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Anyone seen the article at PPCGeeks.com about Windows Phone 7??
I cant believe the crap Microsoft is trying to pull...
-At the Mobile World Congress event on February 15th, 2010, Windows Phone 7 will be unveilved, although at this time plans are only to unveil the user interface of the new platform . Specific indepth functionality of the device will most likely not be shown.
-The User Interface is based upon codename “METRO”. It will be very similar to the Zune HD User Interface with a complete revamp of the “Start” screen. The UI is “Very Clean”, “Soulful” and “Alive”
-Unfortunately there will be no Flash support at the get go as there was not enough time to implement these features.
-Windows Phone 7 will only support application installation through service based delivery. (i.e Marketplace). Application installation via storage card will not be possible.
- No Multi-Task support. Applications will “Pause” when in the background, however will support notifications via push notifications.
-Marketplace will now support “try before you buy” as well as an API
-No NETCF backwards compatibility. This means the original rumor of no backward compatibility for applications holds to be true. That being said, there are high hopes of porting the NetCF to the newer platform easily.
-Microsoft is confident that devices will be ready by September 2010
-Full Zune Integration
-Windows Mobile Device Center will no longer be used. Zune software to take over syncing via PC.
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device. Say goodbye to Sense UI / SPB Mobile Shell / Point UI / Infinity, etc, etc
-Full XBOX Gaming Integration (Gamer tag, achievements, friends, avatars, merchandising, etc)
-Full support for social networking
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Click to collapse
Looks like I will be making my next phone purchase based on WinMo6 and Android... Prob wont ever go to WinMo7...
i wouldnt believe any rumors that come out until microsoft confirms it. there have been so many different rumors from respectable sources and they all contradict each other. who to believe? no one
I don't want an iPhone from my Windows phone!
lol. I may use Android but I was looking at WM and thinking "That is a way better work phone than a Blackberry." but after reading those new rumors I am starting to doubt that.
I hope they are wrong since we don't need another iFail on the market but I can tell you one thing. HTC won't stand for that. They will mask all the ugly with their gorgeous HTC SENSE.
Yes but if u read that
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device. Say goodbye to Sense UI / SPB Mobile Shell / Point UI / Infinity, etc, etc
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So? I think we will see, because HD2 is running with sense, and i don't thing that official update to WM 7 will be something like that.
Oh whatever!...
honestly, why are you surprised?
Look at the success of the other companies and OS's who use similar strategies.
Lock down the device = enhanced and specific support for hardware, and etc., specifically hardware.
ZuneHD is a perfect example. I thought about getting one (for about 5 minutes) because of that sweet'n'sexy little tegra chip. MS couldn't have made that run as smooth & efficiently on a CE5.x base.
I will probably not get one of these phones either (unless they've not leaked some amazing feature like a free MS Surface Table with purchase of every WinPhone7, haha).
Though, I do wish MS the best of luck trying to deliver Proprietary content and software in a prettier way than Apple. I mean lets face it: Apple tends to slap handcuffs on it's customers and they still wanna dance. Hope MS's mobile department has been talking to the Xbox360's marketing Dept.
-OEM Interfaces will not be allowed to run on the device
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Click to collapse
One of the many things I love about my phone is that I can change interfaces, get unique interfaces, and duplicate other phone's interfaces. lets hope this is only one version of Windows 7. It looks they are taking the iphone direction - make the phone idiot proof and lock it down
Haha sounds like someone is making fun of us and posts all that sucks on the iPhone OS:
-Unfortunately there will be no Flash support at the get go as there was not
enough time to implement these features.
-Windows Phone 7 will only support application installation through service based delivery. (i.e Marketplace). Application installation via storage card will not be possible.
- No Multi-Task support. Applications will “Pause” when in the background, however will support notifications via push notifications.
WM7
Hmm.. I see Microsoft Iphone
Well if that is true then I will be staying with winmo 6.1/6.5 and Android forever The HD2 is such a powerful beast, I hope Android will be fully ported to it...
Imagine dual booting WM6.5 & Android on the HD2 with it's powerful cpu & large clear capacitive screen!! Then WinMO 7 can go and die a slow death, I wouldn't care
UGH
I fear the future also, as many do. (of the wm os) Microsoft ~ Windows Mobile has a niche for getting things wrong pretty much all the time. I read a rather creditable article that the new sync software was to be the Zune software? WTF my Zune syncs wrong almost all the time especially this last time and the other last time...UGH I fear the future of Windows Mobile and hope they get there heads out of there A$$ and step it up. I've had to call Zune support multiple times and also have to yet to date. (again ugh)
~Windows Mobile Device Center will no longer be used. Zune software to take over syncing via PC.....?????
~DJyoSNOW~
~PLUR~ Peace Love Unity Respect
If it becomes true, then I will stick on WM 6.5 on the HD2. However, things may change, it could be fake, it could be hackable.
this looks fake... in fact i agree that someone listed all the things that suck on the iphone and wrote "windows phone 7" all over it.
these points look like from an US-centered point of view. i mean - marketplace?! it's crap all over the world and nearly empty, EXCEPT in the US. zune?! it has been released only where? exactly, again the US.
no OEM-gui allowed? if that were to be true, htc would've already announced to stop making winmo-phones.
nah, this is fake...
Just a Rumor
We still need to wait and see, this is a rumor. I think most people on here would not stand for an Iphone like OS and would move to android instead if Windows did that. I kinda believe they will have a duel os model and this description would fit the model for the media targeted devices. A professional-like version would keep alot of what we love alive and give us some of what we are hoping for.
Look what Apple did and how successful they are with those iPhone and iPod Touch.
But I doubt it is true, those rumors are (at least half of them) fake .
omg!!! no multi-task..
I don't think Microsoft will do this.
They must be crazy to.. If they do this, the 'enthusiast' users (the people currently still holding up Windows Mobile on their hands) will drop the new OS and MS would have to start all over again. Why would users choose for their OS while there are no advantages any longer?
Maybe this is the spec of some limited media/Zune version of the OS, not the PRO version, if these are actually true.
Might aswell be some bashing done by an iPhone/Andoid fanboy that got picked up further down the pipe.
I don't believe all of it. I think those are just rumors from the anti-MS people.
If MS ever wanted to make Windows to be like a MAC OS, they would have done it long ago. I don't think they will do such thing in the Mobile branch neither.
I would think(hope) it will be something like:
Windows Phone = Windows 7 Home (for the grandpas)
Windows Phone Pro = Windows 7 Ultimate/Pro (for the enthusiasts/geeks)
i doubt that there is not going to be any Multi-Tasking. thats what "Windows" is all about. probably all BS
OndraSter said:
Look what Apple did and how successful they are with those iPhone and iPod Touch.
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Yep, but just take a look why ppl are still sticking with the pretty outdated windows mobile. Because of an open system, not this closed sh*t. Seriously, why should anybody pick Windows Mobile 7 with the same shortcomings as the iPhone, when the iPhone got perfected for 4 years prior to the new MS OS ... with a whole more of useful apps.
But since android is a nice alternative with lots of customization-options and multitasking, I don't really care about MS f*cking up Windows Mobile 7. Would be nice if they didn't though ...
CAN IT BE UPGRADED TO WINDOWS MOBILE??
does it support windows mobile to be installed on it??
Even if it's possible, I don't think "upgrading" is the correct term.
he might means wp7S
Why would you buy a brand new Android phone and even want to change the OS - astounded!!
I think he means "porting" to WM. I am also wondering if this would be possible to port to WM7S with this device, although, strict hardware chassis requirements would be required (Back, Start and Search button on all Windows Phone 7 Series devices).
I didnt think it was possible to run WM on an android phone, i always thought that android on WM was only possible
Currently, there is no way of installing Windows Mobile on any Android phone
But you can install Android on Windows Mobile on selected devices.
Porting WP7 to the desire would be a downgrade, not an upgrade. WP7 is going to be even more watered down than the iPhone OS, and a trident based web browser... no thanks
Oh dear, getting deja vu feelings here. Let's say it's a recurring topic when new Android devices come out And every time the replies are about the same lol
WP7 offers classic mode
If the news is true and not an April Fool's joke, WP7 will offer a classic mode download once it's launched and we will be able to run all wm6.5.3 programs on it, similar to WinXP mode on Win7. This will be a good reason to port over to WP7 right?
Edit:
Oh well, after doing just a bit more googling it appears to be just another joke.
crasher said:
If the news is true and not an April Fool's joke, WP7 will offer a classic mode download once it's launched and we will be able to run all wm6.5.3 programs on it, similar to WinXP mode on Win7. This will be a good reason to port over to WP7 right?
Edit:
Oh well, after doing just a bit more googling it appears to be just another joke.
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I actually believe it would be easier just to make kind of Windows Mobile emulator or virtualization, something like wine on linux to run wm classic software on android rather than porting to proprietary platform
patasenko said:
I actually believe it would be easier just to make kind of Windows Mobile emulator or virtualization, something like wine on linux to run wm classic software on android rather than porting to proprietary platform
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WINE exists for desktop linux but it's been developed on for years. I'm sure something is possible it's just a case of who would want to adopt and code such a product. And anyway, I think if something was attempted it would be to emulate iPhone apps on Android not WM apps.
I couldn't believe the title of this thread. WHY would anyone want to do this ?
Stick to Android. It will fair you well.
easy
Actually, its remarkably simple to get your Desire to run an almost identical experience to Windows Mobile. Just put it on the floor, and then stamp on it at least fifteen times. Then leave it in the bath for at least an hour.
Upgraded?!?
Windows Mobile is dead and Windows Phone 7 sucks balls, it's worse than iPhone OS.
Nice reactions to Windows Mobile!
I only had wm5 on an old mda compact ii, just got my desire with android and OMG, who would ever take android off their phone? !
profet said:
Actually, its remarkably simple to get your Desire to run an almost identical experience to Windows Mobile. Just put it on the floor, and then stamp on it at least fifteen times. Then leave it in the bath for at least an hour.
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LMFAO!!
At least there wasn't any flaming of the OP this time....
Why would you want to port winmo-CRAP to an android phone like the HTC Desire ???????????????????/
While I'm not a fan of microsoft in general, I have a Topaz presently and I do like both the phone and the HTC Sense/TF3D interface. I also have a collection of apps that I've grown quite fond of, apps that AFAIK don't have any Android counterparts.
In fact, the only things I'd like to improve on the Topaz is a slightly larger screen and much faster CPU. If I could have the Desire with winmo 6.5 or 6.5.x this would fit the bill perfectly.
I know of the supposed HTC Obsession/Diamond 3, but it's supposed to run WP7 and with the kind of functionality sacrifices that means (copy/paste, multitasking, no 3rp party UIs/skins) I'm not tempted.
Each to their own, live and let live. Just because you don't understand why, doesn't make it wrong.
Why on earth would anyone want to install WM on the Desire??
I think its possible like some of the members said, using WINE or something, but i doubt that anyone would be interested (maybe just for experimental purposes)
profet said:
Actually, its remarkably simple to get your Desire to run an almost identical experience to Windows Mobile. Just put it on the floor, and then stamp on it at least fifteen times. Then leave it in the bath for at least an hour.
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Made my day!
Source : http://news.softpedia.com/news/2-Ne...ors-of-Windows-Embedded-Handheld-144898.shtml
Microsoft has announced two new Windows operating system releases planned for delivery this year and the next, both essentially flavors of the same platform. The plain vanilla version of Windows Embedded Handheld will be launched in the second half of 2010, while its successor, Windows Embedded Handheld 7, will drop one year later, in the second half of 2011. The two upcoming Windows releases have the new Windows Embedded Handheld platform at the core, announced by the Redmond company on June 17th, 2010.
its could be the rise of the dead for Winmo
Looks pretty awesome but also looks like its aimed at tablets. The videos all show a tablet style device and not a phone.
A little more info here:
http://www.fiercemobilecontent.com/press-releases/microsoft-outlines-commitment-future-enterprise-handheld-devices
...with a picture of a PHONE about half way down. Looks similar to a b.berry.
Yep, I saw that already, but it's all but clear... All the hardware they present are featuring a tiny screen and a huge keyboard, just unlike the recent touch phone PDAs.
It's unclear either if it will be a sequel from Windows CE or Windows Mobile.
BTW, the connection with Windows Phone 7, or even a possible Windows Mobile 7 pro, isn't established at all.
For now, it just looks like microsoft suddenly realized that WP 7 announcement has frightened their professional customers and try to get them back with some really unprecise project...
Wait and see, but what I'm reading across the Net shows a strong tendency of many users to run towards Android instead.
Z80-Man said:
Wait and see, but what I'm reading across the Net shows a strong tendency of many users to run towards Android instead.
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Well, that trend started way before anything was announced about WP7. And it is reinforced by the fact that all new handsets are released with Android. Also, operators like Verizon are pushing Android like crazy and there have been numerous accounts of people being advised in VZW stores that WM is worthless crap and they shouldn't buy it.
Z80-Man said:
It's unclear either if it will be a sequel from Windows CE or Windows Mobile.
BTW, the connection with Windows Phone 7, or even a possible Windows Mobile 7 pro, isn't established at all.
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The Windows Embedded Newsroom has articles that state that the first edition will be based on WM6.5 and the 2nd Version will be based on the same core as WP7. Whether or not they stick with the 'mobile' tag for the OS is unknown.
See this link for the a page that goes into a little detail: http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2010/jun10/06-17EnterpriseHandheld.mspx
It's not correct, The first edition will be a successor of WM6.5.3 (based on Windows CE 5), the second will be something we can name WM7 based on the Windows CE 7 core.
They skip WinCE 6 as base for this specific OS.
Similar choices you can see for Windows Auto or Windows NavReady.
Our actual application based on .NET CF 3.5 will probably continue to work on the new platform.
This looks hot... can't wait to try it. I wanna see more pics
To general I say!
~~Tito~~
Yes, that's correct. Windows Phone 7 will NOT be officially supported on anything that is currently on the market. Microsoft has repeatedly stated this. It has rather high end specs that very few phones on the market can even support. In addition, Microsoft has a very firm mandate on things such as having the 3, and only 3, buttons on the front of the device.
So will someone here be able to port WP7 to a current device, unofficially? It depends on which device. Does your phone have a Snapdragon CPU? If the answer is no then there is very, and I mean very, little chance of your phone ever seeing WP7. There's a few reasons but the first and foremost being that all of the binaries are compiled with the ARMv7 instruction set. So basically the only phones (that I know of) are the HTC HD2, Acer neotouch, and Toshiba TG01. The most likely is the HD2 which is actively being worked on by Da_G and probably some other people. Several Android phones also sport the snapdragon but we've yet to see an android phone with WM6 running on it so I doubt we'll see WP7 on one either. So I won't straight up rule out other phones from getting some sort of WP7 hack but it's extremely unlikely. If it somehow does, expect the performance to be extremely crappy. There's a reason MS set the requirements to what they did.
Mods: please sticky.
Stickied. WP7/CE6/(future CE7) is quite the different ball game from WM2003/WM5/WM6/WM6.5/CE5/CE5.x...
There's also the LG Expo which runs QSD/ARMv7, so is a possible target.
The major hurdle with porting is that our current devices contain Radio ROMs, Drivers, and Bootloaders which all target the CE5.x platform. CE6+ is a different beast on a low level (in a good way, there are major improvements across the board which required breaking API compatibility - these improvements have been long overdue)
With access to whitepapers documenting the hardware's interface(s) and initialization routines, Platform Builder for WP7, and a good bit of time it's certainly possible to bring any platform supporting ARMv7 up to WP7. However such information/software is not public, so it's up to the OEM to either develop this (not at all likely) or release the requisite platform BSP (also not at all likely) to enable anyone to port their devices to WP7.
There are other possible methods such as emulation, but the amount of work involved would outweigh the end result by a good margin. The OEMs major concerns with porting ROMs is the sharing of 3rd party software to which they are not authorized to license distribution (for example, HTC licenses WM from MSFT, and also licenses a number of other technologies such as swype)
One possible solution for this in an ideal world is for Qualcomm to license HTC to distribute a binary-only driver solution, similar to Nvidias driver license on *nix. Combining that with HTC's own OEM specific binary-only libraries, would give us a bare-bones Platform BSP. This would contain only technologies owned by Qualcomm and HTC. They could then release this bare bones, binary-only, pre-linking BSP, and we could, on our end, combine it with the WP7 Platform Builder, and come out with a completely stock WP7 ROM.
This would allow us to constantly update the OS version, add our own 3rd party software as needed, and eliminate the need to use "cooking" tools to build a ROM (instead we could use MSFT's own PB or a derivative of such)
In this situation there wouldn't be any licensing issues outside of Qualcomm and HTC's own IP. Will they ever do this? I doubt it. But it would be very, very nice! It would satisfy the OEM's requirement that we don't redistribute 3rd party software, and satisfy our own needs to tweak our phones to perfection. Note that Qualcomm/HTC is interchangable with any SoC developer and any OEM. Rather than Qualcomm/HTC it could be Texas Instruments/Samsung, or xxxx/yyyy
Of course there are some other snags with this (WP7 Platform Builder is not publicly available), but one can dream right?
Side note, for more info on what a BSP is from the horses mouth, look here.
Da_G, respecting all the tries that have been made till now, if ever Windows Phone 7 would be ported it would be on very certain device - like lg expo or hd2, as per the hardware requirements. it would be better to buy a windows phone 7 device than buying and porting wp7 on the above devices.
microsoft is trying to create a hype for windows phone 7, and is in the news though not much. almost all windows mobile OEMs are making wp7 devices. if an OEM is making a device with high end specs, it won't port its own software(ui) on the buggy windows mobile, but will buy license for let's say android or why not wp7. we have seen how the OEM tried hard to optimise windows mobile 6.1 and 6.5 on snapdragon. windows mobile still got the future but with limited hardware..
I am one of many owners of an HD2.
Who will lose is the MS.
Will lose many WM7 ambassadors..... will a HD2 owner, buy a new WM7 device ?.......no!.......we will port the HD2 to Android, and become one more Droid embassador.
This is the business of MS in the world of smartphones.....a no upgrade SO\Device seller.
Why would you swap to Android? When you need a new phone, a WP7 would make a good replacement for any Windows Mobile device.
Windcape said:
Why would you swap to Android? When you need a new phone, a WP7 would make a good replacement for any Windows Mobile device.
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Because its Android....its open source, its just better ok, dont question!
i think the issue is that the HD2 is more than capable of doing a lot more than it currently does and i for one have an issue with upgrading phones because of software, if i want an upgrade its for hardware reasons so naturally if other OS's can be ported to the HD2 then it will sustain my device a bit longer. until its no longer able to run what i want it to run.
Android phones are as open source as iPhones are (Android OS, and Darwin OS is open source, most of the rest is closed-source modifications).
Anyway, I don't think it's Microsoft's choice if HD2 get WP7 or not, but HTCs. And HTC look forward to a large profit margin by selling extra much hardware this year, so obviously they wouldn't want to upgrade HD2 -- at least not the first six months.
Windcape said:
Why would you swap to Android? When you need a new phone, a WP7 would make a good replacement for any Windows Mobile device.
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Click to collapse
Because I paid well for it,a shortly time, and i dont want to spend more money, to bought a new Device, always MS upgrade the OS....opposite of the top devices with Android or iphone.
was my mistake, I can not blame anyone else, I was naive in thinking that it would take a WM7 upgrade due to good specs of HD2.
my mistake.
But I will not throw out my HD2
For the iPhone you get a upgrade for a small price, for Android you're completely relying on the mercy of your manufacturer. And the less you pay, the less chance in hell there is you get a update, special for Android phones.
You're being naive if you think Android is any different here.
3 buttons is a must? Nog sure if that could be true... some manufacturers would be left out/give up themselves because of this constraint.
7 for phones... MSFT is losing smartphones market share. Trust me... they will make it available for the... gen pop
Is this suppose to be news? I though everyone knew by now that WM7 will not be supporting current Winmo phones....
It's not meant to be news, it's meant to stop people asking will WP7 be ported to my TP2/Diamond2/(insert current wm phone name here) question
Does this mean WP7 can only be for snapdragon and not OMAP, hummingbird, tegra 2 and all the other arm cpu's out there?
ari-free said:
Does this mean WP7 can only be for snapdragon and not OMAP, hummingbird, tegra 2 and all the other arm cpu's out there?
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Little is officially known about this however it's believed that at first only Snapdragon will be supported. But with Samsung being a partner and other companies certainly wanting choice, it won't last forever. Samsung devices very well may have a Hummingbird but Samsung would just have to develop more of the drivers whereas MSFT is developing everything for Snapdragon.
I just assumed older arm cpu's wouldn't be supported. But only snapdragon? ugh...
I'm not a big fan of HTC because they insist on using snapdragons in their supposedly high end phones.
btw Samsung will probably not use hummingbird in future phones because Apple bought out intrinsity. But I can't imagine them wanting to use snapdragon...they'd probably want to use the OMAP4 which has the same powerVR GPU, the SGX540. OMAP3's cpu is actually better than hummingbird so I don't think anyone will be crying over the Apple acquisition.
In my opinion, HTC could disable a couple of the buttons on my HD2 if it made it applicable for WP7. Though, on the other hand, I see as much reason to upgrade to WP7 as to go for an iPhone. I'd rather iPuke my iGuts out. WP7 looks iAweful and I think it iSucks pretty bad.
I understand Microsoft's rationale for making the specs as strict as they have, as this is the sole reason iPoo...iPhone is so stable. There's simply no room for flawed drivers, and there's only one "option"
ari-free said:
I just assumed older arm cpu's wouldn't be supported. But only snapdragon? ugh...
I'm not a big fan of HTC because they insist on using snapdragons in their supposedly high end phones.
btw Samsung will probably not use hummingbird in future phones because Apple bought out intrinsity. But I can't imagine them wanting to use snapdragon...they'd probably want to use the OMAP4 which has the same powerVR GPU, the SGX540. OMAP3's cpu is actually better than hummingbird so I don't think anyone will be crying over the Apple acquisition.
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I thought Samsung owned/designed Hummingbird?
But at any rate, MSFT will likely open it up later on. They're just keeping it simple for now. Not enough of a difference to start writing/testing drivers for all these different platforms.
tiwas said:
In my opinion, HTC could disable a couple of the buttons on my HD2 if it made it applicable for WP7.
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Having seen videos on how the camera button works, you can now understand why you cant just bodge WP7 onto a HD2.
DMAND said:
Having seen videos on how the camera button works, you can now understand why you cant just bodge WP7 onto a HD2.
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Their internal test devices didn't have hardware camera buttons.
Yes but all retail ones will, one that require half presses for focusing which none of the hd2 buttons could be forced to do if I'm correct.
Ok, so here is my theory why it is taking Microsoft so long to release updates and bug fixes. I think the Windows Phone team is currently recoding Metro to run on top of Windows 8 instead of Windows CE. All the updates they are talking about down the road will be integrated into the new Windows 8 platform. Anyone else think this may be the case.
randude said:
Ok, so here is my theory why it is taking Microsoft so long to release updates and bug fixes. I think the Windows Phone team is currently recoding Metro to run on top of Windows 8 instead of Windows CE. All the updates they are talking about down the road will be integrated into the new Windows 8 platform. Anyone else think this may be the case.
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Click to collapse
That'd be EPIC if it were true.
I'm fairly confident that WP8 will indeed run ontop of Windows 8.
why ?
why would you want wp8 when 7 is still so immature ? a complete rewrite again ? id rather see wp7 mature and actually be updated as promised before a new version was beta'd.
ohgood said:
why would you want wp8 when 7 is still so immature ? a complete rewrite again ? id rather see wp7 mature and actually be updated as promised before a new version was beta'd.
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Click to collapse
I very much enjoy my WP7 device thank you. There is no reason for me not to want a WP8 next year.
In any case, merging Windows CE and Windows "proper" makes perfect sense. I see no good reason to maintain two completely different codebases (Windows CE and Windows 8) once Windows runs on ARM. In many ways there is no need for a complete rewrite as Windows CE (albeit very old) was always the ARM (or, mobile if you wish) version of Windows - it includes many of the very same underlaying principles.
What many people are missing is that WP7 is not an OS as such, the OS is Windows CE. WP7 is the shell. Porting this to Windows 8 should require much less effort than maintaining WinCE.
Since [most] all third-party WP7 apps are frameworked it also means any existing apps will work on WP8.
If done correctly (and I know, this is Microsoft we are talking about - chances are slim) it would also enable devs to code/design apps for Windows Phone and Windows Slate simultaneously. Rather than offer two different versions the app would adapt to the form-factor it's currently running on.
I think they have to. Especially at the rate the competition is going, they will have to merge. They will have to do it fast, if they want to stay relevant.
from what I've read, many people feel that Microsoft will release "Mango" as 7.5, and then WP8 to coencide with Windows 8...bumping up a version number doesn't mean it's a total rewrite...just that it adds enough features to be considered a major enough update to get a new number. For example, iOS 4 wasn't a rewrite of iOS 3, and android 2.x isn't a total rewrite of android 1.x
vetvito said:
I think they have to. Especially at the rate the competition is going, they will have to merge. They will have to do it fast, if they want to stay relevant.
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Yep, and I'm sure Apple is going to have OS/X on Phones and Tablets next year.
I swear some of you people don't even think this through completely before making such baseless statements.
There's nothing saying they have to merge.
Windows just needed ARM support, which is basically done (and Microsoft probably was working on it for years beforehand - CE already basically worked on ARM and they've supported other platforms in the past) and of course another UI layer which they are working on.
However, this says nothing about the tons of Windows Apps which are optimized for non-touch keyboard+mouse use that will be basically broken on a touchscreen device.
You can use any HP touchscreen computer and see just how clunky a Win32 application is on a touchscreen computer. I don't see a majority of vendors running to revamp their application UIs to support touch, and a UI layer cannot do this on the fly due to the multitude of layouts, etc. used in Win32 applications.
Most vendors will basically have to create a touch and non-touch version of their applications.
That's why Apple is using iOS and not OS/X on their iPad. Icons and Widgets work better on larger tablet screens than Tiles, so while WP7 looks great on phones and certainly scales really well to larger/higher res displays... It would look terribad on a tablet, and lead to a ridiculous amount of wasted screen real estate.
I swear you must have misinterpreted my post.
Who said anything about OSX on a phone?
Jobs already said that wouldn't happen. IOS, WebOS(debatable) , and Android will continue to pave the future. Unless Microsoft does something, and I'm not talking about a Windows 7 tablet.
Windows is slow as hell compared to the competition. Look at Windows Media Center, and loom at Google TV, Apple TV.
ohgood said:
why would you want wp8 when 7 is still so immature ? a complete rewrite again ? id rather see wp7 mature and actually be updated as promised before a new version was beta'd.
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Click to collapse
That does not explain why MS failed to solve all the bugs listed here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=9153088&postcount=1
the NoDo update, that arrived so late, shall logically have solved must of the above mentioned bugs/issues. But it didn't.
What are MS waiting for? They behave like they have no competitors.
If the applications are all managed code than who cares whether it's WinCE or Win32?
vangrieg said:
If the applications are all managed code than who cares whether it's WinCE or Win32?
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There are some differences between Silverlight on Windows Phone and Desktop. I believe Silverlight on Windows Phone is a fork of Silverlight 3, whereas the desktop is currently Silverlight 4. It'd be nice to see them converge at Silverlight 5 (crossing fingers for MIX 2011). I've heard plenty of rumors that Microsoft is at work on the compatibility issues.
Sure, but Silverlight can be updated with or without changing the underlying OS.
N8ter said:
I swear some of you people don't even think this through completely before making such baseless statements.
There's nothing saying they have to merge.
Windows just needed ARM support, which is basically done (and Microsoft probably was working on it for years beforehand - CE already basically worked on ARM and they've supported other platforms in the past) and of course another UI layer which they are working on.
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You're right - there is nothing saying they have to. It makes sense business wise though. Rather than having two teams working full out maintaining two similar yet very different OSes they can have one team working on maintaining one OS running on both platforms.
CE does run on ARM, it has done so for years and it's been in use in the enterprise sector for as long. Problem is, WinCE, even in it's later versions is old tech. Not just from a UI perspective but the core OS is old tech.
N8ter said:
However, this says nothing about the tons of Windows Apps which are optimized for non-touch keyboard+mouse use that will be basically broken on a touchscreen device.
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They won't be broken. They will function just as they have always done - with a mouse and/or keyboard. You can't take any old Win32 app and run it on ARM anyway, that's not the idea behind it at all.
N8ter said:
Most vendors will basically have to create a touch and non-touch version of their applications.
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Again, no. They don't have to do anything of the kind. They can do so to stay relevant - especially if their app is the type of app that would be useful on a tablet, but they don't have to. Just because Win8 will have a tablet specific UI does not mean it will not also have the old desktop UI we're all used to. You need to make a distinction between OS and UI, they are two very different things.
arturobandini said:
That does not explain why MS failed to solve all the bugs listed here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=9153088&postcount=1
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While I agree, there are still some bugs in the OS, NoDo did fix the major ones. Most of the remaining ones are non reproducible or actually "as designed". Also, many of them are not OS bugs but rather bugs that only appear on certain handsets.
PG2G said:
There are some differences between Silverlight on Windows Phone and Desktop. I believe Silverlight on Windows Phone is a fork of Silverlight 3, whereas the desktop is currently Silverlight 4. It'd be nice to see them converge at Silverlight 5 (crossing fingers for MIX 2011). I've heard plenty of rumors that Microsoft is at work on the compatibility issues.
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True, but that's of little concern really. As long as SLx is backwards compatible - which it will be, all existing apps will continue to run just fine. Also, with Silverlight finally coming to the Xbox they have all three screens covered (personally I would have preferred a new iteration of Media Center, but there's still time for that) - TV, Desktop and Mobile. The idea is that we as developers can code/design for the audience rather than the platform. Great things ahead if you ask me.
vetvito said:
I swear you must have misinterpreted my post.
Who said anything about OSX on a phone?
Jobs already said that wouldn't happen. IOS, WebOS(debatable) , and Android will continue to pave the future. Unless Microsoft does something, and I'm not talking about a Windows 7 tablet.
Windows is slow as hell compared to the competition. Look at Windows Media Center, and loom at Google TV, Apple TV.
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AppleTV and GoogleTV are Appliance products. Microsoft did have a TV thing a while back, but that's another story. Windows Media Center is fine.
If people aren't expecting Apple to put OS/X on tablets, etc. Why would you make a statement basically they have no choice but to merge WP7 and Windows eventually?
Also, I was talking about Windows 8 (which runs on ARM, and is coming with touch UI), not Windows 7...
N8ter said:
AppleTV and GoogleTV are Appliance products. Microsoft did have a TV thing a while back, but that's another story. Windows Media Center is fine.
If people aren't expecting Apple to put OS/X on tablets, etc. Why would you make a statement basically they have no choice but to merge WP7 and Windows eventually?
Also, I was talking about Windows 8 (which runs on ARM, and is coming with touch UI), not Windows 7...
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My choice of words was wrong. My bad. I was meaning that they should do something, something faster than what they are doing. Phones are moving closer and closer to PC capabilities.
Windows Media Center sucks balls compared to Google TV, and Apple TV. I'm seriously thinking about throwing my HTPC out the window. Its embarrassing. I mentioned it because Microsoft basically invented this market, and now they've been left behind. Sort of like what's going on now.
vetvito said:
Windows Media Center sucks balls compared to Google TV, and Apple TV. I'm seriously thinking about throwing my HTPC out the window. Its embarrassing. I mentioned it because Microsoft basically invented this market, and now they've been left behind. Sort of like what's going on now.
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Windows Media Center is still the absolute best platform out there. Google TV has nothing on MC7. That said, they [MS] have definitely mismanaged the "platform", I say "platform" because Microsoft never saw it as a platform (God knows why?!). WES (Windows Embedded - which is basically a modularized version of Windows 7) should change this though. There were a few MC7 appliances on show at CES earlier this year and if they can deliver they will kill the competition.
From a WAF perspective nothing is close to MC7. From a live TV perspective the other platforms aren't even in the same ballpark.
emigrating said:
Windows Media Center is still the absolute best platform out there. Google TV has nothing on MC7. That said, they [MS] have definitely mismanaged the "platform", I say "platform" because Microsoft never saw it as a platform (God knows why?!). WES (Windows Embedded - which is basically a modularized version of Windows 7) should change this though. There were a few MC7 appliances on show at CES earlier this year and if they can deliver they will kill the competition.
From a WAF perspective nothing is close to MC7. From a live TV perspective the other platforms aren't even in the same ballpark.
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I'd like to know more. Honestly elaborate more. Media Center is awfully slow compared to Google TV. I don't have a gtv, but I demoed it. You can search for shows and the web in a overlay of what you're currently watching on gtv. On my HTPC running windows 7, that's impossible. Starting Media Center is unbelievably slow, and browsing through media in media center is not fun. Its laggy as hell. On GTV its instant.
vetvito said:
I'd like to know more. Honestly elaborate more. Media Center is awfully slow compared to Google TV. I don't have a gtv, but I demoed it. You can search for shows and the web in a overlay of what you're currently watching on gtv. On my HTPC running windows 7, that's impossible. Starting Media Center is unbelievably slow, and browsing through media in media center is not fun. Its laggy as hell. On GTV its instant.
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If you find MC7 to be slow there is a problem with your machine (either hardware or software wise). I'm running it on several HTPCs in the house and there is no lag what so ever.
Comparing it to Google TV is kind of like comparing apples and oranges. They are both fruits, but that's pretty much it. Google TV does not have a live TV option as such - you have to feed the output of your DVR or whatever thru the gtv box. MC7 on the other hand accepts tuners (either local or remote) and acts as your DVR.
If you press the Guide button on your MC7 remote while watching TV it will overlay ontop of what you're watching, exactly like gtv. The guide is also one of the best in the industry (depending on your location of course). You also get [some] internet TV built in, but more can be added by installing a Hulu plugin. In addition you have Netflix etc.
I will agree that browsing the media on MC7 using the built-in functionality is rather lacking, but there are plenty of third-party apps that help with this. myTV is great for downloaded/recorded TV shows and My Movies is great for movies.
I've been using HTPCs for around 10 years and MC7 is IMO still the best option available and I've tried them all - multiple times
I'm running on a AMD 6000, dual core 3.2 ghz. 4gb of ram. That's more than enough for media.
Have you tried XBMC? It runs circles around Media Center. I haven't tried those plugins you mentioned, I will do that today.