I can still sidle load and my phone is still interop unlocked but neither my registry editor nor my advanced configuration editor work. Way to go HTC and MS, pat your selves on the back. I pay $99 dollars a year to have my phone unlocked and to develop apps but I can't even develop useful apps because APIs and restrictions, I can't customize my phone with out hacks, nothing! And to top it all off the phone has very limited functionality. What is MS thinking? I'm seriously thinking about jumping ship after being a loyal Windows Mobile supporter from the very begging. It use to make me sick to think about how flooded the market is with Android phones and now I know why. I can't even come on here and vent my frustrations or voice my opinions without someone getting offended or warned like I'm some child. Granted that all phones have their fails but not as many as this phone, I wish Windows Mobile was still around, imagine a world with no having to have an Windows live account or no complicated Zune, imagine just being able to do what you want or need to do without any limitations or restrictions. Imagine being able to laugh at Android and iPhone users. I honestly don't see Windows Phone 8 being any better at all. Say what you want, lash out at me with your fan boy comments, report me to your MOD but no matter what you say or do at this rate WP will fail.
what is the radio driver version , is it 5.71??
well u cant blame anyone, WP7 is more secure than IOS.
thats a good thing right?
The purpose of paying $99 per year is to develop applications and publish them to the app store.
Being able to sideload for anything other than testing was just a side benefit.
If all you wanted was to side load apps, the ChevRon utility would have been a much better deal. One time fee verses yearly and 10% the cost.
Surprised that the radio drivers are to blame. Unless there was a flaw in them that was being exploited to make the editor.
It is pretty annoying that you can't directly programatically alter the registry.
But, I believe the provisioning methods still work. Just write a C# app that will provision a file. Then have the app generate an xml provisioning string to alter the registry and apply it.
There are ways to read the registry doing the same thing.
I can probably find a link in the Windows Phone 7 development section on how to do this.
I will update with a link if I find something.
Link for an HTC ProvXML importer and Reg to Prov XML convertor: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=907169&highlight=registry
Try searching that forum for ProvXML. There probably are examples. Serach is temporarily disabled. It always around this time of day for about 20 to 30 minutes.
I was afraid of this. The HTC driver updates may have been to v2 and that breaks the interop-unlock ability (such as allowing ACT and Reg Editors to run). This is known and mentioned by Heathcliff.
Magpir said:
what is the radio driver version , is it 5.71??
well u cant blame anyone, WP7 is more secure than IOS.
thats a good thing right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They just fixed an exploit.
Of course it's good to have your own device unlocked, but if Microsoft or HTC wanted you to modify the registry they would have released that feature natively.
For example LG has a native application to do this on their Windows Phones.
I interop unlocked my girlfriend's Optimus 7 the next day she got it in 1-2 mins.
what has the radio got to do with this?
will downgrading radio help then?
I know, it's my fault for being stupid and accepting the update, it's a little faster but I noticed it drains my battery much quicker and it disabled my reg exploits. to be honest I thought it was the keyboard fix but the keyboard seems to be getting worse. Microsoft is not what it use to be, Steve Jobs was right, MS is not original and always steal Apples ideas, why if the thing that made WM better is what is diving Androids success. I went to the T-Mobile store and was tempted to switch but walked out and have not decided yet but I just give up on WP this year if MS doesn't stop being so Communist like.
JVH3 said:
The purpose of paying $99 per year is to develop applications and publish them to the app store.
Being able to sideload for anything other than testing was just a side benefit.
If all you wanted was to side load apps, the ChevRon utility would have been a much better deal. One time fee verses yearly and 10% the cost.
Surprised that the radio drivers are to blame. Unless there was a flaw in them that was being exploited to make the editor.
It is pretty annoying that you can't directly programatically alter the registry.
But, I believe the provisioning methods still work. Just write a C# app that will provision a file. Then have the app generate an xml provisioning string to alter the registry and apply it.
There are ways to read the registry doing the same thing.
I can probably find a link in the Windows Phone 7 development section on how to do this.
I will update with a link if I find something.
Link for an HTC ProvXML importer and Reg to Prov XML convertor: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=907169&highlight=registry
Try searching that forum for ProvXML. There probably are examples. Serach is temporarily disabled. It always around this time of day for about 20 to 30 minutes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately I don't know how to work with ProvXML's. I will check out your link, thanks. do you by any chance know how to change the dark background color back to black using this method?
So you mean to tell me that Windows Phone is actually more secure than the iPhone? God all mighty!! I seriously hope Windows 8 is not as lame as Windows Phone.
sinister1 said:
Unfortunately I don't know how to work with ProvXML's. I will check out your link, thanks. do you by any chance know how to change the dark background color back to black using this method?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just read the thread you sent me and it says that the new drivers also disable this method too.
To the OP, they also fixed a problem, If you ran connection setup with your phone in CDMA mode, it would kill 3G and the only real way to get it back was to hard reset the phone. It also broke those apps too.
To note, I manually installed 8107(last weekend, 3 days before vzw's release) and it did break Advanced Config (could not add more colors but, only had 3-4 extra onces) but, I am still able to sideload as I need. So, I'm not sure if it was the firmware that broke it...
I don't know what the big deal is with MS not letting us to simply personalize our phones? I mean really what is wrong with changing a notification tone, background color or tile color? If they really don't want anyone hacking the phone then simply give us those options. In every update instead of giving us simple features and options that we want all they do is secure the damn phone down even more It's almost like Microsoft wants to fail. Who wants to pay for a phone that is dictated to the point to where you can't even do that? As much as I hate to admit it; Android is coming up more and more when I think about my options.
sinister1 said:
I don't know what the big deal is with MS not letting us to simply personalize our phones? I mean really what is wrong with changing a notification tone, background color or tile color? If they really don't want anyone hacking the phone then simply give us those options. In every update instead of giving us simple features and options that we want all they do is secure the damn phone down even more It's almost like Microsoft wants to fail. Who wants to pay for a phone that is dictated to the point to where you can't even do that? As much as I hate to admit it; Android is coming up more and more when I think about my options.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess it really comes down to what you can do. Opening up the phone, opens it to hack software to run. So, it opens a world of phones with pirated software on it with nothing MS can do it about it. Not everyone will go this route but, there are people who will not buy anything, and that kills the marketplace and vendors who will add to the marketplace.
As I always say, Pirates will always Pirate, block them and they'll find another way around it. BUT with blocking it makes honest people have a harder time to use their devices or software.
I personally just want to customize my phone and use all the home brew apps but, sad to say they will try to block the honest people just to attempt to stop the pirates...
Back to the subject on hand...
So, Connection setup no longer works (I get a Invalid sim if I go to GSM mode or in CDMA mode, Carrer is not in the database), is it possable to get a older version to sideload that would enable registry edits again ?
DavidinCT said:
I guess it really comes down to what you can do. Opening up the phone, opens it to hack software to run. So, it opens a world of phones with pirated software on it with nothing MS can do it about it. Not everyone will go this route but, there are people who will not buy anything, and that kills the marketplace and vendors who will add to the marketplace.
As I always say, Pirates will always Pirate, block them and they'll find another way around it. BUT with blocking it makes honest people have a harder time to use their devices or software.
I personally just want to customize my phone and use all the home brew apps but, sad to say they will try to block the honest people just to attempt to stop the pirates...
Back to the subject on hand...
So, Connection setup no longer works (I get a Invalid sim if I go to GSM mode or in CDMA mode, Carrer is not in the database), is it possable to get a older version to sideload that would enable registry edits again ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had that problem before, I had to toggle airplane mode and WIFI back and forth until it took.
DavidinCT said:
I guess it really comes down to what you can do. Opening up the phone, opens it to hack software to run. So, it opens a world of phones with pirated software on it with nothing MS can do it about it. Not everyone will go this route but, there are people who will not buy anything, and that kills the marketplace and vendors who will add to the marketplace.
As I always say, Pirates will always Pirate, block them and they'll find another way around it. BUT with blocking it makes honest people have a harder time to use their devices or software.
I personally just want to customize my phone and use all the home brew apps but, sad to say they will try to block the honest people just to attempt to stop the pirates...
Back to the subject on hand...
So, Connection setup no longer works (I get a Invalid sim if I go to GSM mode or in CDMA mode, Carrer is not in the database), is it possable to get a older version to sideload that would enable registry edits again ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The registry being locked down is less to do with piracy than control.
Code for the Windows Phone 7 was not a complete rewrite of the OS. They did reuse much of the old Windows Phone 6.5. They might have reviewed each piece and modified most, but they did reuse code. If they give you or developers control of the registry, then the entire device could be put into a state that would make nothing work. Or worse, your phone could be made to do just about anything in the background without your knowledge.
It's one thing to not allow programmers to access it. It's another to stop users from doing it intentionally. Any user doing it themself, knows the risks. And you can always reset the phone.
This latest lockdown might spur more interest in creating custom ROMs. Not sure if it is even possible yet for things like the Titan 2 and the new Nokia phones. But, this is the site to find out or find people doing it.
Your right I don't think it's possible at least not for the Trophy or CDMA phones at the moment, I guess we are just stuck at the state of sucks. Either way MS isn't making any money with their strategy at all the hold like 1% of the market; if it weren't for their PC sales they would have already went under.
sinister1 said:
Your right I don't think it's possible at least not for the Trophy or CDMA phones at the moment, I guess we are just stuck at the state of sucks. Either way MS isn't making any money with their strategy at all the hold like 1% of the market; if it weren't for their PC sales they would have already went under.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft has alot more products as well. SQL Server, Visual Studio (professionals don't use the express versions), Exchange Server, Office, XBox 360, msdn subscriptions, Skype, etc.
Microsoft makes money on all HTC and Samsung Android sales. Somewhere between $10 to $15 for each Samsung Android Phone and somewhere around $5 to $10 for HTC Android phone from patent licensing.
So, every Android sold helps Microsoft. Hopefully they use those dollars to improve Windows Phone 7.
This is actually the real reason that Microsoft can afford to deliver things a little late and still be OK.
They have a ton of cash flowing in all the time and the competition financially supports them.
I'm guessing that there is still a way using provisioning to affect the registry. When exchange servers push policies down, I thought they did that through provisioning. If exchange can do this, then there should be another way as well.
It's also how custom ringtones were created prior to Mango. It would create a xap to create a program that would write a ringtone file using provisioning. Something similar should be doable for the registry. Doing it this way would require you to use a computer to deploy the changes, but you should be able to make them.
Thaks guys for your feed back and support. If anyone knows a way that I can change my background back to default #FF00000 black now that the registry option is gone; please let me know, I will dontae becuse I have lookd at some Android phones and to be honest they are always pluged in and charging and the only other opption is the iPhone
Hmm.. was about to update and then cancelled it when I read this. Does it add tethering? but since it still lets us sideload... I kind of want to update, I don't do any registry stuff and i can always hard reset to interop unlock again right?
slick13 said:
Hmm.. was about to update and then cancelled it when I read this. Does it add tethering? but since it still lets us sideload... I kind of want to update, I don't do any registry stuff and i can always hard reset to interop unlock again right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it actually does nothing other that updates your radio's firmware and blocks exploits, worth less update unless you travel out of the country. This was lame on HTC and Verizon's part. I hate Verizon, MS should just stop doing business with them.
Related
I would like to know if there's gonna be an application HUB in the new Windows Phone 7 Series??
Would be nice to have a hub where you can add your favorite 3rd party applications like:
- Location/Navigation software (Google Maps, TomTom, iGO, CoPilot etc.)
- Browser software (Opera, Skyfire etc.)
- Games
- Multimedia software (CorePlayer, TCPMP etc.)
Sorted by example on Category or Most used.
Would be nice, usefull and marketable.
I don't get why Microsoft would introduce an "Application Hub" when the point of Hubs was to get rid of the "applications".
Games would be in the games hub, multimedia would be in the multimedia hub. There's an applications list in alphabetical order on the start page if the right arrow is pressed...
according to http://www.modaco.com/ there's a marketplace hub. does this mean this is the only entry point to install applications? Makes me get panic attacks!
I guess that there'd be another way to install applications, unless they want to have corporate users stay with WinMo 6.5.* for the future, as when a company wants to have a mobile app tied to there custom company software for in house use, they for sure wouldn't want it to take the way over the Marketplace.
As for having the most used applications easily available: you could just pin them to the Startscreen a.k.a. Live-Tiles. You can pin single contacts, single albums, single songs there and I believe somebody already said, that u could pin programs from the App-List to the right too. Depends on the application how it then uses the Live Tile (to display highscore, in-game scenes or what not).
StevieBallz said:
I guess that there'd be another way to install applications, unless they want to have corporate users stay with WinMo 6.5.* for the future, as when a company wants to have a mobile app tied to there custom company software for in house use, they for sure wouldn't want it to take the way over the Marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is a good point. I hope you are right. Not being able to run whatever program I want to is a big deal breaker for me. If this were the case I would go Android unless WP7 gets jailbroken (I feel so sad using this term for WM/WP; it is so open right now. Why restrict it in such ways?).
the reason that they are restricting the apps, is to make the system more stable. They want the experience to be amazing on every phone, eg making the hardware requirements so strict. They want to be able to evaluate what an app does to the system before it is released. They are making the submission parameters easier to comply with, so it will be easy to put your work on marketplace. They new marketplace specs for 6.5 will give developers the ability to make links straight to the app on the marketplace.
Initially I was starting to kinda freak out, but I think this is for the best. It will force people to use the marketplace, and since it won't support old apps, it will move all the applications for windows mobile to one spot, it is just one more way they are trying to compete with apple.
And on a side note, I'm not actually sure that winpho7 has a file explorer... Nothing in the demo gave me reason to think that one would be there. I think they are trying to replace explorer with the hubs.
If you swipe left on the start page, you get a list of all your applications.
I don't think there's a seperate, categorised hub.
I believe you can also add shortcut tiles on the start page, but that's all I know.
(And yeah, I too would like to find out whether WP7 has a file explorer...)
webpatrick said:
I would like to know if there's gonna be an application HUB in the new Windows Phone 7 Series??
Would be nice to have a hub where you can add your favorite 3rd party applications like:
- Location/Navigation software (Google Maps, TomTom, iGO, CoPilot etc.)
- Browser software (Opera, Skyfire etc.)
- Games
- Multimedia software (CorePlayer, TCPMP etc.)
Sorted by example on Category or Most used.
Would be nice, usefull and marketable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't mean to be rude but this doesn't make any sense.
Add your favorite applications to your Start Screen. All the rest are in a list when you swipe to the right.
Apps that fit a certain category would go in that category's hub. Why would you have Games in an Application hub and then have a Games hub? Remember under the Music&Video hub there was Pandora (right now they have it under a list of apps under the hub).. that's your Multimedia software.
I do agree that additional hubs would make sense.. we don't only care about people and pictures etc. but also things like RSS news updates, or like you said, location and navigation. An Internet hub would be a good place for Favorites/Bookmarks, History (shared across every installed browser), RSS, IE8 Web Slices, website notifications (not every update on Twitter and Facebook is by an actual person/contact), etc. If you give the same treatment to Location/Mapping, then suddenly you don't have the standalone apps of IE and Bing sticking out in the hub-centric experience.
but a bunch of shortcuts to different programs doesn't make sense as a hub, just pin them to Start.
reformedctrlz said:
the reason that they are restricting the apps, is to make the system more stable. They want the experience to be amazing on every phone, eg making the hardware requirements so strict. They want to be able to evaluate what an app does to the system before it is released. They are making the submission parameters easier to comply with, so it will be easy to put your work on marketplace. They new marketplace specs for 6.5 will give developers the ability to make links straight to the app on the marketplace.
Initially I was starting to kinda freak out, but I think this is for the best. It will force people to use the marketplace, and since it won't support old apps, it will move all the applications for windows mobile to one spot, it is just one more way they are trying to compete with apple.
And on a side note, I'm not actually sure that winpho7 has a file explorer... Nothing in the demo gave me reason to think that one would be there. I think they are trying to replace explorer with the hubs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is that you have to pay $100 for your spot at the marketplace table. Even if your app is free. Simply not fair. No more xda members coding up their own programs and releasing free.
And hubs is not a file explorer. I dont want a device that thinks it knows what I want to do with my files. If I want something that restricts where I get apps and what files I am allowed to store on my device I will get an iphone.
The only thing wp7 might have over iphone os (besides interface; I do think wp7 has a very cool and original ui; that is a matter of opinion though) is multitasking. While details are slim and it sounds like multitasking capability will be very restricted, it sounds like background processing will be available to third party apps at least in some form. Thats more than iphones can say.
Unfortunately I think its android time for me. But I'm not sad about it. Ive started really looking into it and it seems pretty cool. It has full multitasking now and the latest phones are sporting some awesome hardware. I will probably get my first android phone over the summer and i'm excited.
I'm not waiting nearly another year to get hands on an actual wp7 device. Maybe when more details come out it won't be so bad but I doubt it and I'm not waiting to find out. The direction of Microsoft is back in time toward more restriction and control of the product. It's time I jump ship to an open source OS. Sad because I love MS desktop products. My computing world is a constant battle between google and MS. I use windows 7, outlook, exchange, windows mobile office ect. But I choose google over ie, google over bing, and soon android over wm. Will be interesting to see how well this combination will play together.
I don't think installing Cab files will change all too much..I believe it will be much like it is today except we aren't putting the cart before the horse this time. I mean Marketplace just launched months ago even though WinMo has been around for over a decade...its hard to have an effective marketplace when people who want apps know the better places to find them. This time around the app store will launch with the OS so i think it puts more emphasis on the App store (to the average consumer) as well as being better integrated into the phone...but who's/what's stopping us from just downloading Apps the same as usual? Microsoft has mentioned that Activesync will still work with WP7 (Zune will be just for music, pictures, movies) so why is it all of a sudden impossible just to do what we've been doing for years?
It seems odd the exodus that seems to be happening lately. Its like you guys were perfectly happy with with Windows the way it is now?!?! If you are then stay with it the way it is now..lol. I personally can't wait to the what the guys here are gonna come up with for HUB's...hell I can't wait for HTC to put their special touch on WP7..I can imagine the HUB put together in a TF3D fashion...with their own additions of Weather (with that gorgeous UI) stocks...etc. I'm not gonna lie...the possibilities are as endless in the future as they are with the current OS. I think it will be fun to see in about a year, how many of you guys who are riding the fence or doubting the upcoming release will change your minds.
I once had to drag my best friend on a double date....he didn't want to go, he complained the whole way there...saw the girl, and did everything he could to make an excuse to get out of there (she wasn't his type)...now they're married, crazy things happen when you give something a chance. I've waited 2+ years for this and won't back out now just because I see something I don't know the answer to...once I get the OS in hand I will make my decision. I think thats the most logical way
~style~
style1 said:
I don't think installing Cab files will change all too much..I believe it will be much like it is today except we aren't putting the cart before the horse this time. I mean Marketplace just launched months ago even though WinMo has been around for over a decade...its hard to have an effective marketplace when people who want apps know the better places to find them. This time around the app store will launch with the OS so i think it puts more emphasis on the App store (to the average consumer) as well as being better integrated into the phone...but who's/what's stopping us from just downloading Apps the same as usual? Microsoft has mentioned that Activesync will still work with WP7 (Zune will be just for music, pictures, movies) so why is it all of a sudden impossible just to do what we've been doing for years?
It seems odd the exodus that seems to be happening lately. Its like you guys were perfectly happy with with Windows the way it is now?!?! If you are then stay with it the way it is now..lol. I personally can't wait to the what the guys here are gonna come up with for HUB's...hell I can't wait for HTC to put their special touch on WP7..I can imagine the HUB put together in a TF3D fashion...with their own additions of Weather (with that gorgeous UI) stocks...etc. I'm not gonna lie...the possibilities are as endless in the future as they are with the current OS. I think it will be fun to see in about a year, how many of you guys who are riding the fence or doubting the upcoming release will change your minds.
I once had to drag my best friend on a double date....he didn't want to go, he complained the whole way there...saw the girl, and did everything he could to make an excuse to get out of there (she wasn't his type)...now they're married, crazy things happen when you give something a chance. I've waited 2+ years for this and won't back out now just because I see something I don't know the answer to...once I get the OS in hand I will make my decision. I think thats the most logical way
~style~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you have misunderstood the announcements. Activesync (as in sync with PC) will NOT be available. It also seems that there is no way to access the file system on the device. The only way to install apps is through the marketplace. They are removing the ability to just install a cab as we have always done. That is the problem. I am not saying I won't give it a chance. These points may turn out to be wrong. All I am saying is that current info suggests that this is the case and if so WP7 is not for me. Of course I am not going to pass final judgement until it is released. But since all indicators point to the negative I am not going to wait to find out for sure when there are tempting alternatives. And no I am not satisfied with WM as it currently is. The problem is that WP7 fixed what was wrong with WM6 and at the same time trashed everything that was good about WM6 (once again, nothing is for certain but this is what evidence points to).
ok even if it's like that it's microsoft.
Even iphone has jailbreak. In our case we will not have to worry for warranty.
The so called no oem sw will return as bumerang on them.
This is the most hardcore forum on pda's and every one says bhaaaa on MS.
When they did their survey they mast asked only iphone and simple phone users, sertainly not wm users. )
wm7 = no native API call, stop running of background program and many other controls
let say good bye appl like WKTASK, CPUMonitorMini and many others
we have to wait for official comments next month. however why switch to Android? The native API of WM 6.5.x will not expire on our devices. With it we can do whatever we want.
...
I can't see me now buying a wm7 device in the future and I defenitly switch to android if wm isn't supporting multitasking anymore.
The fact alone that wm7 won't be backward compatible let's me thing about switching.
Thats all really sad because my omnia 2 is actually my first smartphone and I'm very pleased with it, basically because it uses a desktop like os.
drandazzo said:
will the current WM6/6.5 applications work on WM7.. eg. TomTom?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. No piece of WM6 software will work on WP7. Some pieces may be easier for the developers to convert to WP7 than others, but all will require code-level conversion and recompilation of some sort.
Personally I hope 6.5 apps DON'T work on WP7, it'll make developers lazy and not bother re-writing their apps for WP7.
We need a clean break and that means no backwards compatibility. I want all my WP7 apps to have the jazzy new UI, full touch control and full integration with the hubs.
I don't mind paying the devs some more cash for a WP7 version of their apps, and I'm sure they won't mind taking that money off me!
Jim Coleman said:
Personally I hope 6.5 apps DON'T work on WP7, it'll make developers lazy and not bother re-writing their apps for WP7.
We need a clean break and that means no backwards compatibility. I want all my WP7 apps to have the jazzy new UI, full touch control and full integration with the hubs.
I don't mind paying the devs some more cash for a WP7 version of their apps, and I'm sure they won't mind taking that money off me!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah when wp7 comes out thats when ill start buying my apps
Jim Coleman said:
Personally I hope 6.5 apps DON'T work on WP7, it'll make developers lazy and not bother re-writing their apps for WP7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The majority of the apps I use right now have already a kool looking ui (a lot of freeware is skinable anyway) and are fingerfriendly. And this includes stuff that is no longer in development and won't get updated.
If a developer refuses to update its app than there is a opportunity for someone else the be successful with a better product.
So why can't ms just let the market decide who got the best ui or functionality?
And for hubs, I don't really care for the new ui and would continue to use mobile shell (if still possible).
Shasarak said:
No. No piece of WM6 software will work on WP7. Some pieces may be easier for the developers to convert to WP7 than others, but all will require code-level conversion and recompilation of some sort.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont see why tomtom or things like igo wouldnt work.
Microsoft said that backward compatiblilty will be difficult because of making it fit in with the OS, but if its full screen it doesnt need to fit in with any part of the os.
TheGoD said:
I ... would continue to use mobile shell (if still possible).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it won't be possible.
loomx said:
I dont see why tomtom or things like igo wouldnt work.
Microsoft said that backward compatiblilty will be difficult because of making it fit in with the OS, but if its full screen it doesnt need to fit in with any part of the os.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah but you're missing the point. Tomtom, if written correctly within the new Silverlight framework doodad, will be largely subsumed into the Hubs interface - it'll provide new menu options in People, for instance, to navigate to their home or work address. In Calendar it'll do the same for the location of an event. Etc. Perhaps it'll calculate the route in background and then add it to a route list somewhere else on the phone, who knows. But it'll only go full screen with the 3D view etc when you're actually navigating. The rest of the UI will be done via the hubs.
Jim Coleman said:
Ah but you're missing the point. Tomtom, if written correctly within the new Silverlight framework doodad, will be largely subsumed into the Hubs interface - it'll provide new menu options in People, for instance, to navigate to their home or work address. In Calendar it'll do the same for the location of an event. Etc. Perhaps it'll calculate the route in background and then add it to a route list somewhere else on the phone, who knows. But it'll only go full screen with the 3D view etc when you're actually navigating. The rest of the UI will be done via the hubs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jim doesn't that sound ****ing awesome!?
in my opinion
winmo will be the best or the last
they have only one chance to make it the best mobile os or it will failed completly and all of us will move to android\iphone os
matckal said:
winmo will be the best or the last
they have only one chance to make it the best mobile os or it will failed completly and all of us will move to android\iphone os
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends on what WP7 really will be in the end, I'll switch to it, or just keep my old one. No intentions to switch to anything else, so please don't make such weird assumptions! WM 6.5.x will still be supported for a while by MS, and will be even longer on this board, so I see no reason to jump at the next opportunity because it's now suddenly hip or what?
Im done with Wm for Now...
Im done had all can take my HD2 is up for sale just picked up my Nexus one and its overclocked to 1.3ghz So fast microsoft im done....
Android is the new WinMo.
Except crappier. The slowdowns on the Qualcomm 72** series on the Android is more profound than on Win Mo. Thats how it felt to me.
I've messed around with android and it just doesn't seem that appealing to me honestly. Even though they may be locking down the WP7 UI. I love the integration it's going to have with Xbox Live and Zune. Not to mention the menu systems look very slick to me. I'll be sticking with Microsoft and I guess we will just have to wait for a crack to install our own apps if that's how it's going to go down.
after the recent Apple vs. HTC patent issues I would no longer talk so easy about bright future of Android. We never know what happens.
RAMMANN said:
after the recent Apple vs. HTC patent issues I would no longer talk so easy about bright future of Android. We never know what happens.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was going to say the same thing.
Android might have to get a complete faceleft and lose A LOT of functionality.
**** apple...
RAMMANN said:
after the recent Apple vs. HTC patent issues I would no longer talk so easy about bright future of Android. We never know what happens.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, the future of Android has never been clear really. Not because the OS is bad or anything, but simply because Google doesn't really need it. That is, it's nice to have but it's not a life or death situation for them in this business. It's one of examples of their "let's throw all kinds of cool **** around and see later where it sticks" strategy. They pursue things that go easily and just as well abandon things that aren't going smooth - they just don't know where the money will come from, and don't mind that. Heck they didn't even know how to make money from their search business until they stole the context ad idea after unsuccessful attempts to buy it. But make no mistake - they are in business for the money. It doesn't mean they'll necessarily dump it, but it is an unclear and intransparent game.
So if I were an OEM I'd think a dozen times before really betting on Android, with or without the lawsuit. It's fine to use the opportunities it provides in the short run, but long term commitments? Nah.
Hello.
Few years ago, there were hundreds of different OS for mobile phones, everyone with its pros and cons.
But with these phones, we only could send/recieve calls and sms, take photos and crappy videos and store some music.
every phone had its own file extensions and file compatibilities, only java was able to unify some programms.
The browser were also unusable, despite the small screens, and high costs of internet, there was no compatibility with activex and some frameworks.
I can remember, I had a Samsung sghP910 with 320x240 screen and Nvidia chipset, enough to do many things, but completely disabled by the bad Samsung OS.
Later there was the unification of mobile phones with PDA with Windows Mobile.
I think this was the biggest step in history for mobile phones.
I bought the HTC Touch 3G WM6.1, and I could virtually do anything I could do on my computer. Download programs, remotely connect with my office PC, and surf the internet without any compatibility issues.
for any problem or need, ther was a program on the internet to download!
The only big issue, was the small resolution display 320x240, that complicated my life a little bit.
Now i was searching for something newer, that could totally replace my netbook, I was thinking about some HTC with this brand new WP7 but today I tried out the new HTC trophy of my girlfriend, and was really disappointed!!!!
I mean, very high resolution that could finally activate some remote desktop function, fast processor and relative lightweight.
I saw that junk OS of Iphone, made for rich and useless people, the nokia junk Symbian that I'm actually using for work, and that new IPhone-like Android, that is here today, but maybe not tomorrow.
Blackberry is another useless junk, my sister got it.
I'm searching for some desktop remplacement handheld, but the new WP7 is back to this kind of Multimedia useless stuff, no SD support for upgrade, and this whole windows, that only makes you take more time to find the right application (like the start in WM6.5)
I saw that instead to make a step forward, Microsoft mad a big big step backward!!!!
I'm asking myself why, because handheld should be every-time more like Desktops, but like this, you're bound to stupid aplications, and you have to pay for it.
No file-manager, no desktop, no start button and no task manager, nothing!!
Someone can tell me if there is a possibility that with some tweaks, it would be posible to go back to real Windows Mobile???
If you want all that, buy yourself a HD2 and run WM or Android. Has RDP, file-managers galore, task managers, useless SD support and those all important crashes and slow-downs all the time.
While I agree, the lack of RDP on WP7 is disheartening, judging from the number of quasi-remote-desktop apps available there is actually a real want for this. So I have no doubt it will become available sooner rather than later.
Yes it would be possble, go to your nearest provider and purchase a 6.5 enabled device.
A mobile OS should absolutely not evolve to look and act like a desktop OS. That's what windows mobile was. And it was awful. A mobile OS should be really what wp7 and iOS is; quick, easy to use, and accelerate what you're doing, not hinder it.
XxAndrexX said:
No file-manager, no desktop, no start button and no task manager, nothing!!
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Click to collapse
Yeah see this is exactly the reason I switched to wp7. I was so sick of tweaking and managing. and tweaking. The endless tweaking and managing. My mobile device should not give me a headache whenever I use it and watch it lumber through its operations. Wp7 has no task manger to keep an eye on, no tweaks needed, no file manager to navigate (what do you need one for... seriously), and it's awesome. Seemless and quick. And what's the purpose of the start button? Why do you want one? What do you want it to navigate you to?
I'm really having a hard time understanding why so many people don't research what wp7 is before getting it. It is not windows mobile. Those days are gone. A mobile OS should be what iOS and wp7 is, quick and painless. Let me do whatever I want without having to worry about an app now running in the background or what my memory is at.
Why not just get an HD2 or similar that is designed to run "real" Windows Mobile and not buy an OS that obviously does not suit your needs?
I ave had several wm phones and was a fan, however, windows mobile as it was nearly finished off microsoft in the mobile Market, wp7 may save them
Right now there is nothing more to do for me than wait for an upgrade and see how MS will act. WP7 is a great foundation.
But yes, smartphones - opposed to dumphones - should replicate most of PC abilities.
They should not act like racing horse with 3 legs - and this is what WP7 is right now.
I am able to compromise my needs to wait now. I can't wait however for very long, year is too much, to get features instead of their basic forms like maps, word etc.
So for me, if MS will not make it soon and accelerate development, bring the features an make it capable, I am off to Android.
But now I wait, I want to see MS cards open.
doministry said:
I am able to compromise my needs to wait now. I can't wait however for very long, year is too much, to get features instead of their basic forms like maps, word etc.
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Click to collapse
Which features are you after exactly?
I think you get me wrong. I mean, its very good that everything is getting "easier", more beautiful and so on, but normally they should add tools, without quitting the old good ones.
with my touch 3g, 6.1 i have to use the pen to go through the menus, its complicated, but i know where to find my applications, and configurations, like windows.
But the worst thing, i heard that's a whole new OS and no longer compatible with cab files.
that means, if i want some new programs, maybe i've got to pay for them, and the old ones are lost.
am I right???
XxAndrexX said:
I think you get me wrong. I mean, its very good that everything is getting "easier", more beautiful and so on, but normally they should add tools, without quitting the old good ones.
with my touch 3g, 6.1 i have to use the pen to go through the menus, its complicated, but i know where to find my applications, and configurations, like windows.
But the worst thing, i heard that's a whole new OS and no longer compatible with cab files.
that means, if i want some new programs, maybe i've got to pay for them, and the old ones are lost.
am I right???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. WP7 is made "from scratch" so no, no .cab files.
Everything has to be purchased from Marketplace.
emigrating said:
Which features are you after exactly?
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Click to collapse
Which? Well: marketplace support for all users, bing maps supporting all countries at least in Europe, PC Usb transfer of all documents, multitasking, video send by email, word at least on the level of docs to go featurewise, greater openeness for developers, and some other stuff.
doministry said:
Yes. WP7 is made "from scratch" so no, no .cab files.
Everything has to be purchased from Marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
aha...
And you like this new feature?
Instead of downloading third-party freeware???
what does it means made from scratch?
XxAndrexX said:
aha...
And you like this new feature?
Instead of downloading third-party freeware???
what does it means made from scratch?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To be honest the app distribution is not a problem for me right now.
From scratch = from the beginning. Not based on WM6.5.
doministry said:
To be honest the app distribution is not a problem for me right now.
From scratch = from the beginning. Not based on WM6.5.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmmm maybe i'll wait until they'll put Intel Atom instead of Arm, and run normal Window 7, because even if I buy somenthing like HD2, it will be sooner or later discontinued damn
WP7 is super system, till you use it as M$ engineers thought you would be.
I mean there's plenty things missing. Many people will say, who needs tethering, for example. And those many will be satisfied with other advantages of WP7. But me, who need tethering all the time, I'm stuck. I'm really keen on WP7, it's speed, live sync, zune sync,... but who will tell me when tethering will be possible. I didn't even consider such phone systen doesn't have tethering.
Now I spent whole week hacking the HD7 phone with Chevron unlocker and DFRouter xap. As I'm reading the thread about tethering I must be lucky that I didn't mess it all up cause some can't connect to zune after that.
So, as sbdy said, if you use your phone for most phone obvious things, than WP7 is really great. But if you need a bit more, than you're stuck. So I'm probably selling my HD7 and waiting for Nokia MeeGo device. There I think I can expect more as computer device and a bunch of things WP7 doesn't have: tethering(USB and WiFi), FM transmitter, open platform, video calling. That is what I can think of what matters to me.
About 2 weeks ago, I took johnkussack's advice (I think it was him) and went to LinkedIn to try t be friends with anyone who came up on the search for "kin phone". In the invite email, I just said that I noticed they worked on the Kin phones and would like to ask them a few questions on how one could write to the phone. I have had 3 responses in the last 2 days.
Guy1: didn't know because he worked on the UI for the Kin Studio
Guy2: kindly told me he couldn't release an unauthorized build and that he would be breaking the law by doing so.
Guy3: This guy worked on the phone for over a year. He first told me I was breaking the DCMA by hacking/reverse engineering Kin, regardless of intent. Then he said this important thing:
"You are absolutely right in assuming that the device is locked; in fact, it has a hardware lock that is common to many such devices. When the devices roll of the manufacturing line the programming fuses are blown (literally) preventing any further programming of the device. This is all handled by hardware so unless you find a flaw with that you are out of luck."
So if this is true (sounds like it is), the "dream" is over. Hopefully there is some way that someone out there can find.
If I get more responses, I will post them here. Don't ask me to go back to these three who already replied and asked them more questions, I think I made some of them mad.
Hmmmm... I don't know whether or not the KIN models will accept OTA updates so that's a good question to ask. If OTA updates are possible then it's inherently possible to change the software. I wonder...
Yes, it was me the one who said about "linkedin".
But i also said "in one word NDA". You should known even before ask that the signed NDA are also legal contracts, so i prevented before asking them.
On the DCMA, yes.. on the USA. Outside the big country, the legal question is different and may not operate with that law. (if ever). If they provide a normal (legal?) way to unbrick my factory mode here, or to use the phone options, then i wait for the cost for it.
And everyone knew that hardware was not the way, just at the moment where first flash attempt failed. "Dream" is doable by software, if anything is to be done.
What i don't get is why to ask for rom rom roooooms, where we need drivers drivers driveeeeers... or sdk's. We won't get it anyway from MS, but no flashing means a rom is futile, non useful,crap pack of bytes.
But i also said "in one word NDA". You should known even before ask that the signed NDA are also legal contracts, so i prevented before asking them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I figured I just take a shot in the dark; hope for the best and expect the worst. Since the phone and suuport from MS was discontinued, maybe the NDAs would be voided.
And everyone knew that hardware was not the way, just at the moment where first flash attempt failed. "Dream" is doable by software, if anything is to be done.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to know you still think there's a way.
What i don't get is why to ask for rom rom roooooms, where we need drivers drivers driveeeeers... or sdk's. We won't get it anyway from MS, but no flashing means a rom is futile, non useful,crap pack of bytes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just asked if "there is a way to get around the write lock". Had I known ahead of time to ask about drivers or SDKs, I would have put that in the msg.
I strongly believe that we could operate with the device,softwarewise. there is proof that the kin NAND memory (for now on, called "Storage" as label) is writeable. Not sure on the Rom part.
Of course, i mean.. just use it as a normal writable storage memory.
I posted how it could be done and would do it myself but, again, i bricked my phone, and available ones (through bidding sites) are so expensive to buy another one just for this (+ $150). Don't see a way to get it internationally again.
And even doing it, i'm not sure about what could be done just writing on the storage mem....
If the fuse byte is burn't should not it have prevented you from bricking?
kintwouser said:
If the fuse byte is burn't should not it have prevented you from bricking?
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Click to collapse
Nvitem bricked, not flashing bricked. You can succesfully write to the NVItems memory. But i guess it's just configuration memory and not the one "fused".
I just want to mention that jailbreaking a phone is NOT illegal in the United States! Geohot hacked the iphone... Apple went after him... Apple lost.
Also blowing the programming fuses seems a little fishy to me actually. No other phone does that. The majority of other phones have been flashed. I just think it would be pretty odd for a company to do that so that they no longer could update it. I am not sure I believe him. If this really was true... then why wouldn't Apple or Sony be doing it? This also doesn't make sense since Microsoft actually originally intended on putting WP7 on this as well as allowing apps for it. Check this article out:
http://www.intomobile.com/2010/05/12/kin-windows-phone-7-a-lot-closer-than-we-thought/
you must understand, its not possible to blow fuses in the hardware, it would be a top news story if they were able to keep the OS running in complience with the flash memory without it crashing. Obviously that was a lie to discourage us, and i dont even think that was a real kin developer, because microsoft clearly stated that all kin developers would be moved to WP7 or another programming section. And it doesnt matter if its legal or not to jailbrake phones, if we are porting a new OS, we wouldnt have modified the original OS, which is what jailbraking means. Most likely the OS is hidden deep in the flash memory with a write - protection. If you think its saying access denied because they said the fuses were blown, its wrong. They must just have a password or code that needs to be sent continuasly to the phone to access files. If the fuses were blown, then nothing would be able to be accessed by zune, because it would be impossible to reach the memory.
soninja8 said:
Most likely the OS is hidden deep in the flash memory with a write - protection. If you think its saying access denied because they said the fuses were blown, its wrong. They must just have a password or code that needs to be sent continuasly to the phone to access files. If the fuses were blown, then nothing would be able to be accessed by zune, because it would be impossible to reach the memory.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not my expertise field, but this mobiles can (and in fact they do) have several memories, storing the OS in the ROM memory and all the data on the NAND memory (our "8gb" storage).
Zune software has protocols to query for available storages (requiring its label/id) and is allowed to write/read to it. If you dare to click on update version (at least in the 1st version I tried) it expressed that the option was not "available" to that device without web requesting data, apparently.
So.. in the nand flash we may only have the equivalent of a SD Card. And my last wince PDA showed that as /Storage too, apart from main wince ROM.
You can format the nand memory using win explorer if in fact it is the 8gig storage. I did this and it deleted all pics,albums etc. It was interesting to note that we cannot copy or view these pics without an access error but it does let me delete them.
I just wan't to be able to get my pics off this piece of crap without emailing them.
I posted it once. You are able to:
- Query storage properties (label, size, id,...)
- Query storage folders
- Query folder files.
- Query tracks / albums / playlist / images / anyZuneSupportedFile
- Delete * file (whatever)
- Format the storage
You are "unable" to:
- Upload (create) a file into the device
- Download a file from the device.
MTP protocol tools allows you to do so, from command line (not quite sure if they are available on Win32 OS's), but... fails to operate with this device when it comes to the "unavailable" operations.
I am curious as to which former developers you contacted?
I was doing some research and noticed that Microsoft acquired the company Danger, Inc. After Microsoft purchased them, the former president of Danger went to develop Android (later acquired by Google). One thing I read was that most of Dangers employees left after being purchased by Microsoft. Apparently these people don't like Microsoft all that much! I also looked into it a little more and found one of the founders of Danger who had a twitter account. Of course all of his tweets were via a "KIN". Thought that was interesting. It seems to me that these former Danger employees would be interested in helping out if they don't hold to high of an esteem for the big "M".
seems like this is your first "inside the move" trying-to-hack/reverse a thing, so i will say:
people involved doesnt wanna risk through legal issues, even if they were pissed off, just for "some kids" to have a driver or rom. NDA are strong there, and they could either sign them or leave (if leaving, they don't have the interesting things).
At most you would get bad-mood or good-luck comments, and ocassionaly (very uncommon), leaks (wont happen here).
yeah, they purchased danger for an amazing 500 million dollars, which they later developed the kin with it, they were planning to put windows phone 7 on it, but they were to behind and released it with the old windows CE, then the former developer moved to work on a free source OS, later called android. Google wanted to get android while it was cheap, so they bought that company, and made the old developer as 2nd engineer.
Maybe not worth yet, but we should get more *info* about the SBL mode (aka "Ms Pink Bootstrap), as coinflipper said that it was the way to flash OS or parts (like radio's).
I have been trying even OMA wap WBXML bootstrap examples with it, but as we dont know if our phone is standard, it's like looking for a water drop in the sea of possibilities.
We do not need a guide on how to do something, but what-to-do with it.
Maybe, JUST MAYBE, we could design a program like bitpim. I am a mac user and when I used bitpim with my enV touch, I used to edit all sorts of files. Examples would be phone info, server info etc. We could make a program like that to get the info. I know programming may be hard, but its worth a shot. I hate the OS on this phone, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU PIN APPS! THEY LOOK HORRIBLE
Kinuser1 said:
Maybe, JUST MAYBE, we could design a program like bitpim. I am a mac user and when I used bitpim with my enV touch, I used to edit all sorts of files.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We can't. If we have not the protocols or the supported phone features (protocols, drivers, documentation,...) you cannot guess it and put it into visual basic (or Xcode) and then by *magic*get the program you want.
i will admit that i know very little about protocols and drivers but i would like to point out that bitpim is open source, and that the code can be found here ->
http-//sourceforge.net/scm/?type=svn&group_id=75211 (change "-" to ":")
i seem to recall bitpim already having limited support for the kin, but perhaps with a little research and a little code tweaking we can find ways to improve it? i'm not sure how feasable it is as i have very little experience with programming for phones/usb devices, but it's just a thought.
slimeq said:
i will admit that i know very little about protocols and drivers but i would like to point out that bitpim is open source, and that the code can be found here ->
http-//sourceforge.net/scm/?type=svn&group_id=75211 (change "-" to ":")
i seem to recall bitpim already having limited support for the kin, but perhaps with a little research and a little code tweaking we can find ways to improve it? i'm not sure how feasable it is as i have very little experience with programming for phones/usb devices, but it's just a thought.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We can't. If we have not the protocols or the supported phone features (protocols, drivers, documentation,...) you cannot guess it and put it into visual basic (or Xcode) and then by *magic*get the program you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The above applies to any software you want. Unless you magically found documentation or files (like OP), there's no way to. So f#cked.
The thing is always the same, tweaking tweaking... what to tweak, huh?
I am willing to give $50 (via paypal) to the person that gets native comm access working on a Mango DVP without the need to revert back to pre-mango. The library must contain:
Registry read and write
File browsing
Ability to interop unlock
** Update **
Now up to $100 USD. raiderfan247365 has matched my $50. Hey you also get bragging rights
** Update **
You also need to provide the source code to this.
Cheers!
MJCS said:
I am willing to give $50 (via paypal) to the person that gets native comm access working on a Mango DVP without the need to revert back to pre-mango. The library must contain:
Registry read and write
File browsing
Ability to interop unlock
You also need to provide the source code to this.
Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I love your ambition but this is not the way phones get hacked on this site generally. People that tweak these phones do it for many different reasons and money is not generally one of them. I have have asked a few people if getting their hands on a DVP would help the effort but at this point it appears because of the way Dell constructed their drivers, it really might be impossible to accomplish these tasks you seek, but god knows I would love to have that stuff on our phone. Ill match your 50 but I dont think it will matter
Well dell has as far as I know no apps with native code in the marketplace which makes it quite difficult. Als it will be hard to extract the diagnosis app (or similar) and without these apps it wil be quite impossible to find ways to hack the dvp.
File and Registry operations are too different things, and far away now. A hacker will need these basics first and I understand you are willing to spend a lot of money on it, but its very time consuming and without a device or these native apps it will not be an easy task.
If you have some apps which use native code please post it here, some guys on this board can have a look. If not dont than it will be hard to accomplish.
Marvin_S said:
Well dell has as far as I know no apps with native code in the marketplace which makes it quite difficult. Als it will be hard to extract the diagnosis app (or similar) and without these apps it wil be quite impossible to find ways to hack the dvp.
File and Registry operations are too different things, and far away now. A hacker will need these basics first and I understand you are willing to spend a lot of money on it, but its very time consuming and without a device or these native apps it will not be an easy task.
If you have some apps which use native code please post it here, some guys on this board can have a look. If not dont than it will be hard to accomplish.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Someone did grab the EM app awhile back but is is out of date. I am not sure how he grabbed it in the first place.