Develop Bugs

WP7 Phone with the Best Camera

Anyone have some input on the best WP7 phone to get if I want to use it to replace my Kodak digital camera? The camera on the HD7 kind of sucks.

Don't go with the LG Quantum either. In bright daylight it's sort of ok, but as soon as you need flash, it's like taking a picture on a RAZR from 2007. Awful.
-edit-
I think the HTC Mozart is the only wp with an 8mp camera. Probably the best?

I would say pretty much all of them are the same; the only phone that has more mp is the HTC Mozart (8mp). Idk if that might make a difference though as mp doesn't necessarily define the whole aspect of good pictures. I hear the focus is nice for taking pictures (in terms of clarity and color balance) as well. It also has the SAMOLED screen, which means the pictures show up more vibrant on your phone
I'm interested in hearing what other people say

Don't know about the Focus, but the Samsung Omnia 7 is definitely the best one available in Europe. I would rank them Samsung, LG, HTC - with the Mozart's 8MP not really being any better than the other HTC phones.

I've been extremely satisfied with the photo quality on my Focus.

its worth pointing out that higher MP does not equal better quality.
Most 5MP cameras will be fine in teh correct lighting conditions, low light is the biggest issue, the reason for this is down to optics and CCD size.
If you had a 12MP camera with a lense the size of the HD2/7 the pictures will be crap in low light as well, to be perfectly honest unless you get a phone with a big arse lense and 5+MP you wont get good "poor" light photos
I find the HD2/7 camera is grand in good lighting, had some cracking shots, mess with the lighting a bit and i pull out my slim line 12MP camera with its 32mm lense

yeah, don't replace your camera.
Just buy a second hand canon Ixus series (60 - 95) for less than £70 on ebay and you won't ever be disappointed! They are ultracompact but the picture quality has always been so good!
I don't really understand people who try to replace their camera with their mobile phone.. the mobile phone will take mediocre shots but i guess you have it with you all the time.
BUt even a cheapo crappy dedicated camera with LOWER MP will shoot better pictures than a 5MP-10MP phone.
Get one of the ultracompacts whcih are actually smaller than a lot of the new smartphones anyway!
I don't think I've used my Omnia 7 camera except for when taking lecture notes on Onenote!
Otherwise I stick to using my Canon 550D and Ixus 95

hboos said:
I don't really understand people who try to replace their camera with their mobile phone.. the mobile phone will take mediocre shots but at least you have it with you all the time.
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You just answered yourself - it's because you've always got your phone with you. The less gadgets you have to carry the better.
I tend to use my Omnia7 for photos several times a day. Quick snaps of just about anything. The fact they're snaps doesn't mean I'll be happy with ****ty quality though, you never know, you might get lucky enough to catch that one moment and decide you want it printed.
Now, if I'm out specifically for taking photos I'll obviously use my Nikon DSLR, but for everyday use I want a phone that gives at least half decent results.
The fact is that all WP7 cameras could be better. Especially the HTC ones.

emigrating said:
You just answered yourself - it's because you've always got your phone with you. The less gadgets you have to carry the better.
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Yeah agreed it is slightly more convenient..
But I personally don't like swapping quality for slight convenience
I still use my Cowon for music (better sound quality than phone) and carry my ultra compact when out with friends and my DSLR when I want to take decent photos!
I also find that the lens of the phone camera is always grubby resulting in slightly soft photos!
BUt coming back to the topic..I think the OMnia 7 takes fairly decent photos compared to other phones although I don't know how it compares to other WP7
Engadget reckons the Focus has an "impressive camera" and the Omnia 7 has a "good camera" while the others either aren't mentioned in the scorecard or specifically mention "subpar camera"
They've actually posted all the photos so you should have a look yourself.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/29/htc-trophy-review/
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/22/samsung-focus-review/
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/22/lg-optimus-7-review/
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/21/htc-7-mozart-review/
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/20/htc-hd7-review/
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/20/samsung-omnia-7-review/
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/20/htc-surround-review/

I'm having real problems with the focus camera. I can't seem to get a steady shot. Maybe it's because of the hardware button, and I'm slightly moving the camera when I take it. I hope that's it, because it usually takes me 5 or 6 shots to get a decent one...

jmerrey said:
I'm having real problems with the focus camera. I can't seem to get a steady shot. Maybe it's because of the hardware button, and I'm slightly moving the camera when I take it. I hope that's it, because it usually takes me 5 or 6 shots to get a decent one...
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Have you tried holding the camera button down half-way to let it focus before taking the pic? Also, there is an anti-shake setting on Focuses (and other Samsungs, I presume), but unfortunately the setting doesn't save.

yes i use the auto-focus feature, i've tried the anti-shake setting, i've tried lowering the resolution, pretty much everything...i can get a decent shot about 1 out of 5

[Q] Problem camera - pictures with noise / low quality compared to G3

Hi ..
I bought the device from LG G4 H815 from CLOVE website and for some reason the camera quality is poor daylight compared to my previous device G3.
After I took a picture I made zoom in to check the quality , and here I find that image noise / blurred G3 compared to a photo in G3 ...
How is it possible, it happens to you too?
Another thing I did not have the option of adjusting 8-megapixel, 13 megapixel (as there is in LG G3)
I'd love to know if there is such a thing ...
The quality is really bad ..
I'm with:
5.1
Build Number: LMY47D
Software Version: V10b-EUR-XX
regards,
Tomer.

Info
TOMER628 said:
Hi ..
I bought the device from LG G4 H815 from CLOVE website and for some reason the camera quality is poor daylight compared to my previous device G3.
After I took a picture I made zoom in to check the quality , and here I find that image noise / blurred G3 compared to a photo in G3 ...
How is it possible, it happens to you too?
Another thing I did not have the option of adjusting 8-megapixel, 13 megapixel (as there is in LG G3)
I'd love to know if there is such a thing ...
The quality is really bad ..
I'm with:
5.1
Build Number: LMY47D
Software Version: V10b-EUR-XX
regards,
Tomer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just check If there is same modification in Camera Settings
there is different pic ratio in auto mode for instance.
:good:

thank you for your reply
same ratio, but still picture not good...:crying:
can you add a photo for me (from your G4) ?
in Basic Mode ...

Ive checked up on this and from what I have read:
16:9 = 16MPx / 4:3 = 12 MPx / 1:1 = 8.5MPx (ill try and find the link)
With camera quality.. I know it sounds crazy, but I found cleaning my IR Laser focus and camera lens with Glass or lens cleaner worked for me (remember do not spray cleaner on the lens, apply it to a cloth, then polish the lens with the cloth) and wipe it VERY VERY Gently with a micro fibre cloth or an optical Glasses cloth ,
next Goto > Settings > Display > scroll down to More > Motion sensior calibration (lay it on a very flat surface).. and set it.. (try it a few times)
Motion sensor calibration sets the OIS and all the camera and focus sensors up.
Hope this helps..

Heres the thread here, but its an Android Central forum post, so Im not sure how reliable it is..
http://forums.androidcentral.com/lg-g4/533774-lg-g4-camera-settings-megapixel.html
Cheers

NightOrchid said:
Heres the thread here, but its an Android Central forum post, so Im not sure how reliable it is..
http://forums.androidcentral.com/lg-g4/533774-lg-g4-camera-settings-megapixel.html
Cheers
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Thanks for that..
i tried to clean and calibrate the G4, but still the quality of camera not good (even like G3)...
i attached also some pictures to give you taste from my problem with this camera..
I think the quality here is worse, the trees Smeared -not sharp (capture with 16: 9) ...
http://imageshack.com/a/img538/4183/NIRGSF.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/7079/dNHvrV.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/8522/yncySQ.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img901/2442/D6Jpo8.jpg

TOMER628 said:
Thanks for that..
i tried to clean and calibrate the G4, but still the quality of camera not good (even like G3)...
i attached also some pictures to give you taste from my problem with this camera..
I think the quality here is worse, the trees Smeared -not sharp (capture with 16: 9) ...
http://imageshack.com/a/img538/4183/NIRGSF.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/7079/dNHvrV.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/8522/yncySQ.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img901/2442/D6Jpo8.jpg
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Those pictures look fine to me. Show us the supposedly better pictures of the same thing taken with the G3.
Sent from my LG-H815 using XDA Forums Pro.

Please compare your photos to mine https://imgur.com/a/tqbEJ
If your quality is worse, i think u might have a bad camera sensor, try to replace the unit.

Derpling said:
Please compare your photos to mine https://imgur.com/a/tqbEJ
If your quality is worse, i think u might have a bad camera sensor, try to replace the unit.
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wish i had good quality like your photos..
i think you right i will try to replace with new unit..

gtg465x said:
Those pictures look fine to me. Show us the supposedly better pictures of the same thing taken with the G3.
Sent from my LG-H815 using XDA Forums Pro.
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Im inclined to agree with others here.. they look fine to me. Can I ask you to take some images of smaller objects with close up detail, such as flowers, kids toys, pets, food./. etc.. also, can you post the same pics taken with your G3. Take all pics in 16:9 ratio on both devices, full auto mode without flash.
If you have an issue, it may be the OIS.
They are beautiful pics. look in the bottom left hand corner of the ones youve taken or zoom in places.. theres lovely detail in the brick work.

I've actually noticed the same sort of thing with mine. I think the phone's postprocessing is too strong. Pictures of things like animals and trees almost look like an oil painting filter has been applied if you zoom in on them. Check out the fur on the picture I attached- LG's algorithm doesn't know what to do with images that have a lot of small, complex elements like leaves or fur. Thankfully that's something that could be patched, but I haven't heard many other people noticing it so I doubt it will be.

1. You never ever look at photos of this size. When looked at in a reasonable size, the pictures look awesome. When you downsize the pictures to a reasonable picturesize you would print, look at them again. You won't see those flaws.
2. Postprocessing of the jpegs is really to heavy and when you take a look at the DNGs, you see a real improvement over the jpegs. And I prefer the DNGs, since I can handle all of the parameters myself in Lightroom.
I think we will see some patches to the camera and postprocessing in the future, since LG is aware of the issue with the jpegs.

tripex2k said:
1. You never ever look at photos of this size. When looked at in a reasonable size, the pictures look awesome. When you downsize the pictures to a reasonable picturesize you would print, look at them again. You won't see those flaws.
2. Postprocessing of the jpegs is really to heavy and when you take a look at the DNGs, you see a real improvement over the jpegs. And I prefer the DNGs, since I can handle all of the parameters myself in Lightroom.
I think we will see some patches to the camera and postprocessing in the future, since LG is aware of the issue with the jpegs.
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Agreed here. That photo is briliant, however, yes I agree, LGs processing is very aggressive as is the OIS, so you get over-sharpening, One of the pit falls In photography is to digitally zoom into your images on your PC to check the sharpness, but this is a very bad habit to start and very hard to break.. try to avoid doing this.
In truth... no-body looks at an image 20 or 30x digitally zoomed.. Pictures are to be enjoyed and the camera is only as good as the photographer, so get the light right, frame your subject as big as you can in the view finder, by walking upto your subject and framing it.. not digitally zooming and get creative ... Its so easy to get caught up in the technology that we forget why we take photographs.. which is to either save our memories or create our art. To me, youtube reviewers started this crazy trend of digitally zooming everywhere, so some folk think that a good photograph is one that after a digital zoom you can read the text on a road sign 500 yards away and missing all the image round about.. this is not photography, its zooming.
If your just taking pictures for the technically sharp image, then.. go and buy a DSLR, because no phone camera will ever do it.
Hand on heart, some of the best images Ive ever taken were with an HTC One M8s 4UPX camera.. zoomed n they look like my nephews cra*py MineCraft game, but the image itself.. looks stunning.
Bottom Line, Enjoy your images and the love of photography.. the G4 is one of the best cameras on a phone Ive ever used..
However, if your not happy with the G4s camera.. either return it or buy a nice compact or bridge camera..
Enjoy Photo fans..

but the my quality camera (what i captured here before) is good ?
i mean this not bad sensor or something, right ?

I thought they looked ok, personally. Can you post comparison pics from the G3 (the same pics taken on each, preferably), to demonstrate the issue you are referring to?

Yes, I agree with the subsequent comments. Many years ago I ran motorized Nikons, and did my own color processing and printing, and I like to think I still have an eye for a decent print. I looked at two of the pictures, and while I might have suggested one click higher on the ISO (and that's just personal preference, really) I don't see anything wrong with the pictures.
Enzo

TOMER628 said:
but the my quality camera (what i captured here before) is good ?
i mean this not bad sensor or something, right ?
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Speaking personnally, I think your pictures look great and their really nice, I know youve mentioned this in your OP, but take another look at them and can you tell us what is it about your images that you think is wrong?
RedOCtobyr said:
I thought they looked ok, personally. Can you post comparison pics from the G3 (the same pics taken on each, preferably), to demonstrate the issue you are referring to?
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Click to collapse
Yep, Post some G3 pics,,, a good thing to do here is take exactly the same images with the G3 and G4 then compare them and post them here.
enzo ferraro said:
Yes, I agree with the subsequent comments. Many years ago I ran motorized Nikons, and did my own color processing and printing, and I like to think I still have an eye for a decent print. I looked at two of the pictures, and while I might have suggested one click higher on the ISO (and that's just personal preference, really) I don't see anything wrong with the pictures.
Enzo
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My dad used tr be a wedding photographer before he retired, but he still owns one of the original Rolliflex cameras. These days though I own a Canon SX700. Do you still have any of your Nikons
Another aspect of photography is that whenever you change your camera, youll always get differences thats why Photographers have multiple cameras... such as My canon has a minimum focal distance of 1cm and a 30x Optical zoom, so Ide use it for Macro ( small close up), yet my Olympus stylus 1 has quite nice sharpening and a wide angle Aperture of f3.2 so ide use it for landscapes.
Again, I have to say Tomer, I think your images are great, Heres an experiment you can try which might help.. take your camera out.. and take a few images of things that make you happy and what you want... completely forget about images that show off the camera tech, maybe your kids or friends or something like that,... download them to your PC and look at them.. dont zoom.. then see how you feel about your G4.
Heres the Image I took with a 4 Mpx HTC M8..
Its not technically brilliant, but it was a fun day and thats all that matters.

No, the Nikons and a trillion dollars worth of glass went long ago. I very much miss the film, but just wearied of carrying around a backbreaking load of gear. The digital image is not as good as film, and I don't care what anybody claims to the contrary on that, but I do agree completely that the best camera is the one you have at hand when the picture opportunity arises, and clearly the phone camera wins by a mile on that score.
Enzo

OP, I think a very easy test here would be to take the same photo using JPG, and again using RAW. Then, look at each zoomed in. You should see that the JPG has compression artifacts, but the RAW does not. Then, you will see the camera quality capabilities in the RAW to verify the camera is fine, and perhaps you are just seeing software compression artifacts in JPG.
In fact, it would be interesting to see those two pictures if you could post them here. Choose a subject that has a pattern that will give the JPG compression algorithm trouble, like the cat fur or many leaves/blades of grass at a distance, to make the difference more pronounced.

here couple of pictures ftom today...
this the result :
http://imageshack.com/a/img673/2597/P4I5q9.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/7629/n4t0aA.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img538/9131/AySMqD.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img908/1512/3YRk1w.jpg

Initial Camera Observations

Had my first day out with the V30 yesterday and just imported the photos and videos from it to my laptop for a closer look to make some initial evaluations. With some very interesting things to note and a lot to dig into further. There's definitely some realities that need to be addressed to better manage expectations.
1) I have no f'n clue what the HDR setting is doing other than making crappy photos. Which is about the same as it was on the V20. It's completely the opposite of what it was on the Nexus 6. On the Nexus 6, if you wanted the best photos out of the Google Camera you could get, you turned on HDR and forgot about it. With LG's Camera app, it's the exact opposite. Turn it off and forget it was ever there.
I still need to figure out the mess that the Google Camera app port has become and DL a copy and see how it does with this sensor.
2) If you shoot manual, there's a noise reduction on/off switch now. Unless you have some decent NR software though or know what you want to do with grainy photos (and I think it will have its uses, I just have to find the right subject), leave it on in very low light conditions. Not only does it tame grainy noise, it also tames a bit of purple fringe that will show up in high gain (high ISO) photos once the electronics start heating up around it.
3) As to that last part of #2: We have to be realistic here. This is a tiny cellphone camera packed in with A LOT of other electronics. If you're shooting several shots in a row or long exposures, either in dark conditions at high ISO, you will see amp glow or purple fringing. It's just a reality. Even DSLRs see it.
4) Digital zoom is digital zoom. If you aren't using just the standard view of each sensor, then you are going to see the limitations of a small sensor. I don't care what cellphone you're using. None of my larger/dedicated cameras have it for many good reasons. You shouldn't expect miracles from a smaller camera.
5) The wide angle sensor actually takes pretty good shots now in most conditions! The wide angle camera on the V20 was full of so many compromises that I avoided it at all costs. If I wanted a wider view than the standard lens, I would use the pano setting on the standard lens. Which is still a great option if everything in the frame is going to sit still but it takes time and patience. It still has distortion though, just not as much as before. You can't focus the wide angle in manual mode but you can in auto. Weird. It doesn't like to focus pointing directly overhead. That was hit or miss. Same rules about the NR and HDR apply here.
6) Video AF in low low light does miss sometimes. Again, just remember this phone doesn't have all the high end AF sensors that some DSLRs have to make sure focus is nailed every single time. Somewhere there's an article about the useful range of all the AF systems on the V20, I assume it still applies to the V30. I'll dig it up if I can to help manage expectations. If I remember right, laser AF is short range, maybe 7 feet.
7) During my import of files from my phone to my laptop, some of my videos lost their audio tracks. Not sure what that's about. I don't remember which ones were auto and which ones were manual but I suspect that's the problem. All videos have sound on my phone though.
8) I suck at video. Kinda hoping to kick myself in the rear with this phone and learn more about it. There's a lot more to manage and I probably won't be happy until I figure out the whole color grading thing and get the look I want. So the log file option ought to be a nice addition.
9) I remember telling someone that I swear I saw a video somewhere of a pre-unit that had the directional mics settings in manual video. Well, I can tell you that I must have imagined that because the unit I have does not have that setting. Just sliders and windcut.
10) And I don't know where LG is hiding it but I don't see 240 fps in any settings anywhere. The fastest video setting I see is 120fps. (Remember, only at 720p) I'm guessing 240 fps is reserved for the slo-mo mode and not available in manual or auto video modes.
11) Selfie camera. Yeah, I've seen the complaints. Are you sure your ugly mugs aren't breaking the camera? I posted this in the first impressions thread and I'll post it here. First thing I suggest doing is turning down the "skin toning" and skin lighting settings. Whoever renamed skin smoothing to skin toning should be shot as that's not what I thought that setting was at all. My first thought is that it adjusted the white balance of the skin to give you a rosier glow. Nope. Skin toning will butter face the heck out of you even on basics settings. Set it to zero. After that, the image held up well to some post processing and consistently gave me selfies I actually like. They actually remind me of something that might come from..... film.
I'm going to do some more shooting today and I'll try to figure out how to post examples without making you all click through to some other site. I also need to figure out how to get the videos over sound and all so I can give them honest assessments.

Ah, I just remembered something else to look out for.
12) If you shoot in manual and have the RAW option turned on, it isn't like on a real camera where you get the RAW file and a processed version of the RAW file. It shoots two photos. This does two things. One, it means you will see lag as it is shooting two photos for each press. This gets worse with longer shutter speeds. Two, this means unless you're shooting a still life that the RAW and JPG will not match. If you're shooting action like I was last night, you will get two completely different photos.

Interesting. Thanks for you observations.
I'm a pixel owner and I love the camera. It's ace. I really want to like the v30, but so far the real world observations and initial reviews haven't sung the praises of the camera. Are you happy with the camera or is it not worth the hype?

The camera is better than the V20 and I liked that a lot. Here's the issue in a nut shell. This phone is for those that aren't happy to just let the device to everything for you like an Apple product would. If that's what you want, that's what Pixels are about. Pixel is Google's iPhone. If you want control over the creative process, that's why the V's exist. The V series is more akin to using a DSLR and Pixels are more like a point and shoot. The Pixel series they're kinda hoping you're ok with whatever the phone spits out. The V series you tweak the initial settings and decide what the phone is even going to shoot so you can tweak it more to your liking later. The V30 gives us even more control than the V20 does.

CHH2 said:
The camera is better than the V20 and I liked that a lot. Here's the issue in a nut shell. This phone is for those that aren't happy to just let the device to everything for you like an Apple product would. If that's what you want, that's what Pixels are about. Pixel is Google's iPhone. If you want control over the creative process, that's why the V's exist. The V series is more akin to using a DSLR and Pixels are more like a point and shoot. The Pixel series they're kinda hoping you're ok with whatever the phone spits out. The V series you tweak the initial settings and decide what the phone is even going to shoot so you can tweak it more to your liking later. The V30 gives us even more control than the V20 does.
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Interesting. Thanks for the summary

I would like to but V30, all because camera. But I don't know is this camera one of the best in 2017 or it is just average camera. I see many bad comments on internet. And is front face camera really bad?

isko01 said:
I would like to but V30, all because camera. But I don't know is this camera one of the best in 2017 or it is just average camera. I see many bad comments on internet. And is front face camera really bad?
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Click to collapse
I probably still have a few more days of testing but just based off of what I've seen in my standardized shooting at the museum, LG has pulled off a miracle with this tiny little sensor.
Like I said above, you have to have realistic expectations and know what the limits are of your gear. That's what a really good photographer does though. They know how the gear works and how to use what it does but also know when it's time to use something else or accept not getting a shot.
This is a tiny sensor. The largest sensor on this whole phone is only 1/3.09". It's smaller than the main one on the V20 but it looks better. That in itself is amazing but I'm not expecting a sensor that's 1/3 the size of the sensor of my smallest camera to match it. Yet that's what some people seem to expect . Which is asinine.
Really the only "failing" I had yesterday was trying to shoot overhead in extremely dark conditions with the wide angle camera and shooting performers wearing all black on an outdoor stage in the dark with just stage lighting (which was changing colors constantly) while moving around quickly. Neither of those surprised me at all. The second condition really is the realm of DSLRs still. The first one, I'm ok with too. That said, what I did get from the second condition, I'm still surprised with.
I've only had one day with it but I think I'm going to get some surprising images out of this camera. Now to teach myself more about video editing.
And again, about the front camera. Once you set those stupid settings to the bottom, you can get more skin detail out of a photo than most people would like to see. Every crease and furrow in my brow line and forehead ,pock mark in my nose, and hairs on my head and beard. From shooting models, I can tell you a lot of people wouldn't want to see that level of detail on their face. So I have no idea what people are complaining about. It's an f'n vanity camera that most people wouldn't want to use to its full potential.

Uploaded a couple of shots. All shots are my normal workflow with a cellphone camera. Shot with the V30 and the jpegs processed in Snapseed. First one is shot with the main camera overhead in a room not known for being well lit at the museum I used to work at. In fact the only real lighting is from some LEDs in the pearl at center. The LEDs are designed to be very soft so they don't degrade the paint and woodwork. The other two shots are selfies taken with indirect sunlight being the only light source indoors. The one with back background is indirect sun through clear glass. The one with the light background is indirect sunlight through very milky glass.
Main camera: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/36870848874/
Dark background selfie cam: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/37322765870/
Light background selfie cam: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/23728950428/
Seriously, I'm not sure I'd really want more detail than that. I'm actually quite please with how all of these images turned out so far. I'll try to work up some more shots from the main and wides.

Can you post some pics in a room at night with just a lamp on or something in auto mode?

EVOme said:
Can you post some pics in a room at night with just a lamp on or something in auto mode?
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I'll have to see what I can set up. That's not really a normal shot I have set-up or sitting around. I might be able to do something at work tomorrow before everyone else gets in and the whole place is blasted with light. Unfortunately, I no longer work at the museum but I might be able to make something work.

isko01 said:
I would like to but V30, all because camera. But I don't know is this camera one of the best in 2017 or it is just average camera. I see many bad comments on internet.
And is front face camera really bad?
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Click to collapse
I'm not hijacking this thread, but you asked a specific question. There's another thread where the camera is discussed, along with other features, and @keithleger took all his in "auto" mode, to compare the two V30 back cameras, and he also compared it to the Note 8 camera which he's decided to sell.
Camera
-Excellent camera but not on par with Pixel line or Samsung. Don't get me wrong, it is a great camera and in the sunlight it is fantastic but low light it does not do as well as Note 8. Video or Stills. But it is very adequate for my needs and I prefer having the wide-angle lens over the zoom lens any day.
-The one thing that really bothered me was shutter lag at times. Sometimes when I snapped a photo it was almost instant and others I had to wait a second or so. Long enough to think I might not of pressed the button. Not sure if others have had this issue but it is troublesome. It was not isolated to taking multiple photos fairly quickly either. Sometimes first shot.
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However, he's selling the Note 8 to keep the LG V30.
He posted an album of his first weekend pictures, as well as the comparison shots to the Note 8. The V30 outside shots look FANTASTIC, and even though the Note 8seemed to do better indoors the LG V30 won at least one of the indoor shots, in my opinion.
As for selfies, he gives the same advice as @CHH2.. Turn off the enhancemet crap on the selfie camera.
keithleger said:
For selfies, if you set the skin tone and lighting effects to 0 then it is ok.
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CHH2 said:
Selfie camera. . First thing I suggest doing is turning down the "skin toning" and skin lighting settings.
Skin toning will butter face the heck out of you even on basics settings. Set it to zero.
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See, they say the same thing. The only reason I'm mentioning the other thread -- and I do not mean to hijack @CHH2 camera thread -- is because @keithleger has direct comparisons to the Note 8 camera was well as the f/1.6 and wide angle cameras on the V30. Plus he only shot in auto, and didn't do any post processing (to my knowledge).
I appreciate all the work @CHH2 has put into this thread!

CHH2 said:
I'll have to see what I can set up. That's not really a normal shot I have set-up or sitting around. I might be able to do something at work tomorrow before everyone else gets in and the whole place is blasted with light. Unfortunately, I no longer work at the museum but I might be able to make something work.
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Thanks! You don't have to go out of your way. I will have my phone tomorrow.

EVOme said:
Thanks! You don't have to go out of your way. I will have my phone tomorrow.
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I shot this real quick this morning. It's completely SOOC. Yes, you might notice something rather odd and be asking yourself, "Why didn't he rotate the image?" Well, I didn't rotate it because on my phone the image is upright and correct. Somewhere between the phone and Flickr, it got rotated. I'll be deleting this one at the end of today as it's not really something I'd normally shoot even as a reminder or novelty.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/36882784984/
And just because I got lucky this morning, a little close up:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/37593620881/

Going to add one more photo. This one shot in probably one of the most challenging places to shoot, a jazz club. This is probably the cleanest shot I've taken in there with a cellphone. I'm impressed.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/36883443574/

CHH2 said:
I shot this real quick this morning. It's completely SOOC. Yes, you might notice something rather odd and be asking yourself, "Why didn't he rotate the image?" Well, I didn't rotate it because on my phone the image is upright and correct. Somewhere between the phone and Flickr, it got rotated. I'll be deleting this one at the end of today as it's not really something I'd normally shoot even as a reminder or novelty.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/36882784984/
And just because I got lucky this morning, a little close up:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/37593620881/
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Wow man! I have restored faith in the camera. That office shot is very sharp. For the grasshopper, are you using one of the installed filters or is a post render?
Thank you for taking those.

EVOme said:
Wow man! I have restored faith in the camera. That office shot is very sharp. For the grasshopper, are you using one of the installed filters or is a post render?
Thank you for taking those.
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Click to collapse
You're welcome. For photos, I never use the filters in the camera apps. I always use Snapseed. It has a lot more control and much more power once you learn how to apply the various filters in combination. The grasshopper only had typical post processing that most photographers would apply; a tad sharpening that is only really noticeable when zoomed in, B&W conversion, bump in contrast, and a bump in shadows to make them a tad darker. Oh, and a crop, maybe threw away a little more than half the overall pixels from the frame as I didn't want to scare it off.
And yeah, for being such a tiny sensor, I'm impressed with the low light shooting. I still want to try shooting in the basement of the jazz club. That's usually territory that I need at least my smaller dedicated camera if not my DSLR. I won't get to try that again until this next weekend.

Decided to try something a little different. This isn't final by any means but this shows what playing around for a couple of minutes in Snapseed with just a couple quick shots can get you: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/37605204891/
Looking forward to showing this to my curator friend and watching him fall off of his barstool when I tell him it was all done on one cellphone in under five minutes. (He's pretty much a film guy as is the guy who is the inspiration for this photo. Bonus points if you can name the photographer I'm copying for this photo.)

Main camera: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/36870848874/
Dark background selfie cam: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/37322765870/
Light background selfie cam: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/23728950428/
.[/QUOTE]
What camera was used for those selfies? I'm not a fan of selfies but love the ones you've taken. I'd like to experiment with it and my fiance would too.thank you. Btw love you test album. Talent for sure

lg3FTW said:
Main camera: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/36870848874/
Dark background selfie cam: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/37322765870/
Light background selfie cam: https://www.flickr.com/photos/chimphappyhour/23728950428/
.
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Click to collapse
What camera was used for those selfies? I'm not a fan of selfies but love the ones you've taken. I'd like to experiment with it and my fiance would too.thank you. Btw love you test album. Talent for sure[/QUOTE]
I used the front selfie camera with all of those silly settings at the bottom of the frame turned off, set to zero, whatever their values are. Then I just did some quick processing in Snapseed. That's pretty much it. I don't get too complex. And thank you.

Finally figured out a work around so I can hear the audio on the videos I'm importing from the phone to my laptop and can't believe I didn't think of this before. Pulled the videos from their folder over into an empty Chrome browser window and Voila! they played complete with their soundtrack!
So the following is from shooting in a dark jazz club. (Notes, not footage yet. I'll try uploading something to youtube when I figure out what, when, and how.)
Probably the most important observation I see about video from the V30 (and this actually applied to the V20 too) is that loud music can end up jostling the OIS and introduce more shake than it removes.
Another observation is that recording video while in Auto mode, you better make sure you have plenty of somewhat decent light. Tonight while playing around, the screen would be plenty bright all the way up until I hit that little red record button. Then the screen squeezes down and went dark enough that the footage was unusable. Shooting in manual video mode, I was able to get some footage. It wasn't exactly ideal settings that I was shooting with though so the footage is so-so. (Best settings I could get were ISO 3200 and a shutter speed of 1/25. My understanding is that since I had my frame rate at 24fps, I should have had a shutter speed of 1/50 but that just wasn't happening inside that place.)
In manual video mode, it really doesn't like ISO 3200 for some reason. I'd play with a setting and come back and the ISO would be set to 3150 for some reason. I'd bump it back up to 3200, go do something else, come back to 3150. I would have to make sure that's the last thing I tweaked before hitting the record button.
The audio picks up pretty much all the sounds I'm hearing. I need to sit down with headphones and see if there's extra noise being introduced. I suspect dragging the videos into the Chrome browser is exactly the best quality test. It just lets me know the audio tracks are intact in the file which I was a little worried about at first.
I still have a lot more playing around with the video as most of it is new to me.

Camera/Photography thread - tips, apps, advice

Hi, guys,
I'm coming from an Xperia Z3C, which had a camera that was pretty bad. Even though some bash the XZ1C camera, it's a lot better than what I used.
I'm no photographer and I dont' know the apps, so I'd like everyone to share what they know and use.

doriandiaconu said:
Hi, guys,
I'm coming from an Xperia Z3C, which had a camera that was pretty bad. Even though some bash the XZ1C camera, it's a lot better than what I used.
I'm no photographer and I dont' know the apps, so I'd like everyone to share what they know and use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Despite people putting down the stock camera, I find it does take good a picture, although using a small tripod gets the best results. This is far from idea for a phone, but just resting the phone on something solid dramtically imporves the picture.
The focusing seems to be better if you turn off 'object tracking' and although HDR is supposed to be automatic in the auto mode, I tend to shoot in manual with HDR enabled. The predictive capture is a good & useful tool. I wasn't sure when I first saw it introduced, but it does a burst shot when it gets triggered by a smile and dramtically increases your chances of getting a great picture.
My favorite post proccessing app is SKRWT. I love taking landscapes and this is great for straightening things or there are some funky mirror effects.

Didgesteve said:
Despite people putting down the stock camera, I find it does take good a picture, although using a small tripod gets the best results. This is far from idea for a phone, but just resting the phone on something solid dramtically imporves the picture.
The focusing seems to be better if you turn off 'object tracking' and although HDR is supposed to be automatic in the auto mode, I tend to shoot in manual with HDR enabled. The predictive capture is a good & useful tool. I wasn't sure when I first saw it introduced, but it does a burst shot when it gets triggered by a smile and dramtically increases your chances of getting a great picture.
My favorite post proccessing app is SKRWT. I love taking landscapes and this is great for straightening things or there are some funky mirror effects.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What about the resolution? Many people avoid the 19MP resolution for different reasons.

doriandiaconu said:
What about the resolution? Many people avoid the 19MP resolution for different reasons.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
19MP is the only resolution. It's the native size of the sensor, meaning you get one=one. Anything else is derived from a software interpretation.
People seem to be obsessed by letterbox, perhaps because that's the way they watch TV. If you don't like the square shape of a 19MP picture, then edit it afterwards, but a least get the best quality you can to start with.

I've taken some decent shots with Open Camera. I like its DRO mode (dynamic range optimization). Haven't had much luck with stock camera app, although I'm a fan of the wide angle selfie camera.

the camera is good not more... not a lot of choices in creative mode, iA can't be customized, "macro" focus at 10 cm... at least it's pretty fast

I use the stock app, mainly in manual mode without object tracking (with that setting on I find the focus is a little inaccurate, maybe just an impression).
Overall i would say the app has all you need to take a photo plus a couple of nice features (like autofocus burst mode and predictive capture).

Any tips on what kind of exposure and ISO to use in manual mode? My pics always come out blurry.
Edit: For example, would the tips here apply? https://forum.xda-developers.com/xperia-xz/how-to/xperia-xz-camera-how-to-optimize-manual-t3534640
Sounds like most people are saying choose a low ISO and EV a little below 1.
I'm particularly interested in tips or settings that don't require a tripod, because I don't own one. And I think it's unrealistic to expect people to use a tripod to take decent phone pics.

I had a big night shootout in Frankfurt with XZ1c and Galaxy s8. Im not good in photography and all shoots are in Auto mode. Couple of shoots are manipulated in Adobe Lightroom in Auto light and color corections. They names started with LLR....
What You think?
https://photos.app.goo.gl/YUQIYsKXGg5tGugK2

propov said:
I had a big night shootout in Frankfurt with XZ1c and Galaxy s8. Im not good in photography and all shoots are in Auto mode. Couple of shoots are manipulated in Adobe Lightroom in Auto light and color corections. They names started with LLR....
What You think?
https://photos.app.goo.gl/YUQIYsKXGg5tGugK2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm no photography expert, but I could see the difference instantly on most of these. The XZ1c photos were blurry and seemed improperly exposed. The S8 wasn't perfect, but it was generally a lot sharper. This basically mirrors my experience with the XZ1c and my previous phone that had a better camera, HTC 10.

Has anyone installed AOSP and got the Pixel's camera apk working on the xz1c? This is my main motivation for going the root -> rom route.

Take a picture of a green lawn or of leafy trees, and there's often an unpleasant, slightly smeary watercolor-like effect. Is it possible that using another camera application would prevent this processing effect?

Hello,
I am sorry in case this has been covered so far. I did not find it.
I have a custom ROM (RR6), but would like to use the stock Camera mainly for the slow motion 960fps video recording. It seems to be possible via this topic:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/cr...-apps/app-xperia-xzs-panorama-camera-t3577514
But even if it worked, it would replace the custom ROM's Camera, which I'd like to keep. Is there a way to run these two Cameras side by side?
Or should I use another 3rd party app that does the slo-mo job?
Thanks a lot for anz advidce!

vhatp said:
Hello,
I am sorry in case this has been covered so far. I did not find it.
I have a custom ROM (RR6), but would like to use the stock Camera mainly for the slow motion 960fps video recording. It seems to be possible via this topic:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/cr...-apps/app-xperia-xzs-panorama-camera-t3577514
But even if it worked, it would replace the custom ROM's Camera, which I'd like to keep. Is there a way to run these two Cameras side by side?
Or should I use another 3rd party app that does the slo-mo job?
Thanks a lot for anz advidce!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea thats my concern as well. I am not sure if drm fix can re-enable the 960fps slow mo or is it gone for good after unlocking bootloader. If only we can get gcam and stock camera run together

Question No zoom lens until 5x

So I noticed that the zoom lens only activates at 5x zoom. You can see this by covering the lens with your finger and zooming in.
I gather this must mean that the optical 4x lens is fixed at 4x, but as it only kicks in at 5x zoom you can never get 4x optical zoom shots as it is cropped to 5x ?
This would also mean that up to 5x zoom you are just getting a digital crop of the main lens?
Am I missing something here? Seems a little weird that you cant get a 4x optical shot with a 4x optical lens fitted.

rosso22 said:
So I noticed that the zoom lens only activates at 5x zoom. You can see this by covering the lens with your finger and zooming in.
I gather this must mean that the optical 4x lens is fixed at 4x, but as it only kicks in at 5x zoom you can never get 4x optical zoom shots as it is cropped to 5x ?
This would also mean that up to 5x zoom you are just getting a digital crop of the main lens?
Am I missing something here? Seems a little weird that you cant get a 4x optical shot with a 4x optical lens fitted.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Googles periscope lens doesn't kick in a "fixed" manner, it uses an algorithm (ambient light, shaking, distance to object etc) to decide "on its own" when to kick in the dedicated zoom lens. You can easily test this out/replicate this by lowering the light in your room/and or change your distance to your desired object and see that the point where periscope lens kicks in, changes.
Best just try to focus on the amount of details you can see, if you play around with it, you can quickly see through the Preview when periscope kicks in, since that will improve the amount of details in your preview window significantly.
Many people here want "fixed" values, but as of now, Google doesn't offer that.
This is also a big problem in reviews, since those people don't know about this limitation and you can often see a "here, 4x shot, not looking good" and my eyes tell me "jea, that's a digital crop, you m*ron" and none are the wiser.

So your saying you never know whether you will get a crop or an optical zoom shot at 4x, this makes the 4x lens pointless imho.
Google are basically stopping you using a feature of the phone whenever you want. If every zoom shot is a gamble on cropped or optical, decided by the phone, surely they are stopping you from getting the best performance from the camera every shot/zoom length.
If I choose a 4x shot I want optical every time or I may as well have bought the 6 instead of the pro and saved some money.

The deciding factor on whether it's digital zoom or the telephoto lens is the distance of the object. I estimate the telephoto lens minimum focus distance is around 4 feet. As you go between close and far objects, you can see the stutter between the digital 4x and telephoto 4x. You could always cover the either the main lens or telephoto and figure it out too. What they really need to do is add an icon in the camera app that lets you know it's 4x digital zoom or 4x telephoto.
This isn't something that's only unique to the 6 Pro.

EeZeEpEe said:
What they really need to do is add an icon in the camera app that lets you know it's 4x digital zoom or 4x telephoto.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This. I think that's the best solution for now, let people know what they have at the moment.

rosso22 said:
So your saying you never know whether you will get a crop or an optical zoom shot at 4x, this makes the 4x lens pointless imho.
Google are basically stopping you using a feature of the phone whenever you want. If every zoom shot is a gamble on cropped or optical, decided by the phone, surely they are stopping you from getting the best performance from the camera every shot/zoom length.
If I choose a 4x shot I want optical every time or I may as well have bought the 6 instead of the pro and saved some money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The threshold in the HAL is at about 4.3x provided that all the other requirements for the switch are met. You can see the image "jump" slightly when it crosses the threshold because the image characteristics do not match perfectly. So yes, you can definitely tell which sensor it is using.
The reason why they don't alert you to which sensor it is using is because they (gooble) think they're smarter than you and better able to pick the right sensor.

Another thing to keep in mind is if the 4x telephoto was the default, anything too close would be immediately blurry. Then how do you switch to a digital zoom?

They could just give us a way of selecting the lens in use manually. Instead of treating us all like idiots.

rosso22 said:
They could just give us a way of selecting the lens in use manually. Instead of treating us all like idiots.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good luck with that. Truly given the way the entire world is being run right now, its pretty clear that the vast majority of people *ARE* idiots. And that is putting it mildly. So best way to make money is to sell to the majority, who are stupid enough to trust government -- those people clearly can't think for themselves.

rosso22 said:
So your saying you never know whether you will get a crop or an optical zoom shot at 4x, this makes the 4x lens pointless imho.
Google are basically stopping you using a feature of the phone whenever you want. If every zoom shot is a gamble on cropped or optical, decided by the phone, surely they are stopping you from getting the best performance from the camera every shot/zoom length.
If I choose a 4x shot I want optical every time or I may as well have bought the 6 instead of the pro and saved some money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, return your pro and get the 6. be happier.

It's worse on video. I took a supposedly 4x video of my dog and it looks terrible. Pixelated, oversharpened and unusable.

MacGuy2006 said:
It's worse on video. I took a supposedly 4x video of my dog and it looks terrible. Pixelated, oversharpened and unusable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you have 4k60fps enabled?
For some odd reason, Google only allows the dedicated sensors to kick in if you use 30fps, since both the ultrawide and Tele module do not support 4k60fps.
So if you zoom in whilst having 4k60fps enabled, it will always be a digital zoom.

This is one of the most annoying features. The 4x lense can focus as reasonably close range but the "ai" deciding to either crop and main lense or switch to the periscope is crap.
You can trick it by switching to 4x and focusing on a distant object and back again and hope it's just within range.
People ask why use it so close, but the 4x can really aid in composing a shot without the wide distortions.
Another issue is if you adjust anything like HDR or temperature on the main lense and switch focal length to other options it doesn't switch to the actual lense you want anymore!!

MacGuy2006 said:
It's worse on video. I took a supposedly 4x video of my dog and it looks terrible. Pixelated, oversharpened and unusable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can't use the telephoto sensor for video. Only the other two.

86rickard said:
This is one of the most annoying features. The 4x lense can focus as reasonably close range but the "ai" deciding to either crop and main lense or switch to the periscope is crap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In my book, that's an idiotic "feature" and is in fact a bug.
It makes zooming in day-to-day use unusable in most common cases.
When I zoomed to 4x and took a video, the result (1080) was not usable. It's a joke.

I think the conclusion here is the entire camera system really needs work. The hardware is better but the software is letting it down. Jerky transitions, bugs and a processing algorithm left over from the lower quality sensor days that actually over works the 50mp images.

96carboard said:
You can't use the telephoto sensor for video. Only the other two.
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Click to collapse
No, you can. I just tested it by setting it to 4x, making sure I'm focused on something far enough, and blocking the telephoto lens does block the picture.

Just discussing this elsewhere, with regard to the MWP GCam mod. This is a *serious* improvement over the stock app; the one thing they could do to make it perfect is give you control over when the periscope kicks in. If anyone here knows the people working on this, please mention this. The mod is here, btw — you really should try it! The version you want is 8.3.252-V1c_MWP:
MWP GCam APKs - Google Camera Port
Modified Google Camera app by MWP.
www.celsoazevedo.com

Gnaius said:
Just discussing this elsewhere, with regard to the MWP GCam mod. This is a *serious* improvement over the stock app; the one thing they could do to make it perfect is give you control over when the periscope kicks in. If anyone here knows the people working on this, please mention this. The mod is here, btw — you really should try it! The version you want is 8.3.252-V1c_MWP:
MWP GCam APKs - Google Camera Port
Modified Google Camera app by MWP.
www.celsoazevedo.com
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That may not actually be an option. The hal only presents one logical camera on that side of the phone and transparently switches between the sensors based on the level of zoom requested, and an assortment of other data.
I haven't looked into what the hal looks like, is it open source? If it is, presumably it could be modified to present 3 or 4 logical cameras (I.e. 3 individual + 1 combined).

Gnaius said:
Just discussing this elsewhere, with regard to the MWP GCam mod. This is a *serious* improvement over the stock app;
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How is it an improvement?
Testing zoom, it still uses the main lens on 1x, 2x ad 4x. Just like the stock camera does.
This is another reason to dislike this phone and to recommend against buying it.