I have been doing some experiments with fast charger from Google and a regular 5W charger. My observation is that whenever I use the slow charging, my phone lasts about 7-8 hours of SOT. Whenever I use fast charger, I get around 5-6 hours SOT. This is with exact same set of apps and same kind of daily usage. I have done this experiment over 3 month period and the behaviour is super-consistent.
I did several combinations like did 2 contiguous slow charging sessions, 2 contiguous fast charging ones to make sure that it wasn't just residual of some sort from previous run and stats somehow always giving advantage to slow charging.
I have a theory to explain this experimental data. I think fast charging is inefficient in storing the same amount of actual energy in battery cells as would have happened if you charged slow because of the extra heat it generates. And numbers are just shown by software based on what software thinks it transferred. Its all just software: a component in the phone's firmware and a component in battery's firmware agreeing on amount of energy transferred.
Has there been any scientific study done in this regard to see if same 2 batteries are charged differently to the same %age, how differently or similarly do they discharge?
devsk said:
I have been doing some experiments with fast charger from Google and a regular 5W charger. My observation is that whenever I use the slow charging, my phone lasts about 7-8 hours of SOT. Whenever I use fast charger, I get around 5-6 hours SOT. This is with exact same set of apps and same kind of daily usage. I have done this experiment over 3 month period and the behaviour is super-consistent.
I did several combinations like did 2 contiguous slow charging sessions, 2 contiguous fast charging ones to make sure that it wasn't just residual of some sort from previous run and stats somehow always giving advantage to slow charging.
I have a theory to explain this experimental data. I think fast charging is inefficient in storing the same amount of actual energy in battery cells as would have happened if you charged slow because of the extra heat it generates. And numbers are just shown by software based on what software thinks it transferred. Its all just software: a component in the phone's firmware and a component in battery's firmware agreeing on amount of energy transferred.
Has there been any scientific study done in this regard to see if same 2 batteries are charged differently to the same %age, how differently or similarly do they discharge?
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Your spot on dude, fast charging is a battery killer, although, the 18 watt charger is borderline, i think google did a good job there, dont ever use the 30watt charger on any phone or tablet no matter what its says or comes with, after a year of 30 watt charging everyday the battery will be screwed big time, now this is where the manufacturers get you, you cant change the battery so you have to opt in for a new device. There thinking is, you always have a new phone at start of a new contract so balls to the battery, give super turbo charging as a ground breaking new way of charging quicker, customers wont know whats happening.
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Hey guys. Within a minute or so after my phones removed from the charger it drops to 95%.is this normal?im using the 1.8a LG charger that comes with the phone F240L.i read somewhere that they are using the LG charger 1.2a out of the box.does this phone have two different out of the box charger..thanks..
Completly normal. The method that seems to be employed for the battery percentage is read the voltage itself and make a guess
This high voltage drops down quite quickly both as a "load" is applied to the battery,. Plus there is not a lot of change in capacity from the very high voltages to the more normal voltages, in any li-ion battery. So while the voltage can be used to guestimate a range of charge levels, between like 4.0 and 4.3 there isnt much changed in the battery itself.
Further from what i have seen so far (not totally sure) they are charging to 4.35v which is a rescent slight change in the chemistry of the li-ion to allow for higher charge levels without it gassing or reducing the life (Havent tested that theory long enough yet either).
Also All li-ion alogrythms for charging do a CC CV charge, where the final charge is just "holding" the voltage at the high, till the batterys charge state floats up to that level. This can (not facted out yet) mean that leaving it on the charge past the time it claims it is fully charged , it will put tiny bits more into it. This happens more with my big fat zerolemon battery because it seems to have more resistance to the other connected cell items than would be desired.
Anyways all is well, just dont believe anything a computer tells you , and it will be fine The other methods have thier own deficiencies.
Other STUFF:
Li-Ion batteries really do not prefer to be left at their high charge voltages, as they degrade faster there. so when you read the above, or try "bump" charging methods (thats just restarting the charge) It is not good for it. The battery will be happier, using it like it was designed, taking it off the charge when it states it is full. all of this being more info than anyone needs to know, or freaking care about.
As a li-ion battery becomes old and weak, it will exhibit even more of these charateristics that have people wondering. It will drop off the highs quicker still, have less total capacity, and increse a tiny bit in resistance , which will cause it to drop even more under load. At some point the battery would be so bad at that, you would want to replace it.
Heat, the li-ion cells dont like these extreeme heats. they prefer to work more at normal room temps and cold but not extreeme cold. So take that in also as a factor in keeping your battery more happy, again if you want to waste half your life pampering the thing
runwithme21 said:
Hey guys. Within a minute or so after my phones removed from the charger it drops to 95%.is this normal?im using the 1.8a LG charger that comes with the phone F240L.i read somewhere that they are using the LG charger 1.2a out of the box.does this phone have two different out of the box charger..thanks..
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It's the calibration. Happens to me too sometime. Drops rather fast to 95%, then goes stable around 89%. Just leave it on charge for an extra 45 minutes or so, then let the battery die down to at-least 10% before charging again. Not exact science, it's just what I do.
I tether with my phone all day and I have to keep it connected because it drains the battery quick. Will it have any negative effects on the battery if I leave it connected even if its at 100%?
whytechapel_x said:
I tether with my phone all day and I have to keep it connected because it drains the battery quick. Will it have any negative effects on the battery if I leave it connected even if its at 100%?
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I do the same and haven't had any ill effects, phone stays on charge at work all day
I believe the charger (and most, if not all, smartphone chargers) intentionally cuts out when the battery is saturated to prevent overcharging. Then top off again once the battery level drops a bit. In fact, on some devices (when attached to charger and fully charged) you will actually see the battery level occasionally drop to 99 or 98% then back up to 100% again. Although I haven't noticed this on the M8 yet.
You can get into a discussion of mini-cycles and other ill effects from keeping the device plugged in all the time. But just anecdotally I do this all the time (just leave the phone on charger overnight most nights) and haven't noticed much (if any) ill effect on battery life after owning 5 HTC devices, plus 2 Samsung tablets; most of which were used 1- 2 years each with very little if any decline in battery life over the time they were used.
Actually leaving the battery at full capacity all the time (if I understood your post) is bad for the long term health of the battery.
You need to find an app that cuts your charger off at 70-80%. Most modern laptops have this functionality built in for people that leave it plugged in all the time.
Heisenberg420 said:
Actually leaving the battery at full capacity all the time (if I understood your post) is bad for the long term health of the battery.
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Technically, I would agree. And "best practice" is to cycle often and avoid leaving the phone on the charger when fully charged. But often folks (myself included) will not always follow what is best, and its not always feasible. As I've mentioned, after owning a decent number of smartphone and tablet devices and using then for 1-2 years, I haven't noticed much or any decline in battery life for the time I was using them (despite often charging them overnight). I have no doubt there might be some slight decrease, and especially of one intends to use the device for more than 2 years. But I personally never do (too much of a gear junkie) and also don't sell/trade my old phones.
Your point is a fair one, as it best the OP to know all the facts, risks, etc. and make his own conclusion. The following link has some interesting technical discussion on charging Li ion: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries
I bought an ampere-meter that measures current from the charge to the device and I have awesome news.
Li poly batteries have a very strict charging procedure (voltage and current should change during the charge). The original HTC charge charges flawlessly.
Once the battery tops up to 100% current drops dramatically.
If I do some power demanding task, the current goes up again. This means that all power consumption is taken from the charger, leaving the battery in 100% all the time, without jittering between 99-100%
NOTE:
Yet. The designers of the Li Poly define it as an electrical spring. This means there is no deterioration in the battery life AS LONG AS YOU DON'T CHARGE THE BATTERY OVER 4 volts.
100% is 4.2 volts, meaning you'd stop charging at 85% to prolong battery life.
Is seems logical on the surface. Will fast charging mean discharge will also be faster?
Did you ever use a 'non quick'/ normal charge adapter? Did you find that the battery charge lasted longer?
At night I use a normal charger. The fast charger I use only when the battery is low and I'm in a hurry.
I did not notice any difference in discharge time.
The phone discharges fast when using it heavily (gps, games and browsing with FF), but still gets me through the day. With light usage (messaging, calls, email, little browsing) I have like 50% battery left after 12 hours.
Sent from my ASUS_Z00AD using Tapatalk
i don't think that is the case. discharging based on battery, charging based on charger circuitry. of course both contact must withstand the high current pass through before breakdown. ( if you want to know more, read up on current and its effect on materials, size, width)
Someone did a charge log before on ze551ml on the full charge and each software module, hardware drain comparison, he found out that even though written 100% on the phone, the actual charge did not hit 3k Mah. seem like our lipo battery is not really 3k worth therefore you see a fast draining effect from 100% down to somewhere 80~90ish?
this is true on my side, i know some apps is not coded for optimization and efficiency, for this can be felt by handset being warm because heat is a form of wastage (losses) in engineering term. however some apps that does run optimised also exhibit fast draining effect.
more testing need to conduct in order to conclude that guy's theory.
Atleast I experienced faster discharging in case of fast charging as compared to normal charging.
I have not experienced fast discharging while using the BoostMaster Quick Charger. What you should take a look at are your battery stats, Screen on Time, usage scenarios and signal. Check wakelocks too as that can damper your battery life throughout the day.
After using Turbocharging in Moto X Style i can confirm that fast charging will result in faster discharging, also the battery heats up while turbocharging, and i noticed 20% less standby time (at least 20%) when i use turbocharger. If i am not in a hurry i always use overnight charger.
Curious to know if somebody could share me regarding slow charging after 90%. Actually OP3 dash charging is damn awesome but after 90% or specially after 95% charging becomes too slow. Between I m in 3.5.5 community build. Any explanation or solution would be great.
not just oneplus but pretty much every manufacturer does this possibly to avoid battery damage. You are not supposed to charge batteries over 80% and below 40-50%, it gives your battery the longest life cycle however its something extremely hard to manage.
normal behaviour while charging.
charging above 80% is not really damaging the battery but its wearing them down little faster as it would when the level is kept between 20 to 80% (just what i heard from others)
i usually charge mine to ~ 90ish and unplug the phone
on average i get through a day with less than 60%
It's completely normal (and desired, like already pointed out). First few and last few percent are slower than mid-levels.
It still only takes a bit over an hour to charge from 0 to 100. And it's still the fastest charging device on market.
I'd say that's damn good enough ?
Sent from my OnePlus 3 using Tapatalk
If you want more detail and explanation (and confirmation of the posts to date) see http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries
panopticum said:
normal behaviour while charging.
charging above 80% is not really damaging the battery but its wearing them down little faster as it would when the level is kept between 20 to 80% (just what i heard from others)
i usually charge mine to ~ 90ish and unplug the phone
on average i get through a day with less than 60%
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This is optimal for battery life, due to how lithium batteries work.
I just bought a lenovo p2 after hearing some impressive review pf its battery.But my phone discharged 25% in 4 hours.My 3g connection was on,I played coc,played some music.Is it a battery problem or is it normal?
Your battery will take several cycles to achieve full capacity... let it run down, then slow charge it (NOT with the fast charger supplied) and see how it goes... you should see 2 days of use, although videos and music etc will negate that.
Rooster#1 said:
Your battery will take several cycles to achieve full capacity... let it run down, then slow charge it (NOT with the fast charger supplied) and see how it goes... you should see 2 days of use, although videos and music etc will negate that.
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The only thing I disagree​ is to use a different charger. The supplied charger will automatically switch b/w QC and normal charging (it's not entirely related to the charger either, with processor having some role in it)
Quick charging creates heat in the cells... the worst thing you can do to a battery ! Far better to slow charge, which is more likely to achieve maximum capacity.
Once the battery is "conditioned" then yes - use the fast charger, but the same laws of physics apply... the battery life will be reduced overall, but its a trade off against convenience, and how long you personally plan to keep the phone.
-If you lost 75% of charge in 4 hours that is too much... probably because there was a bad first estimation of the level of charge?
-If you lost 25% battery in 4 hours of intensive use (so you still have 75%) that sounds ok to me.
Also I dont use the fast charger, because battery gets a bit warm if you use it, although that is normal, excesive heat could deteriorate the battery in the long run.
Guys i think the problem is solved.The first 50% charge drains in say 6 hour but the rest 50% lasts like9-10 hours.