Related
Yeah, we should call WP7 that way
Windows iPhone 7 Series
I don't know, I started to like WP7, very excited with the platform, hubs, games, etc.
But more and more becoming super limited phone which you are FORCED to use your phone the way Microsoft want it to use.
And that's not good. At some degree I am OK with some limitations, but more and more now ...
No multitasking
No sd-card
No customization (come on, only 4 accent colors?)
No side-loading
No file manager
No copy paste?
I could OK if they said "We dont implement copy paste because we dont have much time to finish it, we will add it later".
But in fact no, Microsoft is dictating that you dont need copy paste:
"We don't enable copy and paste and we do that very intentionally," Windows Phone executive Todd Brix said in an interview.
Brix said many times when a user copies something on a phone, what they really are looking to do is take a specific action, such as calling a phone number or e-mailing an address. For those specific tasks, Microsoft has what it calls "smart linking," which lets a user double click on a phone number and either call it or add it to the phone book. For an address, one can get a map without having to copy and paste the address.
"It's actually an intentional design decision," he said. "We try to anticipate what the user wants so copy and paste isn't necessary."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is bad ... really bad
Windows Phone 7 Series is becoming similar (or worse) to iPhone ...
So, yeah ... Welcome "Microsoft iPhone 7 Series" ... This name/term is to remind Microsoft Windows Phone team that we really disappointed with Windows Phone 7 Series.
Microsoft still have several months to fix this, if they did, we can remove the "i"
Simply - just stay with WM6.5.5 and customize what you want WP7 is crap, why you need it, while here is a lot software for 6.5 and you can change everything, where is the point?
They are just trying to hide the mess that has accumulated over the years, and at the same time lock down the platform to make it a money machine. Two birds, one stone.
The more news I hear about WP7 the more I realize that I am not a PC, nor a Mac... I am an Android.
I don't know what's the problem with copy & paste missing. If they have a smarter way to do it then why not!? to be honest I never felt very comfortable using it. besides, it's also a funny step-up towards Apple. I mean copy & paste was always possible in WM, it was just a standard feature, like you also have a close button on a window. Then Apple came and added it to their iphone and do TV ads for it(!!!!!) and then MS come along again "Listen guys you don't need this old **** anymore we now have a really better way"
As for the other points of course I fully agree and it's horrible!!!
Well, you are correct.
I admit that I dont use copy & paste quite a lot, but I used it several times (copy pasting some texts from web browser to the email, or to notes to save it later).
I will not discuss or debate how do we use copy paste, because it is very obvious and talked to death on the old iPhone OS saga.
The thing that I don't like with the WP7S approach is that Microsoft really dictate and force how to use the phone even on that simple task (copy paste).
Copy paste is old feature, we are get used to it, especially WE, the Windows Mobile users.
I simply cannot believe this, why not just give the feature, that's not hard to implement.
Sure, they have super duper clever way to detect address / phone number.
But I doubt it, which format of address and phone numbers? Can it detect partial address? part of phone numbers? etc. etc.
RAMMANN said:
I don't know what's the problem with copy & paste missing. If they have a smarter way to do it then why not!? to be honest I never felt very comfortable using it. besides, it's also a funny step-up towards Apple. I mean copy & paste was always possible in WM, it was just a standard feature, like you also have a close button on a window. Then Apple came and added it to their iphone and do TV ads for it(!!!!!) and then MS come along again "Listen guys you don't need this old **** anymore we now have a really better way"
As for the other points of course I fully agree and it's horrible!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RAMMANN said:
I don't know what's the problem with copy & paste missing. If they have a smarter way to do it then why not!?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What are you talking about? How should adding a contact to a phonebook with a doubleclick replace cut/copy/paste?
RAMMANN said:
I don't know what's the problem with copy & paste missing. If they have a smarter way to do it then why not!?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because they don't have that smarter way. First of all, there are applications where copy/paste is already smart, like editing documents or lengthy emails. Second, there's the problem of carrying data between applications. Here I agree, copy/paste is a plug for lack of a smarter way, and in many cases this can be replaced. The problem though is that there's no way you can foresee all the use cases, as sometimes they are very unexpected. Just to real life examples I personally encountered. I'm driving in the middle of nowhere, and I know that somebody sent me a URL with directions in an email. Now what happens if that URL isn't clickable, and the "smart way" doesn't work? It could be a typo or a software glitch. Or, I once received a Wi-Fi access code that was something like E[ybabufct,tfrctccgjqyn. How in the world am I going to enter it without copy/paste? Also, those "smart" ways like detecting phone numbers or URLs will work in standard apps, but what about third-party apps? And finally, OK, you detect phone numbers. But what if I need to remember some code that's a set of digits? For example, someone sends me an access code to an apartment complex in an SMS and I want to add it to Contact notes? You get the idea I think. True, such things don't happen every day. But when they do happen lack of such features is incredibly annoying.
RAMMANN said:
As for the other points of course I fully agree and it's horrible!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, the other problems are not as acute (apart from removable storage). To solve the multitasking and file access and even sideloading restrictions all you need is a nice little privilege escalation hack. Copy/paste is more difficult because you need proper selection UI, and a way to take care of long tap context menus in apps - you can't just intercept all taps and replace whatever action there is with copy/paste menu.
"We don't enable copy and paste and we do that very intentionally," Windows Phone executive Todd Brix said in an interview.
Brix said many times when a user copies something on a phone, what they really are looking to do is take a specific action, such as calling a phone number or e-mailing an address. For those specific tasks, Microsoft has what it calls "smart linking," which lets a user double click on a phone number and either call it or add it to the phone book. For an address, one can get a map without having to copy and paste the address.
"It's actually an intentional design decision," he said. "We try to anticipate what the user wants so copy and paste isn't necessary."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, i want to see Todd when he have to put in a 60number wpa2 key for 3 different wireless networks.......can someone please get android to work on the hd2 ????
RAMMANN said:
I don't know what's the problem with copy & paste missing. If they have a smarter way to do it then why not!? to be honest I never felt very comfortable using it. besides, it's also a funny step-up towards Apple. I mean copy & paste was always possible in WM, it was just a standard feature, like you also have a close button on a window. Then Apple came and added it to their iphone and do TV ads for it(!!!!!) and then MS come along again "Listen guys you don't need this old **** anymore we now have a really better way"
As for the other points of course I fully agree and it's horrible!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i dont use copy & paste but there is absolutely no reason to leave it out, yeah they found a smarter way to do certain things but that way doesnt cover all scenarios, if u get wp7(i plan too) the first time u need copy & paste its prolly gonna piss u off that they left out such a basic feature i know i will im already preparing my woosas for that moment
Back in the days of MS-DOS there were several applications that had [relatively] hi-res displays. Both iPhone and now Windows Phone 7 seem like a reversion to those days. Thanks to the "lowest common denominator" approach, technology has stepped backwards 15 years!!
I dont use copy and paste much either but im sure lots of people do,
So leaving it out would be bad news and limiting the users. im sure wm7 will have copy and paste but its maybe called something different?, for moving into the future.lets face it copy and paste is an old term and even apple has that now!. microsoft is going back to the drawing board with this ui so when they confirm it has no copy or paste maybe it hasnt, its called select text/image - Apply text/image? its all a big secret.
andylayo said:
I dont use copy and paste much either but im sure lots of people do,
So leaving it out would be bad news and limiting the users. im sure wm7 will have copy and paste but its maybe called something different?, for moving into the future.lets face it copy and paste is an old term and even apple has that now!. microsoft is going back to the drawing board with this ui so when they confirm it has no copy or paste maybe it hasnt, its called select text/image - Apply text/image? its all a big secret.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol i like your optimism but i think what really happened is some idiot paid another idiot to think & he came up with the brilliant idea that we dont need copy & paste just a os that recognizes numbers & addresses & how to handle them, but didnt realize that people copy & paste more then just numbers & crap
Did this really deserve a whole new thread when there are multiple discussions going on in different ones about the exact same topics?
I am really skeptical that the reason Microsoft came up is indeed the true reason.
I smell this is patent issue from ... Apple. And Microsoft still does not have other way unless they violate the patent or license it from Apple.
But still, copy & paste doesn't fit into their concept of "great user experience for dumb users". But then I agree they need to put more logic into it (but then I doubt they'd do it) so when taping on a WLAN code in a SMS there should be an entry in the popup menu like "Apply to network". But then this is pretty uncommon approach since you shouldn't send around your WLAN codes and MS are doing their stuff half asses anyway so who cares. I think copy & paste is really smallest "problem" of WP7. Without any hacks (and we don't even know if they're possible on final retail devices) you can literally do NOTHING on your phone that you can't do on any NOKIA DUMB PHONE!!! Oh! And XBOX but what the heck!?
gogol said:
I am really skeptical that the reason Microsoft came up is indeed the true reason.
I smell this is patent issue from ... Apple. And Microsoft still does not have other way unless they violate the patent or license it from Apple.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hopefully thats it & they arent just being stupid...we should come up with ways just incase that this is true & maybe MS will read this & add it
ok ill go first
they can use the bottom tray/option pad or what ever its called to have the copy & paste option & from there select what you want copied because thats nothing like what apple does
and MS if your reading this & use it send me a zune HD plz
RAMMANN said:
But then I agree they need to put more logic into it (but then I doubt they'd do it) so when taping on a WLAN code in a SMS there should be an entry in the popup menu like "Apply to network".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah but how the hell would they know it's a WPA key? It's just a sequence of characters, it could be used for anything.
pilgrim011 said:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
its still works under water man i cant wait to pick 1 of these up
Thats Funny
http://www.windowsphone7series.com/...eral-discussion_little-information-copy-paste
We started building the new Windows Phone 7 Series around two big but simple ideas: Your phone should understand what you care about most - and your phone should enable you to do the things you want in fewer steps.
That's why Windows Phone 7 Series will not initially offer copy and paste. We looked at some of the most common uses for copy and paste, and simplified them with a single-tap action.
Say you're looking at an appointment in your calendar. You need to know when the meeting starts - but you also need to know where to go. In the past you would have to copy the address, open a mapping application or site, paste from the clipboard and then click a button to get a result. With Windows Phone 7 Series, you just click on that address and jump straight to a map.
If you're surfing the Web and you come across a piece of information you'd like to know more about, you don't have to exit your browser and go into a search application. Just highlight the word and click the search key. The new search results are now available at your fingertips.
And of course, Windows Phone 7 Series also supports clickable phone numbers in emails, in browser, and in search results.
In our early testing people have been pleased with this approach - but we're always listening to feedback, and we will continue to improve our feature set over time based on what we hear.
_marshall
backstage moderator
M$ just want to do some stuff to replace copy/paste ,not cut it
But it's not an either/or type thing. MS could have done both, if they'd wanted to.
I also don't like being forced to use bing! to search for whatever I highlight in the browser(without having to type it out on whatever search engine I may wanna use instead). I seriously dislike the tight control MS apparently built into the system. And I actually loved WP7s before MIX10, now I'm having second thoughts...
Regards
So what if I receive an email containing some information I want to place into a Note?
If I can't copy the info from the email, go into the Notes app and paste it into a new or existing note, then what do I do? Write it all down on a piece of paper and then re-type it into the note?
If someone emails me their address, I won't be able to paste that into their contact details?
This just beggars belief! I use C&P all the time, and not for the limited uses Microsoft have come up with!
I do not keep old emails for the information they contain - I rip the info out of the email, put it where it SHOULD be on my phone (maybe in a contact, a new event, a note, a task, whatever) and then bin the email. Without C&P this will be IMPOSSIBLE!!!
The usage scenarios given in the OP are not replacements for Copy & Paste, they are LINKS from a piece of info to another function. Copy & Paste is all about MOVING or COPYING information from one object to another. This will ALWAYS be needed by anyone using the phone for any kind of data. Not being able to copy data around between Word and Excel is just a complete FAIL.
Jim Coleman said:
If someone emails me their address, I won't be able to paste that into their contact details?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my understanding is that u would be able to copy a address or number into a contact and into bing (address), a bit like its a hyperlink that opens up a option menu that lets u send it to pre-defined locations.
Ganondolf said:
my understanding is that u would be able to copy a address or number into a contact and into bing (address), a bit like its a hyperlink that opens up a option menu that lets u send it to pre-defined locations.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see how it would recognize an address. Phone number, yes, I can see that, but an address?
For instance, if I receive the following email;
"Hi, yeah the address is The Willows, London Road, Trowbridge, Kent cheers mate - John"
How in heck will WP7S know there's an address in there?
Not only that, you just said it'll be able to "copy a address into a contact" - I've no idea where you got that from but Microsoft have clearly indicated there WILL BE NO COPY function. So even if it did recognise the address through some miracle of place recognition, the best you could hope for is that it would show you a map, so you would have to keep the email on your phone for ever more and remember that the address is in that particular message. Frankly it's completely unworkable.
As far as I can tell, the only way WP7S will be able to spot an address is if it is in AN ADDRESS FIELD in a contact or a calendar entry.
Mark my words, in less than 2 firmwareupdates the copypaste function is back. Why go to iPhone OS 1.0 and lose all advantage of not being the first one to develop such an interface?
Imho, this is just plain-stupid.
If Microsoft are so worried about all the dumb users, then ship the phone with cut & paste switched off, and add an option to turn it on in the Settings, so the smart users can use it if they choose to. It's not Rocket Science. When you're designing software and you're faced with an arbitrary decision about a feature, always just make it optional.
Silverdragondk said:
But it's not an either/or type thing. MS could have done both, if they'd wanted to.
I also don't like being forced to use bing! to search for whatever I highlight in the browser(without having to type it out on whatever search engine I may wanna use instead). I seriously dislike the tight control MS apparently built into the system. And I actually loved WP7s before MIX10, now I'm having second thoughts...
Regards
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
even though in the end you may finally end up using Bing, but you need a choice...right.?
Jim Coleman said:
So what if I receive an email containing some information I want to place into a Note?
If I can't copy the info from the email, go into the Notes app and paste it into a new or existing note, then what do I do? Write it all down on a piece of paper and then re-type it into the note?
If someone emails me their address, I won't be able to paste that into their contact details?
This just beggars belief! I use C&P all the time, and not for the limited uses Microsoft have come up with!
I do not keep old emails for the information they contain - I rip the info out of the email, put it where it SHOULD be on my phone (maybe in a contact, a new event, a note, a task, whatever) and then bin the email. Without C&P this will be IMPOSSIBLE!!!
The usage scenarios given in the OP are not replacements for Copy & Paste, they are LINKS from a piece of info to another function. Copy & Paste is all about MOVING or COPYING information from one object to another. This will ALWAYS be needed by anyone using the phone for any kind of data. Not being able to copy data around between Word and Excel is just a complete FAIL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Note the underlined words....that is exactly where M$ is trying to go.
Find the most obvious use of the information that is highlighted and do it for you.
Ganondolf said:
my understanding is that u would be able to copy a address or number into a contact and into bing (address), a bit like its a hyperlink that opens up a option menu that lets u send it to pre-defined locations.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you know what? HTC messaging does that even now.
When you click on a text message, it pops up a list of options that you would like to do....
Better yet, what about addresses for folks who live in other places in the world where the address might not be recognizable in english. for instance
-> 72 dr ea cooray mawatha, wellawatte. thats a legitimate address in sri lanka.
I think they will have complete text message copy and paste, and not selective copy and paste to get around apple's patent.
this is assuming people want to be robbed of their $ by paying and subscribing to a data plan. i do NOT plan to do that. i'm gonna just buy the phone and use wifi.
chiks19018 said:
even though in the end you may finally end up using Bing, but you need a choice...right.?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He he, I've been writing a couple answers to this question, and I've ended up deleting them every single time, because I'm having difficulty saying what I wanna say...
Generally speaking, yes it's about choice. No one likes being forced to do things in a certain way? Especially if they feel there's a better way?
With regards to Bing! being the only way to search in a copy/paste type of way, that bugs me. I don't mind if Bing! is the only integrated search engine, or if only Bing! is allowed to use the Bing!/search button. but please allow me the freedom to choose if I wanna use Bing! or not. Without copy/paste there is effectively no choice. It smells of MS wanting to grow Bing! by forcing people to use it. I don't like that. I don't like that one teeny tiny little bit.
Regards
Silverdragondk said:
He he, I've been writing a couple answers to this question, and I've ended up deleting them every single time, because I'm having difficulty saying what I wanna say...
Generally speaking, yes it's about choice. No one likes being forced to do things in a certain way? Especially if they feel there's a better way?
With regards to Bing! being the only way to search in a copy/paste type of way, that bugs me. I don't mind if Bing! is the only integrated search engine, or if only Bing! is allowed to use the Bing!/search button. but please allow me the freedom to choose if I wanna use Bing! or not. Without copy/paste there is effectively no choice. It smells of MS wanting to grow Bing! by forcing people to use it. I don't like that. I don't like that one teeny tiny little bit.
Regards
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally understand your position....I am like that too.
"Especially if they feel there's a better way" -> I will rephrase it this way
"Especially if they feel there might be a better way"
but the fact that bing would integrate itself, might in the end make it to the choice
Hello XDA Community,
@DEVELOPERS: I need some developers with other devices to make things (at least parts of advanced explorer) work on other devices (i have a htd hd7). !Programming & Testing!
Please PM me
To bring all together what xda achieved for WP7, i wrote a helper app for the following tasks,
- File management
- Registry management
- Copy files from desktop to phone
- Copy files from phone to desktop
- Set max unsigned apps
- Provision any given XML
If you post in this thread how any of those features could be implemented on other devices, i will maybe implement them. You can always send me a modified version and i will maybe update this post with the new version!
Usage/(Release-)Notes on the website!
If you encounter any errors, or wanna give some feedback => just leave a post here or use the idea page or write me an email (go to contact on the homepage)!
I included the source code, so that anybody can modify it at will but do not use anything here for commercial purposes (contact me first).
Homepage for this project:
http://sites.google.com/site/yaafdevelopers/projects/advanced-explorer-for-wp7
You can give feedback / bugreports:
http://advancedexplorerwp7.codeplex.com/
(Go to Discussion or Issue Tracker)
You will find the latest version and the Release-Notes there. I will continue to watch this thread!
Because some people asked how to support/donate me:
I appreciate every donation! Thank you!
reddragon
He that is great stff... i am glad you added the source i was thinking about how this could work having had a little peek at the code in the samples that Ms provided.
wings over a thanks too
Question...If you send a file, where does the device dump it into the computer? I was getting an error sending the file to my computer at first, but then I configured correctly and it sends fine, but I don't know where it is...
Edit: Nevermind, I got it. Upload/Download Root folders. Good work on this app man. Pretty nifty. Uploaded a .doc from my laptop to the phone, copy/pasted it into My Docs and it appeared and opened on MS Office Word perfectly.
nice ! but ...
Nice app !
But can't send from \windows directory ?..
Re: can't send from \windows
Hey,
like i said in my first post i brought together what was achieved...
Im using the HTC app COM dll files for file system access. Actually you can send files from \windows but not all. (in usage or no access)...
If somebody knows a better way, or something for other devices => just implement and send it, or post here!
The problem: Now it works on my device, so I can do what i wanted to do (coping .pdf and other stuff on the wp7) I have not the time to search & wait for other devices.
I tried to code it very generic and emulated the System.IO namespace, so everybody can add his results or replace it with better results.
Just contact me and I will check the code and update the first post.
reddragon93
eternalemb said:
Question...If you send a file, where does the device dump it into the computer? I was getting an error sending the file to my computer at first, but then I configured correctly and it sends fine, but I don't know where it is...
Edit: Nevermind, I got it. Upload/Download Root folders. Good work on this app man. Pretty nifty. Uploaded a .doc from my laptop to the phone, copy/pasted it into My Docs and it appeared and opened on MS Office Word perfectly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually you can double tab any file and it should open from any folder.
To get PDF working I copy the file to the PDF reader (most likely the app will crash if Adobe reader is not installed), but you will not see anything as PDF reader just pops up with the file
Just like always contact me if there are file types missing!
cool app, ty
how long did it take?
hi reddragon93, thank you for your work, i've an lg optimus 7, is there an eta for explorer for other device?
i need it!!!
thank you so much!
gianlucarugby said:
hi reddragon93, thank you for your work, i've an lg optimus 7, is there an eta for explorer for other device?
i need it!!!
thank you so much!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I really can understand you because I needed this for myself (that's why I coded it in the first place)
But the answer is NO, because we have to wait until somebody finds a way to get access on other devices and shares the info (i will observe this thread for new infos).
And by the way you should not ask for ETA in developer forum (forum rules), but it's OK for me. Hope you will be the only one after my answer
I answered this question in my first post:
"If you post in this thread how any of those features could be implemented on other devices, i will maybe implement them"
Hope I answered your question.
reddragon
thanks, you were very kind,
apologize me for the ETA, i did not know, i'm just a student not a developer!
good work!
EDIT: I can't figure out how to mark a post as useful yet, so let me just say THANK YOU!!!
Awesome app. However, there are a few things that would be nice in terms of file types:
Any chance of getting support for loading .mobi files (Kindle ebooks)? I'd love to be able to sideload books that aren't in the Amazon store.
Currently, .log files won't open. Copy/renaming them to .txt should work, or a simple text reader/editor could be built-in.
Possible bug: the "Max unsigned apps" field in Settings is showing "Not set - (can't read from registry)" Setting it from within the app seems to work, though (and be remembered).
Feature request: ability to search the registry
Small change request: pressing Back on an Exception could do the same as OK (rather than exiting).
Overally, much thanks for an awesome tool!
Thanks for feedback
GoodDayToDie said:
EDIT: I can't figure out how to mark a post as useful yet, so let me just say THANK YOU!!!
Awesome app. However, there are a few things that would be nice in terms of file types:
Any chance of getting support for loading .mobi files (Kindle ebooks)? I'd love to be able to sideload books that aren't in the Amazon store.
Currently, .log files won't open. Copy/renaming them to .txt should work, or a simple text reader/editor could be built-in.
Possible bug: the "Max unsigned apps" field in Settings is showing "Not set - (can't read from registry)" Setting it from within the app seems to work, though (and be remembered).
Feature request: ability to search the registry
Small change request: pressing Back on an Exception could do the same as OK (rather than exiting).
Overally, much thanks for an awesome tool!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your feedback!
(1) I really needed the app for myself (real pdf support) so... The Thanks Button is only visible with 5+ Posts
(2) i will pm you maybe if i find some spare time. This is most likely pretty simple to implement. Can you edit your (or create a new) post and describe what happens if you double tab a kindle book with the current version?
(3) yeah i saw this before but didn't thought it is important enough to implement. I don't have the time for the own Editor (you have to handle really big files for example) but i can do the renaming thing behind the scenes (remember renaming = copy+delete until a better solution is found).
(4) on first app start i have really no solution in determining how the value is set (no access on this key). So my solution was to set this text ("Not set - (can't read from registry)" until you set a value => then i save this value local to the app, and set it every time the app starts (It gets reset every time i connect the device to the PC anyway)
(5) "search the registry": I thought on this one... But this will not be of much use as we have not really much read access
NOTE: The Problem with the registry is that we have FULL WRITE access trough the provxml method but not very much READ access (HTC COM .dll)
(6) really? I'm satisfied with the current behavior. Without searching I don't know if this is a small change maybe it is, maybe not. At least it looks like one but that doesn't mean anything
reddragon
Thanks for the response, reddragon. I'm at work right now, so the .mobi thing will have to wait. It's a very common request among WP7 users around here, though.
I've found that selecting the Edit context item will open any file in Word, which is typically sufficient for viewing and even editing purposes! True plain text files open fine regardless of extension, and even binary files will usually have enough ASCII in them to determine useful info. You can also send any file (via email) from Word, if you want to email an attachment rather than just transfer to a PC.
Unfortunately, I've found that XML files just... don't work. Double-clicking them opens IE, which complains that it can't handle that file type. Selecting Edit on them looks like it's opening some Office app, but the app then closes and drops back into Advanced Explorer (no error). This is the currently problematic filetype, as a *lot* of data is stored in XML.
The "Registry Editor" app already provides registry search (and despite the security restrictions on read it *mostly* works) but without system copy-paste it's tricky moving data between apps. I enjoy being able to pan between the FS and registry... hell, I want a Windows (desktop) app that does this, now.
It looks like there's FS search (an option on the command bar, and a text box that appears) but I can't get it to do anything. Pressing Enter has no effect, tapping either Refresh or Search again just reloads the page. Am I using this right? It would be great to be able to either scroll long folders (\Windows) or find a filename behind a bunch of GUIDs.
Some files show as "0 b" size, even though they almost certainly aren't. Is that just because some program has an exclusive lock on them and their size can't be read in that state?
Any chance of the ability to create folders in the GUI (I think I see how to do it with provxml files, but that's not exactly convenient)?
Thanks for the explanations on the registry. I was wondering how you could write to locations that you can't read from... Also, I didn't know the sideload limit resets itself. That's something I'll have to watch out for, as I'm near the nominal sideload limit already. Hmm... maybe I should look into writing an app that lets the phone install a .XAP directly, to minimize the amount of PC connecting that's needed.
Sorry, I know that's a lot of comments and questions. If it helps, I showed this to a couple of other HD7 owners today, and the immediate response of both of them was "I've got to get that!" This is a great app, super-convenient and good for making the occasional Samsung Focus owner jealous ;-D
Actually, I'm a developer myself (mostly C/C++, but I know C#). I'll crack a look at the source when I get a chance (probably this weekend) but would you be interested in a patch if there's something I can improve? One thing I might add is an optional "Did you mean that?" prompt on the Back button, as it's a little too easy to hit and knock you clear out of the app (optional of course, as I understand some people don't have such problems).
Thanks again!
does anyone know the latest ETA on compatibility for samsung devices?
Some Answers
GoodDayToDie said:
Thanks for the response, reddragon. I'm at work right now, so the .mobi thing will have to wait. It's a very common request among WP7 users around here, though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like I said: I will pm you most likely, today or this weekend.
GoodDayToDie said:
I've found that selecting the Edit context item will open any file in Word, which is typically sufficient for viewing and even editing purposes! True plain text files open fine regardless of extension, and even binary files will usually have enough ASCII in them to determine useful info. You can also send any file (via email) from Word, if you want to email an attachment rather than just transfer to a PC.
Unfortunately, I've found that XML files just... don't work. Double-clicking them opens IE, which complains that it can't handle that file type. Selecting Edit on them looks like it's opening some Office app, but the app then closes and drops back into Advanced Explorer (no error). This is the currently problematic filetype, as a *lot* of data is stored in XML.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah the best way to handle the edit mode would be an editor inside the app, but that's quite some work i guess... So if somebody is willing to write such a control just contact me!
But the current workaround is quite simple: Upload your file, edit it with the powerful editors you know and send it back to the phone...
In fact what i did was send the complete windows/applications folder and all files that where successfully send can be edited (on the others you have no access anyway).
GoodDayToDie said:
The "Registry Editor" app already provides registry search (and despite the security restrictions on read it *mostly* works) but without system copy-paste it's tricky moving data between apps. I enjoy being able to pan between the FS and registry... hell, I want a Windows (desktop) app that does this, now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I think it's not that difficult to implement a search for registry. It's funny to say that all the time but I thought on this one too and if you look on the source code you will see that i positioned the search/filter text box out of the explorer pivot to use it for registry search or other purposes. If you find it really that useful with the current read restrictions... yeah I should just implement it...
GoodDayToDie said:
It looks like there's FS search (an option on the command bar, and a text box that appears) but I can't get it to do anything. Pressing Enter has no effect, tapping either Refresh or Search again just reloads the page. Am I using this right? It would be great to be able to either scroll long folders (\Windows) or find a filename behind a bunch of GUIDs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In fact this is a filter function so that large folders can be loaded much faster. Just enter "a*" and make the keyboard disappear (tab anywhere else) and you see only the files/folders starting with "a". I don't know why "enter" on keyboard doesn't do anything, I will look into this. I should update the usage in my first post, thanks.
GoodDayToDie said:
Some files show as "0 b" size, even though they almost certainly aren't. Is that just because some program has an exclusive lock on them and their size can't be read in that state?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yep.
From the htc COM call i get 0 bytes....
GoodDayToDie said:
Any chance of the ability to create folders in the GUI (I think I see how to do it with provxml files, but that's not exactly convenient)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hehe, i thought on this one too as it is already implemented (just create a folder in UploadRoot drop a file and start downloading it to the phone => the folder gets created). I will look into this.
Can you (or anybody) provide me with an example on how to rename a folder via provxml. And in Yaaf.WP7.NativeAccess.IO.File i have in the "Move" method some code commentated. Can somebody please un-comment, debug and tell me why the hell this provision-xml is invalid / not working, thanks.
(ProvisionXml is completely new to me as this is my first smartphone)
GoodDayToDie said:
Thanks for the explanations on the registry. I was wondering how you could write to locations that you can't read from... Also, I didn't know the sideload limit resets itself. That's something I'll have to watch out for, as I'm near the nominal sideload limit already. Hmm... maybe I should look into writing an app that lets the phone install a .XAP directly, to minimize the amount of PC connecting that's needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't look into that but i think it is not enough to simply create the guid folder and drop content there... Anyway you can use the "NativeAccess" Projekt to get all the access i used in the Explorer. But you have to create links from your main projekt to the COM-dlls so they get included into the xap file.
GoodDayToDie said:
Sorry, I know that's a lot of comments and questions. If it helps, I showed this to a couple of other HD7 owners today, and the immediate response of both of them was "I've got to get that!" This is a great app, super-convenient and good for making the occasional Samsung Focus owner jealous ;-D
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's what keeping me up i guess
GoodDayToDie said:
Actually, I'm a developer myself (mostly C/C++, but I know C#). I'll crack a look at the source when I get a chance (probably this weekend) but would you be interested in a patch if there's something I can improve? One thing I might add is an optional "Did you mean that?" prompt on the Back button, as it's a little too easy to hit and knock you clear out of the app (optional of course, as I understand some people don't have such problems).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm always interested in any patch especially support for other devices (I have a htc so I can't debug stuff for other devices :/ )
Yeah there could be an option for that. It's pretty easy to implement so... But i don't have this problem so i didn't realised that one.
GoodDayToDie said:
Thanks again!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your feedback
Muzzy777 said:
does anyone know the latest ETA on compatibility for samsung devices?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I answered this on the first page of the thread already, thanks.
EDIT: I updated the program and my first post and implemented some of your feature requests
reddragon
Configuration Service Provider Reference for Windows Mobile Devices
Have you used the forum-search? You'll find a post which describes you how to get these books to your phone (it's by me). I can't give you the link because I send this from my HD7.
really great app. Also like the pc<->phone feature
I use it now very often, so I think it needs:
-2 Filebrowser Tabs
-or an option to "bookmark" certain folders
diboze said:
really great app. Also like the pc<->phone feature
I use it now very often, so I think it needs:
-2 Filebrowser Tabs
-or an option to "bookmark" certain folders
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I talked to other people, at first this feature looks awesome, but after some time you would see that you don't use 2 tabs!
The bookmarking thing is a good idea...
Elerador said:
Have you used the forum-search? You'll find a post which describes you how to get these books to your phone (it's by me). I can't give you the link because I send this from my HD7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm looking into amazon kindle... what i can do for sure is copy the file into the kindle folder and start amazon kindle...
But i forgot how to start a program via app-guid. I remember that i saw an COM.dll which can do that.
__ow said:
Configuration Service Provider Reference for Windows Mobile Devices
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i know that link but i don't see how you can move folders (if it is possible)
reddragon
Love the update! Thanks for cluing me in on the workings of the filter; I wasn't trying wildcards and it therefore looked like it was always empty.
That said, a bug report (reproed on the older version too):
Registry manual mode can crash with a System.ArgumentException "Invalid fullpath".
Start Advanced Explorer
Pan to Registry
Tap "edit manual"
Observe exception
App crashes on hitting OK
About 2 weeks ago, I took johnkussack's advice (I think it was him) and went to LinkedIn to try t be friends with anyone who came up on the search for "kin phone". In the invite email, I just said that I noticed they worked on the Kin phones and would like to ask them a few questions on how one could write to the phone. I have had 3 responses in the last 2 days.
Guy1: didn't know because he worked on the UI for the Kin Studio
Guy2: kindly told me he couldn't release an unauthorized build and that he would be breaking the law by doing so.
Guy3: This guy worked on the phone for over a year. He first told me I was breaking the DCMA by hacking/reverse engineering Kin, regardless of intent. Then he said this important thing:
"You are absolutely right in assuming that the device is locked; in fact, it has a hardware lock that is common to many such devices. When the devices roll of the manufacturing line the programming fuses are blown (literally) preventing any further programming of the device. This is all handled by hardware so unless you find a flaw with that you are out of luck."
So if this is true (sounds like it is), the "dream" is over. Hopefully there is some way that someone out there can find.
If I get more responses, I will post them here. Don't ask me to go back to these three who already replied and asked them more questions, I think I made some of them mad.
Hmmmm... I don't know whether or not the KIN models will accept OTA updates so that's a good question to ask. If OTA updates are possible then it's inherently possible to change the software. I wonder...
Yes, it was me the one who said about "linkedin".
But i also said "in one word NDA". You should known even before ask that the signed NDA are also legal contracts, so i prevented before asking them.
On the DCMA, yes.. on the USA. Outside the big country, the legal question is different and may not operate with that law. (if ever). If they provide a normal (legal?) way to unbrick my factory mode here, or to use the phone options, then i wait for the cost for it.
And everyone knew that hardware was not the way, just at the moment where first flash attempt failed. "Dream" is doable by software, if anything is to be done.
What i don't get is why to ask for rom rom roooooms, where we need drivers drivers driveeeeers... or sdk's. We won't get it anyway from MS, but no flashing means a rom is futile, non useful,crap pack of bytes.
But i also said "in one word NDA". You should known even before ask that the signed NDA are also legal contracts, so i prevented before asking them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I figured I just take a shot in the dark; hope for the best and expect the worst. Since the phone and suuport from MS was discontinued, maybe the NDAs would be voided.
And everyone knew that hardware was not the way, just at the moment where first flash attempt failed. "Dream" is doable by software, if anything is to be done.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to know you still think there's a way.
What i don't get is why to ask for rom rom roooooms, where we need drivers drivers driveeeeers... or sdk's. We won't get it anyway from MS, but no flashing means a rom is futile, non useful,crap pack of bytes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just asked if "there is a way to get around the write lock". Had I known ahead of time to ask about drivers or SDKs, I would have put that in the msg.
I strongly believe that we could operate with the device,softwarewise. there is proof that the kin NAND memory (for now on, called "Storage" as label) is writeable. Not sure on the Rom part.
Of course, i mean.. just use it as a normal writable storage memory.
I posted how it could be done and would do it myself but, again, i bricked my phone, and available ones (through bidding sites) are so expensive to buy another one just for this (+ $150). Don't see a way to get it internationally again.
And even doing it, i'm not sure about what could be done just writing on the storage mem....
If the fuse byte is burn't should not it have prevented you from bricking?
kintwouser said:
If the fuse byte is burn't should not it have prevented you from bricking?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nvitem bricked, not flashing bricked. You can succesfully write to the NVItems memory. But i guess it's just configuration memory and not the one "fused".
I just want to mention that jailbreaking a phone is NOT illegal in the United States! Geohot hacked the iphone... Apple went after him... Apple lost.
Also blowing the programming fuses seems a little fishy to me actually. No other phone does that. The majority of other phones have been flashed. I just think it would be pretty odd for a company to do that so that they no longer could update it. I am not sure I believe him. If this really was true... then why wouldn't Apple or Sony be doing it? This also doesn't make sense since Microsoft actually originally intended on putting WP7 on this as well as allowing apps for it. Check this article out:
http://www.intomobile.com/2010/05/12/kin-windows-phone-7-a-lot-closer-than-we-thought/
you must understand, its not possible to blow fuses in the hardware, it would be a top news story if they were able to keep the OS running in complience with the flash memory without it crashing. Obviously that was a lie to discourage us, and i dont even think that was a real kin developer, because microsoft clearly stated that all kin developers would be moved to WP7 or another programming section. And it doesnt matter if its legal or not to jailbrake phones, if we are porting a new OS, we wouldnt have modified the original OS, which is what jailbraking means. Most likely the OS is hidden deep in the flash memory with a write - protection. If you think its saying access denied because they said the fuses were blown, its wrong. They must just have a password or code that needs to be sent continuasly to the phone to access files. If the fuses were blown, then nothing would be able to be accessed by zune, because it would be impossible to reach the memory.
soninja8 said:
Most likely the OS is hidden deep in the flash memory with a write - protection. If you think its saying access denied because they said the fuses were blown, its wrong. They must just have a password or code that needs to be sent continuasly to the phone to access files. If the fuses were blown, then nothing would be able to be accessed by zune, because it would be impossible to reach the memory.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not my expertise field, but this mobiles can (and in fact they do) have several memories, storing the OS in the ROM memory and all the data on the NAND memory (our "8gb" storage).
Zune software has protocols to query for available storages (requiring its label/id) and is allowed to write/read to it. If you dare to click on update version (at least in the 1st version I tried) it expressed that the option was not "available" to that device without web requesting data, apparently.
So.. in the nand flash we may only have the equivalent of a SD Card. And my last wince PDA showed that as /Storage too, apart from main wince ROM.
You can format the nand memory using win explorer if in fact it is the 8gig storage. I did this and it deleted all pics,albums etc. It was interesting to note that we cannot copy or view these pics without an access error but it does let me delete them.
I just wan't to be able to get my pics off this piece of crap without emailing them.
I posted it once. You are able to:
- Query storage properties (label, size, id,...)
- Query storage folders
- Query folder files.
- Query tracks / albums / playlist / images / anyZuneSupportedFile
- Delete * file (whatever)
- Format the storage
You are "unable" to:
- Upload (create) a file into the device
- Download a file from the device.
MTP protocol tools allows you to do so, from command line (not quite sure if they are available on Win32 OS's), but... fails to operate with this device when it comes to the "unavailable" operations.
I am curious as to which former developers you contacted?
I was doing some research and noticed that Microsoft acquired the company Danger, Inc. After Microsoft purchased them, the former president of Danger went to develop Android (later acquired by Google). One thing I read was that most of Dangers employees left after being purchased by Microsoft. Apparently these people don't like Microsoft all that much! I also looked into it a little more and found one of the founders of Danger who had a twitter account. Of course all of his tweets were via a "KIN". Thought that was interesting. It seems to me that these former Danger employees would be interested in helping out if they don't hold to high of an esteem for the big "M".
seems like this is your first "inside the move" trying-to-hack/reverse a thing, so i will say:
people involved doesnt wanna risk through legal issues, even if they were pissed off, just for "some kids" to have a driver or rom. NDA are strong there, and they could either sign them or leave (if leaving, they don't have the interesting things).
At most you would get bad-mood or good-luck comments, and ocassionaly (very uncommon), leaks (wont happen here).
yeah, they purchased danger for an amazing 500 million dollars, which they later developed the kin with it, they were planning to put windows phone 7 on it, but they were to behind and released it with the old windows CE, then the former developer moved to work on a free source OS, later called android. Google wanted to get android while it was cheap, so they bought that company, and made the old developer as 2nd engineer.
Maybe not worth yet, but we should get more *info* about the SBL mode (aka "Ms Pink Bootstrap), as coinflipper said that it was the way to flash OS or parts (like radio's).
I have been trying even OMA wap WBXML bootstrap examples with it, but as we dont know if our phone is standard, it's like looking for a water drop in the sea of possibilities.
We do not need a guide on how to do something, but what-to-do with it.
Maybe, JUST MAYBE, we could design a program like bitpim. I am a mac user and when I used bitpim with my enV touch, I used to edit all sorts of files. Examples would be phone info, server info etc. We could make a program like that to get the info. I know programming may be hard, but its worth a shot. I hate the OS on this phone, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU PIN APPS! THEY LOOK HORRIBLE
Kinuser1 said:
Maybe, JUST MAYBE, we could design a program like bitpim. I am a mac user and when I used bitpim with my enV touch, I used to edit all sorts of files.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We can't. If we have not the protocols or the supported phone features (protocols, drivers, documentation,...) you cannot guess it and put it into visual basic (or Xcode) and then by *magic*get the program you want.
i will admit that i know very little about protocols and drivers but i would like to point out that bitpim is open source, and that the code can be found here ->
http-//sourceforge.net/scm/?type=svn&group_id=75211 (change "-" to ":")
i seem to recall bitpim already having limited support for the kin, but perhaps with a little research and a little code tweaking we can find ways to improve it? i'm not sure how feasable it is as i have very little experience with programming for phones/usb devices, but it's just a thought.
slimeq said:
i will admit that i know very little about protocols and drivers but i would like to point out that bitpim is open source, and that the code can be found here ->
http-//sourceforge.net/scm/?type=svn&group_id=75211 (change "-" to ":")
i seem to recall bitpim already having limited support for the kin, but perhaps with a little research and a little code tweaking we can find ways to improve it? i'm not sure how feasable it is as i have very little experience with programming for phones/usb devices, but it's just a thought.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We can't. If we have not the protocols or the supported phone features (protocols, drivers, documentation,...) you cannot guess it and put it into visual basic (or Xcode) and then by *magic*get the program you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The above applies to any software you want. Unless you magically found documentation or files (like OP), there's no way to. So f#cked.
The thing is always the same, tweaking tweaking... what to tweak, huh?
I have a rooted box and on certain programs that require root access it removes the allow screen too fast for me to click allow and therefore cannot use the addon. Is there a way to make it simply auto allow everything? On the 1st get I was able to do this but not on the second gen. And when clicking on supersu you cannot launch it to edit any options so basically I am stuck.
Have you tried editing /data/data/eu.chainfire.su/files/supersu.cfg? In particular, change "access=2" to "access=1" as the default.
retyre said:
Have you tried editing /data/data/eu.chainfire.su/files/supersu.cfg? In particular, change "access=2" to "access=1" as the default.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No I have not. Not exactly sure what that means. Is that an adb command?
danknasty said:
No I have not. Not exactly sure what that means. Is that an adb command?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Open the file in any text editor (e.g., ES File Explorer has a Note Editor) and make the change to the default. If you can't, do an adb pull of the file, edit on another device, and put it back to its original location. Make sure you set permissions back to 600.
retyre said:
Open the file in any text editor (e.g., ES File Explorer has a Note Editor) and make the change to the default. If you can't, do an adb pull of the file, edit on another device, and put it back to its original location. Make sure you set permissions back to 600.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was going to try this but remembered that rooting on fire tv uses the a to a usb cable method and all the files are transferred automatically. I do not have a super user file... would I install another one and overwrite it on the box?
sure you do. How would you have root without su? Just look for the file mentioned above and edit it as per retyre's post above.
danknasty said:
I was going to try this but remembered that rooting on fire tv uses the a to a usb cable method and all the files are transferred automatically. I do not have a super user file... would I install another one and overwrite it on the box?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Regardless of the method used to root, rooting involves the install of su and something like SuperSU to make it easier to work with. The fact that you're being prompted to allow su access is proof enough.
Install a root file explorer (I use ES File Explorer), allow it su access, go to the root of the device ("/") and look for the file in the location mentioned above.
retyre said:
Regardless of the method used to root, rooting involves the install of su and something like SuperSU to make it easier to work with. The fact that you're being prompted to allow su access is proof enough.
Install a root file explorer (I use ES File Explorer), allow it su access, go to the root of the device ("/") and look for the file in the location mentioned above.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wasn't saying I didn't have supersu just that the method I use doesn't allow me access before I transfer but I see what you mean I can do this from the box itself. Was hoping I could do it to the supersu file on the computer so that when I root another box I wouldn't have to change the text file again. But I'll try this out later and see how it goes.
retyre said:
Regardless of the method used to root, rooting involves the install of su and something like SuperSU to make it easier to work with. The fact that you're being prompted to allow su access is proof enough.
Install a root file explorer (I use ES File Explorer), allow it su access, go to the root of the device ("/") and look for the file in the location mentioned above.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried accessing supersu in two root browsers and it gives me a bunch of greyed out permissions... I am not sure how to even open it with notepad on es file explorer. This is a little different than the first gen as everything must be installed through tw recovery. Before Supersu would just ask me if i wanted to approve everything I clicked ok and never had to check it again. Is there any way I can edit any of the text that is being injected into the box when installing the firetv recovery via the usb cable method.. I believe this is where supersu is being transfered.
update: ok I found supersu inside the prerooted rom... I opened it as a text file and its pages and pages of random symbols etc.
harlekinade said:
Comedy gold.
I suggest you swipe left.
Or start reading what other people actually posted in here before. Or this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compiler or what a filepath is, or why you shouldnt try to resell Fire TVs - just in case...
Here is why - I havent encountered any case where the allow root access prompt would be on screen for less than 15 seconds during which you have to press down/right/enter to grant it permissions - and it only pops on when you are actively launching anything that tries to pull root rights - so you already have the remote in your hands.
Automating root prompt behavior to grant root by default is a really bad idea in general and you asking not only how to automate it, but also automate further installations of such a setup, suggests that maybe you are battling with user behavior of folks that don't know what a superuser prompt is and that go with default settings in most cases. Ethically it is hard to support any of this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow that was really presumptuous and didn't at all relate to anything or help me.... excellent work. I suggest before attempting to troll a post you read the entire post so you can at least have a firm grasp on your ridiculous comments. 9 posts in you're doing great. Lol "ethically it is hard to support any of this." At least you made me laugh. I guess it's unethical in your opinion for me to paint my car red also since it comes from the dealership blue. Btw it never occurred to me to push down right then enter with the remote thanks problem solved.....
danknasty said:
I tried accessing supersu in two root browsers and it gives me a bunch of greyed out permissions... I am not sure how to even open it with notepad on es file explorer. This is a little different than the first gen as everything must be installed through tw recovery. Before Supersu would just ask me if i wanted to approve everything I clicked ok and never had to check it again. Is there any way I can edit any of the text that is being injected into the box when installing the firetv recovery via the usb cable method.. I believe this is where supersu is being transfered.
update: ok I found supersu inside the prerooted rom... I opened it as a text file and its pages and pages of random symbols etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why are you trying to edit SuperSU (the app)? You should edit supersu.cfg, which is the text config file for SuperSU. Look for supersu.cfg in the location mentioned earlier.
retyre said:
Why are you trying to edit SuperSU (the app)? You should edit supersu.cfg, which is the text config file for SuperSU. Look for supersu.cfg in the location mentioned earlier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only supersu I was able to find using es explorer was the supersu file in the system folder... data showed up as black. I was finally able to find it using a different root browser I changed the setting for the app it self to 1 and it works. The only program that this gives me this issue with is teamviewer and I am wondering if it has to do with using a launcher version of kodi as it always kicks me out of the allow root selection screen, automatically disallows root and jumps to the kodi screen. But doing what you recommended worked. Thanks
harlekinade said:
Thank you for explaining your issue a little bit further. Changing the default of a superuser prompt to "yes" is something that shouldnt be considered an "easy fix" you could integrate into an image an then roll out on several devices.
Even if you LOL at the ethics of this, as you so eloquently put it - its still not something you should consider doing, generally speaking.
Just like you - trying to edit the Superuser binary in a texteditor - people can ruin their devices beyond repair, the default on "no" is a behavioral crutch to make it less likely that they find themselves in that situation.
Not sure if it would work for you - but I posted a teamviewer alternative in the general section (Exposed modules and root apps thread), that you might want to take a look at, as it doesnt require the app to be launched every time you want to access the Fire TV via VNC - as it runs as a service in the background.
I'm not exactly sure what you try to accomplish with teamviewer and why you want to roll out this configuration on multiple devices - so I'm not sure if it fits your purpose, but it might.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My issue was explained in the first post but i think you're really thanking me for telling you that I don't intend to sell rooted fire tv's with super user permissions on yes by default for malicious purposes... as you so eloquently put it.. I was actually laughing at the fact that you are on a forum that is primarily devoted to rooting and customizing devices but you draw the line at me wanting to default the supersu permissions on my devices because of ethical reasons. Anyways I'll check out that alternative to teamviewer you spoke of. I intend to use teamviewer for the purpose it was created which is to remotely access devices from my computer.
I actually did confirm that it was the launcher version of kodi that was kicking me out of the supersu prompt for anyone that was interested.. I turned off the xposed module to confirm.
harlekinade said:
You wanted support, you did get what you asked for, and then you almost ruined your device, because you din't see the file you were told to edit, and decided to open a different one. Then you blamed it on your root explorer app.
In the opening posting you stated that you wanted to change the default, but not why - and when I criticized this as being not needed in general, risky - and if you'd planned to roll it out to several installations, other people might use - as your postings intended, even unethical.
Unethical because of two concepts -
- You usually don't think about automation for mass deployment - if you don't plan an reselling devices, and we have a big problem with resellers in this community, not taking the responsibility "clause" seriously. Because of a principle you could describe as "sell and vanish". Which almost ruined the Kodi community, and arguably has impacted this one as well.
There is this distinct sense of "wasteland" after a general interest crowd was allowed to promote their interests (ad hoc, personal problem solving assistance) for a few months, by moderators that have no stake in this specific scene at all. I can only repeat that.
- It is ethically problematic to tell users like you how to change an important default and not what comes with it. The entire filesystem model and security in operating system depends on escalating user account rights. With root - you always grant access to everything.
Yes XDA (or what this community stood for in the past) is all for root (the rights to do whatever you want in an OS) - but ostensibly not for handing those permissions over to every user, or making sure that root level rights are granted by just pressing the big OK button on a TV remote, whenerver a popup comes up. The prompt is there for a reason. So is the default to no. If you want to change that because of a very specific personal problem, thats fine - you can (thats the "self empowerment" part), its the "mass rollout" of this configuration you hinted at - that rang some alarmbells - so to speak. Just from a "you might cause more problems than you solve" in the longterm - standpoint.
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Well just to clarify not at one point did I ever almost ruin my device that's just pure imagination on your part furthermore I did not blame any program for my own actions I stated my experience. Secondly I can do whatever I want with a device I purchase, are you attempting to police the entire community with our own personal "ethical" standards on what should and should not be done with their property? I can tell you're biased because people sell these and it makes you upset. I've identified as not part of that community and honestly I don't owe you any explanation on what I want to do with my devices period. The quantity is also irrelevant can one not own more than two tvs? But again the issue was solved mainly by the aid of the others contributing to this post thanks for your ethical input though. Lol.
harlekinade said:
Then a simple question.
Did you plan, at any point, to sell rooted AFTVs with Teamviewer on them and Superuser modified in a way that defaults to granting root rights to any process that asks for them?
Because thats a major issue. Not only because we saw in here over the past few months what happens if some peaple sell other people "free and easy" and then arent able to assist them if something breaks. The influx of technically illiterate users - having been sold on "free" and then not getting what they paid for in the end, looking for "support" everywhere they could think of, has scared the enthusiasts community in this sector for years to come.
And amazons moves surrounding it (explained away by product bloggers as "easier for most people" and "necessary") ended up establishing blacklists on consumer android devices for the first time in history (?), and almost killed Kodi as an afterthought (there was money to be made, if you faltered and bowed to amazons restrictions).
Resellers were and still are misusing this community by playing out entities that at no point had a self concept of becoming "product support helplines" and destroying the open source ethos by funneling a mainstream clientel through small community channels, that werent created to handle them.
If you look around you - in this forum, on reddit - even on aftvnews - this is what is left at this point, and some of us have no interest in rekindling the hype.
Part of demanding questions from an open source community is also, that you reflect, contrast, rethink and tinker with ideas in the open. XDA becoming a place for the masses to get personal support services - actually destroys communities like this. People demanding that you attend to their personal needs first, and always are respectful, charming and considerate can become problematic also.
When you had opened the Superuser binary in the texteditor, complaining that it only shows you "cryptic symbols" you were exactly one or two steps away from ruining Superuser on your device. Namely - changing ANY of those cryptic symbols and then saving the file you had already opened with the intent to edit.
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You're still on about me reselling devices I don't know what to tell you I'm not gonna respond to it anymore. I was never close to bricking my device but I love how you decided to map out a scenario where I could have. You seem to be dead set on policing this forum (this post) and I find it odd you're talking about the history of this community after just 10 posts. I never demanded anything, this is a forum as you stated. I made an inquiry you can either help or you can ignore (I thanked those who helped). Or you can force your own moral agenda down everyone's throat that would be option c, the one you chose. Anyway there's really nothing left to be said my issue was resolved with the help of those interested in the actual question. I know people sell these things so does everyone else, this is not relevant to this post however.
harlekinade said:
I have a history in here beyond those 10 postings - but thats a story for another day..
My intent may have been to rattle some notions - but not to "police" by mentioning the concept of ethics once. I'm merely a peasant at this point in time, with a handful of soil in his hand, muttering "what have you done to this place"..
If I had any real power left to wield in here, arguing over concepts would be higher rated than providing "easy solutions". It isn't.
Also, sorry that I have borrowed your thread - and thank you for the conversation. I enjoyed it.
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I figured there was more to your ten post history. Perhaps maybe you were not so ethical at one point to have lost those powers??? [emoji50] But hey like I said you made me laugh so no complaints here. Continue to enjoy the forum as will I.