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Yes, that's correct. Windows Phone 7 will NOT be officially supported on anything that is currently on the market. Microsoft has repeatedly stated this. It has rather high end specs that very few phones on the market can even support. In addition, Microsoft has a very firm mandate on things such as having the 3, and only 3, buttons on the front of the device.
So will someone here be able to port WP7 to a current device, unofficially? It depends on which device. Does your phone have a Snapdragon CPU? If the answer is no then there is very, and I mean very, little chance of your phone ever seeing WP7. There's a few reasons but the first and foremost being that all of the binaries are compiled with the ARMv7 instruction set. So basically the only phones (that I know of) are the HTC HD2, Acer neotouch, and Toshiba TG01. The most likely is the HD2 which is actively being worked on by Da_G and probably some other people. Several Android phones also sport the snapdragon but we've yet to see an android phone with WM6 running on it so I doubt we'll see WP7 on one either. So I won't straight up rule out other phones from getting some sort of WP7 hack but it's extremely unlikely. If it somehow does, expect the performance to be extremely crappy. There's a reason MS set the requirements to what they did.
Mods: please sticky.
Stickied. WP7/CE6/(future CE7) is quite the different ball game from WM2003/WM5/WM6/WM6.5/CE5/CE5.x...
There's also the LG Expo which runs QSD/ARMv7, so is a possible target.
The major hurdle with porting is that our current devices contain Radio ROMs, Drivers, and Bootloaders which all target the CE5.x platform. CE6+ is a different beast on a low level (in a good way, there are major improvements across the board which required breaking API compatibility - these improvements have been long overdue)
With access to whitepapers documenting the hardware's interface(s) and initialization routines, Platform Builder for WP7, and a good bit of time it's certainly possible to bring any platform supporting ARMv7 up to WP7. However such information/software is not public, so it's up to the OEM to either develop this (not at all likely) or release the requisite platform BSP (also not at all likely) to enable anyone to port their devices to WP7.
There are other possible methods such as emulation, but the amount of work involved would outweigh the end result by a good margin. The OEMs major concerns with porting ROMs is the sharing of 3rd party software to which they are not authorized to license distribution (for example, HTC licenses WM from MSFT, and also licenses a number of other technologies such as swype)
One possible solution for this in an ideal world is for Qualcomm to license HTC to distribute a binary-only driver solution, similar to Nvidias driver license on *nix. Combining that with HTC's own OEM specific binary-only libraries, would give us a bare-bones Platform BSP. This would contain only technologies owned by Qualcomm and HTC. They could then release this bare bones, binary-only, pre-linking BSP, and we could, on our end, combine it with the WP7 Platform Builder, and come out with a completely stock WP7 ROM.
This would allow us to constantly update the OS version, add our own 3rd party software as needed, and eliminate the need to use "cooking" tools to build a ROM (instead we could use MSFT's own PB or a derivative of such)
In this situation there wouldn't be any licensing issues outside of Qualcomm and HTC's own IP. Will they ever do this? I doubt it. But it would be very, very nice! It would satisfy the OEM's requirement that we don't redistribute 3rd party software, and satisfy our own needs to tweak our phones to perfection. Note that Qualcomm/HTC is interchangable with any SoC developer and any OEM. Rather than Qualcomm/HTC it could be Texas Instruments/Samsung, or xxxx/yyyy
Of course there are some other snags with this (WP7 Platform Builder is not publicly available), but one can dream right?
Side note, for more info on what a BSP is from the horses mouth, look here.
Da_G, respecting all the tries that have been made till now, if ever Windows Phone 7 would be ported it would be on very certain device - like lg expo or hd2, as per the hardware requirements. it would be better to buy a windows phone 7 device than buying and porting wp7 on the above devices.
microsoft is trying to create a hype for windows phone 7, and is in the news though not much. almost all windows mobile OEMs are making wp7 devices. if an OEM is making a device with high end specs, it won't port its own software(ui) on the buggy windows mobile, but will buy license for let's say android or why not wp7. we have seen how the OEM tried hard to optimise windows mobile 6.1 and 6.5 on snapdragon. windows mobile still got the future but with limited hardware..
I am one of many owners of an HD2.
Who will lose is the MS.
Will lose many WM7 ambassadors..... will a HD2 owner, buy a new WM7 device ?.......no!.......we will port the HD2 to Android, and become one more Droid embassador.
This is the business of MS in the world of smartphones.....a no upgrade SO\Device seller.
Why would you swap to Android? When you need a new phone, a WP7 would make a good replacement for any Windows Mobile device.
Windcape said:
Why would you swap to Android? When you need a new phone, a WP7 would make a good replacement for any Windows Mobile device.
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Click to collapse
Because its Android....its open source, its just better ok, dont question!
i think the issue is that the HD2 is more than capable of doing a lot more than it currently does and i for one have an issue with upgrading phones because of software, if i want an upgrade its for hardware reasons so naturally if other OS's can be ported to the HD2 then it will sustain my device a bit longer. until its no longer able to run what i want it to run.
Android phones are as open source as iPhones are (Android OS, and Darwin OS is open source, most of the rest is closed-source modifications).
Anyway, I don't think it's Microsoft's choice if HD2 get WP7 or not, but HTCs. And HTC look forward to a large profit margin by selling extra much hardware this year, so obviously they wouldn't want to upgrade HD2 -- at least not the first six months.
Windcape said:
Why would you swap to Android? When you need a new phone, a WP7 would make a good replacement for any Windows Mobile device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because I paid well for it,a shortly time, and i dont want to spend more money, to bought a new Device, always MS upgrade the OS....opposite of the top devices with Android or iphone.
was my mistake, I can not blame anyone else, I was naive in thinking that it would take a WM7 upgrade due to good specs of HD2.
my mistake.
But I will not throw out my HD2
For the iPhone you get a upgrade for a small price, for Android you're completely relying on the mercy of your manufacturer. And the less you pay, the less chance in hell there is you get a update, special for Android phones.
You're being naive if you think Android is any different here.
3 buttons is a must? Nog sure if that could be true... some manufacturers would be left out/give up themselves because of this constraint.
7 for phones... MSFT is losing smartphones market share. Trust me... they will make it available for the... gen pop
Is this suppose to be news? I though everyone knew by now that WM7 will not be supporting current Winmo phones....
It's not meant to be news, it's meant to stop people asking will WP7 be ported to my TP2/Diamond2/(insert current wm phone name here) question
Does this mean WP7 can only be for snapdragon and not OMAP, hummingbird, tegra 2 and all the other arm cpu's out there?
ari-free said:
Does this mean WP7 can only be for snapdragon and not OMAP, hummingbird, tegra 2 and all the other arm cpu's out there?
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Click to collapse
Little is officially known about this however it's believed that at first only Snapdragon will be supported. But with Samsung being a partner and other companies certainly wanting choice, it won't last forever. Samsung devices very well may have a Hummingbird but Samsung would just have to develop more of the drivers whereas MSFT is developing everything for Snapdragon.
I just assumed older arm cpu's wouldn't be supported. But only snapdragon? ugh...
I'm not a big fan of HTC because they insist on using snapdragons in their supposedly high end phones.
btw Samsung will probably not use hummingbird in future phones because Apple bought out intrinsity. But I can't imagine them wanting to use snapdragon...they'd probably want to use the OMAP4 which has the same powerVR GPU, the SGX540. OMAP3's cpu is actually better than hummingbird so I don't think anyone will be crying over the Apple acquisition.
In my opinion, HTC could disable a couple of the buttons on my HD2 if it made it applicable for WP7. Though, on the other hand, I see as much reason to upgrade to WP7 as to go for an iPhone. I'd rather iPuke my iGuts out. WP7 looks iAweful and I think it iSucks pretty bad.
I understand Microsoft's rationale for making the specs as strict as they have, as this is the sole reason iPoo...iPhone is so stable. There's simply no room for flawed drivers, and there's only one "option"
ari-free said:
I just assumed older arm cpu's wouldn't be supported. But only snapdragon? ugh...
I'm not a big fan of HTC because they insist on using snapdragons in their supposedly high end phones.
btw Samsung will probably not use hummingbird in future phones because Apple bought out intrinsity. But I can't imagine them wanting to use snapdragon...they'd probably want to use the OMAP4 which has the same powerVR GPU, the SGX540. OMAP3's cpu is actually better than hummingbird so I don't think anyone will be crying over the Apple acquisition.
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I thought Samsung owned/designed Hummingbird?
But at any rate, MSFT will likely open it up later on. They're just keeping it simple for now. Not enough of a difference to start writing/testing drivers for all these different platforms.
tiwas said:
In my opinion, HTC could disable a couple of the buttons on my HD2 if it made it applicable for WP7.
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Having seen videos on how the camera button works, you can now understand why you cant just bodge WP7 onto a HD2.
DMAND said:
Having seen videos on how the camera button works, you can now understand why you cant just bodge WP7 onto a HD2.
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Their internal test devices didn't have hardware camera buttons.
Yes but all retail ones will, one that require half presses for focusing which none of the hd2 buttons could be forced to do if I'm correct.
Paul Thurrott from Windows Phone Secrets have revealed, well, some secrets about the upcoming Windows Phone 7 updates.
He writes that we can expect two updates this year – the first expected to be announced this week, but only pushed in February by carriers, will be called NoDo (for no donuts), will bring support for the Qualcomm 7×30 smart phone chipset, a CDMA location stack, and a number of software fixes.
Of note is that the Snapdragon-based Qualcomm 7×30 chipset comes with HDMI output and the ability to play back 720p video on both its host device and a HDTV. It also supports Flash 10.1.
The next Mango, will come some time later in the year, and bring Internet Explorer 9 with with the Trident 5 rendering engine, HTML 5 and Silverlight, and gesture support. This 75xx (actually version 7.2) update will apparently bring additional, unrelated features as well.
Paul also mentions that Microsoft does not intend to push a number of small updates, but only a few large updates per year, which should mean long waits between each one.
Source:
wpcentral.com/thurrott-details-2011-wp7-updates-mango-and-nodo-as-no-donuts
wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-7-updates-nodo-and-mango-coming/
I still believe that we'll see at least 3 updates in the year. 2 small ones and one large one.
Carriers could hold up and update for 1 cycle. That "advantage" would seem close to useless if the cycles could be almost a year apart.
You misspoke when you said updates are pushed out by carriers. Updates are released by Microsoft but tested by carriers before officially released.
From the article:
Thurrott reports that NoDo will RTM in January, with consumers seeing the update in the early February timeframe, after testing by carriers.
I don't think it would be logistically feasible to push tons of updates and bug fixes as they come up, instead of cumulative updates.
The carriers have to certify them, and I'm sure that they have to be given a certain amount of time to do so.
Though I would like to see an aggressive update schedule. Maybe one every 3 months.
abhinayp said:
Paul Thurrott from Windows Phone Secrets have revealed, well, some secrets about the upcoming Windows Phone 7 updates.
He writes that we can expect two updates this year – the first expected to be announced this week, but only pushed in February by carriers, will be called NoDo (for no donuts), will bring support for the Qualcomm 7×30 smart phone chipset, a CDMA location stack, and a number of software fixes.
Of note is that the Snapdragon-based Qualcomm 7×30 chipset comes with HDMI output and the ability to play back 720p video on both its host device and a HDTV. It also supports Flash 10.1.
The next Mango, will come some time later in the year, and bring Internet Explorer 9 with with the Trident 5 rendering engine, HTML 5 and Silverlight, and gesture support. This 75xx (actually version 7.2) update will apparently bring additional, unrelated features as well.
Paul also mentions that Microsoft does not intend to push a number of small updates, but only a few large updates per year, which should mean long waits between each one.
Source:
wpcentral.com/thurrott-details-2011-wp7-updates-mango-and-nodo-as-no-donuts
wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-7-updates-nodo-and-mango-coming/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually he said that there will be more small updates between now and mango.
Though mango sounds like a great update (IE9 with full silverlight and html 5)
The fact that "Mango" is being labeled as the "Entertainment Branch" makes me wonder about what the "Business Branch" is.
I think it's safe to assume that there is a Business Branch. So I wonder what priority is given to it. Will it come before or after Mango? Will it be released concurrently? What types of updates would fall under "Business Branch"?
I would say letting carriers in "testing" the update is a bad move on Microsoft's part. If it is anything like Palm, a carrier will push the update rather quickly (Sprint), while the other carriers will release it much latter (one month or more) and only because customers were getting pissed (AT&T and Verizon).
canadariot2312 said:
I would say letting carriers in "testing" the update is a bad move on Microsoft's part. If it is anything like Palm, a carrier will push the update rather quickly (Sprint), while the other carriers will release it much latter (one month or more) and only because customers were getting pissed (AT&T and Verizon).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As it was said above, the carriers don't push the updates. When MS released WP7 they said all devices would get updates at the same time, regardless of device or carrier.
The proclamations of imminent failure are rather humorous. It shows 2 main things to me.
1. Some people have very short attention spans, and can't fathom the idea of a "long term plan"
2. Some people think that every other consumer wants the same thing that they do
Microsoft is in this for the long haul. The fact that they have stated that they don't expect to be in a position to beat the major players for at least a few years shows that they are looking at this as a long term investment.
There is a large portion of the mobile phone using market that hasn't upgraded to using a smart phone yet. Many people are happy with their regular phones because they feel that they don't need the features of a smart phone. However, every year, more and more of this very large market slowly moves over into the smartphone arena. These are people who want something that is slick, easy to use, and interesting. They don't need every feature under the sun. These are the kind of people that made the first iPhone such a success even though it severely lacked features compared to Windows Mobile. These are the people that the "Really?" commercials are targeted towards. People who haven't already jumped on the smartphone bandwagon because it just all seems like "too much."
The fact that MS is planning major upgrades to WP7 at all is awesome. It shows that while they are going for the casual feature phone user, they also want to get smartphone users as well. And the fact that they're doing it so quickly is even more awesome. After all, how long has the phone been out now? 2 months? 3 months by the time of the first update? Not too shabby.
MartyLK said:
Just a few I garnered for you:
http://blog.wirelessground.com/windows-phone-7-success-or-failure/
http://www.conceivablytech.com/4653...hone-7-failure-microsoft-will-buy-ad-company/
http://www.infoworld.com/d/mobilize/windows-phone-7-even-bigger-disaster-i-thought-912
http://mosspuppet.com/2010/03/15/windows-phone-7-is-already-a-failure/
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/662...phone-webkit-html-5-ie7-browser-google-ap.htm
http://pocketnow.com/windows-phone/gartner-predicts-windows-phone-7-will-not-succeed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I clicked on some of these articles and some were from March, September, and right around the time of launch. Seriously?
From the article: will bring support for the Qualcomm 7×30 smart phone chipset
Is this a support for any new hardware that might come in future wp7 phones or do the existing wp7 phones support this?
abhinayp said:
From the article: will bring support for the Qualcomm 7×30 smart phone chipset
Is this a support for any new hardware that might come in future wp7 phones or do the existing wp7 phones support this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's supposed to be current generation hardware that has that.
abhinayp said:
From the article: will bring support for the Qualcomm 7×30 smart phone chipset
Is this a support for any new hardware that might come in future wp7 phones or do the existing wp7 phones support this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The MSM7x30 is a second generation snapdragon that has improved GPU (as used in the T-Mobile G2). Though, based on the wiki this is 800 MHz. Guess we'll have to wait for the actual details.
All current WP7 phones use the QSD8250, so this won't benefit existing phones.
poedgirl said:
As it was said above, the carriers don't push the updates. When MS released WP7 they said all devices would get updates at the same time, regardless of device or carrier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With that being said, can't Microsoft themselves push the update as early as next week? The first update seems really minor.
MartyLK said:
A consumer oriented model would have brought the features out either at launch or soon there after. And a consumer oriented model would not hold out on features that are common in the market already for such a long period of time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If the features were ready at launch or around launch, they would have been released. We don't have the functionality because it's not ready. It is no more complicated than that.
abhinayp said:
From the article: will bring support for the Qualcomm 7×30 smart phone chipset
Is this a support for any new hardware that might come in future wp7 phones or do the existing wp7 phones support this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CDMA support
lqaddict said:
Yet MS orchestrated the iPhone funeral during WP7 launch...
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So MS can't do that because they feel (and they do) that they have a good competitive product?
The thing with articles is because they influence public outlook on stuff (for the most part). How many claimed WP7 was gonna fail because KIN was discontinued? Articles nowadays are usually biased toward or for a certain platform and hardly treated as fact. It's always an opinion of some person.
I think you missed my point that a very large percentage of potential customers aren't interested in a list of "features" that could be checked off.
Many people who are transitioning from feature phone to smart phone just want the transition to be nice and painless.
You're looking at things from the perspective of a veteran smartphone user. And most people aren't.
I disagree that the mango update is an issue. It's not like android where half the devices are still on 2.1 with 2.2 released months ago and 2.3 just released.
Updates will be across all phones, yes it will take time to get them, but what OS gets releases out fast?
nrfitchett4 said:
I disagree that the mango update is an issue. It's not like android where half the devices are still on 2.1 with 2.2 released months ago and 2.3 just released.
Updates will be across all phones, yes it will take time to get them, but what OS gets releases out fast?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only thing on this thread that hasn't made me cringe with "WTF?!", so thanks for that.
Did anybody really expect HTML5, Silverlight, Copy & Paste, Multitasking within 2 months of release and bug-free?? That's impossible. They've only been working on the entire OS for just over a year ffs. I'm amazed we're even using WM7 right now, let alone getting ANY sort of an update within a few weeks.
People on this thread just sound like this is their first early adoptation of a phone. Welcome to the gadget world, friends.
one sided promise from microsoft (re:updates) is pure fail. all parties should be brought onboard and each held accountable
http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/10/google-partners-with-oems-and-carriers-to-guarantee-android-upda/
Wow, I saw AT&T on the picture, I must relook at it.
It will never happen because all the OEM's and carriers involved seem to want Microsoft and WP7 to fail.
Look at the Zune hardware. My brother had a Zune since Day 1 and he got every update and new release from Microsoft, no problem. I don't think it's a Microsoft issue, I think it's a carrier issue.
Well, that announcement says Android phones will be supported for 18 months. It doesn't say updates will be instant, OEMs won't take weeks to develop ROMs and carriers won't take weeks "testing" them.
vangrieg said:
It doesn't say updates will be instant, OEMs won't take weeks to develop ROMs and carriers won't take weeks "testing" them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
if you read the live update, it says:
"12:34PM New guidelines! Man, this is going to be huge. Google's laying out a timeline for how long it'll take a device to get updated once a new build is let loose, as well as how long it'll be updated beyond that."
Google and Apple are both more powerful and influential in the mobile space than Microsoft right now. I don't think Microsoft is really in the position to dictate anything to anyone right now.
And what exactly are these guidelines? Three days for a new ROM from HTC with a new Sense on it?
I mean, this is great news for Android, but there's nothing so far that says anything real about what the update experience will be.
I know it's trendy to bash MS, but WP7 has seen four updates already. And the last one was cumulative, by the way.
I don't know, I have been receiving my updates when MS release them; other than the first one that took one or two weeks every other have been the same day (but I’m not in USA).
http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/10/google-clarifies-18-month-android-upgrade-program-details-far-f/
When pressed about how long it'd take updates to flow to phones after given the thumbs-up by Google itself, there's no hard news to report. In fact, the details there are still being hashed out.
To quote Google, "It's a logistics problem." We can only imagine. Trying to get every Android partner to follow a timeline for releases has to be a complete and utter nightmare, but the company seems certain that these stipulations won't cripple anyone's ability to innovate on their skins (or have too little time to make the needed changes).
We would've loved to hear a specific figure that we could start holding phone manufacturers to, but alas, it isn't to be. The only hard number thrown out today is 18 months. That's how long future hardware will be in the support cycle (at least, anyway), so you'll "soon" be able to count on your next Android device receiving all applicable updates for 1.5 years after purchase.
The guideline is yet to be hashed out. That's why they practically included everyone in the group to come up with a guide line. The only reason AT&T is included is because AT&T wants to make sure the final guideline doesn't put it in the spotlight again, like must release updates within 6 months of Google release That will never happen. I'm pretty sure the final guide line will be 12-month (from Google release the code and you see it on your phone), i.e. totally worthless and waste of time. Android is an open source platform, Google has no say about who can use the code and when they need to release the updates. The only thing Google can do is withheld Android market support.
And if they take longer than the set time frame? What happens?
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Nothing would happen. It is called guide line, not rules.
Well then, that'll really be a game changer then... /sarcasm
Where is the news in this?
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
munkeyphyst said:
Well then, that'll really be a game changer then... /sarcasm
Where is the news in this?
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is none. FWIW MS has "guidelines" on updates as well, i.e. that carriers cannot block two consecutive updates.
-R
I smell a publicity fail from Google.
Well I have a wp7 and an android phone, I have to say there is no reason the OEMs cannot make their addtions such as the sense UI to be a replacement, that can be removed and updated seperately from the core OS. If they did that then it would allow for quicker updates.
In the past there were almost no updates done to phone other than small ones that were carrier specific (ie settings or patches) but major upgrades did not really happen. I would not be surprised if eventually updates to the phones to start costing money, much like a new version of OS X or a new version of windows does on a PC.
It's not a timeline.
It's just enforcing devices to be supported for 18 months.
It doesn't mean the manufacturers/carriers will have x amount of days after an android update to release said update. They can still release a phone with FroYo, and take 17 months to release gingerbread for that phone.
Also, it depends on whether the device's hardware supports the update and knowing Andorid manufacturers like HTC they'll just put a ROM chip too small to take any major updates in the phone, etc. Your Evo 4.0 can't support Sense 3.0? Good luck getting that update! HTC will not "downgrade" an Evo 4G from Sense 2 to Stock Android...
They are still trying to get the details panned out, but I'm not getting my hopes up. There are still phones out there sending SMS/MMS to the wrong contacts because the manufacturers don't even prioritize security updates for their phones (which, IMO, is a MUCH bigger issues than even large feature updates...). Android is a huge, hot mess when it comes to updates.
bill.g said:
Well I have a wp7 and an android phone, I have to say there is no reason the OEMs cannot make their addtions such as the sense UI to be a replacement, that can be removed and updated seperately from the core OS. If they did that then it would allow for quicker updates.
In the past there were almost no updates done to phone other than small ones that were carrier specific (ie settings or patches) but major upgrades did not really happen. I would not be surprised if eventually updates to the phones to start costing money, much like a new version of OS X or a new version of windows does on a PC.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you a developer?
Those aren't themes. They're deep customizations many of which have access to parts of the system that would require a "normal" app to run with Super User permissions. You can't release much of that as an App in the marketplace... Not to mention, they would just end up getting pirated by everyone and at worse breaking a bunch of phones that weren't designed to run the software (freezing them, reboot loops, making them unbootable, etc.).
There's also the issue of drivers, because different manufacturers use dispirate hardware configurations with screens, SoCs, cameras, etc. from dispirate sources. Getting all of that to work on an update is MUCH harder than getting the skins functional.
You people (generally speaking) really think the skins are the issue? They are not. Android (specifically, Linux) is the issue. The skins are easy as hell. The latest Epic 4G Gingerbread Leak has a working TouchWiz, but most of the phone/smartphone functionality is broken. That's a great example on just how easy porting the skins form version to version is. Skins typically aren't that sensitive to kernal ABI changes - device drivers ARE.
The fact that Android is based on Linux by default ensures that updates will have issues because it inherits many of Linux's issues. A Windows Mobile 6.0 update could in many cases just reuse drivers developed for Windows Mobile 5.0the same way Windows 7 can use many Windows XP drivers without any issues.
Linux doesn't have this type of backward/forward compatibility. That's why those leaked updates often have close to nothing working on them (No Wifi, no calls, no this, no that, etc.). Linux doesn't have a stable ABI for driver developers. Kernel updates can break any and/or everything. This means that the turnaround for updates is much longer than it will be for something like WP7.
The biggest issue with Android is the fact that Manufacturers and Carriers do not even prioritize critical security updates, and Google seems intent on not patching and quickly propagating patches for exploits used to root devices. Which is nice for tinkerers, but can be an issue when a malware uses that exploit on someone's device to perform malicious actions...
N8ter said:
It's not a timeline.
It's just enforcing devices to be supported for 18 months.
It doesn't mean the manufacturers/carriers will have x amount of days after an android update to release said update. They can still release a phone with FroYo, and take 17 months to release gingerbread for that phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure they said timely updates. Which means they are going to work out some sort of guidelines on how long it takes for the updates to get pushed out. What that actually is remains to be seen though.
Its official that HTC One series will get jelly bean.News is official from HTC.
Source : codenametech dot com
Did anyone think it wasn't going to happen? Here's HTC's quote:
"We know HTC fans are excited to get their hands on Google's latest version of Android. At this point in time, we can confirm that we have plans to upgrade our HTC One X, HTC One XL and HTC One S to Jelly Bean. Please stay tuned for more updates regarding device upgrades, timing and other details about HTC and Jelly Bean."
If you parse it, it says "we can confirm we have plans" and "stay tuned for more updates." Confirming an "update" vs. "plans for an update" are two different things and set different expectations. To me, that means it's not around the corner.
In related news, SamMobile, a 50%-reliable source for Samsung news said:
"The insiders of SamMobile reported that Samsung is testing Android 4.1 for the Galaxy S III and Galaxy S II. Samsung is almost ready to update their Galaxy S III devices to Android 4.1. There is no date planned yet but it could be around August / September."
Neither HTC nor Samsung will want their flagships updated last so sometime in the fall for the One X and SGS3 seems realistic. With a JB release being at least a couple of months away the 2.X update to 4.0.4 should occur as planned. The One S received it three days ago.
its a great news altogether.I think with all the devices that they came up with in 2012 all should be upgraded to Jelly bean.
Not the v apparently.
backfromthestorm said:
Not the v apparently.
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There's a term called "planned obsolescence." It's pretty much designing products so that they'll never be equal to the "new and improved" product causing people to always want and hopefully purchase the "next big thing." Google wants the manufacturers to keep their devices current so that at any given time the majority are on latest and greatest Android OS. The manufacturers want the opposite; people buying-up to a new device to get the new bells and whistles. With ICS out for ten months and only 10% of devices on it I'd say the manufacturers are winning. Does anyone really think it takes companies like Samsung and HTC nine months to develop an update? Dragging their feet is intentional and there's nothing we or Google can do about it.
BarryH_GEG said:
There's a term called "planned obsolescence." It's pretty much designing products so that they'll never be equal to the "new and improved" product causing people to always want and hopefully purchase the "next big thing." Google wants the manufacturers to keep their devices current so that at any given time the majority are on latest and greatest Android OS. The manufacturers want the opposite; people buying-up to a new device to get the new bells and whistles. With ICS out for ten months and only 10% of devices on it I'd say the manufacturers are winning. Does anyone really think it takes companies like Samsung and HTC nine months to develop an update? Dragging their feet is intentional and there's nothing we or Google can do about it.
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Yes but for this question of "planned obsolescence" We need S-OFF in all phones........quickly
g3rm3n said:
Yes but for this question of "planned obsolescence" We need S-OFF in all phones........quickly
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For all we know locking their phones and eliminating the warranty for unlocked devices could be HTC's way of preventing or scaring people from getting the "latest and greatest" on their own and therefore having to purchase the Two X, Three X, and so on. In other words, a form of planned obsolescence. Manufacturers aren't as stupid as a lot of people believe they are. We don't like them for what they do but their well aware of why they do it and what the benefit is financially.
BarryH_GEG said:
There's a term called "planned obsolescence." It's pretty much designing products so that they'll never be equal to the "new and improved" product causing people to always want and hopefully purchase the "next big thing." Google wants the manufacturers to keep their devices current so that at any given time the majority are on latest and greatest Android OS. The manufacturers want the opposite; people buying-up to a new device to get the new bells and whistles. With ICS out for ten months and only 10% of devices on it I'd say the manufacturers are winning. Does anyone really think it takes companies like Samsung and HTC nine months to develop an update? Dragging their feet is intentional and there's nothing we or Google can do about it.
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HTC has been the fastest to produce updates on their flagships to the latest os. And it is hardly a quick process to integrate their sense into the oses.
Sent from my HTC One X using xda premium
BarryH_GEG said:
There's a term called "planned obsolescence." It's pretty much designing products so that they'll never be equal to the "new and improved" product causing people to always want and hopefully purchase the "next big thing." Google wants the manufacturers to keep their devices current so that at any given time the majority are on latest and greatest Android OS. The manufacturers want the opposite; people buying-up to a new device to get the new bells and whistles. With ICS out for ten months and only 10% of devices on it I'd say the manufacturers are winning. Does anyone really think it takes companies like Samsung and HTC nine months to develop an update? Dragging their feet is intentional and there's nothing we or Google can do about it.
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There is also something like the competition and when caring consumers see that the competitor does give them updates they will buy from the competitor next time
godutch said:
There is also something like the competition and when caring consumers see that the competitor does give them updates they will buy from the competitor next time
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Who would that be? They all suck with some sucking worse than others. Samsung is just now starting to update their tablets to ICS. Do you think it's a coincidence that started to happen only after the G-Tab 2's have been on the market for a few months? There's zero incentive for a manufacturer to devote resources to keeping their phones updated. If Samsung started to HTC would also. But there's no motive for anyone to change what they're currently doing. Why do you think Google built their own tablet? With all their influence over the manufacturers they couldn’t get them off their asses to pay attention to a market segment Android was getting the crap kicked out of it in. If Google through Motorola starts setting new precedents others will follow. Until then the dysfunction continues.
I tired of waiting for HTC to do what is right, just give me S-Off and CM10
Sent from my GT-I9000 running CM9
Misleading title ... There is already a thread about this sticky...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1740569
Let's get this out of the way first, nobody here is stupid, we know the L Release is never going to come to the Galaxy Nexus officially. So let's talk about the community. I just have one basic question for our talented devs, what are the odds that a port of L will be able to come to the Gnex and if so, what kind of time frame are we looking at here?
Does the Cyanogenmod team do developers previews like this one? We might see it from them.
I'm sorry, but this post is exactly what I expected to see today.
so lets get it out of the way.
SURE
we COULD see some 5.0 aosp love(via custom development)
MAYBE.
time frame?
when.source drops, give it a few months at most I'd say
source isn't even CLOSE to ready yet though.
SOOO
let's ALSO look at the past.
which nexus devices, after Google officially dropped support, are STILL ABLE AND ARE running LATEST android version?
ALL of them right?
stability and such isn't a factor for this question, it's IF IT CAN/DOES run newest aosp in SOME FORM.
so I'd say YES gnex WILL see 5.0 in SOME usable form. but asking for ANY "time frame"at THIS POINT since SOURCE ISN'T AVAILABLE YET is kinda pointless.
maybe though, just maybe, there are ALREADY some people at work on getting those "preview" things ported. no matter WHAT, patience and not asking for timeframe/eta is key here
I don't normally do +1 style posts, but I am also greatly interested in knowing this as well.
I imagine it is largely going to depend on how much of the underlying kernel and driver interaction changes. I remember on my prior phone, a Droid X which has been and is still locked down, it was generally impossible to get past ICS because of the major underlying changes in JB and not being able to get those on the DX. Granted the Nexus doesn't have this limitation but drivers aren't likely to be further updated and if the kernel goes too far forward it is unlikely to see compatible driver versions for GNex hardware.
EDIT: I should probably say modules instead of drivers. I'm primarily a Windows person PC-side.
Put it this way my 4 year old HTC Desire can run Kitkat then i would be amazed if we didn't end up with some pretty good builds of "L".
ashclepdia said:
I'm sorry, but this post is exactly what I expected to see today.
so lets get it out of the way.
SURE
we COULD see some 5.0 aosp love(via custom development)
MAYBE.
time frame?
when.source drops, give it a few months at most I'd say
source isn't even CLOSE to ready yet though.
SOOO
let's ALSO look at the past.
which nexus devices, after Google officially dropped support, are STILL ABLE AND ARE running LATEST android version?
ALL of them right?
stability and such isn't a factor for this question, it's IF IT CAN/DOES run newest aosp in SOME FORM.
so I'd say YES gnex WILL see 5.0 in SOME usable form. but asking for ANY "time frame"at THIS POINT since SOURCE ISN'T AVAILABLE YET is kinda pointless.
maybe though, just maybe, there are ALREADY some people at work on getting those "preview" things ported. no matter WHAT, patience and not asking for timeframe/eta is key here
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Thanks for replying! I figured since I looked pretty thoroughly and didn't see a thread for it and thought that having at least one place for Gnex owners to talk about the L release for us wouldn't be a bad thing. I in no way meant to be one of those people who constantly bugs the devs about ETA's, I just meant what were could be expecting in the general sense. Thanks for the reassurance about us getting it, I've just been burned before about support with previous devices when they got past official support. But those weren't Nexii so I didn't know what to expect.
Brettbesa said:
Thanks for replying! I figured since I looked pretty thoroughly and didn't see a thread for it and thought that having at least one place for Gnex owners to talk about the L release for us wouldn't be a bad thing. I in no way meant to be one of those people who constantly bugs the devs about ETA's, I just meant what were could be expecting in the general sense. Thanks for the reassurance about us getting it, I've just been burned before about support with previous devices when they got past official support. But those weren't Nexii so I didn't know what to expect.
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yea sorry about my tone in that reply mostly too
I'm usually not the one to fly off ranting towards other users actions, at least not on xda(i do #AshRants elsewhere lol)
your question was a valid one, and I know where you coming from when it comes to nom nexus devices and their lack of support, I had a droid x2 that was ORIGINALLY SCHEDULED BY MOTOROLA to have ICS update. which for some reason they just didn't follow through on. Their REASON they said was that "android 4.0+ would not improve functionality of this device"...aka "we don't feel like fixing all the bugs we gave you already with shotty gingerbread releases, and we aren't going to allow you to unlock the device or give you usable kernel source so screw off",...back when moto didn't gaf about the dev communities. they have made huge strides towards mending that relationship. just couldn't believe they had the gall to say 4.0 wouldn't improve the first dual core android device running a tegra2 chipset. bah. ramblings now again from ash.
but yea reason I kinda went off in that reply was mostly cuz I hoped all the other people who were already drooling at the chance to post the exact same things would slow down and think instead first it wasnt intended as a personal attack towards you or to start any flamewar on the subject. and judging by your reply you didn't take offense to it anyways, so :thumbsup: :good: we all on the same page anyways.
personally, I haven't seen much of the IO stuff about L, I saw mostly design changes, and would like to know more details about it's new features so I'll be digging around YouTube today for recaps and such.
but I'm almost certain that if we don't get some kinda official rom like CM, OMNI, SHINY, PA, etc... building L based.roms for us, then some of our awesomely talented devs will at LEAST get us able to look like we have it, along with SOME if not z MOST functionality of L.
ashclepdia said:
I'm sorry, but this post is exactly what I expected to see today.
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I also think you guys should be patient. Your life won't be (that limited if there won't be a port of the coming up Android L to our Galaxy Nexus. Just relax.
As some have already pointed out, we're unlikely to see Android 5 "officially" ported to our GNex, for pretty much the same reason that we don't have an official 4.4 release for our phone. From ArsTechnica:
"Our talk with Burke shed some light on some more obscure topics too, including the lack of an Android 4.4 update for the Galaxy Nexus. Google's official line was that the company only supports hardware for 18 months after release, which it still mentions in its official Nexus update support document. As was speculated at the time, though, the decision was tied to Texas Instruments' exit from the consumer SoC market (TI's OMAP chip powered the Galaxy Nexus as well as other prominent Android-based hardware like the first Kindle Fires).
"It was a really extraordinary event," he said. "You had a silicon company exit the market, there was nobody left in the building to talk to."
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TI stopped development for the GNex SoC at Android 4.1. Google and others worked hard to support it for 4.2 and 4.3, but the official TI software was broken by 4.4. The reason that we even have 4.4 custom ROMs is because some kind-hearted person, perhaps a TI insider, released beta or engineering sample software for the SoC. But as we've found, it's not the most stable
have a great weekend,
john
You could all complain about TI stopping development and blaming them. The Google Glass uses a not to different TI SOC compared to the GNex has a 3.4 kernel and runs 4.4.2
Now please understand that Google simply ditched us for reasons other than TI stopped developing SOC bla bla bla.
akash3656 said:
You could all complain about TI stopping development and blaming them. The Google Glass uses a not to different TI SOC compared to the GNex has a 3.4 kernel and runs 4.4.2
Now please understand that Google simply ditched us for reasons other than TI stopped developing SOC bla bla bla.
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Plus if they didn't drop support after two years android would have alot more bugs in general.
DR3W5K1 said:
Plus if they didn't drop support after two years android would have alot more bugs in general.
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I don't get your logic. And its not like 4.3 is flawless. HD video playback on this device (GNex) lags.
+ if Google themselves show a bad example to OEMs on how long to update devices, expect OEMs to not update devices older than a year. And this makes the whole "android doesn't get timely updates" into a new issue where "android doesn't get updates after a year+ at best".
GNex will never die!
(3.5 yrs going strong bby, and thanks to vanir+dirtyv f2fs running better than ever)
latenightchameleon said:
GNex will never die!
(3.5 yrs going strong bby, and thanks to vanir+dirtyv f2fs running better than ever)
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Indeed. There will likely be somebody out there building from the latest source for this device as long as it's possible to do so, and possibly even if it isn't.
akash3656 said:
Now please understand that Google simply ditched us for reasons other than TI stopped developing SOC
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Out of curiosity, what would those reasons be?
jsage said:
Out of curiosity, what would those reasons be?
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That's up for you to imagine....
Money, profit, greed? You pick which one. Or make your own reasons.
akash3656 said:
That's up for you to imagine....
Money, profit, greed? You pick which one. Or make your own reasons.
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Well, I guess when simple facts aren't sufficient then fantasy must be more believable.
wow
some of these replies were brutal, sheesh
gray bishop said:
some of these replies were brutal, sheesh
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Honest perhaps. It's pretty simple really. The new OS (4.4) has a new kernel. The new kernel requires new drivers. Neither TI (OMAP SoC) nor ImgTec (PowerVR GPU) will supply those drivers.
Yes, an engineer at TI "released" a blob last fall. But it was not release-quality, it was beta-quality. Not everything is a conspiracy; we've just reached the end of the official support road.
On the other hand if one is inclined to run on the bleeding edge and stability is not their primary concern, there are any number of KitKat custom ROMs in which one can indulge.
have a great evening,
john
jsage said:
Honest perhaps. It's pretty simple really. The new OS (4.4) has a new kernel. The new kernel requires new drivers. Neither TI (OMAP SoC) nor ImgTec (PowerVR GPU) will supply those drivers.
Yes, an engineer at TI "released" a blob last fall. But it was not release-quality, it was beta-quality. Not everything is a conspiracy; we've just reached the end of the official support road.
On the other hand if one is inclined to run on the bleeding edge and stability is not their primary concern, there are any number of KitKat custom ROMs in which one can indulge.
have a great evening,
john
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Ah crap I didn't mean to thank you. Anyway, yea sure remember all those OEMs you blame and all have given everything you've said to a certain product. GOOGLE GLASS. And go and check what SOC Google Glass uses.
Now have fun.