So, I have installed ExtremeKernel3 on my phone, together with EliteGamer 2.0.
And to the question. Apparently the ExtremeKernel overclocks the processor. But how do I know if my phone is overclocked or not? Is the overclocking made automatically, when I install the kernel? Or do I have to do anything else to overclock it? I just don´t know how it works.
U can use "no frills CPU" to overclock ur cpu
Sent from my R800i using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
silmes said:
So, I have installed ExtremeKernel3 on my phone, together with EliteGamer 2.0.
And to the question. Apparently the ExtremeKernel overclocks the processor. But how do I know if my phone is overclocked or not? Is the overclocking made automatically, when I install the kernel? Or do I have to do anything else to overclock it? I just don´t know how it works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Overclocking means that you can set phone's clock speed more then manufacturer default speed. For Xperia Play deafult clock is 1GHz.
Term "overclocking enabled kernel" means that value of clock speed is higher then in deafult (stock) kernel.
To be able to have use of that higher speed, you need an app that take take of clock speed. For example No-frills CPU Control There you set speed of your clock.
What value of clock you can set is determined in kernel. for example, in stock kernel you can set 1GHz and below, in DoomLord kernel you can set up to 2GHz and in Lupus kernel you can set up to 1.6GHz. Remember that doesn't mean your phone can work at that high speed - it is invidually on each phone how much overclocking each phone can take before it just don't work anymore (for example, my phone can't get past 1.8GHz, it can work on 1.7GHz only when on charger, but it is stable on battery on 1.6GHz)
The reason devs make overclocking kernel is to give an option how much max clock speed you can set. But that doesn't mean you should do this by any means, because, even it can work on higher clock, it can be bad for cpu if you do it on long period of time.
With higher clock, phone drain more current from battery, wich means overheating can lead to degrading battery life, shortening cpu and/or electronics lifespan in general
But, with overclocking you could shorten electronic lifespan from 10 years to 4 years, and nowdays hardware became obsolete in only few years, and that's why lot of people don't care about danger that overclocking bring.
If previous text was TL;DR, here is short version:
Kernel gives you option what is MAX speed you can set, with an app you choose what clock speed you want to use
Bakisha said:
Overclocking means that you can set phone's clock speed more then manufacturer default speed. For Xperia Play deafult clock is 1GHz.
Term "overclocking enabled kernel" means that value of clock speed is higher then in deafult (stock) kernel.
To be able to have use of that higher speed, you need an app that take take of clock speed. For example No-frills CPU Control There you set speed of your clock.
What value of clock you can set is determined in kernel. for example, in stock kernel you can set 1GHz and below, in DoomLord kernel you can set up to 2GHz and in Lupus kernel you can set up to 1.6GHz. Remember that doesn't mean your phone can work at that high speed - it is invidually on each phone how much overclocking each phone can take before it just don't work anymore (for example, my phone can't get past 1.8GHz, it can work on 1.7GHz only when on charger, but it is stable on battery on 1.6GHz)
The reason devs make overclocking kernel is to give an option how much max clock speed you can set. But that doesn't mean you should do this by any means, because, even it can work on higher clock, it can be bad for cpu if you do it on long period of time.
With higher clock, phone drain more current from battery, wich means overheating can lead to degrading battery life, shortening cpu and/or electronics lifespan in general
But, with overclocking you could shorten electronic lifespan from 10 years to 4 years, and nowdays hardware became obsolete in only few years, and that's why lot of people don't care about danger that overclocking bring.
If previous text was TLDR, here is short version:
Kernel gives you option what is MAX speed you can set, with an app you choose what clock speed you want to use
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you very much for an informative answer!
Related
what does all these stand for, and what do they actually do?
OCUV (is this faster with less battery consumption???)
OC
UV
HAVS
r3.1 (or other numbers)
De-odexed
odexed
kernel
what I'v read is that you can have kernel, rom and radio separatly installed and they work together. correct?
ocuv = overclocked/undervolted, means the kernel can be overclocked or undervolted, overclocked means you run the cpu at alot higher clock speed than normal, meaning better performance, undervolted means you run the cpu clock speed at alot less than normal, giving you better battery performance.
oc - overclocked
uv - undervolted
havs - never heard of this
r3.1 - sounds like the rom version a dev has given his rom lol
deodexed - The Java virtual machine in Android is a Dalvik Virtual Machine, designed to operate on processor-constrained and memory-constrained devices like smart phones. The files that a Dalvik Virtual machine consumes are DEX files - which are Java files rendered by a utility called dx. After the files are rendered by DX they are loaded into a virtual machine and the classes in them are optimized by a utility called dexopt. This results in an "optimized DEX" - an ODEX. To hack such code, the files must be "DE-ODEX'ed," if you will, which is accomplished with a utility called deodexerent.
odexed - Odex stands for Optimized DEX. This is just the machine compiled version of the classes.dex file. To get from the odex version to classes.dex the term deodex is used. consider odexed roms as compressed roms that give you alot more space but cannot be themed
kernal - the kernel is the core set of files that run an os, it is responsible for handling data processing at a hardware level it also controls system resorces like battery ect
I believe when people say MCR r3.1, they refer to Modaco Custom Rom version 3.1.
havs stands for 'hybrid adaptive voltage scaling'
The purpose of HAVS is to minimize the power used by the CPU by determining and setting the optimal voltage. At the same time, the maximum voltage by which HAVS can scale to is fixed to a specified voltage depending on the CPU frequency in order to prevent scaling to a higher voltage than what is normally used at a specified voltage. The optimal voltage is actively determined for each frequency and temperature. HAVS actively adjusts the CPU voltage as the CPU frequency and temperature changes.
rr3636 said:
what I'v read is that you can have kernel, rom and radio separatly installed and they work together. correct?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need all of them to operate your phone.
The radio is the basic piece of software on your phone, it comes pre installed but you can update it to a newer version. You don't have to do this all the time as it stays untouched.
With every ROM comes a kernel, but some ROMS offer you different kernel updates that you can apply AFTER you installed the Full ROM.
x01a4 said:
havs stands for 'hybrid adaptive voltage scaling'
The purpose of HAVS is to minimize the power used by the CPU by determining and setting the optimal voltage. At the same time, the maximum voltage by which HAVS can scale to is fixed to a specified voltage depending on the CPU frequency in order to prevent scaling to a higher voltage than what is normally used at a specified voltage. The optimal voltage is actively determined for each frequency and temperature. HAVS actively adjusts the CPU voltage as the CPU frequency and temperature changes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you learn somthing new every day on here
AndroHero said:
undervolted means you run the cpu clock speed at alot less than normal, giving you better battery performance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, undervolting means running your CPU at a lower maximum VOLTAGE.
It DOES give you a better battery performance, but some CPUs (not every CPU is produced equally) doesn't like being overclocked/undervolted resulting in an unstable or odd behaviour. You have to test yourself what your CPU can handle
x01a4 said:
No, undervolting means running your CPU at a lower maximum VOLTAGE.
It DOES give you a better battery performance, but some CPUs (not every CPU is produced equally) doesn't like being overclocked/undervolted resulting in an unstable or odd behaviour. You have to test yourself what your CPU can handle
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
x01a4 said:
The purpose of HAVS is to minimize the power used by the CPU by determining and setting the optimal voltage. [...] The optimal voltage is actively determined for each frequency and temperature.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The first poster suggests that manual uv tuning is required while the second poster seems to suggest that the uv values are determined by the phone.
If manual, how to you tune it? Increase voltage after each crash/hang?
If auto, how does the phone know when it's pushing the envelope? Considering that the poster claims that it's temp and speed adaptive, that's quite an impressive feat. It's exactly what I'd want to have though.
the kernel's governor decides what CPU frequency the CPU needs to run at under its current load.
On SVS Kernels, this frequency is a SET voltage. On HAVS Kernels, the frequency is a RANGE of voltages which the kernel decides on.
Some kernels do allow you to set those voltages or voltage ranges, see manU kernels for example.
If you follow the red link in my signature, there is a kernel info thread which may help understand a bit better.
Hello there,
I've been flashing kernels since I was in LeeDroid Froyo and got no problems. However since I switched to GB based roms such as RCMix3D and TB Fusion, my phone always freezes when I try setting Kernel-Lee-V3.1.1-2.6.35.13-CALLREC or MDJs v19 to maximum overclock so I have no choice to but to stay on stock kernel. I have no ext3/ext4 partition on my SD card in case you ask.
Current ROM: TB Fusion 1.1.2
Radio: 12.54.60.25U_26.09.04.11_M2
Any idea what should I do to solve this issue?
golokipok said:
Hello there,
I've been flashing kernels since I was in LeeDroid Froyo and got no problems. However since I switched to GB based roms such as RCMix3D and TB Fusion, my phone always freezes when I try setting Kernel-Lee-V3.1.1-2.6.35.13-CALLREC or MDJs v19 to maximum overclock
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
uoooo this is sooo dangerous for your handset... u can "smoke" it...
Any idea what should I do to solve this issue?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, your handset freezes because the overclock that u do its too high... underclock it at 1200-1400mhz & try...
and configure SET CPU features... like the standby status, etc....but do it with common sense....
think about that DHD proccessor goes by default at 1gz, really when we overclock the processor we are putting in danger the security of our device
SERGI.3210 said:
uoooo this is sooo dangerous for your handset... u can "smoke" it...
yes, your handset freezes because the overclock that u do its too high... underclock it at 1200-1400mhz & try...
and configure SET CPU features... like the standby status, etc....but do it with common sense....
think about that DHD proccessor goes by default at 1gz, really when we overclock the processor we are putting in danger the security of our device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha! I know that overclocking is quite dangerous. Back on the froyo days, my phone is quite stable around 1.8ghz so I'm just wondering why is this happening (maybe my phone's processor is starting to fry up? ). Is there any effect if I'm using smartass profile on those kernels I've mentioned?
golokipok said:
Haha! I know that overclocking is quite dangerous. Back on the froyo days, my phone is quite stable around 1.8ghz so I'm just wondering why is this happening (maybe my phone's processor is starting to fry up? ).
i hope that the processor works or not works (don´t crashes a little bit...)
but the reason of your freezes maybe (almost sure) because froyo & gingerbread don´t works at the same form, and gingerbread need more resources & stability for to work correct... don´t forget that the kernel manages the hardware...
if u force it......... u know what can happen...
golokipok said:
there any effect if I'm using smartass profile on those kernels I've mentioned?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it´s possible, take this explanation, read and judge by yourself what´s the better cpu governor...
smartass (Best explanation i've found paraphrases to: based on interactive, but better.)
----
ondemand
Available in most kernels, and the default governor in most kernels. When the CPU load reaches a certain point (see "up threshold" in Advanced Settings), ondemand will rapidly scale the CPU up to meet demand, then gradually scale the CPU down when it isn't needed. - SetCPU website
conservative
Available in some kernels. It is similar to the ondemand governor, but will scale the CPU up more gradually to better fit demand. Conservative provides a less responsive experience than ondemand, but can save battery. - SetCPU website
performance
Available in most kernels. It will keep the CPU running at the "max" set value at all times. This is a bit more efficient than simply setting "max" and "min" to the same value and using ondemand because the system will not waste resources scanning for the CPU load. This governor is recommended for stable benchmarking. - SetCPU website
powersave
Available in some kernels. It will keep the CPU running at the "min" set value at all times. - SetCPU website
userspace
A method for controlling the CPU speed that isn't currently used by SetCPU. For best results, do not use the userspace governor. - SetCPU website
Interactive
The 'interactive' governor has a different approach. Instead of sampling the cpu
at a specified rate, the governor will scale the cpu frequency up when coming
out of idle. When the cpu comes out of idle, a timer is configured to fire
within 1-2 ticks. If the cpu is 100% busy from exiting idle to when the timer
fires then we assume the cpu is underpowered and ramp to MAX speed.
If the cpu was not 100% busy, then the governor evaluates the cpu load over the
last 'min_sample_rate' (default 50000 uS) to determine the cpu speed to ramp down
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the info
SERGI.3210 said:
because froyo & gingerbread don´t works at the same form, and gingerbread need more resources & stability for to work correct... don´t forget that the kernel manages the hardware...
if u force it......... u know what can happen...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have mentioned about those "resources", is there any special measure that I need to do or what? I'm using the smartass profile on those kernels but still *sigh*
Anyway, I've observed on your sig that yours is overclocked @ 1.8ghz even though you're running GB, me envy
golokipok said:
have mentioned about those "resources", is there any special measure that I need to do or what? I'm using the smartass profile on those kernels but still *sigh*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you only should do a good over/underclock & set the correct cpu governor for your daily use....
well, you know ho is @MDeeJaay? the developer of MDJ kernels and roms...
he explained smartass with this words:
SMARTASS GOVERNOR - is based on the concept of the interactive governor.
I have always agreed that in theory the way interactive works - by taking over the idle loop - is very attractive. I have never managed to tweak it so it would behave decently in real life. Smartass is a complete rewrite of the code plus more. I think its a success. Performance is on par with the "old" minmax and I think smartass is a bit more responsive. Battery life is hard to quantify precisely but it does spend much more time at the lower frequencies.
Smartass will also cap the max frequency when sleeping to 245Mhz (or if your min frequency is higher than 245 - why?! - it will cap it to your min frequency). Lets take for example the 998/245 kernel, it will sleep at 245.
golokipok said:
, I've observed on your sig that yours is overclocked @ 1.8ghz even though you're running GB, me envy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no, no buddy... i only show the max speed nothing more... i set my cpu concretly like this;
CPU GOVERNOR:interactive
MAX SPEED:1113 MHZ
MIN SPEED:245 MHZ
PROFILE: screen off; 245 MHZ max.
245 MHZ min.
in adition i´m going to modify my syg LOL
haha..thanks again. I'm gonna try playing with the frequencies to see which will suit me
i hope someone can make a stable 1.8ghz kernel without the freeze
IT´S POSSIBLE but i don´t want to try it LOL
i love a lot my DHD
What are the safe/stable clockspeeds for underclocking and overclocking my Desire Z? Also, what app do I use? Like, I don't mind paying for the app (as long as it's not too expensive)
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
SetCPU can be used to overclock if you're rooted. Depending on the ROM and Kernel combination, overclocking to about 1.3ghz is usually safe. Some go up to 1.5ghz or even 1.8ghz, but are often quite unstable depending on other configurations you have in your ROM.
As far as underclocking goes, some custom kernels clock all the way down to 122mhz, I've been using a streamline5 kernel on CM7 (which offers 122mhz min) and haven't had any ill effects with this.
I have the Virtuous Sense ROM (with it's default kernel, although it does have other kernels which can give other cpu speeds), right now but might try out another ROM soon (maybe) do you know what's the min and safe max for this ROM?
Also, can I just set a particular clock speed (e.g. 500MHz) and it should be ok or is there any stability difference between say 500MHz and 505MHz? Just curious. I looked at SetCPU and it looks like a good one. Also, if the clock speed I set makes things go wrong, can I revert it or can I get stuck with it and need to do a wipe?
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
zaghy2zy said:
I have the Virtuous Sense ROM (with it's default kernel, although it does have other kernels which can give other cpu speeds), right now but might try out another ROM soon (maybe) do you know what's the min and safe max for this ROM?
Also, can I just set a particular clock speed (e.g. 500MHz) and it should be ok or is there any stability difference between say 500MHz and 505MHz? Just curious. I looked at SetCPU and it looks like a good one. Also, if the clock speed I set makes things go wrong, can I revert it or can I get stuck with it and need to do a wipe?
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, there's no need to set a particular clock speed. Just whatever works for you. I wouldn't recommend going under 800mhz, as the phone will really really bog down even with normal use.
I haven't used that particular ROM, but I'm assuming anywhere around 1.3ghz should be safe on the upper limit. Like I said before, anything above that might start to cause issues. You might also want to consider the battery life implications of severe overclocking.
You can change the clock speed any time you want. If you're having wakeup or heat or any other issues just go back to SetCPU and change the max clock speed again. You can also use profiles in SetCPU to change the clock speed when the phone is overheating, or when the screen is off, or when the battery gets to a certain %. There are tons of posts detailing how others have setup their SetCPU profiles.
One last note, don't forget to check the box for "Set on Boot" in SetCPU, this way your changes aren't undone on reboot.
Thank, I think I got everything I need to know in your last reply
I'm on CM7, with the CM7 kernel, and clocked in at 1.5GHz, and have no problems, and the rom is super fast. And I use SetCPU.
Notes about Battery Saver script
Can be used with kernels that have init.d support
It completely eliminates the need for an application to set CPU speeds or profiles
Easily customizable if you use a text editor(scripts located in /system/etc/init.d)
It will set Max CPU speed to 500MHz & Min CPU speed to 200MHz when a sleep
If SetCPU, Overclock Widget, Android Overclock or QuickClock Advanced Overclock are detected, the script is ignored, so it will not affect them
Preset profiles are:
1.2GHz - 100-85%
1.0GHz - 84-36%
800MHz - 35-0%
And just an FYI, even at 800MHz, the phone still operates very well & smooth but the battery saving are the real benefit
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does this mean that if I don't use Set CPU or any app that undervolt it, the phone will AUTOMATICALLY drop the CPU speed according to my battery level:
1.2GHz - 100-85%
1.0GHz - 84-36%
800MHz - 35-0%
Another word, it will automatically drop CPU speed to 800 MHZ when my battery level is 35-0% in order to save battery?
It won't "Drop" the CPU speed, it will lower the Maximum speed the CPU is allowed to ramp up to.
Drumrocker said:
It won't "Drop" the CPU speed, it will lower the Maximum speed the CPU is allowed to ramp up to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So if I am not doing CPU intensive stuff and just play simple games, email, web surfing phone call, then I am not going to see battery improvement since my CPU probably don't ramp past 800MHZ anyway when I am just doing simple stuff.?
Calk's ROM undervolts the CPU at all speeds so that in itself should help a little with battery life. But you are correct, if you are not doing CPU intensive tasks the CPU probably isn't spending much time at the higher speeds.
There is an app called CPUSpy which shows how much time the CPU has spent in each frequency state.
Your phone will ramp up to 1200 mhz more than you think. When it loads a webpage, it will ramp up to 1200, when it's loading your "simple" game, it will max out for a bit, etc.
It might not stay there for very long, but still. The nice thing about Calkuins rom is that even at 800 mhz, the phone is super smooth and lag free. In fact I just turn setcpu down to 800 all the time.
Let me research setcpu and play around with it. Thanks again for the quick answers.
clamknuckle said:
Your phone will ramp up to 1200 mhz more than you think. When it loads a webpage, it will ramp up to 1200, when it's loading your "simple" game, it will max out for a bit, etc.
It might not stay there for very long, but still. The nice thing about Calkuins rom is that even at 800 mhz, the phone is super smooth and lag free. In fact I just turn setcpu down to 800 all the time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The way Calkulin's rom scripts are setup, setcpu gets reset on every reboot, even if you have it set to boot settings. The scripts installed will still take priority and the old rules apply, just to let you know. So you would have to set setcpu every boot for it to work, that or remove the scripts.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Team era... Does the same idea apply to the blazer 2.0 battery saving script? or does tegrak break it?
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
I havnt opened that rom, but Im gonna say the same applies, I remove those scripts, 2 will affect the cpu state.
edit, let me clarify, the scripts take prority, even if the app makes a script for init.d, the original script will take over on a reboot. So the script breaks tegrak, setcpu, and voltage control unless you set the app on every reboot.
I am running Calks 2 and desperado kernel. I notice when using setcpu, if you have it set on boot, it will override calks script.
His script does work well on saving battery life though. I ran oc'd while at 20% and still had 1700mhz blazing on performance gov.
I'd still use Calks script over setcpu or tegrak only due to the fact im too sporatic with my phone use to create optimal profiles to fit the way and when i need to use the device.
mindgrind said:
I am running Calks 2 and desperado kernel. I notice when using setcpu, if you have it set on boot, it will override calks script.
His script does work well on saving battery life though. I ran oc'd while at 20% and still had 1700mhz blazing on performance gov.
I'd still use Calks script over setcpu or tegrak only due to the fact im too sporatic with my phone use to create optimal profiles to fit the way and when i need to use the device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually in my own testing setcpu will not override the scripts, the slider may stay the same, but trust me, it goes back to 800 (or 1200 over 86%batt), Ive tested it several times. If you want proof Ill tell you how to figure it out. I know Im not respected yet, but I am someone that is known under another name that is highly respected, so, take it as you will.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Era, what's your suggestion for keeping the battery saving scripts running and getting a 1500 ish over clock when needed... something that can do both without having to physically change setcpu everytime. I basically want to permanently over clock to 1.5 and still save as much battery as possible when i have the screen off or it is charging. Idk if setcpu profiles work on this phone because i know they did not work correctly on the galaxy s. And one final question... what voltages do u run at what speeds on the "desperado" kernel to undervolt efficiently?
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
TeamERA said:
Actually in my own testing setcpu will not override the scripts, the slider may stay the same, but trust me, it goes back to 800 (or 1200 over 86%batt), Ive tested it several times. If you want proof Ill tell you how to figure it out. I know Im not respected yet, but I am someone that is known under another name that is highly respected, so, take it as you will.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ERA. I wasn't looking to say that you were wrong in any way shape or form. I would be interested to know how you seen this as I am still in the beginning phases of learning the android system. I do plan on writing my own kernal/roms but I was actually sharing what my logical thought process would have been given the apps and system info I had avail.
I have a little ways to go in understanding the structure and FS of droid. Time is everyones enemy. Thanks for the correction again!
I havnt opened that rom, but Im gonna say the same applies, I remove those scripts, 2 will affect the cpu state.
edit, let me clarify, the scripts take prority, even if the app makes a script for init.d, the original script will take over on a reboot. So the script breaks tegrak, setcpu, and voltage control unless you set the app on every reboot.
I'm currently running Calkulin's rom v2.5, and even at 41% battery I notice the cpu still hits 1.2 Ghz. Is his script activated by default or am I overlooking something? I also have nothing like setcpu installed.
Hi i have ARHD on my phone with the XM Kernel. I was slightly suprised in the Trickster MOD app, the max clock speed is 1.3ghz. Yes i know i can OC to 1.5 but im not sure what is setting this. When i had ARHD installed with stock kernel it was showing 1.3 as default. I assume that was set by the ROM. But i installed this kernel and still has 1.3 as the default.
Also the default govenor settings for the gaming one has the boost_freq set at 1300000, which is 1.3ghz, that can be changed to 1.5 also. But surely the boost freq would be the max freq no matter if you move the slider to 1.5 in the basic controls? But i would be suprised that the gaming govenor would underclock the cpu, surely for gaming you would want the phone maxed out?
Is this expected with the XM Kernel and the ARHD? And if so, is there any things i can change in the govenor settings to make sure it performs at absolute max?
It's kernel related; Xmisters' kernels since 188 have a hard cap(1.3Ghz) by default, but using trickster mod, or another o/c apk, you can raise it to the stock 1.5Ghz(tick 'set on boot' to ensure it stays at 1.5) The best settings are trial and error, tbh, I use touchdemand/sio though smartmax seems to be the best balance.
Thanks for the answer. i can change it to 1.5 easy enough, but if you look in the govenor control, the boost_freq is is set to 1300000. If i left it at that, would it prevent the cpu from going up to 1.5?
Danw20 said:
Thanks for the answer. i can change it to 1.5 easy enough, but if you look in the govenor control, the boost_freq is is set to 1300000. If i left it at that, would it prevent the cpu from going up to 1.5?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you have sleep (lowest CPU can go), ideal freq(the speed the CPU aims for while awake), touch poke (when you touch the screen), boost (what it boosts too to prevent lag) and max (CPU flat out)
Setting the boost to 1.3 will still allow the could to run at full speed.
Sent from my HTC One X using xda app-developers app
That makes sense, cheers. So its probably a good idea to leave it as it is then.