Develop Bugs

Umm... Why is everyone here an A Hole?

It's like a cancer. One person is rude and cruel so it rubs off until it's so unhealthy everyone lashes out at everyone. I could care less how many "noobs" ask questions. Answer it if you like or else ignore it. You people need some serious help!
Waiting to get banned and flamed!?!

because all these stupid n00bs came from hofo thinking that this was a download WM6 only place and not a R&D type forum... the whole point of xda DEVELOPERS is to program code and other wise develope things for our PDA not to come here and ask "how come my symbols are all messed up after i flashed this rom" or how "come my hermes has a tri-colored screen and thats it" So we get to the point of hating every stupid question that it asked because its asked 100000000000000000000000000000000000000 times over and over since no one can use google or the search button/....

Somebody please delete this thread. It is useless and annoying.

its really not a worthless topic...but perhaps it is here.
bottom line is there really is NO excuse ever to be an a-hole.
I could give you 5 sure fire ways to deal with the 'problem' straight-up.....
from the moderators standpoint...and inner-forum standpoint besides the childish ways it was dealt with by chefs and associates....
although its gotten better.

Check this forum in a bit
and I'll show you how to instill forum control.
and ''a-holes'' (authors quote!)....don't say, 'duh...we shouldn't have to do that'
if someone feels so strongly to call new members 's '****in noob...search the f......' thread''...then you have the strength to implement these measures.
it'l be up in an hour or so..got to get home

austinsnyc said:
because all these stupid n00bs came from hofo thinking that this was a download WM6 only place and not a R&D type forum... the whole point of xda DEVELOPERS is to program code and other wise develope things for our PDA not to come here and ask "how come my symbols are all messed up after i flashed this rom" or how "come my hermes has a tri-colored screen and thats it" So we get to the point of hating every stupid question that it asked because its asked 100000000000000000000000000000000000000 times over and over since no one can use google or the search button/....
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That pretty much says it all.....

A-hole???
If you're referring to austinsync or myself as being assholes, shame on you!
Speaking for myself, since 2005, I've had 856 posts, the majority of them helpful. (actually have a sticky, thank you very much)
I'm not known to curse a person but I will attempt to lead them to their destination.
People here have taught me how to fish and I try to share that knowledge.
If you insist on us giving you the fish because you're too lazy so be it... but don't call me an asshole.

Dr Puttingham said:
If you're referring to austinsync or myself as being assholes, shame on you!
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Ya....I never said any specific names, in fact I'm not sure where you got that idea, unless you are just feeling guilty. My remark was just a general feel for what seems like the whole Hermes forum.

me?
i'm quoting the word from the title post....don't know who he's referring to.

Dr Puttingham said:
If you're referring to austinsync or myself as being assholes, shame on you!
Speaking for myself, since 2005, I've had 856 posts, the majority of them helpful. (actually have a sticky, thank you very much)
I'm not known to curse a person but I will attempt to lead them to their destination.
People here have taught me how to fish and I try to share that knowledge.
If you insist on us giving you the fish because you're too lazy so be it... but don't call me an asshole.
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there are alot of members here that treat noobs unfairly sometimes, this site is a little hard to navigate and some people like myself get a new device and are like ok what can i do to it right this second, dont take the time mess it up and so on and so forth. imo some people think a little to highly of themselves and think they have the right to say what should be posted. now there are alot of great people here but there are some that are not so great. this is a developers site not a noob site and i think the best way to prevent this is to redirect noobs to other forums like http://www.htcwizardweb.net/node/103
but they are more device specific so dr puttingham or other great members of this site dont sweet it if someone states that there are some aholes on this site because its not toward yourselves. but i dont think this is the place to post this and dont think someone with a post score of less than 50 should address an issue of this nature. i have been a member for awhile and dont post alot as of yet because i am still a noob and i think to many people start threads that shouldnt be started. if you have a question read the wiki and navigate the threads using google dont start new threads unless your absolutly positive it hasnt been answered. read read read hours and hours read the wiki dont start new threads with noob questions this is not a noob site this is not a download site this is a developer site and we should be greatfull that they dont descriminate new comers. well thats my 2 cents

I think the issue is many people are used to getting things their way right away and don't want to take the time to do some searches and read a few threads before asking stupid ass questions.
I'm a newbie and sometimes I think people here act like they have their ass hairs plucked every morning before they get up. Other times I see people asking questions that are pretty stupid and easily answered. So it goes both ways.
Some here are overly anti-noob and some noobs are overly stupid.

No different
Honestly, this forum or the behavior you are talking about is nothing new or different than many of the other forums I have been part of. When the community supports itself there is a tendancy to appreciate those who help themselves and contribute to the betterment of the comunity overall. Those that detract from the community either by their actions or attitudes are unappreciated. How people show this appreciation or lack of is a matter of personal style. If some people are harsher than others it is just the way it is. If you plan on getting free support for a free product that you can't otherwise produce for yourself there is a certain expectation of self reliance. If you are offended by someone telling you to go read the F*ing wiki you need to probably grow an extra layer of skin or two.
If people who don't have the answers demonstrated and communicated what steps they have taken to find the answer on their own and actually used the google or advanced search features people would probably respond differently.
One big help on the advanced search page is to change the search from threads to posts. It really helps narrow down the exact area in the threads your search terms are and you can go back a few posts rather than try to wade your way through 55+ pages of posts.
I am a self professed "noob". But that said I have, without asking a single question on the forums, flashed several blacks, several custel, and vp3Gs LVSW ROMs, upgraded my radio, downgraded to unlock, upgraded to 1.41 and just this evening dropped it back down to 1.40 (which actually did wonders for my phone).
It is a little difficult to find all the information you need. It isn't spoon fed. But it isn't all that hard either. Between the guides my MrVanx, the wiki and the various search tools provided you should be able to peice together anything.
If everyone follows this methodology the problem would probably take care of itself with minimal effort from the moderators and you would see a lot more decorum in the forums. Until then all threads like this do are spark useless debate that has nothing to do with the hermes and clog up an already bloated forum.
Just my 2 cents. I appreciate all of the members of this community - even the A Holes.
thank you for listening.
Caturix

Did I mention I like beer?

A few day back there was a A - Hole noob here who wanted wm6 for Sony Ericsson M600. It was his first post !!!
You have to behave like an A Hole with A Hole types.

TooSharp said:
It's like a cancer. One person is rude and cruel so it rubs off until it's so unhealthy everyone lashes out at everyone. I could care less how many "noobs" ask questions. Answer it if you like or else ignore it. You people need some serious help!
Waiting to get banned and flamed!?!
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Everyone here is not an a-hole as you so liberally claim.
Why complicate simple matters? You signed up voluntarily and you can leave anytime if you don't like it here.
Don't go around calling "everyone" an a-hole just because you feel like it. Geez.

caturix said:
It is a little difficult to find all the information you need. It isn't spoon fed. But it isn't all that hard either. Between the guides my MrVanx, the wiki and the various search tools provided you should be able to peice together anything.
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SPOT ON analysis. This is precisely what a developer does... piece things together... work away at it... figure it out. And that's why they tend to get hot under the collar when others expect to be spoon fed. This this may come across a being an 'a-hole' to some when in fact they're just demanding a little appreciation for what they do.
If everyone follows this methodology the problem would probably take care of itself with minimal effort from the moderators and you would see a lot more decorum in the forums. Until then all threads like this do are spark useless debate that has nothing to do with the hermes and clog up an already bloated forum.
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Again, excellent.

TooSharp said:
It's like a cancer. One person is rude and cruel so it rubs off until it's so unhealthy everyone lashes out at everyone. I could care less how many "noobs" ask questions. Answer it if you like or else ignore it. You people need some serious help!
Waiting to get banned and flamed!?!
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Click to collapse
well let me step up to the plate and be the A-hole here..
First if you bothered to search you will find that this topic has been talked about many times.. There is even a decent topic under the "About XDA-Developers" sub-fora... This doesnt exactly belong in a WM6 forum.. Posting this only adds to the problem.. instead of complaining about the problem, you need to ask yourself "what have i done to improve the situation?"
Alot of people blame poor moderation, but come on people, most of us are grown up's.. Do you really need babysitters? Why not take a proactive approach to help the situation instead of complaining and make it worse.
So, lets all play nice and make this a happier place..

Rude senior members!!

I have frequented this site over the past few weeks or so and am outright disturbed by the disrespect some "NEW" members are getting. I haven't actually encountered this personally, but as I have read numerous post, I see things that make me want to turn around and split! Senior members calling names and being VERY rude to existing and newer members. Is this really tolerated here? I really hope not because I like the site for the most part. I just refuse to be part of a forum that lets rudeness and disrespect go unattended.
I don't mean to be a bother, but the forum I moderate at would NEVER let this happen. We BAN members for disrespecting one another. I thought that's what I would encounter here as well.
I am not really looking for a response here, just wanted to let someone who cares know what I experienced over the past few weeks here as a new member. Thank you to whomever takes the time and interest to read this.
-Tommy
NOTE TO ALL: DO NOT POST REPLIES TO THIS THREAD! IT HAS BEEN DISCUSSED ALREADY. THANKS -Tommy

Thank you for the quick reply. I'm glad to see you guys are aware of this and working to cut down on the rudeness. I myself have told "newer" members to search instead of posting new threads that look like new mods as well. I do like the site though, and will continue to frequent it. I am SOLD on htc's, as I have recently chased a TD2 and love it. I will also be able to contribute new mods as soon as I can get used to the platform.
Thanks again,
-Tommy

tomtommy306 said:
Senior members calling names and being VERY rude to existing and newer members.
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Tommy, I'm someone who felt, 2 years ago, exactly what you describe here. It was always justified as senior members getting tired of volunteering their time to help people -- only to have some new members bypass reading any "sticky threads" or any admonitions to "please read before posting a new thread" (in which tips are provided for how to get answers to frequently asked questions) -- and seemingly never bothering to search at all.
Over the past 2 years I have observed 2 things, trend-wise: (1) Once I gained some decent baseline proficiency in understanding how the basics work re upgrading my phone with new & improved software, I then started to see, as though appearing for the first time (but they were always present) the TONS of repeated questions and downright disrespect some new members had for even following the most basic of protocols -- like -- "please post that at the forum dedicated to your phone model; you can find it here..." generating responses like
"I don't have time for that. I just need to know what HardSPL means and where I can find the latest ROM for my T-Mobile Wing"
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Personally I attribute a HUGE amount of this to the less-than-optimal information design of this site, which sends people back and forth from here to there to a wiki, then searching for acronyms and definitions, then to a sticky thread (MANY OF WHICH ARE NOW OUTDATED AND HAVE BEEN FOR OVER A YEAR), then back to a hacking section, being shouted at that "this isn't for asking questions, moron; this is for contributing software hacks", and eventually generating some dog-chasing-tail experiences for new members. One of the people working his damned hardest to help minimize this is nir36 (SHOUTOUT!) with his excellent GUIDES, and with his patience within the "Questions and Answers" section.
But -- (2) Here's what I have also seen: A huge disruption of culture here at XDA, prompted, I believe, by the mainstreaming of touchscreen phones with the introduction of Apple's iPhone. Two- to three- to four years ago, the people who frequented this site were predominantly hackers who banded together to solve many of the deficiencies of WindowsMobile software, and who shared their expertise knowing that other people's expertise would benefit them and solve annoying problems, or push a certain envelope. There was, as a result, a culture of CONTRIBUTION, vs one of "gimme gimme gimme, I don't have time, just gimme".
I've seen many an essay posted here by veteran members of XDA expressing a real frustration for some of the behaviors caused by the new influx of people seeing tricks and hacks now posted on YouTube, and then discovering XDA, and coming here to "find that and get it onto my device".
This has created a culture clash which is totally understandable from both sides of of the issue. There's more and more abuse of basic rules & process, where, as I said, more people seek to bypass all that rigamaroll and just post wherever it seems to fit, and seek a specific answer about how to get XXX on my device. There are MANY MANY senior members, even veteran senior members who've been here 4-5 years, who still use a soft touch in asking people to "read this FAQ please" or "please post that in THIS forum". But at the same time, when the response to gentle nudges like that is along the lines of "I don't have time for that, I'm in a hurry, and I just need to get this installed", then patience grows thin.
And so yes, of course, you'll see people snapping at one another. But it's born of frustration for the lack of respect of the culture of XDA -- where it had always been part of the quest to have new people work a little at finding answers, not to punish them, but rather to help them connect the dots and see the solutions available to them, and how they often build atop prior work.
Anyway these are my thoughts. I speak only as a member, not as any representative of the site or group of Mods.

I have been looking around quite a bit lately(here @ XDA), and have better feelings about it. There are a lot more helpful and kind people here, then there are rude ones. I guess I was running into a lot of newer members that were being disrespectful to the seniors. I understand the frustrations of members not being appreciative as I see it often where I mod. It does get frustrating when people don't say "please" and "thank you" , but some people must have forgotten what their families have taught them. MANNERS...
I will continue to be around the site.
You ALL do great work here, and I appreciate the time and effort involved.
I rarely ask for help, but I wanted to know it was welcome, just in case.
We are all here for the same thing, and I am very glad to have found XDA to fuel my need.
The site has a great REP, and that means a lot to me.
It was also the reason for concern in the first place.
Thanks again guys,
-Tommy
Note to MODS or ADMINS: PLEASE CLOSE or DELETE THIS THREAD. I am very happy with the responses I have been given, and am happy to be here. The topic will not be brought up again unless ABSOLUTELY necessary.

At least it's not Howard Forums
Seriously, if you see anything that looks bad, PM a moderator or report the post. We do try to respond.
V

vijay555 said:
At least it's not Howard Forums
Seriously, if you see anything that looks bad, PM a moderator or report the post. We do try to respond.
V
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You got that right.... Howard forums are very out there.
That's where I discovered modding cell phones for the first time.
If any complaints were ever to arise(doubtful), I would communicate via PM only.
Thanks vijay.

Sounds like somebody called you a noob and you got all flustered and decided to make a thread about it. Hope things get better for you.

Drybonz said:
Sounds like somebody called you a noob and you got all flustered and decided to make a thread about it. Hope things get better for you.
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Actually..... I hadn't even started to post in the forum when I wrote this.
It was from responses like YOURS here, except to other members that made me start this thread. And I had no intention of keeping it going. It was for admins and mods to read.
I'm no noob at any of this. I work as a computer technician for the city I live in. And I moderate at MMUS.us for quite a while now. Tkali & Insecure Spike can vouch for all of this. They mod there too... and have worked with me since I have been there.
AND LASTLY...... WHY DID YOU RESPOND TO A POST DOING EXACTLY WHAT I OPENLY STATED TO DISLIKING?? Disrespectful at the least.

tomtommy306 said:
Actually..... I hadn't even started to post in the forum when I wrote this.
It was from responses like YOURS here, except to other members that made me start this thread. And I had no intention of keeping it going. It was for admins and mods to read.
I'm no noob at any of this. I work as a computer technician for the city I live in. And I moderate at MMUS.us for quite a while now. Tkali & Insecure Spike can vouch for all of this. They mod there too... and have worked with me since I have been there.
AND LASTLY...... WHY DID YOU RESPOND TO A POST DOING EXACTLY WHAT I OPENLY STATED TO DISLIKING?? Disrespectful at the least.
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Well an assumption is an assumption. There is nothing you can do about it if a skeptic has little information to analyze.
To explain the frustrations of the "meanies" here are two situations I come up with:
Situation 1
The problem is that XDA is very likely to be the most visited forum as a technical support forum but stupid idiots are just too stupid to fix their problem when the answer is right there.
Example
For example, I have seen plenty on the Xperia forums in which some dude asks for panels when it is available as a sticky called "panels library" and the links worked at the moment, and yet the he requests for an existing panel.
Situation 2
Someone asks for a Windows Live Messenger download, and he/she says that he "looked everywhere, up and down" ... I tell him that it's easy to find and he isn't really looking ... he defense himself saying that he really did look ... we say o rly?
Example
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=517909
By the way, I declare this a skeleton war, since both of you are likely to argue and you both have skull faces

I would say, empathise, its not about senior members but about those people who stay a lot on this forum & loves this place too much that they get annoyed when they find someone littering around or violating the rules.
But being a senior member or more so a lover of XDA I would not allow myself to offend anyone's feelings or his/her dignity.
Enjoy & report mods in case you feel something is too offending & the suggestion is going out of context. Cheers
Saksham Katyal

I am a 28 year old male with not much to worry about.
Arguing on a Smart_phone/PPC forum is a little too juvenile for myself.
I was merely reading some threads, saw some rudeness.... read some more.... saw some more.
Then asked if the admins were aware.
I didn't expect it to cause such a stir. WOW!
Most people here have seemed rather decent since I posted this, and I expected nothing from XDA, but a place to learn new things.
I'm not really that concerned about it, just wanted to let the admins know my initial experience.
I was never directly disrespected.... The fact is, I haven't asked for help here at all.
I actually answered a few questions and really nothing more.
So, is there really a need to continue this discussion??
Not for me.... but you guys feel free to continue.
But if a skeleton war is in order...... I have some tattooed on me and am infatuated with them, so I WIN...hahaha

sakshamkatyal said:
I would say, empathise, its not about senior members but about those people who stay a lot on this forum & loves this place too much that they get annoyed when they find someone littering around or violating the rules.
But being a senior member or more so a lover of XDA I would not allow myself to offend anyone's feelings or his/her dignity.
Enjoy & report mods in case you feel something is too offending & the suggestion is going out of context. Cheers
Saksham Katyal
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Very mature words.... This is what I expect from a forum.
Is that your little girl there..... I read about the tragedy.
Broke my heart into a million pieces!!!

tomtommy306 said:
Very mature words.... This is what I expect from a forum.
Is that your little girl there..... I read about the tragedy.
Broke my heart into a million pieces!!!
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Click to collapse
No its not mine but it was our's.
Even we are stunned with what happened to her in this little age.
get more about her here.
http://www.supportalessandra.com/
I wish you have a nice time over here. Dont worry xda is community inhabited more by mature people fortunately. Or else mods would be always there.
Regards
Saksham Katyal

tomtommy306 said:
I am a 28 year old male with not much to worry about.
Arguing on a Smart_phone/PPC forum is a little too juvenile for myself.
I was merely reading some threads, saw some rudeness.... read some more.... saw some more.
Then asked if the admins were aware.
I didn't expect it to cause such a stir. WOW!
Most people here have seemed rather decent since I posted this, and I expected nothing from XDA, but a place to learn new things.
I'm not really that concerned about it, just wanted to let the admins know my initial experience.
I was never directly disrespected.... The fact is, I haven't asked for help here at all.
I actually answered a few questions and really nothing more.
So, is there really a need to continue this discussion??
Not for me.... but you guys feel free to continue.
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Lol... I love this thread. You got upset because you saw some guys tell some noobs to search for stuff instead of starting a new thread, so you get all flustered, start a thread about it and then you get all defensive when somebody responds to your post.
OMG I can't believe it caused SUCH A STIR... oh wow.
28 year old male with not much to worry about... lol... this is classic stuff.

Drybonz said:
Lol... I love this thread. You got upset because you saw some guys tell some noobs to search for stuff instead of starting a new thread, so you get all flustered, start a thread about it and then you get all defensive when somebody responds to your post.
OMG I can't believe it caused SUCH A STIR... oh wow.
28 year old male with not much to worry about... lol... this is classic stuff.
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What are you from ebaumsworld? Ya know, I am offended by what you just said, and I'm 19. Does age really matter?
There is always a chance that a question/thread is plausible and that he actually tried to search. And beside, sometimes I get lazy about searching and I just ask the question too. Well actually I ask the question first, and search immediately after because I want to gather all the result as soon as possible.

poetryrocksalot said:
Ya know, I am offended by what you just said, and I'm 19. Does age really matter?
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Dunno... I'm 32 and I was quoting it.

Yeash, this is turning into that thread about religion.
Guys, please.
Noobs: sometimes, seniors get tired of answering the same old questions that can be easily found by a quick google.
Seniors: sometimes noobs are coming from a world of Nokias and iphones. You live in a world where people make ROMs for fun. Seriously.
The lot of you: you live in a world where you rub shoulders with Doctor Manhattan style giants, and don't even know it. Some of the guys on this site will astound you with their knowledge of the intricacies of the minutiae of the encryption systems used in the CE rom structure. They could blow you all away.
Experience is a sliding scale, and even George Lucas knows that "there's always a bigger fish".
Everyone should be polite, you were all noobs once.
V
PS be polite, serious, cus I'll start getting medieval soon.

poetryrocksalot said:
What are you from ebaumsworld? Ya know, I am offended by what you just said, and I'm 19. Does age really matter?
There is always a chance that a question/thread is plausible and that he actually tried to search. And beside, sometimes I get lazy about searching and I just ask the question too. Well actually I ask the question first, and search immediately after because I want to gather all the result as soon as possible.
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Nope, age never has anything to do with it as is evident by Drybonz reply...and like he/she said, he/she is 32. Even at the age of 32 he/she still enjoys coming on to a forum and slamming someone for simply stating something the is bothersome to them, then gets a bigger kick when he/she sees that the reply got under their skin. Sad part is he/she will probably see my reply and some how get joy from it too.
Basically you have 1 of 2 choices on internet forums;
1. Let people bother you and lose sight of why you got on to a forum in the first place just to end up not coming back and missing out because of it.
2. Let it go and realize life is too short to care about people with more guts behind a screen/keyboard and what they have to say. You see a post that bothers you? Skip it and go to the next, simple as that.

wagonis said:
Nope, age never has anything to do with it as is evident by Drybonz reply...and like he/she said, he/she is 32. Even at the age of 32 he/she still enjoys coming on to a forum and slamming someone for simply stating something the is bothersome to them, then gets a bigger kick when he/she sees that the reply got under their skin. Sad part is he/she will probably see my reply and some how get joy from it too.
Basically you have 1 of 2 choices on internet forums;
1. Let people bother you and lose sight of why you got on to a forum in the first place just to end up not coming back and missing out because of it.
2. Let it go and realize life is too short to care about people with more guts behind a screen/keyboard and what they have to say. You see a post that bothers you? Skip it and go to the next, simple as that.
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kudos to you sir

I agree with Wagonis: just ignore any remarks by others that you dislike for any reason.
To Tomtommy: I agree with you that everyone ought to be polite, it is an excellent thing to strive for yourself. But if you let impolite remarks bother you, you just make things worse than they need be. If you ignore them, they will bother you far less. Indignation is a dangerous emotion, because it tends to swell with time. Just let people bicker; when they are really offended, they will make it known. Most people can take a bit of bullying.
[What I am going to say now borders on the insolent, so that I must apologize beforehand, but: I think those who are most insecure about themselves are the ones most easily offended. Those who are confident just think: "oh, an impolite remark" without experiencing much emotional impact. Sometimes, others are judged "offended" even when they themselves do not care.
Another option is that there are just differences in culture: in some groups, rude remarks are considered a form of innocent teasing.]

So much disrespect going on!!!

I just really don't understand.. I have been reading though many different threads for a long time now (lurking cuz I dont have any issues to report on) but thats not the point of my post right now...
most people are helpful and respectful and thats what we fellow android lovers should be about, BUT then there are some people that are just straight up A-holes... and people in the android community wonder what is happening to XDA as a whole... just read through pretty much any thread and you can see it...
we are all here to HELP not FLAME!!! we are NO better than others cuz we know more or have more posts, big deal, we all started out at post count 1... alot of times I wonder how old the people on here really are? cuz they act like high schoolers... again, the majority is a good group of people but alot of people need to check themselves... i hate to say it(not really) but everyone is going to rootzwiki and android central for this reason alone... DISRESPECT... think about it.... seriously, just think about it.
If we, or anyone who honestly gives a sh** wants to restore this site to its former glory, then first start showing respect!!!
/END RANT
This thread is for voicing opinions/issues ONLY!!! Rumors will not be allowed and NO flaming tolerated!!! thanks

THIS. Over in Fascinate land, we're losing our best developers as well as some VERY helpful "average users" due to an apparent surge in all-around immaturity and stupidity. Thing is, in my 27 years, I have yet to find a community (online or not) bereft of the "our community's dying!" mentality.
Wherever you have people, you have politics; wherever you have politics, you have conflict. While it's frustrating to see highly valued contributors moving on, we can still follow (and learn from) their continuing efforts while remaining part of XDA ourselves. The Internet's handy like that, but it's a double-edged sword: the masses always follow the content they desire and migrate as needed. The devs are our content providers, but donations and "Thank You" buttons can only go so far to outweigh general Internet shenanigans / douchebaggery.
Basically, I am confident that the greater XDA community will continue to thrive as long as the vast majority of users continue to conduct themselves appropriately and remain intersted in the subject matter. There'll always be petty squabbling and "shocking" departures, but it takes more than that to truly ruin a community.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App

I agree with Jazz. In the many years I've been online I have seen forums go through stuff like this. It's part of our nature as human beings. And eventually the voice of reason prevails.

Omnichron said:
I agree with Jazz. In the many years I've been online I have seen forums go through stuff like this. It's part of our nature as human beings. And eventually the voice of reason prevails.
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I agree with you both... my point is respecting others... I have been a part of this forum and AndroidCentral for years and have never seen such disrespect at android cent...
I just don't get why some(not all) people (mainly the ones with high post counts) think they have the right to flame new people, or people that are asking for help. yes, this help may be obvious to some and not so obvious to others. but isn't the point of an tech forum to get help in a respectful manner? the other day I asked a question (and yes I did use the search tool first to no avail), and I was majorly flamed by two different people for something that was obvious to them but not to others...
the point: I hope this place comes back around
and thank you both for your input, hopefully others will read this and think about it. and I am sure I will probably get flamed for posting this

ssethv said:
I agree with you both... my point is respecting others... I have been a part of this forum and AndroidCentral for years and have never seen such disrespect at android cent...
I just don't get why some(not all) people (mainly the ones with high post counts) think they have the right to flame new people, or people that are asking for help. yes, this help may be obvious to some and not so obvious to others. but isn't the point of an tech forum to get help in a respectful manner? the other day I asked a question (and yes I did use the search tool first to no avail), and I was majorly flamed by two different people for something that was obvious to them but not to others...
the point: I hope this place comes back around
and thank you both for your input, hopefully others will read this and think about it. and I am sure I will probably get flamed for posting this
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I wouldn't worry about it. Just as soon as someone shows the slightest anti-social attitude, put their user ID in your ignore list and you will never be troubled by them again. You won't be able to see anything they say. The thread will be populated only with constructive and helpful posts.
Since I started doing this myself, XDA has been a wonderful site for me.

Thanks, But what if that 'someone' does have some very helpful info but is just an A-hole. is there a way to filter. or just block them and deal with the loss of their info?
PS. I really like your tiny signature at the bottom... awesome

MartyLK said:
I wouldn't worry about it. Just as soon as someone shows the slightest anti-social attitude, put their user ID in your ignore list and you will never be troubled by them again. You won't be able to see anything they say. The thread will be populated only with constructive and helpful posts.
Since I started doing this myself, XDA has been a wonderful site for me.
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Marty, you make a good point. The sad part about it is that when / if those people grow up, any worthwhile posts they make will go unseen by many; in a way, they really end up cheating themselves.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App

Jazz848 said:
Marty, you make a good point. The sad part about it is that when / if those people grow up, any worthwhile posts they make will go unseen by many; in a way, they really end up cheating themselves.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App
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That's very true. But there are some who are not children who are just as disrespectful as some of the younger ones.

ssethv said:
Thanks, But what if that 'someone' does have some very helpful info but is just an A-hole. is there a way to filter. or just block them and deal with the loss of their info?
PS. I really like your tiny signature at the bottom... awesome
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Though it is possible such disrespectful people could have valuable info, I would rather not use it anyway. I'm funny that way. If someone disrespects me, nothing they do is liked. And I personally don't consider anything from them of use.
Thanks for the compliment. It was an addition when I started using the ignore list.

@OP
Indeed we have millions of members who love and respect what XDA stands for: Development!
And with a site of almost 4 million of course problems are in millions, we will be making some changes soon that will lead into a better XDA, of course with the help of all good members out there!
As a recommendation when you detect some problem, instead of reacting yourself and possibly starting a bigger issue please report to us and we will take care.
Thanks for your cooperation.

I agree. I definitely wish XDA was brought back to the way it was a few years ago, however back then it was mostly devs and power users. It's really hard today with the influx of newbs making threads like "I CAN HAZ CM7 ON MY EVO 3D YET?"

@orb3000
Thanks for the feedback... I never feed the fires of a flame... I am here for two reasons only... to get info (by READING or using the search tool) and to help other people out...
I am looking forward to "said" changes coming to the site

tek818 said:
I agree. I definitely wish XDA was brought back to the way it was a few years ago, however back then it was mostly devs and power users. It's really hard today with the influx of newbs making threads like "I CAN HAZ CM7 ON MY EVO 3D YET?"
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I somewhat agree with you... but we all started at post count 1, and were all noobs at one time... everyone that enters this site should be treated with dignity and respect. unless, the are undeserving of it, then as Marty said "block them"
but i understand exactly what you mean.. and it can be annoying at times. thats when i go smoke a cig or take a breath and break from the computer for a while.

orb3000 said:
@OP
Indeed we have millions of members who love and respect what XDA stands for: Development!
And with a site of almost 4 million of course problems are in millions, we will be making some changes soon that will lead into a better XDA, of course with the help of all good members out there!
As a recommendation when you detect some problem, instead of reacting yourself and possibly starting a bigger issue please report to us and we will take care.
Thanks for your cooperation.
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Click to collapse
You are going on my block list. Sheesh, flaming on a thread about stopping the flames. Shame on you!

LOL.... i cant stop laughing, you just made my day a little better

ssethv said:
I just don't get why some(not all) people (mainly the ones with high post counts) think they have the right to flame new people, or people that are asking for help. yes, this help may be obvious to some and not so obvious to others. but isn't the point of an tech forum to get help in a respectful manner? the other day I asked a question (and yes I did use the search tool first to no avail), and I was majorly flamed by two different people for something that was obvious to them but not to others...
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The answer is that after you've been here a while and see crop after crop of n00bs come in and ask the same. frigging. questions when the answers are right there, you get a little jaded and start to lose patience. Sometimes you forget which things are really obvious and which were hard to figure out. All you know is that you've answered it 100 times. So some 'power users' burn out, some keep trucking, and some turn to flaming. This is NOT EXCUSABLE, just explaining the lifecycle.
When you're the kind of person who does things like, say, read all 800 pages of a thread (and weeding out al the useless posts) so you're sure to be up to date, then someone waltzes in and asks a question for the 100th time... it's just incredibly frustrating. For every user that does that, there's one that has come in quietly and found the information on their own, which means the information CAN be found. Heck, I was able to find it. I know it's out there. I earned it and they want it for free. So how many lazy so-and-sos should I give it away to before I get a bit irate? Frustration is instantly doubled if the post is in a Development thread.
We're all standing on the shoulders of those that have gone before us. Problem is, some n00bs don't seem to care if they kick the guys under them in the nuts on the way up. It gets old.
But, as Orb stated, we're making some changes that should start to reverse that trend.

mrkite38 said:
The answer is that after you've been here a while and see crop after crop of n00bs come in and ask the same. frigging. questions when the answers are right there, you get a little jaded and start to lose patience. Sometimes you forget which things are really obvious and which were hard to figure out. All you know is that you've answered it 100 times. So some 'power users' burn out, some keep trucking, and some turn to flaming. This is NOT EXCUSABLE, just explaining the lifecycle.
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But, as Orb stated, we're making some changes that should start to reverse that trend.
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well said, and I understand and agree with you... I am low on my post count on this site becuase I do use the search tool and EVERY singe question known to man has been asked and answered on this site, thats why I lurk and reseach, so I don't ask the same question again... I am on Android Central and know exactly what you mean. I was asked to be a moderator but turned it down cuz I don't always have the time... I mainly try to create guides/fixes/tutorials for the thunderbolt rooting roms and hacks section.
thanks to everyone for there thoughts and replies thus far, hopefully some more people will read and take to heart all of our opinions and issues

orb3000 said:
@OP
Indeed we have millions of members who love and respect what XDA stands for: Development!
And with a site of almost 4 million of course problems are in millions, we will be making some changes soon that will lead into a better XDA, of course with the help of all good members out there!
As a recommendation when you detect some problem, instead of reacting yourself and possibly starting a bigger issue please report to us and we will take care.
Thanks for your cooperation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, especially the bold part. But the current system in place doesn't help us report any problem posts. I've been here since 2007 (in fact the only other older person in this thread is you) and just comparing what was back in 2007 to now, the problem is worse with hot tempered devs and or members in general. Like I said the system doesn't give those that care the affordability to actually report a problem post or member. Having to go through a list of mods and having to choose one to send the complaint is not efficient. Maybe the report button should generate a report post that deposits in a specially created forum for the staff to see and then take care of. This not only keeps a record of problem members but is quicker than the current system.
And while I agree that the site is mostly created by developers for developers, everyone started on page 1. Everyone started asking questions. I understand that some devs (and members) will get frustrated after the same question is asked over and over. But there isn't any need to go off the deep end. The same goes for any member. In the time that one wastes making a post flaming the member, they could have reported it or better yet, provide the answer.
I've gone through threads with hundreds of pages to get an answer, but seeing so many with flames, arguments and nonsense forces those that rather not deal with it to ask the question even if it was asked before.
Now mind you, I firmly believe its not just mods but everyone's responsibility to make sure things run smoothly. If a member starts flaming, being disrespectful, etc, don't add to the argument, report it, this way the staff can remove the post. Maybe then the 100 pages threads won't be so riddled with nonsense or be so long. We can't rely on the staff to see everything, so we should do our part as well. But like I mentioned above the reporting system doesn't help.
Another thing that throws a wrench into this is the fact that staff may be reluctant to give out a warning, infraction or a temp ban to those disrespectful members with high posts counts especially if they are developers for fear that they may take their stuff elsewhere. Its a fine line to cross. Now, what the solution or middle ground is, is anyone's guess. Hopefully the upcoming changes will be a start. But in the meantime, I for one will continue to report anyone that is out of line regardless of post count or title.
TS out

Another thing that throws a wrench into this is the fact that staff may be reluctant to give out a warning, infraction or a temp ban to those disrespectful members with high posts counts especially if they are developers for fear that they may take their stuff elsewhere.
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Very true!!!
the system doesn't give those that care the affordability to actually report a problem post or member. Having to go through a list of mods and having to choose one to send the complaint is not efficient. Maybe the report button should generate a report post that deposits in a specially created forum for the staff to see and then take care of. This not only keeps a record of problem members but is quicker than the current system.
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Hopefully this idea will be considered by the mods, its a good idea!!!
I firmly believe its not just mods but everyone's responsibility to make sure things run smoothly. If a member starts flaming, being disrespectful, etc, don't add to the argument, report it, this way the staff can remove the post. Maybe then the 100 pages threads won't be so riddled with nonsense or be so long. We can't rely on the staff to see everything, so we should do our part as well. But like I mentioned above the reporting system doesn't help.
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well put... thanks for contributing to this thread... I want this to get the wheels turning, I love this place and hate what is and has happened to it...

New report post system is on the way pretty soon

RANT!!!! about unhelpful know-it-alls

Ever notice how these forums are CRAWLING!!!! with the know-it-all put-you-down small-person inferiority-complex type? These are the ones who, even though you used the damn search for three hours before posting a thread, and did not find your answer, they respond to your post with "USE THE SEARCH!!!!!" W T F !!!! They flame the hell out of such members and drive away even some devs because they are just selfish a$$hole know-it-alls. And I LOVE how they will FLAME THE HELL out of anyone who posts a question thread in the dev section claiming it's against the rules, when in fact it's NOT!!! There is no WRITTEN rule here that states that (unlike at PPCGEEKS which DOES have such a written rule), they FLAME people on the claim that these people are violating such a sacred rule, which doesn't actually exist, and yet they are somehow exempt from the explicit written rule of not flaming! If I was a mod, I would seriously devote my time to finding these people and BANNING THEM!!! I've seen people, who have serious, time sensitive problems to solve, and post in more than one forum hoping to get a speedy answer, and some BRILLIANT WIZARD comes along and flames them for CROSS POSTING!!! ARE YOU SERIOUS!? If someone is in desperate need of getting their phone fixed they are not going to be persuaded by some a$$h013 KNOW IT ALL wannabe forum HALL MONITOR bossing them! W!, T!, F!,
You know HOW MANY TIMES I've done a search for a problem, found a thread with someone who has the SAME PROBLEM, but the ONLY RESPONSE listed is someone saying "USE THE SEARCH AND DON'T CLUTTER UP THE FORUM!!!! THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED!!!!" yet for some reason that is the ONLY DAMN THREAD I can find on it!!!! HOW I *LOVE* finding such HELPFUL THREADS!!!
I've read posts by devs who have left or severely LIMITED their work due to people they call "HATERS". Good job. Seriously, yelling at someone who is asking for help is lame and such responses should be deleted and people with such attitudes BANNED!
And how many TIMES do you find someone who posts a question in the DEV section and some EINSTEIN comes along and their ONLY REPLY is "THIS NEEDS TO BE MOVED!! DON'T POST QUESTIONS IN THE DEV SECTION!!!" W T F!!!! These types of people need to be banned for life. Making people afraid to ask questions hinders growth and due to the lack of it my love for searching and using Google has brought to light many more forums which some devs are favoring rather than XDA. Too bad, this place used to be the hang out of the 1337. People shouldn't be flamed for asking questions, and it shouldn't be assumed people aren't using the search. We all know of Google. I doubt there are many posts any more where the OP hasn't first used the search. Even secretaries know how to use Google. Saying "USE THE SEARCH!!!" isn't some stroke of dawning brilliance. This place has become so brutal that I'm sure even AFTER using the search and failing some still won't post their questions.

Let me begin by saying that I'm not attacking you or anyone else personally in this reply. My intention is to illustrate the other side of this argument. You see useless members starting flame wars; I see members protecting other users from potentially bricking their devices, teaching them manners, and upholding the sanctity of our developer forums.
petermg said:
Ever notice how these forums are CRAWLING!!!! with the know-it-all put-you-down small-person inferiority-complex type? These are the ones who, even though you used the damn search for three hours before posting a thread, and did not find your answer, they respond to your post with "USE THE SEARCH!!!!!" W T F !!!!
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I can assure you that the majority of the time, the person in which the flame is directed did not use the search feature. If they did, then common sense would dictate that you give the most amount of information relevant to your problem in order for someone else to help. We are not mind readers. If the majority of the problems that are posted about here could have been answered by the simple use of the search feature, and that person did not use it, well, it gets extraordinarily annoying after a time. In any case, if they did search, but didn't provide that bit of information in their post, then you can't get mad at us for not being mind readers.
They flame the hell out of such members and drive away even some devs because they are just selfish a$$hole know-it-alls. And I LOVE how they will FLAME THE HELL out of anyone who posts a question thread in the dev section claiming it's against the rules, when in fact it's NOT!!! There is no WRITTEN rule here that states that (unlike at PPCGEEKS which DOES have such a written rule), they FLAME people on the claim that these people are violating such a sacred rule, which doesn't actually exist, and yet they are somehow exempt from the explicit written rule of not flaming!
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This is an issue which is always in a bit of flux here. You have to understand that this isn't a support website. This website is dedicated to development. As such, developers on this website come first and foremost. If you or anyone else decide to clutter up the development forums, which are provided as a haven for our developers, with inane posts about simple things that could have been answered with the search feature or should have simply been posted in the proper forum, this too gets very old very quickly. I'm not condoning the flaming, but you have to accept that there is just cause for the disdain on this topic.
If I was a mod, I would seriously devote my time to finding these people and BANNING THEM!!! I've seen people, who have serious, time sensitive problems to solve, and post in more than one forum hoping to get a speedy answer, and some BRILLIANT WIZARD comes along and flames them for CROSS POSTING!!! ARE YOU SERIOUS!? If someone is in desperate need of getting their phone fixed they are not going to be persuaded by some a$$h013 KNOW IT ALL wannabe forum HALL MONITOR bossing them! W!, T!, F!,
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First off, as a mod, tracking down these people should not be your primary concern. There are far more pressing matters to attend to than this select group of people. Besides, pointing out the obvious isn't against the rules. Cross posting, however, is against the rules. The bottom line for the time-sensitive posts is that it is a risk you take by flashing a custom ROM, or doing something the manufacturer didn't intend. It comes back around to my point about us not being a support website. If someone has the spare time to get you an answer, then good for you, but it is never something that anyone should expect here.
You know HOW MANY TIMES I've done a search for a problem, found a thread with someone who has the SAME PROBLEM, but the ONLY RESPONSE listed is someone saying "USE THE SEARCH AND DON'T CLUTTER UP THE FORUM!!!! THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED!!!!" yet for some reason that is the ONLY DAMN THREAD I can find on it!!!! HOW I *LOVE* finding such HELPFUL THREADS!!!
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More likely than not, you simply need to change your search terms. If you aren't able to find your answer by searching, then make a post about it letting us know what exactly you searched for that garnered no results.
This does two things:
1) It narrows down our search criteria to exclude the terms you have already exhausted.
2) It shows us that you didn't come here just to leach an answer from the community, but also put in some effort at troubleshooting your own issue.
I've read posts by devs who have left or severely LIMITED their work due to people they call "HATERS". Good job. Seriously, yelling at someone who is asking for help is lame and such responses should be deleted and people with such attitudes BANNED!
And how many TIMES do you find someone who posts a question in the DEV section and some EINSTEIN comes along and their ONLY REPLY is "THIS NEEDS TO BE MOVED!! DON'T POST QUESTIONS IN THE DEV SECTION!!!" W T F!!!! These types of people need to be banned for life.
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This happens because most of the senior members here, including myself, feel that anyone with half a brain should be able to tell that questions go in the question and answers fora. They are labeled like that for a reason. If you didn't create something developmental, then there isn't a reason to post a thread in the development fora.
Making people afraid to ask questions hinders growth and due to the lack of it my love for searching and using Google has brought to light many more forums which some devs are favoring rather than XDA. Too bad, this place used to be the hang out of the 1337. People shouldn't be flamed for asking questions, and it shouldn't be assumed people aren't using the search. We all know of Google. I doubt there are many posts any more where the OP hasn't first used the search. Even secretaries know how to use Google. Saying "USE THE SEARCH!!!" isn't some stroke of dawning brilliance. This place has become so brutal that I'm sure even AFTER using the search and failing some still won't post their questions.
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Just because people know about Google doesn't mean they've actually used it. It is far more rare to come across a user asking a question who has done a search first than not.
The problem isn't so much about people asking questions. The problem lies a bit deeper now. Things used to be different here, indeed. I've personally been a registered XDA user for 6 years now. Things were more development focused back in the old WM days. It was normally only those of us who were looking for ways to get more out of our Pocket PCs that would frequent the forum. This mentality you are describing wasn't any different then from what it is today. The only difference is that now that Android has flooded the market that Apple made popular, we have a different set of users who are looking for a different type of development.
When I was a noob here, the flaming for not searching and doing the work myself was what eventually taught me how to find my own answers and not rely on others to support my device. I learned how to search, compose a proper post, and ask for help in a way that showed I wasn't trying to be a leach but had legitimately tried to solve my issue and failed.
The other big difference at the time was the age difference between WM users and the current generation of Android and iOS users. Back then, WM users were generally in their 20s or older. Most of the people using it, such as myself, needed it as a professional portable workstation. We had a more mature mentality towards our precious piece of technology. There were few times where you could get one of these Pocket PCs for under $400, so we valued what we had spent our money on, since insurance claims on them were all but nonexistent at the time. If we did something wrong, then there was a good chance that our expensive gadget would be just another paperweight. Since a fair portion of us needed these devices for a daily job, there was more caution thrown towards modding, flashing, or installing software.
Now, our devices are known as smartphones, and our users are mostly teenagers to whom their device was given by their parents. They don't have the same sense of worth towards their devices that used to be present since they didn't pay anything for it, or paid very little.
These users aren't taught that respect needs to be show if you want to receive it. I know it may seem as though they didn't say anything warranting a flame war, but by not showing other members of this community who donate their time to it enough respect to out line their problem and how they tried to solve it, all it sounds like to us is, "Here, I broke this. You need to fix it for me for free."
I hope that this has shown you the other side of the coin.

There is a difference between other forums and this one. They are user forums and this one is not. It is a developers forum. Made by and for developers.

im also newbie,still learning to theme my rom,applying and make new mod from the tutorial that posted here in developement forum,i read all threads and posts to understand how to make it on my phone,not just asking for help,if you say you are tired reading all threads and posts to find an answer,what about the devs??are'nt they tired of answering same question over and over??say something with you mind open,just an advice
Sent from my LT18i

Some good points made on each side, but the fact is that this is NOT the regular use forum, it's for the "pro" people, so I think it's understandable when they get annoyed with some of the users asking seemingly simple questions.

zelendel said:
There is a difference between other forums and this one. They are user forums and this one is not. It is a developers forum. Made by and for developers.
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xda is for developers and users.

Android78822 said:
xda is for developers and users.
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No, it isn't. That's where the confusion comes from. This is a developer forum that we allow non-developers to be a part of. The catch is that you have to actually participate and be a part of the community to get any level of respect here. We don't appreciate people coming here just to turn us into a support forum. If you want tech support, call your carrier. If you want to be a part of a community, come here.

If you are in urgent need of help I would recommend trying IRC first, it's usually a lot easier to get real time feedback from people on there compared to a forum.
Some of the flaming may be unnecessary, but you have to realize that a large amount of time goes into a lot of the ROMs, kernels, etc. If you're nice enough to share it then you deserve to have a chance for everyone to see it. To have everyone bury their posts just so they can ask a question is inconsiderate, to say the least. Plus the clutter makes it harder for those looking for something to find it.
When I first started lurking here I only needed to see one question in the dev section for me to figure out that was the last place to post one. Sure I was cautious the first time or two I posted there, but you better believe I made sure it fit in with the other posts there before I posted it.

cajunflavoredbob said:
No, it isn't. That's where the confusion comes from. This is a developer forum that we allow non-developers to be a part of. The catch is that you have to actually participate and be a part of the community to get any level of respect here. We don't appreciate people coming here just to turn us into a support forum. If you want tech support, call your carrier. If you want to be a part of a community, come here.
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You. Are. Awesome.
Always a level-headed, thorough, well-thought-out response. Keep it up.

arrrghhh said:
You. Are. Awesome.
Always a level-headed, thorough, well-thought-out response. Keep it up.
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Nah he's a scumbag really...
He just pops in here every now and then to make up for trolling elsewhere...
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.......

conantroutman said:
Nah he's a scumbag really...
He just pops in here every now and then to make up for trolling elsewhere...
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.......
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Save your trolling for OT. I'll meet you there later. Lol

I've changed my mind about this very subject so many times that I've lost count. I used to be in the "Search the forum." camp, but then decided that I could be more constructive - "Search the forum and see if you can find any help there. I just used this search term - xxxxxxxxxxxxx - and came up with some answers for you. See if any of them help."
From what I've seen most of the people that are blunt about searching one day are friendly and offer good, helpful advice the next day. Yes, of course there are a few trolls that seem to take pleasure in baiting confrontation, but that's unfortunately the nature of large groups of people. There's always 1!
This community has, by and large, been the most informative website I have ever had the pleasure to take part in. My only advice with regards to this matter would be to learn to take bad attitudes with a pinch of salt, or let the mods know if someone's gone too far. I'm certainly not shy about bringing things to the attention of mods, and I've only been trolled by one of them
Basically, if you see something you don't like then don't rant. Teach by example. It makes the whole place better for us all.

Archer said:
I've changed my mind about this very subject so many times that I've lost count. I used to be in the "Search the forum." camp, but then decided that I could be more constructive - "Search the forum and see if you can find any help there. I just used this search term - xxxxxxxxxxxxx - and came up with some answers for you. See if any of them help."
From what I've seen most of the people that are blunt about searching one day are friendly and offer good, helpful advice the next day. Yes, of course there are a few trolls that seem to take pleasure in baiting confrontation, but that's unfortunately the nature of large groups of people. There's always 1!
This community has, by and large, been the most informative website I have ever had the pleasure to take part in. My only advice with regards to this matter would be to learn to take bad attitudes with a pinch of salt, or let the mods know if someone's gone too far. I'm certainly not shy about bringing things to the attention of mods, and I've only been trolled by one of them
Basically, if you see something you don't like then don't rant. Teach by example. It makes the whole place better for us all.
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I've kind of grown out of the "USE THE SEARCH FEATURE" responses as well. It took me several years, but now I ask questions designed to teach them how they should be posting questions.
When I see a post like "i brookeded my fone. needz help! whAT SHouLd i do?!!!", it generates a response from me along the lines of, "Ok, what did you do to try and fix it yourself? Have you searched for your problem? Did you read the stickies? Did you read any relevant FAQs for that mod/hack/ROM/app?"
It's a bit condescending, but not as insulting as just spamming SEARCH FIRST all the time. This way, they feel a little bit insulted, but at least they know why.

cajunflavoredbob said:
I've kind of grown out of the "USE THE SEARCH FEATURE" responses as well. It took me several years, but now I ask questions designed to teach them how they should be posting questions.
When I see a post like "i brookeded my fone. needz help! whAT SHouLd i do?!!!", it generates a response from me along the lines of, "Ok, what did you do to try and fix it yourself? Have you searched for your problem? Did you read the stickies? Did you read any relevant FAQs for that mod/hack/ROM/app?"
It's a bit condescending, but not as insulting as just spamming SEARCH FIRST all the time. This way, they feel a little bit insulted, but at least they know why.
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Exactly - could not agree more (especially since you were pretty much agreeing with me ) I find myself now showing a newb (not noob) how it should be done, whilst at the same time letting the "SEARCH NOOB" shouters know how they should deal with it.
Given time though, I think most of us realise the futility of shouting at people that demand support. There's one guy in particular I can think of (obviously won't say who), who came on here shouting NOOB and telling people to search and ranting at everything that was even vaguely rantable at, and it was clear that he just enjoyed it. Now, though, after a couple of years on here he's one of the most helpful members I know. He has tons of patience and tons of thanks to show for it. I see him around now and then and we usually say hello, and I have to admit that it's nice to think that maybe showing him how to deal with a newb quietly and calmly may have had some effect. Maybe not, but either way I'm glad he got there eventually.
Either people stay and eventually become more chilled, or they leave in anger or get booted for trolling/swearing/abusing etc..
I have faith in the majority.

Archer said:
Exactly - could not agree more (especially since you were pretty much agreeing with me ) I find myself now showing a newb (not noob) how it should be done, whilst at the same time letting the "SEARCH NOOB" shouters know how they should deal with it.
Given time though, I think most of us realise the futility of shouting at people that demand support. There's one guy in particular I can think of (obviously won't say who), who came on here shouting NOOB and telling people to search and ranting at everything that was even vaguely rantable at, and it was clear that he just enjoyed it. Now, though, after a couple of years on here he's one of the most helpful members I know. He has tons of patience and tons of thanks to show for it. I see him around now and then and we usually say hello, and I have to admit that it's nice to think that maybe showing him how to deal with a newb quietly and calmly may have had some effect. Maybe not, but either way I'm glad he got there eventually.
Either people stay and eventually become more chilled, or they leave in anger or get booted for trolling/swearing/abusing etc..
I have faith in the majority.
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Heheh, you're referring to me, aren't you?
Yea, you just have to find that balance between being insulting and helpful. That way they are less likely to make the same mistake again. It's never a good idea to just hand over the information right away, since that teaches them absolutely nothing. It's like that old proverb saying that you can give a man a fish and feed him for a day, but if you teach him to fish, you can feed him for life.

cajunflavoredbob said:
Heheh, you're referring to me, aren't you?
Yea, you just have to find that balance between being insulting and helpful. That way they are less likely to make the same mistake again. It's never a good idea to just hand over the information right away, since that teaches them absolutely nothing. It's like that old proverb saying that you can give a man a fish and feed him for a day, but if you teach him to fish, you can feed him for life.
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Hahaha nah mate - I wasn't referring to you. You're still a troll

This sort of thing happens all the time in automotive forums, oldsters get super cranky from answering the same questions over and over and new people get mad because they're told to use search literally every time they have a question valid or not. You're probably going to find that this is an issue no matter where you go on the internet.
The only time I've seen this mostly resolved is on a forum where moderation of user behavior is swift, brutal, and pretty impartial, and registration to the forum costs $10. Not likely to work on a forum such as this.

.
To compliment and support what cajunflavoredbob mentioned, please read my signature, you may now understand the nature of XDA:
This is and always will be a site for developers, pure and simple. Without them we are nothing, without them there would be no reason for XDA Developers to exist; we should never ever forget that. Without them this place would not be called XDA-Developers but something else, e.g Mobile Phone User Support Services For Ungrateful Nerds.
XDA is about developing and is for developers. Any user that recognises that will gain the most benefit from this site
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Android78822 said:
xda is for developers and users.
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cajunflavoredbob said:
No, it isn't. That's where the confusion comes from. This is a developer forum that we allow non-developers to be a part of. The catch is that you have to actually participate and be a part of the community to get any level of respect here. We don't appreciate people coming here just to turn us into a support forum. If you want tech support, call your carrier. If you want to be a part of a community, come here.
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Jesus! A quick search would have brought up like 20+ threads just like this one. All of them with the same answer. You could have googled Asshats with tudes and XDA would have been your first answer. Read the rules! Post only when posted at! Never wear white after labor day, and some other stuff that is off topic!!!!

Here is something I don't understand. Yes this site might be for developers, but without users developers would server no purpose so that claim that this isn't for both users and developers seems counter productive. I myself haven't gotten around to making 10+ posts just to justify my rooting knowledge.
Yet the fact remains that without users the developers wouldn't really need to even have a website like this or it would be private which it's clearly not. How many bigger developers actually live off of their user donations?
Just my two cents, but I disagree.

Like this forum but don't

Man I like this forum but don't at the same time.. I love the fact there's so much stuff on here that's so helpful to everyone but at the same time the people on here are 50/50 meaning about 50% you are nice and do realize a beginner has to start somewhere and learn as they go and are willing to help as much as possible you also realize you were once there yourselfs mean while there's the other 50% forget they where beginners and noobs at one point and still think that everyone shouldn't ask questions and automatically think you know the answer as well as give rude and smart butt answers or links... uncalled for is about the best way to describe those answers its amazing that the admin allow these people to give rude and uncalled for comments but when someone responds with a rude or smart butt comment that person either gets a warning or banned and the other person gets nothing kind of interesting to me .... everyone should be treated fairly and evenly .. but had to say something from a lot of posts I've been reading
Sent From My Samsung Galaxy S3

I'm probably one of those guys that sometimes gives snarky responses. I really am trying to be nice and help the person find what they are looking for. That's 90% of the reason I post on here: I remember what it's like to not know much and to come to this community with very little knowledge.
That being said, I also hope people would follow the rules when posting, one of which is to search before starting a thread. I completely understand the complaints of people saying that there's too many threads on this site and it's difficult to find what you're looking for with search, but making a thread that's identical to an existing one is compounding the problem.
The way I try to help out with the problem is to take the time to write out a full response (not just give a link) and to (hopefully gently) point out that this topic has been covered and to look at the correct thread. I know Cnexus and I have been pretty good about this, although sometimes the deluge of MB1 update threads do make me a little short-tempered, and for that, I apologize.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda app-developers app

You fine man I understand the rules and read them so I know personally to search before asking and when posting make sure its in the right section.... as far as posting links example I was referring to about smart butt links is the google one I've notice is when you click on link takes you to google it automatically writes in the question the person would ask then at bottom it would say " now was that so hard " kinda funny but smart butt to I'm its a simple question that person could of easily just said hey man look please go read the forum rules and make sure you post in the right section simple and nicely said you know
But yes it is annoying when people ask / post same stuff that's been posted already 400 times before them again people should just be nice " hey man that question / concern / opinion has been posted already please search google and forums thank you "
Sent From My Samsung Galaxy S3

otterboxfan4l said:
You fine man I understand the rules and read them so I know personally to search before asking and when posting make sure its in the right section.... as far as posting links example I was referring to about smart butt links is the google one I've notice is when you click on link takes you to google it automatically writes in the question the person would ask then at bottom it would say " now was that so hard " kinda funny but smart butt to I'm its a simple question that person could of easily just said hey man look please go read the forum rules and make sure you post in the right section simple and nicely said you know
But yes it is annoying when people ask / post same stuff that's been posted already 400 times before them again people should just be nice " hey man that question / concern / opinion has been posted already please search google and forums thank you "
Sent From My Samsung Galaxy S3
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I know that the user is traditionally at fault (the old IT adage of PBMAC - the Problem Between Monitor and Chair), but I also think it's partially the fault of the xda app on the phone. The search function on there is so woefully inept that I have only used it once or twice (and have never found what I was looking for). On the other hand, when creating a thread on the PC, the website even gives you a list of similar threads that might help you out. There are many times where I've been creating a thread and when I put in the title, a half dozen similar threads popped up with the exact answer I was looking for. I know coding this into the android app would be difficult (if not impossible), but it must be noted that almost all of the MB1 update threads had the "sent from the XDA app..." tag at the bottom. I still tell them to search before posting, but I honestly can't blame them because of the apps search function's shortcomings.

Hi
To respond to the first part about allowing abuse...we don't. But bear in mind we have 5 milllion users, 50000 new posts a day and moderators that are constantly moving questions from the wrong section, breaking up childish nerd fights, responding to reported posts, investigating kang issues, and trying to have a job, family and life. We are not reading every post that enters XDA. We respond to reports by users. And every mod action requires several minutes of "paperwork" to document what was done.
Now to the post about searching, yup app search stinks, however if you switch to browser view there are more search options available as well as googling and adding XDA in the search parameter. The phone is quite large so searching through browser view or just with google is a lot easier than in days past.
In most cases like with football, the person throwing the last punch draws the penalty. It takes 2 to argue but just one is needed to keep it going.
Thanks
Friendly Neighborhood Moderator

I don't care about noob questions. what make me mad is when there is 5 "what is the best rom" threads on the first page. Stuff that you could easily flip through a couple pages and find an answer to is what angers me.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda app-developers app

CrfEpic4g said:
I don't care about noob questions. what make me mad is when there is 5 "what is the best rom" threads on the first page. Stuff that you could easily flip through a couple pages and find an answer to is what angers me.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda app-developers app
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I agree. I hate that question just for the fact what I like you may not like. Just take a hand full of roms and test them out. Lol
Sent from my stock rooted Galaxy S3

Dude..........
otterboxfan4l said:
Man I like this forum but don't at the same time.. I love the fact there's so much stuff on here that's so helpful to everyone but at the same time the people on here are 50/50 meaning about 50% you are nice and do realize a beginner has to start somewhere and learn as they go and are willing to help as much as possible you also realize you were once there yourselfs mean while there's the other 50% forget they where beginners and noobs at one point and still think that everyone shouldn't ask questions and automatically think you know the answer as well as give rude and smart butt answers or links... uncalled for is about the best way to describe those answers its amazing that the admin allow these people to give rude and uncalled for comments but when someone responds with a rude or smart butt comment that person either gets a warning or banned and the other person gets nothing kind of interesting to me .... everyone should be treated fairly and evenly .. but had to say something from a lot of posts I've been reading
Sent From My Samsung Galaxy S3[/If I may, I think we are all big boys and girls on this website. I would never take anything said here offensively. I will forget about all of you as soon as I log off.
The only thing I find aggravating here or ANY forum is the word "respect". Much respect......have respect......yo bro respect to this guy or that guy! What freakin ever! We aren't 1% bikers here. So why are we throwing that word in every sentence. We are all men amongst men(or women). Respect is a given. Let's quit with the manzy panzy complaints and start tweaking our phones to the fullest.
Just my two cents.......do I need a paypal for that? LMAO!]
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kennyglass123 said:
Hi
To respond to the first part about allowing abuse...we don't. But bear in mind we have 5 milllion users, 50000 new posts a day and moderators that are constantly moving questions from the wrong section, breaking up childish nerd fights, responding to reported posts, investigating kang issues, and trying to have a job, family and life. We are not reading every post that enters XDA. We respond to reports by users. And every mod action requires several minutes of "paperwork" to document what was done.
Now to the post about searching, yup app search stinks, however if you switch to browser view there are more search options available as well as googling and adding XDA in the search parameter. The phone is quite large so searching through browser view or just with google is a lot easier than in days past.
In most cases like with football, the person throwing the last punch draws the penalty. It takes 2 to argue but just one is needed to keep it going.
Thanks
Friendly Neighborhood Moderator
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Do you mods get paid by XDA or something? Lol I always wondered that...

Joe0113 said:
Do you mods get paid by XDA or something? Lol I always wondered that...
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No, its a volunteer system basically :beer:
jpgranger said:
If I may, I think we are all big boys and girls on this website. I would never take anything said here offensively. I will forget about all of you as soon as I log off.
The only thing I find aggravating here or ANY forum is the word "respect". Much respect......have respect......yo bro respect to this guy or that guy! What freakin ever! We aren't 1% bikers here. So why are we throwing that word in every sentence. We are all men amongst men(or women). Respect is a given. Let's quit with the manzy panzy complaints and start tweaking our phones to the fullest.
Just my two cents.......do I need a paypal for that? LMAO!]
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You say that, but you'd be surprised at some of the things I see posted here every day
And its difficult NOT to take offense when you find your mental capacity, ability to do something, or your integrity insulted. And the majority of the time, people will attack one of above

Joe0113 said:
Do you mods get paid by XDA or something? Lol I always wondered that...
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The only payment they get is that lovely thanks button at the bottom of every post.

Oh forgot about the most important perk of being a mod
tazfanatic said:
The only payment they get is that lovely thanks button at the bottom of every post.
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This^

Joe0113 said:
Do you mods get paid by XDA or something? Lol I always wondered that...
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Bwahahaha! Thanks for that laugh!
No. All volunteer because we care about the site and helping others.
Friendly Neighborhood Moderator

What's frustrating is all of these rule quoters that do nothing but add to the spam. Just answer the question then point them in the right direction or just ignore the post...

There is a saying you can led a horse to water but you can't force them to drink. But if can shoot the f*cker if he is too stubborn

I know sometimes when I was new to this forum (i am not a developer), I would get irritated when posting a question and you would see a lot of "views" but no replies/posts with any help. But you have to realize (as I did), as smart as these guys are, sometimes, nobody knows the answer to your question! So posting "crickets crickets" or something else snarky to that effect won't help you get an answer either. Most people are nice enough to help and will either post a link that you may have overlooked, or a real answer (or at least acknowledge your existence)...so in that case just be patient for an answer. Alot of the times when you google search, maybe you did not type in just the right terms and didn't get the link you were looking for.

otterboxfan4l said:
Man I like this forum but don't at the same time.. I love the fact there's so much stuff on here that's so helpful to everyone but at the same time the people on here are 50/50 meaning about 50% you are nice and do realize a beginner has to start somewhere and learn as they go and are willing to help as much as possible you also realize you were once there yourselfs mean while there's the other 50% forget they where beginners and noobs at one point and still think that everyone shouldn't ask questions and automatically think you know the answer as well as give rude and smart butt answers or links... uncalled for is about the best way to describe those answers its amazing that the admin allow these people to give rude and uncalled for comments but when someone responds with a rude or smart butt comment that person either gets a warning or banned and the other person gets nothing kind of interesting to me .... everyone should be treated fairly and evenly .. but had to say something from a lot of posts I've been reading
Sent From My Samsung Galaxy S3
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Ok I'm going to be the other "other" 50% whose pet peeves is when people author forum posts with little to no punctuation, commas, apostrophes, structure, periods, capitalization, etc.

LordLugard said:
Ok I'm going to be the other "other" 50% whose pet peeves is when people author forum posts with little to no punctuation, commas, apostrophes, structure, periods, capitalization, etc.
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Lol i thought that was just me

otterboxfan4l said:
as far as posting links example I was referring to about smart butt links is the google one I've notice is when you click on link takes you to google it automatically writes in the question the person would ask then at bottom it would say " now was that so hard " kinda funny but smart butt to I'm its a simple question that person could of easily just said hey man look please go read the forum rules and make sure you post in the right section simple and nicely said you know
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So it bothers you that they held your hand instead of spoon feeding you the answer? Talk about first world problems... If they were really being anal about the rules then that link would take you to www.google.com and you'd be on your own for the search terms - be grateful that they held your hand as much as they did
Ascertion said:
What's frustrating is all of these rule quoters that do nothing but add to the spam. Just answer the question then point them in the right direction or just ignore the post...
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If we just answer the question, we encourage further infractions... It would be kind of like banks taking a policy of giving money to anyone who threatens to rob the bank - we would have more robbers, not less...
Ignoring them almost inevitably leads to more noise from them, not less, so that won't fix their broken understanding of the rules...
But if we add to that spam now, there is a chance that someday, maybe it will end... It isn't likely, but I would rather have the rules on my side
I don't enable people to hide behind excuses - every search on the Internet isn't broken, they just require a little effort (almost as much effort as creating a new post, lol)
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda app-developers app

styles420 said:
So it bothers you that they held your hand instead of spoon feeding you the answer? Talk about first world problems... If they were really being anal about the rules then that link would take you to www.google.com and you'd be on your own for the search terms - be grateful that they held your hand as much as they did
If we just answer the question, we encourage further infractions... It would be kind of like banks taking a policy of giving money to anyone who threatens to rob the bank - we would have more robbers, not less...
Ignoring them almost inevitably leads to more noise from them, not less, so that won't fix their broken understanding of the rules...
But if we add to that spam now, there is a chance that someday, maybe it will end... It isn't likely, but I would rather have the rules on my side
I don't enable people to hide behind excuses - every search on the Internet isn't broken, they just require a little effort (almost as much effort as creating a new post, lol)
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda app-developers app
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How about just showing people how well searching works and provide them proof of it's efficiency by linking them to your search results. This both; enlightens the user of search functionality, while also assisting them with their question.