Before anyone says game streaming I wanted to know if there was any other features that I should consider when deciding over a cheap android box and the shield. I owned a cheap android box for 2 years and it was really good but it was slow and never got updates but kodi worked perfectly until 17 update, but it's hard justifying a $300 price tag for the 16gb over $50 for the cheap one.
1. CPU performance, much faster then any s912, especially it have active cooling make it can keep in full speed, if you use any old amlogic box you will know you just can't decode any 1080 hi10p due to either the HW decoder not support or CPU not fast enough for SW decode. The shield can do it by CPU with 50-70%cpu usage max. Also although newer amlogic such as S912 support h265 but it is very buggy, the shield TV on the other hand is very stable.
2. For Android gaming I don't think you can find any android box in this size/price can better then it. Sure you can get a x86 box but that will much more expensive and larger.
3. Support 1080 ycbcr 422 12bit , I don't have 4K so dunno what is support, but as I remember there are no other cheap android box will support this output. (Sure you will need to take care the HDMI version mismatch problem if you got AVR)
If you will not use Plex and don't need IR then I suggest you just get the 16GB version, by the way I attach a 128GB USB stick to store my mame rom, much faster then hdd version.
Previous I use mi box and some other android box, but I can say shield TV is the most problem free and the fastest one for me.
$50 android boxes are junk, period. These things should be illegal to sell in USA. The manufactures are horrible at support & you never get updates. The only time a cheap android box is worth buying is if there are active private developers. Here's where the price difference matters, your $50 box lasted you 2 years. I've had my shield tv for almost 2 years & my guess is it'll still be alive & kicking in 10 years & still be my main media center. The shield tv was released as a future proof device, meaning it has a long life span while the $50 junk boxes have a very short limited life span hardware & software wise, you'll be replacing these types of boxes every 2 years.
Since when was the 16GB version $300?!
What feature(s)?!
In One Word... Widevine L(evel)1 support. (Ok tht was Two Words, whatever...)
Why is this a big deal? In Two Words this time. Amazon, and Netflix. In full UHD, let alone FHD. Your ~50$ 'Droid Box most likely will never have it. The only exception to that rule would be the Xaiomi Mi Box. Which like the Shield TV is a licenced AndroidTV Box. Which is based on the well known AmLogic S905 SoC. I have no ideas on how, or if Amazon will ever be ported to it. For now I gather it's a bit of a Shield exclusive. But, Netflix should be fine, along with the other usual suspects.
There is also the Gaming, and Emulation side of the Device, that puts it well ahead of the competition. With its small but exclusive Titles under the nVIDIA Lightspeed Studios. But, that may not be enough to convince a mass take up of it considering the initial cost.
If all you need is a cheap Kodi Box than by all means. You could pick one up, and gamble that you get a working one. Note I got burnt TWICE with an AmLogic S912 SoC Device. The first One cooked itself, while using Chrome, and the Second came with a defective WiFi Chip. So you take your chances with an unknown when buying One of these Devices.
When it comes to Updates, you'd be lucky to see a few Bug fixes before whoever's in charge gets bored, and moves on. nVIDIA have been supporting the Shield TV since it came out in 2015, and they will probably still be supporting it for a while yet with the 2017 version.
One last thing you might like to know about Kodi, and these Cheapo Boxes. Unless those Manufactures get off their butts, and code their CODECs to Android spec. Kodi will only ever function in Software mode only. Which will have a major impact on Video performance. Alas I don't know if the Mi Box also has that problem. Given its a specialized AmLogic build, perhaps not? But, a native Netflix App does not a Kodi make.
Of course there is One other thing that separates both the Shield TV, and the Mi Box. (Which I hinted at earlier.)
They are both Licenced AndroidTV units. And, in case that isn't quite clear to you. Then a word of caution to you. AndroidTV ≠ Android (e.g. Some generic 'Droid Box.), You should expect to see virtually nothing in the (AndroidTV), PlayStore. Certainly nothing like what most People probably imagine, after getting off the PlayStore on their Samsung Phablet. And, you can thank Google for that!
se1000 said:
Since when was the 16GB version $300?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably since nVIDIA weren't able to meet the demand for the Device which drove Scalpers to scalp it along with the Pro for Upwards of 600€'s, and no I wish I was making that up. The only time the Shield came down to reasonable levels, was just before they announced the Shield 2 (a.k.a. The Shield TV Slim), which was rightly rejected by those who already had a Shield. Seeing that I was able to get a used '15 Pro for 'round 200€ back in January. Good luck finding one now, for that price. If I wanted to spend nearly 300€ on a used One. I would rather just buy the new '17 Model for a fraction more. (i.e. 329€).
Ichijoe said:
What feature(s)?!
One last thing you might like to know about Kodi, and these Cheapo Boxes. Unless those Manufactures get off their butts, and code their CODECs to Android spec. Kodi will only ever function in Software mode only. Which will have a major impact on Video performance. Alas I don't know if the Mi Box also has that problem. Given its a specialized AmLogic build, perhaps not? But, a native Netflix App does not a Kodi make.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are correct on this, most cheap android box had broken mediacodec support, as KODI remove the amcodec support so either 1. switch to old version/spmc which have amcode, 2. SW decode, but the cpu not fast enough most of the time.
the google version of mi box's mediacodec are ok, but it still cannot hw decode hi10p (main reason I switch from mi box to shield tv)
DummyPLUG said:
You are correct on this, most cheap android box had broken mediacodec support, as KODI remove the amcodec support so either 1. switch to old version/spmc which have amcode, 2. SW decode, but the cpu not fast enough most of the time.
the google version of mi box's mediacodec are ok, but it still cannot hw decode hi10p (main reason I switch from mi box to shield tv)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Outside of actively getting off my [REDACTED] to search for some hi10p Materials, back when I was still knee deep in Linux VDR (i.e. HTPC). The chances of actually encountering anything actually encoded at 10bits is extremely rare. And I do likes me some KissAnime. So I would chalk it down as a nice to have feature, and not the Killer One, that Widevine Level 1 is. As only the Select TVs running ATV, or the MiBox, and Shield TV are capable of such high end DRMs, for legaly being able to watch Netflix in either FHD, or UHD.
Since those other Boxes only have Widevine Level 3. You'd be lucky to watch Netflix in 480p MAX!
So for me that's a bigger deal going forward. Mores the pitty that the MiBox is virtually useless outside of North America though.
Not going into hard core comparison as far as audio support and video support but just general laymen comparison.
As reference current devices I own a A95x cheap android box, Fire TV Sticks, Nexus Players and 2nd Gen Fire TV, Roku2, Shield TV Gen 1
1. Performance - I didn't think the difference would be that huge since I mainly just use streaming services and apps like Netflix and Kodi to name a few but it's noticeable even in just those two areas. My FTV2 was snappy I thought compared to my other devices but the Shield just Launches apps quicker and goes through local and internet streams a lot smoother. Not a gamer but I have used them and let kids use them to try games and again just performance is amazing.
2. Ease of use my gripe with the a95x cheapo is It was IR remote and the interface just sucked. FTV2 and FTV sticks had their own interface over Lollipop and this too I am not a big fan of. Nexus Player and Shield TV are very straightforward and use the Leanback Launcher IMO easier to use and get google play store unlike Amazons offerings.
3. You get what you pay for. It's an investment that hopefully it will last. Performance wise I'm not worried about having to get a new box for a while now. Also the build and the remotes just are more appealing with the metal finish and all and they are rechargeable (yes the drawback is it's not replaceable batteries). It's running official Android TV yes the Playstore is limited for TV devices but for average user that doesn't want to side load and just works great out of the box it's perfect.
If cost is an issue like it was for me just wait for a deal or find one used if you're willing to take the chance. I just got my 1st gen Shield 2 weeks ago because I bought it used for $120 and had I tested it beforehand I never would have bought my a95x, fire tv sticks. I am happy with the Nexus Players I scored those for $40 but it's discontinued and my FTV2 but the Shield TV kicked those devices out of the family room and now those are in mine and kids bedrooms.
If performance isn't a huge deal then I wouldn't upgrade. If it is but cost still too high there are alternatives Fire TV (Just ew Amazon interface) and Nexus Player (Discontinued) or Mi box (Owned for a month and returned it performance wasn't as good as Nexus Player).
I have 2 fire sticks, a firetv box, and the new version of the shield TV. The shield is fast and responsive, but I don't think its performance justifies the price. If you not going for game steaming... I would just use a firetv box. Kodi performance is on par.
Here is my problem with the shield TV. Ram. For its price point I would expect 4gb of ram. This was a huge mistake I feel when they released the new version.
Don't get me wrong, I love my shield but if I didn't get mine for 175 with a deal, I would have not got it.
I couldn't disagree more with the majority of what's been said. It is true that the shield is an investment. It's worth it in the long run to get a shield. Talks of "4gb of ram" are comical at best. You want 4gb of ram buy a jetson tx1 for $500+ The point is, 4gb of ram isn't required when you have a constant power source. Take the Nintendo switch for example, yea sure it's basically a jetson tx1 (4gb ram) but clocked at a much lower speed to run on battery.
I would say it depends greatly upon how you want to come to the Shield TV. If your looking at it as just another in a long line of 'Droid Boxen, then that is how you will see it. If your like me, and your coming in from the huge running costs of an HTPC, with VDR Recording capabilities. Then the Shield becomes self-evident. As it can do those same jobs in a much tighter Footprint, and use just a microfraction of the Electricity to do it. Everything else is just a nice bonus. e.g. The Games, Emulations, Android itself.
So no Op is correct the Shield TV isn't the right answer for everyone. If for example Op wanted just the cheapest Box to do the most basic streaming (Amazon, Hulu, Netflix HBO Go, etc....), Then the Amazon Fire TV, would be right up his street. But IIRC, that only had 2GB of RAM, not that you would need it.
Also, if you want extra storage, you're better off getting the 16GB model and adding an external HDD. The way Nvidia set up the Pro model is kinda dumb - everything (including the system ROM) runs on the HDD, not flash, so it's really slow. It's also not user-replaceable without voiding the warranty and a lot of hassle. 4 TB portable drives are a bit over $100, so you can get a lot more storage for almost the same price.
Mogster2K said:
Also, if you want extra storage, you're better off getting the 16GB model and adding an external HDD. The way Nvidia set up the Pro model is kinda dumb - everything (including the system ROM) runs on the HDD, not flash, so it's really slow. It's also not user-replaceable without voiding the warranty and a lot of hassle. 4 TB portable drives are a bit over $100, so you can get a lot more storage for almost the same price.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That might be true... But it's not like you couldn't just clone the contents of the Original SSHD, and then write that to the heavier, faster SSD. There are at least Two Threads on that subject, that I'm personally aware of. As to it being slower? That only applies when doing things like unlocking the Bootloader (a precursor to rooting), or factory resetting it where in both cases it'll take the best part of 2h to complete. Under day to day use However, I greatly doubt there is any major difference in the overall speed.
Also the newer Slim (and, light) Shield TV, also lack a few things, like the IR Port (for Harmony Remotes), and the OTG MicroUSB Port, and worse of all the MicroSD Slot.
Also one thing about Adopted Storage, e.g. adding external Storage. Just because you could add a 4TB SS/H/DD, doesn't give you licence to go 'round installing everything to your heart's content as not everything will be installed to External (Adopted), Storage and you will most likely be scratching your head about not having enough Space to install some Game even if you have the best part of 4+ GBs left inside in your External Storage. Just the way it is on my Phablet alas Adopted Storage is kind of a lie. As I see it.
If you replace the Pro HDD with an SSD, you're paying $100 just for the hard drive bay. (Edit: I did not realize the Pro hardware was basically unchanged.) Also, I would not recommend using an HDD as adopted storage anyway. Better to leave it as NTFS since Android network transfers are so slow.
Finally, it is possible to boot the Shield TV from an external SSD. You need a special boot image (MM only unfortunately) and an SSD in a USB enclosure. It's a bit tricky to set up but works pretty well. A Nougat version is in the works.
Ichijoe said:
That might be true... But it's not like you couldn't just clone the contents of the Original SSHD, and then write that to the heavier, faster SSD. There are at least Two Threads on that subject, that I'm personally aware of. As to it being slower? That only applies when doing things like unlocking the Bootloader (a precursor to rooting), or factory resetting it where in both cases it'll take the best part of 2h to complete. Under day to day use However, I greatly doubt there is any major difference in the overall speed.
Also the newer Slim (and, light) Shield TV, also lack a few things, like the IR Port (for Harmony Remotes), and the OTG MicroUSB Port, and worse of all the MicroSD Slot.
Also one thing about Adopted Storage, e.g. adding external Storage. Just because you could add a 4TB SS/H/DD, doesn't give you licence to go 'round installing everything to your heart's content as not everything will be installed to External (Adopted), Storage and you will most likely be scratching your head about not having enough Space to install some Game even if you have the best part of 4+ GBs left inside in your External Storage. Just the way it is on my Phablet alas Adopted Storage is kind of a lie. As I see it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try enable force app install on external in developer options, I had no problem to save everything to my USB.
Related
Hi,
so question is:
(Fire TV) Snapdragon 8064 + Adreno 320 VS Amlogic S802 + Mali-450MP6 (Tronsmart Vega S89)
for 1080 TV?
which is better? support more video, audio formats?
EvgeniX said:
Hi,
so question is:
(Fire TV) Snapdragon 8064 + Adreno 320 VS Amlogic S802 + Mali-450MP6 (Tronsmart Vega S89)
for 1080 TV?
which is better? support more video, audio formats?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Going on past experience, not having used the Vega, I would say the Qualcom is the better processor. I consider the Amlogic processors great work horses. Not always the fastest but strong.
kairnage said:
Going on past experience, not having used the Vega, I would say the Qualcom is the better processor. I consider the Amlogic processors great work horses. Not always the fastest but strong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx!
still can not decide Fire TV or Vega... I think Fire TV will get more devs supports when rooted....
EvgeniX said:
Thx!
still can not decide Fire TV or Vega... I think Fire TV will get more devs supports when rooted....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Vega seems a bit to spend $30 to $60 more just for 8GB more storage, but I am sure it will comes down. I was reading some stuff and even though benchmarks are not the be all end all it scores a lot lower, but that goes back to what I think about Amlogic processors. Honestly if both had been $99 I might have considered the Vega, but I have Prime so that would have tipped it.
kairnage said:
The Vega seems a bit to spend $30 to $60 more just for 8GB more storage, but I am sure it will comes down. I was reading some stuff and even though benchmarks are not the be all end all it scores a lot lower, but that goes back to what I think about Amlogic processors. Honestly if both had been $99 I might have considered the Vega, but I have Prime so that would have tipped it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Vega 8gb = $105 or $114 with shipping
Vega 16gb = $120 or $128 with shipping
VS
Fire TV 8gb = $99
so not big difference... just what to get more power
Also one big plus of Vega - it has Miracast
Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk
EvgeniX said:
Vega 8gb = $105 or $114 with shipping
Vega 16gb = $120 or $128 with shipping
VS
Fire TV 8gb = $99
so not big difference... just what to get more power
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually hadn't seen an 8GB version only the 16.
---------- Post added at 11:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 PM ----------
EvgeniX said:
Also one big plus of Vega - it has Miracast
Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
koush ported Allcast to the Fire TV.
kairnage said:
koush ported Allcast to the Fire TV.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes but it does not cast full screen... chrome... when miracast do and do this great...
EvgeniX said:
Hi,
so question is:
(Fire TV) Snapdragon 8064 + Adreno 320 VS Amlogic S802 + Mali-450MP6 (Tronsmart Vega S89)
for 1080 TV?
which is better? support more video, audio formats?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not sure about multimedia side of it, but the snapdragon definitely has the stronger gpu:
http://kyokojap.myweb.hinet.net/gpu_gflops/
EvgeniX said:
Thx!
still can not decide Fire TV or Vega... I think Fire TV will get more devs supports when rooted....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
robclark said:
not sure about multimedia side of it, but the snapdragon definitely has the stronger gpu:
http://kyokojap.myweb.hinet.net/gpu_gflops/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tough times. I am a Minix Neo X7 owner, and if it wasnt to freaktab.com, it would end up being a useless box. I use a KitKat rom which has really revolutionized my Minix but nevertheless, i want to extend and upgrade
BUT...i have conditions. For as why? cause ive seen various devices that amazed me in something, and totally destroyed it with something else. Let me explain myself...
Geniatech has a box that can fit a 2.5/3.5 HDD with a Sata 3 controller, and even has an eSata interface, want the drawback? It runs Android 2.3
Ive seen devices with even analogue A/V output for old TV's (or ppl who prefer stereo over surround, like me), drawback, stupid manufacturers scared to release sources due to the competition in China not giving a damn of stealing.
not to mention rip offs, nearly all RK3188 use 802.11b/g/n chips. when you see 802.11n and no 802.11a, that means it is a draft 11n chip, DRAFT VERSION wifi chips, just amazing. Lately RK3188-T has been found, a locked CPU that does not offer more then 1.4ghz, yet they are sold as 1.6 ghz. and the best one, since we deal with unreleased sources, every time they release a new platform, the old one is totally ignored. At least phones are supported for up to 2-3 years, my Minix is not even a year old and as soon as X8 is out it will be forgotten. and we are talkin about Minix, the company that does the best community support, which is still BULL SH!T.
anyway, Fire TV is future proof as they have started on the right foot (especially by releasing sources), AMLogic just kicked RK3188 out of the game, nevertheless, RK3288 which is ringing the door bell is very powerful, featuring the best Mali GPU that seems to be used only by the RK3288 platform (something specifically done for RK, might end up causing headaches on the community) and even supports HDMI 2.0 which is a prerequisite if you are going for 4K.
This area of products is growing, and the manufacturers better listen to the feed back of the guinea pigs.
I would pay 200 Euros without hesitation if a device featured these as fundamental:
USB 3.0
Gigabit Ethernet
enough space to fit a 2.5" SSD or mSata/mPCIe so we can get rid of slow EMMCs
802.11 a/n/ac - b/g/n with at least 4 Antennas
i'd even go further with details such as dual hdmi/dp, or hdmi in (rk3288 has it), or multiple Ethernet ports. You'd have an Android Computer which acts as a HTPC and as a NAS as well and even as a Wireless Router and Switch.
PS, regarding the vega, s802 does not support DTS and DD, s802-h does, Minix X8 will be released with an elite version that beholds the new s802-h.
PlutoDelic said:
I would pay 200 Euros without hesitation if a device featured these as fundamental:
USB 3.0
Gigabit Ethernet
enough space to fit a 2.5" SSD or mSata/mPCIe so we can get rid of slow EMMCs
802.11 a/n/ac - b/g/n with at least 4 Antennas
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, if you are willing to make your own case, in return for having something that is completely unlocked
http://www.inforcecomputing.com/product/moreinfo/ifc6410.html
(basically same chip as in firetv, but ddr3 vs lpddr2, plus sata and gigabit ethernet)
of course, you are then DIY on the software front.. shouldn't be much of a problem if you just wanted xbmc.
robclark said:
well, if you are willing to make your own case, in return for having something that is completely unlocked
http://www.inforcecomputing.com/product/moreinfo/ifc6410.html
(basically same chip as in firetv, but ddr3 vs lpddr2, plus sata and gigabit ethernet)
of course, you are then DIY on the software front.. shouldn't be much of a problem if you just wanted xbmc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Snapdragon 600, same chip as the one in Galaxy S4, that is powerful. Unfortunately anything that as to do with coding and electronics is above my scope of knowledge , it does look quite good this one. Above that, i dont use XBMC tbh and i use it as a Desktop Replacement Tool in combination with a LED TV and a Logitech k400 keyboard. Of course i dont do desktop-class processing, but it is enough for my needs to explore the internet, basically a basic computer .
ps, Fire TV has LPDDR2?
PlutoDelic said:
Snapdragon 600, same chip as the one in Galaxy S4, that is powerful. Unfortunately anything that as to do with coding and electronics is above my scope of knowledge , it does look quite good this one. Above that, i dont use XBMC tbh and i use it as a Desktop Replacement Tool in combination with a LED TV and a Logitech k400 keyboard. Of course i dont do desktop-class processing, but it is enough for my needs to explore the internet, basically a basic computer .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, fedora runs quite nicely on it: https://github.com/freedreno/freedreno/wiki/Fedora
(as would, I imagine, ubuntu/debian/gentoo/etc..)
PlutoDelic said:
ps, Fire TV has LPDDR2?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah, it has cell phone type low-power ddr stacked on top of the snapdragon 600, vs external DDR3 chips (which I assumed would be cheaper and sufficient since there isn't really a constraint on pcb size..)
but in the end, I guess the different memory won't make so much difference. The firetv does have larger emmc (iirc, ifc6410 was only 4G or 2G?), but that never bothered me as I just use a ssd harddrive anyways.
Why FTV and Not a 802 device
I been using different boxes like the Matricon and RK3188 based ones. Rockchip suck at video but Amlogic excel at video playback. The problem is buggy firmware and that my friends is what makes or breaks a device. I was looking into an S802 but the only worthy one seems to be the upcoming Minix 8 with S802-H. One thing I like about the Roku and FTV is how well they behave and I don't miss the buggy Chinese devices' firmware.
I own a FTV (living room), a Roku and a Chromecast (bedroom, Roku for almost everything and the Chromecast to stream XBMC from android using Moliplayer and Y2Cast free app). Even though Roku have a dual core, it kicks any other box including the FTV at handling video and working with Plex. If there was XBMC for Roku I would considered it the perfect box.
The FTV handles video very well but the user interface is not as smooth as the Roku. Plex sucks on the FTV but XBMC works great (I'm on 13.1 RC-1). Instead of using Plex on FTV I now access my WD My Cloud storage using XBMC via SMB and it works like a charm.
So in short, I will keep my FTV as I'm very pleased with it specially because of XBMC, except if in the future there is an XBMC channel for Roku (doubt it) then I will trade my FTV for another Roku.
Hi,
have the minix but not happy because some bugs, remote and the interface.
My main use is xbmc, will fire tv be as good or better ???
007xico said:
Hi,
have the minix but not happy because some bugs, remote and the interface.
My main use is xbmc, will fire tv be as good or better ???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They're VERY similar. Fire TV has some bugs, some quirks, and a pretty ineffective remote. The best XBMC is probably like a ECS LIVA mini-PC or a bay trail tablet (Dell venue 8 pro) which run full Linux or Windows with much greater speed and stability. An Intel X86 build is probably going to smoke any ARM+Android implementation.
That said, the Neo X8h and FireTV are probably about even for being the best XBMC ARM devices, in my opinion.
cmdrfrog said:
They're VERY similar. Fire TV has some bugs, some quirks, and a pretty ineffective remote. The best XBMC is probably like a ECS LIVA mini-PC or a bay trail tablet (Dell venue 8 pro) which run full Linux or Windows with much greater speed and stability. An Intel X86 build is probably going to smoke any ARM+Android implementation.
That said, the Neo X8h and FireTV are probably about even for being the best XBMC ARM devices, in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for replying.
A quick question, do i need to be rooted to have xbmc?
007xico said:
Thanks for replying.
A quick question, do i need to be rooted to have xbmc?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nope. just need to sideload via ADB.
Root is only needed to make XBMC your default launcher at startup.
The mini x8h apparently has Mali,which is less bad than Fire TV's Qualcomm Adreno.
It also has higher standards for resolution than Fire TV. (I wish I had a mini x8h!)
Can mini x8h run Reicast without causing it to reboot?
Can it run any version of Dolphin Emulator? (It has KitKat 4.4,which means OpenGL ES 3.0 support)
retroben said:
Root is only needed to make XBMC your default launcher at startup.
The mini x8h apparently has Mali,which is less bad than Fire TV's Qualcomm Adreno.
It also has higher standards for resolution than Fire TV. (I wish I had a mini x8h!)
Can mini x8h run Reicast without causing it to reboot?
Can it run any version of Dolphin Emulator? (It has KitKat 4.4,which means OpenGL ES 3.0 support)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually the adreno 320 is better than the mali 450 in all tests
http://www.antutu.com/view.shtml?id=7356#2
http://kyokojap.myweb.hinet.net/gpu_gflops/
adreno 320 APQ8064T 400 MHz 86 gflops
vs
Mali-450 MP8 --- 600 MHz 71 gflops (thats if its using the best mali 450 processor)
You forget the main point.
Stability and compatibility is much better with Mali according to a Dolphin Emulator blog post.
https://dolphin-emu.org/blog/2013/09/26/dolphin-emulator-and-opengl-drivers-hall-fameshame/
Qualcomm is deemed horrible while Mali is called bad,but can now actually run Dolphin Emulator because of driver workarounds.
I bought a Minix 8H and returned it 10 days later. The air mouse is a piece of junk which is what really attracted me to the unit to begin with. Their launcher is clunky and yes, you can go back to the default Android launcher, which I did. It just feels unfinished and unpolished. I know I could have customized it but I didnt pay that much for a box to re-invent the wheel.
MadFlava said:
I bought a Minix 8H and returned it 10 days later. The air mouse is a piece of junk which is what really attracted me to the unit to begin with. Their launcher is clunky and yes, you can go back to the default Android launcher, which I did. It just feels unfinished and unpolished. I know I could have customized it but I didnt pay that much for a box to re-invent the wheel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this^^^. plus you can snag an FireTV for $85 or less while the Minix 8 is like around $120ish I believe.
Well, im right now waiting for my minix8 to be delivered, which i ordered just two days before preorder launch of the atv here in germany.
I did some research beforehand and for my main use xbmc the minix seems to be best, as they are supplied with special minix versions of xmbc featuring a better mali hardware support.
But for a dicouted prime price of just €50 i ordered an atv as well
I only wonder if i should cancel the minix order and wait a month or two for my atv batch to arrive or go with both units and sell one later.
retroben said:
You forget the main point.
Stability and compatibility is much better with Mali according to a Dolphin Emulator blog post.
https://dolphin-emu.org/blog/2013/09/26/dolphin-emulator-and-opengl-drivers-hall-fameshame/
Qualcomm is deemed horrible while Mali is called bad,but can now actually run Dolphin Emulator because of driver workarounds.
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well i had a rk3188, works ok but it always feels heavy and slow compared to my galaxy s2, galaxy s3 and firetv.
but i guess compatibility will be higher since mali is very widespread although i have yet to run something not compatible..
Anyone with a mini x8h please try out Dolphin and Reicast with any game like Luigi's Mansion on Dolphin,but specifically Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 on Reicast since they gave me the most trouble with reboots on my Fire TV.
I am curious if it does not reboot at all with Reicast and if Dolphin actually works since there is KitKat and OpenGL ES 3.0 support on mini x8h.
retroben said:
Anyone with a mini x8h please try out Dolphin and Reicast with any game like Luigi's Mansion on Dolphin,but specifically Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 on Reicast since they gave me the most trouble with reboots on my Fire TV.
I am curious if it does not reboot at all with Reicast and if Dolphin actually works since there is KitKat and OpenGL ES 3.0 support on mini x8h.
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hi retroben i bought a x8-h just for reicast and sa1 and sa2 run really good, no reboots only after applying beta 8 firmware and hardware guru's firmware patch. :good:
Did it have issues before patching?
Are you going to try Dolphin emulator to see if it even runs?
My Fire TV has started running at superb speed since I applied a certain UI tweak.
If you are reading this rbox,I can confirm that nothing bad has happenned since that forced GPU tweak,and I am hoping that you will tell others how to apply said tweak.
retroben said:
My Fire TV has started running at superb speed since I applied a certain UI tweak.
If you are reading this rbox,I can confirm that nothing bad has happenned since that forced GPU tweak,and I am hoping that you will tell others how to apply said tweak.
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Can you elaborate on what the UI tweak is and does? I'm always looking for ways to improve the Fire TV experience.
Lol Rbox holding out on us
I have a MINIX X8-H, Minix Neo Z64 and the Fire TV. I have to say out of the three the Z64 is my favourite. It fixed some of the quarks that the X8-H had and is a lot more customizable than the Fire TV. I actually only use the Fire TV for games now. I just got tired of going to the systems pane to access my apps. In this regard both the Z64 and X8-H are much better. I also absolutely love the air mouse and keyboard remote, light years ahead of the Fire TV's remote. Anyway, grab the Z64, its defiantly the winner, you can also install Windows 8 or Linux, which the Fire TV can't do.
calden74 said:
I have a MINIX X8-H, Minix Neo Z64 and the Fire TV. I have to say out of the three the Z64 is my favourite. It fixed some of the quarks that the X8-H had and is a lot more customizable than the Fire TV. I actually only use the Fire TV for games now. I just got tired of going to the systems pane to access my apps. In this regard both the Z64 and X8-H are much better. I also absolutely love the air mouse and keyboard remote, light years ahead of the Fire TV's remote. Anyway, grab the Z64, its defiantly the winner, you can also install Windows 8 or Linux, which the Fire TV can't do.
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Wow, it fixed some quarks? Far enough, I'm in!
Seriously though, the Chinese boxes look tempting but their support is somewhat lacking. They move to a new model and abandon the last, bugs and all are left unfixed and you are relying on enthusiasts to make them usable. Also, look at the price difference, in Europe the Z64 is 50% more expensive than an AFTV.
the_chinaman said:
Wow, it fixed some quarks? Far enough, I'm in!
Seriously though, the Chinese boxes look tempting but their support is somewhat lacking. They move to a new model and abandon the last, bugs and all are left unfixed and you are relying on enthusiasts to make them usable. Also, look at the price difference, in Europe the Z64 is 50% more expensive than an AFTV.
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Yes but your also getting a lot more, specifically, a customizable UI, which is, to me anyway, worth every penny. I got absolutely sick of having to go to the System menu to access my side loaded apps. There is also a plethora of ports, another area in which the Fire TV falls extremely short. Each to his own tbough but I guarantee that you'll be a lot more happier with the MINIX than the Fire TV. The Fire TV is still better than the Apple TV though, I'm actually dumbfounded as to why people by that thing, just a horribly inadequate TV set box. Oooohhh we now have HBO, says the bloggers on Apple extremist sites, yeah, well I've had it since its incarnation with my MINIX and Fire TV.
I want another player - for Kodi and occasional simple games.
I have the FTV and although I'm happy with the performance, I don't like the inability to root (inc. custom recovery etc) and to use external storage.
Any alternative suggestion at a nearby price? Or is FTV the only way to go at that price mark?
Id wait now, unless you're desperate.
There may be some android tv boxes coming out soon which may be better than the fire tv or amazon might have a sale.
Amazon might cut a tenner out of the price of FTV, but I really want to have the ability to root and not to be afraid that my box will one day be locked forever.
The minix X8 looks tempting
papars said:
Amazon might cut a tenner out of the price of FTV, but I really want to have the ability to root and not to be afraid that my box will one day be locked forever.
The minix X8 looks tempting
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do this. search on ebay for new sealed firetv's. ask the sellers to send you the serial number. Pick up a rooted one. Once rooted you are golden. I essentially got an extra rooted new one in my bunker for future use or I may hook it up in the bedroom in future. I'm glad I picked up an extra rooted one when I could.
The biggest thing you will loose when getting out of an architecture from amazon is the native apps like Netflix, bbc etc. I would stick with amazon ftv and find a rooted one. I'm sure if you look hard you will find yourself a rooted one If you disable the updates you should be fine.
Your suggestion is valid but I'm in europe and not really in need for netflix.
The price for sealed older FTVs seems somewhat high and by reading articles I see that even the SN wont warranty a rootable box.
In the meantime I will try to h/w root my box and see what comes out of this.
I recently shelfed my Fire Tv for the same reason. I have to many streaming boxes kind of a habit of mine (Fire Tv, Google Adt1, Ouya, Madcatz Mojo, Tronsmart Draco). Fire Tv still has the best commercial content but the hardware is getting outdated for games and the OS is way to restrictive. AndroidTV devices are still open to root and side loading but the commercial content is lacking has a great interface. On the opposite end is the Mojo and Draco with raw Android out of the box. They allow root without risk to warranty. I have gone with the Draco for now as it is very fast, Antutu test out at almost 60,000 with Power VR graphics. Madcatz has great quality and controller.
There are allot of consoles coming in the next few months, Razer Forge, Snail Games Obox, Nvidia Shied, Roku 4, Apple TV, others. You will be able to take your pick. My opinion for what its worth
Pure xbmc, get a rasp pi 2. Fast, cheap and simple with openelec And no amazon os to deal with. My living room fire tv has been relegated to the drawer since getting one.
I have raspberry pi first gen. It works ok and decoding is great but is sloooooow as death.
I've replaced it with AFT and I don't want to go back.
pi 2 could be faster but the cost of getting it operational (case, psu, remote etc) is near the cost of a commercial box. I will check out the options listed in above posts.
papars said:
I have raspberry pi first gen. It works ok and decoding is great but is sloooooow as death.
I've replaced it with AFT and I don't want to go back.
pi 2 could be faster but the cost of getting it operational (case, psu, remote etc) is near the cost of a commercial box. I will check out the options listed in above posts.
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i've moved my fire TV to a bedroom and have been running 2 s802 m8n china boxes and if you dont care about android and games.. openelec is flawless on it for me, full CEC control, refresh rate changing, etc etc.. best 75$ i've spent so far.. after using these for a while you really notice how much better openelec runs than kodi on android.
nhumber said:
i've moved my fire TV to a bedroom and have been running 2 s802 m8n china boxes and if you dont care about android and games.. openelec is flawless on it for me, full CEC control, refresh rate changing, etc etc.. best 75$ i've spent so far.. after using these for a while you really notice how much better openelec runs than kodi on android.
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Openelec is an operating system which runs the XBMC/Kodi program the same way that Android is an operating system that runs XBMC/Kodi. The only difference is that Openelec is a minimal operating system that uses just enough to run XBMC/Kodi, while Android is a full operating system able to run several programs. A couple years ago when XBMC came to Android it sucked and I quit using it after about a week, but it has came along way since and my Openelec system running Kodi cannot compare to my Fire TV running Kodi.
papars said:
I have raspberry pi first gen. It works ok and decoding is great but is sloooooow as death.
I've replaced it with AFT and I don't want to go back.
pi 2 could be faster but the cost of getting it operational (case, psu, remote etc) is near the cost of a commercial box. I will check out the options listed in above posts.
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I have to chime in here. With some smart shopping ill bet you could get all you need for 60 or less. My rpi is still the most consistent , reliable kodi device but like you, i thought it was too slow (even running off usb 3.0)
But ive heard good things about rpi 2 just running it on a class 4 sd card. My advice--dont use a case, its not needed unless theres reason to think itll get damaged. My tv remote works fine with it and this might not matter cuz if you have b+ you should have a lot of the stuff u want or need. I heard you might want to upgrade the power supply. I bought one for the b+ that worked great for 8 bucks on ebay. If i didnt care about netflix thatd be the way imight go. Of course that could change in the upcoming months.
porkenhimer said:
Openelec is an operating system which runs the XBMC/Kodi program the same way that Android is an operating system that runs XBMC/Kodi. The only difference is that Openelec is a minimal operating system that uses just enough to run XBMC/Kodi, while Android is a full operating system able to run several programs. A couple years ago when XBMC came to Android it sucked and I quit using it after about a week, but it has came along way since and my Openelec system running Kodi cannot compare to my Fire TV running Kodi.
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thanks, im aware of the setups, had a firetv since day one.. had fedora installed on it at one point even, what im saying is that Kodi for linux (openelec in my case) is much more stable than kodi for android or maybe its just linux stability vs android stability.. i dunno. but you dont get hangs or freezes like you can sometimes get with the android boxes, i also said the main things that are better with openelec than with kodi on the fireTV are fulling working CEC control, refresh rate changing since im kind of an videophile and watching any movie on the fireTV results in less than perfect playback, and HD audio support is also another nice feature you cant get on a fireTV.
porkenhimer said:
Openelec is an operating system which runs the XBMC/Kodi program the same way that Android is an operating system that runs XBMC/Kodi. The only difference is that Openelec is a minimal operating system that uses just enough to run XBMC/Kodi, while Android is a full operating system able to run several programs. A couple years ago when XBMC came to Android it sucked and I quit using it after about a week, but it has came along way since and my Openelec system running Kodi cannot compare to my Fire TV running Kodi.
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Depend on the hw that your OE is running on, got myself an Asus Chromebox that costs slightly more than the Fire TV when it was on sale last Black Friday, it runs like a dream.
As for running Kodi/XBMC on FireTV vs generic Android box vs OpenElec/Xbmcbuntu/Linux + XBMC I'd say it doesn't matter any longer. I've run all 3 ways, and it used to make a difference. A cheap booksize miniPC running OpenElec or Xbmcbuntu was much better than any Android based solution for a variety of reasons. That just isn't the case any longer. Of course if you have better hardware things like menus or the time it takes to start streaming a show will be a bit quicker, but otherwise you can get a solid stable Kodi/XBMC environment on any of these.
Back to the original question, personally I'd hold out until some of the Google Android TV boxes (not generic Android boxes) start shipping. Not because I think they will be better than GATV boxes, but because there should be a better selection of options and one might be a better fit than your two AFTV choices. Either way, it's hard to beat AFTV and I expect similar results from GATV boxes. Side-loading isn't as easy as just installing from the app store, but there are options that have all the plug-ins ready to go. Unlike other setups, you don't have to figure out which remote to use or how to get it configured (yes, I know some generic Android boxes come setup for XBMC and even have their own customized XBMC, I have one).
In short, I used to have a mix of generic Android boxes and mini HTPCs running OpenElec/XBMCbuntu. Now I have AFTV boxes in daily use and two Rokus that are almost never used. For the price point, ease of use, stability and extra functionality above and beyond Kodi the AFTV and presumably GATV boxes just make more sense.
One last thing I almost forgot - the space limitation on the AFTV is a huge drawback. Until (unless) Amazon releases an update to let us use USB drives for apps and data this could be a big issue. If for some reason you absolutely require plenty of disk space, perhaps you don't have network storage and need all your media on the device itself, then AFTV may not be an option.
GATV might have the same lock as amazon regarding custom updates / root.
I would like to escape the proprietary ecosystem opposed by amazon and google if possible to avoid possible lockouts in the near future.
I like the amazon box, is fast and easy to use with its remote. I use a NAS for my media but I would like to have root and extra storage option on it.
The mojo looks like a good option, I might go for this.
I've been using a Fire TV Stick for about a week now, after you sideload Kodi (and then use your Amazon account to install Kodi on another device, so you trick the FireTV into showing Kodi in your Recent apps on the home screen) I don't think you can beat the bang for the buck.
I'm about to order the Minix X8-H Plus. This thing seems a lot better than the AFTV! I have a 256gb SD card lying around, so I can't wait to throw it in this thing. It has 2gb RAM, 2.0ghz Quad-Core Processor, SD slot, three USB 2.0 ports, gigabit ethernet, 16gb eMMC, 4K2K UHD video playback, Octo-Core Mali-450 GPU, Dual-Band Wi-Fi 802.11ac and 4K H.265 / HEVC Hardware Decoding Support.
It looks like they're going for around $150-$160. Check it out:
http://www.minix.com.hk/Products/NEO-X8-H-Plus-Android-TV.html
papars said:
Your suggestion is valid but I'm in europe and not really in need for netflix.
The price for sealed older FTVs seems somewhat high and by reading articles I see that even the SN wont warranty a rootable box.
In the meantime I will try to h/w root my box and see what comes out of this.
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I just got a firetv from ebay and its rootable. I've done about 28 mods and haven't seen one with series 305 which are the incorrect ones.
shutterslaps said:
I'm about to order the Minix X8-H Plus. This thing seems a lot better than the AFTV! I have a 256gb SD card lying around, so I can't wait to throw it in this thing. It has 2gb RAM, 2.0ghz Quad-Core Processor, SD slot, three USB 2.0 ports, gigabit ethernet, 16gb eMMC, 4K2K UHD video playback, Octo-Core Mali-450 GPU, Dual-Band Wi-Fi 802.11ac and 4K H.265 / HEVC Hardware Decoding Support.
It looks like they're going for around $150-$160. Check it out:
http://www.minix.com.hk/Products/NEO-X8-H-Plus-Android-TV.html
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Thats a sweet box for sure.. I am not too sure its a fair comparison though.. My AFTV cost me $80 and came with a remote. The $145 standalone box is more than twice as much if you get a controller. My Android MiniPC's (older) have been disappointing when trying to run Kodi etc.. which led me to the snappy performance of AFTV.. This box looks to have all the power you could need. Should be fun to have
This note on the webpage should be noted as well - The NEO X8-H Plus only supports standard definition Netflix. Netflix 1080p HD and 4K UHD resolution are not available on any MINIX NEO Series devices
I have been watching the Razer Forge TV box as well it looks to be a beast for $99
So i had this idea right, im sitting here in my apartment playing the shield, eating a burrito and then it hits me, with the release of google stadia coming quickly, a new shield with new hardware, and looking more and more likely that the shield might just go into abandonment, and i mean why not just do what all us tech guys do; take something slow/broken/outdated and make it fast/smooth/new, SOOOOOOO i need some thought and opinions on how i should go about this, the idea is too crack open and do a careful teardown of the hadware and case that currently makes up the latetest shield gaming edition, set it aside and fine a small case like a mini ITX, although im thinking i might go a lil smaller, wire the whole deal up using and I/O that comes already on the face of the case, 2+ TB hard disk, (External gpu??) then possibly configuring some kind of water cooling as i FULLY intend too then root the device and use SUperuser too overclock the cpu, and then I KNOWW this is a strech but i was looking into actually running a different OS on the sheild possibly?? WoA (windows on ARM) IS POSSIBLE and fully avalible too developers although the only issue being absolutely no driver support but any NATIVE x86 programs WILL RUN FINE, or possibly running steamOS and making her a steam machine but as newer distrobutions of linux looking like a pretty viable option for gaming nowadays.
aaaaaanyways lemme know what yall think and throw me some of your thoughts my way as any feedback is good feedback
A different Case might be nice, but I don't get the point of running a different OS on it. There are better (and cheaper) Options hardwarewise for other OSes.
jetson board cheaper
At the moment I also use Nvidia Shield. I am planning to add a hard drive to this build to keep my favorite movies in 4k. My library will expand in the future.
Why not get a Network Attached Storage and be able to access it from all the devices in your home?
Fill it with movies from your computer and watch them on your Shield TV (or any other device with a screen for that matter) .
Need help with my LGE LGLS990 "ALT Switch" Gaming console Project (G3 Boost Mobile)
Wasn't sure which G3 forum to put this in due to none being devoted to this specific one so please forgive me if this isn't the right place. Recently I was looking at the Nintendo Switch for some on the go gaming and noticed how difficult it was to find one in stock at any local retailers. Well after getting online and only finding overpriced, Switch Lites going for regular Switch MSRP and standard Switch prices running in the $500 range I decided maybe it would be possible to come up with a "ALT Switch". My requirements seem to be met by the G3, decent SOC, 32gb onboard storage, 3gb ram and a sub $30 dollar price. I plan on pairing this with a bluetooth controller, 64gb sd card and a OTG hub with hdmi and charging. So with the hardware sorted out I started testing various games out and almost everything works pretty well. My problem comes when I play Call of Duty Mobile. It of course runs in low graphics mode but that isn't too bad, the problem comes when it randomly crashes out of the game or lags real bad. I have a LG Rebel 4 with a Snapdragon 425 and 2gb of ram that handles the game on about the same level and is more stable. So I've narrowed down the problem to the outdated OS and trying to run the games in 2560x1440. I would like to drop the resolution down to 1080 but there's no option for that so I started looking for ways to do it. Seems it's possible with a couple programs but those all need ROOT access. So between that and the benefits of a newer version of android I decided to look into rooting and installing a custom rom. Long story short, I've had no luck. If anyone knows of a easy to follow guide to root, unlock the bootloader and install a newer version of android on this hardware I'd love to hear about it. I'll be doing a article and possibly a video on this project depending on how far I can get.
Hmmmmmm......
Okay... Since no one has any ideas does anyone know anybody on the forum who knows their stuff and would be trustworthy enough for me to send my G3 to and have it rooted at the very least? I really think the hardware on the G3 is plenty powerful enough to play anything out there at a good level of detail and good frame rates. I think lowering the screen resolution dropped to 720p or 1080 and change of the performance governor to non interactive mode would give close to top tier chipset performance without the price penalty.
bigwootoo said:
Wasn't sure which G3 forum to put this in due to none being devoted to this specific one so please forgive me if this isn't the right place. Recently I was looking at the Nintendo Switch for some on the go gaming and noticed how difficult it was to find one in stock at any local retailers. Well after getting online and only finding overpriced, Switch Lites going for regular Switch MSRP and standard Switch prices running in the $500 range I decided maybe it would be possible to come up with a "ALT Switch". My requirements seem to be met by the G3, decent SOC, 32gb onboard storage, 3gb ram and a sub $30 dollar price. I plan on pairing this with a bluetooth controller, 64gb sd card and a OTG hub with hdmi and charging. So with the hardware sorted out I started testing various games out and almost everything works pretty well. My problem comes when I play Call of Duty Mobile. It of course runs in low graphics mode but that isn't too bad, the problem comes when it randomly crashes out of the game or lags real bad. I have a LG Rebel 4 with a Snapdragon 425 and 2gb of ram that handles the game on about the same level and is more stable. So I've narrowed down the problem to the outdated OS and trying to run the games in 2560x1440. I would like to drop the resolution down to 1080 but there's no option for that so I started looking for ways to do it. Seems it's possible with a couple programs but those all need ROOT access. So between that and the benefits of a newer version of android I decided to look into rooting and installing a custom rom. Long story short, I've had no luck. If anyone knows of a easy to follow guide to root, unlock the bootloader and install a newer version of android on this hardware I'd love to hear about it. I'll be doing a article and possibly a video on this project depending on how far I can get.
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