Why not make an overview thread for ROMs?

Why not make an overview thread for ROMs? - Samsung Galaxy Nexus

I've noticed that whenever someone asks, "What ROM should I use?" the responses are either brusque (e.g. "Just install whatever and find what you like,") or unverifiable ("I've had okay luck with XYZ").
When I choose a ROM, the first thing I care about are the bugs. And yet, there is no single thread in the development forum that has a list of all the current ROMs, and a list of bugs. Some developers are very good with updating the first page of their thread, clearly listing the bugs, and yet for other ROMs, you have to dig until you get to post 1579 on page 157 to find that such-and-such functionality doesn't work.
Why doesn't anybody do this? Why isn't there a sticky at the top of the development forum that clearly lists the major ROMs in development, and keeps track of the main bugs? This makes selecting a ROM much, much easier.

Why don't you do it?

TSGM said:
I've noticed that whenever someone asks, "What ROM should I use?" the responses are either brusque (e.g. "Just install whatever and find what you like,") or unverifiable ("I've had okay luck with XYZ").
When I choose a ROM, the first thing I care about are the bugs. And yet, there is no single thread in the development forum that has a list of all the current ROMs, and a list of bugs. Some developers are very good with updating the first page of their thread, clearly listing the bugs, and yet for other ROMs, you have to dig until you get to post 1579 on page 157 to find that such-and-such functionality doesn't work.
Why doesn't anybody do this? Why isn't there a sticky at the top of the development forum that clearly lists the major ROMs in development, and keeps track of the main bugs? This makes selecting a ROM much, much easier.
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go ahead, ill definitely link it to those "which roms" threads.

um... you mean something like these?
Stickied in the GSM sub-forum: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1792896
Stickied in CDMA sub-forum: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1399802
it's a really large task to do what you're suggesting... tracking all the features and bugs of every single ROM in development. you'll see that the person who started the CDMA sticky has abandoned the thread and it's now outdated and rather useless. that's pretty much what will happen at some point with any such thread if you want the detail you suggest.

TSGM said:
I've noticed that whenever someone asks, "What ROM should I use?" the responses are either brusque (e.g. "Just install whatever and find what you like,") or unverifiable ("I've had okay luck with XYZ").
When I choose a ROM, the first thing I care about are the bugs. And yet, there is no single thread in the development forum that has a list of all the current ROMs, and a list of bugs. Some developers are very good with updating the first page of their thread, clearly listing the bugs, and yet for other ROMs, you have to dig until you get to post 1579 on page 157 to find that such-and-such functionality doesn't work.
Why doesn't anybody do this? Why isn't there a sticky at the top of the development forum that clearly lists the major ROMs in development, and keeps track of the main bugs? This makes selecting a ROM much, much easier.
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Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1792896

ecs1984 said:
it's a really large task to do what you're suggesting... tracking all the features and bugs of every single ROM in development. you'll see that the person who started the CDMA sticky has abandoned the thread and it's now outdated and rather useless. that's pretty much what will happen at some point with any such thread if you want the detail you suggest.
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I see. Is there a way to make a sort of Wiki-type format where the developer will take the first step, and whenever people find a bug, they can report it?
All I'm saying is that in many ROMs, bugs are buried within the (often) dozens or even hundreds of pages of the thread.
I'm not trying to point fingers at anybody; I'm just asking whether there is a more efficient way to organize the information.

Related

Why not separate forum for each ROM

Hi all!
I have a suggestion to make to the administrators of this portal.
I believe that each ROM should have it's own forum and not just a single thread. Each ROM is a really big deal. It is a piece of software that requires support, and using just one thread - the one that the creator of the ROM started to show off his work - is not enough. There should be one forum for each ROM, with locked threads on top showing latest releases, patches and known issues etc. Just like a real software product. Currently is it not easy at all for the visitor to find an answer for something already been answered before. Search inside a thread is helpful but not enough. Also, I suppose that it's not easy for the creator of ROM to keep up and know what was answered and what was not.
This forum should be administered by the ROM creator or any other friend that he/she could choose to help him out in this difficult task.

papadi said:
Hi all!
I have a suggestion to make to the administrators of this portal.
I believe that each ROM should have it's own forum and not just a single thread. Each ROM is a really big deal. It is a piece of software that requires support, and using just one thread - the one that the creator of the ROM started to show off his work - is not enough. There should be one forum for each ROM, with locked threads on top showing latest releases, patches and known issues etc. Just like a real software product. Currently is it not easy at all for the visitor to find an answer for something already been answered before. Search inside a thread is helpful but not enough. Also, I suppose that it's not easy for the creator of ROM to keep up and know what was answered and what was not.
This forum should be administered by the ROM creator or any other friend that he/she could choose to help him out in this difficult task.
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Mate... i think that cant be applied because there may be 10's of roms then we will need 10's of forums. Its ok with topics i think... they just need good cleaning from useless posts.

And what is the problem with having 10s of forums? If the forum framework is flexible this shouldn't be much burden for the administrators.

yup, i am agree with you papaidi, but, we dont have to make a new separated forum, for a new rom, i think we just need a separated forum for the newest rom, then for the rom before, we need to move it to "upgrading" forum,. ;p

Garmin said:
yup, i am agree with you papaidi, but, we dont have to make a new separated forum, for a new rom, i think we just need a separated forum for the newest rom, then for the rom before, we need to move it to "upgrading" forum,. ;p
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I would also recommend Tags. Aren't they supported?

Take this thread for example:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=270751
How can somebody find in it if there is the answer that he is looking form. This thread has more than 2500 replies! This is not a thread! It's a history book.

i hear what you're sayin but...
that's not even a ROM thread! And he (Ikarus) has taken the trouble to write up FAQs, manuals, etc, so except for troubleshooting IMO you hardly need to look through the whole thread,
This is not a thread! It's a history book.
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but that's a nice line...made me smile at least...
regarding a forum for each ROM, it would be a nice idea, but is there really space, or a real need for this? I mean, I hate looking back at a latest ROM thread and seeing 20 pages to trawl through, but what can you do... I guess I agree with WizeMan. If there is anything that can be done, perhaps harsher moderation (e.g. of newbie's questions) in the ROM threads would help.
...or...if people really did want new forums for ROMs, one for each major cooker? rather than each individual ROM...still don't think that it's worth it/do-able though

I believe seperating ROMS and forum will add more chaos. For example, there is like 100's of ROMS released for each device like hermes, wizard etc. Some of the ROM released might not be good, and hence it might be discontinued. Also with the way people are porting ROM a new OS version is released almost daily, and the chefs, start their job again with the new OS version....so having to seperate ROM forum will add more confusion...(this is my opinion)
Also, use google to search for what you need, I agree you cannot go through the 2500 replies, but some of them do have valuable information.

That's a good idea...

Sorry, but that is probably the craziest thing I have heard. Do you even know how many ROMS are out there? This forum is huge as it is. If they started making new forums for every ROM, then you would have nothing less than 200 forums minimum.
The key is to include a "Thank You" feature for every thread. The biggest problem we have here is noobs and even a lot os senior members posting THANK YOU and I'LL TEST IT OUT messages in the threads. If you actually look at the amount of useful messages in the threads, they are quite minimal as opposed to all this unnecessary chatter.
There are a lot of forums that include this "THANK YOU" feature that I mentioned. If you want to thank the author of the thread, all you do is click on a THANK YOU button and your name gets added to a THANK YOU section in the same thread. That way everything is kept clean and messages are posted only when you have something to contribute, discuss or have a problem.
Check out the thread below... you'll have a much better idea of what i'm talking about. Also, maybe we should make this more visible. If all of us start putting this in our Signatures, then members will take notice and if there is enough of noise, then the admins will take notice and we can move towards a cleaner and more functional XDA-dev.
Thank You Threads

In my oppinion this is a difficult idea to be applied. The most simple way we can wish the moderator give a list of rom and then stick them, so anybody know where is the newer rom, stable rom, or in progress. But actually there is a rule from the rom maker, they use some order of versions which they build, so anybody know when the rom is composed Thank them for the great works.

[TEMP STICKIE] Let's clean up the dev. section

It seems to be getting a mess in the dev. section lately.
Put your idea on this thread and we'll look into it.
1. create sticky for official (samsung) firmware as easy downloads
2. create sticky for some basic guides
3. create sticky with pointers to roms for the in-house cooks (rotohammer etc.)
this is a start.
MOD EDIT: BEFORE POSTING ANY THREAD IN THE DEVELOPMENT SECTION, PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING:
If you have developed a ROM, or are working with others to do so, the development forum is somewhere to discuss and share ideas, post useful feedback and logs or crash dumps, and to discuss a common goal developers are trying to achieve.
It is NOT the place to post your question because it gets higher traffic, or because more experienced users frequent it. Doing this just annoys those who are working on the device, and drives them away. Developers don't want to wade through 20 threads of "Help me urgently" to find their threads for porting and fixing camera issues etc. Similarly, if a thread is designated as discussion for developers say, porting a camera fix, please do not post in there asking "When will it be ready?", "Can I flash this yet?" etc. This is both completely disrespectful to those working on the project (you evidently haven't read the important posts in the thread), and also is making it harder for developers to find comments from other developers or testers when required.
Similarly, don't make loads of "Thanks for your work here" posts in an active development thread. It's just as annoying to developers as asking when something will be ready. If a ROM is complete, then go ahead and thank the developer if you wish, but don't go into threads for devs only, and interrupt it to post "thanks". It's basically spamming, and is treated as such.
If you are posting in development, you should have read every sticky and notice there, and should be actively developing or helping in the development of something. Developing isn't installing a ROM, or using a tweak, it's creating a ROM or other hack or tweak. If you haven't read for several days before starting out on XDA, you are likely about to ask something already solved. I registered on XDA when I first wanted to post, and that was to join in a discussion on something. Sure, join up and ask a question, but read the information available in General and Q&A first, as your question will have been asked before. Search is your friend here, become familiar with it.
Regarding when to post in development if you are not actually developing something, there is one occasion where it's acceptable. If you find a leak of a new ROM, which isn't already posted, and you verify it's legitimacy via either running it, or based on the source you obtained it from, then this is assisting in development, and should be posted in development. If you want to ask when a leak will be available use search first, then if not already in discussion, open a thread in general or Q&A.
If you have a problem flashing a ROM, this is NOT related to development. It's up to you to determine if it is specific to a particular ROM, and post useful information in that developer's existing thread for the ROM. If it happens on more than one ROM, and isn't a known issue (remember you should read several times more words than you post), then find out what you are doing wrong. Check guides written by others, try to repeat the problem and see if it happens every time. Something needs to be reproducible to be fixed effectively.
Once you have identified what you need help with go to the device Q&A forum (general if device lacks one), and make a clear, informative thread that explains the issue, and what you have tried doing to fix it. Did you re-download the ROM? Did you ask a friend to flash it for you, to reduce chance of user error? What steps (exactly) did you follow? What errors did you see (exact wording)? Did you double check all the steps? Did you do a wipe or hard reset?
If you make a clear, concise, yet detailed post, you will find help forthcoming, and should get the problem sorted very quickly. If someone suggests you try something, report back on what happened, did it work etc. Then, next time someone has this issue and searches, they will find this and have a verified and tested solution.
So remember... before you start a thread in development, ask yourself what you are developing. If you can't answer, then stop, step away from the post button, and think about where you are posting. Would it be better in General or Q&A, or is some more time with your best friend, search, required?

I'd have a set of stickies including:
Flashing Guide http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=895827
Unlocking Guide http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=843323
Rooting Guide http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=859712
A *HUGE OBNOXIOUS BLINKING* Readme http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=888071
I'm by no means a Dev myself, but I'd love to see y'know... development posts when I lurk here.

Ok, now that i'm un-retired, i'll ask some major cleanup on the dev section.
Starting today/tomorrow between flashing my dev Tab

Several people posted dumped stock firmwares, maybe this should be consolidated into one "Get back to stock" sticky?
T-Mobile stock firmware! http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=855851
[FIRMWARE] - AT&T stock firmware http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=847609
AT&T Production Stock Firmware (I987UCJK1) http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=857608
Also, rotobackup instructions http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=850359&highlight=rotobackup
Links to Open Source archives http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=844981
Good instructions on building cifs module http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=9470152&postcount=53
Also can be used to build tun.ko module for VPN.

I would recommend having tags for the different models of tablets. ( [VZW] [TMO] [AT&T] [SPNT] [EURO] etc...)
Just my .02

We really need to have them separated... This is getting bad. Take a vote and and promise everyone would be on board!!
Galaxy Tab Android Development (CDMA)
Galaxy Tab Android Development (GSM)
Galaxy Tab Android Development (...)
Please!!! lol

I agree that the Tab development needs to be split amongst compatibility.
GSM/EUR
CDMA
etc.
That will make the issues with possible flashing mistakes lower and also enable people to find the best build for them.

A third vote for at least something like a top level and sub forums for GSM and CDMA. There might be things that apply to both, but it seems like real development would be at least specific to one or the other, if not down to the carrier level (and I'm not suggesting per carrier forums).

A sticky for my directory(bible). This will be updated frequently. And will be useful for all noobs and pros alike.
Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk

What happened to this idea? The development forum is CRAP. I've spent the last three hours seaching for a stock ROM. Can we please, please get some mod action in here?

Sprint only section please! +100 to the splitting up compatible models.

williams37 said:
Sprint only section please! +100 to the splitting up compatible models.
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+1000000 more for spliting up!

I agree and count my vote, this forum should be easier to find and read the info im searching for it took me days to find a rom and another day to find out how to mod my device using google we should also hav more dev's more porting

wingtytn said:
I agree and count my vote, this forum should be easier to find and read the info im searching for it took me days to find a rom and another day to find out how to mod my device using google we should also hav more dev's more porting
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What we really need is a bigger community. The larger the user base, the larger the dev base. Especially in the states, it seems like no one is developing for our Tabs specifically. And from what I've found, ours are, just like the Galaxy S, different from the international version.

So do we even have a Mod ? Can they do this for us ? Its been like weeks since we asked to split it up.....
+1beeeeeeelion to split and have a CMDA and GSM and Intl section added....and then under those when people list just say [Sprint] or [VZW] in the title of the thread....

aal1 said:
So do we even have a Mod ? Can they do this for us ? Its been like weeks since we asked to split it up.....
+1beeeeeeelion to split and have a CMDA and GSM and Intl section added....and then under those when people list just say [Sprint] or [VZW] in the title of the thread....
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Your official mod is taking a break, just busy with life lately. I'll be taking over until he comes back.
I've forwarded this thread on to the admins, being that after being here for 2 days I can already see how bad it is. Hopefully we can get the sections split up and I can start moving posts around.

Can we please also have teh same tagging as HD2 section has, ie the date at beginning of title..
example...
[19.MAR.2011][ROM] Rom Title Rom Version [KERNEL]

is it possible to get this "stickie" out of the developers section?
it would be more helpfull to get serious content into there. also the actual official thread is sticky and dead.
a sticky should be something important or something must read. this thread is not a "must read"
sorry, constructive critics

I agree we need some reorg. PLEASE look at my sig, and follow the HD2 url,
Seems the HD2 overall section has recently had a makeover. It is much easier to navigate, and the people whe are not devs can op in on the thread.
The devs, on the other hand, have their own section, that requires you be a dev in order to get into it and exchange ideas. This keeps the riff raff from convelouting the threads.
So, can you please look it over. What ever work is needed to be done, I will offer my assistance to reorg the threads and topics.
Thanks

StarLog said:
I agree we need some reorg. PLEASE look at my sig, and follow the HD2 url,
Seems the HD2 overall section has recently had a makeover. It is much easier to navigate, and the people whe are not devs can op in on the thread.
The devs, on the other hand, have their own section, that requires you be a dev in order to get into it and exchange ideas. This keeps the riff raff from convelouting the threads.
So, can you please look it over. What ever work is needed to be done, I will offer my assistance to reorg the threads and topics.
Thanks
Click to expand...
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I just looked at HD2 section, and theres nothing new there.
They have a section for NAND dev, and for SD Dev, thats it.
There are some plans in the works for the site in general that may do what you're referring to, but nothing is done yet for any of the fora.
If they give you guys the new sections, It will take me a day or so to move everything around. And I dont know tis section as well as I'd like so it may take a little longer as I'd have to go through every thread, but it would get done.
/IF/ that happens, it should clean up the sections a lot and make it easier to find everything. If not, I'm open to suggestions.

Forum reorganization thoughts

not trying to be mean or anything and probly will get bashed, but I had a thought about how to organize the forums so the questons asked would get an answer faster and with more accurate information.
what if we were to have a question and answer part in each of the roms instead of asking in the genereal q and a
you know sort of like each dev would be able to see all the problems that their rom is currently having.
and it would also help the people running those roms see all the current questions.
we should also have a section for the people who are on stock roms unrooted
I personally think it would help in diagnosing issues if they arrise.

I agree on a rom q and a but inside the development thread. Have rom thread ie bonsai and then a bonsai q and a thread with the most repeated q and a's on the op. This is more work for the devs and entirely up to them. It will help out in organization instead of cluttering a development thread with the same question. have the main thread for dl link, changelog, install instructions, possibly bug reports (some have a dedicated page for this) and that's it.
Edit: and most importantly feedback.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk

To do that, it would need to be reorganized such that roms would each get their own subforum. Then, they could have a "get the new version here" thread, a "general info" thread, and then all the random individual threads. If you have seen how mod forums are organized at civfanatics, you know what I'm talking about.
Lately, I've been thinking we need a "Guides and FAQs" section. Make everyone post guides being worked on in a "works in progress" subforum and then a mod can move completed guides to the main forum. We might be able to get a nice little knowledge base here if a few people wanted to chip in and write out a lot of what we have learned.

DiGi760 said:
and then a mod can move completed guides to the main forum.
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srsly? we cant even get the one overworked mod to move much around as it is.

Which is why I haven't previously suggested the idea.
But, seriously, we need a couple more good mods who want to help build a community here. I know how tough it is. I've been around a lot of forums, both good and bad. It can be hard to find people who are both willing to do the job and mature enough to do it well.

[Suggestion] Thread wiki

It is possible to add a "thread wiki" post below the original post?
Eg in slickdeals, you have a common wiki below the OP that people can add stuff
I feel like threads should have things like that...
OP might not have time to update his/her post with relevant info that an another user can add
It might be difficult trying to look through 100 pages of posts to figure out if someone has a similar problem(or through search), while it is easy for multiple people to maintain a common wiki that they can all edit
EG: http://slickdeals.net/f/4803408-Thi...ted-by-users-like-you?p=51265310#edit51265310

paperWastage said:
It is possible to add a "thread wiki" post below the original post?
Eg in slickdeals, you have a common wiki below the OP that people can add stuff
I feel like threads should have things like that...
OP might not have time to update his/her post with relevant info that an another user can add
It might be difficult trying to look through 100 pages of posts to figure out if someone has a similar problem(or through search), while it is easy for multiple people to maintain a common wiki that they can all edit
EG: http://slickdeals.net/f/4803408-Thi...ted-by-users-like-you?p=51265310#edit51265310
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Click to collapse
Interesting idea, not sure how adaptable it would be with the VBulletin software though. It might also be similar in effect to something I hear is going to be rolled out sometime soon, a post rating system so posts with more positive ratings will move to the top, and posts with enough negative ratings will be hidden.
I think though that the OP should either ask the mods to close the thread or hand it over to another user by contacting the forum admin if they don't have time to maintain their thread with important new information.

mf2112 said:
Interesting idea, not sure how adaptable it would be with the VBulletin software though. It might also be similar in effect to something I hear is going to be rolled out sometime soon, a post rating system so posts with more positive ratings will move to the top, and posts with enough negative ratings will be hidden.
I think though that the OP should either ask the mods to close the thread or hand it over to another user by contacting the forum admin if they don't have time to maintain their thread with important new information.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mean small details: like "most commonly encountered problems and solutions", that the OP might have time to add or not
For a dev thread, I rather have the dev (most likely the OP) focus on developing and other people helping out in figuring out problems by common users... users can update the wiki on the un-resolved problems so that the dev can see, without having the dev to read the last 3 pages that were newly posted
you can see in the Slickdeals thread... 179 pages of posts... some of them are "useless" in saying "thanks for the deal", while some people have legitimate questions (like "is this phone quad band") that other users answered 10 pages after their post... having a wiki means common info will be presented clearly without having to dig through the thread, and anyone can update that, not just the OP <--- most important point
EDIT: Slickdeals uses vBulletin too, but customized plugins... there are probably open source plugins out there, just trying to dig through
EDIT2: i guess SD doesn't use pure vBulletin plugins for that... maybe some CMS system

paperWastage said:
I mean small details: like "most commonly encountered problems and solutions", that the OP might have time to add or not
For a dev thread, I rather have the dev (most likely the OP) focus on developing and other people helping out in figuring out problems by common users... users can update the wiki on the un-resolved problems so that the dev can see, without having the dev to read the last 3 pages that were newly posted
you can see in the Slickdeals thread... 179 pages of posts... some of them are "useless" in saying "thanks for the deal", while some people have legitimate questions (like "is this phone quad band") that other users answered 10 pages after their post... having a wiki means common info will be presented clearly without having to dig through the thread, and anyone can update that, not just the OP <--- most important point
EDIT: Slickdeals uses vBulletin too, but customized plugins... there are probably open source plugins out there, just trying to dig through
EDIT2: i guess SD doesn't use pure vBulletin plugins for that... maybe some CMS system
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I guess the problem really is that the dev thread should not be used for support, but people insist on treating them that way. I think that there should be a "ROM XXXXX Support Thread" in the device Q&A forums and that is where such questions should go instead. Then there would be no problems with the restrictions since user support questions or bug reports without proper logging, details, attempted fixes, etc. would be moved from the dev thread into the support thread if they were able to post them there.

mf2112 said:
I guess the problem really is that the dev thread should not be used for support, but people insist on treating them that way. I think that there should be a "ROM XXXXX Support Thread" in the device Q&A forums and that is where such questions should go instead. Then there would be no problems with the restrictions since user support questions or bug reports without proper logging, details, attempted fixes, etc. would be moved from the dev thread into the support thread if they were able to post them there.
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even in support threads... who would maintain the massive throve of info that many people would ask? the OP(most likely the dev himself who made the thread), or every user who wants to?
example.... if a lot of people post below us, makes it go into 5 pages... someone on page 3 found a plugin that does what it works.... does it make sense for that info to be posted just below my first post by anyone, or is it on me(the OP) to edit my first post "someone on page 3 found this info"?

This is actually an interesting idea. We are busy adding other new features but definitely will keep this in mind. Right now, we do already have a wiki and there is nothing stopping someone from creating a wiki page while adding their thread, and linking to it, but it would be nice to integrate that directly into the page.

bitpushr said:
This is actually an interesting idea. We are busy adding other new features but definitely will keep this in mind. Right now, we do already have a wiki and there is nothing stopping someone from creating a wiki page while adding their thread, and linking to it, but it would be nice to integrate that directly into the page.
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yeah, but it's definitely not as seamless as having it right below the original post
lemme see if there are any plugins to "stream" that wiki page into a post...

Came here to request this too. And precisely for the same reasons as the OP.
This would be immediately embraced.
I don't understand the "I'm not sure this would be adaptable with vBulletin" comment since slickdeals uses vBulletin.
http://www.qapla.com/mods/showthread.php/309-Wiki-Posts-for-VB4-by-BOP5-BETA

another vote for this.
i have been following a thread about about the development of 4.4 for the hisense sero 7 pro (randomblame, davepmer and others are awesome)
anyway it has a post count of nearly 1,000 and people come in and try the latest build, or just wanting to ask a question about the latest builds. the same questions get asked over and over. i don't really think its the fault of the person asking since who is going to read 1,000 posts just to see if his/her problem has been discussed.