Is there a possibility that Amazon might remove the ability to side load apps with future firmware auto update, if you are not rooted?
Thank you
Sure there is. There's a possibility they could do all sorts of bone-headed things to it.
wellersl said:
Sure there is. There's a possibility they could do all sorts of bone-headed things to it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But of course they never would. Because then people wouldn't be able to test their apps on it. No people testing apps == no one releasing apps.
the probably couldn;t remove the Install from Unknown Sources since it;s part of the OS. But they could try to hide it. They could try to hide file managers like ES File manager from their app store as well. It;s more truble than it;s worth. But as long as you can use ADB to push and install apps to your device we will be fine.
I think the biggest thing we need is to unlock the bootloader because that will allow you to install a custom recovery like TWRP or CWM if you want full command and control of the unit.
rbox said:
But of course they never would.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But of course!
In your esteemed opinion, did they deliberately cause the eFuse/locked bootloader fiasco? IOW - Was that a conscious move on Amazon's part?
---------- Post added at 10:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:45 AM ----------
tekweezle said:
They could try to hide file managers like ES File manager from their app store as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They don't need to hide it. They've determined that it's not compatible.
Strange to me how the Amazon app store is so void of apps that *are* compatible with my Fire TV. :silly:
tekweezle said:
the probably couldn;t remove the Install from Unknown Sources since it;s part of the OS. But they could try to hide it. They could try to hide file managers like ES File manager from their app store as well. It;s more truble than it;s worth. But as long as you can use ADB to push and install apps to your device we will be fine.
I think the biggest thing we need is to unlock the bootloader because that will allow you to install a custom recovery like TWRP or CWM if you want full command and control of the unit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They can do whatever they want. They have all of the source code.
wellersl said:
But of course!
In your esteemed opinion, did they deliberately cause the eFuse/locked bootloader fiasco? IOW - Was that a conscious move on Amazon's part?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very much so. They went out of their way to write a program that blew the fuse.
rbox said:
Very much so. They went out of their way to write a program that blew the fuse.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now see, IMO, if I fell victim to that, I'd have them in small claims court in a heartbeat. That's just plain bone-headed consumer product management. That is... if I could prove it.
Note to Amazon: How about a *special* Fire TV with *Special Offers"?
wellersl said:
Now see, IMO, if I fell victim to that, I'd have them in small claims court in a heartbeat. That's just plain bone-headed consumer product management. That is... if I could prove it.
Note to Amazon: How about a *special* Fire TV with *Special Offers"?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's common practice. All the manufacturers do it. What would you sue them for? Protecting their product? They are patching vulnerabilities.
rbox said:
It's common practice. All the manufacturers do it. What would you sue them for? Protecting their product? They are patching vulnerabilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well... it just occurred to me. They aren't actually disabling the device, are they? I keep seeing the term "brick." If, in fact, they're bricking these devices, wrong. There's absolutely nothing that came with or on my Fire TV that says I can't root it.
Else, in terms of vulnerability, I could see them locking me out of AVOD. But they should have any say over my access to Netflix.
wellersl said:
Well... it just occurred to me. They aren't actually disabling the device, are they? I keep seeing the term "brick." If, in fact, they're bricking these devices, wrong. There's absolutely nothing that came with or on my Fire TV that says I can't root it.
Else, in terms of vulnerability, I could see them locking me out of AVOD. But they should have any say over my access to Netflix.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All the efuse does is prevent you from booting an old bootloader. As long as you aren't doing the things we are doing, it's harmless. But if you try to go out of your way to screw around with the software and use an old bootloader, then it will be bricked because the old bootloader will not work with the fuse blown, and it doesn't boot. It has nothing to do with rooting, nor anything to do with avod or netflix...
rbox said:
... use an old bootloader, then it will be bricked because the old bootloader will not work with the fuse blown, and it doesn't boot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Still trying to grasp this...
If you aren't trying to root, why else would you use an old bootloader?
rbox said:
They are patching vulnerabilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was only using Netflix as an example. I don't see Amazon bricking their devices to patch a competitor's vulnerabilities. Though that is a strange relationship...
wellersl said:
Still trying to grasp this...
If you aren't trying to root, why else would you use an old bootloader?
I was only using Netflix as an example. I don't see Amazon bricking their devices to patch a competitor's vulnerabilities. Though that is a strange relationship...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You use the old bootloader so you can take advantage of the bug in the bootloader and load unsigned code. Custom kernels, custom roms, recovery, etc.
That makes no sense... they patched a vulnerability in the bootloader and then prevent you from using said vulnerable bootloader... It has nothing to do with apps.
rbox said:
You use the old bootloader so you can take advantage of the bug in the bootloader and load unsigned code. Custom kernels, custom roms, recovery, etc.
That makes no sense... they patched a vulnerability in the bootloader and then prevent you from using said vulnerable bootloader... It has nothing to do with apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got the first point (I think).
On the second point, Amazon can obviously patch what they perceive as vulnerabilities -unrestricted-. But as soon as they've patched me out of an otherwise legitimate use of the box, they've gone too far. IMHO.
Some years back, I filed a claim against UPS and won. I'm sure they got the paperwork and had no clue what to do with it.
More recently, I filed a claim with the BBB against Roku for the crappy firmware they pushed out on the 2XS. Roku sent me a new 2XS and a new Roku 3. Just to shut me up.
wellersl said:
Got the first point (I think).
On the second point, Amazon can obviously patch what they perceive as vulnerabilities -unrestricted-. But as soon as they've patched me out of an otherwise legitimate use of the box, they've gone too far. IMHO.
Some years back, I filed a claim against UPS and won. I'm sure they got the paperwork and had no clue what to do with it.
More recently, I filed a claim with the BBB against Roku for the crappy firmware they pushed out on the 2XS. Roku sent me a new 2XS and a new Roku 3. Just to shut me up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bypassing their secure bootchain is not a legitimate use. Exploiting a vulnerability in the kernel to gain root is also not a legitimate use.
rbox said:
Bypassing their secure bootchain is not a legitimate use. Exploiting a vulnerability in the kernel to gain root is also not a legitimate use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously, I'm not getting my point across. But that's ok.
Peace.
rbox said:
But of course they never would. Because then people wouldn't be able to test their apps on it. No people testing apps == no one releasing apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Rbox,
This make sense thank you for responding but can the developer just be released the app in amazon app store as free and then user would just download from amazon app, unless of course it is really painful process to get an app approved by amazon for a developer than i can understand or why go thru the process again with amazon if the app is already on google play store.
It seems there are quite a few folks out there who chose not to root there device as long as they can side load any apps they want, which is fine but if Amazon goal is to lock down user on there echosystem than allowing folks to side load any apps user wants this would seriously undermine there goal (Amazon app store, AFTV device, the whole amazon echosystem), this is Just my opinion.
Thank you
ashsha7877 said:
Hi Rbox,
This make sense thank you for responding but can the developer just be released the app in amazon app store as free and then user would just download from amazon app, unless of course it is really painful process to get an app approved by amazon for a developer than i can understand or why go thru the process again with amazon if the app is already on google play store.
It seems there are quite a few folks out there who chose not to root there device as long as they can side load any apps they want, which is fine but if Amazon goal is to lock down user on there echosystem than allowing folks to side load any apps user wants this would seriously undermine there goal (Amazon app store, AFTV device, the whole amazon echosystem), this is Just my opinion.
Thank you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It has nothing to do with releasing apps. If I make an app for the Fire TV. I'm going to test it on the Fire TV. And the way I do that is using adb install. They can't block that, or else no one would be able to test their apps.
rbox said:
It has nothing to do with releasing apps. If I make an app for the Fire TV. I'm going to test it on the Fire TV. And the way I do that is using adb install. They can't block that, or else no one would be able to test their apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ahh, since you put it that way it make more sense. Thank you Sir!
Also it would be a pretty stupid move for Amazon to add "Install from unknown sources" in their latest firmware's if they did not wan't people to install 3'rd party android app's on it. As you do not have to "sideload" with adb anymore, you can just install a webbrowser and browse to a web site (kodi.tv for example) click on a installer .apk and it will immediately install. You can also copy the apk to the sdcard and click on it in a filebrowser and it will install.
Amazon put that option in 1 version ago. So beginning to remove sideloading via. adb and hiding apps seems pretty silly to me.
But ofcause in theory they still have the source and the rights to do what they like..
On the one hand, Amazon doesn't have to provide support for side loaded apps, which saves them money. On the other hand, some side loaded apps allow users to access premium content for free, so Amazon might claim they lose revenue, but those users probably would never have purchased premium content from Amazon in the first place and at least they made some money off the hardware. So I would say that they won't revoke side loading functionality.
Related
I'm rooted, running CM7. Thing is, there are some "Kindle Fire Edition" games I'd like to get via the Amazon Appstore, but my CM7 Fire is listed as not compatible with those games, in the appstore. A few people mentioned that a certain file would have to be changed, but I'm not quite tech-savvy enough to know where this file is, how to change it, what to change it to, etc.
Would anyone happen to have step-by-step instructions as to how to do this?
mrw1215 said:
I'm rooted, running CM7. Thing is, there are some "Kindle Fire Edition" games I'd like to get via the Amazon Appstore, but my CM7 Fire is listed as not compatible with those games, in the appstore. A few people mentioned that a certain file would have to be changed, but I'm not quite tech-savvy enough to know where this file is, how to change it, what to change it to, etc.
Would anyone happen to have step-by-step instructions as to how to do this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You just have to change the build.prop back to the one in the fire os.
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using XDA App
Not sure how to do that, though.
mrw1215 said:
I'm rooted, running CM7. Thing is, there are some "Kindle Fire Edition" games I'd like to get via the Amazon Appstore, but my CM7 Fire is listed as not compatible with those games, in the appstore. A few people mentioned that a certain file would have to be changed, but I'm not quite tech-savvy enough to know where this file is, how to change it, what to change it to, etc.
Would anyone happen to have step-by-step instructions as to how to do this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can try to just download the apk from somewhere and sideload it. Assuming its free of course.
I haven't messed with putting build.prop back to stock, but what I ended up doing was backing up my stuff temporarily, flashing 6.2.1 back to it, root and add TiBackup. Then back up the KF Edition stuff I own (Sim City Deluxe and Angry Birds), restore to CM7, and then restore the backed up apps. Worked a peach for both of those.
It's pretty gross that any app store would let you purchase things and then lock you out of downloading them. (happened to me as well and it's why I don't use the Amazon store outside of the free daily stuff)
Aahz Pervect said:
It's pretty gross that any app store would let you purchase things and then lock you out of downloading them. (happened to me as well and it's why I don't use the Amazon store outside of the free daily stuff)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, they're apps for one particular hardware/software combination, and when something changes you're suddenly not compatible anymore. I get it, they're meant to be exclusive to the Kindle Fire, it just kinda bites that it can tell it's a KF (because it lumps it together in the "manage my kindle" area) but they won't enable the download that way.
I understand the why as it reduces average user confusion but once I've paid for an Android app then I expect for that app to be available on every Android device that I connect on.
Whether it works or not is my burden to deal with not their's to dictate. (not like this is unique to the Amazon app store but still Android is Android is Android and, in this case, the hardware is exactly the same...they just don't like it that we ditched their limited version )
I'm not really that upset but I'm certainly not going to purchase any more apps from them.
You can easily change your make/manufacter and the rest of the build.prop settings with the IMEI program that I created a tutorial for here. I'm not exactly sure what it needs changed to, however. I'll figure it out and update my FAQ.
Hi all.
I've gone through the regular build of my firetv. I usually let aptoide update all the apps automatically, however After the update (im not sure) the firetv is behaving with the following issues.
1. I cannot click on any of the apps from the recent or home screen.
2. I have to select the apps on the manage installed apps page.
3. The apps location looks different and has kodi in it. that shouldn't be the case as kodi is not an amazon sanctioned app.
Is there a utility that got installed?
really really appreciate your help. please see the screen shot
navigates said:
Hi all.
I've gone through the regular build of my firetv. I usually let aptoide update all the apps automatically, however After the update (im not sure) the firetv is behaving with the following issues.
1. I cannot click on any of the apps from the recent or home screen.
2. I have to select the apps on the manage installed apps page.
3. The apps location looks different and has kodi in it. that shouldn't be the case as kodi is not an amazon sanctioned app.
Is there a utility that got installed?
really really appreciate your help. please see the screen shot
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for rbox's recovery, I recovered by cleaning all data and back from scratch with keeping my root. I still am curious. how did this anomy happy. I believe aptoid updated some foundation libraries and my firetv was set to install from unknown sources.
It looks to me like the stock amazon app store was installed. Just a guess
collindv said:
It looks to me like the stock amazon app store was installed. Just a guess
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? Don't know what is a stock amazon app store. I did the recovery and got back to where it should be. Had to redo all apps again but that is a smaller task. The only change I had done was to let aptoide update all updates which I usually don't let aptoide take over. it also updated supersu etc.
navigates said:
Really? Don't know what is a stock amazon app store. I did the recovery and got back to where it should be. Had to redo all apps again but that is a smaller task. The only change I had done was to let aptoide update all updates which I usually don't let aptoide take over. it also updated supersu etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The app store was installed. Do not update all appps with any third party app store. Aptoide always has an update for the amazon app store and if you update it, it installs the actual app store. Pay attention to what apps you are updating and what the version number is, cause sometimes the apps are actually downgraded with third party app stores. I update all apps one at a time with third party app stores, and I check to make sure that the app is the right version by checking it in the google play store first. There are also a lot of fake apps on third party app stores. Lets say you have version 1.2 installed and the updated version is actually 1.3, third party app stores may say the version is 1.4 or 1.5, and that always means the app is fake. So basically, never batch update/auto update with third party app stores, and always check the version number and you will be fine. If the version number does not match, do not update, and if you do not want your apps displayed like an app drawer on the fire TV then never update the amazon app store. BTW, if you accidentally install the amazon app store again, simply uninstall and reboot and it will go back to normal.
porkenhimer said:
The app store was installed. Do not update all appps with any third party app store. Aptoide always has an update for the amazon app store and if you update it, it installs the actual app store. Pay attention to what apps you are updating and what the version number is, cause sometimes the apps are actually downgraded with third party app stores. I update all apps one at a time with third party app stores, and I check to make sure that the app is the right version by checking it in the google play store first. There are also a lot of fake apps on third party app stores. Lets say you have version 1.2 installed and the updated version is actually 1.3, third party app stores may say the version is 1.4 or 1.5, and that always means the app is fake. So basically, never batch update/auto update with third party app stores, and always check the version number and you will be fine. If the version number does not match, do not update, and if you do not want your apps displayed like an app drawer on the fire TV then never update the amazon app store. BTW, if you accidentally install the amazon app store again, simply uninstall and reboot and it will go back to normal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wish I knew this earlier would have saved me loads of time redoing the box again, but that too is no biggie as most of my build is automated through batch files. I didn’t know there is an app store. I’ll be careful. I too typically don’t update all but do it one at a time. The good tip is to check the version number before updating which I will. I’m contemplating getting another rooted one for my self as a backup as those are getting hard to find and my local best buy has a few on hand.
navigates said:
I wish I knew this earlier would have saved me loads of time redoing the box again, but that too is no biggie as most of my build is automated through batch files. I didn’t know there is an app store. I’ll be careful. I too typically don’t update all but do it one at a time. The good tip is to check the version number before updating which I will. I’m contemplating getting another rooted one for my self as a backup as those are getting hard to find and my local best buy has a few on hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Even if they are not rootable, they are still worth the money. The only advantages I really see in rooting is having the play store, default lanchers and external drive support. I could care less about a launcher on the fire TV, cause none of them function correctly anyway, and not having the play store is even less of a care for me, cause I have all the apps I need or want without it. External drive support would be nice, but I am pretty sure it will come in a future update from amazon so no big deal. I guess I can say my only gripe about the Fire TV is that it does not support a lot of apps that are sideloaded, but that is not amazons fault and every device doesn't support all apps.
porkenhimer said:
Even if they are not rootable, they are still worth the money. The only advantages I really see in rooting is having the play store, default lanchers and external drive support. I could care less about a launcher on the fire TV, cause none of them function correctly anyway, and not having the play store is even less of a care for me, cause I have all the apps I need or want without it. External drive support would be nice, but I am pretty sure it will come in a future update from amazon so no big deal. I guess I can say my only gripe about the Fire TV is that it does not support a lot of apps that are sideloaded, but that is not amazons fault and every device doesn't support all apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. At the moment, the benefits of rooting is not outweighed at the moment, however, the custom rom is around the horizon. I specifically like the suspend feature on kodi. Another rooted feature I like is quicksupport/teamviewer, so I can help my family incase they need help. I may drive down to bestbuy on my way in and pick up one of the rootable units and keep it on the side for future need or family need.
Or should I get the nexus player.
navigates said:
Agreed. At the moment, the benefits of rooting is not outweighed at the moment, however, the custom rom is around the horizon. I specifically like the suspend feature on kodi. Another rooted feature I like is quicksupport/teamviewer, so I can help my family incase they need help. I may drive down to bestbuy on my way in and pick up one of the rootable units and keep it on the side for future need or family need.
Or should I get the nexus player.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should get the device you like. If you already know the Fire TV is good for you then why not get another? If you wanna different experience get the Nexus Player or another device of your choosing. Its all subjective, and no one can really answer that for you. Just my opinion, you will be hard pressed to find another android box that can compete with the Fire TV. There are a lot of devices that have great specs that do not compare to the Fire TV, even without root. There is a reason why there are thousands off videos comparing the Fire TV to the Roku and Apple TV, cause its is the top Android box, period.
porkenhimer said:
You should get the device you like. If you already know the Fire TV is good for you then why not get another? If you wanna different experience get the Nexus Player or another device of your choosing. Its all subjective, and no one can really answer that for you. Just my opinion, you will be hard pressed to find another android box that can compete with the Fire TV. There are a lot of devices that have great specs that do not compare to the Fire TV, even without root. There is a reason why there are thousands off videos comparing the Fire TV to the Roku and Apple TV, cause its is the top Android box, period.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. I've gotten myself another box as the serial number was in the series 3 and I would like to keep it rooted. I'm confident a custom rom is around the corner. So far I've given the firetv to my parents, inlaws, brother in law, 3 cousins and loads of friends. They all are super excited about it. the downside is that I'm getting tired of building one for friends as when people ask, they don't realize the effort that is put into building one, specially for rooting. I feel if building one, give the full honesty and build a good one/rooted as you never know what new is around the horizon.
Yes its stock amazon app store, i made the same mistake when apiode updated the amazon store for me. All you have to do is uninstall it.
go to settings apps click on amazon app store and clear data and cash uninstall then reboot.
Is the only reason to root a fire tv to install a custom ROM. Will XBMC still run on a un-rooted device
I have a device that is rooted and only use it for XBMC. Last week it locked up. Going to send it in but they will probably install the latest firmware on it. Thats OK as long as I can still install and use XBMC
Thanks Rick
Lots of reasons to root but no you don't need it for xbmc.
typically rooting only give you access to customizing the actual OS and running certain apps (like openvpn). to use xbmc and 99% of apps, you do not need root..
Rooting ftv
Is is true that if you dont root, Amazons updates can brick your device so you cants use XBMC anymore?
Rooting is keeping your options open for the future.
1. If XBMC or sideloading is ever blocked by Amazon by future updates then rooting w/recovery installed gives you a chance to block the Amazon update.
2. Rooting allow use of USB external hard drive for storage of media with access via xbmc.
3. Possible custom rom in the future. It would be nice to get Android TV onto this box.
4. Root allows you to use an external SSD to essentially replace the 8gb storage and put a lot of games/apps on the Firetv.
5. Allows you to put on a cleaned up Amazon update that could close up the possibility of sideloading.
To add to the above list for me the most needed are.
1. Quick support from google play. You need root for live desktop/remote view. I can support my friends and family remotely.
2. Emulators from google play which needs to be purchased.
3. Change the icon to Kodi.
4. Upcoming custom rom of android TV.
5. Removal of Amazon enforced menu items.
plus the others mentioned such as USB drives.
navigates said:
To add to the above list for me the most needed are.
3. Change the icon to Kodi.
plus the others mentioned such as USB drives.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can change icon to Kodi without root. Thats what I do with my non rooted boxes.
yazyazoo said:
Rooting is keeping your options open for the future.
1. If XBMC or sideloading is ever blocked by Amazon by future updates then rooting w/recovery installed gives you a chance to block the Amazon update.
2. Rooting allow use of USB external hard drive for storage of media with access via xbmc.
3. Possible custom rom in the future. It would be nice to get Android TV onto this box.
4. Root allows you to use an external SSD to essentially replace the 8gb storage and put a lot of games/apps on the Firetv.
5. Allows you to put on a cleaned up Amazon update that could close up the possibility of sideloading.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you upgrade the internal apps storage(#4)?
nebulink said:
You can change icon to Kodi without root. Thats what I do with my non rooted boxes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you sure. I try adbfire on non rooted ones and change of icone does not take effect. I always thought it was a rooted feature. That's good to know.
By the way bestbuys in LA now have the latest non rooted versions. Its sad.
There should be a new way to root. these devices are getting scarce by the day. I always have people come up to me and ask if I can make them one, and I direct them to find a correct piece.
Amazon can't stop you from using Kodi (at the moment).
USB storage is enough reason for me to have the aftv rooted.
krasny2k5 said:
USB storage is enough reason for me to have the aftv rooted.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I still haven't seen the need to expand my storage beyond native. I have kodi with a library of about 200 movies and google play and a few apps. haven't seen the need for additional space . One point to note here is that I did recover about 2 GB of my lost space by running a google play software called SDMaid Pro. That scans for orphan files that are not required and cleans up space. Costs about 2.50. That again needs root for google play.
navigates said:
I still haven't seen the need to expand my storage beyond native. I have kodi with a library of about 200 movies and google play and a few apps. haven't seen the need for additional space . One point to note here is that I did recover about 2 GB of my lost space by running a google play software called SDMaid Pro. That scans for orphan files that are not required and cleans up space. Costs about 2.50. That again needs root for google play.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really?
I'm always having to delete apps to make room for others.. it's a pain
I have a few large-ish games like Game of Thrones, The Wolf Among Us (with all episodes it takes up a lot of space)
8GB is tiny
DN38416 said:
Really?
I'm always having to delete apps to make room for others.. it's a pain
I have a few large-ish games like Game of Thrones, The Wolf Among Us (with all episodes it takes up a lot of space)
8GB is tiny
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh maybe then. I'm not into playing games. the only games i have is the emulators like md.emu for sega or mame etc. those are really small. If your into games then yes 8gb can be a limitation. Also give SDmaid a shot. you'll need google play to get the pro version that matches orphans and recovers lost space. I got 2 gb back which is a good thing with a space strapped storage.
The day I need to expand the storage which I may need as I have about 1.5 gb remaining. I'll look around as to which script to use. i believe by expanding, the firetv bootup becomes slow. I also got a usb 2.0 hub during the black friday sale from staples for 2 bucks. I didn't know what to buy then so got the hub. Its targus and still packed.
bumpaudio said:
How do you upgrade the internal apps storage(#4)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't done it personally.
http://www.aftvnews.com/how-to-use-a-usb-drive-as-the-fire-tvs-internal-storage/
yazyazoo said:
I haven't done it personally.
http://www.aftvnews.com/how-to-use-a-usb-drive-as-the-fire-tvs-internal-storage/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks I've seen that in the past. I will try that when needed but for now I'm ok with the internal storage. I plan to buy the m.2 ssd and put it in an enclosure when I'm ready.
I didn't want to open a thread just to post this but what are the cons of an unlocked bootloader. I'm already rooted with the playstore installed but why would or should I unlock my bootloader?
So wait, are amazon planning on blocking sideloading apps? Where has this info came from? I don't yet have a fire tv but if they are gonna block sideloading, I'll spend my £70 elsewhere. Not a single chance I'd be subscribing to prime or anything like that.
cliffyboro said:
So wait, are amazon planning on blocking sideloading apps? Where has this info came from? I don't yet have a fire tv but if they are gonna block sideloading, I'll spend my £70 elsewhere. Not a single chance I'd be subscribing to prime or anything like that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no one knows. And if you are still contemplating, you probably have missed out on the rootable ones. However if you are in the UK, that is a no go anyways unless you go through the hardware root. I highly doubt Amazon will disable sideloading, however there is no telling what they will do eventually. If you are rooted and update blocked, then you can always use your device the way you want.
PS: Lots of us have extra's for the rainy day ! Its a super fun toy to play with. Unlocator, Streaming. I'd say go for it. Its given me hours of tinkering around fun.
As I've said on many other occasions, they can't disable sideloading. That is, as long as they expect people to still develop apps for the Fire TV.
Hi developers!
Since the OOS 3.2.2 update, systemless root is now failing to pass googled safetynet checks, meaning Android pay no longer works :/ if I roll back to 3.2.1 then it works fine. I'm using the safetynet helped app from the play store to test this. I wondered if any developers or knowledgeable people would know if this is a change in the rom causing this, or just a SuperSU incompatibility?
OOS 3.2.2 validates with no root. I just flash SuperSU when needed and then unroot when finished. (TWRP as recovery) Some of my banking apps will not work with root installed.
Google made server side change that somehow now detects systemless root around 25th July.
spetrie said:
OOS 3.2.2 validates with no root. I just flash SuperSU when needed and then unroot when finished. (TWRP as recovery) Some of my banking apps will not work with root installed.
Google made server side change that somehow now detects systemless root around 25th July.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That might have been why then. Worked momentarily before the 3.2.2 update. Cheers for the info
manor7777 said:
Hi developers!
Since the OOS 3.2.2 update, systemless root is now failing to pass googled safetynet checks, meaning Android pay no longer works :/ if I roll back to 3.2.1 then it works fine. I'm using the safetynet helped app from the play store to test this. I wondered if any developers or knowledgeable people would know if this is a change in the rom causing this, or just a SuperSU incompatibility?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's working for you on 3.2.1.? It stopped working for me on that version just prior to 3.2.2. coming out.
Google made changes sever side to prevent it from working. IT is getting to the point of having to pick. Root or android pay. We all knew this was coming.
Mit Hipster said:
It's working for you on 3.2.1.? It stopped working for me on that version just prior to 3.2.2. coming out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It did momentarily but not for long. might have been a glitch or a slow-rollout on googles part. It's not working now!
zelendel said:
Google made changes sever side to prevent it from working. IT is getting to the point of having to pick. Root or android pay. We all knew this was coming.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah we were waiting. Someone on XDA will find a way round at some point i bet, but we all knew it was coming!
manor7777 said:
Yeah we were waiting. Someone on XDA will find a way round at some point i bet, but we all knew it was coming!
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Click to collapse
If it was done server side there will be no work around. Plus with the new security measures in the linux kernel (XDA portal post) Things like this will be even harder if not impossible.
zelendel said:
If it was done server side there will be no work around. Plus with the new security measures in the linux kernel (XDA portal post) Things like this will be even harder if not impossible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a fair point. Someone made a workaround before that worked for about 6 months through xposed, but to be honest I have twrp so I can flash what I need anyway, no biggie.
manor7777 said:
That's a fair point. Someone made a workaround before that worked for about 6 months through xposed, but to be honest I have twrp so I can flash what I need anyway, no biggie.
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Click to collapse
Yeah that will be the next thing they start looking for. Agreed doesnt really matter to me either. Mobile payments are banned everywhere I go and since I have to legally carry my ID around I also have my cards so even if it wasnt banned I still wouldnt use it.
zelendel said:
Yeah that will be the next thing they start looking for. Agreed doesnt really matter to me either. Mobile payments are banned everywhere I go and since I have to legally carry my ID around I also have my cards so even if it wasnt banned I still wouldnt use it.
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Click to collapse
That's a shame! Where are you based? Its EVERYWHERE in the UK!
manor7777 said:
That's a shame! Where are you based? Its EVERYWHERE in the UK!
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Click to collapse
I am in the US. It is available in most places just not in my town. After it was proven that it could be intercepted and the fact that stores are making their own alt to the pay apps, they decided to just block them.Even my Credit union has removed the chip from their cards due security concerns.
Like I said even if it was I still wouldnt use it. I am smarter then keeping things like my credit card info stored on a device that is always sending data everywhere. Mainly when you think about the fact that keyboards can record every keystroke.
Also I have to keep my ID on me at all times so it is just faster to take my card out and hand it to the cashier.
zelendel said:
I am in the US. It is available in most places just not in my town. After it was proven that it could be intercepted and the fact that stores are making their own alt to the pay apps, they decided to just block them.Even my Credit union has removed the chip from their cards due security concerns.
Like I said even if it was I still wouldnt use it. I am smarter then keeping things like my credit card info stored on a device that is always sending data everywhere. Mainly when you think about the fact that keyboards can record every keystroke.
Also I have to keep my ID on me at all times so it is just faster to take my card out and hand it to the cashier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's only stealable (like with card skimming) whilst the screen is on, at least on a phone. I have a card that I transfer money too whenever I use it (its actually my PayPal card) so I don't have too much of a risk there. They have done a few things like that over here in the UK too but I'm still cautious about it. I have a few measures in place to prevent some of that
manor7777 said:
It's only stealable (like with card skimming) whilst the screen is on, at least on a phone. I have a card that I transfer money too whenever I use it (its actually my PayPal card) so I don't have too much of a risk there. They have done a few things like that over here in the UK too but I'm still cautious about it. I have a few measures in place to prevent some of that
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats all it really takes. When checked they found that the majority of the card readers had some sort of extra device installed on it. Like I said it is not a big deal for me as I wouldn't use it if it was available.
I was using systemless root for a while, it passed system checks just fine. But the funs over now, they've patched it. :/
I have never had so many issues with updating a phone with Magisk before. Today is the 2nd time I lost all my data trying to update. I feel like Magisk isn't worth the hassle anymore. It is frustrating how anti-root google is becoming.
Anyone else share the same opinion?
mkhcb said:
I have never had so many issues with updating a phone with Magisk before. Today is the 2nd time I lost all my data trying to update. I feel like Magisk isn't worth the hassle anymore. It is frustrating how anti-root google is becoming.
Anyone else share the same opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Were you running a custom kernel and you tried to update to March? Did you get the phone is corrupt and it wouldn't boot screen? If that ever happens again, you don't have to wipe, Just go on the Android flashing tool uncheck everything flash and you'll be good to go again. At least it's worked for me every time so far.
mac796 said:
Were you running a custom kernel and you tried to update to March? Did you get the phone is corrupt and it wouldn't boot screen? If that ever happens again, you don't have to wipe, Just go on the Android flashing tool uncheck everything flash and you'll be good to go again. At least it's worked for me every time so far.
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Click to collapse
No custom Kernel, it came to a point where the only screen I was given was Android Recovery screen.
mkhcb said:
No custom Kernel, it came to a point where the only screen I was given was Android Recovery screen.
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Click to collapse
I ended up going to stable magisk
mkhcb said:
I have never had so many issues with updating a phone with Magisk before. Today is the 2nd time I lost all my data trying to update. I feel like Magisk isn't worth the hassle anymore. It is frustrating how anti-root google is becoming.
Anyone else share the same opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I disagree with you...
Coming from the OnePlus 6T, and previous phones you can't really beat just pulling the boot.img from the factory image, patching it with magisk, then fastboot boot that img then install directly in the magisk app. It's actually that simple. Really is that black and white to be up front about it.
That's how I have been doing it for a while now...and...no problems for me! But this IS JUST ME.
mkhcb said:
I have never had so many issues with updating a phone with Magisk before. Today is the 2nd time I lost all my data trying to update. I feel like Magisk isn't worth the hassle anymore. It is frustrating how anti-root google is becoming.
Anyone else share the same opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. It really comes down to reading instructions and knowing what you're supposed to do when it comes to rooting. I can't tell you how many times I read folks spewing instructions that are out of date or they're patching the wrong files for their device that inevitably cause a problem.
I have not had any issues with root since the P6 came out. I have followed directions exactly as they've been written and I've been fine.
mkhcb said:
I have never had so many issues with updating a phone with Magisk before. Today is the 2nd time I lost all my data trying to update. I feel like Magisk isn't worth the hassle anymore. It is frustrating how anti-root google is becoming.
Anyone else share the same opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you update magisk and then faced a bootloop?
That was a bug/is a bug introduced with the latest magisk update (monday), Magisk kind of "lost" the ability to handle a certain amount of modules/certain modules. We are all waiting for a fix. The temporary solution was/is to press down Lower Volume rocker when the Google logo appeared when booting, that way you activate safe mode and all Magisk modules get deactivated. Discord says 4 modules are max right now, some say it's "just" certain audio modules that are incompatible.
I wouldn't say it's become a pain but you really need to "do your homework" and make sure to read before attempting stuff. Same old, same old I'd say.
If you're unsure, just ask. There's plenty of people here who are willing to help out.
I was on regular A12 and tried to update from the app. The device rebooted and didn't appear to be rooted (I know that ryhmed) tried to direct install but got an error, can not remember the error.
Then I decided to update to the A13 DP2 beta and used canary magisk , updating via flashtool and fastboot flashing the patched image and voila! Couldn't be happier.
Seems like people have had some issues lately
I don't know about harder, but maybe more haphazard. February update I did the uninstall magisk method and it worked as described. Did it again for March and this time it took me three tries to get the phone to boot and at that point I lost root. Had to download the image from Google, extract boot, patch it and flash it. Not the end of the world but still no idea what happened.
There was some glitchyness at the beginning with the vbmeta nonsense, but that's all sorted out now. The tools available are so simple to use now that its hard to imagine that anyone could have any trouble with it.
FWIW: for privacy/security reasons, I run GrapheneOS. It would normally do its own update procedures, but when you need root (I need for conducting proper backups since the built-in misses a lot), it freaks out with the unmatched boot.img. The update solution then is to download the full "factory" update package, extract the boot.img, patch it with magisk, edit the "flash-all.sh" script to remove the "-w", run the flash-all.sh, then finally fastboot flash the magisk-patched boot.img.
Ghisy said:
I wouldn't say it's become a pain but you really need to "do your homework" and make sure to read before attempting stuff. Same old, same old I'd say.
If you're unsure, just ask. There's plenty of people here who are willing to help out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^This 100%
mkhcb said:
I have never had so many issues with updating a phone with Magisk before. Today is the 2nd time I lost all my data trying to update. I feel like Magisk isn't worth the hassle anymore. It is frustrating how anti-root google is becoming.
Anyone else share the same opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While there are many ways to skin this cat, I follow the step by step instructions in my sig every update, and haven't had an issue yet.
I will admit that rooting is loosing it's allure for me as it seems cust Rom development on the phones I prefer is waning (remember the day when every device had a dozen cust Roms to choose from). That coupled with I'm no longer the guy who tries to squeeze an extra 30 min of battery life, who over/underclocked cpu's and gpu's to get a 100 pt higher benchmark score.
Root is something I still do because I like having the OPTION of customizing beyond a cust kernel and some "root required" apps, and jumping through a few hoops to make magisk work is worth it IMHO.
Az Biker said:
Root is something I still do because I like having the OPTION of customizing beyond a cust kernel and some "root required" apps, and jumping through a few hoops to make magisk work is worth it IMHO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This 100% as well!!
The stock Google ROM is perfectly fine with some tweaks!
96carboard said:
There was some glitchyness at the beginning with the vbmeta nonsense, but that's all sorted out now. The tools available are so simple to use now that its hard to imagine that anyone could have any trouble with it.
FWIW: for privacy/security reasons, I run GrapheneOS. It would normally do its own update procedures, but when you need root (I need for conducting proper backups since the built-in misses a lot), it freaks out with the unmatched boot.img. The update solution then is to download the full "factory" update package, extract the boot.img, patch it with magisk, edit the "flash-all.sh" script to remove the "-w", run the flash-all.sh, then finally fastboot flash the magisk-patched boot.img.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Root renders half of the purpose of grapheneos moot though... It's "security hardened". Hand a rooted "security hardened" android phone to anyone who can watch a YouTube video and has a computer that has a USB port or wifi and they could be dumping your system files in in a matter of minutes.
What sort of privacy do you imagine you gain? Are you under the assumption that Googleplayservices is the only method by which your traffic can be singled out of the background internet swarms? Hopefully you're not replying on it to not be physically tracked. Or worse, trust it to go dark and do dirt with.
I'm asking because because I generally don't understand the motivations of users such as yourself. Using a flagship device, attempting to de-google/brand it, and then openly say it's for X privacy or X security usecase. It's simply not true. To me it's like someone buying a Porsche, throwing Ford stickers on it's and saying it's because they get better traction.
erktheerk said:
Root renders half of the purpose of grapheneos moot though... It's "security hardened". Hand a rooted "security hardened" android phone to anyone who can watch a YouTube video and has a computer that has a USB port or wifi and they could be dumping your system files in in a matter of minutes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe in the hands of an incompetent, but no, you can't just "walk in". Said compromising individual would have to somehow unlock the device in order to authorize the USB debugging session or whatever type of compromise they're attempting.
erktheerk said:
What sort of privacy do you imagine you gain? Are you under the assumption that Googleplayservices is the only method by which your traffic can be singled out of the background internet swarms? Hopefully you're not replying on it to not be physically tracked. Or worse, trust it to go dark and do dirt with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are mistaking absolute security for mitigating known and easy to close holes. Bad mistake, which will always make you look like a fool.
erktheerk said:
I'm asking because because I generally don't understand the motivations of users such as yourself. Using a flagship device, attempting to de-google/brand it, and then openly say it's for X privacy or X security usecase. It's simply not true. To me it's like someone buying a Porsche, throwing Ford stickers on it's and saying it's because they get better traction.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While root control of a device can provide a high degree of access to a system, it only does so in the hands of an incompetent. Every single server running connected with the public internet has a root account. If it was so terrifyingly and absolutely dangerous, it would be pretty obvious. But the reality is that those systems are administered, in large part, by competent system administrators, who know how to safely make use of the increased access without guaranteeing that some hostile entity will walk in and take control.
Conversely, consumer electronics are assumed to be placed in the hands of nitwits who will install applications that promise to deliver jiggling lady parts that are published in hostile countries, and even worse, will hit the "ok" button when a root authorization prompt pops up. Yes, consumers, by and large, are a security DISASTER waiting to happen.
So don't you dare make the claim that root access is a violation of sane security measures. There is nothing wrong with root, as long as it is used responsibly by someone competent to make use of it.
No, you misunderstand me. I've been rooting android since day one. Literally. Rooted by Dream/G1 running Cupcake with telnet on release day in 2008. I have 3 Pixel in front of me right now. One with CalyxOS, and one with Graphene. Those are for a paying customer who values their privacy, and not walking around with a crippled 'hardened device". So no root. The other is by test device I really want to Kali running on at some point.
I'll just let the lead dev/owner of GrapheneOS say the rest, I'm not debating what you want/like, I only elaborated on you want it sounds like to others.
96carboard said:
Maybe in the hands of an incompetent, but no, you can't just "walk in". Said compromising individual would have to somehow unlock the device in order to authorize the USB debugging session or whatever type of compromise they're attempting.
You are mistaking absolute security for mitigating known and easy to close holes. Bad mistake, which will always make you look like a fool.
While root control of a device can provide a high degree of access to a system, it only does so in the hands of an incompetent. Every single server running connected with the public internet has a root account. If it was so terrifyingly and absolutely dangerous, it would be pretty obvious. But the reality is that those systems are administered, in large part, by competent system administrators, who know how to safely make use of the increased access without guaranteeing that some hostile entity will walk in and take control.
Conversely, consumer electronics are assumed to be placed in the hands of nitwits who will install applications that promise to deliver jiggling lady parts that are published in hostile countries, and even worse, will hit the "ok" button when a root authorization prompt pops up. Yes, consumers, by and large, are a security DISASTER waiting to happen.
So don't you dare make the claim that root access is a violation of sane security measures. There is nothing wrong with root, as long as it is used responsibly by someone competent to make use of it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, you misunderstand me. I've been rooting android since day one. Literally. Rooted by Dream/G1 running Cupcake with telnet on release day in 2008. I have 3 Pixel in front of me right now. One with CalyxOS, and one with Graphene. Those are for a paying customer who values their privacy, and not walking around with a crippled 'hardened device". So no root. The other is by test device I really want to Kali running on at some point.
I'll just let the lead dev/owner of GrapheneOS say the rest, I'm not debating what you want/like, I only elaborated on you want it sounds like to others.
erktheerk said:
No, you misunderstand me. I've been rooting android since day one. Literally. Rooted by Dream/G1 running Cupcake with telnet on release day in 2008. I have 3 Pixel in front of me right now. One with CalyxOS, and one with Graphene. Those are for a paying customer who values their privacy, and not walking around with a crippled 'hardened device". So no root. The other is by test device I really want to Kali running on at some point.
I'll just let the lead dev/owner of GrapheneOS say the rest, I'm not debating what you want/like, I only elaborated on you want it sounds like to others.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's nothing "crippled" about it. Its just AOSP with some hardening.
Yeah briefly looking at that link, their explanations are irrelevant. The bottom line is that they don't want morons who don't know what they're doing modifying the crap out of it, and either (a) having to be supported, or failing that (b) making the project look bad.
Nothing about it makes it "less customizable" than any other AOSP. Magisk/root or anything else installs on it and works just like it does on any other AOSP distribution. It just doesn't have all the broken junk thrown in willy nilly without taking a careful look at the implementation first, i.e., is it actually a *useful* feature, and can it be implemented in a secure manner? As a clear example, take a look at the call recording feature request; https://github.com/GrapheneOS/os-issue-tracker/issues/868 -- clearly a useful feature. The "lineageos" implementation has been brought forward, not as something to pull straight in, but as a point of study and/or somewhere to start building a good implementation -- their implementation is unsatisfactory in terms of security and maintainability.
Rooting this device is so easy compared to attempting to root a z fold 3 or any other recent Samsung flagship