This could benefit many who buy a new fireTV/stick and want to root it. It's a bit long but read on---
First, a little background; I bought my first fireTVstick a few months ago - 5.2.1.1 was on it before I even saw the home screen. I looked into rooting, but found that the hardware soldering method was the only way.
As you know, the fireTV asks for wifi password prior to initial setup & updates itself before you can intervene. But after initial setup, Amazon home can launch without a wifi connection..like on someone else's network..
A friend gave me a stick that hadn't been used since mid2016.. I plugged it in at my house, and before connecting to my network, discovered it was running 5.1.5.0 - so immediately i hid updates and then tried to root with kingo, unsuccessfully. I tried and tried to think of a way to go up one version, to 5.2.1.0, without going all the way to 5.2.1.1--nothing..
Until I stumbled onto a post by sconnyuk about his discovery: by plugging into a laptop USB port for power and performing a factory reset.. the device reboots with low power "complaints" and allows you in without updating - Then, when you go to manually update - POOF: 5.2.1.0 is what you get, and you can root and downgrade etc. Brilliant.
From then until a week and a half ago, I assumed a device with old software was very hard to come by. The only way you would have a chance to root is IF a stick was purchased pre 5.2.1.1, IF it was then setup pre-5.2.1.1, and IF it had not been connected since 5.2.1.1 was pushed out to devices. That's a lot of IF's.
And naturally you would assume that new device = new software....If 5.2.1.1 has been out for months, all new devices should ship with that version by now...right?
But the devices all auto-update prior to initial setup, as soon as they are connected....so who knows what version was there, on the device, in the box, sitting on the store shelf?
The day the voice remote fire TV stick 2 shipped in the US (oct 21) I purchased a standard fire tv stick from a major US electronics store.
Out of pure curiosity, I plugged it into my laptop's USB port, just to see what would be there if the stick was unable to update.
5.0.5.1....from a firetvstick1 purchased NEW at the END of OCTOBER 2016.
I figured it was a fluke- checked someone else's, purchased in a different city, days later.
Also 5.0.5.1.
So I updated to 5.2.1.0, rooted, blocked updates, downgraded etc and have two brand new sticks running 5.0.5 with FireStarter instead of Amazon home.
My question is, has anybody else looked into this?
Is this a coincidence..is it something localized to my area? or is Amazon relying solely on auto updates and leaving old software on ALL fireTVsticks?
One step further -
- Can this same process be done on the fireTV?
-- If so, what version comes loaded on new fireTVs at this point in time?
---Can new ones potentially be rooted/downgraded as was done with these sticks?
And for that matter..
-What about the fireTVstick 2?
--New updates were pushed the day of release...but what version is on the device when it comes out of the box?
To anybody who buys a new stick/tv/stick2:
plug it in to laptop power and go check the version, pre-update. Then post your findings.
I am very curious how common/widespread of an occurrence this is, what versions are being found and when/where, and whether it also includes other fireTV models.
Stick 1/2
Got a stick 2 on Saturday, purely out of curiosity..5.2.2.0, and it updated itself to a newer 5.2.2.0
Also grabbed a new stick 1, like the ones I stumbled onto a couple of weeks ago, it also had 5.1.5.0 - sweet!
But how long will they continue to ship in a possibly-software-rootable-condition?
Anybody have info on what software version the gaming edition, firetv1 or firetv2 ships with?
I'd like to pick one up for myself IF it is rootable; however I don't particularly want to spend 3-4x the cost of the stick for a box that ultimately has less functionality..
Anybody? What version does the FireTV 2 ship with? Gaming edition?
Firetv2
5.2.1.1 straight out of the box..not sure if this is everywhere or just the one I got...device says it was last updated in August 2016...even though I just got it today
This leaves the FireTV 1 --- I'm going to assume that "refurbished" devices from Amazon will already have been updated - but what are the chances of finding a new in box 2014 model ftv with 5.1.5.0 or older?
Somebody?? Anybody??!
Millenials Guide to Tech, Firmware edition.
1. WOW! Found out something crazy, you all should learn about!
2. So I bought this on saturday, and I thought, and then I went there,,,
3. And then a buddy told me...
5. But then I read on the internet...
6. So I'm wondering...
7. What do you guys think?
8. HELP ME!!1!!
Ok - how about we do this for real?
1. Fire TV (/Stick) has to be online to first register it (set it up with a username/pwd), or you would not have access to the main interface, which basically is something you cant work without.
2. Best way to do this is to be fast, and unplug your wireless router, as soon as the login goes through and you see the main home page.
3. Using an underpowered usb connection can delay it, but it wont delay downloading the next new firmware. I guess if you really knew what you were doing, and could root the Stick (because this is not, or less applicable to Fire TV boxes?) always staying on underpowered usb (edit: Or can you? Because su has to be written to the system partition, and actually I don't know how the "do not update check" works (does it prevent stuff like dalvik cache being reinitialized...) - but for now I am guessing, that staying on underpowered USB might be a valid solution...), you could then delete the already downloaded firmware, effectively withou ever updating the firmware once. (Having stayed online long enough for the next firmware to be downloaded... - throttling your routers DL speed is a real solution independent of all this, If you know how to do that.)
4. Fire TV (/Stick) updates are incremental. This information already is in the adventure report in the OP, but to summarize, what that means is, that the devices (as of now) will update to the next firmware update in row, and only then to the next one (downloads the next update, installs it on reboot or promt, ...), and so on and so forth...
5. Fire TV (/Sticks) that come directly from Amazon have a higher chance to be on a newer firmware, because Amazon has a process to preload your account information on there, if you don't buy the device as a gift. So they already power up the device, before shipping it out to you. Which means, that they also can lift it to a more recent firmware without much hazzle. We can't look into this process - or when it changes and how (which means, that at least I don't know if you have a better chance of receiving an older firmware version one, if you order it as a gift for example (username doesnt get set up by Amazon) - but I actually doubt it...).
6. Which means, that your best bet to get a device that actually can be rooted, is actually to go into a box store that doesn't sell through those devices quickly and grab a boxed unit that has been sitting on shelves for months.
7- Which of course means that you have to forego, those GREAT DEALS (wow, so GOODZ) on Amazons refurb path or discount windows.
Now you could crowdsource this out to get more information, if you actually had a community of buyers that was interested in this, and at least somewhat tech savvy, but as with any Fire device, you don't have that. (Generally speaking).
Also - as for the incremental updates - it isn't set in stone, that it will always be this way. Amazon could flip a switch and change that serverside. Its not especially likely that they do (because it requires having someone in charge of the firmware team, that actually knows what they are doing), but it is something that could change eventually, even over night.
Wow
There's no need to be condescending because you don't like my wording.
I'm well aware of incremental updates and the low likelihood of purchasing a NiB device from a major retailer with potentially rootable firmware on it.
The fact that Amazon cranks out "factory refurbished" devices at a lower rate would be a red flag in and of itself; even without considering the fact that the device would have already been updated if it had been used enough (once) to create the need to "refurbish".
I stumbled onto something which one would think would be a highly unlikely find - multiple times - from a MASSIVE electronics retailer with hundreds of locations across the USA.
I wasn't talking about finding a device that fell behind a shelf 6 months ago; this was from 4 different locations of a store which can't keep Amazon devices in stock no matter how many or how frequently they order..
My posts after the OP were primarily just to bump the thread in search of a response (which, what do you know? It worked) - not begging for somebody to help me figure out why I can't root the refurbished fire stick I got from Amazon for half price.
I guarantee I'm not the only person who would be excited to discover that a new device had rootable firmware on it -
A fire tv 2 with 5.2.1.1 pre-loaded is what you would expect to find; having bought it from the same place I found 5.0.5.1-loaded sticks +/-6 months after the version began getting phased out, I thought maybe it could also be the case with the box.
The purpose of my original post was to ascertain whether or not this is a common or localized find..to "crowdsource" .in the one place one would EXPECT to find FireTV enthusiasts..
Pardon my enthusiasm.
Have a stab at it. Crowdsource away.
You are only up against a userbase that doesnt know the least bit about the device, buys their Fire TVs in high percentages from resellers on Amazon, ebay and the local used good portal, because they saw a "free HBO" and SPORTZ label on it, that got told for the better part of two years that root is not necessary - by a freaking product blogger who maybe single handedly killed this scene - syphoning out all information from this community to sell it against ads on his portal (but he contributed pictures)...
And even now most people cant decide if they'd rather have "eazy Amazon Alexa fullservice", or be able to own their devices - but "has hacker found a way so I can use Alexa in *insert country here*".
People don't know how to interface with the device, or even how to copy files, people are told, that they don't need to know anything other than how to sideload using ES File Explorer. And as long as most people have their piracy options - they don't care about the rest.
Thats the deal. When Amazon started to force people that wanted to use alternative launchers away from their upgrade path - product bloggers celebrated it, because it would make stuff, so much more eazy.
Good luck getting the numbers. I have yet to get the impression that anyone (but me and a few others, but I can only buy so many Fire TV 2s in my lifetime...) actually care.
The broader lesson here is - that no one who cares about root rights, buys FIre TVs anymore. And rightfully so. There was so much wrong information circulating, structurally - because some people cared more about establishing their own dependencies, being on the hunt for "great dealz" and buying their way around having to learn basics - that there simply never was a culture of ownership (caring about root rights) around this product.
People updated root away, because product blogger told them, new firmware had great new feature.
Also - Amazon in the backend - now is set up very well to make the windows where devices are rootable very, very short. They don't even provide you with a prompt anymore - they just update away. They update before shipping, they force you having to be online to activate the device...
Those are structural issues. If you don't see them, having worked in the industy for several years, look again.
Back of the shelf boxed units still would be the best bet for people willing to take a chance - and word of mouth that "one guy got an older firmware on a refurbished stick, sold by Amazon" is just that. Word of mouth.
In the meantime you can wait for a new rooting method, and don't care, that amazon restricted apps from reading logs via adb and put in all kinds of non standard android features like "great blacklist, so eazy", and there is still no full conversion rom for this thing, because navigating via a remote is only slowly becoming part of android as an OS.
Its a pitty that it turned out this way - because for a short window - both the Fire TV Stick and the Fire TV2 where the best value for money in this sector you could buy (raspberry pie still has less "power" than a AFTV2) - but you had too many interests only "faking" that they would act in favor of a homebrew community - too many users that only cared about solving problems that came up as a result of them not understanding what they bought on shady channels - looking for service, to many people too willing to excuse Amazon of wrongdoing, before even all the facts came out...
The truth is, that this is a dead category.
Give the raspberry pie two more years, and understand that if you care about openness and doing stuff the manufacturer hasnt set up for you - open hardware will be more and more your only opportunity.
Not so much because devices become harder and harder to hack open (which is also an increasing issue) - but because you cant set up a community thats set on "demanding enduser service", paying resellers to cut corners as far as them learning to set up stuff, and listening to product bloggers that provide them with tutorials stolen from here ("But they have added pictures!!"), as long as it is convenient for them, but then help mask the fact, when and how amazon splits this community or moves against our interests, because they benefit more - when they can make their readers entirely dependent on Amazon - and look, its so easy....
Try to get your numbers in this environment. I watch.
harlekinwashere said:
Have a stab at it. Crowdsource away.
You are only up against a userbase that doesnt know the least bit about the device, buys their Fire TVs in high percentages from resellers on Amazon, ebay and the local used good portal, because they saw a "free HBO" and SPORTZ label on it, that got told for the better part of two years that root is not necessary - by a freaking product blogger who maybe single handedly killed this scene - syphoning out all information from this community to sell it against ads on his portal (but he contributed pictures)...
And even now most people cant decide if they'd rather have "eazy Amazon Alexa fullservice", or be able to own their devices - but "has hacker found a way so I can use Alexa in *insert country here*".
People don't know how to interface with the device, or even how to copy files, people are told, that they don't need to know anything other than how to sideload using ES File Explorer. And as long as most people have their piracy options - they don't care about the rest.
Thats the deal. When Amazon started to force people that wanted to use alternative launchers away from their upgrade path - product bloggers celebrated it, because it would make stuff, so much more eazy.
Good luck getting the numbers. I have yet to get the impression that anyone (but me and a few others, but I can only buy so many Fire TV 2s in my lifetime...) actually care.
The broader lesson here is - that no one who cares about root rights, buys FIre TVs anymore. And rightfully so. There was so much wrong information circulating, structurally - because some people cared more about establishing their own dependencies, being on the hunt for "great dealz" and buying their way around having to learn basics - that there simply never was a culture of ownership (caring about root rights) around this product.
People updated root away, because product blogger told them, new firmware had great new feature.
Also - Amazon in the backend - now is set up very well to make the windows where devices are rootable very, very short. They don't even provide you with a prompt anymore - they just update away. They update before shipping, they force you having to be online to activate the device...
Those are structural issues. If you don't see them, having worked in the industy for several years, look again.
Back of the shelf boxed units still would be the best bet for people willing to take a chance - and word of mouth that "one guy got an older firmware on a refurbished stick, sold by Amazon" is just that. Word of mouth.
In the meantime you can wait for a new rooting method, and don't care, that amazon restricted apps from reading logs via adb and put in all kinds of non standard android features like "great blacklist, so eazy", and there is still no full conversion rom for this thing, because navigating via a remote is only slowly becoming part of android as an OS.
Its a pitty that it turned out this way - because for a short window - both the Fire TV Stick and the Fire TV2 where the best value for money in this sector you could buy (raspberry pie still has less "power" than a AFTV2) - but you had too many interests only "faking" that they would act in favor of a homebrew community - too many users that only cared about solving problems that came up as a result of them not understanding what they bought on shady channels - looking for service, to many people too willing to excuse Amazon of wrongdoing, before even all the facts came out...
The truth is, that this is a dead category.
Give the raspberry pie two more years, and understand that if you care about openness and doing stuff the manufacturer hasnt set up for you - open hardware will be more and more your only opportunity.
Not so much because devices become harder and harder to hack open (which is also an increasing issue) - but because you cant set up a community thats set on "demanding enduser service", paying resellers to cut corners as far as them learning to set up stuff, and listening to product bloggers that provide them with tutorials stolen from here ("But they have added pictures!!"), as long as it is convenient for them, but then help mask the fact, when and how amazon splits this community or moves against our interests, because they benefit more - when they can make their readers entirely dependent on Amazon - and look, its so easy....
Try to get your numbers in this environment. I watch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fair enough... I don't have the funds to test the waters on the spread of still-rootable FTVs either. Matter of fact, I returned the one I bought, the day after I posted the bit about it being unrootable.
Dead category or not, I still enjoy screwing around with them and I know others out there (in here, in this forum) do too..
The problem is, as you said, it's a device that sells out not because of the people who populate these threads, who have both (hopefully) the interest and ability to investigate, understand, and modify, the ins-and-outs of the things they buy...but because of the people who buy the devices up 10 at a time and run an automated process to sideload kodi with outdated wizards, so they can make $15 a pop..
I think the back of the shelf copy is a thing of the past, at least in my area..the number of retailers is a small one, only a few places carry them - they get a whole bunch in, then sell out in a day or two..and nobody has any for weeks..
I don't know if anybody still stocks ftv1's but I am still curious what remains floating around in circulation...
The search continues...
Related
I am looking for a replacement to the mad catz m.o.j.o console i had a refund on it but i want open android with superb graphics really,but the thing is i don't want anything too expensive or too cheap either,the problem is i don't know what models are best,or more importantly for this section of the forum what i can do in relation to getting a fire tv gaming and web browsing etc?Can i play games can more importantly can i sideload and also can i sideload downloaded stuff? Or possibly flash a rom on it?
PHYSC-1 said:
I am looking for a replacement to the mad catz m.o.j.o console i had a refund on it but i want open android with superb graphics really,but the thing is i don't want anything too expensive or too cheap either,the problem is i don't know what models are best,or more importantly for this section of the forum what i can do in relation to getting a fire tv gaming and web browsing etc?Can i play games can more importantly can i sideload and also can i sideload downloaded stuff? Or possibly flash a rom on it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dont take this the wrong way, but to get everythihg you want you will need to custom build a HTPC with a computer. These android boxes are good and most are cheap, but they do have limitations and will not meeet all your expectations.
IMO, the FTV is the best box on the market in the under $150 category. If you are willing to comprimise, it should meet most of you expectations. All you questions are answered in this forum, so read up or use search.
byrdcfmma said:
Dont take this the wrong way, but to get everythihg you want you will need to custom build a HTPC with a computer. These android boxes are good and most are cheap, but they do have limitations and will not meeet all your expectations.
IMO, the FTV is the best box on the market in the under $150 category. If you are willing to comprimise, it should meet most of you expectations. All you questions are answered in this forum, so read up or use search.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Had enough of pc's i am a computer repair technician,i want it for the lower power consumption but with nearing or par with console level graphics.Pc's are too expensive to run they are rubbish in small form factors they tend to burn out on the bridge on the board, or they come with cheap [email protected] psu's that cost a bomb for good one's in small form factor.If there's one thing i learned quickly it was never buy small form factor pc's if you want it to last or not to overheat.
But on the other hand android tv box's don't push the same high level temps because they are only passively cooled quite often as apposed to actively cooled,besides if i really want i'll cooling mod it like my k-r42 with 80mm fan and shimmed.
But basically i want an android unit that has gaming power beyond a mali400 and closing in on if not better than a snapdragon 8xx chip.I've looked at the huwaei tron but it's yet again a 4.2x android system with no guarentee my tv will be supported over hdmi properly i learned that from my mad catz m.o.j.o not outputting 1080p on my 1080p tv.So i may just hang on until k1 touches down in shops but it looks like they are not in a hurry although there is the mipad rumor,i think i'll be waiting until 2015 at this rate before a god unit comes out that has kitkat on it,i was wondering if any rockchip 8 core cpu's are out in tv box form yet,and if they have a heightened gpu to the mali 400? And was also wondering where they fit in terms of graphical power?
Firetv is anything but open. IMO android boxes are all underpowered and frustratingly issue laden. Pity as I too am wanting to buy something good... I bought a s89 tronsmart and it's not as good as I'd hoped. I was interested in the MOJO... Why did you return it, it's a lot more open than Amazon firetv surely?
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk
I've bought it as replacement for raspberry pi and was disappointed. Yes Fire TV build perfectly and has a good hardware. But software is a crap and no way for root by now, only hopes and blocking of update server. It's not clear for now what improvements OTA brings and if root will be issued. If you looking for a good device that works and not for fun reverse engineering hours. Try to find alternative.
May be once it will be a good choice but not now, unfortunately.
Sent from my LG-G2 using XDA Free mobile app
Rumored Android TV BOX... http://pulse.me/s/1jrW6M
God I hope that one IS true and GREAT!
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
I was 100% happy with my ouya, with stock OS, and then even better with CM11. performance was never a problem.
really the only reason I went for firetv was that I watch prime video A LOT. and between flash-plugin + pick-your-favorite-browser being way-EOL and a bit buggy, and the fact that it took literally 6-8 clicks/actions to go to the next episode of a show, vs 1 (or at most 2) clicks/actions on firetv (yeah first-world problems...)
ouya sales on amazon for $60 would still be worth it (esp they want like 50 bucks for just an extra controller) but at the 100 point might as well firetv or something else.
but honestly it all comes down to what do you want to do with it. oh wait I don't have to re-ramble all this...
http://www.xbmchub.com/forums/threads/21722-Fire-TV-vs-Ouya?p=185275&viewfull=1#post185275
Anyone who bought Amazon-anything devices and expect openness is definitely going the wrong path. Amazon has some great devices but it has a pretty strict walled garden environment (which, granted, is kind of pretty) where they are expected to stay. Amazon is somewhat similar if not worse than Apple in this regard.
Amazon's latest devices such as the Fire HDX and the Fire TV are amazing devices on their own right, but if you are not getting them because of what they can do out of the box but instead of what they 'should be able to do' and expect to hack/mod them, you are in for a disappointment. This is what differentiate them to Google's devices, where it can be a gamble whether a product can be 10x better or 10x worse in the few months following its release (see: Google TV vs. Chromecast).
With Amazon devices it's extremely simple. You go to the product page and look at what it's offering. If you're wowed by those, then get it, if you think that 'it has potential', then don't get it.
Newcron said:
Anyone who bought Amazon-anything devices and expect openness is definitely going the wrong path. Amazon has some great devices but it has a pretty strict walled garden environment (which, granted, is kind of pretty) where they are expected to stay. Amazon is somewhat similar if not worse than Apple in this regard.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes and no - I bought this box because I wanted one device that did both amazon video and Netflix. Met expectations there.
But I also wanted to be able to use it as a front-end for music stored on my NAS. This is why I was never interested in Roku, might've been interested in the Apple product but don't remember it having Prime support, and kept using my Western Digital Live Plus for as long as I did - the access to files inside the walls is important to me.
By day 2, I had enabled ADB and sideloaded XBMC. Yes, I don't have root, but I have Amazon, Netflix and local files all in one place, which I like a lot.
From what I've seen, on the Fire tablets amazon doesn't block sideloaded apps, or I wouldn't have bought this device. It makes a decent HTPC device for my purposes, though, and is open enough for me. Of course I'd prefer root, but in this instance, not if having root broke the Amazon Video stuff.
My biggest complaint so far is that amazon doesn't give us a preference setting for how much bandwidth the box should allocate to itself. So I needed to do that with my firewall instead.
I'll be interested to see if Amazon makes Prime available for the rumored Google TV box. My guess is they will not. But if they do, and I'm within my return window when the device is fully announced...
How often with current trends would a hardware refresh be necessary on android streaming boxes . From a developers standpoint does this cause as many issues as it would on say a xbox or ps4? I see so many people reference that Fire TV is getting long in the tooth already? It seems to me that many of the set top boxes are outdated already at release to keep the cost down? In there current state can they really compete in the gaming arena with the likes of Microsoft or Sony? I am A laymen when it comes to development but would love to learn what a dev has to do to put a game on Fire TV or Google Play?
These days, most electronic devices are obsolete after a few months, but not to me. I use my electronics til they stop working or I get something new. I still have an original Apple TV that I use all the time. Do not ever let people tell you when you need to replace your device. If it works, use it. A good example of this is the Galaxy Note 4 on AT&T, I commented the other day that I never thought it would get root, cause it was already three months old and it had not happened yet, so everyday it does not happen is another day that someone is losing interest in hacking it, and that developers are always looking for the next big thing. Just me saying that got the thread closed, but its true. If the Fire TV 2 came out next week a lot of people would say our Fire TV was garbage even though it works just fine. If my Fire TV last five years then it will get used for five years, period. Don't let anyone ever tell you when your device is outdated, make that decision for yourself. Normal people would never be ready to buy a new car or home every six months, but when it comes to electronics, a lot of people wanna throw away their device every time the new thing comes out. Those people are lame as hell, and only want new phones, tablets etc, cause society tellls them its cool to have it. I am still using the first Galaxy Note and will continue to do so till it dies. I have replaced the screen and went through two batteries exploding, and its still works, so why upgade? These devices are for casual gaming, not hardcore gaming. Android boxes were never meant to compete with or replace gaming consoles. All the people that say that the Android boxes are taking over game consoles are unintelligent. Android boxes provide a different type of gaming experience then modern gaming consoles and til google decides to make an android gaming consoles they will never be able to compete with sony or microsoft. I also doubt google would ever turn Android into a big time gaming platform, but I do think google will release a gaming console in the future to compete with sony, microsoft and nintendo, just won't be an android console.
I'm actually with porkenheimer on this. I have good equipment but I've become sort of a hoarder of electronics. Lots of stuff is older than 8 years and whether it's an external hdd or an old laptop or even an iPod, I've had amazing luck fixing things and I DO find a purpose for it. I've used laptops from a decade ago as ubuntu servers, got xbmc running on some.
I actually benefitted from people discarding what they think is broken and/or obsolete.
As for aftv, I don't think the hardware is the reason development will slow down. It's more to do with Amazon's resistance to opening it up.
In fact, I have looked around, here & abroad and I've found some good possible replacements but not in the price range of aftv. The processor will be a tad less powerful with the same amount of ram or the processor and ram will be better but the price is over bloated. But for now, I don't think you'll find a faster experience for the price. Once it gets to the $200 range I'm thinking of building an htpc or investing the money elsewhere because I'm satisfied with what's happening on my TV.
Of course I think if cyanogenmod becomes a reality on aftv, the hardware will be put to better use. Fast is great but fire os, imho, is not a worthy os.
Thank you both I appreciate your words of wisdom. I agree its so easy to pile up old hardware. I don't know why the android media streamers have become such a point of interest. I currently own Fire TV, Ouya, Madcatz Mojo, Android TV ADT1, and in the end they all basically do the same thing So, yes maybe its time for me to stand back and say to myself "What exactly am I trying to do with these devices"? I do no I have been searching for that box that has all my streaming apps and games with extra power to spare? The closest I have come so far is a modified Madcatz Mojo which has HBO Go, Showtime, Starz, Encore, Netflix, Hulu, Etc. its far from perfect! I have been eyeing (though I need to Stop) the forthcoming Razer Forge or Snail Games Obox? I dont like how amazon has locked out root, and all the proprietor y parts of the OS. Eight gig of storage is a joke for anyone who likes games?
You developers out there when you release your code on a device does it have to be custom configured for each chipset you release it on? Say you upgraded fire TV to the Qualcomm 810 would each app require modification?
I stumbled across this website with instructions for installing a custom ROM on the Fire Phone. Can anyone confirm this? I'm only know enough to follow instructions.
I'm too new to post a link. Just Google:
custom ROM fire phone
You're looking for the nsme rom-lollipop.
It may be a scam. It asks you to complete offers to download the files. But, people in the article comments say it worked.
It's just ads / survey scam behind shortened links, as you said. The people in the comment section aren't "real", also just fake accounts used to make it look more legit.
Just remember the site layout and graphics, because the people behind this have dozens of domains registered, that lead to sites that look just like the one you found.
that's too bad. i just find it hard to believe we have a root method and no custom recovery/bootstrap. I remember when palm went under and had firesales on their phones and tablets. dev's crack it open and loaded android on them. this is a decent spec device and with all the cameras you'd think someone would eventually get some project tango features integrated.
PIYIRIO said:
i just find it hard to believe we have a root method and no custom recovery/bootstrap
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Look at it from Amazons perspective: they want their devices to be (almost) closed plattforms. Providing a method of unlocking the bootloader for all their devices is not in their interest. (I'm not going to start discussing the HDX bootloader case ^^)
Yes, the device is decent, but there are so many alternatives. So as of now I highly doubt that anyone will be looking for an exploit or any possibility to unlock the bootloader.
i'm not worried about the locked bootloader. it doesn't have to be unlocked for custom roms, plenty of devices with locked bootloaders have custom roms. we have root so we should be able to have a bootstrap method. we're just lacking in dev support. i can't blame them at all, i'm just saying for about $100 device (if your already renewing prime) this is a pretty high spec device and has hella potential. wishing it had the support of the old palm's.
I'm also confused - Fire Phone is brutal device for current price. I was expecting much broader adoption after drastic price drop.
Sent from my SD4930UR using XDA Forums
you will see a drastic increase in adoption if the bootloader has been unlocked
veti said:
you will see a drastic increase in adoption if the bootloader has been unlocked
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of course. but if no one adopts it, no one cracks the bootloader: its a catch-22. but again, everyone worries about the bootloader but that's not everything. with proper root we can have a bootstrap and custom roms which would be a million percent improvement... for example: every verizon galaxy since the s4...
this is my first fire device and thought "for the price, what the hell". turns out i absolutely hate fireos, haven't used the device at all until the latest update with root, google play, and a proper launcher.
PIYIRIO said:
of course. but if no one adopts it, no one cracks the bootloader: its a catch-22. but again, everyone worries about the bootloader but that's not everything. with proper root we can have a bootstrap and custom roms which would be a million percent improvement... for example: every verizon galaxy since the s4...
this is my first fire device and thought "for the price, what the hell". turns out i absolutely hate fireos, haven't used the device at all until the latest update with root, google play, and a proper launcher.
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i got it for 10 euros with a year of amazon prime, so it was a no brainer.
you stole it. i paid about 10 times that after the year of prime.
PIYIRIO said:
you stole it. i paid about 10 times that after the year of prime.
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huge pricing error in germany. many people got it for that price.
10 euros is an amazing deal. Really the price tag on this phone is amazing even at the non German price. So much so that I hope I get a chance to buy another one before they liquidate completely. Did some benchmarks and got performance better than the Galaxy s5 (as listed using vellamo) except for the single core test.
Anyway it seems to me that developers would adopt the phone, but it was also such a great flop that it might just continue to be neglected. I'm okay with that, but I would really like to see some development to replace some of the less functional bits of the fire os
It's too hard to get a custom ROM for Amazon fire phone.
1. The bootloader has been locked and no way to unlock.
2. We haven't found an available recovery for it.
3. We don't have the drivers of the phone.
4. Some software by amazon are used for the adaptation of the device, but we cannot make sure we can still use them in the new ROM. Such as the fix of the position of touch.
I agree, that's a bummer to not have dev support. No one wants to spend time developing for Fire OS and limit themselves to a small market niche when they can develop native Android apps and target 60%+ of the smartphone world. I bet so many cool things can be done with 5 front facing cameras, given development hours and diverse creativity input. Such a waste :/
stascom said:
I agree, that's a bummer to not have dev support. No one wants to spend time developing for Fire OS and limit themselves to a small market niche when they can develop native Android apps and target 60%+ of the smartphone world. I bet so many cool things can be done with 5 front facing cameras, given development hours and diverse creativity input. Such a waste :/
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I don't think "5 front facing cameras" is a good design.
Actually I disabled it immediately when I got my phone to save power.
It doesn't make sense.
5 front facing cameras
I am wondering if the camera system will ever be able to scan objects for 3D information, and send data to some 3D printer setup. Might be fun.
aegoyu said:
I don't think "5 front facing cameras" is a good design.
Actually I disabled it immediately when I got my phone to save power.
It doesn't make sense.
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It seems the 4 cameras in the corners are "ultra-low-powered specialized cameras", so I guess they work just for the sake of the gimmicky Dynamic Perspective.
If it's like that, what a waste of cameras.
The 4 cameras and pseudo-3D was a gimmick, in hindsight it would've been better for amazon to do its own gearVR-like accessory instead given that eye-tracking doesn't come anywhere close to the quality of VR
Besides the VR market its nowhere near the saturation of mobile so amazon could've gotten its foot on the door rather than competing with android in that respect
As for the bootloader situation has anyone considered posting a reward to get more devs to try to unlock it?
There is (or was): http://forum.xda-developers.com/fire-phone/help/bootloader-unlock-development-t3022030
And there was a change.org petition for Amazon to unlock the bootloader (I doubt they care): http://forum.xda-developers.com/fire-phone/general/petition-posted-to-change-org-to-unlock-t3009342
That would be me!! lol. Amazon made me an offer I couldn't refuse -$159- I got the free year of prime- I paid for it last year by accident and ended up getting a lot of use out of it, so this made it easy. And the phone was $60 (after putting $99 towards prime), and I opened an amazon CC which gave me $40 in an instant credit- so this phone was $20 in the end!! plus taxes of course.
Before I pulled the trigger I looked to XDA to see where development was for this phone- and it looks like it is picking up and starting to move- so I will be getting this new fire phone tomorrow!!! I have to confess I have been using an iphone 5s (JB of course!) for the last year and a half and have been missing the challenge of rooting, romming, and making the best out of the hardware that is lacking due to poor software.
My plan is to put on the latest update and add google play market- leave it unrooted for now and see how it goes. But I am keeping my eye on beta CM11 and seeing how far it goes with CM 13 possibly in the future!!
@ggow- you seem to be very ambitious with this phone!!!! You are doing some great work and I am following your development closely :good::highfive:. I have never used safestrap before, but I may just have to give it a whirl. You make it very tempting
Why was I interested in this Fire Phone??? I bought a kindle 7 hdx last year and hacked that to run google market and it turned out to be a pretty great tablet that I also got a great deal on. It has the fire OS running along side google market with a great launcher running to swap back and forth. So kindle, instant videos, amazon music, and all the google apps too. It's specs were very close to the ipad mini and was a third of the cost. I gave it to my daughter to use in NYC running on att and she has had no complaints with how I modded it. And she is not very techy! :silly:
I am getting a little bored with my 5s and wanted a bigger screen- I passed on the 6+ since we are no longer getting subsidies and $850 for a phone seems ridiculous!! I don't know if 0.7 inches will make much of a difference, but for $20, I just had to find out
I have a Fire Stick TV also and I want to see how they work together. Very excited to receive this phone tomorrow.
Even after all the horrible reviews I read and watched on you tube!! Hopefully these modifications developed here will make it great!
Geez!!!! 75 views and no comments? Come on people- loosen up and let me know if you love your fire phone or hate it or Hate me cause I got it so cheap:silly: Please share your experiences with your Fire Phone. By now it's a year old, but still looks like a great phone for $60. I am basically a really cheap bargain hunter and wait for things to go on sale. This was really a good one.
Share what you did to make it a great phone! Would love to benefit from your experiences.:highfive: Do you love the Fire OS? Do you love the Market? Or CM11? Please share And I thank you in advance:good:
Great phone for the money. If throw yourself into the Amazon ecosystem the fire OS works quite well but I think only Jeff Bezos has done that so far. I'm using it with a custom launcher at the moment but when cm11 is final I might adopt it.
sashusmom said:
Geez!!!! 75 views and no comments? Come on people- loosen up and let me know if you love your fire phone or hate it or Hate me cause I got it so cheap:silly: Please share your experiences with your Fire Phone. By now it's a year old, but still looks like a great phone for $60. I am basically a really cheap bargain hunter and wait for things to go on sale. This was really a good one.
Share what you did to make it a great phone! Would love to benefit from your experiences.:highfive: Do you love the Fire OS? Do you love the Market? Or CM11? Please share And I thank you in advance:good:
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Since you asked:
The hardware is incredible for the price. The antutu benchmark puts it slightly faster than a galaxy s5. However, the bells and whistles (extra cameras, 3D, etc) are irrelevant at best. -- The os is terrible. It works well enough but is far behind other smart phones' os. Also, Amazon's wish to completely control your "experience" gets in the way of good hardware. If you root and then add gapps and the google now launcher, the phone is better to use, but still feels wrong, especially when certain apps can only be added through amazon's app store. -- Finally, I'm still irked by the locked bootloader. It was at this stage I put it in the drawer to use as an emergency backup - or maybe a "mini-gamer" for kids.
Then came ggow and his work to bring CM11 to the phone. Thanks to him, I now use it as my daily driver. I have added Xposed Framework with a few modules, all my favorite apps, and the phone is great! The only annoyance is that there are very infrequent random google play services stops which quickly correct themselves leaving a msg that needs to be swiped away. This is no big deal and ggow might have this fixed by the time you read this. Ggow also mentioned bypassing lollipop (CM12) and looking to "M" for his next major upgrade. How this will happen with a locked bootloader I don't know, but all praise to the person who brought my firephone backed to life.
Enjoy your firephone.
I bought the Fire Phone 6 months ago (I think, don't remember), when it was $189 (and a year of Prime). Having a phone with those specs at $90 was a great deal and hard to refuse. Bought it, got it, and the first day of using it I was amused with how different it was from stock Android. I had a Nexus 5, which got stolen, and I wandered with a low-end phone until I bought the Fire Phone. The Fire Phone couldn't be more different from the Nexus 5, software-wise. I saw the lock screen, toyed with it and thought: "Wow, it moves depending on where I look it from, nice!" (my first lock screen was the one with the time made from the stars and the moon with below it) but also "Did Amazon really need 4 cameras just for that? It might drain my battery" and "Which real-world use could I give to this feature?"
Yes, it was nice to see how things moved thanks to the Dynamic Perspective feature, at least at first; then, like all novelties, my attention to it faded and eventually I disabled it. Having my battery drained wasn't worth for a feature I wasn't paying attention to and which the only real-world use I could think of was showing it to some friend to surprise them a for a little time. And because this phone doesn't have a removable battery, I couldn't afford to lose it for some gimmicky feature.
Then I saw the Carousel, which is the home screen where the most recent apps are shown, with the notifications below it. They were affected by the Dynamic Perspective too. I hated that dotted pattern they used for the Carousel, and then I tried to change it for, say, whatever picture this phone could've come with.
I went to Settings, and was surprised to see, first, that that annoying dotted pattern was there too, and then that there wasn't a way to change the wallpaper. I thought "Come on, it's 2015, every OS in the friggin' world has a way to change the wallpaper. It's the most basic form of customization. Even Apple (which I don't hate), with all that walled garden feeling, allows you to change the wallpaper." But Amazon's FireOS didn't (I haven't ever seen a Kindle Fire tablet). My phone shipped with version 3.6.8, and we had to wait until May to see such a basic feature with the upgrade to 4.6.1. I got annoyed by that, but there was nothing I could to about it.
I checked the pre-loaded games, which make heavy use of the same Dynamic Perspective. I half-liked the Planet Blocks game and played it for a while. After that, I forgot I had it and remained hidden.
Then I went to the Appstore to see what was new. I knew the Appstore didn't have any Google app, and understood it. Amazon had an equivalent to every Google app and, even though I didn't like how they looked, they got the job done, and that was what mattered. Downloading and installing was what I was used to, and updating was a breeze.
But I guess I missed some apps that weren't on the Appstore and was lazy to not sideload all of them. I needed to see good ol' Google on this phone, so I went to XDA and checked if there was a way to sideload Google Play Services. After all, underneath all the Amazon skin and no traces of Google, FireOS was Android at the heart (3.6.8 was based on Android 4.2 Jelly Bean, which was pretty outdated even then). There was a way to install Google Play Services, and there was a way to root the phone too, but only if you were brave (and foolish) enough to downgrade to 3.5.1 (it was a bad idea, because if you did that, there would be problems with the Amazon account registration and also some nasty overheating issue). So, I stayed with just installing Google Play Services. It went smoothly and finally got Google. With the Play Store I'd be able to download and install SwiftKey and maybe Google Now Launcher or Nova Launcher.
I got no luck with SwiftKey. It installed, but then you couldn't use it unless you activated it via ADB. After that, got SwiftKey. And about launchers, they worked, except for widgets (which weren't supported in FireOS) and the wallpaper (there was a way to change the wallpaper in Nova; you could choose the image, but it never worked; you had to like the black background because it was the only option). I checked other launchers, some supported widgets (not all widgets, but some) and some found a way to change the wallpaper. I stuck with Buzz Launcher, which made the phone look and work most similar to Android.
I hoped Amazon would sometime hear what users here at XDA (and everywhere else) had to say. The Fire Phone was a great piece of hardware, but its software was a bummer. People were trying to google it but all you could do was sideload Google Play Services. The bootloader was locked (and still is), and the Towelroot method for rooting didn't work for 3.6.8, so downgrading was the next stage for googling up the device. I remember seeing some guys here at XDA offering some money to the first person to unlock the bootloader, and some people sending a letter to Jeff Bezos himself to unlock it and then also a Change.org petition, taking the example of the HP TouchPad tablet (it saw new life after HP unlocked its bootloader, after which people flashed Android instead of the built-in webOS, becoming the second-most selling tablet of 2011). It never happened.
Then it was the question if the phone would ever receive a FireOS 4 update (based on Android 4.4 KitKat), given its lackluster sales. It finally happened on May, and came with very necessary changes to help customize the phone.
This new version would eventually be rooted via Kingroot, which is a very shady-looking app for rooting. It worked, and then there was a way to change it for SuperSU, a more reliable root app. With all the long wait, knowing a developer found a way to flash a ROM even with the locked bootloader was a relief. I flashed it as fast as I could. Now I'm using Cyanogenmod 11 and it's great (no trace of Amazon). It's still beta (the developer uploaded the first build just 4 days ago), but it works pretty well right now, and it'll only get better.
Now we can use a phone that has a great price and good specs with a great OS to match. To the people out there wondering if the phone is worth the price (right now it went back to $449 and comes with a year of Amazon Prime, with $99 alone, so the phone's real price is $350), no, it's not, you could get a OnePlus One at that price (which comes with Cyanogen OS), or a Moto X, or a Xiaomi Mi4, or many other great phones below $350 (and then if, and only if, you want Amazon Prime you can subscribe). When it gets a big discount, which happens from time to time (last one was this week and the price went down to $159), it gets more attractive (especially if you were going to subscribe to Amazon Prime). The phone has many gimmicky features which are really useless, uses an OS that is difficult to adapt to, and is overpriced most of the time (no wonder Amazon failed to sell it at launch at $199 with AT&T contact, or later at $649 unlocked, or now at $449), but may be a great deal when bought at discount (this week the real price of the phone was $60, and at that price you cannot get any smartphone off-contract) and if you're willing to tinker with the phone and flash a ROM (Cyanogenmod 11 is the only one right now, but might be more in the future), it makes a pretty good phone.
A quad-core Snapdragon 800 CPU, with Adreno 330 GPU and 2GB of RAM, a 13MP rear camera and 2.1MP front camera, 1080p recording, 32GB of built-in storage and now the ability to flash Cyanogenmod 11 for just $60? I'd buy it.
Wow!! Great responses guys. I thank you for taking the time to offer your opinions and I really look forward to receiving my Fire phone
Got my Fire phone!!
I really like the screen- overall size of the phone is not really bigger than my 5s but the screen real estate is a little bigger. It's not so lite that you will drop it or so thin you will drop it either. When I use my 5s bare, I have a hard time hanging onto it. It's in a wallet case that I can get a good grab onto. I like a little heft to it and it does feel good in your hand.
I have the incipio folio case on this fire phone that I got for $10 from ATT online store. That was a really good deal. Also did a screen saver just because I like them and the protection from minute scratches they provide.
So, on my Amazon account it was registered to me and the free prime was added on. When I went to set up the phone it requires you to register again to your account and I got all errors that it couldn't be done at this time, blah blah blah. I researched it and apparently this was a big problem at launch too.
So I updated it to the latest of 4.6.1 (820) and tried again, same deal. It just wouldn't register. So I de-registered it on my computer, and tried again on the phone, no go. You can't use the phone without it being asso. with an amazon acct- no apps at all are usable, even the preinstalled ones. So I chatted online, they couldn't help me and wanted to have their Fire Team support call me back- but I couldn't at that time so I will deal with it tomorrow. I'll have to search this forum and see if there's any info about it.
In the meantime I got the google apps working so now I at least have a pretty good list of apps, but no amazon services working yet. I still have to add a sim card and check the basic call functions- since it is a phone.
The benefit of picking up a phone that is a year old is you guys have already tackled the tough parts of rooting, modding, roms, etc. I checked out this forum before purchasing and was pleasantly surprised that you just made the break through just this week for CM. I may have to check that out! I have the att Mega and that poor orphan phone is so crippled most guys just walked away. I Love it for it's 6 inch screen size. The iphone 6+ was in my thoughts but can't justify that price tag. My mega was a penny when we still did subsidies.
I thank you all for your perseverance and hard work and your stick-to-it-ive-ness:good: This could actually be a decent phone with all the modifications. I am hoping I can leave it as is and swap between the Fire OS and the Nova launcher. Hopefully I'll get it registered correctly tomorrow. It's nice getting back into android after apple. I like them both- but I do get bored.
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So even though it is 3 am here, I just got off the phone with fire phone support and I was told it was a system wide outage and there are many people having this problem. They will get back to me!! I won't hold my breath here
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Talked again to amazon and I am "on the list" to have this registration fubar sorted out. She took additional info- my mac address on the phone specifically, and supposedly this will be fixed OTA magically. We'll see.
I do have a working sim in and phone calls work fine. I have issue with the tinny sounding speakers that are suppose to be stereo- Sounds terrible- especially with music clips ringtones. Pandora sounds bad too. I did read the reviews about the sound and it appears to be true.
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So Amazon finally fixed the registration problem OTA. I can now access my Amazon stuff. Problem solved.
Hello guys.
I bougth the above mentioned (which I'm not sure the information is 100% correct, but windows properties when i connect the fire stick to it says firmware1.0) some years ago and i was scammed.
Bouight it from a third party, obviously, and the phone stoped existing soon after.
Yes, stupid, i know.
I have confirmed that the device in question is banned on amazon, due to misplaced/stolen and they cant help me (whicH i totally understand).
It just pains me - A LOT more than being scammed - having a piece of hardware that is actually in good shape and throwing it in the garbage.
Is there something I can use this for? I've tried browing the internet but I come a accross a lot of jargon that throws me off.
I'm tech savy or computer savy enought to follow tutorials but I cant really understand where to start or even to be sure if this device can be worked on.
Please tell me if this is something i should persue and if you can lend a hand in pointing me the right way or if it's pointless and ill throw it in the garbage.
Thanks everyone.
Edit: i think this is what windows identified the stick as
Fire TV Stick 4K – 1st Gen (2018)AFTMMFire OS 6