Develop Bugs

Apps2sd problem

I have had the latest MoDaCo rom running on my T-Mobile G2 touch a day after I recieved it and have to say that it out performs the stock rom by far. I have noticed a problem in the last 2 days or so which prompted me to do a clean install today but unfortunately did not resolve the problem.
I originally installed the MoDaCo rom using the guide over at the unlockr which was very simple and effective. I also decided that I would try and use apps2sd to help remove installed packages off my phone and store them on my 8GB SD. I had partitioned my sd card as the guide here suggests, I followed the code correctly by basically using copy and paste function in cmd so as to not make any mistakes and made note to update the ext2 to ext3 only as I read that the ext4 has issues with this particular rom.
I presumed everything was fine until today I noticed that when I install an app from the market store it seems to still be storing all the applications on the phone memory, I noticed the phone memory was reducing on every installation wheras the sdcard memory is untouched. Another thing I noticed is that in the sd card setting the sd card total space is being read as 7078MB wheras the partition was for a size of 7437MB. I have also accessed the data/apps folder on my phone through adb shell commands and low and behold all my apps are stored on there. There is also no folder on the sd card so there must be a problem.
I would be greatful if anyone could guide me as to any known issues with apps2sd on this particular rom or whether they can see where I might have done something incorrectly.
Many Thanks

With Aps2SD as I understand it, some parts of the programmes are still stored on the devices - system files etc. so The phone memory will change gradually.
Also, the browser and market caches still grow on the device, and need deleting via Application manager to keep the device memory as free as possible. (With Browser, clear cache, but not data as this clears your cookies and bookmarks )
Also, the apps from aps 2 SD are of course stored on the Ext3 partition. It doesn't get read at all as the SD Card in the device, as the device only sees FAT32 as SDCard space, so new apps loaded don't make a dint in the SD Memory seen on the device, or even in your PC, as this does the same thing, it doesn't see the Ext3 partition.
In My case, prior to installing MCR rom, I had around 50 apps on my device and my phone memory was reading around 70MB
After a wipe and installing MCR2.0 before loading any APPS - I was at around 155MB
After reinstalling ALL my 50 apps plus a fair few more - so around 60 apps(including some bulky apps like CoPilot - which I know stores around 8mb of its total of 15mb on the device itself to run smoothly and Docs To Go) I'm at around 120MB
So my advice is - Check your Browser and market caches. If your device has 50 or 60 apps on taking up around 30mb, then the bulk of those apps are being stored on your Ext 3 partition and its likely all running as it should.
If you have 50 or 60 apps and they are taking up closer to 80/90mb of your device storage, then aps2 SD might not have worked. - check on the thread for ROM that you have installed for advice on how to solve it.
Hope that helps
Dayz xx

I switched to Apps2SD. My internal storage is still only 200MB. Why? How do I lower?

Am I supposed to go back and erase all of my apps from internal storage after they are moved to the SD card? If so, how?
I just don't understand why I only have 200MB out of 1GB available. All of my apps are on the SD card now.
What do I need to delete out of the internal memory?
Any help is MUCHO appreciated.
tia

You don't actually have 1GB of usable storage space by default. It's split into partitions, and the user storage is only ~512MB or less (I can't remember how I saw what the internal storage was split up as...)

"ONLY 200MB"
How much do you need?

I get your point. You get the point of my questions though, right?

If you have a fast SD card, you can move the dalvik cache to the SD card and free up another 60 megs or so.

You'll never see most of that gigabyte on your phone. Ever. I think the maximum you're allowed for apps on the internal flash storage is 350 megabytes. Even with Apps2SD, I think the dalvik cache for all of your apps is still stored on the internal memory, which would occupy some space.

I don't know what the heck I'm doing is the problem. Once I figure it out, I'll post some stats for new guys like me.
I've formatted my card correctly. Now I'm just trying to figure out if I'm supposed to wipe my system and reinstall in order for the apps to get "moved over" or not. I'm curious as to whether My Backup Pro or Titanium will "restore" the apps to the SD card now that I'm formatted correctly.

I believe the "moving" is not really moving it happens on install. So yes starting fresh is probably the best way to go.
There is only like 350mb or so of user installable space. Depending on rom it could go up a little but its close.
Also remember, not every single portion of the app gets installed on the SD. Some files still need to be stored on nand, just less. Much less depending on the app.
Just make sure you have a decently fast sd card if you want to move dalvik there. class 6 or better imo. It will work with a slower card but it could slow things down.
Froyo requires ext4 partition btw. Not sure what rom your using.

^^ Thanks for the info. I'm using Fresh 1.0.1, which is good because I don't even know how to make Ext4. I'm using Amon RA to partition and the only upgrade option was from 2 to 3. I didn't see anything about 4.
I'll wipe clean and see what happens.

Oh, one more thing that your post made me think of. The whole reason that I'm doing this is so that I don't have to re-install apps every time I wipe and install a new ROM. I figured that the new ROMs would just find my apps on my SD card.
If this isn't the case then it is not worth it to me. Meaning, if I still have to re-install all apps each time I wipe the device there is no benefit to me.
So: is that the case? Do new ROMs just "find" the apps on the SD card?
Aridon said:
I believe the "moving" is not really moving it happens on install. So yes starting fresh is probably the best way to go.
There is only like 350mb or so of user installable space. Depending on rom it could go up a little but its close.
Also remember, not every single portion of the app gets installed on the SD. Some files still need to be stored on nand, just less. Much less depending on the app.
Just make sure you have a decently fast sd card if you want to move dalvik there. class 6 or better imo. It will work with a slower card but it could slow things down.
Froyo requires ext4 partition btw. Not sure what rom your using.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

APPS on SD?

Any ideas how I could get my apps onto my 4gig sd card.
I have read the tutorial but in my clockwords recovery mode, there is no option to partition.
The reason for the partition is for adding my apps to my SD card.
Currently I have tons of apps and allot of them slow my phone down.
Should this be the case? I was advised that the way android works is, it auto closes apps when the speed starts to slow down?

mobad said:
Any ideas how I could get my apps onto my 4gig sd card.
I have read the tutorial but in my clockwords recovery mode, there is no option to partition.
The reason for the partition is for adding my apps to my SD card.
Currently I have tons of apps and allot of them slow my phone down.
Should this be the case? I was advised that the way android works is, it auto closes apps when the speed starts to slow down?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the linux kernal will close apps when it needs to but that has very little to do with where the apps actually reside.
you need to partition your card with rom manager from the market in order to enable apps2sd( not the crappy froyo apps2sd mind)
copy the contents of your card at the moment to your pc. downlaod rom manager from the market, use it to partition your card with 512mb and 32mb swap. then dowload modinstalllocation from the market, this will allow you to chose where you save your apps too. choose 1 internal( ie the 512mb ext 3 partition for apps2sd you made with rom manager). copy all your content back to your sd card. all your apps should now be in your ext3 partition. if you really want to move apps to the actual sd card main partition, choose location 2 phone with modinstallocation but beware that whenever you mount the sd card those apps wont work till its remounted( its wise not to put widgets on the sd card). to check all this info and make sure apps2sd is working correctly you can downlaod quick settings info from the market and it will give you all the info you need on internal and apps2sd storage on your phone.

Many thanks for your reply.
I have just done as you said and then downlaoded aroudn 4 apps equalling around 20mb.
They seem to be on the sd card and internal.
The size of external has gone down by around 15mb and around 5-10mb has goen down on the internal as well?

mobad said:
Many thanks for your reply.
I have just done as you said and then downlaoded aroudn 4 apps equalling around 20mb.
They seem to be on the sd card and internal.
The size of external has gone down by around 15mb and around 5-10mb has goen down on the internal as well?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is correct. If you are using legacy Apps2SD or Froyo Apps2SD, the Dalvik cache (see here) remains on the internal phone memory.
So, when you install a new application onto SD card, it will consume memory on internal phone memory, though at a lesser rate than if the app was installed on phone memory (in my experience, roughly half the rate).
The only way to "resolve" this is to install legacy Apps2SD+, which also moves the Dalvik cache to SD card.
Personally, I don't do this - what I do is actively manage my applications using Titanium backup. For example, I seldom use certain large apps such as Google Earth, and some games, but I do want to keep them available. So I install them on the phone, and then back them up using Titanium Backup. When storage is low, I will remove them from the phone, but I can bring them back quickly (and without using data) as required.
I don't use legacy Apps2SD+ because I do have several SD cards that I want to be able to swap between quickly.
Regards,
Dave

Dave - many thanks for your comprehensive and useful reply.
What would be the limitation for using Apps2SD+?
From your reply im assuming it would stop me from chaing sd cards?

Essentially yes - you'd need to keep the EXT partition across SD cards in sync, which while not impossible, is more difficult than just copying .android_secure folder from one card to another which I believe should work ok so long as being used in the same phone.
Regards,
Dave

Excellent.
I think im ready to set it all up.
Got two not technical final question for you -
Which rom would you recommend?
I'm currentl with Frost 2.9a however I found Modaco's custom rom to be mroe fruitful with apps/stability.
Which 16gb/32gb sd card would you recommend?
Thanks

mobad said:
Which 16gb/32gb sd card would you recommend?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I regularly use two 16gb Class 2 Sandisk cards and a 8gb Class 6 Transcend card. To be honest, I've no performance issues with either and my Sandisk cards regular exceed Class 6 minimums. Personally, I see no point paying extra for a large capacity Class 6 or Class 10 card - I may try 720p recording on my Class 6 soon though to see if it improves the framerate, but I doubt there will be much if any difference.
Regards,
Dave

I put Kings SHOOTER 2.3, pretty sweet!!! Just one question bout memory....

I put Kings shooter and it is working awesome. It's not glitchy, it's smooth and everything works. I partitioned the sd card with Rom Manager. When I use Task Manager the total memory is 404 mb, but free is only 75-90 mb. The apps are downloading to the sd card, but I need to verify they are running from there right? Should I have made it so the Rom runs off the sd card too? Probably dumb questions.
I guess my question is, after loading the rom then I partitioned the sd card, then downloaded a couple apps. I didn't tell it to do anything. I thought I read somewhere I need to tell it to load apps to sd card or something?
Ok, I read where I can go into the settings, applications, yada yada and move it to the sd card. All the ones I downloaded are on the sd card. Is it recommended that I move most other apps to the sd card also to free up lots of memory? Will the phone respond quicker? Thanks

sounds like someone is about to learn the difference between memory(RAM) and storage

Thank you for raising your hand young Mr. Sled=)
deathsled said:
sounds like someone is about to learn the difference between memory(RAM) and storage
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now for your first lesson:
RAM = random access memory, used to temporarily store information for quick access, to put it simply.
storage = self explanatory.
Now to the question at hand. Just like we install apps to our sd card and then run them off that versus installing to our internal memory, is this able to be done with for our Rom to save more internal memory? Unlike a computer which uses a hard drive, our phones actually have solid state storage. But maybe it doesn't matter where the apps or roms are stored for speed of use.

I was talking about you not me.....
I based it off of this statement:
"When I use Task Manager the total memory is 404 mb, but free is only 75-90 mb."
and then you go on to talk about storage and apps on SD and blah blah blah.
You understand that Task Manager is showing you the amount of RAM free and not storage space? right?

haha
deathsled said:
I was talking about you not me.....
I based it off of this statement:
"When I use Task Manager the total memory is 404 mb, but free is only 75-90 mb."
and then you go on to talk about storage and apps on SD and blah blah blah.
You understand that Task Manager is showing you the amount of RAM free and not storage space? right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very nice of you to base it off not asking me in the first place and then not offering any info, thanks mr sled. Yes, I do. I'm not up on the latest hardware capabilities, but I know years ago back when nokias were big, we were discussing the use of internal memory as a possible source of expanding ram. Although it doesn't sound like that is the case still since you're not aware of it. Thanks for splaining it to me.
Do you actually have the answer to if we can and should run the rom off the sd card, just like we would run the OS off a hard drive in a computer?

The only devices I'm really aware of that allow running the actual ROM (or OS if you will) from the SD card are the Nook and the HD2. For anything else you're going to have the ROM reside on the internal storage.
You would be taking a big performance hit running a ROM in SD anyway, SD is typically much slower than the internal storage.
You can however install plenty of apps on SD and move lots of stock apps to SD if your has App2SD built in.

deathsled said:
The only devices I'm really aware of that allow running the actual ROM (or OS if you will) from the SD card are the Nook and the HD2. For anything else you're going to have the ROM reside on the internal storage.
You would be taking a big performance hit running a ROM in SD anyway, SD is typically much slower than the internal storage.
You can however install plenty of apps on SD and move lots of stock apps to SD if your has App2SD built in.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, very true, for os speed is everything. It would be a slug with slow sd memory. Thanks Deathsled.

[Q] D'Inc Memory Full ? Too many apps?

Droid Incredible Specs:
-OVO Community Rom Sense 3.0
-HTC Kernel
-Android 2.3.4
So I keep getting every week that my phones running out of memory space. I wouldnt mind the message but everytime that happens I have to clear all of my apps cache and data so I can be able to use the Internet if not it wont let me.What I dont understand is how?
-Obviously we have 8GB interior memory
-I have an external 4GB Micro SD Card
So my question is, is there anyway I can possibly use the interior memory of my phone (like the DROID X, etc does it) for the apps and cache and all of the sweet stuff. Since I mostly use my SD Card and a few gigs on the interior memory for music.
????
If thats not possible can I somehow override the message so it will stop bothering me and let me use my apps and internet without having to clear caches and data?
Thanks in Advance

I believe the ext4 mod is what you need to resolve this issue. Found here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1315372

eljean said:
Droid Incredible Specs:
-OVO Community Rom Sense 3.0
-HTC Kernel
-Android 2.3.4
So I keep getting every week that my phones running out of memory space. I wouldnt mind the message but everytime that happens I have to clear all of my apps cache and data so I can be able to use the Internet if not it wont let me.What I dont understand is how?
-Obviously we have 8GB interior memory
-I have an external 4GB Micro SD Card
So my question is, is there anyway I can possibly use the interior memory of my phone (like the DROID X, etc does it) for the apps and cache and all of the sweet stuff. Since I mostly use my SD Card and a few gigs on the interior memory for music.
????
If thats not possible can I somehow override the message so it will stop bothering me and let me use my apps and internet without having to clear caches and data?
Thanks in Advance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The low space warning is common among incredible users. It is due to the /data/data partition filling up because it was made ridiculously small by the manufacture, HTC.
You could move apps to sd either nativley, or with the many apps on the market. Link2sd is a great one in my opinion, and the way to go if you choose to use an app to solve your issue.
Or you could use the ext4_no_data_limit mod. What it does is move the app storage (/data/data) off of its own seperate tiny partition and instead uses the much larger /data partition to store your apps needed files.
The first option does not require root, but you have to know how to partition your sd for use with the app.
The second option does require root, and also that you have a kernel that supports ext4. The mod will install a compatible kernel for you, but you cant switch to a different kernel after flashing this mod unless it also supports ext4.
I would go the way of the second option, as it is more reliable than an app, and also is better because it does not use the slow sdcard or emmc. And the gingertiny kernel it installs has tons of perks, and is great on battery life.

Thank you guys! Tons of help