Develop Bugs

NO BIAS: the G nexus vs G S2

I gave my wife my old Nexus One. Recently she dropped it and cracked the screen, badly. The phone still works as well as the touch.
But if I were to get her a new phone as a gift, which one would be a better choice nowadays?

STOP POSTING THESE THREADS AND READ THE OTHERS, please.
Buy a Galaxy Nexus, you won't be disappointed.

Give her your phone and get yourself a Nexus

Galaxy Nexus
or possibly Galaxy Note if a larger phone is preferable

I own a galaxy nexus and i have no complaints whatsoever....like...at all.
But if you don't already own the galaxy nexus...i would get the galaxy s III...its rumored to have a quad core exynos processor and IMO get that...its a newer phone and probably the same price.
@people getting annoyed at these threads - this is a FORUM...for people to post questions and comments...if you don't like it don't comment and clutter the thread with useless posts.

Imo galaxy nexus is better in every possible way, but I think s2 has better design. More professional look
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

ultra99 said:
I gave my wife my old Nexus One. Recently she dropped it and cracked the screen, badly. The phone still works as well as the touch.
But if I were to get her a new phone as a gift, which one would be a better choice nowadays?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since this is the gn forum then most will blindly suggest the gn.
Assuming your wife is not a techy person (u gave her an old nexus one), i think the gs2 would suite her better. Better camera (women love taking pictures right) and sd card support (for even more pics and media) and now has official ics.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

bimmerboii said:
Since this is the gn forum then most will blindly suggest the gn.
Assuming your wife is not a techy person (u gave her an old nexus one), i think the gs2 would suite her better. Better camera (women love taking pictures right) and sd card support (for even more pics and media) and now has official ics.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually I disagree. Gnex has faster shutter speed. Which means almost never miss the moment. My gf always *****es about blurry shots. I never have this issue with my Gnex
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

woostar88 said:
Actually I disagree. Gnex has faster shutter speed. Which means almost never miss the moment. My gf always *****es about blurry shots. I never have this issue with my Gnex
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the shutter speed might be awesome, but the quality of the shots themselves is pretty ****.
for anyone non-technical, the SGSII is imo the best iphone alternative atm

Hinee said:
the shutter speed might be awesome, but the quality of the shots themselves is pretty ****.
for anyone non-technical, the SGSII is imo the best iphone alternative atm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't go on and to say it's ****. But it could be better... What do you expect? It's a damn phone.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

what do i expect? them to be better than the older model SGSII, which they certainly aren't.

get her a nokia 5110 thats undestructable! hehe just jokin!! wait till the sgs3 gets out, get yourself the gsg3 and give her your nexus and wrap her hands with 2 sided tape!

If you want a non biased opinion, don't post your question in the G-Nex forum. LOL...
That said, I would recommend getting the SGS II. It's smoking fast, thin, and has gorilla glass. Good battery life when set up properly. Did I mention it's really fast?
Sent from my Galaxy Note (SGH-i717) using XDA Premium.

woostar88 said:
I wouldn't go on and to say it's ****. But it could be better... What do you expect? It's a damn phone.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to agree.. taking advantage of the zero shutter lag results to blurry photos.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

Its a phone...what do you really expect from the camera?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA

woostar88 said:
Imo galaxy nexus is better in every possible way, but I think s2 has better design. More professional look
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
S2 has better design?? When it comes to phones, nothings says "sexy beautiful" better than a curved screen.
If you want the "professional look" get something with a physical keyboard.

i'd say S2 out of the box is more user friendly to ladies
not everyone knwows how to appreciate vanilla android
speaking from personal experience, i bought her a new Gnex for her and i use her S2
well, i have always prefer older phone as the dev is better and more rom to choose from (i was a super vibrant user)
less than 2 weeks, she wanted her S2 back and gave me back my Gnex. LOL
she think S2 is more user friendly and has better quality pix

Barring the screen, which is almost as good as the Gnex, I would say SGS 2, as it is miles better than the nexus. SGS 2 is a lot faster.
Camera on Nexus isn't really good enough for a phone, SGS2 Camera is miles better.
SGS 2 is an 9/10 phone, the nexus is a 7/10 phone.

biffsmash said:
Barring the screen, which is almost as good as the Gnex, I would say SGS 2, as it is miles better than the nexus. SGS 2 is a lot faster.
Camera on Nexus isn't really good enough for a phone, SGS2 Camera is miles better.
SGS 2 is an 9/10 phone, the nexus is a 7/10 phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The screen on the SII is not anywhere close to the screen on the nexus. No idea why you would even say that.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA

Smokeey said:
Its a phone...what do you really expect from the camera?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is such a stupid comment it frustrates me. I expect a comparable camera to the 4s at least.
I'm glad people like you have nothing to do with product development.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

Is it worth buying a Nexus today?

Hello,
How are you?
As I have said in previous threads, I currently have a Galaxy Note.
I am wanting to switch to a bit smaller phone with better handling with one hand on the go.
I've though about the HTC One X and Samsung Galaxy S3, but I think the support in regard to updates is just slow.
So, I am thinking about a Nexus.
My question is with the Nexus running older, is it still worth the purchase today? It is a fairly bit cheaper than the S3 or HOX.
ALso, the camera is an important feature to me.
I don't carry dedicated cameras with me no more, so I rely on my phone to take some casual snaps.
How is the camera on the Nexus in comparison to my Note, in regard to general image quality?
Hope you can help me out.
Thank you.
Best wishes.

Some references:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1843976
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1841776

If I were you, I would wait a month or two to see which handsets that will be released.
The spec's on the Nexus is 9 months old so it is not the best out there anymore in regards to hardware, but it is without comparison the best handset when it comes to updates and community support.
The camera on the phone is OK, not the best out there but it manages for my use. I don't know how it compares to the Note's camera since i've never tried it.

if the camera is important to you and is a higher priority rather than the software updates I'd go with something newer. Having gone from a GS2 to a GNex I can say the picture quality is down and is noticeable. I'm guessing they use the same 8mp sensor in the Note as the GS2

I have the post-ban Gnex GSM.
In the last year, I've used One X (awesome screen, awesome camera, but that's it. Sence is stupid), Nokia 900 (awesome hardware, meh camera, meh screen, terrible app store), GS3 (awesome everything except touch wiz), Galaxy Note (hate touch wiz, good camera, good screen, unique), and of course the iPhone 4S.
Today, when my friends ask what phone to get, I direct them to GS3. I'm not a fan of touch wiz, but it's hard to deny the awesome hardware that thing has in it.
If you put the Gnex software with the S3 hardware, you would have the best phone in the world today. For me, software is more important than hardware which is why I support the nex.

Yes, it's worth it.
Sent from my Stock AOSP Android 4.1.1 Galaxy Nexus

Thank you all for the replies.
Is the Nexus too much of a downgrade in terms of hardware from my Note?
Also, If I install a rom like CM10 on my Note, I will almost get that stock ICS feel on the note, or even an S3, right?
Those kinds of roms are not that much ate in time after the original Google updates, are they?
Cheers!

The Nexus is always worth it especially for development.

The Nexus is always the way to go if you like flashing ROMs.

No jelly bean for Verizon or sprint Gnex yet. International s3 getting official jelly bean next week. S3 over Gnex was an easy decision for me.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using xda app-developers app

I own the Nexus VZW and S3. I prefer the S3 for the hardware but I love the nexus for roms. I will probably flash the S3 today.

When it's said that the nexus is better to install customs ROMs, what is the difference from a HOX or S3?
Does the nexus have a bigger development community and better support?
Cheers
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda premium

Tlo218 said:
No jelly bean for Verizon or sprint Gnex yet. International s3 getting official jelly bean next week. S3 over Gnex was an easy decision for me.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Official nothing. You buy a Nexus to have the choice to not wait for the carries. All versions of the Galaxy Nexus have stock and custom ROMs built on 4.1.1 source. I run stock 4.1.1 on my Sprint Galaxy Nexus and it runs just as well as any other.
Development on a Nexus device is always easier than any other, has more potential, and a larger development community. Your GS3 may see 4.1.1 but may get left in the dust for the next version while my Nexus will remain up-to-date, regardless of whether the "carrier" releases it or not.
Sent from my Stock AOSP Android 4.1.1 Galaxy Nexus

I went from the Note to the Nexus yesterday. I realised that the Nexus is a better size for me but the Note lives on with my wife and it is an awesome peice of kit. Also for me as much as I messed around with TW roms I always craved vanilla Android. The problem is that CM and AOKP always had issues despite the devs hard work. My advice to the OP is to buy the GNex now and swap it next year for a new Nexus next year when prices of those have dropped. That's what I will be doing. In 23 months of Android I have had 6 different phones, but this is easier to do in GSM land.
Sent from my LG-P990 using xda app-developers app

finbaar said:
I went from the Note to the Nexus yesterday. I realised that the Nexus is a better size for me but the Note lives on with my wife and it is an awesome peice of kit. Also for me as much as I messed around with TW roms I always craved vanilla Android. The problem is that CM and AOKP always had issues despite the devs hard work. My advice to the OP is to buy the GNex now and swap it next year for a new Nexus next year when prices of those have dropped. That's what I will be doing. In 23 months of Android I have had 6 different phones, but this is easier to do in GSM land.
Sent from my LG-P990 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's helpful.
Can you please give me your impression of the camera on both phones? Is it a dramatic difference?
Also, any kind of regrets on the swap?
I'm still over thinking... I can get the Nexus for a sweet price and still make some profit in selling my note, but I am afraid of regretting it...
Decisions...
Cheers
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda premium

To the OP- I have both phones. I got the G note at the beginning of the year, but switched to tmobile and it was not too reliable then. I got the G nexus 2 months ago and love the smaller size.
I have recently gotten to test out both cameras with the ustream app- Trying to catch a mouse popping out of my stove- Arghhhh!!!!
This ustream app sends out the camera as a live feed to your computer. I used both phones on 2 different nites. I am sorry to say there is a significant difference. The G Note is a great picture. The G nexus is a step down in clarity. I can't say its blurry, but there are more details shown with the g Note. In still pictures, it seems to be fine. I wouldn't have known the difference is I didn't see it with my own eyes.
I now switch off between the phones. the radio problem has been fixed for the note on tmobile. I really love my Note, but at times the Gnex is more practical to carry around. I was able to sell an old iphone and infuse to pay for my gnex, so I could keep both
Tough decision! Good Luck!

Sorry I have not had enough experience yet with the GNex camera, but that is not so important to me and my wife can take the pictures on the Note. No regrets for me.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

When the next nexus arrives, do you think the current nexus will hold it's value better than the note? The note 2 will be announced the coming week, and it might pull the note's value Down. It does have the uniqueness of the screen tough...
Cheers
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda premium

gdourado said:
When the next nexus arrives, do you think the current nexus will hold it's value better than the note? The note 2 will be announced the coming week, and it might pull the note's value Down. It does have the uniqueness of the screen tough...
Cheers
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think nexus will hold its value much longer than note, thanks to timely update from Google.
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF300T using xda app-developers app

Zeinzu said:
Official nothing. You buy a Nexus to have the choice to not wait for the carries. All versions of the Galaxy Nexus have stock and custom ROMs built on 4.1.1 source. I run stock 4.1.1 on my Sprint Galaxy Nexus and it runs just as well as any other.
Development on a Nexus device is always easier than any other, has more potential, and a larger development community. Your GS3 may see 4.1.1 but may get left in the dust for the next version while my Nexus will remain up-to-date, regardless of whether the "carrier" releases it or not.
Sent from my Stock AOSP Android 4.1.1 Galaxy Nexus
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^ This is the chief reason why I kept my Sprint Galaxy Nexus rather than returning it before my 14 days were up.
I still have my HTC EVO 4G LTE, but love the Nexus. I find it much more appealing design and it feels better to hold for long calls that I can't use speakerphone on. I consider myself to be very demanding of my phones and, like every other handset I have had, I have found things with the Nexus that need to be tweaked to my liking. This is the best part of this phone. I can do that if I dig into it and learn about the design and programming. Lack of carrier "sh_tware" is an extra bonus, but that can be removed from any rooted phone with TB.

looking at switching from GS2 to GNEX

The Main reason I am thinking of switching over this phone is because development on the gs2 isnt really kicking anymore and I love switching thru roms on my phone. what do you guys thing about the dev situation on this gnex? looks like there is alot going on here to me.
Thoughts?

Lots of roms that are similar and some stock aosp roms that will be obsolete when ota arrives. My favorite is the codename android one. Obviously cm9/10 as well
sent from stock toroplus

Cant beat a nexus device and go with team baked. I believe they will be updating later today. I dont know how to share a profile from google+ but if you go to teambaked rom or teamicemods.com on the site you can see it.
*Shaolin Shadowboxing*

I came from an epic touch 4 G and never looked back I love the Galaxy Nexus and can't wait to the new 1 is revealed!!

There's so much going on w/ the gnex, you can't keep up w/ it all. Always something to try if you don't like what you tried...different flavors for everybody. The only problem w/ having a gnex is you may become a crack flasher...

I hardly stick to one rom. So many to try, n most of em are frequently updated. I found the lack of kernel choices in the s2 forum.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

You'll be happy. Aosp just works on this phone. You pretty much never see a what works and what doesn't in any of the ROM threads. There's also no weird bugs or reason to flash back to stock Like to get a GPS lock or update the prl like many of galaxy s2s have to do.
Even with the higher resolution screen and different GPU the galaxy nexus still runs ICS and jellybean much smoother than the s2 in my experience. I have ran cm9 on an epic 4g touch with that my friend has. It is so much less buggy and smoother on the galaxy nexus.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

Had a GS2. Screen is crap compared to GNEX. You won't be sorry. Performance is great.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

My other half has a SGS2. I personally think the phones are roughly equal.
GNexus has a better screen but the S2 has a better camera. Roms for GNexus are more stable but S2 has proper dual boot kernels etc. In terms of performance I find them about the same.
It'll be more of a sidegrade than an upgrade, but it's great owning a Nexus device and getting the latest Android updates right away.

Michealtbh said:
My other half has a SGS2. I personally think the phones are roughly equal.
GNexus has a better screen but the S2 has a better camera. Roms for GNexus are more stable but S2 has proper dual boot kernels etc. In terms of performance I find them about the same.
It'll be more of a sidegrade than an upgrade, but it's great owning a Nexus device and getting the latest Android updates right away.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This camera rocks it! I took pics of jupiter the other morning. Have yet to have a camera get these shots.
*Shaolin Shadowboxing*

I switched from a GS2 to the Galaxy Nexus because I wanted the HD screen.
Other than that, the experiences really aren't much apart.
The GS2 will forever have a special place in my heart as the exynos proc they used is such an amazing piece of technology.
Still, and will always remain the fastest GB phone ever produced.

I switched from a GS2 to a Galaxy Nexus when I dropped my GS2 and destroyed it. It's not the biggest upgrade, but I love the HD screen and how smooth it is. I just wish it had the GS2's camera. My only complaint.

I switched to the galaxy nexus and gave my gf my sgs2, both are great phones, I'm happy with my choice and stable ROM development is a plus
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

I actually just sold my epic touch and purchased a galaxy nexus and straight talk sim card. I like my epic touch but the screen just looks like crap with its small resolution compared the galaxy nexus. Can't wait for my new phone to get here!
Sent from my Ally using xda app-developers app

Anyone moved to S3? Why?

If yes, please state your reasons of moving to S3.
Let's share our knowledge.

lol biggest regret ever stick to google for android or gt iphone
most apps and game dnt makke full use of quadcore
samsung offer little support
tbh first android phone iv used that made me wanna gt an iphone and iv always used android
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

I made an even trade w/ a friend.
Screensize.
Sent from the Mars Rover.

I think it's safe to assume most people that have moved from a Nexus to an S3 wouldn't continue to lurk in the Nexus forums. Probably best to ask in the S3 forums :good:
I love my Nexus and will always stay Nexus for the stock Android experience and abundance of ROMs. That said though I did try a S3 4g/LTE model today and was MIGHTY impressed with how snappy it was with Jellybean.

I've been tempted several times. Its the physical buttones that are holding me back.

I recently had the chance to get it myself. But I couldn't do it. I was looking at the aosp development, and from what I'm used to it was weak. I could live with touchwiz but I just don't like it. The physical keys where also a downer. Just something I wouldn't like to give up. And since i already have a quad core tablet there really was nothing besides a better camera and even then the gnex camera is pretty good I don't listen to what others say I know what I've seen it do.
Sent From My Toro+ via Tapatalk

Got this phone after having an sgs2 with touchwiz.
I hate touchwiz.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

Hayness said:
I think it's safe to assume most people that have moved from a Nexus to an S3 wouldn't continue to lurk in the Nexus forums. Probably best to ask in the S3 forums :good:
I love my Nexus and will always stay Nexus for the stock Android experience and abundance of ROMs. That said though I did try a S3 4g/LTE model today and was MIGHTY impressed with how snappy it was with Jellybean.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wrong i have both and im using my nexus now. Gnex will always be smooter than and non native aosp devive
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

I have both as well (SGS2 being my daily phone) and for me (my own personal preference) both the GNex and SGS3 has their own perks in their respective right. With that being said, if i had to choose, my GNex will come out on top each time. But my SGS3 is a damn good device.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

[email protected] said:
Wrong i have both and im using my nexus now. Gnex will always be smooter than and non native aosp devive
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
-.- touch wiz is actually pretty fast and well optimized its faster then the gnex
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

Jasonhunterx said:
-.- touch wiz is actually pretty fast and well optimized its faster then the gnex
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im talking about pure Android loke aosp or cm10
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

The latest Touchwiz is pretty bad. I had TW ICS on my tab2 and just recently we got TW JB on the tab2. I don't know if the SGS3 will get something similar but this latest version of TW JB on my Tab 2 is slow, the browser force closes and the interface has been changed for the worst. The ICS version of TW was better than this newest version they have released.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

[email protected] said:
Wrong i have both and im using my nexus now. Gnex will always be smooter than and non native aosp devive
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
have you even tried a gs3? even though the gnex is really smooth, the s3 is pretty much on par with their touchwiz.

jeeholim said:
have you even tried a gs3? even though the gnex is really smooth, the s3 is pretty much on par with their touchwiz.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The bigger question is did you read what he said? Now re-read what you typed.
He was talking about AOSP. If there was still confusion, he posted specifically that he was talking about AOSP, over an hour before you posted.

jeeholim said:
have you even tried a gs3? even though the gnex is really smooth, the s3 is pretty much on par with their touchwiz.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For the last time im not on about ****wizzzz im on about pure Google Android like cm10
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

I have both and most of the time use my s3 for the battery life. If I want to try something new or interesting I'll usually do it on the nexus. As far as bad aosp goes I'm not sure what you're smoking, we get nightly cm10 builds consistently. I'm currently running the m2 release and it's perfectly suitable for every day use. Prior to this I was running paranoid and it was great. M2 just has better battery life. Also while they do get worse battery life than touch wiz it's still better than my nexus.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda premium

[email protected] said:
Wrong i have both and im using my nexus now. Gnex will always be smooter than and non native aosp devive
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He said most.. Lol
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

lolno.

Well a lot of people I know have the s3. A lot.
Anyway...I've had a lot of opportunities to play with it. It is very very very fast first and foremost!
I've mostly played with the ICS versions. So smooth and a real joy to use. The nature UX is also very nice. Its one of the best android skin I've used from any OEM I think. They finally moved away from trying to mimic the IOS look and feel with the UI which is good.
I've tried the jellybean version of the s3 just once and to be honest I could not tell a big difference. That's because the s3 is awesome with speed and responsiveness even with ICS.
The screen is excellent also, and the feel and look of the handset in the hand is nice. It looks a lot like the galaxy nexus with buttons.
I would not move to the s3 as a full time replacement for the galaxy nexus however. Simple reason being that I had the galaxy note and waiting for ICS and Jellybean was not my thing.
I'm too comfortable with quick stock updates from my nexus s days. Plus the main reason also...the galaxy nexus is insanely fast and smooth already!
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

I have a chance to trade for a one x. Not sure If I should do it
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Galaxy nexus or galaxy s3

I have I galaxy nexus that I rooted and flashed custom roms. This guy on craigslist is offering his s3 with a case and an extended battery for my nexus. Is it worth the trade? I like the roms on my nexus like xylon(it takes paranoid android, cyanogenmod, aokp and blends it into one rom.). Does the s3 have that or something similar that includes pie controls?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

ayo234 said:
I have I galaxy nexus that I rooted and flashed custom roms. This guy on craigslist is offering his s3 with a case and an extended battery for my nexus. Is it worth the trade? I like the roms on my nexus like xylon(it takes paranoid android, cyanogenmod, aokp and blends it into one rom.). Does the s3 have that or something similar that includes pie controls?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure enough. Go check out the Original Android Development section. Cheers

Xylon has been ported to the sgh-i747 galaxy 3.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2144299
Please hit Thanks if I've been helpful at all.

ayo234 said:
I have I galaxy nexus that I rooted and flashed custom roms. This guy on craigslist is offering his s3 with a case and an extended battery for my nexus. Is it worth the trade? I like the roms on my nexus like xylon(it takes paranoid android, cyanogenmod, aokp and blends it into one rom.). Does the s3 have that or something similar that includes pie controls?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My wife has a gnex and I have a gs3, and I'd probably keep the gnex if I were you. I prefer AOSP ROMs and they just work a bit better on the gnex that the gs3 without giving up much speed.
Slim bean works great on the gs3 for me so far though. If you really need LTE, might be worth the trade, otherwise I'd stick with gnex.
Or you could do the trade, sell the gs3, and buy a new nexus 4
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747

LTE is addiction once get the hang of it

Pacman ROM is what you are looking for if you want all the features in one ROM.
GS3 vs Nexus
- Better CPU
- Better GPU
- 2x RAM
- Better Display
- SD Card Slot
- LTE
Sounds like a no brainer to me.
Sent from my SGH-I747 using xda app-developers app

Galaxy SIII
I would go with the Galaxy S3. Better specs hardware wise. And there's a ton of great roms for it.