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We all know Microsoft is on a roll to make patent licensing agreements with Android OEMs. Since last week, Microsoft have announced 4 such deals without disclosing the amount of royalty involved. Today Reuters that Microsoft is demanding about $15 per Android device from Samsung, one of the largest android OEM in the world. Microsoft is also ready to lower the royalty amount if Samsung agrees with some deeper alliance related to Windows Phone smartphone making. Microsoft signed similar deal with HTC last year, Will Samsung also join the fray soon? I hope Samsung agrees with Microsoft on the later deal of less royalty amount for Android devices and more Windows Phone smartphones. Also analysts predict Samsung to ship about 19 million smartphones this quarter, if the deal is done Microsoft will get about $1 Billion IP licensing revenue from Samsung alone in a year...
Now that is a beautiful puzzle, they've already released the most user friendly and in my opinion best is on the market and now they're putting a squeeze on the big name android OEMs to eliminate some of the competition. I love this, now just throw in some good marketing and well have the trifecta of a perfect operating system.
z33dev33l said:
We all know Microsoft is on a roll to make patent licensing agreements with Android OEMs. Since last week, Microsoft have announced 4 such deals without disclosing the amount of royalty involved. Today Reuters that Microsoft is demanding about $15 per Android device from Samsung, one of the largest android OEM in the world. Microsoft is also ready to lower the royalty amount if Samsung agrees with some deeper alliance related to Windows Phone smartphone making. Microsoft signed similar deal with HTC last year, Will Samsung also join the fray soon? I hope Samsung agrees with Microsoft on the later deal of less royalty amount for Android devices and more Windows Phone smartphones. Also analysts predict Samsung to ship about 19 million smartphones this quarter, if the deal is done Microsoft will get about $1 Billion IP licensing revenue from Samsung alone in a year...
Now that is a beautiful puzzle, they've already released the most user friendly and in my opinion best is on the market and now they're putting a squeeze on the big name android OEMs to eliminate some of the competition. I love this, now just throw in some good marketing and well have the trifecta of a perfect operating system.
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Well, you know what they say...fruit is better for us than pastries/dairy. (Mango vs. Ice Cream Sandwich/Eclair)
good for them, I don't think it's good for us
I can't believe a thread on xda of all places supporting a broken patent system, extortion, profiterring instead of innovation. wow.
*wipes tear* i love you Microsoft! always have done and will be loyal forever
The only group to blame for this is Google, releasing something that completely infringes on a bunch of other peoples patents. While it may be a douchey move to do this to the very manufactures you're partnered with, I can't blame MS.
ohgood said:
I can't believe a thread on xda of all places supporting a broken patent system, extortion, profiterring instead of innovation. wow.
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Except, after seeing your responses on here for months now... You would have zero problems with this if Google was doing it, right?
FiyaFleye said:
Except, after seeing your responses on here for months now... You would have zero problems with this if Google was doing it, right?
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You are probably right
I'm kinda put off by some of those patents . I mean really .. you can patent that ?
Although they do own the patents so "Pay up Sucka's ."
This will not be good for user's in the end either way .
My .02
ohgood said:
I can't believe a thread on xda of all places supporting a broken patent system, extortion, profiterring instead of innovation. wow.
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But be logical now instead of loyal. Is it fair for someone to release a product using a part of something that you own and you receive nothing for it?
How would you feel if you developed an app and I took a portion of that and created my own app and made millions?
I am not saying the patent system is perfect; it is far from. But people need to innovate and license, not steal and pass off. And we are not even sure what this patent infringement is, but players are settling quickly. This suggests to me that it may be open and shut wrong-doing on Google's part.
But the thread is a little sensational. If MS's intention was to cripple they would be doing more than seeking royalties
nicksti said:
But be logical now instead of loyal. Is it fair for someone to release a product using a part of something that you own and you receive nothing for it?
How would you feel if you developed an app and I took a portion of that and created my own app and made millions?
I am not saying the patent system is perfect; it is far from. But people need to innovate and license, not steal and pass off. And we are not even sure what this patent infringement is, but players are settling quickly. This suggests to me that it may be open and shut wrong-doing on Google's part.
But the thread is a little sensational. If MS's intention was to cripple they would be doing more than seeking royalties
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That's my sentiments and what I've been about all along. Yet when I say Apple has the rights to receive compensation on their infringed patents, I'm an Apple fanboy. Then when I side with MS's side of the patent infringement, I'm a MS fanboy. The only time I'm not harassed badly for seeming like a fanboy is when I say something favorable about Google. If I say something favorable about any other company...even if the favored words are intermixed with multiple companies, I'm a fanboy. The friggin rationality of the web is beyond mind twisting. People will stomp and storm over the least little thing.
nicksti said:
If MS's intention was to cripple they would be doing more than seeking royalties
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I agree with this. MS definitely has the money to go after Google itself if they wanted to, but going after OEM's could be a way to secure a footing for WP7 as it's up to them to push WP7. If OEM's don't support WP7, it's screwed. Also, going after Google would conflict with MS & it's anti-monopoly issues.
Kinda old. Its been a known fact that Microsoft makes more money from Android than WP7.
Sad, sick, but true. The patent system is ridiculous.
The patent system is there to protect people from having their stuff stolen. How'd you like it if someone broke into your house & stole everything? Ok, not exactly the same thing. Or how about, you developer some new software or Ui or something & some big company like MS/Apple/Google steals it & makes millions or even billions off it? It's funny how when it's the big corperations, it's "sad/sick/etc," but if it were some small company or a single person, it's ok.
Double Standards just aren't cool. I may not like big corporations & their greed, but guest what, they have rights too.
You do realize that patent licensing happens everywhere to protect the developer of a technology. Like DVD/Blu Ray manufacturers paying royalties to the developers of that technology. The "Blu-ray Disc Association" (Sony, Panasonic, Pioneer, Philips, Thomson, LG (Lucky GoldStar) Electronics, Hitachi, Sharp, and Samsung) created the Blu Ray format, so everyone else making Blu Ray players/burners must pay a royalty. How would you like it if you were the developer of Blu Ray & seeing all these companies making money on your technology while you're broke.
NOTE: In all of MS's 36 years, this is only the 7th time they actually acted on their patents.
drkfngthdragnlrd said:
The patent system is there to protect people from having their stuff stolen. How'd you like it if someone broke into your house & stole everything? Ok, not exactly the same thing. Or how about, you developer some new software or Ui or something & some big company like MS/Apple/Google steals it & makes millions or even billions off it? It's funny how when it's the big corperations, it's "sad/sick/etc," but if it were some small company or a single person, it's ok.
Double Standards just aren't cool. I may not like big corporations & their greed, but guest what, they have rights too.
You do realize that patent licensing happens everywhere to protect the developer of a technology. Like DVD/Blu Ray manufacturers paying royalties to the developers of that technology. The "Blu-ray Disc Association" (Sony, Panasonic, Pioneer, Philips, Thomson, LG (Lucky GoldStar) Electronics, Hitachi, Sharp, and Samsung) created the Blu Ray format, so everyone else making Blu Ray players/burners must pay a royalty. How would you like it if you were the developer of Blu Ray & seeing all these companies making money on your technology while you're broke.
NOTE: In all of MS's 36 years, this is only the 7th time they actually acted on their patents.
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I agree with you.....
everyone have the right to collect $$$$ for their patents, as they have spent time money and efforts, and no one is allowed to just take and use someone else's work...
Google will have more trouble coming their way when Nortel patents will change hands...
Oracle is also going to collect money from Google for some stuff they used in android, estimated $2 billion or so....
Google should have done their homework tbh, handing over these issues to the hardware manufacturers is pretty weak.
Not that I'm agreeing with these patents, some of them are very vaguely defined.
You guys really don't know how vague some of the patents are. Hell I can pick any software and find some copied code. Do some deeper investigation yourself. Doesn't matter how big or small a company is, doesn't matter to me if its Google, Apple, or some unknown Guy down the street.
The patent system needs a major over haul. Make a new OS or program and make millions, and I guarantee you that you will be slapped with patent infringement. Its sick.
truffle1234 said:
I agree with you.....
everyone have the right to collect $$$$ for their patents, as they have spent time money and efforts, and no one is allowed to just take and use someone else's work...
Google will have more trouble coming their way when Nortel patents will change hands...
Oracle is also going to collect money from Google for some stuff they used in android, estimated $2 billion or so....
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You do know oracle had to drop more than 90% of their case.
It isn't vague. When you patent something, you have to be thorough about how it all works. These "news" articles just give the "Title" to the patent. The full patent has this huge legal description of what exactly is patented. I know this because as a kid I was going through the patent process, till my lawyer found out what I was trying to patent already existed. BTW, as for try to make an OS. Well the problem is all OS's are basically the same, very similar UI's save (WP7). they all have some form of taskbar/start menu/window based applications. The whole point why Windows is called Windows. The point of inovation is to make something new, not copy what's there & try to make it different. That's basically borderline plagerism, granted that's to do with writing, but it's the same thing.
See this;
1) No. 6,909,910 from 2005 for "managing changes to a contact database."
2) No. 7,644,376, issued in 2010 to cover an API that lets mobile apps learn about state changes in the device.
3) No. 5,664,133 from 1997 covering "context sensitive menu system/menu behavior," known more generally as a graphical user interface that lets users "quickly and easily select/execute the desired computer resource."
4) No. 6,578,054 from 2003 covering online and offline transmission of data through methods that "eliminate data transmission and allow multiple copies of data to be synchronized via incremental changes."
5) No. 6,370,566 from 2002, with the self-explanatory title, "Generating Meeting Requests and Group Scheduling From a Mobile Device."
All of that us understandable but the patent system us royally ****ed up.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/27/technology/27patent.html
http://www.macgasm.net/2009/12/30/the-patent-system-is-broken-and-nokia-vs-apple-continues/
There are patents that defy the laws of phsyics, patents that are beyond belief. ****s stupid. Its actually hurting innovation from the little guys.
Ok I hesitated before creating this topic because everytime you mention Android here you end up with arguments and closed threads. Let's try to all behave like adults that can have a proper conversation.
So, Google buys Motorola Mobility... Do you think other OEMs will come running to Microsoft anytime soon? And should they be welcome with open arms? Or do you think Microsoft should also make its hardware and buy Nokia/RIM? I'm not sure which is the best strategy but it's likely this will hugely impact Windows Phone.
Dont think anything will change or this will have any big impact on WP7. htc, samsung, etc always had android as their preferred platform and make boatloads of cash from it, this will likely just make them compete harder and possibly neglect WP7 even more. Which basically is the situation today.
I think MS should buy Nokia after WP7 is well established and selling well, then they can build on that and not be beholden to the android OEM's.
1. Windows Phone 7 will not be running on Motorola/Google hardware
2. More focus on internal hardware, ie; updates will be released for internal hardware ahead of what is release to other suppliers
3. Multi-vendor support will decline ane more WP7 support
4. Increase in WP7 support at the expense of Android
Apple does its manufacturing in-house.
Google owns Motorola.
Microsoft's major partner is Nokia.
It's all the same thing, just with a different spin on it. Nothing will change. If anything, it might make OEM's prefer Windows Phone over Android... probably not, but maybe. It's all speculation anyway.
efjay said:
Dont think anything will change or this will have any big impact on WP7. htc, samsung, etc always had android as their preferred platform and make boatloads of cash from it, this will likely just make them compete harder and possibly neglect WP7 even more. Which basically is the situation today.
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I don't know, eventually Motorola phones will get exclusive features and will probably be the only Android phones that get day one updates like the Nexus One/S. If Motorola sales grow too much there's a case to be made for Samsung, HTC, etc. to go and look elsewhere.
one big patant war
so now we have google&motorola vs MS&nokia vs apple&(let them buy samsung)
I was about to make the same question, I think that Google buying Motorola Mobile maybe will help WP7, why? Because now the other OEMs will have to compete against Google as a Hardware maker... Before, they were where partners, now they're competing companies and obviously Google will have preference for Motorola over the other companies when delivering updates, etc... That's my thinking...
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Means we are screwed. Not!
Motorola aint Nokia. But yes, expect some real nasty Android devices, as Google is (dont deny) a creative company. HTC and Samsung will spend more time trying to follow Motorola, as Motorola will always update their phones fast as Google update Android.
It will be nice, I admit. One of the fatal flaw of Android just ended together with the treat of the patent war (which puts Google again on feet).
Android will run better on Motorola devices, smoothier, since they are going to work with the hardware and software.
No WP7 on Motorola since Google hate it so bad (look at our Youtube and Google search page).
Maybe less chances to WP7, because 50% of the market is already using Android. Google is more Apple alike now, and this should count.
But probably HTC, Samsung and LG is going to try some more of WP7 Mango juice. Or I hope so. Sony Ericksson would be nice too..
With a good deal I can see Samsung and LG making more WP7 devices, but SE??? I don't know... :-S
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I wouldnt bet on that.. But hope is the to die, right? I like SE's phone. More than LG and Samsung for sure.
Probably means Apple goes after Motorola and Google now and gives Microsoft and Samsung a break. Or they hire even more lawyers to go after all the above.
Oh...what does it mean to us, the consumers? Probably higher prices to pay for all those f**king lawyers.
markgamber said:
Probably means Apple goes after Motorola and Google now and gives Microsoft and Samsung a break. Or they hire even more lawyers to go after all the above.
Oh...what does it mean to us, the consumers? Probably higher prices to pay for all those f**king lawyers.
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Yeah, it makes sense too.
everything to do with patents and nothing to do with hardware.
oh, and a few people just DOUBLED their money on moto-mobile, ill bet. look at the price jump ! wow !
this only effects microsofts ability to sue google, and no royalties. smart move google.
whatever happens, the patent system is still stupid and broken
Sure it's mainly about patents but Google could have just bought/licensed the patents for a lot less, I don't see Motorola turning them down. I think if they went for the whole of Motorola Mobility it's to also make a strong line of hardware. You don't pay $12.5 Billion to not make the best handsets you can when you get an OEM in the package.
Motorola, TBH I was unware they made an android phone!
the acquisition of MM is just about as quiet as MS's acquisition of Danger in 2008. Anyone remember that...not a lot of people =/
Hello the result is Android more protected, and widows phone falling its gud move by google
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Well, I will tell you the future I foresee.
Apple will still be around selling iPhones.
Samsung, HTC, LG, etc. will still be selling Android handsets, but the majority of the handsets they sell will be Windows Phones.
Motorola Mobility (eh. Google Mobility) will be making record breaking profit and will be responsible for 70%+ of all Android phones produce.
Windows Phone will make up the majority of the smartphone market share.
Microsoft will license (but not buy) many technologies from RIM including BlackBerry Messenger.
day2die said:
Well, I will tell you the future I foresee.
1) Apple will still be around selling iPhones.
2) Samsung, HTC, LG, etc. will still be selling Android handsets, but the majority of the handsets they sell will be Windows Phones.
3) Motorola Mobility (eh. Google Mobility) will be making record breaking profit and will be responsible for 70%+ of all Android phones produce.
4) Windows Phone will make up the majority of the smartphone market share.
5) Microsoft will license (but not buy) many technologies from RIM including BlackBerry Messenger.
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1 yep, nice ones even if i don't like their lockdown
2 er - who what why where when - is this going to start happening ?
3 those droiiiiiiiiid commercials were already old. hopefully they branch out in marketing. like htc.
4 repeat of 2
5 why on earth would M$ ever care/want anything about bbm ?
No one knows where this one will head. It all depends on what Google's intentions are for the hardware side of the business. It's doubtful that Google seriously wants to be in the hardware business.
The only firm conclusions I think we can reach are...
(1) It was all about the patents.
(2) Google is more serious about mobile than many people thought previously. They just spent a good chunk of their cash hoard on a bunch of patents that may or may not be sufficient to protect Android and/or they spent a bunch of money on an overpriced phone maker. Either way, they probably more than doubled their total investment in Android.
Personally, I think G will be selling pieces off to interested parties, but I could be wrong.
MS is in an interesting position now. Google just handed them a great talking point for their sales pitch to Samsung/HTC/SE but the BFF relationship with Nokia takes the wind out of that sail. Hard to tell what their next move should be.
Interesting times ahead. Time to go make some more popcorn.
Before I give my opinion, I must admit that my opinions may not hold true legally. I know little more than DMV laws. Nor am I a tech expert, insider or historian. I will be wrong on some facts, but I believe that my overall analysis will stand true.
Apple isn't really hitting Google as hard as some may think.
Google and apple are 2 forces that have an inverse success relationship. This we all know. They compete over the same market. This was from day 1, heck, even before then (depending on how you judge when day 1 was).
This is a fact that hasn't gone unseen to them both. They choose 2 tactics to deal with that issue. Apple chose to gain fame and sales through marketing, and got patents on all that's under the sun. A tactic that may look ugly, but money doesn't care.
Google, on the other hand, doesn't look perfect either. They gave ALL the freedom to developers, and opened the platform up. This protects them from apple, to a degree, because they aren't accountable for the actions of others. This gave their platform an advantage over the legal system and the rights of others.
I dislike apple, and like google, but that's not worth a thing. Google's tactics are healthier towards the market. Apple kills development... Outside apple itself.
The thing is, apple can continue to harm the android platform, and never kill it, ever. This is because android is open, and devs and manufacturers will always adjust.
Google, on the other hand, only needs one hit on ios, One injunction, and apple is dead in the water. Apple has, in many senses, only one device (the iphone and ipad are not that different). If they can stop the iphone OR the ipad, they don't need to settle, they can keep devices off the market for weeks, months or even permanently (if it's a hardware issue).
Keep in mind that most apple devices are produced BEFORE THE FIRST PIECE IS SOLD. So once google stops a device, apple's sales stop for a year (or so). apple can throw all what it made in the sea, or ship them overseas.
Also keep in mind, that most development and it's financial backing (as in app sales), is within US borders. This means IOS will effectively die.
BUT
What's hard to believe, is that both parties needed the existence of each other. In this case, each of them needed a competitor (though they each wanted the bigger piece of the pie). Economics says that competition creates demand, and in some cases vice versa. Ex: look at Pepsi and coke. They gained by competing, through keeping the other soda manufacturers out. The war between these two tech giants helped them sell devices.
Part of the reason that the current situation got so ugly, is that the market has a new competitor, a crappy one too (apple and Google's wet dream). Microsoft has taken apple's closed stance. This allows for the existence of google, not apple, as it is a more direct competition with the latter. Microsoft also gains if it remains in the market with Android, even as a weaker party, because it gets so much money off most android manufacturers (through licensing settlements) .
This whole situation is a move to drive apple out of the market. Apple's is clawing everyone cause it knows that it's being choked. Apple will not hold back any card that will keep it alive, even suing a search engine for searching for stuff.
THIS IS ONLY THE BEGINNING.
Am I right?
------------------------------------
Sent from my banned Galaxy Nexus
If Google gets that patent for the notification center then apple will be surely in the cesspool.
It's all been dramatized to elicit blog clicks. Nothing will be the end or death or ruin of either of them, they'll just posture enough and setup a convincing enough legal threat by building precedent with these little cases until they're forced into some sort of cross licensing deal. It's business, not politics, or religion. Don't believe the hype.
Well patent for notification center will be an exact stop point for Apple because they have only few devices that uses same OS. It's not the same as Android where one condition applies to a minority of devices.
Apple is destined to die anyway. Their biggest innovation in the last few years was providing more density to their devices as I've said in another thread.
Djabolic said:
Apple is destined to die anyway. Their biggest innovation in the last few years was providing more density to their devices as I've said in another thread.
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Apple's not going anywhere. Part of their genius is convincing their idiot users that the Apple logo is all the innovation they need to look for.
1cewolf said:
Apple's not going anywhere. Part of their genius is convincing their idiot users that the Apple logo is all the innovation they need to look for.
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And that is the core of apple. Misleading when they use the full shiny apple when in reality it should be a picture of a rotten core.
butter and jelly please...
Google just being quite. thats all. They wanted all the crApple and its user just use their Google product only. If only they dont have that, Apple would be long gone. Most technology used in Apple, are from Google(i think so...). and if Samsung, HTC and others join forces and stating each of their patent used by Apple, its done. the thing is, other companies actually wanted a healthy competition, which is totally different than how Apple see it, cuz they are out of ideas and forgot how to innovate!
I have yet to understand why Google hasn't sued apple back. For example, one of apples newest features is from android. The feature in which when you receive a call you can reply back with a text stating "i am driving" for instance. Meanwhile, the apple notification Center was biggest steal ever. Finally, they sued amazon for calling their store the App store. App store is just to generic they honestly can't have a patent on that....
It is as if i sued a grocery store because i have a patent on the word grocery store so they can't call themselves grocery store.
Samsung Galaxy s2 Nuclear Rocket - Embryo 3.2 [UCLE2 BASE]
iPhone 4S - Gave it away, not cool enough
iPhone 3GS - Went for a Swim
Dog - Custom Rom [Golden Retriever] [BEAR2 BASE]
LuffyPSP said:
Google just being quite. thats all. They wanted all the crApple and its user just use their Google product only. If only they dont have that, Apple would be long gone. Most technology used in Apple, are from Google(i think so...). and if Samsung, HTC and others join forces and stating each of their patent used by Apple, its done. the thing is, other companies actually wanted a healthy competition, which is totally different than how Apple see it, cuz they are out of ideas and forgot how to innovate!
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the idea of joining forces may seem childish to some, but a quick look at the Rockstar Consortium should change their minds. The problem with that idea is that apple is not their #1 competitor, other android manufacturers are. Google is the only party that can lead a case against apple (on software at least), and Google has been holding back since the start.
My guess is that, that's about to change
1cewolf said:
Apple's not going anywhere. Part of their genius is convincing their idiot users that the Apple logo is all the innovation they need to look for.
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I still have some hope left in me about the next generations will be smarter than the current zombie-like society.
Djabolic said:
I still have some hope left in me about the next generations will be smarter than the current zombie-like society.
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I don't. A co-worker of mine has a college aged daughter who went to an orientation where they were doing some kind of ice breaker game. Anyway, the student gathered around in a circle and they would ask these student something and depending on the answer they would step in the circle. So they asked "whoever didn't have an iPhone step in the circle" and she was the only one to step inside. She felt so bad she's going to buy an iPhone just to be like everyone else. Peer pressure at it's finest
Geo411m said:
I don't. A co-worker of mine has a college aged daughter who went to an orientation where they were doing some kind of ice breaker game. Anyway, the student gathered around in a circle and they would ask these student something and depending on the answer they would step in the circle. So they asked "whoever didn't have an iPhone step in the circle" and she was the only one to step inside. She felt so bad she's going to buy an iPhone just to be like everyone else. Peer pressure at it's finest
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Bet she comes back to the light.
butter and jelly please...
Djabolic said:
If Google gets that patent for the notification center then apple will be surely in the cesspool.
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Click to collapse
At this rate apple will file for it and get it
Sent from my JellyBelly Gnex
Geo411m said:
I don't. A co-worker of mine has a college aged daughter who went to an orientation where they were doing some kind of ice breaker game. Anyway, the student gathered around in a circle and they would ask these student something and depending on the answer they would step in the circle. So they asked "whoever didn't have an iPhone step in the circle" and she was the only one to step inside. She felt so bad she's going to buy an iPhone just to be like everyone else. Peer pressure at it's finest
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Yeah two of my gf's ladies friends only bought iPhones because "everyone has one" I lol'ed and said well more people have android. Then the most painful thing I have done with a phone and that's including rooting. I had to set a mp3 as ringtone for one of her friends iphone.....dear god I didn't think I was going to be able to do it
Sent from my A500 using Tapatalk 2
BrianDigital said:
Yeah two of my gf's ladies friends only bought iPhones because "everyone has one" I lol'ed and said well more people have android. Then the most painful thing I have done with a phone and that's including rooting. I had to set a mp3 as ringtone for one of her friends iphone.....dear god I didn't think I was going to be able to do it
Sent from my A500 using Tapatalk 2
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Yes adding media outside of iTunes sucks. And god forbid you have to use a different computer than the one the iPhone was originally synced on.
i agree with many points. but in my opinion google isn´t so much interested in producing and selling mobile phones. it´s more to keep people related to google itself. the search, email, chat, google+ etc... and i think there´s much more. the accounts and usage of them are important for google itself. the hardware developers samsung htc etc... they sell phones to make money with hardware, google with android and google products. i think android would be enough for supply and demand, because that´s the competition of the hardware-manufacturers (samsung, htc, etc...). i think the mainreasons is the market to keep android alive. as u see with nexus7, google isn´t interested in selling hardware, just to get their software sold. 200$ isn´t much for the hardware. google wants to sell the hardware a) to get as many people to google b) to ace apple out of the market. google makes money with selling software over their market. and with the new market, tv, movies and more. on the other hand, if more people get android, less will stay with apple.
may be, google will become monopolist on the market. dunno, dislike apple and me as customer, i profit from google products. as in op, the policy is more friendly of google than apple.
(sry for may bad english in some cases )
Anthonok said:
At this rate apple will file for it and get it
Sent from my JellyBelly Gnex
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One would hope our patent system isn't so broken that Apple could file now and get it before Google who filed for it years ago.
adrynalyne said:
One would hope our patent system isn't so broken that Apple could file now and get it before Google who filed for it years ago.
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Money goes a long way.
Sent from my JellyBelly Gnex
Anthonok said:
Money goes a long way.
Sent from my JellyBelly Gnex
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That may be, but that sort of blatant corruption would be very visible.
adrynalyne said:
That may be, but that sort of blatant corruption would be very visible.
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They just got the patent for water damage detection and the shape of the macbook air... aka just a thin "wedge" shape... and something extremely similar to Google glass.
Sent from my JellyBelly Gnex
Android, and every other touchscreen OS, (besides iOS) you might as well say goodbye to... I HOPE NOT!
Apple now has the power to destroy Android, Windows Phone, and any other iOS Touchscreen Competitor... Steve Jobs wins this round (for now anyways...)
How long before Apple has the PS2 and S3 Pulled?
Check this out:
http://www.acsyndicate.net/apple-aw...ts-the-possible-end-of-android-as-we-know-it/
This could spell the end for Android and this phone, and I will not be a happy camper if I can't upgrade to the S3 because of Apple... I will throw a major tantrum! But they can ban the Galaxy S, Epic Touch, and S3, along with any and all other android manufacturers... The government will fix this hopefully...
Google, act & appeal fast and fix this mess!!!!
Comments, Thoughts, Last Wishes?
I am not saying this will happen, but is quite possible if the government doesn't block Apple in their tracks from doing so... (I think once Google Appeals, these parents will be made standard for touchscreens...)
Google never loses. End of story, this will not happen.
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yeah, this is a bunch of FUD.
and a very poor ruling by a judge. most of those patents won't hold.
Android is not going anywhere.
With apples iphone sales slowly declining and losing loyal customers, I don't see this being an issue...not just with the phones, I am reading alot of fanboys upset about the new mbp and how everythings soldered down making it near impossible to upgrade or repair....
Apple will fight tooth and nail saying that other companies stealing patents are the reason they are losing business, but they are really doing it to themselves being greedy.
Lol I'll go to a flip phone before I'm FORCED to go to Apple
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I hope this will go away soon!!!
Over dramatic much?
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It's just the basic forms of technological evolution. We've seen what phone such as the Samsung Galaxy S3 brought, they bring so much more than the iPhone 4S or maybe even the rumored "iPhone 5". Like honestly Apple is slowly becoming a monopoly, if anyone knows history Standard Oil was seperated into different oil industries because of actions that were harmful to the consumer/ government/ and other industries. Apple, being a large company, would try to take out any sort of competition that would "try" to honestly throttle their sales of their product. Customers all don't want to be tied down to a single phone. Just like people have different tastes in food, clothing, and other marketed products, they will also continue to have different taste in phones as well. It saddens me because my first phone was an iPhone (1st Gen) (I was 17 at the time) and I was proud to have it. But after seeing other phones that bring better features and finally ended up getting better and more phones that have better use to me. I get disgusted by the fact that Apple is using tactics to obliterate competition. Tactics that will not only hurt the industry such as Samsung, but also the consumer because I am 100% sure that this Android community will want to have iPhones only. So overall Apple....to me is becoming a monopoly, it's just slowly becoming one and won't stop bringing others to court until the iPhone is in everyone's grasp.
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What ever happened with that patent that Palm had for the phone app? It was rumored that if that was ever brought to court all iphones would just become ipods.
The second it gets in my grasp, I'll be throwing into moving traffic...
But Apple is just evil in what they are doing to Android... I really don't like it, and for once I feel bad for Windows Phone...
Remember, there are touchscreen BlackBerrys... If Apple sues RIM, it's over for them...
If I might add, if an iPhone gets in my grasp, it better be a quadcore phone with a 4.8" screen, Gorilla Glass, and Android Key Lime Pie or Kandy Kane running flawlessly with 4G LTE, as if that will ever happen...
I bet money that these patents will be invalidated soon. Why? Because theres no way that the government can allow apple to monopolize the smartphone business. Ill happily stick with my s2/s3 the rest of my life if they dont get invalidated
Id love to see samsung buy all the palm patents from hp that shut apple up real fast
Sent from the Apple store using my Gs2
apple is a lost cause.. epic in the era of steve jobs and now trying to stop the giant that is google to survive.. even if apple wins, there will be millions of android users across the world that would defend google. open source is the future, google will never die.. if anything google will be forced to come out with something even better than a "touchscreen" smartphone.. either way apple is against the ropes and probably losing fast as far as the long run looks.. apple is in the shadow of blackberry, destined to fail
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Google needs to step in and stomp apple
Apple is pathetic.. I say we C4 every Apple building in the US to make a point who's with me?!
Jk lol
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locoboi187 said:
Lol I'll go to a flip phone before I'm FORCED to go to Apple
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Seriously had to put a thanks on this post. If (and honestly I don't see it happening) this ever does happen I'll go buy a flip phone period and say screw you to apple.
cidica said:
Seriously had to put a thanks on this post. If (and honestly I don't see it happening) this ever does happen I'll go buy a flip phone period and say screw you to apple.
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wow this is a load of bollocks!! I agree lets all go back to flip phones!
Doesn't Google have it's own arsenal of patents it owns from Motorola mobility... as in first cell phone. If Apple doesn't play with Google, they could say "fine... you don't want us to have a touch screen... you don't get to have a cell phone."
Ok so Apple is rewarded +1 billion USD from Samsung copying their patents. I have to say that some of those patens must have been approved by people who smoke crack. I hate the verdict, I hate the fact that this type of trial in US is actually decided by jury of regular people. There are just so many things I hate about the whole thing thats going on, but thats not why Im posting.
As now this whole thing probably gets deeper with appeals and most likely Google will have to get more involved. What do you think, the 2 biggest are fighting together could this actually a good thing for WP camp, especially Nokia since they are the main manufacturer in the WP camp?
Loco5150 said:
Ok so Apple is rewarded +1 billion USD from Samsung copying their patents. I have to say that some of those patens must have been approved by people who smoke crack. I hate the verdict, I hate the fact that this type of trial in US is actually decided by jury of regular people. There are just so many things I hate about the whole thing thats going on, but thats not why Im posting.
As now this whole thing probably gets deeper with appeals and most likely Google will have to get more involved. What do you think, the 2 biggest are fighting together could this actually a good thing for WP camp, especially Nokia since they are the main manufacturer in the WP camp?
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This has no benefit to WP whatsoever, 1B for samsung is like two pieces of paper, and they won't pay it, they'll appeal as usual.
So, nope Nokia and WP will need something else to shine.
apple will get, ohhhh , about what they get for 3 months worth of new activstions on iPhones. Samsung will keep on pummeling us with incredible phones.
Nokia? no benefit. unless it bumps the stock price (taking profits time) for the folks that are raping it daily.
This most likely will end with sales ban for some devices, also Apple will go after other Android manufacturers. Bloomberg also reports that Samsung will most likely have to delay some new devices so they have time to change things so they will not do the same thing again.
All this might be helping the smaller guy. But for the record I hope the appeals court will change this verdict. Also that they void Apple's ridicilous and vague patents that never should have been rewarded anyway.
Loco5150 said:
This most likely will end with sales ban for some devices, also Apple will go after other Android manufacturers. Bloomberg also reports that Samsung will most likely have to delay some new devices so they have time to change things so they will not do the same thing again.
All this might be helping the smaller guy. But for the record I hope the appeals court will change this verdict. Also that they void Apple's ridicilous and vague patents that never should have been rewarded anyway.
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but those rounded corners are apples' genius!
the whole thing is stupid anyway. if you can't win in sales, sic lawyers on the competition.
remember sco?
ohgood said:
but those rounded corners are apples' genius!
the whole thing is stupid anyway. if you can't win in sales, sic lawyers on the competition.
remember sco?
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wasnt the rectangle with rounded corners thrown out though?
as to the topic, It could be good for WP, the whole android model is starting to look a bit dodgy, potentially, manufactures might start to say its not worth the hassle and since google has made it perfectly clear they are on their own it makes for a juicy target!
MS and Apple have cross licence agreements going back decades and as such are by and large protected from this stupidity, but lets be clear on something here, its neither apple or Samsung that should be attacked because of these daft patent wars, its the people in the patent office that should be shot, if Apple are awarded a patent for a box with a button in the middle then it is perfectly within its rights to uphold that patent.
its stupid, but I don't hold the companies to blame, every single one of us would jump through hoops to make 2.7B USD regardless of how stupid it is and how marginal it is, if there was a chance we'd go for it, and its the patent office that sets up these chances.
Well it's just about some patents regarding pinch to zoom, double tap and bounce scroll. All of the other competitors were paying already for using those patented features, Samsung wasn't because it's a scumbag company which is only able to make good internals and displays slapping them into fugly plastic bodies with no personality whatsoever, and therefore keeps copying the competition to make up for the above mentioned weak points. Paying for anything doesn't appeal to them, they much prefer stealing instead. Don't get me wrong, I still think that these things should be under FRAND, but law is there to be respected or reformed, acting like it didn't exist and getting into such kind of trials just in order to spare a few bucks is just being a lame and disrespectful scumbag company. At least in this case, justice was done. Now let's reform this patent bull**** system.
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Having owned a device from every smartphone platform except BB and Android I think Android is the platform that tends to borrow the most from everyone else.
Samsung is a cloning company, they make things for people. So it should come as no surprise that they are good at lifting other peoples ideas.
What ground-breaking products has Samsung introduced to the market? by that I mean game changing devices, not technology. I bet you're struggling to think of any.
I think iOS has fallen behind the times and so my move to Windows Phone, but we all owe Apple for making multitouch and finger based touchscreen devices mainstream. It's something Samsing would never have done, their top selling phones before the iPhone were mostly dumbphones.
dazza9075 said:
wasnt the rectangle with rounded corners thrown out though?
as to the topic, It could be good for WP, the whole android model is starting to look a bit dodgy, potentially, manufactures might start to say its not worth the hassle and since google has made it perfectly clear they are on their own it makes for a juicy target!
MS and Apple have cross licence agreements going back decades and as such are by and large protected from this stupidity, but lets be clear on something here, its neither apple or Samsung that should be attacked because of these daft patent wars, its the people in the patent office that should be shot, if Apple are awarded a patent for a box with a button in the middle then it is perfectly within its rights to uphold that patent.
its stupid, but I don't hold the companies to blame, every single one of us would jump through hoops to make 2.7B USD regardless of how stupid it is and how marginal it is, if there was a chance we'd go for it, and its the patent office that sets up these chances.
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I was being silly about the round corners. the patent system is broken, but that's another story /thread.
so long as the android devices are selling better than the iPhone, I doubt manufacturers will think of it as dodgy.
manufacturers only care about selling phones... they'll do whatever is needed to keel doing that, inuding paying pennies to the apple gods to do so. passing on expenses is economics 101. (sad really)
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gilesjuk said:
Having owned a device from every smartphone platform except BB and Android I think Android is the platform that tends to borrow the most from everyone else.
Samsung is a cloning company, they make things for people. So it should come as no surprise that they are good at lifting other peoples ideas.
What ground-breaking products has Samsung introduced to the market? by that I mean game changing devices, not technology. I bet you're struggling to think of any.
I think iOS has fallen behind the times and so my move to Windows Phone, but we all owe Apple for making multitouch and finger based touchscreen devices mainstream. It's something Samsing would never have done, their top selling phones before the iPhone were mostly dumbphones.
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its not much of a struggle to think of very good, very impressive samsung devices of late. the s3 and even s2 are selling (and reselling) like hotcakes. look at your local craigslist , the most desired phones are back and forth between ihpone 4s and s3/s2. I would expect some kind of shattering ideals cpu and display by Christmas from them also.
clones? yes, everyone is making a slab of glass phone. its what sells now. Nokia, Samsung, HTC, LG (are they still making phones) , everyone is on the slab of glass bandwagon.
ohgood said:
its not much of a struggle to think of very good, very impressive samsung devices of late. the s3 and even s2 are selling (and reselling) like hotcakes.
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Yes, but they're basically "me too" products. They've taken their existing product and added hundreds of features and bigger screen etc.
The sad thing is Apple is now stuck in this cycle of just adding a few more features, nicer screen and camera.
What I was saying was when did Samsung ever release a product that totally changed the market? It seems to me that Apple has released the devices that changed the computing industry the most. Mam, iMac, iPod and iPhone, iPad. While they may not have invented all the technology they used it still takes a lot of guts to release a different product.
The sad thing is how Microsoft laughed at the iPhone and then scrambled to release their own comparable platform (3 years later!).
I couldn't care less for Google, they're even worse than Microsoft for copying. At least when Microsoft look at a rival and release their version it is usually better in many ways, cheaper and not much less in quality. Google's stuff tends to be very low quality and poorly supported. Even devices they have had made for them were badly made (Nexus 7).
gilesjuk said:
Yes, but they're basically "me too" products. They've taken their existing product and added hundreds of features and bigger screen etc.
The sad thing is Apple is now stuck in this cycle of just adding a few more features, nicer screen and camera.
What I was saying was when did Samsung ever release a product that totally changed the market? It seems to me that Apple has released the devices that changed the computing industry the most. Mam, iMac, iPod and iPhone, iPad. While they may not have invented all the technology they used it still takes a lot of guts to release a different product.
The sad thing is how Microsoft laughed at the iPhone and then scrambled to release their own comparable platform (3 years later!).
I couldn't care less for Google, they're even worse than Microsoft for copying. At least when Microsoft look at a rival and release their version it is usually better in many ways, cheaper and not much less in quality. Google's stuff tends to be very low quality and poorly supported. Even devices they have had made for them were badly made (Nexus 7).
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ahhh, misunderstood you. I see now.
can't think of anything revolutoonary since the mouse really. voice input is neat, but the keyboard and mouse still own.
Loco5150 said:
Ok so Apple is rewarded +1 billion USD from Samsung copying their patents. I have to say that some of those patens must have been approved by people who smoke crack. I hate the verdict, I hate the fact that this type of trial in US is actually decided by jury of regular people. There are just so many things I hate about the whole thing thats going on, but thats not why Im posting.
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Err... This jury had people with legal knowledge and at least one engineer with a patent of their own. It was probably the most knowledgeable jury I've seen... ever.
vnvman said:
Well it's just about some patents regarding pinch to zoom, double tap and bounce scroll. All of the other competitors were paying already for using those patented features, Samsung wasn't because it's a scumbag company which is only able to make good internals and displays slapping them into fugly plastic bodies with no personality whatsoever, and therefore keeps copying the competition to make up for the above mentioned weak points.
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You said it brother.
gilesjuk said:
What ground-breaking products has Samsung introduced to the market? by that I mean game changing devices, not technology. I bet you're struggling to think of any.
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Nope. Samsung Note. At first I thought it sounded redonkulous. The build quality sucks compared to the Lumia 900 but the screen size definitely caught on with a certain segment of the population. The iphone 4s' screen is pathetic. No way around that. I'm not saying I would cruise around with a note in my pocket but it definitely explores a space. If the iphone 4s was the final word on smartphone screens we would be stuck in the stone ages. People crow about the iphone apps but I can't see those things God damn it! That screen is tiny.
sitizenx said:
Err... This jury had people with legal knowledge and at least one engineer with a patent of their own. It was probably the most knowledgeable jury I've seen... ever.
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Yup, one person that that has some knowledge on patents. Not enough in my opinion. Even if it was the "most knowledgeable jury", that does not mean that it is qualified to handle the matter.
Now why I started the whole topic. Apple has now asked sales ban for 8 Samsung devices in the US. I would expect we will see a lot more of this in the near future.
And yes Samsung keeps copying things, hell yes that happens in every business all the time. But you know what, so does Apple. They are just better at it. They basically steal because they are able to make the consumer think they actually invented these things. They did not invent mp3 player or a touch screen phone, they just copied it and made it better.
Loco5150 said:
Apple has now asked sales ban for 8 Samsung devices in the US. I would expect we will see a lot more of this in the near future.
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proof that the USA is in need of a rethink of (not just) its patent system.
they want the sales ban to get some of their sales percentage back, not because of patent infringement. its a lie covering inadequacies. pitiful.
The law ask "are the products similar "? Thats all it ask, and the obvious answer is...
Everybody said it before the original Galaxy S was released,"boy that thing looks a lot like the iPhone". Every reviewer, just YouTube it. The icons and bounce scroll sealed it.
Dont hate the player(Apple), hate the game(patent system).
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So here we go... Now Apple is seeking sales ban for new Samsung devices, inluding Galaxy S III and Galaxy Note.