Develop Bugs

Windows Mobile - I officially am fed up with it

I am over all of the things it CAN do.
All of it's stupid retarded quirks, bugs, and glitches have worn me thin in the patience department for this stupid phone.
The final straw that broke the camels back:
Now for absolutely NO reason on every reboot the WiFi is switched on. Yet it doesn't do anything. The WiFi light blinks and the icon appears but that is it. After around 3 minutes of the phone being on, it switches off by itself.
I have NEVER had this problem before and I haven't changed ANYTHING on my phone for a solid few months.
This is the type of **** I'm talking about. Windows Mobile just breaks itself for no friggin reason other than it is poorly written.
If they had a "Trade your Windows Mobile device for an iPhone" promotion, I would be the first damn person in line.
I am over Windows Mobile and Microsoft in general.
</rant>

You are not Alone
GldRush98 said:
I am over all of the things it CAN do.
All of it's stupid retarded quirks, bugs, and glitches have worn me thin in the patience department for this stupid phone.
The final straw that broke the camels back:
Now for absolutely NO reason on every reboot the WiFi is switched on. Yet it doesn't do anything. The WiFi light blinks and the icon appears but that is it. After around 3 minutes of the phone being on, it switches off by itself.
I have NEVER had this problem before and I haven't changed ANYTHING on my phone for a solid few months.
This is the type of **** I'm talking about. Windows Mobile just breaks itself for no friggin reason other than it is poorly written.
If they had a "Trade your Windows Mobile device for an iPhone" promotion, I would be the first damn person in line.
I am over Windows Mobile and Microsoft in general.
</rant>
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been looking into getting a blackberry probably a curve. as long as I can find a device that let me ssh and telnet into the servers I support I'm good.
I have gotten over all the things you can do with it...I actually did a hardreset and really do not have plans on putting too many custom apps onit ...I just want the device to work as intended...the hell with the pizazz

try a symbian based phone. i use one as my second phone. i never reflashed it just works all the time.
Chris

I believe the 3G iPhone is coming out this year. They need one like the touch slide or something. I text too much to consider the iPhone's keyboard.

LOL @ Symbian based phone... A few of us have tried it with "smart" phones - I, for example, tried it with a Nokia E61. All I can say is - good luck... The software you can get for the symbian pretty much all sucks and looks like it was written for Windows 3.1 (and as a software developer I know why - the way software is written for Symbian OS couldn't possibly be more quirky); the menu system looks and feels like win 3.1, and the OS itself has EVERY BIT as many quirks. Oh - and outlook push? Good luck - they'll say it can do it - have fun with that (haha). Blackberry push? Same there. Office documents? Sure - open them... Have fun editing and then trying to re-open desktop side. The *only* thing symbian does better, in my opinion, is allow syncing with more than one PC - but since I have outlook push to my 8525, that's not an issue for me anyway
I tried and tried to love my symbian. In the end, I unloaded that turd for less than $100 US on eBay and bought my 8525 - which SMOKES the symbian based E61.
Thats my 2.5 cents worth -

mybikegoes200 said:
LOL @ Symbian based phone... A few of us have tried it with "smart" phones - I, for example, tried it with a Nokia E61. All I can say is - good luck... The software you can get for the symbian pretty much all sucks and looks like it was written for Windows 3.1 (and as a software developer I know why - the way software is written for Symbian OS couldn't possibly be more quirky); the menu system looks and feels like win 3.1, and the OS itself has EVERY BIT as many quirks. Oh - and outlook push? Good luck - they'll say it can do it - have fun with that (haha). Blackberry push? Same there. Office documents? Sure - open them... Have fun editing and then trying to re-open desktop side. The *only* thing symbian does better, in my opinion, is allow syncing with more than one PC - but since I have outlook push to my 8525, that's not an issue for me anyway
I tried and tried to love my symbian. In the end, I unloaded that turd for less than $100 US on eBay and bought my 8525 - which SMOKES the symbian based E61.
Thats my 2.5 cents worth -
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like I said it's a second phone (actually my wife's) it takes good pictures and can do more than the average phone. I actually like the camera better, when you click the button it actually takes the picture. MP3 ringtones actually work flawlessly from the sd card. I wish MS and HTC could get those 2 issues right. Otherwise, I really enjoy tweaking my phone and installing ton's of useless stuff to waste my time....LOL... I started with my MPX200 and after my backlight broke for the 10th time I grabbed the symbian phone, only to end up back with a MS based phone. MS is just too big to avoid. Could be better, but I still like the fact that I can customize till my heart is content....even with the bugs..keeps my adrenaline flowing....lol
Chris

Gotta agree.... symbian no way. Lived with it for ages on my SE P900 and it did rock but the support was garbage!
Moved on to the TyTN as a gamble and it was totally worth it.

Funny you guys mention that, I'm looking to get a Nokia E51 as my going out phone. I need something "smart" and small. Despite what you say, I love the navigation compared to Windows Mobile Smartphone (WM 6 Standard). You're telling me 5 different "more" pushes to get through settings? Screw that.

irockash said:
Funny you guys mention that, I'm looking to get a Nokia E51 as my going out phone. I need something "smart" and small. Despite what you say, I love the navigation compared to Windows Mobile Smartphone (WM 6 Standard). You're telling me 5 different "more" pushes to get through settings? Screw that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quick question...what do you expect from a forum dedicated to WM devices??

mrvanx said:
Quick question...what do you expect from a forum dedicated to WM devices??
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Click to collapse
=) There are different followings. I love Windows Mobile... as long as it has a touch screen. I've played with many of the WM Standard (and by standard, I mean non-touchscreen devices) devices released in the states, and they all seem cumbersome as hell. Recently played with a Blackjack II and it had literally 7 pages in settings. In my opinion, Symbian (S60) and BlackBerry have the non touchscreen OS market on lock. Whats the point of functionality if it takes too long to find it?

irockash I just bought an E51. It is one of the best and most capable phones I have ever had - for it's size especially. I am originally a Symbian fan, but once I was introduced to Windows Mobile 2 and a half years ago I bought little else but HTCs. I have to say, that every once in a while I go back to Symbian for a try - namely the latest Nokias - N82, E51 etc, and they are really trouble-free compared to WM. They don't freeze up, they work flawlessly, and generally run faster than MW phones. Unfortunately there's no Skype for Symbian - you have to use 3rd party apps like Fring, and they work alright. I have to say however that at the end of the day I would have to choose WM over Symbian if I want to have a SERIOUS phone with loads of functionality - the Nokias like the N82 are super because of the 5mega-pixel camera and very good video recording, but give me my WM anyday - and I mean HTC ONLY! I guess each of us has our preferences.

I have both a symbian (SE W950i) and wm phone (hermes)...
Simply put, Symbian is no where near WM as far as customization, flexibility, and support is concerned. Symbian is just too plain and bland, and the W950i freezes way more than my hermes, not to mention that occasionally I can't even pick up phone calls. What's worse....I cannot do anything about since I can't mess with the firmware.
OTOH, cooking WM is easy if you spend some time studying it. I can do almost whatever I want with it. Most "problems" people encounter has to deal with the Rom's stability + application installed.

I would never go back since using my WM touch screen phones. My wife can't figure it out though. Her 6682 runs without reboot though for about 2 weeks when the battery dies...lol. Then I find it in the car and charge it so I can call her sometimes....lol. It's simpler for her to use, but it's not near as capable as my phone. It's better than the free phones most people typically have. So if I was techno dyslexic I would go for the symbian phones.
MS squashed the competition and will keep it that way. Even the IPhone 2 is promising, but MS will squash them too. Thanks to Apple for reving up the competition though! (Bill Gates owns half of them anyway)
So if I had to give up WM, I'd be bored for awhile........ I would suggest loading a good reliable rom & don't load anything else. yeah right....

Agreed! Well said! I had an N82 for 3 days - I mean the camera IS on par with a DEDICATED digital camera - even for night photos - but the functionality and flexibility of WM phones are UNBELIEVABLE and that's what I'd go for if I had to choose only ONE of the two OSs and have it for the rest of my life. Regardless of the little idiosyncracies - Windows Mobile ROCKS!

Also, as a serious audiophile, I really really urge that people think TWICE, or TRICE, before jumping on WALKMAN phone. I bought the w950i as I only paid a little over $200 for it new, and it has 4gb built-in. I'd expected the sound quality to be at least as good as some MP3 players....boy was I wrong..my Hermes + SRS WOW with Stock earbuds beat the crap out of the walkmanphone with whatever EQ on it, even if I amped the phone and use it along with my Sennheiser HD600, there's still no match at all. I immediately felt stupid for buying that phone. Fortunately, the phone was for my GF so it didn't bother me too much and she didn't seem to care too much about Sound Quality, convenience was all that matters to her. As for me, WM, hands down. I wouldn't mind playing with an iphone after it gets matured. ATM, there's just so many things that's lacking on it...undeniably, the UI is great...Apple's always good with UI and design..a very innovative company indeed. And TBH, I thought HTC's Apps played a great deal of a role in keeping the competition up. If WM looks like WM5/Stock WM6....I wouldn't be surprised that WM would slowly get crushed by Apple in the future.

I will probably jump ship to when an 3G Iphone is available and I see that you can actually install 3d party apps on it.
I did however see the new Samsung I780 and it looks very nice, small formfactgor, localised proper keyboard, 3G, Wifi, bt, GPS and touchpad like on a notebook to control stuff..

I've been a WM user for a long time. I used to lurk on the forums waiting for all of the new roms waiting to install them all. I also used to try out EVERY new 3rd party app that hit the market. I've been a long time member here, in fact my registration here is the longest standing for any website I'm actually active on.
It pains me to leave it all though. I'm buying an iPhone in the next couple of weeks. When it first came out, I still had my "Well who cares, I've got my good old HTC" mindset but have seen it perform better for the purposes I have reduced to using my phone for.
I want to be clear on what those purposes are, I listen to alot of podcasts and audio books. I also do alot of email and text messaging. Thats pretty much it. I don't need a great camera or fast Internet. with that said, the iPhone handles the audio that has become such a big part of my phone usage over the past year better than any WM device ever built.
How can you go wrong with a 160dpi 3.5" multi-touch screen anyways?

ljinsane said:
I've been looking into getting a blackberry probably a curve. as long as I can find a device that let me ssh and telnet into the servers I support I'm good.
I have gotten over all the things you can do with it...I actually did a hardreset and really do not have plans on putting too many custom apps onit ...I just want the device to work as intended...the hell with the pizazz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My girlfriend got a blackberry curve a few months ago and I am amazed by how FAST and how WELL it works. Makes me jealous I'm stuck with this bloated troll known as Windows Mobile.

I definetly sympathize with you on this topic - many of times lately I've scoured the AT&T website debating to get a phone that I CAN'T flash 30 frigging times a day - just so I can lead a normal life again.
I think it boils down to what you want it to do. I like to have the flexibility to shape it any and every way I can, and try to find a way around something that doesn't work well. Some people prefer simple and reliable.
'Tis a rough blade edge to manuver, but here we dance on it every day

mattk_r said:
I definetly sympathize with you on this topic - many of times lately I've scoured the AT&T website debating to get a phone that I CAN'T flash 30 frigging times a day - just so I can lead a normal life again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I live in Japan, home of some really slick phones that never make it to Europe or the states. Most people look at my Tytn and say things like, "its so clunky!" and "what?! it doesn't have a TV tuner?!"
But recently I sent my Tytn away for servicing (HTC refused me by the way, caught me out with a different bootloader) and it was away for a week. They gave me one of those slick phones as a replacement and I totally went into withdrawal. It felt like when I was quitting smoking and the replacement phone was like that nicorette gum - necessary and yet sooo unsatisfying. For me Matt, there is no more "normal life" to go back to.
Iphone is really, really nice. But in the end it is going to be just like Mac computers. With WM and with Windows, I can do what I want, how I want, when I want (and usually for free). Iphone and OSX trade these freedoms for a smoother, cleaner and more stable system. It is a fair trade-off and may fit some people's needs, but I'll take the former any day.

So, not to miss out on the Windows Phone 7 bashing...

I went to the AT&T store last night for two reasons: 1. To play with WP7 on a live device so I could reject it with authority; and 2. to resign myself to replacing my iPhone 3G with an iPhone 4 and a package of prayers for an unbroken back.
What I found surprised me. Now mind you, I'd played with the emulator so I knew the basics of how the OS operated, but man...in person on a real device is a whole other ballgame. I was so surprised at how fast, responsive and intuitive the device was that I began to think I might actually buy one. "But the app store sucks, I hear!" so I took a look--and discovered that all but ONE of the apps I use on my iPhone were already there (minus a couple of specific games titles like awesome solitaire, but meh, it's solitaire, who effing cares?).
So I bought the phone. Today I found via techbargains.com that AT&T is offering $75 off any smartphone, with free activation (iPhone excluded,) so I called and got them to apply that, crediting me $93. Effectively I bought a new focus for $125, which seemed pretty damn good to me.
So far, I really think the device is fantastic, and side by side with iOS...it really makes Apple's mobile OS seem rather antiquated.
So basically that's it: I've switched back to Windows Mobile, and I'm not looking back

kudos for the actually going to the store to play before making a judgment and double kudos for buying one over an iphone 4. Did you get the Focus or the Surround?

I hear that the focus is a really great phone.

Aturayd said:
kudos for the actually going to the store to play before making a judgment and double kudos for buying one over an iphone 4. Did you get the Focus or the Surround?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got the focus, as I wanted the larger screen. Plus, truly, I wasn't impressed with the surround's speakers enough to warrant the extra bulk . I'd read that the focus "felt cheap," but to me it seems solidly built--just not heavy. But frankly, I like that--the device is incredibly comfortable to hold and operate.
I'm sure everyone here already knew about this, but I just found out about an hour ago: Voice command. It works REALLY well. I'm a Systems Engineer by trade, and my coworkers are all geeking out at the new phone. I think it may have caused spontaneous nerdgasms in half a dozen people so far today, LOL.

What is the battery life like... is it better than say a hd2? Will it go 2 days without charge?
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App

b_u_d said:
What is the battery life like... is it better than say a hd2? Will it go 2 days without charge?
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haven't had it long enough to comment intelligently on the battery life . I can tell you that with HEAVY usage today (read: 6 guys passing the thing around, loading apps, web surfing, downloading apps, trying out Xbox Live games, etc) it got down to 30% battery life as of 4:00PM; it's been off the charger since 7AM, and being played with extensively from 10AM onward. I've downloaded over 1GB worth of stuff just this afternoon.

Note, the battery life will get longer after a few charge/discharge cycles (and when its not played with as much)
I'm not sure how different the Omnia 7 is in hardware specs, but during a 'work day (8 hours)' i dropped to 3/4.
I have had it for a week, so I'm still fiddling often, but not as much.
My friend got his Omnia 7 2 days ago. yesterday he had the battery at critical over the same time period (so it does improve)

microhaxo said:
I hear that the focus is a really great phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So check this out. Met with a buddy of mine for lunch, and mostly spent the hour with him playing around with my focus. He runs a small consulting firm with about 30 techs, mostly on a mix of iPhones and Blackberries. I just got a call from him:
"Hey, loved your phone today. I just got in touch with my AT&T rep, confirmed I can get the $75 off promotion. I'm moving the whole company to Windows Phone 7 effective when we take delivery of the new phones next week. Thanks for letting me get my hands on it!"
I'm shocked, but not *too* shocked. Personally I'd still wait awhile before moving over my business entirely (mostly for the first update and maybe the app store to mature a little more,) but he's a tech genius, so if it's good enough for him, I see no reason to argue

mei_liberi_fatali said:
Note, the battery life will get longer after a few charge/discharge cycles (and when its not played with as much)
I'm not sure how different the Omnia 7 is in hardware specs, but during a 'work day (8 hours)' i dropped to 3/4.
I have had it for a week, so I'm still fiddling often, but not as much.
My friend got his Omnia 7 2 days ago. yesterday he had the battery at critical over the same time period (so it does improve)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to hear, thanks . I'm now on the prowl for a decent class 6 32GB MicroSD for the sucker. I've never used more than 8 (even when I had a 16GB iPhone) but I think with the Xbox Live games, I'm likely going to!

Probably it is a good idea to wait a bit for WP7 certified memory cards. Microsoft says it is not all about the speed class.

b_u_d said:
What is the battery life like... is it better than say a hd2? Will it go 2 days without charge?
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
why do you need to go two days without charging your phone? You do have electricity don't you?

Also nice to see the WP7 app count now over 2000+.

nrfitchett4 said:
why do you need to go two days without charging your phone? You do have electricity don't you?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea i've never understood the 2 day thing
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

jasongw said:
I've switched back to Windows Mobile
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Buying a Windows Phone 7 is *not* switching to "Windows Mobile."
WP != WM
But it's all good -- glad you're liking the phone! I like my HD7 too.

jasongw said:
I went to the AT&T store last night for two reasons: 1. To play with WP7 on a live device so I could reject it with authority; and 2. to resign myself to replacing my iPhone 3G with an iPhone 4 and a package of prayers for an unbroken back.
What I found surprised me. Now mind you, I'd played with the emulator so I knew the basics of how the OS operated, but man...in person on a real device is a whole other ballgame. I was so surprised at how fast, responsive and intuitive the device was that I began to think I might actually buy one. "But the app store sucks, I hear!" so I took a look--and discovered that all but ONE of the apps I use on my iPhone were already there (minus a couple of specific games titles like awesome solitaire, but meh, it's solitaire, who effing cares?).
So I bought the phone. Today I found via techbargains.com that AT&T is offering $75 off any smartphone, with free activation (iPhone excluded,) so I called and got them to apply that, crediting me $93. Effectively I bought a new focus for $125, which seemed pretty damn good to me.
So far, I really think the device is fantastic, and side by side with iOS...it really makes Apple's mobile OS seem rather antiquated.
So basically that's it: I've switched back to Windows Mobile, and I'm not looking back
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's my sentiments too. That's why I made a thread about WP7 (on the HD7) being like a high-end Lexus or Infiniti...very, very sophisticated and elegant.
jasongw said:
Got the focus, as I wanted the larger screen. Plus, truly, I wasn't impressed with the surround's speakers enough to warrant the extra bulk . I'd read that the focus "felt cheap," but to me it seems solidly built--just not heavy. But frankly, I like that--the device is incredibly comfortable to hold and operate.
I'm sure everyone here already knew about this, but I just found out about an hour ago: Voice command. It works REALLY well. I'm a Systems Engineer by trade, and my coworkers are all geeking out at the new phone. I think it may have caused spontaneous nerdgasms in half a dozen people so far today, LOL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahahaha...they must have been very sticky by day's end.
jasongw said:
Haven't had it long enough to comment intelligently on the battery life . I can tell you that with HEAVY usage today (read: 6 guys passing the thing around, loading apps, web surfing, downloading apps, trying out Xbox Live games, etc) it got down to 30% battery life as of 4:00PM; it's been off the charger since 7AM, and being played with extensively from 10AM onward. I've downloaded over 1GB worth of stuff just this afternoon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I turned off the GPS, like I do on my HD2 (using WM or Android) and it makes a significant difference in BL.
jasongw said:
Good to hear, thanks . I'm now on the prowl for a decent class 6 32GB MicroSD for the sucker. I've never used more than 8 (even when I had a 16GB iPhone) but I think with the Xbox Live games, I'm likely going to!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope you are aware that changing the MicroSD card will wipe the system. You basically are doing a hard reset to upgrade to a larger card.

MartyLK said:
That's my sentiments too. That's why I made a thread about WP7 (on the HD7) being like a high-end Lexus or Infiniti...very, very sophisticated and elegant.
Hahahaha...they must have been very sticky by day's end.
I turned off the GPS, like I do on my HD2 (using WM or Android) and it makes a significant difference in BL.
I hope you are aware that changing the MicroSD card will wipe the system. You basically are doing a hard reset to upgrade to a larger card.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And the card isnt guaranteed to work. I personally wouldnt risk it.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

buying the phone on att website is only 100.00 before tax, free overnight shipping.

This is a great thread. I agree with the original poster - the Focus is a fantastic phone. Once you start to actually use WP7, and get a feel for the UI and how it operates, it's like a whole new world, and the iOS/Android icon grid system seems archaic in comparison.
I also agree that at this early stage, I can still find a relevant app for almost everything I have previously needed on Android.
Really liking WP7 overall. I think if people give it a chance and start to use it, they will see the difference as well.

Arg, the Dell Venue Pro is becoming more tempting with each day. Damn you for this thread, my better half is going to leave me if I drop another $500 on an unnecessary toy

f1restarter said:
Also nice to see the WP7 app count now over 2000+.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where do you find that info? I have noticed that on each of the two days I've now had the phone, new apps have appeared. So far I'm only missing really two apps from iPhone: a turn by turn GPS and Wordpress. I'm sure both will be along before long

finally got wp7.....wow..

Wow is all I can say...I bought the focus and the UI blew me away as soon as I turned it on, I bought the focus. I have used all the mobile OS and this by far is the most sleek, easy to use, and just plain nice of all, I don't miss c&p bug I do miss multitasking in apps like last.fm, I can still send it back and get something else, but what's better then this? I'm typing this from wp7 now and man this keyboard is awesome, the level of little details they put into wp7 is crazy, gotta say I'm really impressed here, I'm sticking with this for a while to see where this goes, hopefully MS stays true to their word and keeps on supporting with updates, as for apps, I've come to realize that I don't need a million apps, I only use like 20 anyway, but it seems to be growing fast anyway. All in all super impressed with wp7,9/10 from me and if this keeps getting better, I don't see myself going back to anything else.

Yea I played with the Focus today at the AT&T(worst wireless carrier in the universe) store and I love the UI and how smooth the OS is. I'm currently on Evo 4G, but I'm considering WP7 once it comes to Sprint. I previously had the iPhone 3GS and WP7 user experience is very comparable with iOS. While I like Android the lack of GPU acceleration is a huge issue, until that's implemented the user experience will never compare to iOS and WP7. I'm holding out for the January update to see if MS adds free turn by turn navigation, better landscape support(what idiot decided that you can't input a URL in landscape mode?), flash and copy and paste.

Is there a list of wp7 problems or missing features? Cause it seems like I'm missing very little atm.

solidkevin said:
Is there a list of wp7 problems or missing features? Cause it seems like I'm missing very little atm.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=814075
first pinned thread.
though i'm happy with my phone.

Believe it Or not I am very tempted to get an n8 as well, saw it in person and wow, what excellent hardware!! And it does all those little things like mass storage etc. Anyone here have an n8?

N8, looks great. But lacks balls and has a very crappy OS. Know of two friends whom have returned them. Due to bad reception and a buggy slow OS playing up..
Go Android or if you must iPh or W7 if you want all that exchange compatibility with MS apps etc at work.
That's where it is at...
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

solidkevin: The windows phone might have some small problems but that nothing compared to the N8. I only hear bad stories from people that have that phone.

KMino said:
N8, looks great. But lacks balls and has a very crappy OS. Know of two friends whom have returned them. Due to bad reception and a buggy slow OS playing up..
Go Android or if you must iPh or W7 if you want all that exchange compatibility with MS apps etc at work.
That's where it is at...
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Symbian has way better Exchange functionality than Windows Phone 7. WP7 may not be thoroughly suitable for serious business use until Q3/Q4 2011. It's not the device/OS to get if you want great Exchange support. An HD2 or Blackberry Torch would be optimal for business use (assuming you like Touchscreens, otherwise a Bold would do).
There is no comparison between WM6.5/Symbian and WP7 when it comes to Exchange support. WP7's support is actually kind of embarassing considering it comes from Microsoft, TBQH. It's better than Android at least, and maybe on par with iOS, or perhaps a little worse than Apple, even - at the moment, at least.
Yes, the N8 isn't the best device, but it works well. Nokia will be patching Symbian the same way MS will be patching WP7. If you can deal with Windows Phone 7 and its functionality gaps, etc. then I don't see why anyone can simply discount an N8 when it's not out of the realm of possibility that it too can/will benefit from updates from Nokia.
Symbian also supports the ActiveSync Protocol, more Media formats, more DRM formats (including Windows Media DRM for syncing ZunePass subscription content to the phone).
The worse thing about Symbian is the user interface and the Screen Resolution of their touchscreen phones (what an odd choice of resolution, IMO).
I'm not even gonna continue. I've gotten my point across by now, hopefully.
The Samsung Focus is available for 79 bucks on contract at the local Wal-Mart here. The 8GB storage is a showstopper, though. I'm not playing SD Roulette with a phone. 16GB is the bare minimum I can put up with. The build quality isn't all that great. The back cover pulls off like a cheap hooker's bra.
TBQH, the only WP7 device I feel is worth buying is the Dell Venue Pro. Fortunately it's on T-Mobile and I get Corporate Discounts from Dell, so I'm sort of thinking about it. It's a shame the HD7 has such terrible build quality with such a bad LCD on it... Thoroughly pissed me off...
But I'm going to wait until CES. Maybe an Android device from a decent manufacturer will come out and I will stick it out here.
Judging from what Microsoft is saying, it's gonna take them a year to really get WP7 functionality up to par and judging form my experience with this phone... I simply don't have the patience for that...
I also want to see if RIM will come out with a decent Touchscreen phone soon with a more refined/better OS on it, as well. We'll see at CES. I'm holding off all purchases until then.

Well while I AM enjoying the focus at the moment, I am waiting for CES as well, I want to see what everyone offers as far as Android and Hopefully Nokia shows what it plans to do with Symbian because if it gets a revamp, I may have to get the N8, I will have a lot of money to spend, because I sold the extra focus I had (buy one get one free ATT), so If I want something else I can sell this one as well. But yea hopefully theres some interesting things at CES, really just Android and Symbian are what interest me though.

solidkevin said:
Well while I AM enjoying the focus at the moment, I am waiting for CES as well, I want to see what everyone offers as far as Android and Hopefully Nokia shows what it plans to do with Symbian because if it gets a revamp, I may have to get the N8, I will have a lot of money to spend, because I sold the extra focus I had (buy one get one free ATT), so If I want something else I can sell this one as well. But yea hopefully theres some interesting things at CES, really just Android and Symbian are what interest me though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Isn't it just Nokia now who are actively developing Symbian?

Symbian will be ditched to midend and Meego or however it's called will be used as highend platform. Known for months.
Symbian development is over for me. Nokia has a reeeaally hard time to give really competitive hardwarwe. I would forget it.
And yes, only Nokia does Symbian. All of the rest kicked it out, significant move.

N8ter said:
Symbian has way better Exchange functionality than Windows Phone 7. WP7 may not be thoroughly suitable for serious business use until Q3/Q4 2011. It's not the device/OS to get if you want great Exchange support. An HD2 or Blackberry Torch would be optimal for business use (assuming you like Touchscreens, otherwise a Bold would do).
There is no comparison between WM6.5/Symbian and WP7 when it comes to Exchange support. WP7's support is actually kind of embarassing considering it comes from Microsoft, TBQH. It's better than Android at least, and maybe on par with iOS, or perhaps a little worse than Apple, even - at the moment, at least.
Yes, the N8 isn't the best device, but it works well. Nokia will be patching Symbian the same way MS will be patching WP7. If you can deal with Windows Phone 7 and its functionality gaps, etc. then I don't see why anyone can simply discount an N8 when it's not out of the realm of possibility that it too can/will benefit from updates from Nokia.
Symbian also supports the ActiveSync Protocol, more Media formats, more DRM formats (including Windows Media DRM for syncing ZunePass subscription content to the phone).
The worse thing about Symbian is the user interface and the Screen Resolution of their touchscreen phones (what an odd choice of resolution, IMO).
I'm not even gonna continue. I've gotten my point across by now, hopefully.
The Samsung Focus is available for 79 bucks on contract at the local Wal-Mart here. The 8GB storage is a showstopper, though. I'm not playing SD Roulette with a phone. 16GB is the bare minimum I can put up with. The build quality isn't all that great. The back cover pulls off like a cheap hooker's bra.
TBQH, the only WP7 device I feel is worth buying is the Dell Venue Pro. Fortunately it's on T-Mobile and I get Corporate Discounts from Dell, so I'm sort of thinking about it. It's a shame the HD7 has such terrible build quality with such a bad LCD on it... Thoroughly pissed me off...
But I'm going to wait until CES. Maybe an Android device from a decent manufacturer will come out and I will stick it out here.
Judging from what Microsoft is saying, it's gonna take them a year to really get WP7 functionality up to par and judging form my experience with this phone... I simply don't have the patience for that...
I also want to see if RIM will come out with a decent Touchscreen phone soon with a more refined/better OS on it, as well. We'll see at CES. I'm holding off all purchases until then.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good post. You made some valid points, but I got the impression that you believe MS dropped the ball with WP7, and I don't believe that to be a true..or even fair assessment.
It is the nature of version 1.0 of just about anything to be incomplete..to be a work in progress. In regards to smart phone OS's, its always been that way. iOS v1.0 was very limited, as was Android 1.0, and so on so forth. I was an early adopter of both platforms and was at times frustrated by the limitations. But, as an early adopter I understood that this was the way it usually is, and that things would gradually flesh out.
For me, iOS never did "flesh out" enough. I've always loved the smoothness and general quality of iOS and the iPhone, but I found myself bored by it. Android did grow and develop quickly enough to keep me engaged, and I still enjoy the control I have when using Android...and also enjoy that the relatively open nature of it allows be to constantly tinker with my device. But, even though I usually enjoy doing so, the main reason I'm always tinkering with my Android devices is because I've never been satisfied with how they felt. I hate the apparently inherent choppiness and occasional lag of Android, and my main motivation for rooting my Android devices had always been to try to get rid that.
Somewhere between those 2 extremes lies WP7. Yes, in some regards it is limited. But, I can accept this for now because, as I mentioned earlier it is v1.0 and I know these limitations are being worked on as we speak. Many people are refusing to accept that, though...and it seems that you're one of them.
The gist of the argument seems to be that MS came late to the party, so they had already known what the dress code was, and shouldve showed up fully decked out. That they shouldn't have released v1.0 until it matched its contemporaries feature for feature. I disagree with this. I think MS was right in getting a v1.0 that provided the basic user experience that they were aiming for out there as soon as was possible. Did this strategy suddenly propel WP7 to the top of the smart phone world? No, not even close. But it has managed to grab just about everyone's attention...and has solidified it's position as a viable player. I believe that is all MS wanted to accomplish by rushing to release v1.0 just before the holiday season...and I also believe that it was better for them to do so than for them to sit out until after the holidays.
I am convinced that WP7 v1.0 is the best 1.0 smart phone OS released to date. I think that MS got the basics incredibly right...and that the limitations are going to begin to be addressed very soon. Yes, MS was late to the party, but they've shown up with more style than anyone else, if not with as much substance...and they are moving much faster than both Google and Apple did to provide said substance. WP7 is a joy to interact with. It is beautiful. It's fun. So much so, that despite the current limitations, I choose to use my HD7 as my daily driver...and to leave my Android phones at home.
WP7 is in many ways very good right now, and it has an extremely bright future. I can understand that some of you don't have the patience to wait for WP7 to catch up in the few areas that it's lacking in, but such patience is a prerequisite of being a happy early adopter. If you can't enjoy experiencing the growth process of a new platform, then maybe being an early adopter isn't for you. But, please people, don't make it seem like MS blew it in regards to WP7, because that couldn't be further from the truth.
Oh, one last thing. How in the world does the HD7 have horrible build quality?? Yes, as you tilt the phone away from the optimal viewing angle, the colors somewhat fade. It is not an AMOLED screen and the black levels pale in comparison..quite literally. But, when I use my phone, I tend to keep it within the optimal viewing angles...and within those parameters, the HD7's screen displays good and VERY natural colors..unlike the overwhelmingly oversaturated colors that my Galaxy S displays...and without any banding.
Also, I love the 4.3" screen. Those extra .3" make a real difference. Do I prefer the outrageously deep blacks and the incredibly effective viewing angles of the Super AMOLED screen? Yes, if course. But, I prefer my HD7's spacious, natural looking screen in every other way.
Outside of the screen though, I don't see how anyone can critize it's quality. I've owned MANY top of the line mobile devices, and none have felt better in the hand than the HD7. It looks good and feels good because HD7 uses high quality materials..unlike Samsung. People complain about the thinness of the back cover. It is just as thin..or thick, as the one on the Evo...and I don't see anyone criticizing it's quality. Despite being thin, it feels great when attached to the phone. The soft touch surface is great.
I'm also aware of the complaints about a relatively large gap between the removable and fixed portions if the back of the phone. I found this to be an optical illusion caused by the unfortunate location of the white sim card right where it's partially visible through the gap. But, I found an easy fix. I pulled my SIM card and colored the upper third of it with a black sharpie. Guess what...after that, the so called huge gap magically disappeared. The gap itself is no larger than on most phones. The location of the sim card was the problem. It looks great after taking a sharpie to it.

I can't reply to all the parts of that. Will take too long.
The build quality of the HD7 is terrible compared to the Dell Venue Pro. HTC was never known for having superior build quality. The HD2 was pretty good, though. Don't know why they paid so little attention to the HD7...
The HD7 has basically the same LCD panel from the Evo and/or HD2. It's not a good panel. It has bad color saturation and terrible viewing angles. It's also overly reflective. Size can only make up for so much, but you can get a Dell Venur Pro 16GB on contract for $50 less than an HD7 and the screen is only 0.2" smaller. The HD7 is a pretty bad phone by current standards. They used parts from last year to build a phone this year, and it's pretty apparent if you look at it next to other WP7 devices.
You can harp on the oversaturation in sAMOLED panels, but the fact and the matter is that it blows this crappy HD7 panel out of the water in almost any category. Viewing Angles, Brightness, Color Representation, etc. It's a bad screen. You can't make excuses for that... It almost looks foggy compared to an AMOLED panel (even something like the MyTouch 4G screen is obviously better).
Also, it has a smaller battery than some Blackberry Curve smartphones. 1150 mAh... Seriously? Anyone who uses their phone moderately will not be able to get good battery life out of that. It may be fine for YOU, at least now, especially with no third-party multi-tasking (this also makes WP7 perform artificially better compared to competing products - it only has to do one task at a time), but once that update comes and you're running 3-4 apps concurrently it will nosedize. All reviews has been pretty negative on the small battery in the phone.
The camera also isn't anything to rave about.
The materials used to build the phone are pretty dubious.
Build quality means the hardware build quality. It has nothing to do with the software.
Moving on to the software (WP7). Yes, they dropped the ball. They missed an opportunity to get a ton of frustrated Nokia and RIM users, as well as pick off more Android/iOS users when they decided to rush the OS out 6-12 months early with entire classes of functinality missing.
WP7 fails as a business phone right now, and Microsoft saying they're focusing on consumers is nothing short of an excuse. They said it will take almost a year to bake the business into the phone, so obviously that was in the roadmap. What they did was rush it out to try to save face while they "finished' the job. Coming from Android and Windows Mobile, some people are tired waiting on Manufacturers, etc. to "finish the job" while they sit there with a down syndrome phone saying "look how smooth it is, it's worth it!"
No HTML5 in the browser. No multi-tasking, C&P, embarassing Exchange Policy Support for a Microsoft OS, a user interface that in several areas looks like only 5 minutes was dedicated to design (Calendar, Dialer, etc.), lack of Flash (oand/r Silverlight), etc. Even blackberries have an HTML browser, now Not to mention WP7 didn't evne attempt to really exploit the enhancements made in Microsoft Exchange to convince business users to use it instead of RIM/Nokie/WM6.5 devices...
If you read my posts in this thread, you can clearly see that I'm not some Anti-WP7 fanboi.
But I think some people are making this OS to be way better than it actually is.
It really isn't revolutionary in any way, and falls on it face in many areas given what competing products can do and [rightfully] assuming competing products will improve as well.
The only thing that's really good about WP7 is the fact that it doubles up as a ZuneHD.
But a ZuneHD is cheaper than a whole smartphone and at this point in time it's almost worth buying an Andriod/iOS device and carrying a (much smaller) ZuneHD around than buying a WP7 device.
The hardware isn't all that good right now (will probably make a lot of "early adopters" mad at CES), and the manufacturers are paying little attention to what they're putting out.
If the Dell Venue Pro was in T-Mobile stores they would hardly sell any HD7s.

Sorry, gotta disagree about the dvp. It has already been recalled twice due to issues. How can you be confident that you will get 2 years out of it?
Coming from the hd2, the hd7 screen is fine. Maybe coming from a vibrant, its an issue, but I have seen more complaints about oversaturation and color banding of the focus screen then I have of the "washed out" look of the hd7.
I was a little worried about the back of the hd7, coming from the brushed aluminum back of the hd2, but since I'm not having to constantly pop the back to reset the phone, the back is no longer a worry and the texture is nice.
I've owned 4 HTC devices and overall the phones have been great. The best of them all (the hd2), is the only one that I had to replace due to failure. I consider that pretty good.
Maybe some early adopters will be frustrated by CES, but I doubt it. There haven't been many leaks of newer wp7 devices on the horizon. I think it might be fall before the next Gen wp7 devices hit, a full year after the hd7, which is about normal for new devices.
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express

I had an hd2 before this. I'm not blind and pretty much every review said the screen was pretty bad.
Dev has a warranty. Ill get enough time out of it until I get a mew device, if I get it. It a better phone than the hd7, in every imaginable way.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

N8er
So now after fighting with everybody and proving WP7 is the best,
you say it basically sucks?
Hard to believe.
And apparently you don't have WP7 device?

It's all well and good comparing feature lists, but really when you are talking about a smart mobile phone, it comes down to usability.
I put up with the quirks of WM5, 6.1 and 6.5 for a few years. While it did technically have a lot of features, it was slow and a pain in the ass to use. And if anyone not familiar with the phone used it they were immediately lost.
Now I'm using WP7 (HD7) since October and it just works. It's fast and everything is intuitive and makes sense. And oddly enough I am only very rarely missing some advanced features. For example, I thought I'd be crippled without tethering, but as it turns out I am using my laptop via tethering much less when I'm travelling because the mobile browser and mobile apps on WP7 are so much better than any previous mobile browsers I'd used, so I'm more likely to use it rather than just getting frustrated and dragging out the laptop to use the "proper" browser. The great WP7 keyboard has a lot to do with this.
And if I lend my phone to someone else so they can make a call or check their email or whatever, they can use it! WP7 passes the idiot test! I would actually get this phone for my father!
A few days ago I met a techy friend who's a nokia die-hard, he had just purchased the N8. We swapped phones for half an hour to test them out, and the look on his face afterwards was proof enough that MS is on to something. My initial impression of the N8 software was that Nokia hasn't changed their OS since 1999. There was an impressive list of features for sure, if you could find them, as the menu system and shortcuts confused the hell out of me. And fonts were tiny everywhere. Maybe I'm just spoiled by WP7 now, but the experience of using the N8 was dreadful.
TLDR; You can compare a list of features as much as you like to see which is best; but you have to experience it to appreciate it. And WP7 seems to have the edge in this regard at the moment, even above iOS and Android.

Focus
nrfitchett4 said:
Sorry, gotta disagree about the dvp. It has already been recalled twice due to issues. How can you be confident that you will get 2 years out of it?
Coming from the hd2, the hd7 screen is fine. Maybe coming from a vibrant, its an issue, but I have seen more complaints about oversaturation and color banding of the focus screen then I have of the "washed out" look of the hd7.
I was a little worried about the back of the hd7, coming from the brushed aluminum back of the hd2, but since I'm not having to constantly pop the back to reset the phone, the back is no longer a worry and the texture is nice.
I've owned 4 HTC devices and overall the phones have been great. The best of them all (the hd2), is the only one that I had to replace due to failure. I consider that pretty good.
Maybe some early adopters will be frustrated by CES, but I doubt it. There haven't been many leaks of newer wp7 devices on the horizon. I think it might be fall before the next Gen wp7 devices hit, a full year after the hd7, which is about normal for new devices.
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"over saturation and color banding", I have no idea what you are talking about. I have had the focus for a week now and the screen is amazing. I don't even use my laptop any longer, just IE on the Focus. I was an HTC advocate for years (8125, 8525, FUZE) and switched to the Focus after careful consideration and will never look back. I have heard these criticisms of the screen and quite frankly don't see any of it. Am I just lucky? I have been to three ATT stores and played with 3 different Focus's before buying and did not experience these screen issues.

N8ter said:
I had an hd2 before this. I'm not blind and pretty much every review said the screen was pretty bad.
Dev has a warranty. Ill get enough time out of it until I get a mew device, if I get it. It a better phone than the hd7, in every imaginable way.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the reviews I've read, had the screen as the "worst" of the wp7 phones, but due to bigger color range of wp7, the screen looked better than the hd2. Being the worst of the wp7 phones, is like saying the worst between a lcd, a plasma, and a dlp t.v. They are all perfectly acceptable, some people like lcd, some like plasma, I like dlp because it looks better for sports.
As far as the dvp begin better than the hd7, what are you basing this on? Hardly anyone has been able to get their hands on one. You can't go to a store and try it out since its only coming through dell and MS.
HD7 has a bigger screen, and more RAM.
Hell, even engadget can't get a review out because their demo units keep breaking...
We get it, you hate the hd7, but I don't think the dvp is any better.

JamesAllen said:
"over saturation and color banding", I have no idea what you are talking about. I have had the focus for a week now and the screen is amazing. I don't even use my laptop any longer, just IE on the Focus. I was an HTC advocate for years (8125, 8525, FUZE) and switched to the Focus after careful consideration and will never look back. I have heard these criticisms of the screen and quite frankly don't see any of it. Am I just lucky? I have been to three ATT stores and played with 3 different Focus's before buying and did not experience these screen issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.mobiletechworld.com/2010...nding-issue-microsoft-could-partially-fix-it/

Why does my phone get so unstable after awhile?

This has been going on for awhile now but it keeps getting worse and worse. My Tilt2 is extremely unstable. Usually after I flash it it will be fine for awhile, a couple of weeks maybe. After that it gets progressively more and more unstable. It gets less and less responsive, especially when waking, programs close without warning, I sometimes get graphical glitches. Hard locks are not uncommon. There have been days that I have had to soft reset my phone 3 or 4 times during the day.
Sense seems to be at least part of the culprit. Restarting it when things aren't responding seems to help sometimes. I sometimes have had some luck with deleting all of my text messages but that is only temporary at best.
I have been running Energy ROMs for the most part. Other ROMS I have tried have behaved similarly. XDAndroid is also abnormally unstable.
Could a bad SD card be causing the problems? I was trying to record a video with my phone a few days ago and it just suddenly stopped without warning. Trying to start the recording again resulted in it recording maybe a half second and then stopping again. Changing the storage to internal memory allowed recording normally. The camera app has also popped up a message about a new sd card being detected a couple of times recently.

May I add, that I have had enough with this phone. It's absolutely unreliable for any business worker who really needs a phone that can do simple tasks such as check emails, use bluetooth and of course, make a damn phone call - and it sucks at doing so.
I have flashed it with energy, and I must point out the dev has done a good job in appearance, other than that windows 6.1 - 6.5 is a TERRIBLE OS. I don't care what others have to say; if you can prove me wrong, then show a video that the phone is great.
I have numerous occasions where the phone just starts playing up. One huge annoyance is making calls. If someone calls you, who then later hangs up, the first thing you do is check who it is and then unlock the phone. But once you unlock it sometimes it doesn't allow you to press anything on the screen. You are then forced to reset the phone and wait for the boot screen and after that you are taken to the damn TIME REGION setting which takes an eternity to get to (like i already INPUT the place from before, why the hell must I remind the effin phone again?), afterwards even when you make a call, the call connects but you cannot hear ANYONE on the other line - thus you have to RESET the phone AGAIN!
Even once you are on a call, there are times that the phone decides to END IT. One may ask, "well your ear probably touched something" - great, nice to know my ear can act as a small stylus that SOMEHOW it can go slide all the way to the connectivity area and just by chance HIT the 'airplane' mode making the phone unavailable thus ending your call - this has co-incidentally happened to me already about 25 times!
I can keep going on, but check out my rant review on the got mine section here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=521271&page=173 - and read till the end.

While it has tons of nice eye candy, Energy is not the best in terms of speed and stability. Try a more lightweight ROM, like Jackos. Simplicity is also excellent, although it hasn't been updated in a while. Both of these ROMs are more lightweight, and manage memory better than Energy.

Got room for a "me too"? I've said it before. I don't know if the problem is HTC, Windows, or AT&T...or a combination of the three, but I have: Unreliable, painfully slow 3G; frequent dropped phone calls; Internet browser DNS failures; Wi-fi that seems to be just for show; and finally, a phone that is so slow to respond to any screen taps or button pushses that it tests my patience daily. Oh yes, I almost forgot, I have to reset the phone at least every other day and sometimes as often as twice in one day.
I still have ten months on my contract, and then it is goodbye to HTC, ATT, and Windows Mobile. I know you die hards here on the forum say iPhone is for kids and Windows is for business, but for my business, a working phone is what is important, and this ain't it!

redpoint73 said:
While it has tons of nice eye candy, Energy is not the best in terms of speed and stability. Try a more lightweight ROM, like Jackos. Simplicity is also excellent, although it hasn't been updated in a while. Both of these ROMs are more lightweight, and manage memory better than Energy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you must go Energy though, stick with the "Reference" builds. It does't have all the apps you never use on it, just the important ones. Runs much better on speed and battery life for me.

Although I will probably go with an android phone next contract cycle, windows mobile 7 (or whatever it's called) is actually quite nice.

slapshot30 said:
If you must go Energy though, stick with the "Reference" builds. It does't have all the apps you never use on it, just the important ones. Runs much better on speed and battery life for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep. I am using that. And I am still very annoyed with this phone.

dirty_johnny said:
Although I will probably go with an android phone next contract cycle, windows mobile 7 (or whatever it's called) is actually quite nice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, WM7 might indeed be nice. However, in spite of the typical Microsoft promises, there are still few apps for WM 7...just like prior versions of WM. iPhone, Android, and Blackberry. If you don't have one of those, you are SOL.
BTW, avatar28, I just had to do my fifth hard reset since installing ROM 2.nnnn, so I took this opportunity to go back to the original 1.5nnn ROM. I had almost forgotten how much I lost with the "upgrade", not the least of which is the task manager icon on the home screen and the ability to select from All Programs without having to install each one on a button. Yeah, I no longer have a video recorder, but I'll deal with it (LOL)!

dirty_johnny said:
Although I will probably go with an android phone next contract cycle, windows mobile 7 (or whatever it's called) is actually quite nice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do realize WP7 is closed-source... right? That means not NEARLY as much development and such that you got on the Tilt2/TP2. Get Android and you will be able to customize even more than you did in winmo, and have a stable overclock.

slapshot30 said:
You do realize WP7 is closed-source... right? That means not NEARLY as much development and such that you got on the Tilt2/TP2. Get Android and you will be able to customize even more than you did in winmo, and have a stable overclock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeh but i rather get a WP7 than deal with the **** Wm6+ has to offer even if it does have more development. Even if it does, that doesn't entirely mean the phone is going to be very stable in performing.

sharkfinrazor said:
Yeh but i rather get a WP7 than deal with the **** Wm6+ has to offer even if it does have more development. Even if it does, that doesn't entirely mean the phone is going to be very stable in performing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android is very stable and is much more aesthetically pleasing in my opinion than WP7. The possibilities with android are so much more vast than WP7. The whole windows phone as a whole is slowly deteriorating and I feel sorry that you don't understand that. It still has hardly any apps compared to Android or even iPhone. You seem like you want a stock operating system though, so I guess if you really want to stay away from modding and customizing your phone, get that 'soon to be dead' WP7.
Modding (open source) = Android
Stock (closed source) = WP7

slapshot30 said:
You do realize WP7 is closed-source... right? That means not NEARLY as much development and such that you got on the Tilt2/TP2. Get Android and you will be able to customize even more than you did in winmo, and have a stable overclock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like I said, I will most likely go with an android phone next go around - specifically because of the open vs closed source. However - I know of some upcoming things that might also make the win 7 mobile even more of a nice package (for the right consumer). Or maybe it will lead to another release of a new mobile operating platform (ala win 7 trumping 6.5). Time will tell.
To be perfectly honest, I only have the win 6.5 phone because it was free with a 2 year. Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint are currently running a similar deal on win 7 phones. Free is a pretty compelling argument.

dirty_johnny said:
Like I said, I will most likely go with an android phone next go around - specifically because of the open vs closed source. However - I know of some upcoming things that might also make the win 7 mobile even more of a nice package (for the right consumer). Or maybe it will lead to another release of a new mobile operating platform (ala win 7 trumping 6.5). Time will tell.
To be perfectly honest, I only have the win 6.5 phone because it was free with a 2 year. Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint are currently running a similar deal on win 7 phones. Free is a pretty compelling argument.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It depends on how you order your priorities. In my opinion, my phone is something I use many many times every single day. I want to be able to constantly change it and be excited about it all the time (I got bored with winmo after a while). I just bought a non-contract android phone for around $400 and to me that is worth it, to others who don't care as much about modding and such, it probably wouldn't be worth it.

slapshot30 said:
It depends on how you order your priorities. In my opinion, my phone is something I use many many times every single day. I want to be able to constantly change it and be excited about it all the time (I got bored with winmo after a while). I just bought a non-contract android phone for around $400 and to me that is worth it, to others who don't care as much about modding and such, it probably wouldn't be worth it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, I can buy one whole tire for that amount

Hehe. I've been so busy lately I almost forgot about this thread. I haven't even been on the boards.
bowserb said:
Yes, WM7 might indeed be nice. However, in spite of the typical Microsoft promises, there are still few apps for WM 7...just like prior versions of WM. iPhone, Android, and Blackberry. If you don't have one of those, you are SOL.
BTW, avatar28, I just had to do my fifth hard reset since installing ROM 2.nnnn, so I took this opportunity to go back to the original 1.5nnn ROM. I had almost forgotten how much I lost with the "upgrade", not the least of which is the task manager icon on the home screen and the ability to select from All Programs without having to install each one on a button. Yeah, I no longer have a video recorder, but I'll deal with it (LOL)!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know that I would say there are very few apps. They just announced the 20k mark at the end of May (doubled in about a month). It's not a lot compared to the 300k or whatever on iOS but a lot of those are basically clones of each other anyways. A lot of iOS and 'Droid apps are just packaged HTML5 anyways and will be easy to port if/when WP7 gets some traction.
I think I may give a different ROM a shot. Something without CHT2 since I think that's some of the problem and I've gotten to where I don't even bother customizing it anymore because of hard resets/reflashes.
slapshot30 said:
You do realize WP7 is closed-source... right? That means not NEARLY as much development and such that you got on the Tilt2/TP2. Get Android and you will be able to customize even more than you did in winmo, and have a stable overclock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think there is a lot more application development on WP7. But you're right about there being a lot less development of customizations and the like. Maybe with Mango we'll get more adoption and that will help things.
Honestly, I really want a new phone but I'm trying to hold off. I really want to see what Mango and the new version of Android bring to the table and I want some better hardware than the current crop of WP7 offerings. Something with specs similar to the T-Mo G2 maybe.

I have to agree this phone is a disappointment. Part of the problem is that it is underpowered for the software it runs i.e. WinMo/Sense 2.5. I find that a process called GWES keeps expanding over time since last soft reset and consumes a large slab of runtime memory. The effect of this is to make things like the camera really slow to load. I don't know if it is a memory leak but it seems rediculous having a process that doesn't have some restrictions on its memory consumption.
I was having massive problems with Standby Of Death but replacing the SIM card seems to have fixed that much to my surprise.
I have to say that I look enviously at iPhone users who press something on the screen and the response is practically instantaneous compared to the sluggish performance of WM6.5. The WP7 phones are supposed to perform well but I guess the generous minimum specs mandated by MS have a lot to do with that.
Ashley

slapshot30 said:
Android is very stable and is much more aesthetically pleasing in my opinion than WP7. The possibilities with android are so much more vast than WP7. The whole windows phone as a whole is slowly deteriorating and I feel sorry that you don't understand that. It still has hardly any apps compared to Android or even iPhone. You seem like you want a stock operating system though, so I guess if you really want to stay away from modding and customizing your phone, get that 'soon to be dead' WP7.
Modding (open source) = Android
Stock (closed source) = WP7
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Click to collapse
I'm sure i made it clear that I prefer a WP7 phone over a WM6, not WP7 over android. I know how android works and that they are an open source, that is not new news. I'm just saying that the tp2 with wimo6 is a joke of a full time business phone. I'm not a full coding developer so I'm not interested in tricking the tp2 that it can perform something when it really can't - or it can't do whatever it's suppose to do well.
Open source is good, but sometimes it sucks that u can come across terrible, buggy apps. Sure they are free and can be fixed but that's where it fails for the consumer. These buggy apps could potentially destroy your phone. And this is the biggest flaw that winmo6 has to offer. it makes sense to just get rid of the whole entire os altogether; the most important fact of what a consumer needs in a phone is one that WORKS as a phone, NOT a developing tool.
I'm sure Microsoft understood this, which is why they are not open source. That's like if nintendo had anyone building their games without any consent from nintendo in doing so. We'd get a lot of crappy buggy games. Plus Microsoft isn't a small company. Having xbox integrated with wm7 plus buying out Skype and working together with nokia for some of their phones is a huge thing for
WP7 - so saying that they will die sometime soon is by far from happening.
Don't think that WP7 will die due to the lack of open source. The most that anyone needs on a phone is to make calls, txt/email msgs, make notes, watch movies, play music and or internet browsing - do we really need many developers to make something that's already integrated on the phone? Plus they have ms office - as a full business worker that's a big plus.

[Q] Happy with your WP7 Device??

hey there, i´m looking for a new smartphone and since i don´t want spend like 450 euro for a phone (that i don´t like for a 100% - i´m very picky....). i tried the galaxy s2 (kinda HATE the big home button, very cheap battery cover) and the sensation (lousy internal memory, very low "loud"speaker, wifi issues, and so on), again unfortunately i´m VERY picky.......
anyway, i stumbled over the win 7 phones which are at a very low price at the moment and the Optimus 7 is the one with the lowest price.
so i´m asking you if this device is good enough to spend some time with until new flagships (new android or maybe the galaxy s2 wp7) come out or does it have BIG known issues???
and could you tell me your results with the camera since i read somewhere that it isn´t THAT good....
thx!
/e: just to put some numbers in
the LG optimus 7 is available for like 160 euro and the next step ahead would be the omnia 7 for 213 euro.
specially when i see THIS video, i´m not too sure anymore, which one to pick

no matter which one u pick u will love wp7 especially with the mango beta out. the Omnia has an AMOLED screen and people swear that it's the **** so if that matters to u than I would go for that otherwise go for the optimus 7

I came from Android to WP7 and love it. If you pick one up now, the specs might not look incredible, but everything just WORKS. I've been running the Mango beta, and I can't go back to NoDo now.

I love my HD7 & WP7. There are some design changes I'd like to see, but nothing deal breaking. What'd I suggest though, is to go to your local retailer & play with it in person & make your own choice/decision. everyone has their own tastes, so it's best to play with one yourself & make up your own mind rather then follow the opinion of others. For me, the biggest thing is that WP7 is very fast & smooth. The integration is also awesome. mango will only make things better. This being said, if you are big into hacking/customizing your device, WP7 is lacking in that area. Especially after Mango because of the INTEROPSERVICES block that has broken almost all homebrew apps (registry editor/etc.)

monkeytown said:
hey there, i´m looking for a new smartphone and since i don´t want spend like 450 euro for a phone (that i don´t like for a 100% - i´m very picky....). i tried the galaxy s2 (kinda HATE the big home button, very cheap battery cover) and the sensation (lousy internal memory, very low "loud"speaker, wifi issues, and so on), again unfortunately i´m VERY picky.......
anyway, i stumbled over the win 7 phones which are at a very low price at the moment and the Optimus 7 is the one with the lowest price.
so i´m asking you if this device is good enough to spend some time with until new flagships (new android or maybe the galaxy s2 wp7) come out or does it have BIG known issues???
and could you tell me your results with the camera since i read somewhere that it isn´t THAT good....
thx!
/e: just to put some numbers in
the LG optimus 7 is available for like 160 euro and the next step ahead would be the omnia 7 for 213 euro.
specially when i see THIS video, i´m not too sure anymore, which one to pick
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would not recommend WP7 alltogether because of limitations it gives.
But if you're into it, and yes WP7 can be very saisfying in many areas,
I can say - having still my LG Optimus 7 - that it's a very very good phone itself.
I would never trust LG but this phone is really robust and well designed and was a complete surprise to me.
It has hardware keys which I find very comfortable, not allowing any accidental press,
back cover is top noch metal and the whole phone looks 100 times better than on any photo, quite classy but not too much. All the hardware keys are great too. The screen is sweet, audio quality very good.
But the Camera:
In daylight it's great. You can make great photos and videos.
The whole problem is in the night & dark... Well the colours are OK but basically in those conditions pics are complete ****. Just blurry and not sharp, as well as videos. TBH not many modern phone cameras work in these conditions anyway.

doministry said:
I would not recommend WP7 alltogether because of limitations it gives.
But if you're into it, and yes WP7 can be very saisfying in many areas,
I can say - having still my LG Optimus 7 - that it's a very very good phone itself.
I would never trust LG but this phone is really robust and well designed and was a complete surprise to me.
It has hardware keys which I find very comfortable, not allowing any accidental press,
back cover is top noch metal and the whole phone looks 100 times better than on any photo, quite classy but not too much. All the hardware keys are great too. The screen is sweet, audio quality very good.
But the Camera:
In daylight it's great. You can make great photos and videos.
The whole problem is in the night & dark... Well the colours are OK but basically in those conditions pics are complete ****. Just blurry and not sharp, as well as videos. TBH not many modern phone cameras work in these conditions anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
uhh yea stop spreading FUD naco he's looking for someone to help him purchase a wp7 device not for someone to deter him from purchasing a wp7!

If you're "VERY picky" then I wouldn't buy a Windows 7 phone.
Basically it's a *good* system, but it's clear from the lack of apps and the number of small niggles that it's an OS that is still maturing. I imagine Microsoft see this WP7 the same as the original Xbox; a way to get developers, phone carriers and hardware manufacturers on board, as well as iron out most technical issues, before the real battle; the launch of Windows Phone 8.
If you're the sort of person where just one little thing could ruin your enjoyment of the phone, then I'd probably recommend iOS (where everything pretty much just works as intended).
Oh and to answer your original question, yes I'm happy with my HTC Mozart, though there are a few frustrations with the system, and many apps that I miss.

extremely happy

If you find yourself only using 10-20 apps on other OS, odds are you will be perfectly happy with wp7. I think I have a total of 8 third party apps right now, I just don't need much that isn't already built into wp7.

ryude said:
If you find yourself only using 10-20 apps on other OS, odds are you will be perfectly happy with wp7. I think I have a total of 8 third party apps right now, I just don't need much that isn't already built into wp7.
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Click to collapse
exactly, and after mango there're gonna be much more built-in apps even if you'd like to use many apps, go right ahead, it won't slow down the OS (unlike android)

I would spend sometime playing with one in the shop and see what you think, I like my Ominia 7

eric12341 said:
uhh yea stop spreading FUD naco he's looking for someone to help him purchase a wp7 device not for someone to deter him from purchasing a wp7!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're FUD as a whole. As I see you get many warnings on this forum.
Don't reply to me if possible.

doministry said:
You're FUD as a whole. As I see you get many warnings on this forum.
Don't reply to me if possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
u stop posting bull**** I'll stop replying.

eric12341 said:
u stop posting bull**** I'll stop replying.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You keep replying. You don't even have the ability to understand what you read.

i have a HTC 7 Pro, and a Samsung Omnia 7.
Best Phones i've ever had.
Even Android Phones like Galaxy S (S II wasnt out back then), Nexus etc were simply bad after i used a WinPho7
Keep in mind that everyone has their own opinion, and this is mine.

I left android for a huge reason (one of the same reasons why I left winmo as well)
no matter how much a custom rom improved the experience, at little things, both OSes sucked at. I didn't want to buy apple because they are POS when you jailbreak them. That said, windows phone intrigued me after playing with it for a good 10 days. And when I had to go back to android or windows mobile, life was grim. I was bored with the constant rom flashing to get the device to work. even though miui was good for android and dutty was good for windows mobile, the experience overall was mediocre.
I am definitely enjoying windows phone and it gives me so much options

With Mango around the corner I can now recommend WP7 without hesitation as I know things like push notifications will be fixed soon. That's the only thing I don't like about WP7 along with some very poor Xbox Live games.
Sent from my Samsung Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

domineus said:
I left android for a huge reason (one of the same reasons why I left winmo as well)
no matter how much a custom rom improved the experience, at little things, both OSes sucked at. I didn't want to buy apple because they are POS when you jailbreak them. That said, windows phone intrigued me after playing with it for a good 10 days. And when I had to go back to android or windows mobile, life was grim. I was bored with the constant rom flashing to get the device to work. even though miui was good for android and dutty was good for windows mobile, the experience overall was mediocre.
I am definitely enjoying windows phone and it gives me so much options
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thats a thing that bothers me, too....i already had a optimus speed for a couple of time and all i did was flashing a new rom again and again....
i already thought of an iphone too but since i already got a contract and have to buy the phone at the normal price, the iphone would be around 580 euro ;(
the perfect device would be a good out-of-the-box phone at a "normal" price where i don´t have to tweak everything myself
but thx for your answers

monkeytown said:
thats a thing that bothers me, too....i already had a optimus speed for a couple of time and all i did was flashing a new rom again and again....
i already thought of an iphone too but since i already got a contract and have to buy the phone at the normal price, the iphone would be around 580 euro ;(
the perfect device would be a good out-of-the-box phone at a "normal" price where i don´t have to tweak everything myself
but thx for your answers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sounds like wp7 may be just for you, its the best out of the box experience and there's no cluttered UI like ios or tiny (though admittedly clear) screen. wP7 never stops amazing me with all of its functionality.

indeed, it sounds pretty good to me
maybe i should wait till september?? i read somewhere that new phones will be released then and it´s my birthday too