Related
See the linked article http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/26/windows_phone_7_sales/
WP7 doesn't appear to be doing very well. So many people want this to fail it amazes me!
That's truly sad. I'm actually a bit disappointed with the advertisements from Microsoft. Sure, the ads are broad casted a lot but there aren't any catchy ones like the iPod silhouettes and what not. MS needs to step it up when it comes to appealing to consumers through ads otherwise it'll be hard to dent the Androids hold over the smartphone marketshare.
Same here in France, with this article from a famous french magazine LE POINT: "What's wrong with WP7" (google translation)
http://translate.google.fr/translat...-qui-cloche-22-11-2010-1265610_47.php&act=url
Articles underlines some missing features when readers in the comments mainly insist on:
- the fact that WP7 is too locked, especially compared to Android
- WP7 is not designed for business
I guess that if it doesn't do well, those of us who have a wp7 device are going to be part of a pretty exclusive club! Still there is time yet, if MS produce the updates which add the missing features that all the naysayers continually whinge about and go up a gear on their marketing campaign WP7 will fly - it is too good a product not to!
I don't have a magic boll but I think that all of this will change in a couple of months
adesonic said:
I guess that if it doesn't do well, those of us who have a wp7 device are going to be part of a pretty exclusive club! Still there is time yet, if MS produce the updates which add the missing features that all the naysayers continually whinge about and go up a gear on their marketing campaign WP7 will fly - it is too good a product not to!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is reported that MS is in it for the win. I can only believe such criticisms will spur MS on to ever higher efforts. I agree, too, that most of the criticisms are about the lacking features. This will change when those features are added. I know I love the system but almost gave up on it...I was livid actually...when I saw it didn't have common voice nav. The copy & paste and multitasking, I was aware of it not having. But the voice nav, I wasn't aware of. It rocked me badly. I can only imagine what the general, unknowing, public might be feeling about the system...without all of these features.
I think for the sole reason of creating the hd7 and not allowing a hd2 upgrade they deserve to fail.
HTC deserve to fail for their mediocre WP7 devices. MS doesnt, but sadly they are depending on these hardwaremanufaturers.
nizzon said:
HTC deserve to fail for their mediocre WP7 devices. MS doesnt, but sadly they are depending on these hardwaremanufaturers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
please tell me what is wrong with my hd7 ?
The press has pretty much written off Microsoft as a whole already. They need somebody to bark at and somebody to adore, if they aren't opinionated nobody will read their stuff.
twisted89 said:
I think for the sole reason of creating the hd7 and not allowing a hd2 upgrade they deserve to fail.
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Click to collapse
the hd2 was never in line for it MS has always said that this is a stupid argument the hd7 may have similar specs but the hd7 is a vast improvment in design
Everyone is always bashing MS but that's not stopped them they new that the haters would come but so to are the updates and tbh if less ppl have one then the more ppl there are who will be amazed when they see mine
WP7 is too important for Microsoft for them to give up on it. It's their only mobile platform that ties all of their online services together. If they want to compete with Google WP7 has to succeed. Microsoft can't afford for to let everyone use an Android phone with cloud services and search services all going to Google.
For those that are worried about bad press remember people said the same thing about the xbox when it came out and it's been a success despite having a horrible track record with hardware failures.
WP7 is a long term strategy for Microsoft. Poor sales in the beginning is hardly anything to worry about it.
lumpaywk said:
the hd2 was never in line for it MS has always said that this is a stupid argument the hd7 may have similar specs but the hd7 is a vast improvment in design
Everyone is always bashing MS but that's not stopped them they new that the haters would come but so to are the updates and tbh if less ppl have one then the more ppl there are who will be amazed when they see mine
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
vast improvement in design? how exactly? they moved a couple of buttons around!
There is no vast improvement in design but the simple answer is the hd2 doesn't meet the button requirements for WP7. There's no exceptions to the rules Microsoft has laid out.
twisted89 said:
vast improvement in design? how exactly? they moved a couple of buttons around!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ceesheim said:
please tell me what is wrong with my hd7 ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe nothing wrong with yours, but I'm on my 4th one. The first one had data reception problems. The second one had dead pixels all over the screen and at the perfect angle you could see scuff marks on the screen. The third one had trash under the screen, on top of the actual LCD. There were tiny specks of something on it.
I always thought my HD2 was exceptional for quality, and it is. But I have not had fortune with HTC's latest offerings.
adesonic said:
Seems the press are already writing off WP7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Them again. And how many journalists are experts in anything?
The reports are just the typical anti-ms nonsense from the media...here in Canada it's hard to find the Samsung focus...the US launched with far fewer devices than demand.
MS is in for the long road...let's remember android for the first 2 years...
vangrieg said:
The press has pretty much written off Microsoft as a whole already. They need somebody to bark at and somebody to adore, if they aren't opinionated nobody will read their stuff.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's getting to the stage where the Microsoft-bashing is beyond the joke.
Journos and many other people in the media are Apple supporters simply because it's the platform on which they create, design and produce their content. This is mostly due to the fact that Microsoft were years behind MacOS in regards to graphic design and publication software in the 90s. Apple is still deeply encroached, despite the fact that Windows has since caught up with, and arguably overtaken, Apple's ability in that industry.
However, the other 99% of the world is very happily using Microsoft products. I don't use Office because I have to; I use it because, to me, it's a damn sight better than any comparable product. I don't use Windows 7 because I have to; I use it because, to me, it's a damn sight better than MacOS or any other flavour of Unix / Linux. And I've started using Windows Phone 7 because, to me, it's a damn sight better than WM 6.5, Apple iOS, Android, Blackberry or any of the others out there at the moment.
You really just need two things for WP7 to succeed; it needs to be good, and it needs to be relentlessly promoted.
Microsoft have relentlessly promoted terrible products in the past, and they have naturally failed (case in point: Microsoft Bob). However, they relentlessly promoted XBOX for years as well, even when in the beginning it was a less-than-strong platform. But it's just as well they did, because now it's bloody brilliant and we have new technologies like Kinect to play with.
At the end of the day, the great news here is that WP7 is actually good; and since the WP7 platform is the future home of Microsoft's silverlight technology, and a main branch of their XBOX development, you can be sure as hell they will keep promoting it until it succeeds.
twisted89 said:
I think for the sole reason of creating the hd7 and not allowing a hd2 upgrade they deserve to fail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was a pretty crappy move, but that is more of an HTC crime, not MSFT.
The new WP7 is a good platform, but only in some ways.
MS does make a 'brand-new' OS, however, since its launch, there are these 2 questions from the consumers:
1) From the current iOS and Android users: 'Its functions is almost the same, but my phone(iphone) display is much prettier and more apps, why should I change?'
2) From the current WM users: 'Geez, lots of functions that we like are now gone, no file explorer, no tethering, no mass storage mode, no copy&paste, can't remove storage-card, have to have a live-ID, etc etc.... I might as well just wait til the first update and see....'
The phone manufacturers has invested tons of money to make up phones for WM7, however, the response from the market is nothing close to expectation, if there's no breakthrough on the up coming update from MS, manufacturers like HTC and samsung might also hold on to the WM7 platform too.
To write off a product, you don't need the press, or experts, the consumer market does.
So just how is Windows Phone 7 doing, and what is next in Microsoft’s effort to get back into the phone game?
In the hot seat next at D: Dive Into Mobile is Joe Belfiore, one of the Microsoft VPs in charge of the company’s phone effort. We’ll see what he has to say on these and other topics, including a planned January update that would bring copy and paste, among other things
Transcript: http://mobilized.allthingsd.com/20101207/microsofts-joe-belfiore-talks-windows-phone-7-at-d-div/
Video: http://video.allthingsd.com/video/j...e-market/2F3322D5-0029-4F97-BAC3-BAF82BE2B9CE
Walt comes over as a bit of an iDiot in the interview..
That's not the Walt I know when he is interviewing Steve Jobs.
what a douchebag
I mean he is! Belfore was surprisingly calm he could've been eric lin in this interview
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTA3MjU0MTYw.html
Yeah, I read this over at Engadget yesterday. The Walt guy kind of being a douche. Only focusing on the negatives of WP7. Don't get me wrong, Android and iOS are farther along but you have to realize WP7 has only been out in the market for just over a month. And don't forget, WP7 went gold in September so there could easily be a major update in Feb. as that would have been 5 months post going Gold. Belfiore seemed to stay calm and answered the questions. Though I think it would have been better if he just said "Are you mad that Microsoft isn't Apple or Google?"
He was also quite disrespecting of the RIM official as well. I couldn't believe what I was reading when I found this on Engadget.
What I don't understand is why are they making a big deal out of the old kernel? I mean, MS's kernel is solid and better than any other...it just happens to be old. That just means MS was ahead of the pack that much longer.
It can hardly be better than the Linux kernel...
And while Walt is a douche, Belfiore didn't exactly do well there. Apparently Microsoft doesn't have a plan for catching up and this is the real issue here!
Belfiore essentially admitted that they would never catch up with Android, which is quite pathetic on Microsoft's part if you ask me.
tomhierl said:
Belfiore essentially admitted that they would never catch up with Android, which is quite pathetic on Microsoft's part if you ask me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you are putting words in his mouth - he said he didn't know how long it would take create that sort of volume - longer than a couple of months possibly a couple of years.
tomhierl said:
It can hardly be better than the Linux kernel...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android uses a heavily modifies kernel and there are many things nt does better than linux.
Not breaking ur software when u update it being one.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
tomhierl said:
Belfiore essentially admitted that they would never catch up with Android, which is quite pathetic on Microsoft's part if you ask me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where did he say anything like that? He said it may be year(s) before they catch up to the sales volume of android, but i'm not sure what you mean by "catch up" If you ask me, my Focus is already ahead of android in everything that matters.
I'm sort of surprised MS isn't touting some of their firsts.. first to market with a subscription music service - one that the infamous apple can't even do and no other phone can really compete against experience wise. First to market with fully integrated facebook/people hubs
BTW, the host was a complete Douche.. if he thought he was being tough, he was just coming off as stupid. He reminds me of a kid that keeps on asking "are we there yet" when they parents have already given every conceivable answer and the kid just doesn't give a rats ass anyway
tomhierl said:
It can hardly be better than the Linux kernel...
And while Walt is a douche, Belfiore didn't exactly do well there. Apparently Microsoft doesn't have a plan for catching up and this is the real issue here!
Belfiore essentially admitted that they would never catch up with Android, which is quite pathetic on Microsoft's part if you ask me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Attention Attention...possible android fanboy alert!
blahism said:
I'm sort of surprised MS isn't touting some of their firsts.. first to market with a subscription music service - one that the infamous apple can't even do and no other phone can really compete against experience wise. First to market with fully integrated facebook/people hubs
BTW, the host was a complete Douche.. if he thought he was being tough, he was just coming off as stupid. He reminds me of a kid that keeps on asking "are we there yet" when they parents have already given every conceivable answer and the kid just doesn't give a rats ass anyway
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So what I'm thinking the guy reminds me of my son when we gets on one (he is 3) and I to think MS needs to learn the skill of bragging they have had to defend themseves so much they seem to have forgot how to big up the things they have done first/best. Zune is untouchable and its about time they let people know.
Doesn't matter how rude the host was, the microsoft guy had NOTHING to new or exciting/relevant to say. From the look on his face I bet he was expecting another light interview full of fluffy and nothing of value, which is exactly what he delivered.
It's one thing to not give timeframes for when features will be released but it's worse to not even let developers know if the features are going to be added or not.
Multitasking? - maybe
Sockets? - maybe
Meanwhile I'm slowly turning my attention to other platforms that actually have working API and a much broader market including tablets.
The whole live at dive thing was full of bad hosts.
You guys have to remember its like politics. Belfiore couldn't say much, I think he did a great job. One slip up and he could have lost his job.
He couldn't say the people hub is the first of its kind, because its not.
vetvito said:
The whole live at dive thing was full of bad hosts.
You guys have to remember its like politics. Belfiore couldn't say much, I think he did a great job. One slip up and he could have lost his job.
He couldn't say the people hub is the first of its kind, because its not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
where else has a people hub been used? This isnt trying to be a back chat i am genuinely interested as i have owned a blackberry (storm) android (htc desire) symbian (n95 8gb) my family have iphones and i use them at work and my wife has had an lg cant remember what model it was though and a nokia e70. I have not seen anything on these like it are you referring to the palm pre as i have never seen this is action? But the closest i have seen is the way android pulls the data together and the use of widgets.
Yes Android. Twitter, Facebook, and others have the option of integrating with your contacts. I just hit my contacts button and bam there is everything I need social wise. All the latest updates.
Yea, People Hub isn't new. The only thing new about it is the workflow (i.e. the way it actually functions). And it had to be "new" in that regard because the WP7 UI workflow demanded it. It would be like putting new mail counts in a notification bar with the Outlook Tile right there in you face...
I agree much of that was political.
Engadget's "additions" on their site probably made it read worse than it was. We all know who they are rooting for, though.
That interview totally cracked me up! It's true Belfiore couldn't say much, and beside that it wouldn't do good to give Walt more fuel to put aflame.
I like MS's approach with the WP7 marketing, development and app screening, and even opening up nearly all their whitepapers to developers - professionals and freelance alike, as well as students. I'm not familiar with how Apple does things on the development side but it seems their holding their own in terms of quality assurance of apps, but in Android its simply a horrible experience (at least from my experience, limited as it is).
On the issue of Legacy Code, well one really shouldn't re-invent the wheel. The Apple Mobile Kernel is basically a stripped off version of the original MAC kernel with a lot of optimizations, including its modular approach. The Android kernel is basically the linux kernel with, again, optimizations and changes for mobile architecture. But Hey, who's the layman who will say that Android and iOS isn't new? I think the WP7 OS is just getting dimmed by the Windows Mobile OS.
But I had to laugh at Walt's use of "Carrier Crapplets". ) Not that I'm against them.
denizen08 said:
I like MS's approach with the WP7 marketing, development and app screening, and even opening up nearly all their whitepapers to developers - professionals and freelance alike, as well as students. I'm not familiar with how Apple does things on the development side but it seems their holding their own in terms of quality assurance of apps, but in Android its simply a horrible experience (at least from my experience, limited as it is).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been using android for about six months now and the biggest frustration for me is the endless, endless sea of crap that is the market. Some apps will be absolutely genius, work flawlessly and be well designed. Others look like they've been made by a sick monkey with a crayon. Admittedly, my experience is limited, but most of the apps I've tried (30-40+) have been in the latter category.
I'm sure if I had the time to go through every app for everything I required in the market, I could find good ones, but I don't, so I like the idea of quality control.
Who is the bearded fellow? he's a real ball buster lol
Now I know how these tend to be contentious topics but hopefully we can avoid this.
I looked (and am still looking) over the iOS 5 features and it seemed a little lackluster to me. The iCloud is nice and the Notifications is Android but welcomed none the less. Microsoft does have Skydrive but I am trying to head to head the two cloud services to see the differences.
What do you think? Was there enough innovation in iOS 5 that gave it market separation? What does Windows Phone need (besides notifications)?
Both are due in fall. I was worried iOS would do some kind of widgets with a fresh new UI but they did not which is a win for android and wp7.
Your take?
truthfully nothing to worry about...
next thing you know apple is gonna sue google for the notifications hahah
also is the icloud some type of paid dropbox?
I really haven't seen much that it's adding. Still, it will sell millions.
Shame on Engadget.com....
They turn to be more fans than Apple's fanboys.
The first 9 post now are for Apple and the WWDC 2011 event...
I dont remember last week to do the same whith microsoft WP7 Mango event.
Shame on you ...once again...i will stop reading that site
Engadget have been Apple fanboys for a while now. The Microsoft keynote that was liveblogged by them was shamefully fully of sarcasm. Biased to no ends.
iCloud is free so I am not sure how it is a paid dropbox. Unless you mean the offering of paid services from the free one.
It sounds like Skydrive to me but also integrating Apple services.
I was most afraid they would really improve the look and feel of iOS but that did not happen. It reminds me of some arguments that took place on this forum about progress. It is easier to add missing features than to innovate.
nicksti said:
Engadget have been Apple fanboys for a while now. The Microsoft keynote that was liveblogged by them was shamefully fully of sarcasm. Biased to no ends.
iCloud is free so I am not sure how it is a paid dropbox. Unless you mean the offering of paid services from the free one.
It sounds like Skydrive to me but also integrating Apple services.
I was most afraid they would really improve the look and feel of iOS but that did not happen. It reminds me of some arguments that took place on this forum about progress. It is easier to add missing features than to innovate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
And as i wrote in another thread
Apple is the trend and the fashion Company..not technology and inovation !!!
New new future presented today by Apple
1. They present today a camera button as a big news... OMG
2. They presen icloud as something new ...Guys skydrive or dropbox are on the market for some time now
3. They present today the notification system ...Woowww this is realy a breakthrough.
This is Apple guys...
Dont forget 2 years a go they told us for the fisrt time that there is something called copy paste and multitasking....
They are good ...but only on marketing and on creating trend and fashion...
While iCloud is basically SkyDrive + Mesh, it's important that it seems better implemented based on what I hear. It allows to back up your settings, ringtones etc., and it gives APIs to third party apps. These two things make it immensely more useful, IMO.
Oh, and one more thing - before iCloud, Apple actually had nothing to lock users in after they started selling DRM-free music. Now they do.
I would be a hater to say that the features presented are not useful, and/or desireable. But on a whole it lacked the wow factor.
Should this have been iOS 5? Or 4.7?
Judging by media reaction, it has enough wow factor to last three OSes for like a year or so...
vangrieg said:
Judging by media reaction, it has enough wow factor to last three OSes for like a year or so...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No surprise there, the media hates everythng Microsoft and loves everything apple so they could have showed a pile of poo and the media would still have loved it.
This is Apple guys...
Dont forget 2 years a go they told us for the fisrt time that there is something called copy paste and multitasking....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dont forget,microsoft told us about copy paste and multitasking last year and get it this year which android and iOS already had these in their OS ages ago.In this competition,it is all about speed.
Furthermore,in this year,iOS5 will provide over 1500+APIs to developers which is he same with mango update,however,when you add up the previous years APIs,it is over 5000APIs....
now,lets see how microsoft chase this trend...Of course,I'm not worry,but iOS and android always give us an option....
sylau90 said:
Dont forget,microsoft told us about copy paste and multitasking last year and get it this year which android and iOS already had these in their OS ages ago.In this competition,it is all about speed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But Microsoft did not market it like they were the first. I was actually surprised about the humility Apple showed in the conference. I did not see any blatant jabs at anyone else (save for some PC and Windows ones in the Lion like when he said lost in windows).
I came out feeling that Android and Windows Phone could gain further marketshare by Apple not doing something really different to the UI. I was hearing the widgets rumours and the orbital UI and thought they would come out with something that would put them lightyears ahead. Instead, the race is a photofinish.
Nothing to worry about? Sounds like 2007 in here. Be honest.
I'm really disappointed in iOS5 because I expected Apple to innovate and come with new features that would push the entire mobile space forward. Instead we got stuff that has already been done on the other platforms.
That said, they did manage to make the platform much more solid, taking care of many of the complaints people have against it.
sylau90 said:
Dont forget,microsoft told us about copy paste and multitasking last year and get it this year which android and iOS already had these in their OS ages ago.In this competition,it is all about speed.
Furthermore,in this year,iOS5 will provide over 1500+APIs to developers which is he same with mango update,however,when you add up the previous years APIs,it is over 5000APIs....
now,lets see how microsoft chase this trend...Of course,I'm not worry,but iOS and android always give us an option....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure, but iOS has existed for much longer than WP7. It took Apple and Android over a year to add Copy/Paste, whereas it took WP7 only a few months. iOS didn't even have MMS for the longest time, whereas it came stock in WP7. A camera button still doesn't even exist on the iPhone, users have to now use the volume key. What happens when they're listening to music and want to take a picture? Which takes precedent? Great multi-tasking for ya...Oh yeah, and they still have to fumble to their camera app to even be able to take one. The WP7 Marketplace reached 10,000 and 20,000 apps in a shorter time period than the competition.
When looking over the lifetime of all three platforms, with startup at the same point in time, WP7 is expanding much quicker than iOS and Android ever did.
I know you can say "Oh, well since these things (Copy/Paste) already existed in other platforms, WP7 should have had them from the beginning."
That's not how development works. An infant OS is born, and it is updated as it is developed.
vetvito said:
Nothing to worry about? Sounds like 2007 in here. Be honest.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They have a point
Joe Belifore hit it on the head when he mentioned a lot of the things on ios 5 is on mango or in nodo...and its not that groundbreaking...
IMHO I'm not impressed and I use apple ipad so its not blind windows fanboyism
I really wanted to be impressed and frankly I was not
I hope Microsoft also impliments a notification tray of some sort in the future. WebOS and Android got it right and Apple copied it right. I haven't seen any improvements to notification system in Mango, yet. I hope they address it in Apollo.
Other than that, I am really not surprised that Apple didn't add much to the OS. I mean, once you have a good multitasking system and a good notification system, there is nothing much left to develop for an app launcher style smartphone OS. Developers can pretty much add any features that users need/want.
Smartphone OS development/update graph is very logarithmic.. it slows down considerably after 2-3 updates. Expect the same with WP7
Expectations were high lets admit it, and a few were expecting something grand like only Apple and Jobs know how to put out.
Putting aside comments of "Android/WebOS" already had this, and the fact Apple took advantage of little things that were developed by other apps & services, at the end of the day its a good upgrade to iOS, which only brings values to us customers.
Couple of nice features (PC Free and iCloud) but I was hoping they'd let us in on the whole Nuance deal and their voice recognition, which didn't happen.
domineus said:
Joe Belifore hit it on the head when he mentioned a lot of the things on ios 5 is on mango or in nodo...and its not that groundbreaking...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe, but the important thing is that he has to resort to twitter to talk about it, and this is largely ignored by the world. So, for the general public, it won't matter whether Joe Belfiore thought ahead of Steve Jobs. And that's something Microsoft should worry about.
Me, not so much.
I was doing some reading on the CES for 2013 and this article stated that Google will rule 2013 CES. So as im reading the writer states something about Apple never attends CES and that Windows phone is TO LATE.
What exactly does the statement, "Windows Phone is to late" ?
Ive seen this statement more than just this one time and wonder why people think its to late for Windows Phone. Am I missing something. Are they saying that Windows Phone doesnt stand a chance. Or are they saying there can only be Iphone and Android being your only choose for a smartphone? What about Blackberry, symbian, webos and others. Why do they seem to try to attack Windows Phone and say they dont stand a chance. I never once heard them state this about the new Blackberry OS. Are these people scared of Windows Phone potential on the competition?
Forgive me for rambling on, but im just curious about the topic and wonder why people are taking jabs at Windows Phone.
Windows has been in this game for a long time, a lot longer than Iphone and Android, and with the revamped system I feel they have much potential, but others feel they dont. Why is that?
i'm not sure what he meant....maybe he meant "too late"?
Too
Too
Too
Too
Too
Too
937dytboi said:
I was doing some reading on the CES for 2013 and this article stated that Google will rule 2013 CES. So as im reading the writer states something about Apple never attends CES and that Windows phone is TO LATE.
What exactly does the statement, "Windows Phone is to late" ?
Ive seen this statement more than just this one time and wonder why people think its to late for Windows Phone. Am I missing something. Are they saying that Windows Phone doesnt stand a chance. Or are they saying there can only be Iphone and Android being your only choose for a smartphone? What about Blackberry, symbian, webos and others. Why do they seem to try to attack Windows Phone and say they dont stand a chance. I never once heard them state this about the new Blackberry OS. Are these people scared of Windows Phone potential on the competition?
Forgive me for rambling on, but im just curious about the topic and wonder why people are taking jabs at Windows Phone.
Windows has been in this game for a long time, a lot longer than Iphone and Android, and with the revamped system I feel they have much potential, but others feel they dont. Why is that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's the typical closed-mindedness that accompanies anything new and late to the dance. That it carries the typically loathed Microsoft label, makes it even more of a target. WP7 has a lot of work to do, but there are those of us who like the product (faults and all) and who choose to support it to help it become successful, or until it fails.
Because Windows Phone IS Microsoft, and because of that, most people see Microsoft products as fail, but that was before with Zune Players and Vista.
And now that Microsoft is stepping up again with great products and services, and receiving positive reviews, haters obviously cant give pure positive comments about it, and because they pretty much cant admit that the OS is better than the one they're praising, instead they can only hope WP to fail - which is most unlikely to happen since most popular apps are already in WP Marketplace and OEMs are considering producing a WP.
Also, what kind of tech journalist would even use the words "too late" when really you can't be "too late" in the tech industry. I think Microsoft is already "waaaaay ahead" in tech industry with their Surface project.
--------------
Not to sound like an android hater but, admit it, Microsoft is better than Google now. And the article I read about Google using Metro style on their services is bsh*t. Magazine-style? REALLY? I'd say its a cheap knock-off of Metro UI. Just because Microsoft promoted Segoe family font as a clean typography font, that doesn't mean you have to make a font (Roboto) and promote it and say "oh look its so modern and clean and pleasing to the eye" when clearly it looks a lot like Helvetica font.
That is all.
I think Microsoft is ahead, with stability and build quality being stunning on nearly every device. Sure dual core and such isn't out yet but with Android dual core is needed just to run smoothly. Take it from an ex Android Fanboy, Windows Phone 7 is not late, it's just on time.
I suspect it goes beyond that guys. I believe the too late sentiment is based on where Microsoft was before (Windows Mobile) and where Microsoft is now (Windows Phone).
Somewhere between Windows Mobile 6.5 and now we saw the emergence of iOS and Android. They have plenty to show for their efforts while Microsoft has very little. If they did something about it back then people would not say they are too late. No one really says that about Symbian.
Also, ultimately it is a prediction of demise.
I know this sounds like blind fanboyism, and maybe it is, but I honestly think if Microsoft did not go to sleep like they did they would not have come out with such a refreshing interface. It is hard to sound objective and say it was for the best because of course it was not, but with the way the landscape is going, I like where Microsoft is at (unification of platforms).
The two most picked on companies, Microsoft and T-mobile. Others can do no wrong.
Okay what i´ll say is that WP has the Prob that it is new,also a reaseon is that there is this IPhone Hype bute i think that this´ll stop the next few years,also what i think is,if i´m looking to androidbrothers there is the disadvantage that they´ve low specs compared with for eg. the Galaxy S2,eventhough i think that the Titan2,FocusS and Lumina are the right way but not right enough because they´ve no Dualcore CPU´s which is reason for which i think the most customers who want Highspec Devices choose an Android Device,also they´ve no really big new Features like 3D or so,and it seems to me like the People are saying,why to pay that amount of Money for this when i can get something really better!
And something at the end:My informatics teacher said before some weeks :"Now that Microsoft is beginning to bring the better products like Apple the people buy more Appleproducts while they´ve buyed more Microsoftproducts when Apple was much more better than Microsot",and i think that´s in some way´s sadly true
As a developer people always get hung up on worrying about waiting until the next bet. Use the current stuff and enjoy it.
937dytboi said:
I was doing some reading on the CES for 2013 and this article stated that Google will rule 2013 CES. So as im reading the writer states something about Apple never attends CES and that Windows phone is TO LATE.
What exactly does the statement, "Windows Phone is to late" ?
Ive seen this statement more than just this one time and wonder why people think its to late for Windows Phone. Am I missing something. Are they saying that Windows Phone doesnt stand a chance. Or are they saying there can only be Iphone and Android being your only choose for a smartphone? What about Blackberry, symbian, webos and others. Why do they seem to try to attack Windows Phone and say they dont stand a chance. I never once heard them state this about the new Blackberry OS. Are these people scared of Windows Phone potential on the competition?
Forgive me for rambling on, but im just curious about the topic and wonder why people are taking jabs at Windows Phone.
Windows has been in this game for a long time, a lot longer than Iphone and Android, and with the revamped system I feel they have much potential, but others feel they dont. Why is that?
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Shorter version: don't believe all the crap you're reading. Find out for yourself.
Longer version: /Rant on
The truth is, WP7 was behind the other 2 big OSes: iOS and Android. Now it's almost on par with iPhone and clearly surpasses Android. Imho, Java has its limitations (Symbian folks understood that) but I'm not criticizing it. They ARE ahead on releasing for phones and tablets and that puts them ahead. However, as I said, Android has its limitations (really, no flame intended - other OSes have theirs too) and that's why it's not really picked up yet. The main complain is that it's not easy to use, so it's definitely not for older people, girlfriends, folks who need simple and straight stuff, or your little sibling With that in mind, iPhone fills this gap and WP7 tries to go even further, by bridging that simple use with the other Windows services: XBOX/Office.
Now that the stage is accurate and complete, Android is based purely on advertising and that also shows in the quality. iPhone by comparison, is a much more mature, stable and "you" (read simple) oriented experience. WP7 tries to make it even simpler than that while integrating more into the phone.
Who is right (now)? Does it matter? We all decide where the future is, so if you like something, act on it, whatever your choice is. If you will believe other articles and make your decision based on other's experience, you'll end up regretting it, as it won't be yours. So if someone comes and tells people "X is going to be the one" they either have been an oracle (and think they still are) in their past lives or they're paid to say so
/Rant off
I believe you should never compare previous iterations of something to the current iteration. You should simply just use it, and see how useful it is in your own life. Nothing is "too late". If its usable and serves a good purpose for what it does, then it's fine.
Besides, if we were supposed to buy stuff based on marketshare, we'd all drive Toyota Corollas, use iPhones, eat McDonald's and listen to Lady GaGa.
Did MS say themselves at CES 2012 that they won't be at CES 2013?
It's never too late. Things are constantly changing. People will always be buying new phones to replace theirs. Hopefully in a few years Android is an unpleasant memory.
Sent from my SGH-I897
I think the only way one cant 'test' if it's too late or not is by doing the following:
Get a Windows Phone. Here in the UK you can return it or swap it for something else within 27 days unless you buy it one of the contracts or sales. If you get such a deal, get one. Try it for ALL 27 days. If it's not going to rock your boat, then in your opinion it is too late. It rocked my boat in just first 4 hours. In my opinion, it's bang on time into the game. It's our opinions. We spend time on this discussion board much more than what we used to back in the day during WM6 and WM6.5 in development sections. This changes nothing for Microsoft. They jumped into the market after epic failure of WM6 and WM6.5 followed by Apple and Google's success stories. Such a huge software giant won't have a board/team of members who wouldn't have thought of how late they are in the game. Why would a software company invest in a software and push marketing with it's partner as if there is no tomorrow (I think they can do much better marketing) if even one person involved thought they are 'too late' in the game.
Philosophy - https://buddhasadvice.wordpress.com/2010/04/29/a-story-or-its-never-too-late/
Music - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lL2ZwXj1tXM
Strike_Eagle said:
Did MS say themselves at CES 2012 that they won't be at CES 2013?
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They will have a presence at CES 2013 but won't have a big booth or keynote.
Microsoft, like Google, isn't really a consumer electronics company. They don't manufacture many devices, apart from Xbox. I'd expect to see plenty of Microsoft and Google products at CES 2013 from OEMs. Windows 8 will be out, so there'll probably be lots of Windows 8 devices (e.g. tablets etc) on show.
For Windows Phone, Nokia will be at CES 2013 promoting their WP8 devices. Nokia won best smartphone of CES 2012 for the Lumia 900, so obviously Windows Phone wasn't too late for CES 2012 It will be interesting to see what happens next year.
Just to keep some balance in here.
To say the Windows Phone has caught up with the iPhone is stretchier than Reed Richards of the Fantastic Four.
nicksti said:
Just to keep some balance in here.
To say the Windows Phone has caught up with the iPhone is stretchier than Reed Richards of the Fantastic Four.
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I agree... windows phone has passed the iphone on many grounds with only a single core processor
Troll squashed Nothing to see here people, now move along back on topic.
nicksti said:
Just to keep some balance in here.
To say the Windows Phone has caught up with the iPhone is stretchier than Reed Richards of the Fantastic Four.
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It blew past Android before it was launched.
Sent from my SGH-I897
No wonder people say we are fanatics. I guess they are right.
Ok so Apple is rewarded +1 billion USD from Samsung copying their patents. I have to say that some of those patens must have been approved by people who smoke crack. I hate the verdict, I hate the fact that this type of trial in US is actually decided by jury of regular people. There are just so many things I hate about the whole thing thats going on, but thats not why Im posting.
As now this whole thing probably gets deeper with appeals and most likely Google will have to get more involved. What do you think, the 2 biggest are fighting together could this actually a good thing for WP camp, especially Nokia since they are the main manufacturer in the WP camp?
Loco5150 said:
Ok so Apple is rewarded +1 billion USD from Samsung copying their patents. I have to say that some of those patens must have been approved by people who smoke crack. I hate the verdict, I hate the fact that this type of trial in US is actually decided by jury of regular people. There are just so many things I hate about the whole thing thats going on, but thats not why Im posting.
As now this whole thing probably gets deeper with appeals and most likely Google will have to get more involved. What do you think, the 2 biggest are fighting together could this actually a good thing for WP camp, especially Nokia since they are the main manufacturer in the WP camp?
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This has no benefit to WP whatsoever, 1B for samsung is like two pieces of paper, and they won't pay it, they'll appeal as usual.
So, nope Nokia and WP will need something else to shine.
apple will get, ohhhh , about what they get for 3 months worth of new activstions on iPhones. Samsung will keep on pummeling us with incredible phones.
Nokia? no benefit. unless it bumps the stock price (taking profits time) for the folks that are raping it daily.
This most likely will end with sales ban for some devices, also Apple will go after other Android manufacturers. Bloomberg also reports that Samsung will most likely have to delay some new devices so they have time to change things so they will not do the same thing again.
All this might be helping the smaller guy. But for the record I hope the appeals court will change this verdict. Also that they void Apple's ridicilous and vague patents that never should have been rewarded anyway.
Loco5150 said:
This most likely will end with sales ban for some devices, also Apple will go after other Android manufacturers. Bloomberg also reports that Samsung will most likely have to delay some new devices so they have time to change things so they will not do the same thing again.
All this might be helping the smaller guy. But for the record I hope the appeals court will change this verdict. Also that they void Apple's ridicilous and vague patents that never should have been rewarded anyway.
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but those rounded corners are apples' genius!
the whole thing is stupid anyway. if you can't win in sales, sic lawyers on the competition.
remember sco?
ohgood said:
but those rounded corners are apples' genius!
the whole thing is stupid anyway. if you can't win in sales, sic lawyers on the competition.
remember sco?
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wasnt the rectangle with rounded corners thrown out though?
as to the topic, It could be good for WP, the whole android model is starting to look a bit dodgy, potentially, manufactures might start to say its not worth the hassle and since google has made it perfectly clear they are on their own it makes for a juicy target!
MS and Apple have cross licence agreements going back decades and as such are by and large protected from this stupidity, but lets be clear on something here, its neither apple or Samsung that should be attacked because of these daft patent wars, its the people in the patent office that should be shot, if Apple are awarded a patent for a box with a button in the middle then it is perfectly within its rights to uphold that patent.
its stupid, but I don't hold the companies to blame, every single one of us would jump through hoops to make 2.7B USD regardless of how stupid it is and how marginal it is, if there was a chance we'd go for it, and its the patent office that sets up these chances.
Well it's just about some patents regarding pinch to zoom, double tap and bounce scroll. All of the other competitors were paying already for using those patented features, Samsung wasn't because it's a scumbag company which is only able to make good internals and displays slapping them into fugly plastic bodies with no personality whatsoever, and therefore keeps copying the competition to make up for the above mentioned weak points. Paying for anything doesn't appeal to them, they much prefer stealing instead. Don't get me wrong, I still think that these things should be under FRAND, but law is there to be respected or reformed, acting like it didn't exist and getting into such kind of trials just in order to spare a few bucks is just being a lame and disrespectful scumbag company. At least in this case, justice was done. Now let's reform this patent bull**** system.
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Having owned a device from every smartphone platform except BB and Android I think Android is the platform that tends to borrow the most from everyone else.
Samsung is a cloning company, they make things for people. So it should come as no surprise that they are good at lifting other peoples ideas.
What ground-breaking products has Samsung introduced to the market? by that I mean game changing devices, not technology. I bet you're struggling to think of any.
I think iOS has fallen behind the times and so my move to Windows Phone, but we all owe Apple for making multitouch and finger based touchscreen devices mainstream. It's something Samsing would never have done, their top selling phones before the iPhone were mostly dumbphones.
dazza9075 said:
wasnt the rectangle with rounded corners thrown out though?
as to the topic, It could be good for WP, the whole android model is starting to look a bit dodgy, potentially, manufactures might start to say its not worth the hassle and since google has made it perfectly clear they are on their own it makes for a juicy target!
MS and Apple have cross licence agreements going back decades and as such are by and large protected from this stupidity, but lets be clear on something here, its neither apple or Samsung that should be attacked because of these daft patent wars, its the people in the patent office that should be shot, if Apple are awarded a patent for a box with a button in the middle then it is perfectly within its rights to uphold that patent.
its stupid, but I don't hold the companies to blame, every single one of us would jump through hoops to make 2.7B USD regardless of how stupid it is and how marginal it is, if there was a chance we'd go for it, and its the patent office that sets up these chances.
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I was being silly about the round corners. the patent system is broken, but that's another story /thread.
so long as the android devices are selling better than the iPhone, I doubt manufacturers will think of it as dodgy.
manufacturers only care about selling phones... they'll do whatever is needed to keel doing that, inuding paying pennies to the apple gods to do so. passing on expenses is economics 101. (sad really)
---------- Post added at 05:37 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:31 AM ----------
gilesjuk said:
Having owned a device from every smartphone platform except BB and Android I think Android is the platform that tends to borrow the most from everyone else.
Samsung is a cloning company, they make things for people. So it should come as no surprise that they are good at lifting other peoples ideas.
What ground-breaking products has Samsung introduced to the market? by that I mean game changing devices, not technology. I bet you're struggling to think of any.
I think iOS has fallen behind the times and so my move to Windows Phone, but we all owe Apple for making multitouch and finger based touchscreen devices mainstream. It's something Samsing would never have done, their top selling phones before the iPhone were mostly dumbphones.
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its not much of a struggle to think of very good, very impressive samsung devices of late. the s3 and even s2 are selling (and reselling) like hotcakes. look at your local craigslist , the most desired phones are back and forth between ihpone 4s and s3/s2. I would expect some kind of shattering ideals cpu and display by Christmas from them also.
clones? yes, everyone is making a slab of glass phone. its what sells now. Nokia, Samsung, HTC, LG (are they still making phones) , everyone is on the slab of glass bandwagon.
ohgood said:
its not much of a struggle to think of very good, very impressive samsung devices of late. the s3 and even s2 are selling (and reselling) like hotcakes.
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Yes, but they're basically "me too" products. They've taken their existing product and added hundreds of features and bigger screen etc.
The sad thing is Apple is now stuck in this cycle of just adding a few more features, nicer screen and camera.
What I was saying was when did Samsung ever release a product that totally changed the market? It seems to me that Apple has released the devices that changed the computing industry the most. Mam, iMac, iPod and iPhone, iPad. While they may not have invented all the technology they used it still takes a lot of guts to release a different product.
The sad thing is how Microsoft laughed at the iPhone and then scrambled to release their own comparable platform (3 years later!).
I couldn't care less for Google, they're even worse than Microsoft for copying. At least when Microsoft look at a rival and release their version it is usually better in many ways, cheaper and not much less in quality. Google's stuff tends to be very low quality and poorly supported. Even devices they have had made for them were badly made (Nexus 7).
gilesjuk said:
Yes, but they're basically "me too" products. They've taken their existing product and added hundreds of features and bigger screen etc.
The sad thing is Apple is now stuck in this cycle of just adding a few more features, nicer screen and camera.
What I was saying was when did Samsung ever release a product that totally changed the market? It seems to me that Apple has released the devices that changed the computing industry the most. Mam, iMac, iPod and iPhone, iPad. While they may not have invented all the technology they used it still takes a lot of guts to release a different product.
The sad thing is how Microsoft laughed at the iPhone and then scrambled to release their own comparable platform (3 years later!).
I couldn't care less for Google, they're even worse than Microsoft for copying. At least when Microsoft look at a rival and release their version it is usually better in many ways, cheaper and not much less in quality. Google's stuff tends to be very low quality and poorly supported. Even devices they have had made for them were badly made (Nexus 7).
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ahhh, misunderstood you. I see now.
can't think of anything revolutoonary since the mouse really. voice input is neat, but the keyboard and mouse still own.
Loco5150 said:
Ok so Apple is rewarded +1 billion USD from Samsung copying their patents. I have to say that some of those patens must have been approved by people who smoke crack. I hate the verdict, I hate the fact that this type of trial in US is actually decided by jury of regular people. There are just so many things I hate about the whole thing thats going on, but thats not why Im posting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Err... This jury had people with legal knowledge and at least one engineer with a patent of their own. It was probably the most knowledgeable jury I've seen... ever.
vnvman said:
Well it's just about some patents regarding pinch to zoom, double tap and bounce scroll. All of the other competitors were paying already for using those patented features, Samsung wasn't because it's a scumbag company which is only able to make good internals and displays slapping them into fugly plastic bodies with no personality whatsoever, and therefore keeps copying the competition to make up for the above mentioned weak points.
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You said it brother.
gilesjuk said:
What ground-breaking products has Samsung introduced to the market? by that I mean game changing devices, not technology. I bet you're struggling to think of any.
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Nope. Samsung Note. At first I thought it sounded redonkulous. The build quality sucks compared to the Lumia 900 but the screen size definitely caught on with a certain segment of the population. The iphone 4s' screen is pathetic. No way around that. I'm not saying I would cruise around with a note in my pocket but it definitely explores a space. If the iphone 4s was the final word on smartphone screens we would be stuck in the stone ages. People crow about the iphone apps but I can't see those things God damn it! That screen is tiny.
sitizenx said:
Err... This jury had people with legal knowledge and at least one engineer with a patent of their own. It was probably the most knowledgeable jury I've seen... ever.
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Yup, one person that that has some knowledge on patents. Not enough in my opinion. Even if it was the "most knowledgeable jury", that does not mean that it is qualified to handle the matter.
Now why I started the whole topic. Apple has now asked sales ban for 8 Samsung devices in the US. I would expect we will see a lot more of this in the near future.
And yes Samsung keeps copying things, hell yes that happens in every business all the time. But you know what, so does Apple. They are just better at it. They basically steal because they are able to make the consumer think they actually invented these things. They did not invent mp3 player or a touch screen phone, they just copied it and made it better.
Loco5150 said:
Apple has now asked sales ban for 8 Samsung devices in the US. I would expect we will see a lot more of this in the near future.
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proof that the USA is in need of a rethink of (not just) its patent system.
they want the sales ban to get some of their sales percentage back, not because of patent infringement. its a lie covering inadequacies. pitiful.
The law ask "are the products similar "? Thats all it ask, and the obvious answer is...
Everybody said it before the original Galaxy S was released,"boy that thing looks a lot like the iPhone". Every reviewer, just YouTube it. The icons and bounce scroll sealed it.
Dont hate the player(Apple), hate the game(patent system).
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
So here we go... Now Apple is seeking sales ban for new Samsung devices, inluding Galaxy S III and Galaxy Note.