Develop Bugs

Desire 2.1/2.2?

Alright. I have been looking over some of the supposed fixes and features that are to come with 2.2. The thing is though, I have noticed that these things are already available on the Desire. Increased Ram, Flash 10.1, and a few other things. I know the Desire is running 2.1... but why does it seem to have the features 2.2 is said to bring? Has anyone else noticed this or found it a bit odd?

Whiterin said:
Alright. I have been looking over some of the supposed fixes and features that are to come with 2.2. The thing is though, I have noticed that these things are already available on the Desire. Increased Ram, Flash 10.1, and a few other things. I know the Desire is running 2.1... but why does it seem to have the features 2.2 is said to bring? Has anyone else noticed this or found it a bit odd?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the desire doesn't have very good flash implementation 10.1 is suppose to bring flawless flash which could possibly be GPU accelerated at the moment. at the moment flash on the desire and legend is flash lite and is 100% software based (ie no acceleration)
more ram i assume means more available as in 2.2 has a smaller memory imprint add that and JIT compiler and we are in for a big performance boost on all current 2.1 devices (provided an update is supplied)

the desire doesn't have flash 10.1, it has flash lite.

What I am talking about with the Ram is that supposedly when 2.2 comes out, the phones that currently have 512mb of Ram will have 576, the same as the Desire has. The Desire also has FM radio, and some other things 2.2 is meant to bring. That's why I thought maybe there were some 2.2 features on the Desire now. Since the Desire already has some of these features, what will 2.2 mean for it? Does the Desire have the extra ram because of the kernal/rom it uses, or because it physically has the extra Ram? If it physically has the extra, does that mean 2.2 will increase the Ram on the Desire as well?

noobdeagle said:
the desire doesn't have very good flash implementation 10.1 is suppose to bring flawless flash which could possibly be GPU accelerated at the moment. at the moment flash on the desire and legend is flash lite and is 100% software based (ie no acceleration)
more ram i assume means more available as in 2.2 has a smaller memory imprint add that and JIT compiler and we are in for a big performance boost on all current 2.1 devices (provided an update is supplied)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If not supplied, we will hack it

Say a phone running 2.1 , has 512mb of ram, not all of that ram is available as say 200mb is used by android 2.1,
the 2.2 basically means instead of using the 200mb that 2.1 uses, it will use 150mb, therefore freeing up 50mb of ram.

2.2 is also ment to have JIT (just in time), apparently apps will be 3x faster and use less battery

i hope that htc release their sense quite soon after the froyo is out cause i LOVE it. i wonder why some people are trying to vanish it off their phones. i didn't find something that the stock android can do better than the sense does. anyway i just hope froyo to be ported to desire soon!!!

Phil750123 said:
Say a phone running 2.1 , has 512mb of ram, not all of that ram is available as say 200mb is used by android 2.1,
the 2.2 basically means instead of using the 200mb that 2.1 uses, it will use 150mb, therefore freeing up 50mb of ram.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I get that much, but I find it odd that the Desire has 576 while all the other new phone have 512, and with 2.2 the other phones are supposed to have the same amount of Ram as the Desire. Don't most of the new HTC phones have basically the same hardware and Android version? What it is about the Desire that makes it have more Ram then the other phones, and when 2.2 comes out, will the Desire also get a boost in Ram, or will it stay at 576?
Also, I may sound a little out of the loop here, but what exactly is JIT meant to do?
As for Sense UI. I really like some of the HTC Widgets, but I was looking forward to the new Drawer feature in 2.1 as well as the unlock screen... I love the Desire, and I am slowly getting used to the Launch bar at the bottom... but the lock screen on the Desire is awefull. I would really have preferred the normal 2.1 unlock screen. I know you can root it and change it, but I would rather not root my phone. I also know you can download Helix or whatever it is called and have the Drawer launcher, but my HTC Widgets don't work with it and Sense is still open in the background using up Ram.

Whiterin said:
I get that much, but I find it odd that the Desire has 576 while all the other new phone have 512, and with 2.2 the other phones are supposed to have the same amount of Ram as the Desire. Don't most of the new HTC phones have basically the same hardware and Android version? What it is about the Desire that makes it have more Ram then the other phones, and when 2.2 comes out, will the Desire also get a boost in Ram, or will it stay at 576?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you're getting a little bit confused here. RAM is the physical amount of memory the device has. The desire has 576MB on a chip. The Nexus One, for example, has 512MB, also on a chip.
No software update is going to change that. The only thing the software update can do is to make the RAM usage more efficient, meaning the device will have more available RAM, as mentioned above.
But they'll still have the exact same amount of total RAM as they did before the update.

tuatha said:
I think you're getting a little bit confused here. RAM is the physical amount of memory the device has. The desire has 576MB on a chip. The Nexus One, for example, has 512MB, also on a chip.
No software update is going to change that. The only thing the software update can do is to make the RAM usage more efficient, meaning the device will have more available RAM, as mentioned above.
But they'll still have the exact same amount of total RAM as they did before the update.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know how Ram works. I am asking why is the amount of Ram on the Desire currently higher then other new phones. I mean the actual ram allotted and usable. Does the Desire physically have more Ram, or is there something about the Rom or Kernal version that is letting it have more usable memory? Seems like you're saying the actual physical RAM is higher. Which still leaves the question of whether or not the Desire will have more usable memory when 2.2 hits. From reading around on the internet, 2.2 is supposed to up the usable memory on some of the newer devices (Nexus One and possibly Incredible) because it is based off of a newer Kernal. So if the Desire has more physical memory then the other devices, and the new Kernal is able to free up more of it to be usable... it would be logical to assume that the Desire will get an increase of the usable memory. If there is something about the current Rom or Kernal on the Desire that allows for more usable memory, but it has the same amount of memory as say, the Nexus one... then they should be even when 2.2 hits. Which one of those will happen is what I am wondering if anyone knows.

Yes, it physically has more RAM than the Nexus One. A total of 576MB of physical RAM. So yes, it should logically follow that it will also have more available RAM after the update (provided both are running identical software versions).
But in all honesty, we don't even have a confirmed feature list for FroYo yet. It's 90% guess-work right now (albeit educated guesses).
Plus we don't know what HTC's updated Sense will be like or how much RAM it will require. It's completely impossible to answer that with any certainty.

tuatha said:
Yes, it physically has more RAM than the Nexus One. A total of 576MB of physical RAM. So yes, it should logically follow that it will also have more available RAM after the update (provided both are running identical software versions).
But in all honesty, we don't even have a confirmed feature list for FroYo yet. It's 90% guess-work right now (albeit educated guesses).
Plus we don't know what HTC's updated Sense will be like or how much RAM it will require. It's completely impossible to answer that with any certainty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I have just seen a few places saying the Nexus One as well as other phones that currently have 512 RAM should have 576 available in 2.2. Like you said though, most of it is guess work, so hard to tell how accurate that is. Hopefully in 2.2 they will let you change the launch bar and the drawer to the 3D scrolling one. Also hope they change the lock screen. Anyways, thanks for the replies everyone.

Whiterin said:
Yeah, I have just seen a few places saying the Nexus One as well as other phones that currently have 512 RAM should have 576 available in 2.2. Like you said though, most of it is guess work, so hard to tell how accurate that is. Hopefully in 2.2 they will let you change the launch bar and the drawer to the 3D scrolling one. Also hope they change the lock screen. Anyways, thanks for the replies everyone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see how that's possible re: upping the N1's memory. Unless it already has 576MB of physical RAM, only 512MB of which is active. Which seems incredibly unlikely.
Unless somebody knows differently, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that whoever said that was either misinformed or a liar
I'm no expert though, so I could be wrong.

Whiterin said:
Yeah, I have just seen a few places saying the Nexus One as well as other phones that currently have 512 RAM should have 576 available in 2.2. Like you said though, most of it is guess work, so hard to tell how accurate that is. Hopefully in 2.2 they will let you change the launch bar and the drawer to the 3D scrolling one. Also hope they change the lock screen. Anyways, thanks for the replies everyone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's impossible. The Nexus One was released with 512MB and no update will increase that amount.

Hmm, perhaps it was a mistake from whoever wrote the article then.

is there a possibility that the nexus 1 does have a 576 chip in it? I understand on the spec sheet it says 512mb, but seeing how the desire and nexus are the same device packaged differently, it wouldn't surprise me if there is an extra 64mb of RAM not currently being used.
It would be great for some one who really knows to actually confirm that the nexus really only has 512mb inside.

Why would it not have 64mb less? It's not like the Desire has an actual extra mic. And it has an optical trackpad. There are differences, just like the RAM.
And most importantly, why wouldn't the specs say it has 64mb extra. And why not use those 64mb extra? It seems to me it would be quite stupid not to mention ánd use it when it's actually in the device.

Ramedge said:
is there a possibility that the nexus 1 does have a 576 chip in it? I understand on the spec sheet it says 512mb, but seeing how the desire and nexus are the same device packaged differently, it wouldn't surprise me if there is an extra 64mb of RAM not currently being used.
It would be great for some one who really knows to actually confirm that the nexus really only has 512mb inside.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it definitley only has 512MB of ram, why wouldn't they enable the extra 64MB? They are similar devices but by no means the exact same.

Why would it not have 64mb less? It's not like the Desire has an actual extra mic. And it has an optical trackpad. There are differences, just like the RAM.
And most importantly, why wouldn't the specs say it has 64mb extra. And why not use those 64mb extra? It seems to me it would be quite stupid not to mention ánd use it when it's actually in the device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well Google/HTC are stupid then aren't they. they didn't mention the nexus ones FM radio capability, HTC forgot to mention the Desires wireless N radio. from a production point of view its easier to keep the PCBs the same with the same chips, peripherals like track pads and microphones are easy to add/remove.
it honestly wouldn't surprise me, from experience. this is why I want some one to really confirm this.

"ReadyBoost" for Android?

Hello,
Why isnt it possible to use SDCRAM as sort of RAM in android? same as VISA/7 Using ReadyBoost to expand the ram with an USB disk on keys?
thanks!

Why would you want that?

since you only use flash based memory anyway: that's called swaping

And is Swap enabled in all froyo roms today?

rommark said:
And is Swap enabled in all froyo roms today?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But why would you need it? You have 512MB of RAM, with a clean boot you have around 200-220MB of it free for whatever you want to do with it. Not enough for you?

martino2k6 said:
But why would you need it? You have 512MB of RAM, with a clean boot you have around 200-220MB of it free for whatever you want to do with it. Not enough for you?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
won't heavy 3d games eat that?

rommark said:
won't heavy 3d games eat that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. Smartphones =/= PCs. And if you are really out of space for a short amount of time, unneeded processes get killed automatically. Swap was only really needed on the G1 but definitely not on the Desire.

rommark said:
won't heavy 3d games eat that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, that's a bit too much even for a game... unless the code has memory leaks. With so much RAM it'd make more sense to use ramdisk (but who knows for what good use)

martino2k6 said:
No, that's a bit too much even for a game... unless the code has memory leaks. With so much RAM it'd make more sense to use ramdisk (but who knows for what good use)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RamDisk could be insane for 3d gaming as then the textures would have fast extraction means less delay in rendering....

What Readyboost is NOT
Hey folks. I've only recently discovered Readyboost as I'm primarily a Linux guy. I got all hot and bothered about it immediately as well as it is (despite Microsofts constant onslaught of horrific failures) an absolutely brilliant and elegant technology/idea.
HOWEVER!!!
Nearly everyone is confused about what RB actually does, so I thought I'd take a minute to explain.
ReadyBoost is NOT swap. NOT SWAP!, not swap.
Swap is not something to get excited about, it is a last resort for when you're out of RAM and it's excruciatingly slow. In the land of IT, one of the first things we check for when a server is experiencing horrible performance, is "IS THIS MACHINE SWAPPING". Everyone's gotta learn that swap, while it is more useful than "not enough memory" it is nor more useful than utilizing the memory you already have, and it will always result in poor performance.
ReadyBoost is an additional disc cache for small, non-sequential reads/writes. It works with your existing FS cache but is faster in some cases because FLASH has a much lower seek time. Most FLASH chips have a seek time of <1ms while most rotational discs have a seek time of around 8ms. This adds up on a large number of small non-sequential r/w.
ReadyBoost takes any caching operations which fit it's strength profile (small, non-sequential) and offloads them to your FLASH device. This can increase load speed of some files/application dramatically (2-20x faster).
So, when someone asks you if they can use Readyboost because they don't have enough memory, please, take a moment to explain that RB is not swap, but is in fact a supplementary disc cache for small, non-sequential reads and writes.
That said, I haven't had time to dig into the question of whether or not RB would benefit Linux FS's.

I know this is a really old thread but I just wanted to put my two cents in. Memory boosting apps like ReadyBoost do have a viable purpose. That is keeping older hardware viable as minimum specs increase. There is an Android app that is equivilant to ReadyBoost called Roehsoft RAM Expander. There are mixed reviews for its performance but that is to be expected. If this app helps my aging 8227_Demo head unit work well enough for me to not replace it I will update this post.

[SOLVED][Q] Where's the RAM?

My phone shows 370Mb Total, 198Mb Free. Not the 512Mb as promised.
I don't get it. Is some of this RAM blocked off and dedicated to some obscure backgrounded processes?
How much RAM do you guys have?

reserved for system

I read around a bit. So does the GPU share in the 512? How come my G1 showed the full advertised 192Mb and this does not?

funkeee said:
I read around a bit. So does the GPU share in the 512? How come my G1 showed the full advertised 192Mb and this does not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, the GPU (and the radio) shares in the 512MB. That's normal.

believe the radio/gpu are using 128mb or close to that

larryccf said:
believe the radio/gpu are using 128mb or close to that
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is this configurable? Some users might want to be able to switch between two profiles: Gamin/Business

funkeee said:
I read around a bit. So does the GPU share in the 512? How come my G1 showed the full advertised 192Mb and this does not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
different cpu/gpu combo.
thats y the g2 has better graphics.
No bigger tho you wont have a problem with it

Ram Hack Impossible?

I was wondering if we can expect a ramhack in the future or if it looks like it will never happen.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App

That would be awesome. I too am intrigued by this.

is a ram hack even necessary? it certainly was with my G1 but this phone has much more ram that anything we might be able to free would be irrelevant

Ramhack?
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 running Cyanogenmod.

Powers88 said:
is a ram hack even necessary? it certainly was with my G1 but this phone has much more ram that anything we might be able to free would be irrelevant
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For me, it's not even a matter of if it's necessary, but can it be done?

Where there's a will there's a way

More is better my old nexus got 400 MB usable via ramhacks, on less optimal conditions I miss those few bytes.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App

Also interested in this. Anything to increase performance, Im all for it.

Definately worth looking in to.

Powers88 said:
is a ram hack even necessary? it certainly was with my G1 but this phone has much more ram that anything we might be able to free would be irrelevant
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm with you. The reason I sold my mt3g and picked up the mt4g was mainly for the extra ram. The G2 has plenty, I don't really see the need.
If I recall correctly the extra ram came at the expense of graphics and 3d. Hardly a worthwhile trade off for a device that already has plenty of ram.

Phateless said:
I'm with you. The reason I sold my mt3g and picked up the mt4g was mainly for the extra ram. The G2 has plenty, I don't really see the need.
If I recall correctly the extra ram came at the expense of graphics and 3d. Hardly a worthwhile trade off for a device that already has plenty of ram.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya they had that ram hack and they had the one that was with the new radio which just allowed for 14 more megs to be freed without losing anything

Powers88 said:
Ya they had that ram hack and they had the one that was with the new radio which just allowed for 14 more megs to be freed without losing anything
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The new radio is different than the old ram hack.
If I'm wrong about this, someone please correct me.
The ram hack "stole" memory from gpu. (graphics)
The new radio/spl mapped memory that was previously unavailable in its entirety and gave us access to it.
Does that make more sense? The first is a hack/mod done by the devs here and the second is an upgrade from HTC/T-mobile.

Phateless said:
The new radio is different than the old ram hack.
If I'm wrong about this, someone please correct me.
The ram hack "stole" memory from gpu. (graphics)
The new radio/spl mapped memory that was previously unavailable in its entirety and gave us access to it.
Does that make more sense? The first is a hack/mod done by the devs here and the second is an upgrade from HTC/T-mobile.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your right, I already knew what it was I just didnt explain it

The nexus was able to increase the ram by repartitioning its usage. Why can't we? Does anybody have a partition map saying how much ram goes to every reasource? I know 371 is not the max we can pull out.
Sent from my CM7 G2

If I'm not mistaken I believe I saw something about memory partitions in the wiki.
Sent from my thumbs

[Q to devs and everyone]what is the max RAM amount we can get from galaxy s?

i have started my own and read every topic about why we could not see all the ram as user available (329 instead of 512) .. first i compared galaxy s with tab but it turned out tab has 640 Mb of real memory in total.. but i also have seen it was possible to add more memory about 40 Mb to the user available ram .. and i also learned there is also a part which is not used and called "blackhole" approximitely another 40 Mb..
so i believe it is possible to make some adjustments to improve the weakest (according to me) part of our galaxy s.. would some devs please mind trying this for us and share it?

We don't need the RAM (yet)
There are a lot of developers who try to get more out of our SGS's. For instance Juwe/ GingerReal increases the RAM to around 340MB.
Appearently Google thinks we don't need the full potential RAM and that's why they made it with a default of 300-330MB. Still still most developers agree on XDA that we should be able to acces the other 160MB because it doesn't do anything.
Until then we'll just have to wait.

even 340 Mb instead of 329 makes a difference .. i cant think what would happen with 380 or 400 or maybe even more..
because as far as i understood from what i have read; 128 memory is reserved for some drivers and capturing video is taking most of it.. i am taking a video maybe once in 2 monts.. but i am using my widgets, apps, playing my games everyday.. so if was asked to choose i would love to have that memory reserved for video taking..
edit:typo

First of all, the amount of RAM is NOT related to the ROM....
The kernel makes the difference...
In general the max amount of RAM in Gingerbread is 340MB, cuz if we go over the phone will become unstable and we'll break some functions like 720p recording....
In Froyo we used to reach max of 350MB without issues

just curiosity;
galaxy s2 and galaxy s has the same rams with different amounts.. what would happen if we soldered the 1gb ram to galaxy s? would it recognize it without any software tuning? or would we just kill the phone completely? or would still see 329 ?

simone201 said:
First of all, the amount of RAM is NOT related to the ROM....
The kernel makes the difference...
In general the max amount of RAM in Gingerbread is 340MB, cuz if we go over the phone will become unstable and we'll break some functions like 720p recording....
In Froyo we used to reach max of 350MB without issues
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so is it possible to disable video recording completely and having lots of more Mb?

_delice_doluca_ said:
just curiosity;
galaxy s2 and galaxy s has the same rams with different amounts.. what would happen if we soldered the 1gb ram to galaxy s? would it recognize it without any software tuning? or would we just kill the phone completely? or would still see 329 ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you want to instert 1GB ram into our SGS? I dunno sincerely what will happen.....
_delice_doluca_ said:
so is it possible to disable video recording completely and having lots of more Mb?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably yes, i am not a kernel expert, i am only a rom cooker/recognised developer, so my knowledge on kernels is very basic....
Maybe you'd better directly ask to a kernel dev like hardcore, nikademus, chainfire....

simone201 said:
Do you want to instert 1GB ram into our SGS? I dunno sincerely what will happen.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i would really want that but i am sure its not as easy as soldering the gps antenna.. i have read about a HTC device getting a memory upgrade to 128Mb from 64 in xda forum.. so technically there is no impossible but i wonder what else need to be done after soldering the ram? software adjustments (kernel maybe?), or any more hardware changes ?
simone201 said:
Probably yes, i am not a kernel expert, i am only a rom cooker/recognised developer, so my knowledge on kernels is very basic....
Maybe you'd better directly ask to a kernel dev like hardcore, nikademus, chainfire....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks for tip, i will ask them..

i am really feeling bad about this ram issue.. every web page is showing nexus, galaxy s, galaxy tab have 512 Mb of ram.. but the memory dedicated for users is far less than the other 2 phones in galaxy s ... so it bothers me.. is there anyone who returns their phones to samsung and gets the money back?
first i believed somehow it was possible to use most of the ram with some software adjustement but then i realised even quadrant shows the total amount of ram memory is only 384 mb (and there is a part which is not used at all) ..