Hi there,
first of all, many thanks to all the talented people here, who give their time and energy to serve pda enthusiasts! I'm new to the htc smartphone world, just bought a Magician, a Prophet (G4), and a Universal to get a nice introduction into the mobile world. So far, I've read tons of materials before first deciding on changing ROM on my Magician, with success. Well, it's a risky business, and so many times you read alarming posts from people who wracked their nice working devices just by lack of knowledge. In fact, it all reminds me of walking on a ground stuffed with landmines. There are leaders who find a safe path (write an instruction), tell the others to follow, but never miss saying "remember, we don't take any responsibility".
I think the instructions are fine, but what I would really appreciate is to have some light shed on how the things work, so that I know what I'm doing, not just following the footsteps of someone who knows. I'm desparate to see some real piece of knowledge, but they are scarce. Take, e.g. a paragraph I found here (http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=FAQ#faqOsPhone) on IPL/SPL:
"IPL: Initial program load - usually paired with Secondary Program Load (SPL), is the boot loader of your phone, much like the BIOS is the boot loader for your PC. Note: IPL/SPL are highly hardware dependent, flashing the wrong IPL/SPL is much more serious than a flashing the wrong ROM. It may be noted that, sometimes a ROM package also contains the IPL/SPL which will be flashed into your phone. Hence be extra careful what you are flashing. Note: although a ROM may also contains the IPL/SPL, `ROM` usually refers just to the OS (eg. the Windows Mobile 5, not the IPL/SPL) and the ExtRom."
Well, it looks like this stuff is absolutely vital to anyone who ventures beyond entering the bootloader screen of their device, but why the fundamental questions raised there are left without answers? Some of such questions are:
1. Why do some ROMs contain IPL/SPL, if IPL/SPL are hardware dependent?
1. How do I know if a specific ROM I'd like to flash on my device contains the IPL/SPL? And then - can I flash its IPL/SPL on my original IPL/SPL?
2. What does it mean "flashing the wrong IPL/SPL"? How do I find out which ROM is suited for the IPL/SPL on my phone?
3. How do I find out the IPL/SPL for my Magician, if it's not desplayed neither on the spash screen, or in device information tab?
Please have some understanding for those newbe's questions. Maybe they are naive, but I don't want to learn the hard way... My question is: do you know any good site (or hardcopy materials) with regular knowledge to learn from about the mentioned and other important issues on pda modding/upgrading? I'll be really grateful for some guidance tips on how to guide myself
Many thanks in advance,
greg
Related
Newbie question. I don't understand, what is difference between a kitchen and tools like mamaich's ? At first I thought they were the same but now I'm not sure because I keep seeing references that don't make sense.
Post removed.
Post removed? That's it? Pardon me....Look, I know this is a newbie question but I am honestly confused as to what the definition of kitchen is. If I use mamaich's tools to prepare, view, etc. I end up with what seems, to me, to be a similar thing as a kitchen. Are they the same? Is there something about a "kitchen" that is fundamentally different than only using the tools? I have read many, many pages here and I'm honestly trying to understand. Please point me in the right direction. Thank you.
edit: sorry, I thought "post removed" in the earlier post meant I got my message removed from the forum by an admin, anyway, my question still stands.
Since the unhelpful member above failed to give you a decent answer, I will help you. Tools are either a program or a set of programs designed to do a task with the roms (for example, Mammich's tools are designed to help you edit the imgfs part of the rom). A kitchen is a set of tools (made by various people) designed to edit the whole rom or most of the rom and build your own custom roms.For future reference, if you ever have any other questions about rom building, let me know and I will help you out as much as I can.
Thank you very much Steven855 and I appreciate the offer to help.
I originally gave an inadequate answer - thus the removed post. Home ill with the flu, Nyquilled up and forgot which section I was in (thought I was in the Kaiser specific section and gave an answer associated with that). No ill intentions, so to speak.
What I will say is the various tools are something a newbie should probably feel comfortable using. Before using a kitchen, read, learn and flash a number of others' custom ROMs. While the great developers here have made cooking custom ROMs very easy with the kitchens, you can cause a lot of problems with your device if you don't know what you're doing.
No ill intentions taken. Like I said, at first I misunderstood and thought my post got nixed by an admin. btw notwithstanding Steven855's helpful answer, I had my question answered earlier on another thread when the same question came up.
Quote originally Posted by ramsses:
My understanding is the kitchen implies each module (with its associated registry - RGU - files and dlls etc.) is explicitly separated so it can be incrementally and selectively combined. What we are doing here is taking an existing set of ROMs and combining the dlls, exe etc. by hand - there isn't a handy gui where you can select which module you want. Also, the registry is necessarily hand crafted too. So by using the extract/rebuild tools, we are making a ROM, but it isn't a kitchen, more a roadside burger van!
Thanks again, really enjoying this site, and learning alot.
Steven855 said:
Since the unhelpful member above failed to give you a decent answer, I will help you. Tools are either a program or a set of programs designed to do a task with the roms (for example, Mammich's tools are designed to help you edit the imgfs part of the rom). A kitchen is a set of tools (made by various people) designed to edit the whole rom or most of the rom and build your own custom roms.For future reference, if you ever have any other questions about rom building, let me know and I will help you out as much as I can.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Steven. I was wondering if you knew about ROM cooking for Verizon CDMA devices..ie the i730? I was looking around to see where I would be able to find the bootloader for it but I haven't found any answers yet. Thanks.
Sorry! Unfortunately, I don't know anything about rom cooking for pocket pc phones (yet). I'm still trying to get the hang of this rom building stuff myself (after 2 failed attemps to make an updated rom for the axim X50(mid)).
Hi Guys,
I have an Unlocked T-Mobile G2 Touch - AKA - HERO !!!
I have installed new firmware / roms on Nokia phones numerous times but Android is new to me - however i wont go back to Nokia as the Hero is great...
CAN SOMEONE ON HERE POST AN IDIOTS GUIDE MAYBE WITH VIDEO ON HOW TO DEBRAND / INSTALL ORIGINAL HTC HERO ROM
I have tried and failed reading numerous posts and there are plenty of newcomers here that are after the same.....
Please, Please help us newbies to ANDROID out...
Thanks
Checkout this link:
http://android.modaco.com/content/h...and-your-orange-t-mo-etc-device-via-nandroid/
Explain
packetlss said:
Checkout this link:
http://android.modaco.com/content/h...and-your-orange-t-mo-etc-device-via-nandroid/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi - Thanks for that but i got lost on the keep original name etc..... - I think i must be an idiot !!! HELP - someone put a step by step guide up please...
I'd second this request.
Looking through posts on modaco and here it's not obvious what you have to do and why you are doing it.
What is nandroid and recovery image etc ?
cheers
And if it could be Mac and Windows information, not all of us are Windows based here
joemax said:
And if it could be Mac and Windows information, not all of us are Windows based here
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly!!!
A lot of us are Linux users too!!!
No offense, but please get more into adb and all the tools needed for reflashing.
Making things idiot proof is useless in my opinion. If you have no idea how to use adb, why upgrade anyway? Chances are you won't understand most custom upgrades/tweaks anyway..
All releases by HTC will be idiot proof, no doubt about it, but installing a custom rom takes skill, knowledge and patience.
In general, an idiot posseses none of the above.
Second, there are no custom roms available for the Hero.
If you want to install custom roms in the future, take some time to understand things. Spoonfeeding this info won't learn you anything.
Sykow said:
No offense, but please get more into adb and all the tools needed for reflashing.
Making things idiot proof is useless in my opinion. If you have no idea how to use adb, why upgrade anyway? Chances are you won't understand most custom upgrades/tweaks anyway..
All releases by HTC will be idiot proof, no doubt about it, but installing a custom rom takes skill, knowledge and patience.
In general, an idiot posseses none of the above.
Second, there are no custom roms available for the Hero.
If you want to install custom roms in the future, take some time to understand things. Spoonfeeding this info won't learn you anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey Sykow, I understand your point but it wasn't helpful. It's comments like these that can deter a newbie from asking questions. A person must ask questions to learn.
No doubt some of the skills needed to load custom firmware or even stock HTC firmware to de-brand your Hero are needed in order for many of us here to upgrade to the rumoured minor update and major update coming soon.
Having a handset from the telco on contract and then having to wait for weeks or even forever to get a bug fixed / performance enhanced firmware update from HTC is not something I want to have to suffer.
As soon as HTC release updated firmware, I will want to know how to load it via my Mac running OS X (preferred) or booted into my Windows partition (not preferred).
All without drama and with little risk of toasting my Hero.
Its not too much to ask surely
joemax said:
No doubt some of the skills needed to load custom firmware or even stock HTC firmware to de-brand your Hero are needed in order for many of us here to upgrade to the rumoured minor update and major update coming soon.
Having a handset from the telco on contract and then having to wait for weeks or even forever to get a bug fixed / performance enhanced firmware update from HTC is not something I want to have to suffer.
As soon as HTC release updated firmware, I will want to know how to load it via my Mac running OS X (preferred) or booted into my Windows partition (not preferred).
All without drama and with little risk of toasting my Hero.
Its not too much to ask surely
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From what I can tell, it is pretty straight forward, just like the first time you flash a phone, a bit never racking, and a bit foreign. A co-worker of mine has assured me it is as easy as a WinMo phone.
Nice to be easy as a WiMo phone... but I've had Nokia for years.
Easy to de-brand.
Use Nemesis.
Change Product Code to one like a generic EU code.
Go back to Nokia Software Update.
Download new manufacturer direct firmware... Orange as far as I know, never approved new firmware while I used an N95, N82, N85.
Android de-branding seems to involve a complex trip to a command line editor, a download of firmware that you don't really know where it came from and a large dose of prayer and crossed fingers and toes...
I guess I will wait until someone posts how to load the upcoming updated firmware from HTC so I will end up with a more reliable, stable and faster performing handset... like the one I thought I'd signed up for.
joemax said:
Nice to be easy as a WiMo phone... but I've had Nokia for years.
Easy to de-brand.
Use Nemesis.
Change Product Code to one like a generic EU code.
Go back to Nokia Software Update.
Download new manufacturer direct firmware... Orange as far as I know, never approved new firmware while I used an N95, N82, N85.
Android de-branding seems to involve a complex trip to a command line editor, a download of firmware that you don't really know where it came from and a large dose of prayer and crossed fingers and toes...
I guess I will wait until someone posts how to load the upcoming updated firmware from HTC so I will end up with a more reliable, stable and faster performing handset... like the one I thought I'd signed up for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am getting my Hero sometime mid-september... I will post up a walk through when I get some personal experience.
Sweet
That sounds like a plan...
Sykow said:
No offense, but please get more into adb and all the tools needed for reflashing.
Making things idiot proof is useless in my opinion. If you have no idea how to use adb, why upgrade anyway? Chances are you won't understand most custom upgrades/tweaks anyway..
All releases by HTC will be idiot proof, no doubt about it, but installing a custom rom takes skill, knowledge and patience.
In general, an idiot posseses none of the above.
Second, there are no custom roms available for the Hero.
If you want to install custom roms in the future, take some time to understand things. Spoonfeeding this info won't learn you anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A touch patronising.
I Flash Roms all the time on my Blackstone, and manage to use the custom upgrades/tweeks....
Android is a new OS, and has a new set of terms and abreviations etc, As the OP says, there seems to be little out there to explain things
When there are pages and pages of wikis for the Hero/Android then yes, I can understand being frustrated about noobie questions, but until there IS threads/stickies/Wikis out there then I'm afraid there will be questions put forward like this.
Correct. But those things need time. How long has the Hero been out now? Couple of weeks? C'mon..
And a person doesn't learn by asking questions. At least, not here. There are TONS of threads around. All the things you need are in there. It's just a matter of looking, taking the time to actually learn and read. If you still don't get it after the proper research, ask questions. Give the exact problem so we can tailor the reponse to it.
I flashed my old Wizard so many times.. Then I got on to the iPhone 2G, making it work in The Netherlands. I took the time to read all the reports, stickies and the necessary info to make it work. With some motivation and some common sense every person can do this.
I'm completely new to Android and I managed to root, update and tweak my Hero within 1 hour.
I just have a problem with these guys coming here, "demanding" a guide for idiots, making no effort at all to understand the complexity of it all.
This device hasn't even been out for a month! Chill out! When the stuff is ready, it will come.
Hmmmmm
Sykow said:
Correct. But those things need time. How long has the Hero been out now? Couple of weeks? C'mon..
And a person doesn't learn by asking questions. At least, not here. There are TONS of threads around. All the things you need are in there. It's just a matter of looking, taking the time to actually learn and read. If you still don't get it after the proper research, ask questions. Give the exact problem so we can tailor the reponse to it.
I flashed my old Wizard so many times.. Then I got on to the iPhone 2G, making it work in The Netherlands. I took the time to read all the reports, stickies and the necessary info to make it work. With some motivation and some common sense every person can do this.
I'm completely new to Android and I managed to root, update and tweak my Hero within 1 hour.
I just have a problem with these guys coming here, "demanding" a guide for idiots, making no effort at all to understand the complexity of it all.
This device hasn't even been out for a month! Chill out! When the stuff is ready, it will come.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sykow - thanks for your comments, please dont call us "demanding idiots !" Like you I and many others are new to Android and yes its a huge learning curve, I have rooted my HERO and Tweaked it but merely wanted advice on some of the explanation given as i did not think it was that clear !!!
I have programmed, tweaked and installed numerous roms on blackberry and nokia previously and wanted advice on Android - you were not born with the knowledge you had to learn it....
Anyway after a polite request at least someone was polite enough to assist and it is sorted - bring on the cooked roms.
I have to agree with Sykow here to a degree. Rooting, flashing and backing up isn't for the weak of heart, and one wrong move could mean that the same newbie comes back to this forum crying about a bricked phone and bad instructions, and that would just distract people from the real point of this sub-forum, i.e. actual ROM hacking, stuff like what Haykuro is doing in the background.
Here's a starting point that worked for me:
Rooting the Hero: http://theunlockr.com/2009/08/08/how-to-gain-root-access-on-your-htc-hero/
After that, if you're looking at replacing built-in apps and cooking your own ROMs, you're better off looking in the Dream Android Development sub-forum where it all started. If you're having problems looking for technical pointers in those sub-forums and instead finding that most questions are about how-do-i root/flash/etc, you'll start to understand where Sykow is coming from
Me, I don't think you're an idiot. I just think it'd help to spend your time with the Android SDK as well as searching the other Android Dev sub-forums in XDA for what you're looking for. If you're confident enough after that to come up with a How-To of your own for the benefit of newbies, feel free to go ahead, but from what I have seen from time to time, it can be a thankless job when newbies fail to follow the instructions to a T, brick their devices then come back crying or *****ing, and expect someone to fix it for them.
I found the HTC Dream wiki section on rooting/hacking etc quite informative:
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=HTC_Dream_overview_and_useful_information
I managed to work out how to make a backup last night, using files from Paulatmodoco's rooting guide:
http://android.modaco.com/content/htc-hero-hero-modaco-com/291397/12-08-1-4-modaco-hero-patch-a2sd-root-busybox-much-more/
Simply follow his instructions up to stage 5. Then you will be in the recovery image menu and you can select to make a nandroid backup.
If I have some time later, I'll write up a dummys guide to making a nandroid backup, which is one of the most important steps I reckon And rooting using paul's system is then very, very easy. as is flashing a new ROM.
I must also agree with Sykow. I only recently got my Hero and had no knowledge of rooting. I'm sure a step by step guide would be lovely but actually it is possible and it pays to read up about it yourself.
I knew the Android SDK was needed, so I downloaded and installed that as per Android website, read about what adb and fastboot did. The files and commands were easy to source from here. About and hours reading and a complete Android noob was rooted and away. I do feel that some folk maybe can't be bothered with the reading part, but think - if something goes wrong in the process, you aren't going to know why or how to fix it.
My sentiments exactly.
Can I use a ROM from one model phone to another. Ex. can I use the ROM from a Blackstone and use it on a Fuze? I know I can use the blackstone radio but how about the ROM?
thanks
fuzeman219 said:
Can I use a ROM from one model phone to another. Ex. can I use the ROM from a Blackstone and use it on a Fuze? I know I can use the blackstone radio but how about the ROM?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
NO!
You can't use another device ROM or RADIO.
thank you sir, but you say you cant use the radio either? in other forums people are using different radios, ex. blackstone radio on a raphael, (fuze)
Yes you can use radios in 2 cases:
1) the radios are compatible. If you're not sure, don't flash it.
2) the phone is security unlocked.
Also, to use a ROM from another device it must be dumped and then ported in a Kitchen, you can't just flash it. The Kernel's and drivers just won't work.
Dave
Well, a teacher I had, always told "you can, but you must not". You can jump down from the roof of a highscraper, but you should not have to do it...
So, you MUST NOT flash a ROM of a device into another different one. Yes, you have tools to do it, but you'll probably get an electronic brick to put in any hole of a brick wall.
There's a part of the ROM which is specific for the device. Another part is specific for the OS. So, some parts of a ROM are related to WM6.1 or WM6.5, etc. and some others are related to a device. That's what is called the Kernel, mainly related to a nk.exe file inside the ROM files. In example, we can run WM6.5 into a Kaiser with a nk.exe belonging to a kaiser and WM6.1... BUT for running same OS of a different device, (i.e. Opal's WM6.1 into Kaiser) you'll completely inutilize (maybe forever) the device. Yes, you can do it if sou have enough money to buy another device, but if you don't want it, I suggest you to send me your device or give it for charity, but not to destroy it.
Another thing you can do is, as you were told, "dumping" the ROM, this is extracting all the files and structure, and then port it (this is, adapting it) to your device's needs - this means, getting your specific drivers and kernel files and substituting them into the folders you obtained of the ROM. (Also, getting the correct screen resolution files). In example, nk.exe and other files will be different for a Kaiser and for a Herald. And you should have different Camera files, as the drivers are different for one device and the other one. Also, a Touch HD uses different screen resolution that a Herald... so you must find the correct files for every device.
This looong post is to tell you that using ROMs from other phones is RISKY and also it GETS LOTS OF JOB (and TIME), and you'll always miss something. Only good, big teams, like to do it, not an only person. And they spend days, weeks, and must correct bugs and make trials and risk their devices even if they have lots of experience.
thanks
thanks folks, makes complete sense..
this leads to another question, how do you know if the radio is compatible with another device, ex. the blackstone radio with a raphael? I know the simple answer is to read the forums, which I have, but besides taking someones word for it, how do you know?
fuzeman219 said:
thanks folks, makes complete sense..
this leads to another question, how do you know if the radio is compatible with another device, ex. the blackstone radio with a raphael? I know the simple answer is to read the forums, which I have, but besides taking someones word for it, how do you know?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have to know about the chips in the phone and what's in the radio firmwhere, I leave it upto the experts .
Just take peoples word for it, if in doubt, don't use it.
Dave
I have a T-Mobile HTC Touch Pro 2. I would like to upgrade this phone to use one of the good operating systems from on these forums and would like to add Android to my phone. However, I have no idea what to do or where to get the correct files that are working.
If someone could help me with what I must do to achieve what I am trying to get done I would appreciate it. I need both instructions and files.
Scott Gleaton
For windows http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=550540
For Android
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=627997
And my other advice is to read everything you can
Links in the post above tell you most of what you need to know.
You will need to HardSPL before you can flash a new ROM. This is mentioned and linked in the "Flashing for Noobs" thread linked above. But here it is also: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=550131
I also recommend running Task29 after you HardSPL and before flashing any ROMs: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=649191
Not fully mandatory, but Task29 formats the phones whole memory, so there is no chance of fragments of the old ROM to mess up the new one.
What ROM is best depend on the individual user. Each cook includes different apps, looks and functionality in their ROMs. So look thru the different ROMs, and pick on that suits you. If you are still at a loss, I personally like the Energy ROM. This guys is very reputable for stable, fast, and aesthetic ROMs. I doubt you would be disappointed.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=490
Just read all the instructions carefully before you flash, plus the FAQs on each page, and (at least) the last couple pages of the threads. This will often clue you in to the common issues some people have, and how to solve them.
Project Android for the TP2 is not a full ROM, but is nice because you install on your MicroSD card and boot it from Windows Mobile. WM gets unloaded, and Android is loaded. To get back to WM, you just soft reset. Its not perfect, there are still plenty of bugs (no sound, no Bluetooth, some apps crash or lag). But its pretty functional, and lets you mess around and explore Android, check out the app store and play some of the games, etc. Highly recommended to try it out, if you are curious about Android (and who isn't?).
I want to be clear, I used the search feature before posting here. I was able to find vaguely related threads, but there was a similar issue with each. They all were made on the assumption that the reader has a basic understanding of the terminology and the purpose of each of those things. While I've jailbroken iPhones in the past, I find that there is a world of difference between doing that and doing anything on the droid. While there is usually only one model of iPhone to worry about, there are several different versions of each model of phone released that runs the Android OS. This, coupled with all of the different things you can do discourages me from reading the mode advanced threads and blindly following the instructions. I want to understand the basics so that I can understand why I'm flashing a rom, why I'm rooting, what a flash counter is, etc.
If anybody remembers coming across a good thread or website that gives a good intro to Android (modification, upgrading, etc), then please let me know where I can find it! I would be grateful even if the information spans across 5 different sources, as long as it is a good introduction. I'm mainly interested in:
Stock Roms
Rooting
Recovery
Odex vs. deodex
Flash Counter
Flashing Rom
Thanks in advance guys!