Develop Bugs

Why take WP7 over android?

Hello everyone!
I just have a quick question, Why should a person take a Windows Phone 7 over an android Phone? I like the UI of WP7 but i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
I am a normal/amateur-flasher user, what does WP7 give me and others like me that android doesn't?

Meatballs said:
i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In other words, it has everything android has and then some - namely, UI you like. Sounds like a reason.
I personally will most probably go to WP7 via Android as WP7 most probably won't be available here for a while, and I never start a new year without a new phone. But that'll be a temporary stop. Android for me is like buying a Ford. It may be a great deal but I just couldn't possibly love the thing.

Meatballs said:
Hello everyone!
I just have a quick question, Why should a person take a Windows Phone 7 over an android Phone? I like the UI of WP7 but i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
I am a normal/amateur-flasher user, what does WP7 give me and others like me that android doesn't?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well for me xbox live and the gaming & android was never an option for me since it just felt boring when i pick it up, i was thinking about the evo until i used it & after that i realized that i just dont like android. for you tho im not sure what your into, but silverlight should bring some amazing apps that other platforms cant match supposedly
thats all i have since i never owned an android phone I wont speak to much on it

Meatballs said:
Hello everyone!
I just have a quick question, Why should a person take a Windows Phone 7 over an android Phone? I like the UI of WP7 but i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
I am a normal/amateur-flasher user, what does WP7 give me and others like me that android doesn't?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If a spec list is important to you, Android is your choice.
If a seamless experience with a responsive UI is more important, WP7 is the better option. WP7's spec list will grow over time (probably rather quickly). It provides the "it just works" aspects of the iPhone while giving you the carrier and hardware choice of Android.
So at this point, it really depends on what you value more.

1) Hubs - WP7 is an information centric OS vs Android, which is app centric. Hubs allow you to have all of the information and applications that you need one click away, instead of jumping in and out of apps continuously.
2) Games - Xbox Live is the largest and most poplar gaming platform ever. Games will integrate into Live and will allow you to play fantastic games online, and most likely cross-platform. (Probably not until v1.1)
3) Music - Every WP7 is a Zune HD. The Zune interface is integrated and beautiful, much better than music on an iPhone (IMO) and undeniably better than the music experience on any Android Device.
4) Social Networking - Facebook and Twitter are integrated into your contacts (Similar to the Facebook updates for each contact in Sense for Winmo but much better). All of the social networking updates are also integrated into the People hub, and you can comment and such w/o even opening an app.
5) Other random tidbits -
Applications are super super easy to create (I'm taking hours instead of weeks), thus developers will jump on this, and lots of apps will be created.
Hardware minimum is very high, 1ghz snapdragon, WVGA, and 5megapixel cameras are the min (but the platform supports much higher specs).
Large phone selection! Almost all phone manufactures have signed up to make a windows phone, and you will find a couple on every carrier guaranteed.
Lastly, Android is free! this means its likely we will be able to duel boot on a WP7 device, but you will never be able to do this on an android device
Somebody help me out, this is all i could think of off the top of my head. Hope it helps

For me: the clean interface, Live (and Xbox Live) integration and Zune Pass.
I've tried Android and didn't really like it. In a post-iPhone world I don't think it cuts the mustard, it's basically Google's take on Symbian/WinMo.

I like these arguments...
Keep them coming

- Uniform design language for applications
- Better business model for distribution applications
- Trial API for letting users try-before-buy
- More strict hardware requirements (= easier to write apps)
- Larger coverage of paid apps in Europe
- Zune integration
- Xbox integration
-- Xbox achievements (oh yeah!)
- No fragmentation in OS updates
- Supports OTA updates from version 1
- Better design and development tools (Expression Blend and XNA Studio specifically)
- Support for vector graphics
- Windows Live integration
- Cloud storage
- Automatically ("it just works") sync with the PC.
- Best platform for creating mobile games
- Hubs
I could go on, but what I think is really important, is that application and games development is easier than on any other platform. It's more rapid, with larger amount of tooling.
And this means more than people think.
Combined with the good business model for using the marketplace, the market will thrive. Which iPhone proved to be a really killer point.
Apps and iTunes are two points contributed large amount of the iPhone's success. It's scary how little Google cares about these two points for Android.

sprinttouch666 said:
4) Social Networking - Facebook and Twitter are integrated into your contacts (Similar to the Facebook updates for each contact in Sense for Winmo but much better). All of the social networking updates are also integrated into the People hub, and you can comment and such w/o even opening an app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All of your points are well "supported" though there is one flaw with the above quoted statement..
As of right now, Twitter is kinda' denying Microsoft access to certain functions of the TwitterAPI [not fully], thus the Twitter Integration with the new Windows Live Essentials Suite is still... pretty much useless.
And to my knowledge, Microsoft hasn't fully announced 'out-of-the-box' Twitter Integration, as they have with Facebook Integration...
And to make a stand-point in this thread:
Why will I choose Windows Phone 7 compared to the other available Mobile OS's? Because I like being a Tech-Guinea Pig. Testing is fun, especially when it comes to products from Microsoft. I've only been disappointed with Windows ME and Vista {Compared to what Vista was SUPPOSED TO BE <- Click to see}
Apple calls themselves innovators, yet all the do is polish a pile of sh*t (idea) and release it... if you polish sh*t, it's still sh*t... it just looks prettier. Microsoft is compressing this sh*t with 40 billion PSI and making, what looks to be, the most beautiful Diamond in the world.
{Figuratively speaking}

Agent Zach said:
All of your points are well "supported" though there is one flaw with the above quoted statement..
As of right now, Twitter is kinda' denying Microsoft access to certain functions of the TwitterAPI [not fully], thus the Twitter Integration with the new Windows Live Essentials Suite is still... pretty much useless.
And to my knowledge, Microsoft hasn't fully announced 'out-of-the-box' Twitter Integration, as they have with Facebook Integration...
And to make a stand-point in this thread:
Why will I choose Windows Phone 7 compared to the other available Mobile OS's? Because I like being a Tech-Guinea Pig. Testing is fun, especially when it comes to products from Microsoft. I've only been disappointed with Windows ME and Vista {Compared to what Vista was SUPPOSED TO BE <- Click to see}
Apple calls themselves innovators, yet all the do is polish a pile of sh*t (idea) and release it... if you polish sh*t, it's still sh*t... it just looks prettier. Microsoft is compressing this sh*t with 40 billion PSI and making, what looks to be, the most beautiful Diamond in the world.
{Figuratively speaking}
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ops. Not sure what i was thinking, you are very correct about twitter. But, its time for M$ to blow that 3 year old polished turd out of the water with WP7!!!!
(P.S. Thanks for reminding me about Longhorn! I was 11 or 12 at the time!!! I'm gunna QQ all over again!! haha)

It was a minor error, so no biggy. I'm sure Microsoft will somehow introduce their Twitter Integration with an update of some-sort, assuming that they'll do "Client-Side" device updates, like they do with the Zunes.
I use both Facebook and Twitter, so both would be preferred, but if Facebook is all we can get 'out-of-the-box', then I guess I'll have to suffer.
[Actually, I don't mind.. I'm sure there will be a nice TouchTwit 7 App.]

Let me give you a real reason, instead of ****ty phone feature bullet point lists as above:
Android didn't go anywhere yet. Granted, while every app store has its rather tremendously huge share of **** applications, the respective share of good applications on Android is way smaller than in the Apple app store. Android's UI is also so-so and not consistent in itself (the system itself, third party apps don't count, since they're never consistent). Call WP7 minimalistic, but at least they're trying to go for a certain style and presentation, and that consistently. And even with third party applications, look at Facebook for Android, then at Facebook for iPhone. Maybe it's just me, but I want everything I use on the phone to be somewhat attractive. Now look at the upcoming Facebook integration in WP7. Unless you're absolutely disgusted by the Metro style, it looks way more attractive than the Android offering. This'll apply to a lot of future applications, too.
And with the easy and powerful programming environment available in WP7, you should see quite a bunch of decent and innovative applications. Because applications is where it's at in the end. An example: WP7 isn't even out yet, some guy is already demoing a panorama stitching application on Youtube, while there isn't even such a thing available for Android, and the platform's out since quite a while.
I've tried programming with the Android SDK, it was a pretty frustrating experience. Unless someone's a sperg or has tangible financial opportunities to be had (i.e. killer app or hired as Android developer), I don't see people giving it enough effort. As to be witnessed by current application quality.

Tom Servo said:
Android's UI is also so-so and not consistent in itself (the system itself, third party apps don't count, since they're never consistent)
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Click to collapse
And actually third party apps will be consistent in WP7, it's awesome \o/
The amount of games available months before launch is also staggering.

^ your opinion only.
You have several FB and twitter apps to choose from on android, so your point there is completely bogus.

And they're all winners in terms of visual prowess and usability (note: sarcasm).
Windcape said:
And actually third party apps will be consistent in WP7, it's awesome \o/
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Click to collapse
No they won't. Microsoft's obviously a gatekeeper on what it'll allow onto the marketplace and what not. But nothing forces you to keep within the Metro guidelines. You're dealing with Silverlight here, you can do whatever you want. I'm keeping a GPS logger on the backburner and am currently tinkering with a second UI for it based on the Zune desktop software. Granted, it's kinda Metro-like, but still completely breaks the norm in relation to the system UI.

I'm aware it's possible, but it's common practice for UI developers from the .NET / Windows stack to stick to the design guidelines. The vast majority will be using the Metro design language, and utilizing pivot/panorama controls, and so on. (Except for games, of course).

Tom Servo said:
No they won't. Microsoft's obviously a gatekeeper on what it'll allow onto the marketplace and what not. But nothing forces you to keep within the Metro guidelines. You're dealing with Silverlight here, you can do whatever you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are right, however, judging by all the demos so far, a lot of applications actually are very close to the standard. Simply because the Metro concept is pretty strong I guess. So we can at least reasonably expect a lot of "apps" that conform.
Tom Servo said:
I'm keeping a GPS logger on the backburner and am currently tinkering with a second UI for it based on the Zune desktop software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A GPS logger for WP7? Running in foreground all the time?

vangrieg said:
You are right, however, judging by all the demos so far, a lot of applications actually are very close to the standard. Simply because the Metro concept is pretty strong I guess. So we can at least reasonably expect a lot of "apps" that conform.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not opposed to custom UIs. But I very rarely see good ones. Hell, even myself am copying an established UI for **** and giggles, because most other things I've tried looked like **** in practise (I'd say I've at least a baseline talent in graphical design).
For that matter, the current templates shipped with the latest SDK don't match the system that well. They're close, but not exact.
For some reason, Microsoft figured to write WP7 with Iris UIX, while giving us developers Silverlight instead, with clones of the various system controls.
vangrieg said:
A GPS logger for WP7? Running in foreground all the time?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. That obviously relies on the application continuing to run on the phone, if you lock the screen. Sadly I couldn't test this yet, since the emulator locks up when you set a screen timeout and let it happen.
As for running in foreground, I don't see the problem in that. Personally, when I'm on my way with a bike, I have the phone stashed away in the backpack, so I don't need anything else running.
Remains to be seen, if calls interrupt the application. Not sure how to initiate fake incoming calls on the emulator.

Tom Servo said:
I'm not opposed to custom UIs. But I very rarely see good ones. Hell, even myself am copying an established UI for **** and giggles, because most other things I've tried looked like **** in practise (I'd say I've at least a baseline talent in graphical design).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's hard to beat a professional design, with some talent or not. People spend a lot of time on those for a reason.
Tom Servo said:
For that matter, the current templates shipped with the latest SDK don't match the system that well. They're close, but not exact.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True. They promised to supply Pivot and Panorama in the final version of tools, AFAIR.
Tom Servo said:
For some reason, Microsoft figured to write WP7 with Iris UIX, while giving us developers Silverlight instead, with clones of the various system controls.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess it was difficult to do it in Silverlight when it wasn't ready? Apart from that, you don't want a web browser done in C#.
Tom Servo said:
As for running in foreground, I don't see the problem in that. Personally, when I'm on my way with a bike, I have the phone stashed away in the backpack, so I don't need anything else running.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't use GPS loggers myself but always thought one of the core usecases was logging your track while you're using satnav.

I would not take any win oh no matter what version over Android. Personally windows phone 7 def.ly is a major upgrade but it still can't be compared to the open source Android. You will def.ly be by far more restrictive with win 7 ph, plus the apps market for WP7 can't be compare to the Android market.
Don't get me wrong WP7 is a total and competely new UI with a bunch of features that would def.ly be useful to some, but at the end of the day it's MS.
Sent from my Evo using XDA App

Where the hell is windows live messenger???

You would think Microsoft would create this application as a priority. Jesus, even my blackberry has WINDOWS LIVE!
What the hell!

Yes that was quite puzzling.
I would have thought that it would be on there before it launched.

I'll laugh if AOL sticks an AIM client on the marketplace before Microsoft gets an MSN Messenger client up there. It's boneheaded moves like this that have defined Microsoft lately and it's why they went from almost owning the smartphone market to being in a position where they may never be able to catch up.

Did ya'll look on the marketplace??? There is a live messenger there. The company that made isn't microsoft but they got paid by ms to do the app and it's the official messenger app...
Dont really get the confusion

BIG-Stan said:
Did ya'll look on the marketplace??? There is a live messenger there. The company that made isn't microsoft but they got paid by ms to do the app and it's the official messenger app...
Dont really get the confusion
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TRUST ME IF THAT POS APP WAS REMOTELY PRACTICAL I WOULD HAVE USED IT.
Pretty much the "in and out" phone is just keeping me out from using my phone! Seriously this OS has immense potential but the launch was seriously half-assed, I would have been happier if they had delayed the launch window to early next year.
This is going to give a bad impression to many early adopters, let's not forget the issues with supply.

ManicDVLN said:
TRUST ME IF THAT POS APP WAS REMOTELY PRACTICAL I WOULD HAVE USED IT.
Pretty much the "in and out" phone is just keeping me out from using my phone! Seriously this OS has immense potential but the launch was seriously half-assed, I would have been happier if they had delayed the launch window to early next year.
This is going to give a bad impression to many early adopters, let's not forget the issues with supply.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know...I've played with the phones now quite a bit and really like the polish and features...yes, there are some glaring features missing but they will be added. I was told at an MS kickoff meeting earlier this week that they are going to have a ton of updates starting in January...they kept saying they are betting the farm on this so we'll see...
I would agree on the marketing front however...I don't understand how they can do such a good job with xbox360 marketing and do such a half assed attempt with the wp7 which is arguably more important to them in the long term.

They must be working on a native WLM. They make one for iPhone and Blackberry. They have produced a version for 3 on Android, which a third party coded.
It plugs into Yahoo Messenger too. Plus WLM now talks to Facebook Chat. They are rolling out that feature as we speak. But only a few people have it right now.
Maybe they will release WLM at CES. I can imagine Ballmer and Zuckerberg make an announcment together. Or at Mobile World Congress at the latest.

Maybe they were waiting for Microsoft Lync, which is apparently coming to Windows Phone in 2011. I just hope that, whatever it is, its a native app and ideally integrated into the OS.
Was just doing some reading about Microsoft Lync, sounds perfect...
Add Contacts and Share Presence and Instant Messages Users can add contacts on Windows Live, AOL, Yahoo!, and Google Talk networks to their contact list. With the Communicator “14” client, users can share presence status information and participate in instant messaging with colleagues and customers who use public IM connections.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://lync.microsoft.com/en-us/Product/Technologies/Pages/public-im-connectivity.aspx

you can go to live.com and use the web messenger from the menu-> messenger option
peace

The Zune HD Live Messenger only came out last month and had Facebook chat integrated. They're probably working on it.

What on earth are you talking about??? Messenger was available from day one and was one of the first apps I downloaded! its made by another company though. not microsoft. have a proper look or bing it in market place.

davidebanks said:
What on earth are you talking about???
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Click to collapse
There's no need to be like that when evidently you haven't read all the posts. We know there's a messenger but it's not an official one and as such it doesn't do the job for the OP and others.

But it wont get more official. I read somewhere that the company that made the current wlm was paid by ms to code the app as an official one.
I'm pretty sure though that it will get updated with more features. The current version certainly lacks some features compared to the ios version.
ps: here is the link to the article
http://www.liveside.net/2010/10/14/whos-building-the-official-messenger-app-for-wp7-not-microsoft/

Microsoft has often asked other developers to make app for them like the facebook one on winmo 6.5 but they would always mark it as an official MS app, so if that company is in charge I'm sure it would be a different version without their name on it.
That aside, I can't see Microsoft developing a WLM app for Zune HD and an awesome one for the iPhone and then not make one for their own platform. Doesn't make any sense.

Pretty sure we will see something soon enough that surpasses the cheesy app that is out now.

Why the hell would MS pay somebody to make the messenger and not provide them with the ability to have it run in the background?
I have read the same articles, and it smells rather off to me.
Personally, i cant wait for a better one. (or the existing one to get out of pre-alpha phase, coz that's how bad it is)

what dont you guys get? the official app is the one on the market. microsoft just paid another company to make it.

kiloah said:
what dont you guys get? the official app is the one on the market. microsoft just paid another company to make it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"Messenger by Miyowa"? What don't we get? Well, for starters, how you managed to use it to message anyone. That thing is rubbish, I can't imagine Microsoft let anyone put that thing out in their name and, last I checked which was about 45 seconds ago it was the only IM app in the marketplace.
The app doesn't have to run in the background. Beejive and IM+ for iPhone worked quite well before iPhone supported background operation and it worked via push notification. I think they both support background execution now but why bother when push works so well? That's memory freed up to use for something else.
Finally, a really half-assed solution that works is the SMS / IM interface most carriers provide. Some only do AIM but some cover them all. Do a google search for your carrier. AT&T, for example, uses SMS numbers starting with 265000 to log in and so on. If you're really that hard up for IM it's better than nothing, but just barely.

People are funny in this world.
In theory this OS is a platform for the community to build on.
Too bad the community is a mob with pitchforks.
Who in their right mind will develop anything when the populous will undoubtedly attack their creation?
Microsoft can't fix people. Why does anyone need messenger when all they do is hate on everything new?

I read that news about this third party company and I have a strong feeling that it's false. There is no way, that MS which created official messenger app for every other platform would outsource something so native to an unknown third party company for the windows OS!
I have a feeling that was a fake news spread by that third party company.

Lets see how fast MS will push an update now :)

now that we can sideload app's (something like a jailbreak)I am really interested how fast Microsoft will release his first wp7 update to fix this

ceesheim said:
now that we can sideload app's (something like a jailbreak)I am really interested how fast Microsoft will release his first wp7 update to fix this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a suspicion MS wanted this hack out there. MS has never been much of a locked down company, like Apple is. So I see something like this happening with their blessing.

ceesheim said:
now that we can sideload app's (something like a jailbreak)I am really interested how fast Microsoft will release his first wp7 update to fix this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They won't i think imo, Look at the Xbox, We get wave bans/Yearly updates even though they have teams following the forums for what's going on.
Jtags were aloud on-line for years until recently.
I'm just happy i have another device in C# so i can continue to make games and apps to make myself laugh.
MS thrive off hackers and modders imo telling them what's wrong and what people want without risking doing it themselves or overloading this first release scaring people off like the previous WM versions. it's all open source in a hackers mind, but the hacker can't sell the modified ROM can he , MS just release an update with more features*clever really*, where's the white line ? they just wait to see what's popular, same like FSD did for the xbox imo with all the media functionality.
*thats my 2pence *

The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios

adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here. I like what MS is trying to do with WP7 but I fear the worse because Balmer isn't resolved like Jobs is.
Actually I don't think it really matters because what the Market is loaded with right now is pure crap. If MS lets this continue, forget about this platform surviving.

WP7 is great, I just have technophilia lol

adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't worry WP7 won't die... ease of use/speed will not need to be sacrificed for outlook connectivity or some file access

Very true I mean the info. Is more secure on microsoft or Google server than it is on ur personal computer. Don't know why people are so scared of cloud based integration. It makes life a lot easier for people who dont wanna deal with syncing stuff on their own.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

MartyLK said:
Same here. I like what MS is trying to do with WP7 but I fear the worse because Balmer isn't resolved like Jobs is.
Actually I don't think it really matters because what the Market is loaded with right now is pure crap. If MS lets this continue, forget about this platform surviving.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The reason the market is so flooded with rss readers and flashlight apps is because that is about all that is currently possible with the current api.
Allow multi tasking, access to the compass, side loading of files into apps and a whole world of app opportunity opens up

AceofSpades25 said:
The reason the market is so flooded with rss readers and flashlight apps is because that is about all that is currently possible with the current api.
Allow multi tasking, access to the compass, side loading of files into apps and a whole world of app opportunity opens up
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't say "type" of app. I was talking about the quality of those apps and the devs who are crooks being allowed to post false and misleading apps.

mwako said:
They won't i think imo, Look at the Xbox, We get wave bans/Yearly updates even though they have teams following the forums for what's going on.
Jtags were aloud on-line for years until recently.
I'm just happy i have another device in C# so i can continue to make games and apps to make myself laugh.
MS thrive off hackers and modders imo telling them what's wrong and what people want without risking doing it themselves or overloading this first release scaring people off like the previous WM versions. it's all open source in a hackers mind, but the hacker can't sell the modified ROM can he , MS just release an update with more features*clever really*, where's the white line ? they just wait to see what's popular, same like FSD did for the xbox imo with all the media functionality.
*thats my 2pence *
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to clarify on the jtag thing, it was most definitly not years, more like weeks. When the first freeboot was released it was only a few weeks later which Microsoft made changes to ban anyone in a few hours after logging on live with a jtag. Sure you could use the king kong shader hack and run a bit of custom code long before freeboot but it was nothing amazing and you could not get online with the latest dash.
I think that Microsoft only really takes quick action when it poses a serious security threat, as with the jtag it allowed custom code and modified xex's to be run online whereas with just modded firmware you cannot, and modded firmware mostly just leads to piracy and a few cheaters with modded games. So as for WP7 at the moment I dont think that they will rush an update out just to patch up this hole.

Too much investment to let it die
adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi all
I don't think M$ will let WP7 die. They've invested too heavily in it to let it go. I am in the minority camp here but I think that a lot of average users quite like what is on offer. I've shown my HTC Mozart to a few people who haven't ever used a smartphone and they were all "Wow! What is that? It looks amazing!"
I think it will do OK.
Cheers
andrew-in-woking

MartyLK said:
I didn't say "type" of app. I was talking about the quality of those apps and the devs who are crooks being allowed to post false and misleading apps.
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it's the same for any app store. iTunes app store probably has the same proportion of good apps to bad as does windows phone, it's just iTunes has 100 times more apps.

andrew-in-woking said:
Hi all
I don't think M$ will let WP7 die. They've invested too heavily in it to let it go. I am in the minority camp here but I think that a lot of average users quite like what is on offer. I've shown my HTC Mozart to a few people who haven't ever used a smartphone and they were all "Wow! What is that? It looks amazing!"
I think it will do OK.
Cheers
andrew-in-woking
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i've shown my phone to a bunch of iPhone users and they like it's look and feel. i don't have them throwing their iPhones away, but they definitely see it as a good phone and perhaps when it comes to them renewing their contracts (most of them have 3GS), they might think twice about just getting "another iPhone".

Where the hell all the talk of WP7 dying come from weeks after it's launch lol...
The marketplace is riddled with people rushing to get an APP out there. Will be like anything else every few days or so when we see a good app coming out.
Yipes.

adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
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No the whole point of using Microsoft product is the way all their BUSINESS products offer tight and nice integration. I have no problems with cloud per say (I still don't trust them with security but that is just me I guess). Many people have invested heavily in Outlook and their work and life harmony depends of Outlook. Not giving them the ability to simply sync to Outlook is just pure lazyness. I am a software developer and I can see how they have taken simple route to eliminate sync issues.
You want ppl to use cloud contacts and calendar? Fine, ask Microsoft to first provide 50% of the available fields in Outlook! It's missing the most basic field such as Anniversary for a contact! The WP7 phone has that field but the Windows Live contact doesn't.

I doubt MS will rush to close this hole, if indeed, it's classed as a hole at all. Simple fact is, this sort of stuff is good for them, generally speaking. Particularly since they'll be able to block pirated apps from using live services, it deters piracy and promotes homebrew software to fill the gaps that would take them a lot of time and effort to fill. It's much more cost-effective to get a good base out there, and let the community pick up the slack and build on top of what they provide.
The fact is there are still other, much stronger protections that negate some of the traditional disadvantages a company may have with exploits of this kind. The protection that prevents people from porting WP7 to phones that have not had the licence paid for - means MS always gets their cash. The integration of the cloud also means they can detect pirated apps much more easily - for example, a Game accessing Xbox Live can have it's legitimacy checked server-side. Has that user purchased that game from the Marketplace? No? Deny them access. It adds a premium to staying genuine, and therefore, many will. That leaves the prime use for sideloading as homebrew, unverified software. Now, because it's unverified, they don't have to go to the trouble of supporting it, ensuring backwards compatibility as they move forward at a rapid pace, but yet their platform can still do *everything* it should be able to. And frankly, right now, MS know that profit is secondary to Market Share. A strong side-loading homebrew development scene can make serious inroads to the "open" environments that they are competing against, particularly Android.

The Gate Keeper said:
it's the same for any app store. iTunes app store probably has the same proportion of good apps to bad as does windows phone, it's just iTunes has 100 times more apps.
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Right now the WP7 app store is averaging 100%. The very first app I buy from this new store and it's false. That never happened with Android Market or iPhone App Store. But it is true, I need to give it time to get filled up. I'm just peeved at the bad del I got and the lack of a response from the money grabber.

MartyLK said:
Right now the WP7 app store is averaging 100%. The very first app I buy from this new store and it's false. That never happened with Android Market or iPhone App Store. But it is true, I need to give it time to get filled up. I'm just peeved at the bad del I got and the lack of a response from the money grabber.
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I thought all apps came with a trial period?

hounsell said:
I doubt MS will rush to close this hole, if indeed, it's classed as a hole at all. Simple fact is, this sort of stuff is good for them, generally speaking. Particularly since they'll be able to block pirated apps from using live services, it deters piracy and promotes homebrew software to fill the gaps that would take them a lot of time and effort to fill. It's much more cost-effective to get a good base out there, and let the community pick up the slack and build on top of what they provide.
The fact is there are still other, much stronger protections that negate some of the traditional disadvantages a company may have with exploits of this kind. The protection that prevents people from porting WP7 to phones that have not had the licence paid for - means MS always gets their cash. The integration of the cloud also means they can detect pirated apps much more easily - for example, a Game accessing Xbox Live can have it's legitimacy checked server-side. Has that user purchased that game from the Marketplace? No? Deny them access. It adds a premium to staying genuine, and therefore, many will. That leaves the prime use for sideloading as homebrew, unverified software. Now, because it's unverified, they don't have to go to the trouble of supporting it, ensuring backwards compatibility as they move forward at a rapid pace, but yet their platform can still do *everything* it should be able to. And frankly, right now, MS know that profit is secondary to Market Share. A strong side-loading homebrew development scene can make serious inroads to the "open" environments that they are competing against, particularly Android.
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Click to collapse
Totally agree with the above.

MiX2011(12-14.04)-Will There Be Any New"additions" to wp7 ANOTHER UPDATE BEFORE MANGO

MiX2011(12-14.04)-Will There Be Any New"additions" to wp7 ANOTHER UPDATE BEFORE MANGO
The MiX conference is just around the corner and i thought that it would be interesting to see what the users think, hope, want software vise.....
On the other hand, maybe a new handset will be revealed or the new minimum requirements...
With certainty new api's will be introduced...
My hope is for another update in june-july...

The things I would like to see in this order:
#1 Open up APIs that use address book which will open the door for whatsapp and skype.
#2 Bug fixes.
#3 An improved way of delivering updates.
#4 More new features.

I expect announcements of other upcoming features which have not yet been announced.
I fully expect some of the API's to be opened up to developers.
Maybe an announcement of a smaller update which will come out before Mango.
I don't expect any phone announcements, but maybe some Nokia teasers? That would be pretty cool.

nicksti said:
The things I would like to see in this order:
#1 Open up APIs that use address book which will open the door for whatsapp and skype.
#2 Bug fixes.
#3 An improved way of delivering updates.
#4 More new features.
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Click to collapse
I made a bit of a list myself. Well, it's kind of large: http://n8ter.wordpress.com
Skype is a bit meh for me.
There is more to gain by developing a good Windows Live Messenger integration with VoIP and Video Calling, in addition to Facebook Chat and Integrated Presence information in the People Hub. Add in Push Notifications, Group Chat, and File Transfer from the Office/Picture Hubs and it would be just perfect.
They need to add Tasks to Hotmail and add Task Synchronization to WP7's ActiveSync support.
The rest is in the link above. Don't want to bloat up the thread listing all my thoughts...
IE9 needs to be pushed out the minute it's done. Just upgrading IE would be considered a ridiculously big update to many users, and seriously... It would make tons of websites either usable, or much much easier to use.
A Basic RSS Reader integrated into the Platform (with configurable polling times and notifications on new items) would be nice. However, Windows Live allows you to subscribe to Blogs from there, so maybe that serves that purpose and you can just get this form people HUB.
They need to make Facebook Pushed, IMO. And add support for giving Push Notifications adn a counter on the People Hub tile when you get a new Direct Message/Facebook Message/Mention. Perhaps they can roll out Twitter support early.
I think it's pretty bad that they're holding back so much for one big update. I wonder how many people at Microsoft are actually closet iOS/Android users. They don't seem to be clued in much with the way they're iterating on the platform.

I expect nothing new so that I don't get disappointed again.

My wish list:
- ful Skydrive integration so all office documents can be synced
- Twitter integration in the people hub
- some way to allow zune streaming music and video not only to the XBox but to the WP7 devices as well

New apis like above said to make whatsapp available, youtube embedded vids working properly on all regions, bing maps merged with ovi so i can actually use maps, skydrive for office, taskswitcher and facebook im/private messages integerated in messaging app (a pivot next to sms would be cool) and people hub. Ill be a more than happy guy, will be all i need

Interesting if they will show anything we don't already know there.

Talks about NoDo and more Mango previews. Maybe a mention of some API, maybe, and that is all. Any bets?

N8ter said:
I made a bit of a list myself. Well, it's kind of large: http://n8ter.wordpress.com
There is more to gain by developing a good Windows Live Messenger integration with VoIP and Video Calling, in addition to Facebook Chat and Integrated Presence information in the People Hub. Add in Push Notifications, Group Chat, and File Transfer from the Office/Picture Hubs and it would be just perfect.
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Click to collapse
One of the few times we agree 100%. MSN Messenger by Miyowa is not good enough. If MSN Messenger was as feature-rich as you described I would buy a WP7 phone tomorrow.

If there are no new APIs I will be very surprised. And if there aren't, as much as I love my Omnia7, I'm picking up an Xperia Play the very next day. I can understand not having some functionality, but not providing APIs to developers is just plain stupid.
Sent from my OMNIA7 using Board Express

blade0rz said:
if there are no new apis i will be very surprised. And if there aren't, as much as i love my omnia7, i'm picking up an xperia play the very next day. I can understand not having some functionality, but not providing apis to developers is just plain stupid.
Sent from my omnia7 using board express
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+11111111111

Yep, the lack of functionality isn't what stinks. Developers can develop apps to fill those voids.
What stinks is the API blackholes in the platform. That pretty much makes this functionally is impossible to implement at the moment, and there is nothing you or any non-OEM/Microsoft developer can do about it.

You guys shouldn't really expect much in the way of new features. MIX is where the development platform was unveiled last year, I imagine any announcements will be centered around that.
I'm expecting a focus on IE9, hopefully some additional APIs like sockets (which they said has been the #1 request from developers).

vetvito said:
Talks about NoDo and more Mango previews. Maybe a mention of some API, maybe, and that is all. Any bets?
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I'll take the bet that you're 100% right. That's what they do with the 360, it's like "you won't want to miss our announcements" then they serve you the same old sh.. you already knew about.
Sent from my OMNIA7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

dkp1977 said:
My wish list:
- some way to allow zune streaming music and video not only to the XBox but to the WP7 devices as well
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Marketplace (or Zune > Marketplace) > Music > Find Music > Click on Album/Single > Click on Play icon next to album or single = Streaming music,

I mean streaming media that I have on my windows 7 PC.
Sent from my HD7 T9292 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

doministry said:
Interesting if they will show anything we don't already know there.
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Joe Belifore mentioned in a Channel 9 interview last week, that they will be revealing Mango features that they have not talked about before. Expect some major announcements. It was obvious that he was holding back some good stuff.

wheelerk said:
Joe Belifore mentioned in a Channel 9 interview last week, that they will be revealing Mango features that they have not talked about before. Expect some major announcements. It was obvious that he was holding back some good stuff.
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Don't, you're just setting yourself up for disappointment.
This year, MIX will highlight Microsoft’s commitment to web standards and HTML5, build on the excitement for IE9, and showcase the future of the Windows Phone developer ecosystem. Plus, we’ll unveil what’s new for developers in the next version of Windows Phone.
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If they announce new features, great I've learned to keep expectations in check when it comes to WP7 though.
Edit: There are 13 sessions on the platform updates. That should mean a good number of APIs are coming our way.

foxbat121 said:
I expect nothing new so that I don't get disappointed again.
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same here....lol

Windows Phone Marketplace App Milestones

Source
Fastest to 10,000 Apps - March 12th 2011
Fastest to 20,000 Apps - May 29th 2011
10,000 Apps in 2.5 months is rapid growth. I made a prediction that the Marketplace would have 50,000+ Apps by Q1 2012 and it seem like pocketnow now shares this thinking.
My prediction may be conservative. At this rate they could be at 70K by Q1.
Handsets - check.
Apps - check.
Features - (holds pen until fall 2011)

I think you may be underestimating the growth that will come with the release of Mango. The wealth of new APIs in the Mango SDK will spur development of a whole new generation of apps (some great, many not-so-good ). My prediction is that there will be 100,000 apps in the Marketplace by Christmas.

Agree. Mango is going to open up the possibility for a whole host of apps. I'm really excited to see the exciting new apps that will start releasing with mango.

The only problem: where is the useful apps?
Evernote?
IM +?
Kik?
Dropbox?
I still miss many apps from my iPhone.

mikeeam said:
The only problem: where is the useful apps?
Evernote?
IM +?
Kik?
Dropbox?
I still miss many apps from my iPhone.
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Click to collapse
Evernote -> fasternote (I'd still rather use OneNote)
Dropbox -> boxfiles for dropbox, kickbox
So 2 of your 4 mentioned points have been solved a long time ago already. Don't know what makes IM+ so special, but as far as I know it's under development. Kik? Never heard about that, sorry.

dkp1977 said:
Evernote -> fasternote (I'd still rather use OneNote)
Dropbox -> boxfiles for dropbox, kickbox
So 2 of your 4 mentioned points have been solved a long time ago already. Don't know what makes IM+ so special, but as far as I know it's under development. Kik? Never heard about that, sorry.
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Well, thanks. Didn't know about fasternote. Downloading.
But I want the official app. I can't buy Kickbox cause my country isn't supported yet.
IM will be the first good multiprotocol app. Flory is good, but still miss lot of features. And is buggy ;/
Still, it really needs some official apps.

Yeah, thanks to the spammers the marketplace is growing fast... Is that really a good thing? How many of those Real Estate apps have been released in the past week?
I can see the answer coming "it was like that with iOS and Android" and I would argue that because it happened there it should have been prevented on WP7.

mikeeam said:
Well, thanks. Didn't know about fasternote. Downloading.
But I want the official app. I can't buy Kickbox cause my country isn't supported yet.
IM will be the first good multiprotocol app. Flory is good, but still miss lot of features. And is buggy ;/
Still, it really needs some official apps.
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That will be at least partly resolved with mango. Not only because of the then built in Live Messenger and Facebook support, but also because of the 1500 additional APIs. I'm quite convinced we'll see official ICQ and even several multimessengers that are currently available on other platforms for WP7 as well.
If you can't purchase kickbox, go for boxfiles (which I prefer over kickbox anyways). It has a free version that works perfectly.
Sure, there are loads of "official" apps still missing, but like I already said, most of them are supposed to come some time after mango was released.

Peew971 said:
Yeah, thanks to the spammers the marketplace is growing fast... Is that really a good thing? How many of those Real Estate apps have been released in the past week?
I can see the answer coming "it was like that with iOS and Android" and I would argue that because it happened there it should have been prevented on WP7.
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Click to collapse
It was and still is that way with iOS and Android. I'm not sure I see your point. When people tout the number of apps on those platforms, they are including all of the useless and duplicate apps, but for some reason WP7 shouldn't?

mikeeam said:
The only problem: where is the useful apps?
Evernote?
IM +?
Kik?
Dropbox?
I still miss many apps from my iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
they're releasing kik sometime in june, at least that's what their support said on twitter. But i thought KIK needed mango to work doesn't it?

Nop. Whatsapp needs it

IM+ said they were in beta on a WP7 app.
KiK is working directly with MS to do KiK for WP7.
I do not know why MS chose KiK. No BB support and legal issues sitting over their heads. Whatsapp I would bet is more popular.
But Apps are coming. We know they are missing now.