Apologies if this has been resolved before, but I've been seeing two download folders in my SD card "downloads" and "Downloads." I've tried deleting one but I get an error - this also confuses Recovery when I try to flash a file located in one of the directories it typically looks in the wrong one. Has anyone had this or resolved it?
pongalong said:
Apologies if this has been resolved before, but I've been seeing two download folders in my SD card "downloads" and "Downloads." I've tried deleting one but I get an error - this also confuses Recovery when I try to flash a file located in one of the directories it typically looks in the wrong one. Has anyone had this or resolved it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have the issue and have just learned to deal with it. I don't really know when it why it happened, sometime around when I first flashed jellybean I think. Idk. Just letting you know you're not alone. Btw the "download" folder appears first in recovery. I move all my roms and kernels there. The "Download" is the folder all the general downloads end up in for me... at least I think... it's confusing but a sms issue to me.
DARKSIDE
I made a folder called Aaroms. It goes alphabetical and capital letters first so that folder is always on the top of the list. I then sort my roms mods and kernels with sub folders.
If you keep your (D)download folder clean and sorted it should be easy to know which one has what
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
This is just speculation, but...
1. I think the virtual sdcard (sdcard0) and its links exists to make the real "sdcard" (/data/media) look like fat to apps instead of ext, which it really is (because it doesn't have a separate partition to itself). Most apps only know how to write to fat on the sdcard.
2. To programs that expect to be writing to fat, "download" and "Download" are the same directory, so they can be careless how they spell it when they access it or create it. But since the real filesystem is ext, they get created as two different directories. Maybe through some case-checking bug in the virtual sdcard or some program that writes directly to /data/media.
3. What I wound up doing was taking all my data out of both directories, deleting one, and making sure the remaining one was named "directory". Then I put all my data back in that one and everything has been good since then.
Well this is Linux after all. Downloads != downloads
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Need help too
pongalong said:
Apologies if this has been resolved before, but I've been seeing two download folders in my SD card "downloads" and "Downloads." I've tried deleting one but I get an error - this also confuses Recovery when I try to flash a file located in one of the directories it typically looks in the wrong one. Has anyone had this or resolved it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have the same issue. I have two Download folders. The thing is that the one with the small "D" (download), it is empty, and when I try to delete it, it always reappear.
Help!
this was anwsered like 2 days ago.
sent from my i9250
bk201doesntexist said:
this was anwsered like 2 days ago.
sent from my i9250
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I cant find the post telling the answer. Lol. The last post isbin october 2010.
strumcat said:
1. I think the virtual sdcard (sdcard0) and its links exists to make the real "sdcard" (/data/media) look like fat to apps instead of ext, which it really is (because it doesn't have a separate partition to itself). Most apps only know how to write to fat on the sdcard.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that the symlinks are there just for backwards compability issues with apps, that look under /sdcard/ mount point. it doesn't have anything to do with fs, android never used fat, or ntfs; known fs in android are yaffs2, ext4 and maybe a few proprietary ones like sammy's rfs.
bk201doesntexist said:
I think that the symlinks are there just for backwards compability issues with apps, that look under /sdcard/ mount point. it doesn't have anything to do with fs, android never used fat, or ntfs; known fs in android are yaffs2, ext4 and maybe a few proprietary ones like sammy's rfs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The real sdcards were formatted as fat, and most apps that used them to store data only knew how to read/write a fat fs. I found this out by creating a mountable volume on a real sdcard on my old phone. It mounted as a directory on the sdcard. If I formatted the volume as fat, all my apps could use it normally. If I formatted it as ext(anything), a few apps could use it but most could not.
The symlinks are for backwards compatibility, but I believe the fuse filesystem virtual sdcard0 exists to make ext4 look like fat to all apps and to windows.
Note that if the gnex "sdcard" had its own partition, it could be formatted as fat and mounted as USB external storage like a real sdcard. I don't know, but it seems like Google went out of their way to prevent that.
The Google line is that the gnex sdcard shares an ext4 partition to maximize space, ie no unused wasted space on two partitions. But that is pretty farfetched, since the number of problems caused by this arrangement is huge in proportion to the "space saved" which is negligible.
Obviously, the real reason for this kludged-up mess is to discourage local storage/backup and encourage cloud storage, which can then be monetized.
strumcat said:
The real sdcards were formatted as fat, and most apps that wrote data to it only knew how to write it to a fat fs. I found this out by creating a mountable volume on a real sdcard on my old phone. It mounted as a directory on the sdcard. If I formatted the volume as fat, all my apps could use it normally. If I formatted it as ext(anything), a few apps could use it but most could not.
The symlinks are the for backwards compatibility, but I believe the fuse filesystem virtual sdcard0 exists to make ext4 look like fat to all apps and to windows.
Note that if the gnex "sdcard" had its own partition, it could be formatted as fat and mounted as USB external storage like a real sdcard. I don't know, but it seems like Google went out of their way to prevent that.
The Google line is that sdcard shares ext4 partition to maximize space, is no unused wasted space on two partitions. But that is pretty farfetched, since the number of problems caused by this arrangement is huge in proportion to the "space saved" which is negligible.
Obviously, the real reason for this kludged-up mess is to discourage local storage/backup and encourage cloud storage, which can then be monetized.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sure, i was talking about nand storage. still, if apps really depend on that to survive (said "fat compability"), it's unlogical to me coming from linux, where several fs can co-exist, as you may know.
if sdcard had its own partition like you say, and it could be formatted to fat, it would suck from a performance point of view, right? because its way slower than ext4 or yaffs2?
sent from my i9250
bk201doesntexist said:
sure, i was talking about nand storage. still, if apps really depend on that to survive (said "fat compability"), it's unlogical to me coming from linux, where several fs can co-exist, as you may know.
if sdcard had its own partition like you say, and it could be formatted to fat, it would suck from a performance point of view, right? because its way slower than ext4 or yaffs2?
sent from my i9250
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure, Android knows how to read/write fat as well as ext. But I guess the app devs figured sdcards would be fat forever. so they only included fat I/O in their apps.
Yes, ext4 is better than fat. But fat+mass-storage is far better and faster than ext4+fuse+mtp. For example, an sdcard backup from fat mounted as mass storage to a pc is much faster and more reliable than an sdcard backup using mtp. MTP backups are painfully slow and often won't even complete due to errors.
strumcat said:
Sure, Android knows how to read/write fat as well as ext. But I guess the app devs figured sdcards would be fat forever. so they only included fat I/O in their apps.
Yes, ext4 is better than fat. But fat+mass-storage is far better and faster than ext4+fuse+mtp. For example, an sdcard backup from fat mounted as mass storage to a pc is much faster and more reliable than an sdcard backup using mtp. MTP backups are painfully slow and often won't even complete due to errors.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well it still happens in 2017 running Android 7.1.2 lol
Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
Related
In short:
Is there a thread somewhere stating the pro's and con's of running Android from different types of "media" (SD, NAND, EXT2)?
If there is, please provide a link, I can't seem to find anything that isn't an unanswered question or small comments.
If there isn't, let this be a starting point for those looking for the answer to this question.
Longer:
I've seen this question pop up once and again but it might be that the topic is totally exhausted and people have stopped commenting on it. I can't seem to find an answer though; What are the pro's and con's of using NAND, EXT2, FAT32 or any combination of it?
I see a couple of installation alternatives and some I have been able to conclude myself but others not.
* Running from SD-card using HaRET
This option is the slowest in terms of Android performance. It has the added value of easily getting back to Windows Mobile by rebooting the phone, gaining easy access to the SD card and manipulation options.
* Running the system AND data on NAND
This option has in my view the fastest Android experience. Access to files on the SD card is a bit more cumbersome (there is the SD card split widget APK available but I have yet to see it working) and access to files for manipulation I can't comment on (haven't gotten to that yet).
* Running the system from NAND and data on EXT2
The performance seems almost as fast as the system+data on NAND. I have no idea about the added value of running anything from an EXT2-partition in the SD card but I'm guessing it will be slower. I have no idea if file access for manipulation is easier or not compared to the other options.
* Running the system AND data from EXT2
I have not tried this yet and cannot comment on it. Something tells me it will be slower than NAND because of SD card overhead.
* Running the system from EXT2 and data on NAND
I have not tried this yet and cannot comment on it.
Now, I've missed out on several of the installation options but I'll edit this post as soon as I get to investigating it further.
Any comments/experience/knowledge in this is greatly appreciated, as it can make things clearer as to what options to choose.
Well these are very good question and wanted to start a thread on this matter as well. I also could not find a strait answer anywhere.
I also want to know if there is an advantage using ext2 over fat32.
So, people out there having knowledge about this matter please share it.
Ext2 and Fat32 are both types of filesystem used on various different types of media, including SD card, Hard drives etc.
EXT2 is (one) of the native linux filesystems, and is fully supported in kernel, and is usually faster and more stable in that OS
FAT32 is the 32bit version of the old MSdos filesystem, used up to Windows 98, and still supported by windows machines, but slower and less stable than the native NTFS filesystem used by XP and above.
Nand is actually the type of flash ROM used by our devices, and not a filesystem as such, and running Android in Nand refers to where the information is stored, rather than the filesystem used to store it.
It's equally valid to say that we run WM in Nand also.
I think that in the case of Android EXT2 should be faster and more stable than fat32 since it's designed for Linux, and works better in that OS.
Zenity ik would like to thank you very much as this answers mij questions.
And i think this would many others aswell.
Don't forget - if you format your MicroSD to just EXT2 then you will make it very awkward to transfer files to/from the card on a Microsoft Windows based system.
This may, or may not be a problem for you.
Ultimately, the current ideal situation (IMHO) is to run your OS from NAND, and to store your data (music / movies / documents) on a FAT32 format MicroSD - as this enables you to swap the MicroSD card without turning off the device, and provides best cross-platform usability of the MicroSD for the purposes of transferring data to/from it.
Thank you all!
Thank you all for commenting! I will add your comments to the Android-wiki I'm building as this question could come back repeatedly from newcomers (and old ones who forgot )!
boli99 said:
Don't forget - if you format your MicroSD to just EXT2 then you will make it very awkward to transfer files to/from the card on a Microsoft Windows based system.
This may, or may not be a problem for you.
Ultimately, the current ideal situation (IMHO) is to run your OS from NAND, and to store your data (music / movies / documents) on a FAT32 format MicroSD - as this enables you to swap the MicroSD card without turning off the device, and provides best cross-platform usability of the MicroSD for the purposes of transferring data to/from it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is a program for allowing the mounting of EXT2 file systems on windows, however they are not signed. This is more problematic in Windows that are 64bit. The program is called 'ext2fsd' and you can get it from source forge. EXT2 is a better file system, and does not have the 4GB file size limit, and does not fragment (although on a SD card, this should not be an issue). EXT2 also has file permissions that Linux understands. Fat32 has no Access control file permissions.
I have just recently got polymod's eclair running with both system and data on ext2 partitions.
my question is...
I am just wondering what the boot order is...
and where(if possible) can it be changed?
system.img in the andboot folder VS system on partition.
I know it can be set in the installer. but lets say I had installed system on ext2 partition. and then later placed a system.img in the andboot folder.
can I swap between the two?
OK...
I figured it out myself,
You can use the installer to select boot options (Not just options to install)
so I have a system and data on partitons. (currently using)
and I also have a second build installed to .img files in the andboot folder. (for failsafe backup)
if I want to swap from one into the other
I enter installer and change the settings for the system and data to
their respective locations and then just QUIT.
I also still have a donut build in the android folder. as well as still running winmo.
quad boot system on my phone...LOL
Now thats a neat use of the installer, I think this find deserves it's own thread in fact, I'm certain others will find it useful
Tanks !
binlabin said:
* Running the system from NAND and data on EXT2
The performance seems almost as fast as the system+data on NAND. I have no idea about the added value of running anything from an EXT2-partition in the SD card but I'm guessing it will be slower. I have no idea if file access for manipulation is easier or not compared to the other options.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've done some tries with this doing the partitioning from within android and then formatting the FAT32 partition from Windows 7 but the FAT32 partition doesn't work very well afterward. Really slow and sometimes crashes the explorer. Propably something to do with my SD-card. May try doing the partitioning and formatting from Linux to see if it works better.
Seems to me the main advantage of this option is to increase the size of available data storage which i suspect can become a limitation sooner or later in a pure NAND install.
EDIT: Now I've done it and gone NAND-System + EXT2-Data... Partitioned the SD-card from Ubuntu with gparted. Resized the FAT32 partition and created 3 primary EXT2 partitions. only the second (partition 3) should be used though with the setup I am using. It's charging right now so I haven't tried it out much yet but I will later on. However I noticed that I now have 171Mb free phone storage instead of 30-something that I had before (same apps installed).
EDIT2: Ran gparted again and shrinked the unused partition (partition 2) and expanded the data partition (partition 3) so I now have 369Mb free "Internal phone storage". Haven't noticed any speed differences between this and when I had data on NAND.
nand
By then one question:
If im install android in the NAND is more fast ready? But this process erase WM6?
Because now android work good in my HTC TYNT II but the camera and bluetooth not work and have one or two performance problems and for this dont like delete WM6 of my phone, and for this im use Android from my SD.
But look the NAND option because have a problems with the time live of my battery only lasts 5hours with android and SD.
Thanks for your help and cooperation
excellent thread which answers some questions that I had. Thanks to everyone who contributed. The only question remaining though and I have posted this elsewhere without getting an answer:
I partitioned a 2 gb sdcard with ~1.6gb Fat32 and the rest as a single Ext2. I selected system on nand and data on ext2 in the installer. After installation, it does show alot more memory for data as compared to data on nand, BUT I also have a data.img in andboot which is in the Fat32 partition, with a size around 250mb. The question is, is the data in that file or on ext2? If I backup data from installer, it creates a databackup.img in andboot with the same size as data.img. Seems to me the ext2 partition is just taking up space and not being used. Can anyone more knowledgeable shed some light on this? Thanks.
Not quite sure what is going on there, seems very counter-intuitive, I would have assumed that system on Nand, data on EXT2 would have installed the data partition to EXT2 on SD. This would seem not to be the case in this instance.
There are a few experiments you could try, if you are brave enough, since you may cause problems by trying any of these suggestions, which could mean a reinstall, I leave it to your judgement how to proceed
Ok firstly I assume you have a card reader, since you managed to partition and format the SD card in the first place. Remove the SD card, insert in card reader, delete the andboot folder, or the contents of the folder, ( may be wise to have a spare SD with either a winmo or android install handy at this point, just in case things go horribly wrong ).
Now with the cleaned SD, put it in the phone and boot, it should boot fine, IF the data is truly on the EXT2 partition.
That at least will answer one question, namely, where the heck is my data?
If this works fine, then I'd just put it down to some inner weirdness of android on non-native devices, if it fails then I'm wondering if your EXT2 partition may have problems, forcing the phone to dump it on the first available good partition, namely the FAT32 one.
Oh and if it does fail, you will have to reinstall, since your data will be toast.
Finally, good luck, I await with interest
As I recall, the install has the FAT32/Ext2 options incorrectly swapped. It has been this way for a while.
zenity said:
Not quite sure what is going on there, seems very counter-intuitive, I would have assumed that system on Nand, data on EXT2 would have installed the data partition to EXT2 on SD. This would seem not to be the case in this instance.
There are a few experiments you could try, if you are brave enough, since you may cause problems by trying any of these suggestions, which could mean a reinstall, I leave it to your judgement how to proceed
Ok firstly I assume you have a card reader, since you managed to partition and format the SD card in the first place. Remove the SD card, insert in card reader, delete the andboot folder, or the contents of the folder, ( may be wise to have a spare SD with either a winmo or android install handy at this point, just in case things go horribly wrong ).
Now with the cleaned SD, put it in the phone and boot, it should boot fine, IF the data is truly on the EXT2 partition.
That at least will answer one question, namely, where the heck is my data?
If this works fine, then I'd just put it down to some inner weirdness of android on non-native devices, if it fails then I'm wondering if your EXT2 partition may have problems, forcing the phone to dump it on the first available good partition, namely the FAT32 one.
Oh and if it does fail, you will have to reinstall, since your data will be toast.
Finally, good luck, I await with interest
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great idea, I'll try this on the weekend. I wont delete data though, I'll just rename andboot and backup data for good measure, because I want to be able to go back to the data by renaming it back if it doesn't work. I was also thinking if there is any way to get to the ext2 partition and read it... I'm on xp so I cant do it on my pc, and on the phone, I've looked around in astro n other file managers but cant see anything. But if the case is as golfnz34me points out, then I should just backup the data, and change the option to Fat32 in install and restore data. That should do the trick.
golfnz34me said:
As I recall, the install has the FAT32/Ext2 options incorrectly swapped. It has been this way for a while.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, will check this out. If its true, then great, more speed for my /data! I wonder how I missed this, been going through these forums regularly...
Ok I checked it out, and golfnz34me is correct it seems.
But now I found a new problem. I backed up data, and in the installer, set the data to SDCard, and tried to restore data. It gives various errors like
Code:
cannot determine filesystem size
failed
failed to format
...some other lines...
losetup: /dev/block/loop2: no such device or address
I created the partition with Paragon partition manager, and after getting this error I rechecked in PPM. I reformated the partition, but still get the error. In PPM the partition drive letter isnt assigned. Or, the partition isnt the active partition. Can one of those be the problem? The volume name is Ext2. Im not very experienced in partitioning etc, apart from normal ntfs partition for new hds in windows, so I didnt play with any options. I dont have a linux system either. Any got any ideas? Any help would be appreciated alot!
Not sure about using partition managers other than gparted, afaik most people are using the Gparted live cd if they don't have a linux install handy.
The errors all point to some sort of problem with the EXT2 partition, or it's formatting.
Also EXT2 partitions do not have drive letters, nor do they have to be active partitions.
Apps and data on SD card.
I cant seem to figure out how to make all the apps and other stuff install to the SD card. Do I have to partition the card into two partitions? or is there a way to install the system to Nand and make all the apps and data go to the SD card? Ive tried setting it to System on nand and data on SD partition but it says no partitions to install to or something.
Ok lets start this discussion
Some reports:
- Fresh install, Wiped Data. Startup Manager throws a dozen of NOT RESPONDING errors before having my finger tip read
- Ok after a pain taking process of going to home, I see everything quick (entering/exiting from Drawer, switching homes, widgets etc)
- The native web browser hangs up after every GO to entered web address. (same is the case with xScope and Opera Mini
- Frequent incomplete downloads and failures
- tTorrent randomly PAUSES and goes to SCHEDULE when phone goes to sleep.
- Download speed is like 12KB/sec (my wifi router broadcasts an 8Mbps connection)
When I installed on NAND (SYS + DATA)
- Speed is just a dream, Menu transitions, Settings APIs etc open really fast (competing my friend's experia x10i )
- Browser seldom stalls on webpage " GO "s
- Download never fails and speed is decent (from 50KB/s to 120KB/s)
- tTorrent doesnt crash the download
- All application I install dont show black screen for too long.
So whats the remedy?
Obviously no one would want a space of only 90MB for a heap of software. Are there any suggestions?
My SD Card is partitioned as:
1.1GB FAT32 Primary
180MB Ext2 Primary (dont know whats that for)
Remaining space to Ext 2 Primary (for Data since Android installs DATA on LAST ext2 Partition)
Please propose some working solutions. My phone has like 2MB of system memory left (shown in settings) and I have to clear cache and end all tasks after like every 20 minutes of web browsing.
As a start, you'll have to realise that probably ANY sdcard, is slower that your NAND drive. To make matters WORSE, the sdcard drive on the kaiser, is kind of slow.
So, your apps not responding are a direct cause of this whole slowness. What can you do ?
Use another SD. Class 4 or 6 should do the trick.
If you can't, try formating your SD card with those special tools to fix FAT32 errors. I remember a HP tool...
Also, are you using DATA on SD Card Partition, or data on SD card imagefile ??
daedric said:
As a start, you'll have to realise that probably ANY sdcard, is slower that your NAND drive. To make matters WORSE, the sdcard drive on the kaiser, is kind of slow.
So, your apps not responding are a direct cause of this whole slowness. What can you do ?
Use another SD. Class 4 or 6 should do the trick.
If you can't, try formating your SD card with those special tools to fix FAT32 errors. I remember a HP tool...
Also, are you using DATA on SD Card Partition, or data on SD card imagefile ??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The img file is made on FAT32 and the Data on Partition uses the last Ext2 Partition available.
I'm still figuring out which one's better of the two file systems. I suspect that the .img loop file doesnt get fatter with more income :| (Tried with the regular Slackware Live distros which make a specific sized .img file and store data in there and its un-expandable)
dark_prince said:
The img file is made on FAT32 and the Data on Partition uses the last Ext2 Partition available.
I'm still figuring out which one's better of the two file systems. I suspect that the .img loop file doesnt get fatter with more income :| (Tried with the regular Slackware Live distros which make a specific sized .img file and store data in there and its un-expandable)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ext 2 for running off an sd card is better for 1 or 2 reasons
1. since its on a separate partition from your user data the system doesnt have to sort through your user data when trying to run the system
2. ext2 and 3 are both native linux formats, so its just a little more efficient at reading them. like somebody who's native language is english but knows how to speak spanish, its always going to be easier to speak english
Actually, i belive even linux reads/writes FAT32 faster than EXT2/3.
It simply doesn't have to write/read as much, there's no ACL, no owner for the files, you simply get a creation date, last modification date, and 3 or 4 attributes (read only, system, hidden, archive)
Either way, i don't belive its possible to expand a filesystem mounted through loop. you probably would need LVM (i thin its LVM) for this, which would be overkill for this matter.
As for... data on imagefile or on partition, i belive a partition is always better. First, although as of yet impossible, you can not mount the sd card via USB if the DATA is on a imagefile in it. Android cannot access /sdcard if its mounted.
Second, FAT32 is subject for fragmentation. A SD card does not suffer as much as a normal harddrive from it, but due to the major slowness of our sdreader, it would be noticable. Worse, you risk more data lost, as even if you don't get errors on the EXT2 filesystem, you might get them on the FAT32 filesystem.
IMHO of course
daedric said:
Actually, i belive even linux reads/writes FAT32 faster than EXT2/3.
It simply doesn't have to write/read as much, there's no ACL, no owner for the files, you simply get a creation date, last modification date, and 3 or 4 attributes (read only, system, hidden, archive)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats what I believe
Either way, i don't belive its possible to expand a filesystem mounted through loop. you probably would need LVM (i thin its LVM) for this, which would be overkill for this matter.
As for... data on imagefile or on partition, i belive a partition is always better. First, although as of yet impossible, you can not mount the sd card via USB if the DATA is on a imagefile in it. Android cannot access /sdcard if its mounted.
Second, FAT32 is subject for fragmentation. A SD card does not suffer as much as a normal harddrive from it, but due to the major slowness of our sdreader, it would be noticable. Worse, you risk more data lost, as even if you don't get errors on the EXT2 filesystem, you might get them on the FAT32 filesystem.
IMHO of course
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. I wish Kaiser had slightly bigger native storage tsk tsk
Has anyone successfully reformatted either /sdcard or /sdcard/external_sd/ /emmc as ext3? I'm not talking about an Apps2SD partition, I'm talking about reformatting the whole volume as one partition, transparent to apps. I do not use Windows so I do not need interoperability, I am fine with ext filesystems.
My goal is to be able to use symlinks (not to mention a more robust filesystem) to redirect certain hard-coded items to store on a different storage volume than it defaults to, but symlinks are not permitted on vfat (FAT32) filesystems.
Thanks!
Anything that I look an answer for, is just not answered. :-(
I am looking for the same information. Wonder why the native ext file systems are not allowed, given that its a Linux kernel running.
You could format it to ext3 and see how it works. Worst case scenario is your phone will tell that sdcard to fu*k off. Given that our phones can and do read the ext format I'm sure you can do it. I'm just not sure how well it will work as far as mounting and such.
On top of that, Windows can read ext formats. You just need a program to do it. I use it all the time.
Thanks for reviving this thread. Surely there must be someone out there who has tried this, and I was hoping to hear from them before I gave it a go, but looks like I'll just have to give it a shot myself.
When I find the time to backup & wipe my sdcard to try and reformat & mount it, I'll report back here.
With my Galaxy Note N7000 I can format a USB Stick to EXT3, and the phone uses it perfectly well as USB Storage...
(rooted, w/w SpeedMod kernel)
All of the new ICS roms talk in their instructions to partition your sd card. Some also have a non partition version for those that wish to not partition but those releases take longer to come out.
So why should I partition? I am asking in a general I really want to know why as on all of the rom release pages it just says to partition but no one every talks about why. Why do the newer roms require partitions while the 2.x Android roms never needed this.
Can't anyone let me know?
A lot of ROMs in 2.x support DarkTremor which allows many of the ROMs files to go onto a separate partition on the SD Card. This speeds up the phones response time as you run various apps.
This is most likely why the ICS builds are asking for you to partition the SD Card since they are automatically enabling this which is unlike the 2.. builds in which it was an option.
Doc
DocEsq said:
A lot of ROMs in 2.x support DarkTremor which allows many of the ROMs files to go onto a separate partition on the SD Card. This speeds up the phones response time as you run various apps.
This is most likely why the ICS builds are asking for you to partition the SD Card since they are automatically enabling this which is unlike the 2.. builds in which it was an option.
Doc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is this new automatic thing part of ICS or just something differently the rom developers are now doing?
Was DarkTremor built into the 2.x roms? When I first moved from stock to Cyanogen all I remember doing was wiping and installing the zip file, never did anything extra.
LordJezo said:
Is this new automatic thing part of ICS or just something differently the rom developers are now doing?
Was DarkTremor built into the 2.x roms? When I first moved from stock to Cyanogen all I remember doing was wiping and installing the zip file, never did anything extra.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe that this is something being put in by the developers. The ICS you get from HTC, LG, Samsung etc.. does not have this.
DarkTremor was built into a lot of the 2.x roms and would only become active if you you had the SD Card partitioned properly. It is in Cyanogen but it is something that you did not need to use if you did not want to.
There are some good tutorials out there if you want to give it a try. The big advantages are that it speeds up your phone and frees up precious space on your internal memory.
Doc
I believe the simple answer is that ICS has a bigger footprint and therefore requires more internal system capacity. The phones that come stock with ICS have more system capacity than our EVO 4G. A2sd and an ext partition effectively expand the system partition so that these larger footprints will work on our phones.
Non-a2sd versions take longer because the dev has to figure out how to get ICS working with "insufficient" capacity.
Another development to look at is firerat's mtd mod that allows one to reconfigure the system, cache, and consequently data partitions.
Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk 2
dcharleyultra said:
I believe the simple answer is that ICS has a bigger footprint and therefore requires more internal system capacity. The phones that come stock with ICS have more system capacity than our EVO 4G. A2sd and an ext partition effectively expand the system partition so that these larger footprints will work on our phones.
Non-a2sd versions take longer because the dev has to figure out how to get ICS working with "insufficient" capacity.
Another development to look at is firerat's mtd mod that allows one to reconfigure the system, cache, and consequently data partitions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks! That was exactly what I was looking for.
When people use in in GB roms is it just them trying to optimize things better by freeing up system memory by utilizing sd space?
LordJezo said:
Thanks! That was exactly what I was looking for.
When people use in in GB roms is it just them trying to optimize things better by freeing up system memory by utilizing sd space?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, that's what I think.
Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk 2
That is why I partitioned my drive (to move apps to my sd card and to free up space on the phone). I am on the MikG ROM.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
1TonyC said:
That is why I partitioned my drive (to move apps to my sd card and to free up space on the phone). I am on the MikG ROM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would you need to partition the sd card to move apps? That's a built in feature of GB.
Or do you mean system apps?
I was constantly getting alerts that I was running out of internal memory. This was after I transferred as many apps as I could to the sd card.
So I partitioned my sd card and flashed the MikG ROM. No more memory problems .
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Partitioning for apps2sd is not to move ur apps to SD card. It will automatically install ALL apps downloaded from play store to the SD. No need to move anything! Its like adding internal memory to our phones! I was hesitant at first but now I wouldn't do it any other way. I noticed a nice increase in performance on ics roms and I can now download whatever the hell I want and not worry about bogging down my internal memory
Sent from my D.I.R.T.y CM9'd EVO 4G using xda premium!
Rather than posting a new thread, I'll ask my question here since it is somewhat relevant to the conversation.
I'm at work while I was updating to jmztaylor's latest nightly, so I do not want to backup my SD onto my work computer. Can apps2sd be flashed at any point after flashing the ROM or does it have to be at the same time as flashing the ROM?
Jaxp3r said:
Rather than posting a new thread, I'll ask my question here since it is somewhat relevant to the conversation.
I'm at work while I was updating to jmztaylor's latest nightly, so I do not want to backup my SD onto my work computer. Can apps2sd be flashed at any point after flashing the ROM or does it have to be at the same time as flashing the ROM?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It can be done later.
Captain_Throwback said:
It can be done later.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great, thanks for the info!
The main difference between the built-in moving of apps and the partition is where the apps go.
With GB's moving (a2sd) the .apk file is moved to a directory on your SD card called .android-secure. The big con to this is that if your SD isn't mounted (for example, if you're moving files from your computer, or on the initial error check on boot), you can't access these apps. You also cannot use any widgets an app might have if it's been moved to .android-secure.
If you have a partition (ext3 generally) then it's a different story. Generally, what happens is that the /data/app directory in your internal storage is symlinked to your partition, /ext. (I think it's /ext/data/app, but I can't remember and haven't used the sd partition for a bit). Pros to this one are much more space, since assuming you have the space and your SD is fast enough you can also symlink your appdata and dalvik-cache. Plus, you are able to use widgets because Android thinks the apps are installed to the internal data. One major con is that you can potentially reduce your SD card's life, since it will be reading and writing a lot more from that portion of it.
And a symlink explanation: In a sense, it points one directory to another area of the filesystem. When I was partitioned Root Explorer showed my symlinked /data/app as this: "/data/app > /ext/data/app". It's a way to have parts of the filesystem "appear" in other areas without having to copy/paste. I've used it to get a few directories to sync to Dropbox without having to keep spare copies of my files in the main Dropbox ones.
Be careful. I just did it an hour ago and everything disappeared from my sd card. So pissed.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
What are partitions..
SLB9884 said:
Be careful. I just did it an hour ago and everything disappeared from my sd card. So pissed.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is because when you re-partition your card (or hard drive,etc..) it basically wipes it. What you are doing is redefining the very volumes that take up space on your card and giving them a starting and ending block address based on the size of the card and the defined size of the partition. You can think of it has a two pieces of glass and you are pouring colored sand in. You pour red in and get your data partition, then you pour in green and get your swap partition so on. Eventually all partitions are defined and ideally will make the most use of the total space on your card.
So when you partition, it's very low level and requires abandoning all data and prior formats on the card unless you are using some special software that attempts to adjust the sizes of the partitions.
Somewhere at the beginning of your card is a small sector that lists all the partitions and their starting/ending blocks, plus other relevant informationj.
So if you plan to partition, you need to back up the data first to your pc or what not.
Storage
Because its an entire system you'll want to to save space on your card, make a backup of any important files because its gonna wipe it and you cant undo it
Here's a couple of great guides for a2sd. Once I finally did my phone performed much better.
http://therootofallevo.com/2011/04/10-step-guide-properly-set-darktremors-a2sd/
http://androplasty.com/2011/08/mini-guide-how-to-re-partition-your-sd-card/
I know I'm late to the party and this was probably already discussed, but I couldn't find it with search. Has anyone considered converting the inc to a data media device (http://www.xda-developers.com/android/what-is-a-data-media-device/)? I've seen this done with other devices (e.g. hp touchpad). I'd be nice to be able to use the EMMC partition for storage and data. I know there is ext4all but I still seem to run out of space quickly since dalvik-cache is half of /data.
Not sure if hboot will let you combine partitions to do what you want; however, lvm can probably accomplish what you're hoping to achieve but it takes quite a bit of effort to setup.
Sent from my One using Tapatalk
I wasn't necessarily thinking we need to combine any partitions. Just don't mount the existing /data and /data/data partitions, and mount the EMMC partition as /data with an emulated sdcard at /data/media. I think this is how the Samsung phones work; you have both "internal" and "external" sdcards. Seems like it should just be some config changes and maybe a recovery that is datamedia aware so you don't erase the emulated sdcard when wiping data.
Smells like a project. I'll see if I will get around to this but this sounds doable.
No promises but my Inc could get bricked and I wouldn't cry over it so I can take a few risks.
Sent from my One using Tapatalk
I've only done a little research so far, but it seems like you'd only need to change a few configuration files. I don't think you could truly brick your Inc, could you? I'm tempted to try and get it working myself but I can't risk bricking my dd.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk
ive got 2 incs so I dont mind messing with it, I have a touchpad tho and from what I know (I am decent friends with invisiblek and he does work on the touchpad) the only real difference, is re-partitioning your internal and setting the device tree to mount data as data/media instead of for say /data or /data/data
I have a TouchPad too. Finally made the leap to kk and datamedia there which is what got me thinking about the Inc. The repartioning done for the TouchPad was too make the data partition larger since it now holds both apps and sdcard data. We shouldn't have to do that for the Inc since we already have a partition with 6.6 gig available. Nothing is mounted at /data/media, it's just another directory on the main /data partition. That's why you need a special recovery that "wipes" data instead of formatting...
I've been looking at the changes milaq made. I assume invisiblek did something similar if not the same.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk
natediggity said:
I have a TouchPad too. Finally made the leap to kk and datamedia there which is what got me thinking about the Inc. The repartioning done for the TouchPad was too make the data partition larger since it now holds both apps and sdcard data. We shouldn't have to do that for the Inc since we already have a partition with 6.6 gig available. Nothing is mounted at /data/media, it's just another directory on the main /data partition. That's why you need a special recovery that "wipes" data instead of formatting...
I've been looking at the changes milaq made. I assume invisiblek did something similar if not the same.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A fancy flashable script to convert your boot.img to use /data/media should be possible. So far I told it to switch to mmcblk03 from 01 for /data so it's 6.6GB. The other part is relocating fuse to use /data/media for the internal storage instead of /emmc. That should be somewhat easy to change but a bit harder to script.
/data/media was designed for devices that don't have an sdcard slot which the Inc does have so this is more of a proof of concept idea for me than actual utility.
Ok, the last part is recovery and the current recovery images appear to be large enough to make the recovery build part fail. I'm not sure the actual recovery partition size on the inc but the images come to be about 4.5 MB and fail.
zachf714 said:
ive got 2 incs so I dont mind messing with it, I have a touchpad tho and from what I know (I am decent friends with invisiblek and he does work on the touchpad) the only real difference, is re-partitioning your internal and setting the device tree to mount data as data/media instead of for say /data or /data/data
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
/data/media uses fuse on an existing ext4 partition so the recovery as nate said has to be told to wipe /data instead of format (in other words, using an rm command and excluding /data/media).
This makes filesystem corruption harder to fix since the partition can't be wiped from recovery normally unless it's a format which TWRP does have an option to format /data.
tiny4579 said:
A fancy flashable script to convert your boot.img to use /data/media should be possible. So far I told it to switch to mmcblk03 from 01 for /data so it's 6.6GB. The other part is relocating fuse to use /data/media for the internal storage instead of /emmc. That should be somewhat easy to change but a bit harder to script.
/data/media was designed for devices that don't have an sdcard slot which the Inc does have so this is more of a proof of concept idea for me than actual utility.
Ok, the last part is recovery and the current recovery images appear to be large enough to make the recovery build part fail. I'm not sure the actual recovery partition size on the inc but the images come to be about 4.5 MB and fail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check my device tree, I have a commit on omni that compresses recovery a bit more and I use it to build
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk
tiny4579 said:
A fancy flashable script to convert your boot.img to use /data/media should be possible. So far I told it to switch to mmcblk03 from 01 for /data so it's 6.6GB. The other part is relocating fuse to use /data/media for the internal storage instead of /emmc. That should be somewhat easy to change but a bit harder to script.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't need a flashable script unless it's required. Personally, I'm fine just building a new system image and flashing that.
tiny4579 said:
/data/media was designed for devices that don't have an sdcard slot which the Inc does have so this is more of a proof of concept idea for me than actual utility.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
datamedia can be used in conjunction with sdcards. This is what the new samsung phones do. I thought the HTC One did as well, but I just remembered it doesn't have a sdcard slot. If you haven't already, check out this page: https://source.android.com/devices/tech/storage/config-example.html. Our config would be similar to the Xoom's.