Hello everyone! I just registered on the forum, but I'm following it for a while. In fact I just bought a galaxy s, switched from an iphone 3g in fact, and I'm loving it!
Before buying the phone, I read all the info available about it, and I was really preoccupied about the whole gps issues posts...I use the gps quite a lot, and I really couldn't stand a 500€ phone with no working gps. But in the end I bought it, thinking "well, if it is so bad I could always keep my iphone and use it as a navigator".
Now I tried the navigator two times already, on a 40km route, from my house to the city and back, the former with the navigon software and the latter with the google navigator. I must say that my navigator was ALWAYS SPOT ON. And I mean it, every street I crossed was exactly at the point it is supposed to be, and turn indications were very precise, in fact even more precise than the iphone gps with tomtom, which I loved!
My galaxy s was bought in Italy, and is running firmware 2.1-update1, baseband I9000XXJF5, kernel 2.6.29 root(at)SE-S602 #2, build number ECLAIR.XWJFD. I configured it to use both the gps and the wireless network in home settings.
I just wanted to share my experience because maybe there are other people like me out there who are thinking twice about buying the phone because of the reported gps problems...
Now...could it be that the supposed gps issues were an hardware problem, which has been fixed in a more recent batch production?
I havent had any issues with my SGS aswell, works great (JM2 firmware), maybe its a different version of SGS...
Navigation software like Navigon, CoPilot etc always try to place you on the nearest road, and hence they work fine even though the GPS isn't spot on.
Try using MyTracks, SportyPal or iMapMyRun to track a route and you can clearly see that the GPS is struggling with keeping an accurate fix.
I've used my SGS with CoPilot and it guided me perfectly around northern europe, but tracking my cycling or running is not an option as it is now.
Would be interested in seeing you track a drive/bike ride/run with one of these apps to see if it works as it should.
I have to agree with you on this. I never experÃenced ANY problem with the GPS. And I use it ALOT!
And here we go again.
The problem is indeed with the GPS having trouble to keep an accurate fix (so not obtaining it fast enough) and in most 'road navigation' software, or the likes, you won't experience this behavior since they: pin you to the road, smooth your path, or perform any other optimizations after they've received the position from the GPS driver/interface.
If you indeed use a program like MyTracks, SportyPal, RunGPS, etc then you will see you're 'jumping' around quite a lot. This is caused by:
1) The GPS LOCKS to 8 satellites Max
2) It drops any satellite with a SNR less than 22
this can be tested by using a program like GPS Test. This holds true for ALL Galaxy phones out there. Not every one is experiencing these problems since:
1) They use a program that pins the user to roads or does some other modification
2) They are lucky to be in a relative clear field so enough satellites with a SNR above 22 are available
3) They simply think those few deviations are not a problem
It is very most likely an issue with the GPS driver which can be fixed by Samsung.
scrappy.doo said:
And here we go again.
The problem is indeed with the GPS having trouble to keep an accurate fix (so not obtaining it fast enough) and in most 'road navigation' software, or the likes, you won't experience this behavior since they: pin you to the road, smooth your path, or perform any other optimizations after they've received the position from the GPS driver/interface.
If you indeed use a program like MyTracks, SportyPal, RunGPS, etc then you will see you're 'jumping' around quite a lot. This is caused by:
1) The GPS LOCKS to 8 satellites Max
2) It drops any satellite with a SNR less than 22
this can be tested by using a program like GPS Test. This holds true for ALL Galaxy phones out there. Not every one is experiencing these problems since:
1) They use a program that pins the user to roads or does some other modification
2) They are lucky to be in a relative clear field so enough satellites with a SNR above 22 are available
3) They simply think those few deviations are not a problem
It is very most likely an issue with the GPS driver which can be fixed by Samsung.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
or they have another batch, or they do not have lots of programs running or they have that magic touch or they control memory in a better way or using another firmware........
My GPS has been accurate both walking in the forest driving the car .... and yes I know the differences between the softwares internal handling of the fixes. I still think that some people has the error and others have not. Of course I can get errors if I want to, by loading a lot of programs, keeping it very hidden inside the car etc. Due to something, different users get different results and I do not know which is in majority. Maybe all but a few got a faulty phone or the reverse. Just do not get to the assumption that everybody that has a good GPS are some amateurs and do not know anything about GPS.
My Galaxy S regularly has locks on sats that have SNR's lower than 22.
scrappy.doo said:
And here we go again.
The problem is indeed with the GPS having trouble to keep an accurate fix (so not obtaining it fast enough) and in most 'road navigation' software, or the likes, you won't experience this behavior since they: pin you to the road, smooth your path, or perform any other optimizations after they've received the position from the GPS driver/interface.
If you indeed use a program like MyTracks, SportyPal, RunGPS, etc then you will see you're 'jumping' around quite a lot. This is caused by:
1) The GPS LOCKS to 8 satellites Max
2) It drops any satellite with a SNR less than 22
this can be tested by using a program like GPS Test. This holds true for ALL Galaxy phones out there. Not every one is experiencing these problems since:
1) They use a program that pins the user to roads or does some other modification
2) They are lucky to be in a relative clear field so enough satellites with a SNR above 22 are available
3) They simply think those few deviations are not a problem
It is very most likely an issue with the GPS driver which can be fixed by Samsung.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have found that the internal driver that spits out the NMEA can get locks to more than 8 satellites < 20 SnR, but when presented to the Android API, Samsung only announce upto 8 satellites > 20 SnR.
Unfortunatly the NMEA locations are just as wayward as the MyTracks information, so we can't blame the apps.
I too agree that this problem is across all phones, whether the user is fortunate to experience the issue or not. You just have to have the right/wrong conditions, and even then the system is intermittent.
I have had two Galaxy S phones now. The second isn't as bad as the first. But I know there is a large section of people who state that their GPS is perfect who then fire up MyTracks and go back on what they say.
milsjg said:
or they have another batch, or they do not have lots of programs running or they have that magic touch or they control memory in a better way or using another firmware........
My GPS has been accurate both walking in the forest driving the car .... and yes I know the differences between the softwares internal handling of the fixes. I still think that some people has the error and others have not. Of course I can get errors if I want to, by loading a lot of programs, keeping it very hidden inside the car etc. Due to something, different users get different results and I do not know which is in majority. Maybe all but a few got a faulty phone or the reverse. Just do not get to the assumption that everybody that has a good GPS are some amateurs and do not know anything about GPS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How long have you had your Galaxy S milsjg? How long have you been testing the GPS? What firmware version are you running? Have you applied any lag fixes? What software do you use to test the tracking?
I would be keen to point out, just because you don't experience errors, do not assume your phone does not have the error.
Certainly at minimum, your phone will have the software bug where accuracy is misreported, locks on satelltes < 20SnR, or locks on more than 8 satellites are reported.
heygrl said:
My Galaxy S regularly has locks on sats that have SNR's lower than 22.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think 22 is the wrong SnR. It's actually < 21, but lets say 20 to be on the safe side.
If you do have lots of locks, please post a picture of GPS Test output showing a lock on more than 8 satellites. As far as Im aware, no one ever has seen this on GPS Test under Samsung Galaxy S, and when pressed about the matter, they confess that they see more than 8, but only get a fix on upto 8.
Remember a fix is a bar in GPS test that isn't grey.
sjdean said:
I have had two Galaxy S phones now. The second isn't as bad as the first. But I know there is a large section of people who state that their GPS is perfect who then fire up MyTracks and go back on what they say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But there are also people who do use MyTracks that does not have problems with the GPS.
I have posted an example when I recorded with GPSCompassMap (which like MyTracks will not snap to roads):
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=e...9.033224,15.057449&spn=0.076491,0.147629&z=13
That is typical performance for me, and I have been walking and driving with MyTrack, GPSCompassMap and Co-Pilot without issues.
Obviously, judging by most disussions on the subject I seem to be in a minority, so it still seems to be a major issue with the phone that needs to be fixed.
But something seems to be at play that means that some users find the GPS unusable, while for others it is fine.
That's not terrible at all.
I also wanted to note that the GPS really seems to be biploar. I think this is just a huge issue with Samsung's poor firmware/software/coding/whatever. There is no reason why it shouldn't work right, the chip is featured in many other phones and it's not from some second rate manufacture. The phone has no problems seeing sats with good enough SNR's.. etc.
PsiIion said:
But there are also people who do use MyTracks that does not have problems with the GPS.
I have posted an example when I recorded with GPSCompassMap (which like MyTracks will not snap to roads):
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=e...9.033224,15.057449&spn=0.076491,0.147629&z=13
That is typical performance for me, and I have been walking and driving with MyTrack, GPSCompassMap and Co-Pilot without issues.
Obviously, judging by most disussions on the subject I seem to be in a minority, so it still seems to be a major issue with the phone that needs to be fixed.
But something seems to be at play that means that some users find the GPS unusable, while for others it is fine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like suggested earlier if your Galaxy's GPS performs perfectly 100% ok to you then please: "post a picture of GPS Test output showing a lock on more than 8 satellites."
Judging the track you drove you where clearly in the open field so the GPS should perform ok. The conditions are very optimal. Despite the conditions being good you see some deviation at the beginning of your track (when you seem to be just marginally surrounded by some trees/forest).
Hell I can show you plenty of screenshots that will show my Vibrant locked on sats that have SNR's well under 22 which seems to be some type of "thing" that the Vibrant doesn't do which is a fabrication for me. I often have locks below 22SNR.
heygrl said:
Hell I can show you plenty of screenshots that will show my Vibrant locked on sats that have SNR's well under 22 which seems to be some type of "thing" that the Vibrant doesn't do which is a fabrication for me. I often have locks below 22SNR.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but i do bet that you dont have a lock under 20SNR!
scrappy.doo said:
Like suggested earlier if your Galaxy's GPS performs perfectly 100% ok to you then please: "post a picture of GPS Test output showing a lock on more than 8 satellites."
Judging the track you drove you where clearly in the open field so the GPS should perform ok. The conditions are very optimal. Despite the conditions being good you see some deviation at the beginning of your track (when you seem to be just marginally surrounded by some trees/forest).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I never locked to more than eight satellites, but why do I need to do that as long at it the precision is fine?
GPSCompassMap shows the number of sats you are connected to, and while recording that track it was locking to eight almost constantly, only occasionally dipping down to six or seven.
There is a lot of trees and forest along the road, but not really obstructing the view of the sky.
I basically turned on the GPS and app and started driving, and the starting point was not obstructed. But of course it takes a few seconds to get a proper lock.
Like I said, I have used the GPS a lot in various conditions without problems. It does't seem like the ones having problems are only trying it indoors or in canyons, so I don't think the difference is about the conditions.
Well to answer the questions that Sdjean asked: I have had the phone for one and a half month. I am using I9000XWJM2 with Samset 1,7 (I have not had any serious problem with any firmware regarding the GPS but have had some lag issues). I have used CardioTrainer, My Track as tracking software, Navigon for navigation and Gmaps for, well I don,t know. I have had a mobile from 1989 and GPS from ca 2000. I have had GPS enabled phones and handhelds for the last 6 years and also owned some external GPSs. I have worked with tracking for at least 8 years, so do not think that people that do not complain about Samsung GPS is amateurs.
IMHO handhelds without any corrections (WAAS, ERGOS, DGPS etc) will get a fix within 5- 15 meters (sd 95). If you want a fix better than that, you have to apply some correction.
This talk about more than 8 fixes is not important. If you have 8 fixes the ninth will not improve the total location fix very much, specially if it has crappy s/n. Other phones may use another statistically way of calculating the fix using bad fixes and get down to an accuracy of 5,6 feet (which I do think is highly improbable if you do not use corrections). If they use low quality fixes they may only mess things up.
However, I agree that the jumping of the GPS fix is not tolerable so if you have that issue Samsung most help you. But if you complain about the accuracy being 5 to 10 meters. Search Google and read about how the GPS works and what you can do to correct it.
Definitely, I agree. An accuracy of 5m to 10m would be ideal, unfortunately while my phone does achieve that on many occasions, the signal is too sporadic.
I can turn a corner and get a signal loss and show as going round a loop, or carrying on in a straight line until the GPS catches up. I can go under a bridge and the GPS will think Im walking off to the right, or left when Im going straight.
I know XWJM2 seems to dampen the path a little. That I think is in XXJP3 firmware as "Use Sensor Aiding", but unfortunately this is a bodge that doesn't fix the jittery signal.
At times, my GPS can be flawless. I'll get a lock onto 8 satellites, stable with no problems. I'll get a flawless track. But the rest of the time, I'll lose lock at random moments and struggle to gain even three satellites.
Then there are the times I'll be out walking and the because I turn corner, despite having a ten metre accuracy and the compass pointing in the right direction, the GPS thinks Im moving sideways and plots a sideways path. It thinks Im a crab.
I would concur, 8 satellites should be enough, but we do know that more satellites can help in urban canyons when you're likely to lose 5 behind a tall building. The problem is further compounded when your GPS struggles to maintain lock. Some of us do actually need those extra satellites on the GPS, and we do need the system to lock onto <20 SnR Satellites.
Just to ask this one more time in case it was missed milsjg, are you running any lag fixes?
Thanks
Simon
What is this nonsense about the phone not allowing a lock on sats with SNR's below 20?
I regularly get 5-10 meters in my car. NEVER any higher.
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sjdean said:
Definitely, I agree. An accuracy of 5m to 10m would be ideal, unfortunately while my phone does achieve that on many occasions, the signal is too sporadic.
I can turn a corner and get a signal loss and show as going round a loop, or carrying on in a straight line until the GPS catches up. I can go under a bridge and the GPS will think Im walking off to the right, or left when Im going straight.
I know XWJM2 seems to dampen the path a little. That I think is in XXJP3 firmware as "Use Sensor Aiding", but unfortunately this is a bodge that doesn't fix the jittery signal.
At times, my GPS can be flawless. I'll get a lock onto 8 satellites, stable with no problems. I'll get a flawless track. But the rest of the time, I'll lose lock at random moments and struggle to gain even three satellites.
Then there are the times I'll be out walking and the because I turn corner, despite having a ten metre accuracy and the compass pointing in the right direction, the GPS thinks Im moving sideways and plots a sideways path. It thinks Im a crab.
I would concur, 8 satellites should be enough, but we do know that more satellites can help in urban canyons when you're likely to lose 5 behind a tall building. The problem is further compounded when your GPS struggles to maintain lock. Some of us do actually need those extra satellites on the GPS, and we do need the system to lock onto <20 SnR Satellites.
Just to ask this one more time in case it was missed milsjg, are you running any lag fixes?
Thanks
Simon
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No lag fixes except the Samset 1,7 that may do something to run it smoother (I really do not know). I hope that Samsung can resolve this jumping fix and bad reception problems Even if it is a problem that not seems to occur in every phone (or setup) they are obliged to customers to fix the problem. I appreciate your work to get a deeper view in to the GPS problem. So as long as you are interested keep on doing your good work but remember it is Samsung that are obliged to get the solution.
heygrl said:
What is this nonsense about the phone not allowing a lock on sats with SNR's below 20?
I regularly get 5-10 meters in my car. NEVER any higher.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This seems very strange from my perspective if this is a normal view. I hope that this is the startup of the GPS in GPS test otherwise it should lock on to the satellites with higher S/N. I do not have any GPS problems just for the record. What firmware are you using?
igniztion said:
Try using MyTracks, SportyPal or iMapMyRun to track a route and you can clearly see that the GPS is struggling with keeping an accurate fix.
Would be interested in seeing you track a drive/bike ride/run with one of these apps to see if it works as it should.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
just for the record, windows mobile devices like my old HTC Athena, had even worse GPS tracking, and took forever to pick up satellites using any GPS software
so the SGS GPS is amazing in comparison, it picks up in less than a minute vs. like 5+ min on the HTC Athena
Even if I put the phone on the level surface, the compass is very unstable, value changes very quickly. This is very annoying using streets view (compass mode) in Google Maps or Google Sky Map - if the phone is horizontally, the map rotates both directions very fast. Any fix for this?
I'd think that the sensitivity is set too high, I don't think this is something you can change from within Google Maps.
Have you tried downloading a compass app from the Market and seeing if the results are them same? Most apps will have some settings you can change to see where the problem lies.
Yes, I've tried... Same problem in Ulysse Gizmos - pitch and roll are very unstable
Just downloaded that app, the compass works fine, but my pitch and roll are way off. Not quite fluctuating wildly, but very inaccurate.
Have you tried calibrating the compass by waving it in a figure of 8 horizontally.
Of course I did but is the same
I have exactly the same. But annoyingly I also have that it places me consistently 10 to 40 meters off.......
Really annoying! If anyone has a solution please let me know!
Is there anyone who use defy GPS daily? Can you share which rom or any GPS tweak to make defy more accurate and responsive for navigation?
I have been testing defy GPS, it seems like its rather not accurate to pinpoint location. Accuracy show 4-9m, but often real position is off by 30-200m. For navigation, it's response time rather slow plus the inaccuracy makes it not reliable. My old windows mobile P3600 gives precise position when put beside defy while navigating.
For info, I have disable wifi in location setting. I know I have successfully download supl data. With data enabled, I can lock under 10 sec.
This inaccuracy had been a problem for CM7. I have tested stock froyo and gingerbread, and problem still there.
So, can anyone help here? Do you have the same problem, if not please share your rom version or tweak..
I've used mine a lot for gps, i just make sure to download agps data with an app called GPS test as soon as i can, then if i'm not moving too much from where i stopped gps for the last time it takes very little to lock.
I'm on CM7 and it never disappointed me in Italy, Germany, Netherlands, Belgium and France.
Any GPS fix i've tried did nothing good for me.
My defy lock fast. What bothers me is the accuracy.
Google maps shows accuracy 4-9m, but real position is off sometimes by 200m.
Sometimes it correct itself, other time, even if I waited for a few minutes, it didn't show my real position.
And I'm sure I disable Use Wireless Networks in location setting.
So how is your accuracy?
Relly good, thanks
Seriously, i've seen this mentioned quite often in the CM7 thread, but it never happened to me.
As said before, keeping agps data pretty updated to my position or close enough has always been enough for me.
Good luck in finding a solution that works for you!
GPS has been working perfectly for me under any Rom. Stock GB, CM7 and Stock Froyo.
In CM7 it locks pretty fast, always under 10 secs, after a few secs accuracy down to 3m. Works really good.
I only have GPS Status to download from time to time accurate AGPS data and that's all.
Thanks for the reply..
I have tried almost everything.
Tuning gpsconfig.xml and location.cfg, clear agps cache, restart before testing many value one by one. Tried many stock rom, take GPS files from milestone and milestone2 and the GPS still inconsistent.
Sometimes its accurate, but after turn off GPS for a few second, turn on again, its showing wrong position with accuracy shown as 4-9m, waited for some minutes, and still wrong. Sometimes its accurate for a few test, but after a few minutes, turn on GPS again, its showing wrong position again.
Tried also calibrate compass, even remove the compass driver, but still error.
There is a possibility of multipath error in GPS (bouncing signal from surrounding), but with easily lock to 5-6 satellites with 10-12 satellites in view, I suppose this can nullify error, as real for positioning, we only needed 4 satellites.
I hope there is someone out there know fix for this..
use this fix: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=953630
Maybe it helps
pravarth said:
use this fix: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=953630
Maybe it helps
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Already tried.. even tested various value in gps.conf. No good..
Thanks.
bobo9900 said:
Is there anyone who use defy GPS daily? Can you share which rom or any GPS tweak to make defy more accurate and responsive for navigation?
I have been testing defy GPS, it seems like its rather not accurate to pinpoint location. Accuracy show 4-9m, but often real position is off by 30-200m. For navigation, it's response time rather slow plus the inaccuracy makes it not reliable. My old windows mobile P3600 gives precise position when put beside defy while navigating.
For info, I have disable wifi in location setting. I know I have successfully download supl data. With data enabled, I can lock under 10 sec.
This inaccuracy had been a problem for CM7. I have tested stock froyo and gingerbread, and problem still there.
So, can anyone help here? Do you have the same problem, if not please share your rom version or tweak..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MIUI rom allows you to enter your preferred satellite under ph settings ^^
Then use gps status app to manage a-gps state - I get anywhere from 10 - 30m accuracy
You are not alone
GPS accuracy on my Defy has been a concern since I bought it. Just like yours, it locks to 4-6 satellites and claims that it's accurate to 4 meters, but my real position is usually a block away. Other symthoms are:
- Accuracy improves with speed and becomes very good when traveling by car, very poor when still or just walking. The correlation between accuracy and speed should be the other way around...
- If there are more than 6 satellites in view, it locks to a maximum of six and then starts "jumping" from one set of satellites to another each two seconds or so. It does so even if the telephone is completely still. I think It should stay with the same satellites while not moving.
As you, I also tried all and every GPS fix script under the sun to no good, even filled a bug report for CM7 back in the day with no luck. It seems that a lot of people out there have perfectly working GPS (o so it seems).
This issue is quite strange though. I have a green lens Defy, and my wife has a Red lens one. We bought them several months apart and they both have the same accuracy issue, so it doesn't seem to be related to a bad production batch. I wonder if its related to geographic position (maybe it works worse in some countries, somehow)
Hopefully its a software issue and can be fixed.
I dont have this issue. Ive actually been sort of surprised at the accuracy of the GPS with CM7... it locks on within seconds (vs the minutes with Froyo). Almost instantaneous with WIFI and GPS on. And it is always accurate. Sorry to hear about your GPS troubles. It could be a hardware problem also?
Is there any app (besides the GPS) that uses the built-in barometer in the Gnexus?
Is there even a reason to have an app use the barometer?
Just curious.
JJHunterx said:
Is there any app (besides the GPS) that uses the built-in barometer in the Gnexus?
Is there even a reason to have an app use the barometer?
Just curious.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would assume any app that uses it will be GPS based, as it's used for locking on to GPS co-ords quicker. PressureNET is the only app, besides Google Maps, like you say, that I know that uses it.
An altimeter for instance could use the barometer. And of course a local weather forecast. I suppose that developers will use the readings to code some new apps in the future.
edit : this app use the GN barometer
https://market.android.com/details?...yLDEsImNvbS5ndWlsZHNvZnR3YXJlLmJhcm9tZXRlciJd
I believe that the strava app (for logging bikerides) uses the barometer.
https://market.android.com/details?..._result#?t=W251bGwsMSwyLDEsImNvbS5zdHJhdmEiXQ
The altitude information is much better than in the iPhone app.
Using the built-in barometer doesn't necessarily give you increased precision in a single position measurement, but it can radically reduce the noise in the z-component of multiple readings.
I use this one: https://market.android.com/details?id=org.ssandon.altimeter
But i noticed that the barometer and GPS elevation varied by about 400 feet. Has anyone noticed this? or is it just me?
I realize that i can calibrate the app, but will that effect my gps locking abilities?
Thanks
extremx said:
I use this one: https://market.android.com/details?id=org.ssandon.altimeter
But i noticed that the barometer and GPS elevation varied by about 400 feet. Has anyone noticed this? or is it just me?
I realize that i can calibrate the app, but will that effect my gps locking abilities?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not familiar with that barometer, but knowing the basics of how GPS and altimeters work I can say that you have to calibrate the app for the readings to be of any use.
A barometer is very good at detecting changes in altitude but sucks at absolute numbers. A GPS on the other hand is awful when it comes to quick changes, but the long-term average is normally pretty good. What you should do is to calibrate the barometer app to a known altitude (if you're trecking in the Alps it's recommended to do this at least once a day). Either use a map, or let the GPS sit and average for a while.
WeatherMappr
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.staircase3.openweather
Crowdsourcing pressure maps. Quite fascinating, actually.