Develop Bugs

Have we been duped?

Ok, I am been a big fan of WP7 since day 1, I now have a bad feeling I have been duped.
Given what we are seeing with the current update, the pre update update and what I and others are being told by carriers about "testing" imagine this scenario.
21.2.11 Microsoft release pre-update update carrier will forward it only after 8 weeks "testing" phase.
8.3.11 Microsoft release NoDo, carrier decides to skip this one
21.4.11 Carrier releases pre-update update to consumers
15.11.11 Microsoft release Mango (late 2011)
16.11.11 Carrier announces Mango will be released with NoDo rolled in after another 8 week "testing" phase.
16.01.12 Consumers get NoDo/ Mango update.
Yes friends, you could end up waiting a full 15 months from the UK launch of WP7 before you get any sort of significant update! "But we knew about the carriers option to skip an update" you say, but we did not know that MS release dates are useless because carriers are allowed to add 2 or 3 months for "testing", this on top of a barely acceptable update cycle from MS. Even if your carrier gets NoDo, that gives them the option to skip Mango in which case, who knows when you will get any functionality beyond C&P (meh).
I am stuck on a 24 month contract with a phone which will possibly not get a full feature set until near the end of that contract and I am pissed at how stupid I have been not to have worked this out before I signed up. My advice? If you really want a WP7 wait until you can get a properly SIM free one that is not tied to any carrier.

I feel you, but don't be like my wife and judge guilty before the crime
It hasn't happened yet, and though I share the sentiment of the jist of your post, remember to base your mindset on fact, not hypothesis.
In a years time, we will know if we truly were duped. You had to know it was a gamble when you signed up, and now the risk is being realised. Just trust in Microsoft to do the right thing, and raise hell if they don't.

adesonic said:
Ok, I am been a big fan of WP7 since day 1, I now have a bad feeling I have been duped.
Given what we are seeing with the current update, the pre update update and what I and others are being told by carriers about "testing" imagine this scenario.
21.2.11 Microsoft release pre-update update carrier will forward it only after 8 weeks "testing" phase.
8.3.11 Microsoft release NoDo, carrier decides to skip this one
21.4.11 Carrier releases pre-update update to consumers
15.11.11 Microsoft release Mango (late 2011)
16.11.11 Carrier announces Mango will be released with NoDo rolled in after another 8 week "testing" phase.
16.01.12 Consumers get NoDo/ Mango update.
Yes friends, you could end up waiting a full 15 months from the UK launch of WP7 before you get any sort of significant update! "But we knew about the carriers option to skip an update" you say, but we did not know that MS release dates are useless because carriers are allowed to add 2 or 3 months for "testing", this on top of a barely acceptable update cycle from MS. Even if your carrier gets NoDo, that gives them the option to skip Mango in which case, who knows when you will get any functionality beyond C&P (meh).
I am stuck on a 24 month contract with a phone which will possibly not get a full feature set until near the end of that contract and I am pissed at how stupid I have been not to have worked this out before I signed up. My advice? If you really want a WP7 wait until you can get a properly SIM free one that is not tied to any carrier.
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I'm afraid your carrier testing dates and deadlines are incorrect.

8 weeks is what 2 carriers in the UK have said to consumers here

OP doesn't make sense to me.
This 'pre' update went to carriers for testing ages ago.
If a carrier skips an update they have to rollout the next update, which will have to include the skipped update.

digime said:
OP doesn't make sense to me.
This 'pre' update went to carriers for testing ages ago.
If a carrier skips an update they have to rollout the next update, which will have to include the skipped update.
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Click to collapse
This is what I read from Microsoft as well, they can skip 1, but they have to push out the next update which also includes the previous one.

adesonic said:
Ok, I am been a big fan of WP7 since day 1, I now have a bad feeling I have been duped.
Given what we are seeing with the current update, the pre update update and what I and others are being told by carriers about "testing" imagine this scenario.
21.2.11 Microsoft release pre-update update carrier will forward it only after 8 weeks "testing" phase.
8.3.11 Microsoft release NoDo, carrier decides to skip this one
21.4.11 Carrier releases pre-update update to consumers
15.11.11 Microsoft release Mango (late 2011)
16.11.11 Carrier announces Mango will be released with NoDo rolled in after another 8 week "testing" phase.
16.01.12 Consumers get NoDo/ Mango update.
Yes friends, you could end up waiting a full 15 months from the UK launch of WP7 before you get any sort of significant update! "But we knew about the carriers option to skip an update" you say, but we did not know that MS release dates are useless because carriers are allowed to add 2 or 3 months for "testing", this on top of a barely acceptable update cycle from MS. Even if your carrier gets NoDo, that gives them the option to skip Mango in which case, who knows when you will get any functionality beyond C&P (meh).
I am stuck on a 24 month contract with a phone which will possibly not get a full feature set until near the end of that contract and I am pissed at how stupid I have been not to have worked this out before I signed up. My advice? If you really want a WP7 wait until you can get a properly SIM free one that is not tied to any carrier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes you were duped: you signed a contract, for a phone.
as far as updates, microsoft has been promising "this is the best windows ever!" since win95. at least you don't have to buy a cd for wp7 updates, if they ever come.
btw, android 3.0 sdk was released , that means. yet another bump for android, like now. hmmm duped indeed.

I suggest waiting until that all gets laid out. Microsoft has been paying attention to the mobile world. I think it is taking the better aspects of Android and iOS. If this is true, they know how important software updates are. They do not want all of the update issues Android has. Trust me. Those voices from the Android crowd are starting to get rather loud boasting about devices being left in the dust, or simply getting an update 6-10 months after the update was released.
As for the new Android sdk, it's tablet only for the moment. The next phone update will be 2.4 that will really bring extra functionality. Heck, Google's own developer phone, the Nexus One is just starting to get the latest update to Gingerbread. Thats over 2 months after it was announced with Nexus S. XDA released it before Google did!
Bottom line, be loud about the updates, but don't speculate. It sounds fine when you do it, but all it does is get you worked up for no real reason. Enjoy the phone for what you bought it for. As key as updates are, you should still buy your phone for what it does now.

This why I am going to wait at least a year or two before I go out and buy a WP7 device, they have so much to work out before it is a functional daily device, but I think in the end they will work all this out.

Me too... I've been looking for a replacement for my ageing sghI780, and as of now the best bet is an android based one. As much as I like the WP7 interface, I want a phone that I can customize anytime I want, with a true offline and not to mention free GPS navigation. I also use my phone to carry important files with me, plus a videos and music files to while away the time. There's a lot of holes that need to be filled in WP7 for the moment. Until those are fulfilled, then I will not own a WP7 device anytime soon. Maybe I'll just get a Galaxy S for the meantime.

I don't feel duped. I knew I was buying into an early mobile os. There is little functionality I miss in day to day operation, and I'm confident that my phone is going to get an update in early march.
Now, if that update for some reason never comes, then I would start to worry, but until then, why cause any more stress than I need to?

digime said:
OP doesn't make sense to me.
This 'pre' update went to carriers for testing ages ago.
If a carrier skips an update they have to rollout the next update, which will have to include the skipped update.
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Click to collapse
If this update went to caariers for testing ages ago, why are carriers telling consumers they cannot release it because they have a 6 to 8 week testing cycle o go through? I am not bothered about this specific update, nor am I bothered by the "carriers can skip one update thing" what bothers me is that we now have to add an indeterminate length of time (6 weeks? 8 weeks?) to whatever date MS give for an update

ohgood said:
yes you were duped: you signed a contract, for a phone.
as far as updates, microsoft has been promising "this is the best windows ever!" since win95. at least you don't have to buy a cd for wp7 updates, if they ever come.
btw, android 3.0 sdk was released , that means. yet another bump for android, like now. hmmm duped indeed.
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Click to collapse
Come on OhGood. You know better than that. The last OS to boast about updates has to be Android.
I'll be sure to send your baseless plug to Google.

Well lets look at it this way. MS's original, public pitch for WP7 was that updates will come solely from them, with no inteference from carriers, OEM's, tooth fairies or frost giants. Now what has been unveiled, not by MS themselves publicly but by bloggers like Paul Thurrott is that the reality is carriers have the power, just like before, to insert themselves into the update process and delay or block updates as they see fit and again here we are, scrambling around trying to find out where our updates are.
It doesnt really matter if they have to pass the next update after a blocked one, conceivably they can do their "testing" for an indeterminable length of time and still in effect block that update as well. The reality today regarding updates is a far cry from what MS publicly promised, and in typical MS style all mention of that is missing from their website or from any MS official.
Duped, misled, hoodwinked, call it what you will, the truth of the matter is updates are NOT solely controlled by MS, contrary to what was originally claimed and that is not a nice thing to discover AFTER buying the device. It may or may not be better than android's so called "fragmentation" but in reality it pretty much results in the same thing, pissed off users.

Fortunately I'm not on a contract with my WP7. And mine is already sim-unlocked. I wonder if I could put a foreign sim in and see if the update would happen?
The only contract I'm in right now is for my iPhone, which is a sure bet.

theo80 said:
Me too... I've been looking for a replacement for my ageing sghI780, and as of now the best bet is an android based one. As much as I like the WP7 interface, I want a phone that I can customize anytime I want, with a true offline and not to mention free GPS navigation. I also use my phone to carry important files with me, plus a videos and music files to while away the time. There's a lot of holes that need to be filled in WP7 for the moment. Until those are fulfilled, then I will not own a WP7 device anytime soon. Maybe I'll just get a Galaxy S for the meantime.
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Click to collapse
I'd wait just a little bit and get a galaxy S2

efjay said:
Duped, misled, hoodwinked, call it what you will, the truth of the matter is updates are NOT solely controlled by MS, contrary to what was originally claimed and that is not a nice thing to discover AFTER buying the device.
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Click to collapse
While this may or may not be true (according to bloggers it is - I'm not arguing either way) I very much doubt this pre-update would have gone thru the carriers at all. Microsoft always said smaller updates would be delivered directly. If this isn't considered a small update I don't know what is. More pointing to this fact is that most carriers don't seem to have a clue about the update - sure, they may state there's an internal testing period of x weeks, but these people don't have a clue; they read from a script. If your question doesn't exactly match one available in their script they will pick the closest one - which in this case may have been an Android update.
That said, I don't see why the carriers would block updates at all - unless they include features specifically forbidden on the network in question (i.e. VoIP and similar services). The networks have no financial interest in blocking the updates, on the contrary they should get them out the door as fast as humanly possible to keep their customers happy. OEMs on the other hand does have a financial interest in holding off on delivering updates as it means they can produce an almost identical phone with the latest greatest OS included.
In any case, if carriers were looped in here we would have seen evidence of this. Either by me receiving an update before my wife (I've got an unbranded O7, she's got a TMODE branded O7) or by lots of people complain that their X branded device still hasn't received an update. We haven't seen this, at all. Looking at various surveys online it's pretty clear that devices from just about every network have received the pre-update. Microsoft did state it was a staggered release, so the fact that person Y has received his while person Z hasn't isn't evidence of a carrier blocking it IMO.

Dunno if ive missed something but what network has actually blocked you from receiving the update?

ohgood said:
yes you were duped: you signed a contract, for a phone.
as far as updates, microsoft has been promising "this is the best windows ever!" since win95. at least you don't have to buy a cd for wp7 updates, if they ever come.
btw, android 3.0 sdk was released , that means. yet another bump for android, like now. hmmm duped indeed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Stupid analogy. Sounds like you bought into the Apple propaganda commercials, which funny enough you see alot less of since Windows 7 (because Windows 7 is actually decent). Every Windows after 95 has been better.
Android Updates:
1.0 ...5mths... 1.1 ...1mth... 1.5 ...5mths... 1.6 ...1mths... 2.0/2.1 ...7mths... 2.2 ...7mths...
Windows Updates:
1.0 ...?... 1.x and we are 4 months into the offering.
Seriously.

efjay said:
Well lets look at it this way. MS's original, public pitch for WP7 was that updates will come solely from them, with no inteference from carriers, OEM's, tooth fairies or frost giants. Now what has been unveiled, not by MS themselves publicly but by bloggers like Paul Thurrott is that the reality is carriers have the power, just like before, to insert themselves into the update process and delay or block updates as they see fit and again here we are, scrambling around trying to find out where our updates are.
It doesnt really matter if they have to pass the next update after a blocked one, conceivably they can do their "testing" for an indeterminable length of time and still in effect block that update as well. The reality today regarding updates is a far cry from what MS publicly promised, and in typical MS style all mention of that is missing from their website or from any MS official.
Duped, misled, hoodwinked, call it what you will, the truth of the matter is updates are NOT solely controlled by MS, contrary to what was originally claimed and that is not a nice thing to discover AFTER buying the device. It may or may not be better than android's so called "fragmentation" but in reality it pretty much results in the same thing, pissed off users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Listening to the Windows Weekly podcast is painful & funny at the same time. You can hear & see Paul Thurrott's frustration & his enthusiasm for WP7 slipping away week after week. At the beginning he was gushing over WP7 but now not so much.
One day I fully expect him to announce this is his last podcast, given all the disappointment he's had with WP7, Zune & Windows Home Server.

Nodo - due out today or not?

Plenty of people had been postulating that Nodo would be released today, but I do vaguely recall seeing an article on Monday saying it would be out "next week".
Anyone got any ideas?

I'm still waiting/looking for my first update. I guess I don't need it if the new one comes out considering all previous patches are supposed to be rolled into it.

The rumors have all been for today, with the exception of one that said yesterday was the day. The only official word from MS has been "first two weeks of March," which means we still have 6 more days to wait until they end up being made into liars.

No specific date set yet officially. My advice is don't get excited until Microsoft officially announces it or people start getting it. Whichever comes first. I just can't see it coming out without an officially announcement first.

Let us hope for the sanity of some that it comes out today. What ever happened to patience is a virtue?

The official word was "early March" so it could be anytime between today and next week. No one really knows, the March 8th date was a rumour.

Given that device-specific 7389 ROMs have started to appear (HTC Mozart and Trophy at least) I get the feeling that something is imminent. Just how imminent is, of course, another matter....

I got the update thing today, dunno if it pre NoDo or NoDo, don't have any data cables at school :/

brondum said:
I got the update thing today, dunno if it pre NoDo or NoDo, don't have any data cables at school :/
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Click to collapse
which phone do u have? which carrier ?

You guys need to all calm down ! Unless you can post (from a certified Microsoft site) that they have said the update is on so and so date ,then just chill, this reminds me of the oil situation in the US with speculators , the more intense the debate the higher the prices get and of course none of them have a clue whats really going on !
The update will come , does it not perform well without it , copy/paste is that the biggest complaint ? have it on my iphone and have never used it , custom ringtones, if your on this forum , obviously you know (or should know) how to create custom ringtones by now!
This forum gives you all the information needed for any number of phones and disciplines , read /learn and move on!

FishFaceMcGee said:
The rumors have all been for today, with the exception of one that said yesterday was the day. The only official word from MS has been "first two weeks of March," which means we still have 6 more days to wait until they end up being made into liars.
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hahaha LMAO

I want the update for bug fixes and application loading speed improvements..
Honestly don't care about copy/paste..
Hopefully it comes soon.
it would suck for the HTC 7 Pro on sprint to be released on March 20th and leave the rest of us stuck without the update.

TOA Duck said:
hahaha LMAO
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Click to collapse
LMAO what?

Vintage144 said:
You guys need to all calm down ! Unless you can post (from a certified Microsoft site) that they have said the update is on so and so date ,then just chill, this reminds me of the oil situation in the US with speculators , the more intense the debate the higher the prices get and of course none of them have a clue whats really going on !
The update will come , does it not perform well without it , copy/paste is that the biggest complaint ? have it on my iphone and have never used it , custom ringtones, if your on this forum , obviously you know (or should know) how to create custom ringtones by now!
This forum gives you all the information needed for any number of phones and disciplines , read /learn and move on!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LMAO X2
Finally told us someone what we need :-D
And if we do not feel that we have this "need" than what?
You will come over and bomb aour country?

Still nothing here with Focus on At&t as of 10:17am EST

Using the HTC Euro update in the dev forum, gold card installed to O2 HD7 in UK, and first impressions are there are slight improvements overall, few extra animations and email flagging (unless i messed that before), copy & paste works well, haven't noticed that apps load any quicker.
More an overall polish than anything revolutionary - that'll come october!

Microsoft, if they're smart, should be aware of the March 8 rumour, and should publicly address it. "not true", "sort of true", "we're not sure". Even a "we're not sure when" would satisfy people, like myself. It at least would show they've got their finger on the pulse and have half a clue of what's going on.
And just like above, I want it for performance upgrades, I couldn't care less about copy/paste.

FishFaceMcGee said:
LMAO what?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LMAO about your statement about them lieing
again
the red prt in the quote

Okay now tell me if this is a lie:
"I will be home by 5." You leave work at the same time you normally do but there is an accident on your regular route. You get home at 5:27. Do you consider yourself a liar? Probably not.
Let us not get on Holy. A big problem I have with humanity on the net is we are all overly critical towards others because we are just a screen name.
Apple claimed there was no Death Grip and in order to throw smoke and mirrors at the loyal customers they announced at the beginning of July 2010 that they would be shipping white iPhone 4s at the end of July. Now that is a bold-faced lie. And even bolder since it happened during a damage-control P.R. spectacle.
So they said they would have an update in February and it is March. Your phone is not unuseable no matter what picture you try to paint. We sometimes get places late. We sometimes finish our work late.
STS (stop the stupidity)

nicksti said:
Okay now tell me if this is a lie:
"I will be home by 5." You leave work at the same time you normally do but there is an accident on your regular route. You get home at 5:27. Do you consider yourself a liar? Probably not.
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Click to collapse
Oh gosh...did MS have a road accident?

Bell customers - don't expect NoDo or any updates in the future

I just had a live chat with their "customer service". This is the familiar realization that there will not be updates released for Bell customers. Read below...
A chat representative will be with you in about 0 minute(s). Thank you for waiting.
Chat representative Claire has joined the session and is ready to help. To start, please provide your name and home phone number.
You: Hi Claire
Claire: Hello, thanks for visiting bell.ca. How can I help you today?
You: I was wondering if you knew when the NoDo update for windows phone 7 is being released from Bell?
You: Just cause Microsoft released it weeks ago
Claire: Sure, I will help you with that.
Claire: Are you an existing Bell Mobility customer?
You: Yes, I have an LG Quantum, my wife has an iPhone, we have Bell TV, home phone, and two other cell lines
Claire: Thank you for being a loyal customer to Bell. Kindly stay online while I transfer this chat to our support queue, would request your patience if the chat remains in the queue for a few minutes in case the support reps are busy helping other customers. We thank you for your patience.
You: No problem!
Please wait. We are transferring you to the specialist best suited to help you.
Welcome to bell.ca! You are chatting with Marlena. To assist you, may I please have your name and mobile phone number with area code?
Marlena: Hello and welcome to Bell Mobility's chat service. How can I help you today?
you: Hi there, I was wondering if you knew when the NoDo update was being released for Windows Phone 7?
Marlena: For more information concerning software updates for your device, please visit this link: Software updates for your handset.
Marlena: Is there anything else I can help you with today?
you: My phone (LG Quantum) isn't listed in the link you gave me
you: LG C900 to be exact I think
Marlena: Did you check your phone under tools to see if there is an update available?
you: And it's not an over-the-air update, windows phone 7 updates through Zune desktop PC software
you: Yes I checked that. I know Microsoft released the NoDo update to the carriers, and that now the carriers are holding up the release of it
Marlena: Well if the phone shows there is no updates that means there is none available at this time.
you: ...ok yes I am aware of that. I'm wondering if you know -when- it will be available
Marlena: No I'm sorry we don't have that info.
you: hang on a second please...
you: Please navigate to this link: http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/features/update-schedule-world.aspx
you: Under "Bell" is says "delivering update"
you: Someone must know, a manager or engineer?
Marlena: Please check your phone for any updates that may come in the future, this info is not provided to us or managers any sooner than it is to you.
Marlena: Is there anything else I can help you with today?
you: I don't understand, how can Bell not know what is going on with its own company?
Marlena: I'm afraid I have nothing new to add to what was already said, the info that you are looking for is not available at this time.
you: Ok who in your company would be aware of the updates?
you: SOMEONE has to know
you: Corporate office?
Marlena: As previously mentioned this info is not provided to us or managers any sooner than it is to you.
you: Thank you, but I asked that SOMEONE at Bell must know. There has to be some person who is aware of windows phone 7 updates
you: Another amazing experience with Bell. Thanks
(long pause)
Marlena: Thank you for chatting with me. Please click the "Close" button on the top right of the chat window to tell me how I did today. Enjoy your day!
Marlena: Bye.
Your chat representative has ended the chat session. We thank you for using this service and we hope to have answered all your questions.
*********************************************
If I was the CEO of this company and saw this I would be appalled. My goodness they're so helpful and so nice.
So if anyone is familiar with Bell and how they handle things, you can see the writing on the wall. Not gonna happen. And don't expect Mango either.

If it says "Delivering Update" then its in Microsoft's hands, not Bell.

Just click on the update option in phone settings in Zune and then turn off Wifi. You'll get the update.
They are contractually obligated to allow the update since they skipped Pre-Nodo, FYI. The timeframe is up to Microsoft at this point.

Umm... I think the original post is an over-reaction, and the subject line is misleading.
Here are a couple of posts from Mobile Syrup, showing that Bell is delivering the update to the LG Quantum and HD7:
http://mobilesyrup.com/2011/03/29/wp7-nodo-upgrade-now-available-on-the-bell-lg-optimus-quantum/
http://mobilesyrup.com/2011/04/01/bell-htc-hd7-receives-windows-phone-7-nodo-update/
If you followed the whole initial delivery system fiasco, the MS delivery schedule update, and looked at the document provided by MS, you would know that:
The updates for a given provider are pushed out over several weeks. Your device may not be on the list to be notified yet.
MS controls the device-specific delivery schedule and updates are pushed from MS servers. Bell isn't going to be able to tell you when your particular update will arrive (though she could have provided the range of dates).
All devices will eventually get the update.
There is no call to claim that users should not expect the Nodo update if they are on Bell (or any other provider showing "Delivering update" as the status on the MS page). The tech support person told you "Please check your phone for any updates that may come in the future, this info is not provided to us or managers any sooner than it is to you." That is because the update is pushed directly from MS servers once Bell signs off on it. MS knows when your device will get the update in the next few weeks... Bell does not.
If you don't want to wait, use one of the Zune disconnect NIC tricks to get your update now (there are quite a few sets of instructions floating around here, and you don't even have to modify anything on your device other than whether wifi is on).

thesecondsfade said:
Just click on the update option in phone settings in Zune and then turn off Wifi. You'll get the update.
They are contractually obligated to allow the update since they skipped Pre-Nodo, FYI. The timeframe is up to Microsoft at this point.
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Click to collapse
I actually got the pre-NoDo. But my phone didn't notify me, Zune did when I connected.
And I know about the wifi trick, but I'm hesitant to do that in case I miss some handset-specific updates or what have you. You just never know.

VelJharig said:
Umm... I think the original post is an over-reaction, and the subject line is misleading.
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I disagree. In the links you posted I'm not sure where they got those images from, but Bell has definitely not released NoDo.
I've dealt with this company for years, I know them like John McClane knows the Grubers. Bell will not be releasing any updates. While I sure hope I'm wrong, but I'd put money on it and write it on a stone tablet. Ain't no one getting updates the official way.

If you have dealt with Bell for as long as you have, and with their ExpressVu portion as well, then you should have also learnt a very long time ago that these reps, and nearly anyone you speak to in any of their stores or kiosks, are clueless on anything other than what current promotion they are pushing, as they read that from a cue card.
For example, I went into the Bell store here on launch day for WP7.... they had no effing clue what I was talking about. Hadn't even HEARD of Windows Phone 7. So should I assume that Bell won't be selling any Windows Phones? Or should I realize that these people (as in store salesmen and generic help-line staff) are at the bottom of the totem pole, and don't really know much beyond the bare minimum?
I recieved my pre-NoDo notification for my Optimus Quantum on my phone, fyi. I think you are jumping the gun; I bet you could call that same person the day after Bell releases the NoDo update, and you would get the EXACT same response.

She said that she gets this information at the same time as you do. Why keep harrassing the person?

the92playboy said:
If you have dealt with Bell for as long as you have, and with their ExpressVu portion as well, then you should have also learnt a very long time ago that these reps, and nearly anyone you speak to in any of their stores or kiosks, are clueless on anything other than what current promotion they are pushing, as they read that from a cue card.
For example, I went into the Bell store here on launch day for WP7.... they had no effing clue what I was talking about. Hadn't even HEARD of Windows Phone 7. So should I assume that Bell won't be selling any Windows Phones? Or should I realize that these people (as in store salesmen and generic help-line staff) are at the bottom of the totem pole, and don't really know much beyond the bare minimum?
I recieved my pre-NoDo notification for my Optimus Quantum on my phone, fyi. I think you are jumping the gun; I bet you could call that same person the day after Bell releases the NoDo update, and you would get the EXACT same response.
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Good points.
I still believe 100% that Bell will not be releasing any updates, but you do make good points here.

sure haven't said:
I disagree. In the links you posted I'm not sure where they got those images from, but Bell has definitely not released NoDo.
I've dealt with this company for years, I know them like John McClane knows the Grubers. Bell will not be releasing any updates. While I sure hope I'm wrong, but I'd put money on it and write it on a stone tablet. Ain't no one getting updates the official way.
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Click to collapse
I don't understand. You just claimed in the previous post you got pre-nodo. Am I correct in assuming you are just hung up on the fact that your phone isn't notifying you about an update, instead of you having to do it yourself by running zune?

sure haven't said:
I disagree. In the links you posted I'm not sure where they got those images from, but Bell has definitely not released NoDo.
I've dealt with this company for years, I know them like John McClane knows the Grubers. Bell will not be releasing any updates. While I sure hope I'm wrong, but I'd put money on it and write it on a stone tablet. Ain't no one getting updates the official way.
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Click to collapse
MS Worldwide update schedule:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/features/update-schedule-world.aspx
From the commenter that provided the pictures in this link:
http://mobilesyrup.com/2011/03/29/wp7-nodo-upgrade-now-available-on-the-bell-lg-optimus-quantum/
"When I got the notification for an update yesterday morning I did not have to do anything special. Just came up on my phone while connected to Zune.
Both checkboxes in Settings/PhoneUpdate have been checked and, as it happens, my WIFI was off. Message just popped up on the phone.
First install froze on step 6. It asked for a phone to be connected to the PC. It already was. After a 10 min wait I just unplugged the phone restarted Zune and everything went smooth.
Works well, Copy and Paste are simple and intuitive. Market place is definitely more responsive. Other than that the phone OS seams very similar in speed/performance. Can vouch for any overall OS speed boosts like other have noticed. My biggest complaint is that camera settings are not saved and this is still true with NoDo. But this is primarily a phone after all"
--Posted by Sasha | March 30, 2011, 11:16 am
That sounds to me like Bell has authorized Nodo device updates as of at least the 30th, and that updates are going out through official channels. It doesn't get delivered through Zune to a carrier device (without hacking or interfering with Zune) unless the carrier has signed off on the update.
When we have personal testimony from Bell customers that they are receiving the Nodo update (with photographic evidence), and that corresponds with the MS statement that they are delivering the update to Bell customers (over 2-3 weeks)... explain to me again why we should believe you?
Your assurance based on random internet authority that Bell is not going to provide the Nodo update is not compelling. All you are doing is spreading FUD unnecessarily.

VelJharig said:
MS Worldwide update schedule:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/features/update-schedule-world.aspx
From the commenter that provided the pictures in this link:
http://mobilesyrup.com/2011/03/29/wp7-nodo-upgrade-now-available-on-the-bell-lg-optimus-quantum/
"When I got the notification for an update yesterday morning I did not have to do anything special. Just came up on my phone while connected to Zune.
Both checkboxes in Settings/PhoneUpdate have been checked and, as it happens, my WIFI was off. Message just popped up on the phone.
First install froze on step 6. It asked for a phone to be connected to the PC. It already was. After a 10 min wait I just unplugged the phone restarted Zune and everything went smooth.
Works well, Copy and Paste are simple and intuitive. Market place is definitely more responsive. Other than that the phone OS seams very similar in speed/performance. Can vouch for any overall OS speed boosts like other have noticed. My biggest complaint is that camera settings are not saved and this is still true with NoDo. But this is primarily a phone after all"
--Posted by Sasha | March 30, 2011, 11:16 am
That sounds to me like Bell has authorized Nodo device updates as of at least the 30th, and that updates are going out through official channels. It doesn't get delivered through Zune to a carrier device (without hacking or interfering with Zune) unless the carrier has signed off on the update.
When we have personal testimony from Bell customers that they are receiving the Nodo update (with photographic evidence), and that corresponds with the MS statement that they are delivering the update to Bell customers (over 2-3 weeks)... explain to me again why we should believe you?
Your assurance based on random internet authority that Bell is not going to provide the Nodo update is not compelling. All you are doing is spreading FUD unnecessarily.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That lovely mobile syrup link contains two random pictures, and then you repost something from the comments section to counter my position? I don't know that person, neither do you, and it's in no way an official response from Bell.
You know, I'm sorry, I wasn't aware you had a single piece of anecdotal evidence. You're right, I must already have the update.
I never said I had the authority, I just said don't expect it. I'm not.

Mango coming in a week or two!!

Here's the source, finally a word from Microsoft:
http://windowsteamblog.com/windows_phone/b/windowsphone/archive/2011/09/21/where-s-mango-an-update-on-timing.aspx

question....what abt those of us running RTM?
should we restore to nodo?
and do we get the firmware updates too if there is no need to restore back to nodo?

blanket said:
question....what abt those of us running RTM?
should we restore to nodo?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you are running the Beta it will definitly be impossible to upgrade from the Beta to the final, carrier and OEM approved version of Mango.
Most likely this will be the case for the leaked RTM as well but you never know. If you have to roll back to NoDo you will lose every Text and save games etc. created after you left NoDo, so downgrading to NoDo now will at least allow you to keep those after downgrading to NoDo.
However, if it turns out that you can upgrade from the leaked RTM to the final thing, then you won't lose anything and you might wanna take the risk and wait for the rollout to begin.

Awesome news

Just saw the post on twitter, and I must say that I'm pretty exited!
I'm actually gonna wipe my phone before the update. Some may wonder why, and it's simple: My region thingy won't work in Norway before Mango, HAH!
The wait is almost over y'all!

Mango in 1 or 2 weeks and battlefield 3 beta next week. Things are looking good.

DJRedLine said:
Mango in 1 or 2 weeks and battlefield 3 beta next week. Things are looking good.
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Click to collapse
Yeah and an iPhone 5 announcement in about 2 weeks. Great timing MS, the apple rumors and excitement are just starting to draw attention from everything else.

Well look at this. THIS is exactly what they should be doing (albeit weeks ago, but still). Fantastic.

sure haven't said:
Well look at this. THIS is exactly what they should be doing (albeit weeks ago, but still). Fantastic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Weeks ago the plan was still to release on September 15th (if you can trust the leaked stuff).

slimshady322 said:
Yeah and an iPhone 5 announcement in about 2 weeks. Great timing MS, the apple rumors and excitement are just starting to draw attention from everything else.
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Click to collapse
Apples fanfare will make mango a near silent memory... poor timing microsoft, very poor indeed.
Also, verizon is lighting up quite a few around the same time... maybe the LTE iphone is possible after all .?

slimshady322 said:
If you are running the Beta it will definitly be impossible to upgrade from the Beta to the final, carrier and OEM approved version of Mango.
Most likely this will be the case for the leaked RTM as well but you never know. If you have to roll back to NoDo you will lose every Text and save games etc. created after you left NoDo, so downgrading to NoDo now will at least allow you to keep those after downgrading to NoDo.
However, if it turns out that you can upgrade from the leaked RTM to the final thing, then you won't lose anything and you might wanna take the risk and wait for the rollout to begin.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i updated to mango a little over 24 hours ago, so damage is little tbh
and
garymoncrieff
@John, I just asked on Twitter and upgrade instructions for those of us running beta will be released when they have them.
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Click to collapse
this was in the comments section, so we may have hope

blanket said:
i updated to mango a little over 24 hours ago, so damage is little tbh
and
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well than I would downgrade to NoDo using the backup if you can live without Mango for another week or two.
blanket said:
this was in the comments section, so we may have hope
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Click to collapse
Yeah I read that as well but the instructions might just be "downgrade to NoDo using your backup" etc. Time will tell and fortunately it's not that far away.

The only reason they made the announcement is because we now know when Apple will reveal the next iPhone which basically means no living sould will give a damn about Mango. Way to go Microsoft, good luck with that!

I'll believe when I see it. Until then, it's all rumor and speculation.

There should have been a disclaimer that "unless you're on the AT&T network, then you'll need to wait until December or January since Mango is complex and needs to be tested before release."

Can anyone tell me why carriers have anything to do with updates at all? Carriers simply provide the infrastructure for a phone to work. What have they got to do with anything? It's something I have never understood. My ISP isn't testing my Windows 7 updates before I install them, why would they do so on my phone?

Merkie said:
Can anyone tell me why carriers have anything to do with updates at all? Carriers simply provide the infrastructure for a phone to work. What have they got to do with anything? It's something I have never understood. My ISP isn't testing my Windows 7 updates before I install them, why would they do so on my phone?
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Click to collapse
Probably because the phone has a radio in it and it's different from carrier to carrier..

Merkie said:
Can anyone tell me why carriers have anything to do with updates at all? Carriers simply provide the infrastructure for a phone to work. What have they got to do with anything? It's something I have never understood. My ISP isn't testing my Windows 7 updates before I install them, why would they do so on my phone?
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Click to collapse
It has to do with service compatibility. They make sure the phones perform properly with the various services the carriers provide. Plus, on top of that, they make sure the phone that bares their logo and name performs to their specific standards. Any malfunctioning phone can potentially give the carrier a bad rep.
I know from experience that a phone sold outright...unlocked and from the handset maker...can be buggy as hell. Whereas the exact same phone under the carriers moniker is a sweet and well functioning phone. This doesn't apply to Apple, though. Apple is in full control of any and all updates for the iPhone. But I bet the carriers who carry iPhones are allowed testing before updates are issued.

I'm glad this is more concrete than the fall. Lets see if ATT keeps to their words and updates my damn phone in a week or two.

Not even fall yet and an official announcement. Good job.

Where's our security update!?

Sprint and AT&T are pushing out updates for the home screen bug and the home key bug.
https://plus.google.com/photos/1108...499&sqsi=08a8f0bc-e488-422b-9b6c-d8e0a826d79d
http://community.sprint.com/baw/com...04/17/samsung-galaxy-note-ii-software-updates
Figures that I leave sprint for the their slow data speeds and firmware updates and now they are always the first to get firmware updates. But I'll take Tmo's data speed over sprint any day of the week.
Anyone know when we are suppose to get our update?!
EDIT: And I already checked Kies but no update.

TMobile is pretty notorious for slow updates. That does have one upside, they test them thoroughly to make sure nothing breaks. It CAN be irritating at times though. Android as a whole could really do with a more universal update system that allows for faster distribution. When an update is released, it will be all over XDA, just watch and someone will post a ZIP you can flash or you can update via Kies.

blazinazn said:
Anyone know when we are suppose to get our update?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Keep an eye on http://support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-4962 - you'll see future updates there a few days before it becomes available. That's where the bloggers are getting their info from. If you have a news feed/RSS reader, add that page for instant updates on T-Mobile's Note II updates.

No one knows but T-mobile and they probably do not know.

ttabbal said:
TMobile is pretty notorious for slow updates. That does have one upside, they test them thoroughly to make sure nothing breaks. It CAN be irritating at times though. Android as a whole could really do with a more universal update system that allows for faster distribution. When an update is released, it will be all over XDA, just watch and someone will post a ZIP you can flash or you can update via Kies.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Making some kind of modular system where pieces could be upgraded by Google, pieces by the carrier, and pieces by the manufacturer. Let Google handle almost all security updates except maybe device driver stuff. Drivers and whatnot by the maker. Bloatware and the **** they install, let the carriers upgrade.

muqali said:
Making some kind of modular system where pieces could be upgraded by Google, pieces by the carrier, and pieces by the manufacturer. Let Google handle almost all security updates except maybe device driver stuff. Drivers and whatnot by the maker. Bloatware and the **** they install, let the carriers upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think what needs to happen is that Google needs to require a drop dead date for updates. Something to the effect of "we drop an update on X date, and if it is a security update or a patch, the manufacturers/carriers have 30 days to get it out to their phones. If it is an operating system update, they have 120 days, etc. If the manufacturer needs more time to make their GUI work, they can drop a vanilla android update in the meantime.
Actually, I think it'd be great if Google required all manufacturers to make a vanilla android ROM available for their phones anyway. It'd certainly be an asset to the development community.

badutahboy said:
I think what needs to happen is that Google needs to require a drop dead date for updates. Something to the effect of "we drop an update on X date, and if it is a security update or a patch, the manufacturers/carriers have 30 days to get it out to their phones. If it is an operating system update, they have 120 days, etc. If the manufacturer needs more time to make their GUI work, they can drop a vanilla android update in the meantime.
Actually, I think it'd be great if Google required all manufacturers to make a vanilla android ROM available for their phones anyway. It'd certainly be an asset to the development community.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the time schedule woukd be a great idea. As for the vanilla android. It wouldn't happen because then google couldn't sell the nexus devices
Sent from my SGH-T889 using xda app-developers app

badutahboy said:
I think what needs to happen is that Google needs to require a drop dead date for updates. Something to the effect of "we drop an update on X date, and if it is a security update or a patch, the manufacturers/carriers have 30 days to get it out to their phones. If it is an operating system update, they have 120 days, etc. If the manufacturer needs more time to make their GUI work, they can drop a vanilla android update in the meantime.
Actually, I think it'd be great if Google required all manufacturers to make a vanilla android ROM available for their phones anyway. It'd certainly be an asset to the development community.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am hoping some high profile CEO has a trojan cause a major loss. ie Bank of America CEO loses the company 1 billion dollars due to some Android trojan. That might prompt the US Senate and Congress to enact legislation requiring carriers to be more timely and to provide updates for at least the length of the contract you bought the phone on.
Of course Congress acting proactively would work too, but I don't see them having the sense to pass something like that. Especially not with all the money carriers throw around.

muqali said:
I am hoping some high profile CEO has a trojan cause a major loss. ie Bank of America CEO loses the company 1 billion dollars due to some Android trojan. That might prompt the US Senate and Congress to enact legislation requiring carriers to be more timely and to provide updates for at least the length of the contract you bought the phone on.
Of course Congress acting proactively would work too, but I don't see them having the sense to pass something like that. Especially not with all the money carriers throw around.
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Click to collapse
Yeah hoping for a billion dollar hit to the market is a fantastic idea. Of course no serious business takes place on phones right now and those that are serous have their phones encrypted.
ROOTBOX| Holo Glass Theme | Crack Flasher

RonnieRuff said:
Yeah hoping for a billion dollar hit to the market is a fantastic idea. Of course no serious business takes place on phones right now and those that are serous have their phones encrypted.
ROOTBOX| Holo Glass Theme | Crack Flasher
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Click to collapse
Hey, if it gets consumers what they deserve I don't care about the corporations.

muqali said:
Hey, if it gets consumers what they deserve I don't care about the corporations.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Corporations? It affects peoples retirements LOL. You know 401ks...
ROOTBOX| Holo Glass Theme | Crack Flasher

I'm back on stock, and what exactly is this bug you speak of? I'm having no issues. Stock/rooted/4.1.2/MB4-No issues at all, super butter, not one bug. Curious, do explain... please.
TerrorCandii Inc.