).
For the AUTO mode the DRO/AUTO HDR is set to AUTO, which it seems to be a special config just for the AUTO mode. I guess that it will apply the D-Range Optimiser, or HDR or none of these depending on the scene.
Quick test for the HDR in AUTO modes:
Standard Camera App: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/2FgY1d
Photo Pro AUTO: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/08z99k
Photo Pro P Mode, default, HDR Off: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/1rf185
As you can see, the results from the two apps are similar for AUTO and in both cases HDR was applied. If you compare them with the third image where the HDR was set to off, it’s quite obvious.
Things are getting interesting when you touch the screen with the aim to change the focus point - lets use Sony’s term for now on: “touch to adjust”.
For the standard app, it's not possible to configure what will be happened on that action but it seems that it adjusts the focus and the brightness/exposure. In the Photo Pro you can choose whether the application will adjust only the focus or the focus and the brightness (Settings -> Touch to Adjust). That choice will be applied in all modes including the AUTO mode. Btw, adjusting both, the focus and the brightness is a common/expected behaviour and you will find it in other apps by other manufactures or developers.
Based on the above, someone would expect that if you choose for the Photo Pro to adjust both the focus and the brightness (as the standard camera app does), the results from the two apps would be identical when you touch to adjust. The reality is: not always!
The reason is that the HDR gets disabled in the standard app when the following two things happen at the same time: a) you touch to adjust and b) there is enough light in the scene so no special mode (low light or night mode) is applied. This is not the case for the Photo Pro AUTO where the HDR remains on auto (only if it’s required as described above). I have to add that the standard app provides you the ability to adjust the brightness/exposure for the focus point once you apply touch to adjust. This is not possible in Photo Pro AUTO - If you want to have this kind of control, you will need to switch to P mode. Based on that, it's obvious that the two apps follow different approach for the particular scenario.
Before I continue with further analysis of that scenario, I need to provide a clarification for the low light cases: you should expect similar results from both apps (AUTO) no matter if you touch to adjust or not. Low light or Night mode will be applied in both cases.
So, let’s discuss further the behaviour of the standard app for the touch to adjust and when it will result to a different outcome in comparison to the Photo Pro.
Based on what I mentioned above, if you “touch to adjust” and there is enough light in the scene (so the app can achieve correct exposure for the focus point without applying any special mode), the HDR will go off. The application adjusts the ISO and the shutter speed in the attempt to achieve the right exposure for the specific point. The truth is it does that correctly most of time. However, the outcome depends on the scene (basically the light) and on the user’s choice regarding the focus point.
Usually it is a photo with the right exposure for the focus point but with blown highlights for the brightest parts of the scene e.g the sky. If you understand the concept around the exposure, I guess it’s quite clear why this is the case. The focus point becomes the reference for the right/correct exposure, so anything brighter than this point will appear over exposed. In the case of really bright parts - light sources e.g sun, clouds etc, that over exposure causes blown highlights. A possible solution to mitigate that effect is to adjust the exposure manually for the focus point in an attempt to capture some of the missing highlights.
Quick example/test:
Without touch to adjust: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/bo9TL6
With touch to adjust: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/8eZ4ZX
In the Photo Pro AUTO mode, just because the HDR doesn’t go off during the above scenario, the outcome will be a photo without blown highlights. However, the reference for the exposure will still be the focus point (assuming you selected the touch to adjust to adjust focus and brightness), so the result won’t be the same with a photo that was taken without applying touch to adjust. It’s usually a brighter photo and this is because the HDR is applied with the provider point as a reference for the exposure.
You can observe all the above in the following test I did: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mlqKaFObgkV6ZyV2X7B1y1kYzmpNBrtZ/view?usp=sharing (pdf file with the photos)
I tested the touch to adjust for both, the standard camera and Photo Pro in AUTO.
You can see from the results that the photos from the Standard Camera are similar to the photos taken using the P mode with the HDR off, while the photos from the Photo Pro AUTO are similar to the photos from the P mode with HDR on AUTO.
When it comes to AUTO mode, I am not convinced what would be the right thing to do around HDR for that particular scenario - the touch to adjust. Both options/behaviours (HDR to go off but be able to adjust the exposure vs HDR on AUTO) can be valid depending on the use case. My personal preference would be to have the control around the HDR.
We can’t say that there is an issue or a bug with any of the two AUTO modes. It seems to me that the two apps were developed separately and different decisions have been made. Atm, If you would like to have some control around the HDR but you don’t bother about anything else, you can still use the P mode with everything in the default config and adjust DRO/AUTO HDR, as I demonstrated in my tests.
Just for completeness: In Photo Pro, If you select the touch to adjust to adjust only the focus, the results won’t be similar as the tests above. In that case, when you touch to adjust, the exposure doesn’t change based on the focus point. As a result, the exposure of a photo taken with that setup will be identical to the one taken without applying touch to adjust.
I will close this part around that particular scenario with a quick tip/advice: if your aim is to have everything in focus and have balanced/correct exposure across the whole photo, there is no reason to try to focus on something in a distance (e.g the mountain in a landscape, a building etc) using the touch to adjust feature. Due to the fact that smartphones camera sensors are small in general, the depth of field is large/wide so everything will be in focus (this is applied for any smartphone, it’s not only for this device). Use the touch to adjust for things in close distance unless you intentionally want to adjust the exposure of the photo based on a particular point.
Overall, I would say that the AUTO mode is decent and I can trust it, especially if I want to snap something quickly.
I saw comments from reviewers mentioning blown highlights and this is the reason I spent some time to explain the touch to adjust.
If someone experienced blown highlights in AUTO mode without applying touch to adjust, I am really curious to see that.
Thoughts around the camera apps
It’s more that obvious that Sony targets the enthusiasts with this device. You can see in the product’s page that they target photographers, cinematographers, cinephiles etc
When it comes to camera, they want people to use the Pro apps. However, I am not convinced that the Cinema Pro can be used by everyone.
So, this is how I interpreted the three apps:
Standard Camera app (video): that’s easy. The default app for video for most of the people.
Cinema Pro: 100% for people interested to shoot mini projects and happy to use tripod, gimbal, maybe filters etc and they are happy to spend reasonable time to take the right clip. There is a room for improvement, mainly around the fix exposure after starting recording, so more people can use it.
Standard Camera app (photos): I saw people saying: forget about this one, use Photo Pro only. I kinda disagree. If this device is your daily driver, it means that you take a lot photos with that camera beyond the nice shots of different memorable scenes. I believe that this app is intended for the moments when you want to take a quick photo without thinking too much. Possibly this is the reason they chose to have all the special modes be applied automatically (HDR, low light, night mode etc). If you don’t have time, you don’t want to mess with settings, just point and shoot. It does provide decent results.
For the daily stuff this is a no brainer. Examples: random photos of items that you need to show to people , a meal you cook etc
For more “critical shots”, between missing the shot, and having the perfect shot after 3 mins in the settings, I choose to take the shot.
So let’s say you have spent some time taking photos of a landscape using the Photo Pro. Job done, phone in the pocket. Suddenly you see something nearby that you want to photograph. What do you do? Photo Pro is in M/P/S mode as you left it 5 mins ago with the configuration for that scene. Yes, you are 2 clicks away from setting it to AUTO but you may miss the shot. Standard camera is your friend in that case.
Photo Pro: My default option if I want to shoot anything and I have reasonable time. It can be AUTO mode, it can be the P mode and taking multiple shots by experimenting with HDR off/AUTO etc. It can be any other mode. It depends on the amount of time I want to spend on taking the shot and my mood
General thoughts
HDR
I do like the convenience of computational photography, however I am not a big fun when camera apps end up over-processing the photos. The usual example: taking a photo of a landscape during a cloudy day and the HDR makes the photo looks like you are in the middle of a hurricane.
Fortunately, Sony’s HDR appears to be not that aggressive and I really like that part.
Having that said, I still believe that there is room for improvement/optimisation with:
a) the algorithm that calculates whether the HDR will be triggered or not.
b) the HDR algorithm itself on how it blends the images and what images should be taken (how many stops above and below)
It’s really good but not perfect. There is no perfect anw.
As mentioned above, it would be nice for Sony to provide the users the option to adjust HDR in the auto mode.
Portrait Mode
I still try to understand why Sony chose to add that mode in the standard camera app. I don’t see the reason of adding a non well optimised mode to a device that is advertised so much about its photography capabilities.
For now, If you want to take some portrait photos, switch to the 70mm lens and that’s it. Nice natural portrait photos with decent bokeh effect. That bokeh effect is not comparable to any portrait mode that uses computational photography, but it still look good enough. The nice thing about that is that you get consistent results cause it's 100% natural effect by the lens (no issues with hair etc).
Not the best example: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/m2152a
Night Mode - low light
These modes are triggered/applied automatically. I took some decent shots under low light. I can see that Sony didn’t follow the path of the other manufactures. Similar to the HDR, the night mode algo is not that aggressive. Sony tries to remain close to reality and avoids over processing. Maybe this is not something that everyone will appreciate but I think it's nice to have different approaches by different manufactures. It results to more options for the consumers, more competition and innovation etc. Personally, I don't really understand why some reviewers are giving credits to manufactures for over processing.
Back to Sony, It would be nice to provide the users the option to enable/disable night mode during the auto mode or provide a dedicate night mode.
Some photos:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/5fZ25B
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/0rfGPZ (I was a bit surprised looking that one)
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/vK61N9
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/A4U34R
Macro
At Auto, both apps are able to recognise a macro shot and actually in the standard app if you enable the photography hints, the app will guide you to "move further away" in case you are too close. Photos look natural, there is not any kind of computational photography processing in that mode. The blur parts in the photo is a natural outcome from the lens and it happens when parts of the scene lie outside of the depth of field.
Some photos (main lens - 24mm, standard app):
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/BM00v8
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/s6p1Sh
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/257gts
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/H75112
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/396Ac0
https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/Z83oh4
Hardware
Through my tests I did notice that the zeiss optics help a lot by reducing reflections and flares especially when I was pointing directly to a source of light (e.g sun, lamb etc). I compared it with Pixel 2 xl and Samsung s9 (whatever I had access) and the difference was obvious.
However, I noticed that when there is light coming from a particular angle (it's an edge case), there is a specific type of lens flare only for the main lens, 24mm.
Example: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/vp48Jd
The album with all the photos in the post and some additional photos: https://www.flickr.com/gp/[email protected]/K343dG
Sony released an update while I was writing this, I will try to update the post if they changed anything around the stuff I covered.
Update: added macro shots.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really appreciate that detailed info, thanks!
Quick question from me - in the Photo Pro app Auto mode, if RAW or RAW+Jpg is the selected format, have you found that the phone doesn't use HDR? Seems to be my experience. Make sense, but I wondered if it might still use HDR for the JPG and perhaps save each of the RAW files it generated, too. Doesn't seem so.