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Attention NOOBS. I'm becoming less patient with your posts that include whining and redundancy. This forum isn't here to provide you with all the comforts of your carrier. These roms and installing them is for people who are advanced users of WM. If you need your device for work or if you're new to PocketPCs this isn't the place for you. These roms aren't for you so please stick to your carriers’ rom.
The chefs of these roms aren't here to help you setup your device and to solve all of your issues. If you have issues read, search and fix them. The research is part of the fun...finding fixes is part of the fun. Finding new ways to configure your device and setups is FUN. By asking first you're not participating in the best part of the forum. Questions like...my keyboard is wrong and it doesn't look different or I can't connect to the internet are redundant. Those questions have been asked, answered and fixed OVER-AND-OVER AGAIN....WHY KEEP ASKING?
I'm not anti-noob. I was a noob once and I am still a noob in many ways. I also know that there are some good noobs in the forum. But I'm tired of taking the time to read the threads for critical information and coming across posts for how to install a new theme or where did the backlight on my keyboard go. That's where your user manual or the HTC website comes in. For Cingular people you have a great resource over @ the Cingular forums.
This is a community of like minded technical individuals. This is not HTC tech support or your carriers support. No one here owes you ANYTHING. You install a rom it's on you. If you can't take the responsibility then don't install the rom. It's pretty simple really.
I just had to get that off my chest. I'm sick and cranky but that only played a small role.
Again TIP YOUR CHEF!!!!! and donate to XDA. To all of you that make this a interactive vibrant technical-minded environment THANK YOU!
When I posted this the first time I was trying to prevent what has eventually happened. We've lost one of our genius rom Chefs. So...thanks guys!
Admins....
As for fixing the "noob" issue...I think there is one pretty good solution.
I think the only way to fix such an issue is to either restrict new users from they'll use that period of time to read. Because if they choose to install a rom and they know they can't post a question they'll probably be more apt to read.
I agree with Xultar that a minimum registration period before posting should be enforced, and any BLATANT stupidity should reset the period.
This seems like the best idea. Someone mentioned having a sub forum only accessible by experienced members. Denying read access to the masses however would make this a very exclusive club, which I do feel strongly about.
I am still a relative noob, but found this site and was reading away well before getting my first WM device. It was partly this site that gave me the confidence to try such a device instead of a dumb phone. If I had looked around and seen only the stupid questions, with an inaccessible sub forum that I could not read, then I would have moved on elsewhere and not discovered all the things I have.
I guess it all depends what the key developers here want to achieve. If it is an exclusive club where everyone is a technical whiz then OK I am screwed and will miss this forum. That decision is however entirely theirs to make and no one has the right to tell them what they should or should not do or judge them in any way.
Along with many who do try to avoid asking stupid questions and do try and RTFW first, I can only hope that they choose to try and spread the word so to speak - don't mean to sound all preachy and religious - and that a way can be found to reduce the hassle they get from morons.
I remember seeing one of Sleuth's posts - he said he took no responsibility if anyone chose to use that bit of software and if you bricked your phone it was on you and hard luck. He also added that if that did happen, he would however do his best to help fix any issues. Exactly what I wanted - I knew the risk and choice was mine, but knowing that someone with a lot of knowledge would try and help was very reassuring.
Anyway, thanks to all the deveopers who have helped with the Hermes forum, and to anyone who wants to flame me, just please keep it civil. (There has been rather too much rudeness recently, as tensions seem to have increased... - just my view)
I agree, a "seniors only" forum section would be advantagous but would repell alot of potential members.
I made my guides to help the newbies along the way but i have always said to read the threads and RTFM in order to increase thier knowledge of the various things we do here. Yet still I get very STUPID questions which have been addressed in the guides, why should I write them if people arent going to read them correctly!?!? (rant over hehe) Thankfully on the whole I havent had so many annoyances as jass and the rest have.
I figure this is like a game of lemmings, theres only so many levels you can go through guiding them on the way before you lose your rag and blow them all to hell!!
If people have simply signed up to get thier chosen version of WM6 then piss off thats exactly NOT what we want! ROM chefs dont spend the time to cook these ROMs for people to just download then come back whining when they dont fucntion as they want.
As I've frequented my fair amount of forums, I'd suggest for specific ROM Downloads, or Radio Downloads, Cab files, that users there me be a hidden link and set for users to see if they have a certain amount of posts. Good to that is that you will see Quickly who is simply spamming to get access. Just a thought... I've been able to SuperCid, and Sim Unlock, as well as upgrade to WM6, just by reading several posts and the WIKI. It's really not that difficult.
Even me would not be able to access with some of these restrictions, but that is alright as something like this is very much needed.
ROMS = 50 posts, or active for 8- 12 months
Radio = 40 posts, or active 6 months
CAB files = 25 posts or active 3 months, etc...
Thoughts???
mrvanx said:
If people have simply signed up to get thier chosen version of WM6 then piss off thats exactly NOT what we want! ROM chefs dont spend the time to cook these ROMs for people to just download then come back whining when they dont fucntion as they want.
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Click to collapse
I agree - I joined up before you could even SIM unlock without going through EMEI check. I joined up so as to learn about my device and then help spread the knowledge if I could.
It will be harder to sift out those hit and run artists however. Perhaps say a three month delay before you can download or post? removes the quick fix junkies hopefully - although unfortunately many will now be registered already. Perhaps if the post count is under an arbitrary number then the posting delay would come in, but you could PM a moderator to show you had not asked silly questions and get it revoked? Maybe too much work for mods though.
Agreed, I dont think I have been guilty of blatant stupidity, I have bricked my phone once but enough reading around the various forums and its fixed and fine.
If you arent capable of learning for yourself, you have no real business being here, you certainly shouldnt be flashing a £2-300 phone then complaining when it goes tits up.
PhatFarms approach sounds workable though.
Sad to see Jasjamming go, that kind of altruism is pretty rare these days......
chrisjasper said:
Agreed, I dont think I have been guilty of blatant stupidity, I have bricked my phone once but enough reading around the various forums and its fixed and fine.
If you arent capable of learning for yourself, you have no real business being here, you certainly shouldnt be flashing a £2-300 phone then complaining when it goes tits up.
PhatFarms approach sounds workable though.
Sad to see Jasjamming go, that kind of altruism is pretty rare these days......
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Click to collapse
hey guys,
im not going, just laying low for a while till things settle down and become a developer forum again, or atleast not a howard forum.
Good luck sport, maybe now you will have more free time and your wife wont be taking your credit cards away......
Great ideas.
Let's just add taking money for reading the posts (and sending money to the posters) and we will kill this forum forever.
The whole Internet idea, if you like it or not, is to share information freely.
There will always be the lamers that will ask their stupid question, and there always be the people that will share their great work with the others.
Anyone (from either side) can join or leave anytime he like.
Jasjamming (The "black guy") did a great job, I relay mean it.
But his leave would not end the great work of this forum.
l hope he will change his mind and decide to continue his work with the others even that some lamers are here.
I think a senior forum would work.
Sure all the ROMs would leak out onto bittorrent etc, but surely that doesn't actually matter? It would be to stop the n00bs moaning about dead phones. if they don't have the rights, they can't post regardless of if they have the ROM or not.
jasjamming said:
hey guys,
im not going, just laying low for a while till things settle down and become a developer forum again, or atleast not a howard forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least you can sleep now?
Jas... do you want me to remove your ROM from my mirror? I noticed you removed your own download link, but I don't know where you stand on mirrors?
It's sad to see ppl who don't want to learn join and ask stupid question.
I have joined since 2005 but never post once
Yes! this is my first post!! haha
I want to thank jasjamming for his hard work... and all the ROM chef.
One of the things that has caused an increase in NooB's (in my opionion) is that knowledge of these roms (as well as links) get posted on to howard forums and those same users come rushing in to download the files without paying attention to the fact that this isn't the HTC customer support forum. I agree with what JJ ended up doing only cause I am STILL reading through that forum and have only spotted about 4-6 actual issues the rest are repeats or dumb comments (up to page 42).
Personaly I am far from a developer, but taking the time reading through threads has given me a lot of knowledge about what my device can do.
I like the ideas of having some kind of feature that NooB's can join, and even download, but at their own risk, and after a waiting period can then post etc. even if you make it just for the WM6 forums until a branded official rom is released in q3
Im wondering what the mods opinion is on this issue??
I think probably the best thing to do is as phatfarm suggested, a postcount limit which you must have before you can download an attachment? Thing is the wiki does have the links to the various ROMs so thats the way you get around it.
mrvanx said:
Im wondering what the mods opinion is on this issue??
I think probably the best thing to do is as phatfarm suggested, a postcount limit which you must have before you can download an attachment? Thing is the wiki does have the links to the various ROMs so thats the way you get around it.
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That in conjunction with a 30 day waiting period would work for Noobs.
I totally Agree
I totally agree with you guys. It's sad to see how things have turned out lately. I have been to this site off and on for a few years now (just reading actually), and loved everything that I read. Now in a sense I can be called a noob (I joined in 2/07), but technically I am not. I am coming from the symbian os (Nokia N93) and the minute that I got my windows mobile phone (February of this year - 8525), I joined this site. I read and read and read, never really felt the need to post, because you can find everything you need either by the wiki or just plain clicking on the search button, but I guess most people don't see that button
Anyway, I agree that something should be done to stop what has been happening in the last month, but I don't think that saying we should have a senior member forum only or you have to have this amount of post to get it, will work. Because if you look at JJ's, Kyphurs, LVSW threads, you will see that there were people who had a lot post and even a few junior and senior members who complained and questioned. There are a lot of people who come on and actually read and never post, because they search and figure things out without having to question these great chefs. I personally don't want to have to come on here and began to post everyday to get to junior and/or senior status. I never once complained since being here and believe me, since the release of these WM6 roms (Kyphur's first), I have been flashing 2-3 times per week. So much, my wife has gotten sick of it.
I think, you should continue to let people join and continue to flash, with the understanding that, they are doing everything at their own risk. What I think should be done is, people who have been a member for 3-6 months or less would have to have there post/threads approved by the mod's before it could be posted. Sought of like on myspace when you post your initial pic, they tell you that it is pending approval and that it if approved, it should be posted within 24 hours. They even have a function where you can have it set on your page, that if a person leaves you a comment, it will not post until it has been approved by you. You can either delete or post it. That's how I have my page set up. It would be a lot more work on the mod's, (I don't even know if that is capable), but it would cut back a lot of stress on all of the chefs and even the people who really sit and read/search and get the answers that they need.
What do yo think?
True, this would be much more easier to contain if M$ didn't shut down the ability to put roms on the FTP. People could earn their way in, maybe give access to certain users could be a lot of admin work entering all the compliant users, I would be willing to help with something to that degree, giving time to those that spend countless hours helping out people like me.
JuniorPhatFarm said:
As I've frequented my fair amount of forums, I'd suggest for specific ROM Downloads, or Radio Downloads, Cab files, that users there me be a hidden link and set for users to see if they have a certain amount of posts. Good to that is that you will see Quickly who is simply spamming to get access. Just a thought... I've been able to SuperCid, and Sim Unlock, as well as upgrade to WM6, just by reading several posts and the WIKI. It's really not that difficult.
Even me would not be able to access with some of these restrictions, but that is alright as something like this is very much needed.
ROMS = 50 posts, or active for 8- 12 months
Radio = 40 posts, or active 6 months
CAB files = 25 posts or active 3 months, etc...
Thoughts???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Idea sounds good but the noobs do tend to post a lot....
Most of it rubbish or repeated requests over and over and over...........
Another problem is that some of us (like me) have not been on the forums long but are far from noobs because we have only just switched to a hermes from another PDA
Suggest big sign on front page:
THIS IS NOT A SUPPORT SITE
Perhaps longer than thirty days? If you are serious about this stuff then there is sooooo much to read and understand, and then read again. This would hopefully avoid all the
"I just bricked my phone! - HELP ME"
or
"I want Crossbow - where can I download it"
where people do not read first.
Postcount limits might encourage lots of one line no purpose posts, and to sort the good from the bad requires a lot of time and effort from mods.
self inflicted problem?
one of the problems is that most *interesting* posts (new releases, etc) are 10+ pages long and full of pointless posts and cr*p ("can't wait", "downloading now", etc.). reading these posts have become more and more difficult. Doing a search also leads to loads of crappy posts.
The problem is that the higher your rating / grade / status, the more likely you are to have innondated the forum earlier with pointless posts. A senior member-only forum (or similar) will create more incentives for people to post crappy things until their postcount is high enough... don't think this is the way forward.
As for removing the link to WMBlackEd2.0 and stop releasing public updates: although i fully respect jasjamming's stand on this, I think it goes against the spirit of this great place. there is a difference between "decommissioning" something, and not "supporting it" anymore. I feel the link to the download should be there for people to install the rom and try it, and future releases made public (if thats what he intended to do in the first place) but the thread should be a closed one: people, download it and support it yourself or don't download it at all if you don't know what you're doing.
maybe this will deter enough neebies from the site and help make this place the great place it used to be.
the wiki should be used as front page for the site, with all resources there. I am sure not everyone knows about the wiki, as it is somewhat hidden from the main xda-developer page.
just my thoughts...
by the way, I have not posted for a while as i upgraded / downgraded / sorted out issues all by myself after doing loads of reading and searching... but I must admit that only 10% of the posts on the whole site are helpful/meaningful - the rest is an attempt by people to increase their postcount.... and this really puts me off.
With the amount of editing and new versions of ROM's and applications, and people's suggestions, it takes going 39 pages deep into a thread to get any good info, or a download.
For Example, Kavana's thread, Rickwyatt's thread....my god. Is it possible to sticky JUST the latest version of ROM's, applications, etc.
So many versions of everyone's ROM, it's hard for the newer people (such as myself) to know wtf ROM to get, and to know if they're inclusive to updates from the previous version.
I installed Kavana's lastest ROM a few weeks ago, but I like some of the updates that Rickwyatt has done, but it's so hard to understand the progression of versions. Also Rickwyatt's threat makes my eyes bleed with all the ascii seperating the versions. A FINAL version would be nice, and a list of what it includes.
Another sticky with add-on links or attachments would be key as well. I think keeping ROMs and apps down to a few threads would be a lot easier for people who are new to flashing to understand.
I wish we had a moderator in this forum, that actually took care of these things, but it doesn't look like one exists.
d0m1n0 said:
With the amount of editing and new versions of ROM's and applications, and people's suggestions, it takes going 39 pages deep into a thread to get any good info, or a download.
For Example, Kavana's thread, Rickwyatt's thread....my god. Is it possible to sticky JUST the latest version of ROM's, applications, etc.
So many versions of everyone's ROM, it's hard for the newer people (such as myself) to know wtf ROM to get, and to know if they're inclusive to updates from the previous version.
I installed Kavana's lastest ROM a few weeks ago, but I like some of the updates that Rickwyatt has done, but it's so hard to understand the progression of versions. Also Rickwyatt's threat makes my eyes bleed with all the ascii seperating the versions. A FINAL version would be nice, and a list of what it includes.
Another sticky with add-on links or attachments would be key as well. I think keeping ROMs and apps down to a few threads would be a lot easier for people who are new to flashing to understand.
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I think you're absolutely right. Doing so would eliminate a lot of the redundant questions that continue to be asked. By the way, it bothers me when noobs get pounced on because they ask questions that have already been covered. Unless they've been lurking for weeks prior to registering--how are they to know that their issues have already been adressed several times before?! I'm by no means an expert...but I am a tad more knowledgeable now than I was when I first logged on here. I STILL have "noobish" questions here and there! Some are VERRRRRY NOOBISH! lol But I would hope that someone would lend a hand to help me out from time to time. ((exhaling)) Whew...
I agree with everything that what just said. I am new and I find it hard to search for anything because I don't know what's new or updating. I started a thread for help and no one seems to wanna help.
I've been here for a while now, I just don't post as much, only if necessary and mind you, getting my thread sticked - The Upgrade from Windows 5 to 6 Guide was a mission. I even asked to be the moderator for this forum because I really have a good idea as to where what can go, Me & OrganicM/Ricky/Kavana/RIPSyntaxx are some of the members I can think of as moderators. I asked many times to be the moderator but I didn't even get a reply to know if I was selected or not.
If I'm elected as the moderator, I'll organize everything as soon as possible and delete threads that are not needed and taking space for no reason. I'll do it accordingly
1) Guides for Upgrading/Solution to Errors etc
2) SIM/CID/APP Unlock
3) ROMS
4) Registry Hacks/Tweaks
5) Apps
6) Backgrounds/Themes
7) Games
6) Suggestions
7) Etc
- That's just a quick rough format but you get the drill
and let me tell you something, I completely agree even with whatever that's been said, even though I'm an old member - I had to dig through threads to even find stuff that's worth it for me, for example - registry tweaks for OldSaps Favorites to work - cmon now :S
I had to search and search - so why not make it easier for all newb's and old members so everythings organized and in one place??
Can some moderator help us out? In the smartphone section, we have the most Excalibur users compared to other phones. I'm not putting anyone down but there's many threads compared to others.
Why not make 3 moderators for each section? If you guys think I'm good enough to be a moderator, I don't mind. I'd be happy to moderate - If not me, no problem - Anyone senior who knows the subject and knows what to do to keep this thread clean !
Please Help Us, Moderators !
lukybandit said:
I've been here for a while now, I just don't post as much, only if necessary and mind you, getting my thread sticked - The Upgrade from Windows 5 to 6 Guide was a mission. I even asked to be the moderator for this forum because I really have a good idea as to where what can go, Me & OrganicM/Ricky/Kavana/RIPSyntaxx are some of the members I can think of as moderators. I asked many times to be the moderator but I didn't even get a reply to know if I was selected or not.
If I'm elected as the moderator, I'll organize everything as soon as possible and delete threads that are not needed and taking space for no reason. I'll do it accordingly
1) Guides for Upgrading/Solution to Errors etc
2) SIM/CID/APP Unlock
3) ROMS
4) Registry Hacks/Tweaks
5) Apps
6) Backgrounds/Themes
7) Games
6) Suggestions
7) Etc
- That's just a quick rough format but you get the drill
and let me tell you something, I completely agree even with whatever that's been said, even though I'm an old member - I had to dig through threads to even find stuff that's worth it for me, for example - registry tweaks for OldSaps Favorites to work - cmon now :S
I had to search and search - so why not make it easier for all newb's and old members so everythings organized and in one place??
Can some moderator help us out? In the smartphone section, we have the most Excalibur users compared to other phones. I'm not putting anyone down but there's many threads compared to others.
Why not make 3 moderators for each section? If you guys think I'm good enough to be a moderator, I don't mind. I'd be happy to moderate - If not me, no problem - Anyone senior who knows the subject and knows what to do to keep this thread clean !
Please Help Us, Moderators !
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Click to collapse
Let's make this guy moderator. newbs like me need a guide.
I agree! This forum is great but looking for the information is become more difficult and sometimes confusing.
I agree we need some moderators here, but i think we might have to post this on the general Section, see if we get the moderators to help us out.
I fully agree. I joined this forum just a couple of weeks ago, and it's been a living h*ll waving through all the threads here at XDA and at Howardforums just to find the solutions I need. Even the FAQ threads at Howardforums are ancient and 50+ pages, just a lot of stuff to read.
Get a poll going on.
I definitely agree with this and strongly urge EVERYONE to support so we can get 3 moderators. I myself can be one depending on user response as I'm familiar with the layout, the content and have been here for a while to know what's good and what's not. I was the one who wrote the The Windows Mobile 5 to 6 Guide and I know it helped a lot of people. Before, people used to post questions non stop and eventually a lot of users got frustrated. I do suggest a FULL CLEAN UP of this section and I could get it done hopefully by the coming weekend if everyone here helps me out to become a moderator. Here's my suggestions for moderators
1) Organic (AMAZING Contributor - The 6.1 Slide Panel King)
2) Outerdepth (Very Helpful - Has the knowledge and the resources available to help you)
3) PudgeDaddy (Was one of the prime reasons behind Weather Panel and has contributed a lot as well and is very helpful from first-hand experience
and finally Me only because I do have the extra time to help clean up the mess, have the knowledge, have been posting regularly and finally know what to do when it comes to helping the majority of questions.
It's upto you guys and someone has to e-mail the Moderators because I did in the past and No Luck. Finally, I'm not sure if everyone's willing to do this (from the 3 that I suggested) but I definitely will be happy to do it.
Keep Posting and Let's do something about this, guys !
What do you say guys?
Help me out here.
if you want to provide useful, up-to-date info, why not use the wiki?
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=HTC_Excalibur
I will be happy to moderate the threads and forum here. I'm here almost 24 7 anyway. I've also tried to PM other moerators and even the admin...with no luck.
After reading this thread, I feel like I'm on Capitol Hill. lol Re-elect lukybandit for District 4 congressman!
I posted a verbose request for Mods (or making our own) to the staff here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=392112
Please visit, and maybe tack your approval on too? If everyone does this, it might affect them more?
Profezza said:
I posted a verbose request for Mods (or making our own) to the staff here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=392112
Please visit, and maybe tack your approval on too? If everyone does this, it might affect them more?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did my part on this lets hope we get more people to comment on it so we could get this going.
I'd be more than happy to moderate the Excalibur thread as well. I am almost here 24/7 myself. Me, Organic & one more person who is a regular (so far I've seen outerdepth to be pretty regular and jjdograz - not sure if thats the right username) but yes both of these are very helpful, have the knowledge and are pretty regular. I'd definitely help this forum out. I know what to do and how to get rid of the junk as soon as possible and help this thread a better place to be. Right now, in my opinion - it is a nightmare. So many newb's and even old-timers have such a hard time finding the right information. As Windows 6.1 is the current ROM, Me & Organic will collaborate and break it down for everybody with the right sticky's and information needed to get your 6.1 up & running without errors. Furthermore, I will have Recommendations (for apps, regedits), solutions to errors etc. You get the picture. I love XDA and so does almost everybody. Without XDA, my phone would have been a HTC s620 but thanks to XDA it's now a customized and highly modified machine.
I've said what I could have, please read my previous posts to see what I would do and how I would do things. If you don't think I'm the right person, no problem
I only want 3 moderators in this forum so visiting XDA could be a peaceful one. As of now, the search function has been fully abused, atleast by me because I have such a hard time finding the right information when infact, all the crucial information should be stickied.
Anyway, do your part and help get this going. As it'll only benefit newbies and ofcourse old timers, it's best we get to this as soon as possible. Thanks
Cmon guys we got to get this going so we could have a beter looking forum and make it easy to all of us to find updates.
I think the ROM cooks just need to learn to use the wiki. e.g. have a table sorted by date of all the ROMs and a page about each.
Good point... but the question is... will the majority of the users use the wiki ? Nope.
[highlight]Mod Edit: @Mikey or overground: I have stuck this thread in here, but I will let both of you decide on the future of this sticky as I don't want to step on your toes in the organization of such stickies. It is a pretty good "Read First" thread and should remain stuck IMHO.
egzthunder1[/highlight]
When you start to look into rooting your phone, remember what Uncle Ben said:
"With great power comes great responsibility."
I struggled with whether to post this thread under "Development" or "General." I didn't see anything similar already under Development, and I firmly believe a thread such as this needs to be front and center in the Development area. As the OTA has been leaked (twice!), more and more inexperienced "junior modders" have started to comment in the forums. This is all well and good, but there really should be a central, basic tutorial including terms, do's and don'ts, etc. available to those that need it, while at the same time cleaning up the threads for specific ROMs from non-ROM-specific questions.
With that being said, I am going to post some basic guidelines/facts below. If you believe any of this information is not correct, please PM me so that we can come to a collaborative agreement without spreading confusion within the thread.
General Information for Beginners (Please At Least Read This Info!)
1. ROOTING IS NOT FOR EVERYONE! Please don't root because it's "cool" if you don't have any idea what you're doing. There really is nothing wrong with waiting for the official OTAs, etc. If you want to experiment with your phone, I applaud you - but see #2.
2. Always read ALL of the directions in a thread FIRST. Keep in mind that many threads will direct you to yet another thread for full instructions on a process - read those instructions entirely too!
3. Once you read the instructions. FOLLOW THEM. Do not take shortcuts. If you do, you may be the owner of a very expensive paperweight.
4. If you think your phone is stuck, boot looping, frozen, or whatever else, especially during a system, radio or ROM flash - DO NOT REMOVE YOUR BATTERY. Step away from the phone, and give it time. Give it at least half an hour, then reassess. (Thanks to sryan2k1)
5. If you encounter a pitfall, you should search the thread before you post your request for help so that you can see if others have had similar difficulties, as well as how they resolved them if they did in fact fix the issue.
6. If you found a solution to your problem you've asked for help on - please, post that you resolved it, and HOW you resolved it, especially if none of the advice offered by others helped.
7. The developer community is inherently an open and helpful one. Always feel free to post your questions, but please try to do your research first and always post your questions in the proper forum and thread. (Thanks to Linux4me28)
8. It's good practice to always make a backup! That may take the form of Nandroid (backing up your entire system, usually through Recovery), but if you start dabbling in ADB it also means rather than overwriting files you should simply append the old file's name until you're sure you've got it right (myfile.zip > myfile.zip.bak).
Rooting and Mod Terms, Basics, etc.
1. "Rooting" means, essentially, providing yourself with administrative rights to your phone.
2. A "ROM" is basically an entire system image - think of it like Windows XP versus Windows 7.
3. A ROM will *not* root your phone.
4. "Bricking" your phone means it's permanently borked. If you can turn your phone on and get to virtually any system screen, you're probably not bricked, and there's probably hope for you and your device!
5. You must be already rooted to install a ROM.
6. A ROM is installed through a custom recovery, such as ClockworkMod Recovery.
7. There are tools in existence, such as UnrEvoked3.x that will assist in easily rooting your phone.
8. The "Radio" is (in layman's terms) the part of the phone that interacts with a service provider's tower, and it too has firmware. Flashing a Radio image is a bit more of a risky proposition than just flashing a ROM, but it may be required in some cases. Again, ALWAYS READ THE DIRECTIONS.
9. ROMs are device-specific and, oftentimes, Radio-specific as well. This means that you must pay attention to the requirements for the ROM you want to install.
10. Remember: Rooting doesn't mean that you'll have any more success in "pirating" software. It just means you'll be able to control more of your phone's functions. I think you'll find that the developer community is even more protective of IP rights than the average user-base. A lot of developers work off of donations, but that doesn't mean that credit for their original works shouldn't be given.
Miscellaneous
1. Google is your friend, and so is the "Search Thread" tool. Please do not post questions in a thread when you could easily, and more quickly, find the answer by doing a search. That's just lazy .
Links to Other Helpful Threads
HTC Droid Incredible Helpful/Popular Threads (Thanks to stroupified)
I welcome any additions, but let's keep this polite and courteous. I was new at this once, myself - three weeks ago I purchased my first Android device, the Dinc. And yes, I mean that to be a somewhat strange statement. Before I've done ANY modifications, I've read the instructions, read the entire thread, and followed all directions to the letter. The only pitfall I've had was because I took a shortcut - once (but I learned my lesson!).
Changelog
08/04/10 - Cleaned up some formatting and spelling. Added contributions from others.
08/05/10 - Added links from other contributors, as well as additional information. Things were also getting unwieldy, so I broke things up a bit to make it more readable. If everyone prefers it all mashed together like it was, please let me know.
Excellent advice, sir.
I lurked here for months before trying to root and install ROMS. While I'm not a pro at it yet and have much to learn, I have more confidence in what I'm doing.
I think the reason most people try rooting is because they think they will get "free" apps or something, like its something they can do to pirate software with their phone or something. I do not think they understand the process completely.
To simplify your post OP,
If you want to root and are inexperienced, read what you are doing first over and over or at least have insurance...Most problems people have is caused by their ignorance, not the fact a program did something wrong.
I was new to rooting with my Moto Droid. Before that I was loading hybrid OS's on my POS Storm. Due to having lots of computer experience, I picked up rooting and ADB quite easily. Most people that root though, I really think they are looking for the ability to pirate and not to install custom ROMs, themes, and/or run apps at root level.
^^^ This should be stickied...
I agree with op couldn't said it any better. Also agreed it should be sticky post.
Sent from my ADR6300
Excellent! Bravo!
TNS201 said:
I think the reason most people try rooting is because they think they will get "free" apps or something, like its something they can do to pirate software with their phone or something. I do not think they understand the process completely.
To simplify your post OP,
If you want to root and are inexperienced, read what you are doing first over and over or at least have insurance...Most problems people have is caused by their ignorance, not the fact a program did something wrong.
I was new to rooting with my Moto Droid. Before that I was loading hybrid OS's on my POS Storm. Due to having lots of computer experience, I picked up rooting and ADB quite easily. Most people that root though, I really think they are looking for the ability to pirate and not to install custom ROMs, themes, and/or run apps at root level.
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I have a character flaw of wanting to wring the very last drop of performance out of my electronic devices...plus I find it challenging.
I'm sure there's a bit of "I'm really not supposed to be doing this" involved as well.
magneticzero said:
There is no reason this belongs in the dev thread. reported.
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I am going to have to disagree with you. A general set of guidelines for people to follow are always a good idea in a development forum. Something like this is bound to catch at least a few wandering eyes of new-comers into the site. By reading this, they will likely lurk around, read, and search before asking questions, avoiding possible flaming in the process (and making mod's lives a bit easier in the process too )
Also, fairly important, if you are in the middle of a flash/recovery, and you think the phone has frozen, or bricked, or stopped. DO NOT PULL THE BATTERY OUT.
Wait at least a half hour before touching it. It is the same with any device, a computer BIOS, phones, embedded devices, it may not look like it is doing anything, but it likely still is. That is one of the few ways to really brick a device is yank the power in the middle of a OS/ROM/Baseband/Etc flash.
We do it all the time on our hardware at work, but we have JTAG ports where we can reprogram the internal/external flash with a external tools. We don't have that luxury on these phones. Patience is your friend.
well said sir. the incredible was my first android device and i waited a couple months before i rooted it and felt comfortable with adb and weighed the benefits of rooting vs not rooting (that took like 2 min lol) I love technology and belive in running it to it's full potential because we paid $xxx.xx for our divices we should want to get our money's worth.
i was gonna suggest some threads that helped me out but someone has alread complied them into it's own thread. maybe you could make a shortcut for those people who are new to the forum. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=739428
magneticzero said:
Good read, but it is just "General Information". How is it directly helping me development a ROM or OS update? Just wondering...
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It benefits you in that you hopefully might have fewer people cluttering your Dev threads. No offense, but you're assuming the average consumer is going to look in "General Information" for General Information. They don't. There should be some detterent in place. As these types of devices become more prevalent, you should understand that the average "Development" visitor and poster is no longer a Developer.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
thank you.
great hopefully more people will read this
magneticzero said:
So what you are implying it isnt really a development section of the forum....maybe they need to lock it and just post releases to you in the general forum....no matter what people are still gonna post crap and clutter this place.
I vote lock this forum to developers only and make it read only for general public.
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magneticzero said:
i am entitled to my opinion. cheers!
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With all due respect, you have been around for less than a month. XDA has historically been a place where people contribute, come to learn from each other, and get help if needed be. What you are suggesting here goes completely against the whole ethos of XDA as a community. Non-devs come here to learn from the devs. Unfortunately, many people from the newer forums have very little tolerance for others who may not be at their level, and this really gets in my nerves as well as the rest of the mods. While I agree that people should search and read prior to posting questions, I wholeheartedly disagree with the fact that as of recently, people cannot even post a single question without being flamed to smithereens. The OP simply posted a very useful and to the point guide with suggestions (and yes, it is basic but not everyone can understand how to make a new kernel).
At this point, I would like to ask you to stop posting these kinds of comments in this thread. You are trying to start a very much unneeded argument in a thread whose sole purpose of existence is to prevent the sole thing that you are complaining about in the first place. This thread will stay in place and that's the end of it. I have talked this over with overground and Mikey (both in charge of this section) and they have agreed with my decision.
While you are entitled to give your two cents, you are not allowed to troll and or flame, and starting unnecessary arguments for no reason is considered flaming.
Quite honestly this is the most sensible piece of information on XDA. I implore you to talk to some of the other dev mods (particularly evo 4g) and offer to add this as a sticky. I've been here a short while myself, but have already seen things devolved to a level of non-civility that makes me not want to participate anymore myself.
Seriously, awesome post.
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
egzthunder1 said:
With all due respect, you have been around for less than a month. XDA has historically been a place where people contribute, come to learn from each other, and get help if needed be. What you are suggesting here goes completely against the whole ethos of XDA as a community. Non-devs come here to learn from the devs. Unfortunately, many people from the newer forums have very little tolerance for others who may not be at their level, and this really gets in my nerves as well as the rest of the mods. While I agree that people should search and read prior to posting questions, I wholeheartedly disagree with the fact that as of recently, people cannot even post a single question without being flamed to smithereens. The OP simply posted a very useful and to the point guide with suggestions (and yes, it is basic but not everyone can understand how to make a new kernel).
At this point, I would like to ask you to stop posting these kinds of comments in this thread. You are trying to start a very much unneeded argument in a thread whose sole purpose of existence is to prevent the sole thing that you are complaining about in the first place. This thread will stay in place and that's the end of it. I have talked this over with overground and Mikey (both in charge of this section) and they have agreed with my decision.
While you are entitled to give your two cents, you are not allowed to troll and or flame, and starting unnecessary arguments for no reason is considered flaming.
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We all need to start somewhere. Few people come here at the level of a Mr Koush.
douger1957 said:
We all need to start somewhere. Few people come here at the level of a Mr Koush.
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You know what's great though? Even he offered to meet me in IRC to help with an issue one time. That's what's great about this community.
I am a lurker and while I was good at messing with custom ROMS in Windows, I have been crawling up a steep learning curve with Android. But then I am a 50 year old lady lawyer so of course it's steep...
I rarely post anything. I do NOT ask questions because I do not want yelled at. BUT!
I have learned a great deal from other peoples' questions and the answers provided by the technically adept. Please don't close this forum to civilians. The information imparted in the give and take between n00bs and pros is invaluable as a teaching method, really it is.
The one observation I would make, though, is that 500 page forums are not really useful. Maybe shut them down more quickly as issues which emerge are addressed. For instance, once a newer ROM has been released, or patched, or an issue resolved, close that forum and start a new one with the resolved issue as the subject of the new thread and a link to it as the last post in the referring thread.
Thank to all of you for making owning a droid a blast!
Read and re-read....
I bricked a phone cause i read something wrong, once i read it again i got it, plus i had a few older phones that i toyed with to see if i understood everything.....nice having a few older devices around to test if your a noob. Like myself....
I totally agree with all that has been said here. The DInc took a long time to get root, but once it did, I was ready to give it a shot..as I had already been flashing, and cooking roms for my WM 6800..and also loaded a few hybrid OS's on my Storm.. so this was naturally the next chapter in my development as a developer...which is the endgame.. Bravo to all who help to keep rooting/modding fun, and edifying! Next I'm going to see if I can cook up my own Froyo ROM..
So I am considering rooting my phone, and I have been poking around and noticed all of the "essential" rooting threads are ages old, I have had my evo 4g for a week, and coming from a noob considering rooting I have a few questions (secondly im sure most of my questions just involve digging, but I am the kind of learner who needs to see everything in one or two places, not 20 or 30 different ones) so here goes my questions...
1. Why should I root, what are the advantages
2. What is the difference between deoxed and odexed
3. what is the step by step guide to rooting (im running snow leopard, but can get access to windows, would prefer to do it in snow leopard)
4. What are roms, kernals...other lingo and definations I need to or should know before rooting
5. what does rooting disable
and 6. Whats the coolest thing i can do once I am rooted
A special thanks to any one willing to take there time and explain these items to me rather then link me to another thread.
you seem like you haven't done any research what so ever.
What OS did you come from?
Yeah, it's kind of important to be willing to read a LOT. Or you probably shouldn't even bother. If you don't wanna read and really examine, then I would just stay stock. Evo is a fine phone stock.
'What's the 'coolest'thing you can do?'
(Aside from reading), I would say, that would be up to you what's coolest.
ROM is read only memory. Kernel, as I understand it, is the resource your ROM relies on to run, and greatly impacts battery life, and various functionalities. And allows for overclocking/undervolting, etc.
Root would disable/disallow you from accepting OTAs directly from Sprint
Kornsaq said:
you seem like you haven't done any research what so ever.
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I have done some reading on it, just as i said everything is spread out, and I have a very difficult time combining stuff from different areas, I am currently using osx, and all of the noob rooting instructions im able to find need files to be modified in windows/linux (osx is unix based)
Read the sticky thread at the top of this Q&A forum. The thread is called "Common misconceptions and useful information." ricsim included some really good pointers at the top of the thread and I have my own contributions at the bottom of the thread. I know you'll probably be a little annoyed by the fact that you have to find your own answers but it's critical that you learn what you're doing to your phone and why. Unless you do you'll turn into the next user who gets flamed for posting something similar to "OMG WHRE r Da GOOGLKE appzzzz" or anything resembling that.
What I'm trying to say is the rest of us learned by researching and we have faith that you can too.
Good luck.
beatblaster said:
Read the sticky thread at the top of this Q&A forum. The thread is called "Common misconceptions and useful information." ricsim included some really good pointers at the top of the thread and I have my own contributions at the bottom of the thread. I know you'll probably be a little annoyed by the fact that you have to find your own answers but it's critical that you learn what you're doing to your phone and why. Unless you do you'll turn into the next user who gets flamed for posting something similar to "OMG WHRE r Da GOOGLKE appzzzz" or anything resembling that.
What I'm trying to say is the rest of us learned by researching and we have faith that you can too.
Good luck.
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Since i posted this, I have been doing some clicking around, and im very very slowly understanding stuff, i will read through the mentioned thread, and the reason im asking these questions is an attempt to help me understand some more of this, i really dont want to risk bricking my phone (however low the risk is) with out knowing what im doing
As the title states, I am using my unlocked Verizon galaxy S4 on T-mobile. The problem I am having is that because it is loaded with all of Verizon's software it doesn't function the same way as an S4 from T-Mobile would. I get edge, 3G and, H+ Data connectivity but, it is spotty and more edge than anything.
My question is:
Is there a way to basically transform this Verizon phone into a T-Mobile phone by flashing T-mobiles radio firmware, Kernels and, OS? I cannot find this question being asked anywhere and I have been scouring the internet for 2 days. I am rooted and running CWM recovery. I have been an avid modder since the release of the first Cyanogen mod for the T-Mobile G1. I guess what I'm saying is, I don't care how technically complicated it is. If it is AT ALL POSSIBLE,,, I just want to do it.
I am not trying to be mean in saying what I am about to say next so please, no one take this the wrong way.
If you do not know the answer to this question please do not post one. Do not post a response of NO just because that's what you've heard or assume is correct. I am posing this question to experienced developers NOT modders like myself who simply use others work for our devices. I did find in a Google search where someone posted a tutorial on how to do this but, for reasons that I am not aware, the thread was discontinued.
Thank you for any help. I refuse to give up on this. I've made it my mission and I will not quit until the phone explodes.
yutzyscott said:
I am not trying to be mean in saying what I am about to say next so please, no one take this the wrong way.
If you do not know the answer to this question please do not post one. Do not post a response of NO just because that's what you've heard or assume is correct. I am posing this question to experienced developers NOT modders like myself who simply use others work for our devices. I did find in a Google search where someone posted a tutorial on how to do this but, for reasons that I am not aware, the thread was discontinued.
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This paragraph is unnecessary. If we are posting in the QnA section we are either providing our knowledge or telling toy that this question has been answered already. There is rarely any trolling on here. (At least in this section) If we are replying to your question with an answer than it is probably the beat answer we can provide. if we reply with a few word response than take it. We do this on our free will. Take any reply you get seriously no matter how long the post.
Now on topic, you can only flash an m919 ROM on any other s4, besides the i9500. Not sure about radios, but DO NOT flash an m919 Kernel* on your Verizon s4. Only do it if you want a fancy paperweight.
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I am here to help and provide knowledge to help others with there problems/issues. If you do have a question don't be afraid to shoot me a PM and I will help you and put you in the right direction to the best of my ability and will get your problem and/or issue solved.
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'Murica said:
This paragraph is unnecessary. If we are posting in the QnA section we are either providing our knowledge or telling toy that this question has been answered already. There is rarely any trolling on here. (At least in this section) If we are replying to your question with an answer than it is probably the beat answer we can provide. if we reply with a few word response than take it. We do this on our free will. Take any reply you get seriously no matter how long the post.
Now on topic, you can only flash an m919 ROM on any other s4, besides the i9500. Not sure about radios, but DO NOT flash an m919v radio on your Verizon s4. Only do it if you want a fancy paperweight.
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I am here to help and provide knowledge to help others with there problems/issues. If you do have a question don't be afraid to shoot me a PM and I will help you and put you in the right direction to the best of my ability and will get your problem and/or issue solved.
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I have been on here for years. there have been many times over the years that I have helped others do something that some said to be impossible and there are time when people have helped me do things that were said to be impossible. that paragraph was not aimed at you so do not take it personal. I've just been on here long enough not to be irritated by trollers but, rather by people who do not have any clue what they are talking about answering questions they do not know the answers to simply so they can attempt to look smarter than they are. if this does not apply to you then ignore that paragraph but, you cannot say that it wasn't necessary. You say, "we are providing our knowledge" this is a broad statement that you cannot make because you can only speak for yourself and those that you know personally. unfortunately there are many more than you and your friends on the internet. So if you understand that that wasn't directed at those that are helpful, there there is no need for debate
Thank you for the info though.
Not asking for debate not was I taking it personal, just informing that you don't need to add that extra paragraph. If you feel someone is trolling you then retort them
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I am here to help and provide knowledge to help others with there problems/issues. If you do have a question don't be afraid to shoot me a PM and I will help you and put you in the right direction to the best of my ability and will get your problem and/or issue solved.
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Verizon is CDMA, T-Mobile is GSM. Different radio hardware required.
There are both GSM and CDMA radios in the galaxy s4. That is how I'm using it on t mobile now. This has been a topic of discussion since the phone was released and responses have been back and forth as to whether it was possible to use it on a GSM network at all. then it was discovered that it is in fact a world phone.it is simply carrier locked which under normal circumstances would make you right however, mine is unlocked and able to utilize both. Thank you for your response.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app