Develop Bugs

Who is planning to stick with WinMo7?

I made this poll last time, but this was around when the news of WP7 was just getting out. I'm sure that from then and now, we've learned a lot more about the OS and MS has released a lot more info regarding the OS. So with that being said, I was just curious to see if there were any change of hearts.
Vote on!

I plan on buying a windows phone whenever some nice looking hardware comes to Verizon. I might have to wait a while since ill have to buy one at full price because my upgrade isn't until 2012.

Never will I ever choose anything besides Windows 7 or their webcam for my products.
Ad notifications? What kind of nonsense is this?
And here is the real nail in the coffin:
"At launch, Windows Phone 7 will not have the ability to cut, copy, and paste. It will recognize telephone numbers and addresses, but Microsoft says the majority of users don't need 'cut, copy, and paste'."
With that attitude, do I trust this company for phones? No. The iPhone 2G had more features than this!
I hope they die in the mobile arena. Their efforts have been haphazard and poor. If it does turn out to be good (doubtful since I've used Windows Mobile since the Blackjack) I don't see anything it offers that Android or iPhone doesn't already do, and better.
Fun phones are the iPhone and Android systems. They're also very good for work as well.
Blackberry handles business as usual.
And Microsoft, your best move was investing in Apple.

Dratini said:
Never will I ever choose anything besides Windows 7 or their webcam for my products.
Ad notifications? What kind of nonsense is this?
And here is the real nail in the coffin:
"At launch, Windows Phone 7 will not have the ability to cut, copy, and paste. It will recognize telephone numbers and addresses, but Microsoft says the majority of users don't need 'cut, copy, and paste'."
With that attitude, do I trust this company for phones? No. The iPhone 2G had more features than this!
I hope they die in the mobile arena. Their efforts have been haphazard and poor. If it does turn out to be good (doubtful since I've used Windows Mobile since the Blackjack) I don't see anything it offers that Android or iPhone doesn't already do, and better.
Fun phones are the iPhone and Android systems. They're also very good for work as well.
Blackberry handles business as usual.
And Microsoft, your best move was investing in Apple.
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Sounds like a guy who is been around for a long time !!?. I respect your opinion but it is windows mobile what made this forum what it is today. So let it die?
It depends what kind of user you are, I have always been a fan of windows because its customizable, what is for me an added value. Now with the coming of mobile7, I dont know, but I´m sure we can support and make the OS better around here.
Iphone is in my opinion a hyped phone (especially the iphone4) and clearly is not as good as the previous versions because of its hardware malfunction.
Respecting Andriod, I like the phones and they are great but still I´m staying old fashioned and try and stick to WinMo.
As you can notice I will buy a phone with the new OS because I´m just curious and its flawless integrated with windows platforms in private and corporate perspective. What i believe is the advantage of Microsoft software.

I will buy a WP7 device in Germany as soon a device similar to the HD2 is released. For me are a display around 4 inch, arround 448 MB RAM, at least 16GB flash memory important. An amoled display is prefered.
Why WP7? As a developer I have with Silverlight much more fun and I have no fun to flash my device regularry to get the rom to a quality level that should be out of box. Is's a shame but big thanks to this board for making the good HD2 roms

Just waiting on what T-Mobile USA will bring us

Dratini said:
With that attitude, do I trust this company for phones? No. The iPhone 2G had more features than this!
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Sure it did.
Main difference between WP7 and other mobile OSes, that it is being complex. iOS has just core stuff - kernel, some core APIs and few built-in apps like mail or safari. Android adds some wannabe support for integrating facebook, today widgets. WP7 comes as latest one with around 2 year development as of now, including full facebook integration at launch, combining and integrating your contacts into facebook. This was just an example, that WP7 is way more complex system, than any other mobile OS we have now. It allows integration into hubs, ... while all you can do on iOS is just add your icon on app launcher. No integration into core apps.
Also the biggest fun will begin shortly. Possibility to develop for PC-Xbox360-WP7 with one source code (and just optimizing user input for mouse, joystick or touchscreen) is f...in promising. And Silverlight, C# and XNA are awesome to play and create with, compared to native coding.
I will be getting WP7 as soon as I get the opportunity. Love the UI (I'd just say more colors into icons in the applist). Love the possibilities. Love MS!

OndraSter said:
Sure it did.
Main difference between WP7 and other mobile OSes, that it is being complex. iOS has just core stuff - kernel, some core APIs and few built-in apps like mail or safari. Android adds some wannabe support for integrating facebook, today widgets. WP7 comes as latest one with around 2 year development as of now, including full facebook integration at launch, combining and integrating your contacts into facebook. This was just an example, that WP7 is way more complex system, than any other mobile OS we have now. It allows integration into hubs, ... while all you can do on iOS is just add your icon on app launcher. No integration into core apps.
Also the biggest fun will begin shortly. Possibility to develop for PC-Xbox360-WP7 with one source code (and just optimizing user input for mouse, joystick or touchscreen) is f...in promising. And Silverlight, C# and XNA are awesome to play and create with, compared to native coding.
I will be getting WP7 as soon as I get the opportunity. Love the UI (I'd just say more colors into icons in the applist). Love the possibilities. Love MS!
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what?!!
xbox-wp7-pc game integration is a possibility? but how is a phone going to be as capable as the three cores plus graphics core of a 360?

As soon as Sprint gets a killer 4G enabled one. Bamn! I'm there.
Gota get on the leading edge again and start promoting the thing to my friends/family/co-workers/etc.

theomni said:
what?!!
xbox-wp7-pc game integration is a possibility? but how is a phone going to be as capable as the three cores plus graphics core of a 360?
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First of all, WP7 has a lower target resolution than XBox and PCs. You also can use a lower resolution than the native resolution of WP7 and the phone will resize the image "for free" using a dedicated chip. To target the different input formats, you have to tweak the code and use conditional compilation (like #If Xbox; #If WP7; #If Windows). If you want to utilize the full potential of each platform, there may be many conditional compilation instructions, but it is possible. Depending on the architecture, the main game logic can remain the same and does not need (many) changes.

Ima stick with it. WP7 is nice.

Yep, just as Reihnold described it.
The main logic and core is the same, you just optimalize it for different input and ofc slower HW (but with coming Hummingbird etc we will see reaching Xbox on WVGA screen in few years I bet). You disable some cool effects etc, but you do that with those #If Xbox360 fxRainbow.Enable = true; #Endif etc, so nothing huge. Compared to Linux-Android it is something quite easy. Mostly because of awesome IDE.

Wouldn't consider anything else.

I will definitely buy one. Love MS products and services and using them all integrated on my phone is the biggest thing they could ever made!
Cloud is the future

I'd be more interested to know what percentage of people would switch to wp7 in an iphone and/or android forum really. That to me is a better indicator of how well wp7 will do at launch.

I eventually want to switch, but ill do it further down the line when the OS matures.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

I voted for sticking with WP7, all the latest videos I've seen show how super smooth it is so I wont be switching to clunky Andriod anytime soon

I am waiting to actually see how well the office, RDP and other apps integrate into windows before I pull the trigger on one. I really could care less about facebook integration or twitter or any social networking. Sure I use facebook, but I want to keep my contacts seperate from my social networking. I want a business device first. Not to say I won't try one out, but I intend on keeping my Tilt2 around unless they release a WM6.5 handset with a keyboard and a faster processor and more RAM! like that will happen...
And if it comes to switching platforms, android is next in line. No apple products ever in my house.

kdj67f said:
No apple products ever in my house.
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I second that

I am so ready to purchase one of Windows Phone 7 phones! Why? please... for those ppl who say WP7 is not as great as their beloved WM 6 series, you gotta let your ego go. And yes, i have HD2. So this is a customer with experiences with hacking my device and use cooked ROMs. And yes i hate using cooked ROMs. Althogh i use cooked ROMs that looks like stock version atm. But i am planning to purchase it in this holiday or wait for htc to announce HD3 the beast! I really want my phone to have 1.5ghz or something downgraded clocked duo cpu.

Won't there ever be a Windows Phone 7 Lite ROM?

I was just curious to know this from a long time.
Will there ever be a Lite Windows Phone 7 ROM for phones that are lesser than 1GB processor.
If so, what are some of the things we might have to sacrifice??
Just a question and a no offence to any1...
Thanx...healthy arguments are welcome...

Your beloved X1 or any other non-snapdragon phone doesn't meet requirements, the processor simply isn't capable of running it on instruction level, it requires ARMv7 processor, while all other <Snapdragon are ARMv6 only capable (WM requires ARMv4i).

OndraSter said:
Your beloved X1 or any other non-snapdragon phone doesn't meet requirements, the processor simply isn't capable of running it on instruction level, it requires ARMv7 processor, while all other <Snapdragon are ARMv6 only capable (WM requires ARMv4i).
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Thanx al ot for ur reply..I got it...no WinPhone 7 for me....
BUt how about a Lite ROM???
Minus a few things mayb....its the famous game of 'wait and watch'

WP7 IS Lite, the only thing you could remove is all 3D animations and such, which probably would require deep changes in the core which also probably would break compatibility with all WP7 Apps. You would also need to recompile the OS for versions lower than ARMv7, which would require the source code, which only Microsoft have. Microsoft know exactly what they are doing so they wont open support for old crap devices. There is a reason that they broke backwards capability.
TL;DR: Get a new phone instead, there will never be a "lite" ROM of this.

Sir. Haxalot said:
WP7 IS Lite, the only thing you could remove is all 3D animations and such, which probably would require deep changes in the core which also probably would break compatibility with all WP7 Apps. You would also need to recompile the OS for versions lower than ARMv7, which would require the source code, which only Microsoft have. Microsoft know exactly what they are doing so they wont open support for old crap devices. There is a reason that they broke backwards capability.
TL;DR: Get a new phone instead, there will never be a "lite" ROM of this.
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Sigh...
Sad but true. Thanx anyways...its a lil bit like IE9 not being compatible with XP....

Such a ROM would be instantly banned from XBox Live, etc. when you try to connect. Microsoft already has the infrastructure in place to do it. I would be a dumb phone with a cute UI, basically.
Same goes for WP7 ROMs ported to other devices.

circleofomega said:
i was just curious to know this from a long time.
Will there ever be a lite windows phone 7 rom for phones that are lesser than 1gb processor.
If so, what are some of the things we might have to sacrifice??
Just a question and a no offence to any1...
Thanx...healthy arguments are welcome...
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Click to collapse
ha ha ha ha no never ever ever !!!!! Supporting devices slower than 1ghz was why windows mobile was introuble in the first place they allowed their os on crappy devices!!!!! Now windows phone 7 will never be on crap phones with these new restrictions and i agree with the minimum requirements 100% go microsoft for killing low-end crap windows mobile crashboxes

Also there is no need for Microsoft to develop a Windows Phone 7 Lite for new entry-level handsets. At the moment Windows Phone 7 is used only in high-end handsets, because of the strict hardware-requirements. But with time, this hardware will become cheaper and therefore Windows Phone 7 will be available in entry-level handsets. I guess you can get a WP7 device for 200€ instead of the current 500€ in two year.

What does 'entry level handset' mean?

circleofomega said:
What does 'entry level handset' mean?
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A phone that is cheap to buy, unlike the current phones (200 with 2 year contract)

desolateone1 said:
A phone that is cheap to buy, unlike the current phones (200 with 2 year contract)
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getting my hd7 for 100 with corporate discount. Is that entry level enough?!?

Well Folks
What say
http://www.unwiredview.com/2010/04/...e-launched-in-india-other-developing-markets/
http://www.tech-exclusive.com/microsoft-to-launch-cheap-windows-phone-7-in-india/

Why Windows Phone 7 doesn't desperately need more powerful devices this year

I take no credit for this, ita a great article i came across that made the most sense in a while related to hardware :
http://www.mobiletechworld.com/2011...erately-need-more-powerful-devices-this-year/
As you have probably already noticed I was at Mobile World Congress this week so I had the opportunity to play around with some of the latest and most powerful handsets ever created. This year was obviously dominated by Google’s Android platform which took center stage at the convention with essentially every OEMs demonstrating or unveiling products running the immensely successful OS. What does it have to do with Windows Phone 7 hardware ? Well if there’s one thing that really garbed my attention it is the fact that not a single Android device I played with was as snappy and smooth as the Samsung Omnia 7 device I had in my pocket (or any iPhone model). Yes some of the devices on display were running non finalized software and probably hardware too but this has already been the case with retail devices like the Galaxy S and Desire HD which feature more powerful hardware than all the currently released WP7 devices.
I will repeat what I have been saying for a while: Android is the new Windows Mobile. OEMs want to differentiate their the products and one of the best way to do this is to use the latest and greatest chipsets, screen technology or other fancy hardware components. But as an end user, why should I care about the newest Exynos 4210, TI OMAP 4430, Tegra 2 if it can’t provide me with the same user experience as the now nearly 3 years old QSD8250 found in my Windows Phone 7 device? Similar to the old Windows Mobile days; OEMs are using Android’s “openness” as a test bed for their new CPUs and chipsets and are pumping out devices with crazy hardware specifications to show themselves in the press and sell device purely based on check list features: Dual-Core CPU ? Check. XX Mpix camera ? Check. 3D Cameras? Check. Huge Screen? Check etc. The issue here is that device manufacturers are more interested in time to market so optimizing the software to work with the hardware is just an afterthought. It’s not Google’s job to code the driver for the Samsung Exynos or for TI’s OMAP4. Google doesn’t even want to get the browser to use GPU acceleration for smoother scrolling and panning so the device manufacturers shouldn’t even count on the big G to give them any kind meaningful help in this department (Samsung has apparently implemented GPU acceleration to the browser in some unreleased Galaxy S firmware builds).
HTC has apparently learned the lesson a long time ago and has instead decided to milk the same SoC for while and instead just improve it’s Sense software layer every time it releases a new batch of devices. The end user is in both cases being presented with less than optimal solutions / offerings: On one hand you have new hardware that goes totally unused (Samsung, LG) and on the other you are buying exactly the same hardware but with an updated software layer (HTC).
Now let’s go back to Windows Phone 7 for minute. Take a Google Nexus One/ HTC Desire and compare it to the similarly speced WP7 devices. Which one is the snappiest and offers the smoothest UX? Same for the HTC HD2 running WM6.5 compared to the same device running Windows Phone 7. Microsoft has several big advantage with WP7 compared to Android. First, the have enforced strict HW guidelines and are currently only supporting Qualcomm’s Snapdragon SoCs and their Adreno GPUs. Secondly the Adreno GPUs are closely related to the Xenos GPU found in the Xbox360 so the company was already quite a bit familiar with architecture. Thirdly they control the APIs (Direct3D Mobile through DXGI and probably Direct2D for IE9 Mobile) unlike Android which relies on OpenGL ES and the drivers developed by the chipset manufacturers. The Windows Phone 7 ecosystem is like a console ecosystem with one set of drivers and APIs all controlled and certified by Microsoft while Android is more like a PC ecosystem filled with tons of different hardware configurations, driver versions controlled by nobody (Qualcomm even told me that OEMs don’t really bother including the latest drivers in the devices just because they are more concerned by the shipping date of the handset than with the end user experience. For example, as of right now the SE Xperia Play is the Android handset that has the latest Adreno 205 drivers).
Who would have thought that Microsoft would be able to easily port IE9 (which requires a DX10 GPU on the desktop) to Windows Phone 7 which only runs on a relatively old Adreno 200 GPU (DX9 capable) ins such a short time? Now take a look at the current state of the Webkit on Android: Yes it’s blazing fast at loading web pages on those super powerful handsets but after that the UX is simply anticlimactic because of the lack of HW acceleration. This is supposed to be fixed in Honeycomb on the tablets right? But where’s the smartphone version? From what I have seen at MWC the touch responsiveness of the Android 3.0 tablets varies greatly from one device maker to another. So once again Google’s lack of control of the hardware and drivers is going to hurt the end user.
This is not to say that Windows Phone 7 should be stuck with the current QSD8250. New high-end WP7 devices are going to be announced later this year because technology evolves at a rapid pace and Microsoft will obviously want to support higher resolution screens and video formats (and yes they are working on new Chassis but the Nokia partnership which was decided only last Thursday changed some of the plans), more graphically intensive 3D games and applications but the point here is that they are in no rush to do this because they can squeeze a lot more out of the first generation Snapdragon SoC than what is possible with Android. Everything I just said so far also applies to Apple’s iPhone which is quite similar to Windows Phone 7 and I personally think that there’s no need for Apple to switch to a dual-core SoC for the upcoming iPhone 5 given that the A4 is still powerful enough for 99% of the tasks (but if they do then you can be sure that they will have the software to take advantage of it). Android is obviously a really great OS that I enjoy using it on a daily basis thanks to all the features it supports but Google should really stop the madness and take over control of what should or shouldn’t be done on the platform. OEMs are loving it right now because they are free to do whatever they see fit but I really think that it will hurt the platform in the long run when people start to realise that they paying for hardware that most of the time isn’t used all or just paying for a software update (HTC..).
What Windows Phone 7 is in desperate need of is software updates filled with differentiating features and thrid-party access to more APIs so they developers can create more exciting and advanced applications.
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Discuss...

Pretty much the facts.... I mean that is just an astounding article... spot on.

As an Android user who is otherwise impartial to OS wars, I wholeheartedly agree. For months now, I've been telling people that Android reminds me of the old Windows Mobile. Every WM7 device I have ever played with has exhibited exemplary smoothness and snappyness compared to any Android handset you care to name. It's a shame because Android is really good otherwise.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

IMO, although it would be nice to have, WP7 doesnt have to go overboard like Android is doing when it comes to specs as to dual core cpu's, 3d displays and such. I believe that they should improve hardware based on features such as front facing camera to add video chat functinality, perhaps a video output via 3.5mm jack (since requiring hdmi might be pushing it a little across all oem's) etc.
Im positive that if they bump up the cpu to support at least second gen snapdragon with its 45nm architecture, improved 205 Adreno GPU and much faster clock per clock compared to first gen, i have no doubt that besides the inmensly graphical stressing situations, WP7 would run circles round any dual core Android device since it being used to its full potential and proper optimization and drivers makes it not have a elephant on its back to carry

I think it is a given that we will eventually see more powerful Qualcomm SoCs show up in WP7 devices, and possibly other manufacturers' SoCs. This generation might become the "budget" chassis in 2012...Who knows?
What I do like, and want it to remain the same, is the fact that Microsoft needs to certify whatever hardware specs is used, so when updates are pushed out, Microsoft wouldn't need to run to each manufacturer and ask for drivers...

I'm sold where can I buy one? I kid, I kid. I have a Focus.
One thing is for sure, the overall opinion of the phone UI is excellent for all the listed reasons. Thanks for the post.
I compare this current experience to my experience with Windows 7 rc. Much like the day I installed Windows 7 to my lowly Dual Core (e2150, 2gb, 7200 HDD), it was good but not great in terms of speed, quick but not fast. Then, the cycle moved on and new hardware at low prices came into my life...
Now at Quad Core, 8 gb, Dual GPU, SSD, it is like driving a Buggati Veyron, downhill, on a 5 lane speedway, with no traffic. Life is instantaneous, the only limit...my ability to click as fast as it acts. ha! It happens as if I had on a thinking helmet and it sucked the idea out of my head!
I can only imagine wp7 on the set of phones that will come out...8 months...1 to 2 years from today...oh yeaaaaaa
close your eyes, think about it. Did you think about it? Think again, that's right. Amazing.
Wasn't that nice? Ahhhh yeaaaaaa
With dual core and a 2x faster GPU...oh my...it will get smoother and faster...hard to imagine and exciting at the same time. :splooge:
All in due time, I am happy with my phone today and happily have put my development time into other projects and not Wm6.5. Like this one from Johnny http://hackaday.com/2011/02/09/low-cost-video-chat-robot/

The current WP7 devices are fine. Just make sure you get one with 16G Storage and 512+ RAM or hope you're gonna be lucky enough to find a big SD Card that works well the first time. Data loss due to a bad/incompatible SD Card months down the line is... Unfun!
I want my next phone to have the IBM Watson OS

I don't really expect to see WP7 handsets with faster processors. It isn't needed. Every app or game being made will be aiming for a certain minimum standard.
I do see improvements coming in extra features (like a front facing camera). And I do expect to see handsets with more and more memory.
If the end of 2011 brought WP7 devices with the current processor, but also offered 768 MB RAM, 32 GB storage and a front facing camera, that would be one hell of a competitive device.
Then in the holiday of 2012 we could see WP8 push the hardware limits by launching with some really high minimum specs. But at the same time, still support WP7 for "budget" handsets.

They need sexier devices. I must admit the three buttons on the front do look classy.

Reflexx1 said:
I don't really expect to see WP7 handsets with faster processors. It isn't needed. Every app or game being made will be aiming for a certain minimum standard.
I do see improvements coming in extra features (like a front facing camera). And I do expect to see handsets with more and more memory.
If the end of 2011 brought WP7 devices with the current processor, but also offered 768 MB RAM, 32 GB storage and a front facing camera, that would be one hell of a competitive device.
Then in the holiday of 2012 we could see WP8 push the hardware limits by launching with some really high minimum specs. But at the same time, still support WP7 for "budget" handsets.
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The minimum specs must be maintained and they must be maintained at a level that ensures user experience will not be compromised for people who bought launch devices. In the holiday season of 2012 people will still be stuck on contract with current devices, probably for months to come.
All of a sudden apps will be updated in a way that their phones will choke running these apps.
Just upping the minimum specs because you think it sounds cute is a dumb idea. I doubt Microsoft will do it, and if they do, people will sort of laugh at them and they will lose a ton of customers. By then RIM will have QNX Blackberries and WebOS may be well-developed. There will be even more choices than we have today...
They really have to take an "Apple" approach to hardware support, IMO. It's the only thing that makes sense sort of overspeccing your devices and enticing a bunch of geeks to upgrade their phones every year for major software updates/bug fixes every 9 months to a year.

Yeah but is it partially due to room? I mean, Sense ROMs running slower than the cleaned up and simpler AOSP ROMs? I get the lack of acceleration ... a d understand the end result and why people might complain ... but my phone is snappy even though at times I notice slow down .. but that is hardly reason to ignore stability updates, even others. I mean , while my phone might be running smooth here ... it may slow down there. I see the choppy scroll .. but I've seen friends WP7 - uh, phones? - slow down at times too.
I get sick of this WP7 is constantly butter because its not. More often than not? Sure. But I rarely get agitated at the speed of mu device and most don't either ... sure I can see it, but I've also seen my.phone jump as much as my friends WP7 devices. It all depends. Overall, sure ... but it still doesnt touch iOS. To think you are major steps ahead is hype. More overhead here .... lack of acceleration here ... it's not shocking when you think about it. Android uses more resources and overhead ... you have such q standardized system. Its almost not surprising. And it's NOT suggestive of you being "good" at the moment.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

That's a great article. I agree 100%. I had a Samsung Galaxy S and with it's freshest time it had the most powerful chips int the markets, but even today it is not lag free, because of crappy Samsung optimizations to the software. That's why I really don't believe the new Galaxy S II will be any better with it's dual core. You could see it from the videos, that it's laggy at the moment and I don't believe Samsung will get it lag free ever.

fast hardware = bad ?
this smacks of hardware envy something terrible.
surrrrre, android + quad cores will suck... but wp8 will be perfect. whatever, if ever.

N8ter said:
The current WP7 devices are fine. Just make sure you get one with 16G Storage and 512+ RAM or hope you're gonna be lucky enough to find a big SD Card that works well the first time. Data loss due to a bad/incompatible SD Card months down the line is... Unfun!
I want my next phone to have the IBM Watson OS
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Why is 512+ RAM important, I was thing about getting the HTC 7 Pro, which only has 448 RAM and also is 16gb necessary if I don't use my phone as a media player as HTC 7 Pro only has 8gb as well?

Beesneazy, you're either completely full of crap or just delusional. I mean wow. Android fanboyism at its ugliest. Yeesh.
Ohgood, did you read the article? If you did, perhaps it's time to go back to Hooked on Phonics to work on word comprehension...
Anyhow, on topic, I completely agree with the article posted by OP. Kiddies like these Android fanboys love to deny the truth but it is what it is. Did everyone really think Microsoft would just sit back and be pummeled in the mobile phone market forever? With the right moves in the future WP7 will be huge. Maybe knock Android back down to third or fourth place and setup a head to head with iOS...
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express

ohgood said:
this smacks of hardware envy something terrible.
surrrrre, android + quad cores will suck... but wp8 will be perfect. whatever, if ever.
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Yes, and when you get your quad core phones that are still lagging, and still dont recieve the latest updates, and are still running a version of android that is essentially a pallet swap of 2.1 and still looks like a low end iphone we'll be happy with our maybe dual or maybe quad-core phones that run smoother, have better games (because aside from iphone ports and maybe 1-2 other games androids selection is just terrible), have a decent media player, have oustanding integration with business and personal matters, and we'll actually have a NEW OS not just an overhyped pallet swap of the previous version.

Fact WP7 will never catch Android or IOS.
Sure WP7 is nice. Serious competitor, nope.
Think realistic and remove your love affair. Maybe WP7 can be 5th place or if things go well 4th place.
Now flame on.

N8ter said:
The minimum specs must be maintained and they must be maintained at a level that ensures user experience will not be compromised for people who bought launch devices. In the holiday season of 2012 people will still be stuck on contract with current devices, probably for months to come.
All of a sudden apps will be updated in a way that their phones will choke running these apps.
Just upping the minimum specs because you think it sounds cute is a dumb idea. I doubt Microsoft will do it, and if they do, people will sort of laugh at them and they will lose a ton of customers. By then RIM will have QNX Blackberries and WebOS may be well-developed. There will be even more choices than we have today...
They really have to take an "Apple" approach to hardware support, IMO. It's the only thing that makes sense sort of overspeccing your devices and enticing a bunch of geeks to upgrade their phones every year for major software updates/bug fixes every 9 months to a year.
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I'm not sure what you're attempting to address when you quoted me. I never mentioned changing the minimum specs of WP7.
And I think it's pretty much guaranteed that WP8 will have a completely different set of minimum specs. Do you expect it to never change?

vetvito said:
They need sexier devices. I must admit the three buttons on the front do look classy.
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Exactly! I agree they don't need more powerful devices but they do need more appealing hardware (for a start a 32GB device would do no harm).
vetvito said:
Fact WP7 will never catch Android or IOS.
Sure WP7 is nice. Serious competitor, nope.
Think realistic and remove your love affair. Maybe WP7 can be 5th place or if things go well 4th place.
Now flame on.
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Sad but true. WP7 is quite late and if you think about it the real launch will be with Nokia, I doubt they'll sell anything before that as nothing has changed since October.

vetvito said:
Fact WP7 will never catch Android or IOS.
Sure WP7 is nice. Serious competitor, nope.
Think realistic and remove your love affair. Maybe WP7 can be 5th place or if things go well 4th place.
Now flame on.
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Click to collapse
this is true only because the majority of cellphone owners are complete morons.

[Believable or not?] Windows Phone 8 is not supported by current Windows Phone Gens

http://wmpoweruser.com/german-busin...te-for-current-handsets-to-settle-for-wp-7-7/
The German Business Week ‘(WiWo), claiming sources from Microsoft and Nokia, has confirmed that Windows Phone 8 will not be coming to the current generation of Windows Phones.
These handsets will recieve a stripped down version of Windows Phone 8 which may be called Windows Phone 7.6 or 7.7.
The publication reports ”An update is not technically possible because Windows Mobile 8 <-- WUT? uses different chip sets.”
Microsoft apparently expects current Windows Phone users to be happy with this solution, with a Microsoft manager quoted as saying: ”If people have the same functions on their smartphones, they do not care what version number the operating system is.”
Microsoft has previously alluded to Apple forcing customers to buy new handsets by releasing updates which slow down their current phones, so this solution appears to have been in the works for some time.
What do our readers think of this (likely) solution? Let us know below.
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Joe Beofiore or Scott Gu hasn't said a word, we will have to wait.
But believable or not? I don't think so, Microsoft used to confirmed that Windows Phone 8 will come to all 2nd Gen Devices.
Your Opinion?

Doesn't matter , I'm getting a Apollo device. I heard current devices would be getting WP 7.7 or 7.6 anyways , stripped down Apollo
Bye bye Zune, hello Xbox Music.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

^
Do you have any info for the XBOX Music and the Application that we are going to control the Music in Windows 8?
The current Music App in Windows 8 is pretty bad, lacks of customization like Zune and got all of my Singer wrong Bio.

anybody Who writes about Windows Phone and calls it "Windows Mobile" is not worth trust! Windows Mobile is the past, and Windows Phone is now!

Strike_Eagle said:
^
Do you have any info for the XBOX Music and the Application that we are going to control the Music in Windows 8?
The current Music App in Windows 8 is pretty bad, lacks of customization like Zune and got all of my Singer wrong Bio.
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Click to collapse
Its preview, so its not complete. I haven't updated to latest preview yet, so I have no idea if it has gotten better.
The Music app now is basically the one from the 360. I hope it gets better, and I also hope we won't have to download additional software for syncing the phones.
Edit
http://m.zdnet.com/blog/mobile-gadgeteer/goodbye-zune-hello-xbox-music/5803
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As what was shown at E3 for Xbox Music, the Nokia Lumia 800 is running the same interface as the Xbox and Windows 8. So it is unlikely that it will be a separate app, otherwise it will end up like Spotify or iHeartRadio.
It is likely that Microsoft will update current windows phones to replace its current Zune branding, and maybe make it compatible with windows 8 synchronization. Or there is still hope that Windows Phone 8 will come to current windows phone devices.

We need a Apollo thread. I'm certain apps like these will come over faster with native coding
http://m.networkworld.com/news/2012/060612-microsoft-onx-259898.html?hpg1=bn
Its basically MS version of tasker
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Dinchy87 said:
anybody Who writes about Windows Phone and calls it "Windows Mobile" is not worth trust! Windows Mobile is the past, and Windows Phone is now!
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Click to collapse
Google translate screwed up, the source says windows phone

Well, I would agree it is the same if WP7 would share the same attribute as WP8, like native API and WP8 apps compatibility.
Otherwise what he said same experience is simply not about right, at least the background run, launch speed and performance are not the same as WP8 with same hardware.

Can't believe that Nokia and MS don't support at least the second gen devices! And there were at least enough rumours for the other way round.
And technically speaking, it should be possible as Windows Phone 8 is pretty likely to support ARM like Windows 8 itself! The "incompatible chipset stuff" is just rubbish in my eyes!
Well, new handsets will feature new hardware and more capabilities but in the end I' pretty sure that they will make also low-end WP8 device with pretty much the same specs as current high-end WP7 device!

read the original article:
http://blog.wiwo.de/look-at-it/2012...-losung-fur-update-problem-bei-windows-phone/
this guy has no proof at all. he says he heard it from 2 sources (which of course are not named, he has no evidence etc.) and he names some unknown "microsoft manager" who told him some stuff.
also "An update is not technically possible because Windows Phone 8 uses different chipsets." is a pretty lame statement. When I can compile my linux kernels to run on different architectures I would think that MS can do this too.

drill_sarge said:
also "An update is not technically possible because Windows Phone 8 uses different chipsets." is a pretty lame statement. When I can compile my linux kernels to run on different architectures I would think that MS can do this too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lumia 900 is heard to get an Upgrade but Lumia 800 wont (Nokia Online Helpdesk http://wparea.de/2012/06/nokia-care-das-lumia-900-wird-ein-update-auf-wp8-apollo-erhalten/). The only difference between these devices is that the chipset of the 900 supports LTE. So according to the rest of the hardware (Single Core Snapdragon S2, ARMv7) the 800 should support WP8, as all other phones should, too.

Well that's bad news for me; I have a first gen HTC Trophy; I doubt I will get the Apollo update after reading this, Oh well.

Hmm, sounds like crap if you ask me, different chipsets? presumably it still means ARM and we're not all going to go all x86.
I think its safe to say, that WP8 will get released to new hardware, it will have many new swanky features.
Said swankiness will filter down through current win 7 devices IF said feature is available on the device.
I think that's a fair thing to expect. To say we are not getting WP8 is perhaps a bit misleading though, more accurately is that we will get updates that our devices can support.
All in all I am sure we can be confidant that we will get some form of update, without a list of WP8 specs its difficult to say how much of it we can expect to receive.

Should know on the 20th
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Do or die
The Windows Phone 8 release on 20th would be just a proof of concept device, if there is a presentation at all.
However it will spark the rumour mills and as always, Microsoft will leave out enough info to make us all keep wondering. In a way it creates a sense of suspense which will help make the phone more visible on the internet with lots of people speculating stuff. Would be a smart move to do so IMO.
That said, if they don't support WP8 on 900, people will hate them. If they support it, then there is no real reason not to support 800, 710 and the other second gens. Microsoft will not leave the lower end market out (tango), hence first gen has a great chance if 610 has a chance.
After all, Microsoft doesn't want to lose what little they have so soon.

According to a Tweet by MS_Nerd (one of those notoriously unreliable leakers) Microsoft will bring 2 OSs going forward.
The one which the Business Week called WP7.6 oder 7.7 is going to be named WP8, still based on the CE-Kernel and likely to include most of the features that the NT-Version is going to bring along.
The one which Business Week called WP8 is to be named Windows RT phone (as it is based on Windows RT - the Windows 8 version that is running ARM).
So we most likely will get WP8 with most of the features, but Microsoft introduces a new version for High End Phones including Multi Core support. WP8 will live on for the mid- to low-range Market.
At least that is what we can puzzle together if those 2 leaks are to be confirmed. Although it was pretty clear from the beginning that old devices would be missing out on some features when WP8 came along due to missing processing power/memory.

I don't think that MS would want to keep two different WP versions that have different kernel. Too much code to take care of IMHO.

Well I really hope that Windows Phone 8 will be way diffrent than WP now. Hopefully an opption to ad a start screen wallpaper instead of just the lame old lock screen wallpaper. Also I hope they let us have an unlocked file system so that we could browse our files instead of this BS where we have to use Zune currently. In other words hopefully the new WP will save us from the current one like Windows 7 saved us from Vista.

Tiles that can change sizes
Folders
Tiles with real information instead of badges, ie the missed call, and email tile will show real information
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Ubuntu for smartphone!!! Could this be ported to Note II ?

http://www.androidpolice.com/2013/0...on-of-its-os-just-for-your-pocket-superphone/
It seems they are going to release images for Galaxy nexus. lets hope this can be ported soon to Note II when they release it.
Press Release:
Ubuntu comes to the phone, with a beautifully distilled interface and a unique full PC capability when docked
· Leading open PC platform with huge global following announces mobile version for network operators, OEMs and silicon vendors
· Fast, beautiful interface for entry level smartphones
· Unique PC experience on superphones when docked with a monitor, keyboard and mouse
· Ubuntu raises the bar for mobile UI design, for richer and more immersive apps
· A single OS for phone, PC and TV
London, UK, 2 January, 2013: Canonical today announced a distinctive smartphone interface for its popular operating system, Ubuntu, using all four edges of the screen for a more immersive experience. Ubuntu uniquely gives handset OEMs and mobile operators the ability to converge phone, PC and thin client into a single enterprise superphone.
"We expect Ubuntu to be popular in the enterprise market, enabling customers to provision a single secure device for all PC, thin client and phone functions. Ubuntu is already the most widely used Linux enterprise desktop, with customers in a wide range of sectors focused on security, cost and manageability" said Jane Silber, CEO of Canonical. "We also see an opportunity in basic smartphones that are used for the phone, SMS, web and email, where Ubuntu outperforms thanks to its native core apps and stylish presentation."
Ubuntu is aimed at two core mobile segments: the high-end superphone, and the entry-level basic smartphone, helping operators grow the use of data amongst consumers who typically use only the phone and messaging but who might embrace the use of web and email on their phone. Ubuntu also appeals to aspirational prosumers who want a fresh experience with faster, richer performance on a lower bill-of-materials device.
The handset interface for Ubuntu introduces distinctive new user experiences to the mobile market, including:
1. Edge magic: thumb gestures from all four edges of the screen enable users to find content and switch between apps faster than other phones.
1. Deep content immersion - controls appear only when the user wants them.
2. A beautiful global search for apps, content and products.
3. Voice and text commands in any application for faster access to rich capabilities.
4. Both native and web or HTML5 apps.
5. Evolving personalised art on the welcome screen.
Ubuntu offers compelling customisation options for partner apps, content and services. Operators and OEMs can easily add their own branded offerings. Canonical's personal cloud service, Ubuntu One, provides storage and media services, file sharing and a secure transaction service which enables partners to integrate their own service offerings easily.
Canonical makes it easy to build phones with Ubuntu. The company provides engineering services to offload the complexity of maintaining multiple code bases which has proven to be a common issue for smartphone manufacturers, freeing the manufacturer to focus on hardware design and integration. For silicon vendors, Ubuntu is compatible with a typical Android Board Support Package (BSP). This means Ubuntu is ready to run on the most cost-efficient chipset designs.
In bringing Ubuntu to the phone, Canonical is uniquely placed with a single operating system for client, server and cloud, and a unified family of interfaces for the phone, the PC and the TV. "We are defining a new era of convergence in technology, with one unified operating system that underpins cloud computing, data centers, PCs and consumer electronics" says Mark Shuttleworth, founder of Ubuntu and VP Products at Canonical.
Canonical currently serves the leading PC OEMs: ASUS, Dell, HP, and Lenovo all certify the majority of their PCs on Ubuntu and pre-install it in global markets. Over 20 million desktop PCs run the OS today, and Canonical estimates that close to 10% of the world's new desktops and laptops will ship with Ubuntu in 2014. Ubuntu is also wildly popular as a server platform, the number one server OS on the key major public clouds and the leading host OS for OpenStack, the open source IAAS

Just saw this too and at the end of their 20 minute video they said that it would run with the android kernel and drivers meaning it shouldn't be hard at all to port to our current device!

This summer I saw an XDA video of a galaxy s 2 running Ubuntu for Android. It shared the same kernel and worked together with android. As soon as you connected the phone to the dock it turned into an Ubuntu os desktop pc. This is what I'm interested in. I'm not interested in using Ubuntu as my phone os. Is this what is being released by canonical? Because from the videos I saw today it seems its a new operating system.
Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2

this is a brand new OS and i really hope we can get it on the note 2 since its the top of the line phone

slekkas said:
This summer I saw an XDA video of a galaxy s 2 running Ubuntu for Android. It shared the same kernel and worked together with android. As soon as you connected the phone to the dock it turned into an Ubuntu os desktop pc. This is what I'm interested in. I'm not interested in using Ubuntu as my phone os. Is this what is being released by canonical? Because from the videos I saw today it seems its a new operating system.
Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
That was only ever available to OEM's, and I'm fairly sure none of them took it up. That's probably why Canonical have taken this route instead.

jellydroid13 said:
Just saw this too and at the end of their 20 minute video they said that it would run with the android kernel and drivers meaning it shouldn't be hard at all to port to our current device!
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Click to collapse
Thats the reason why i am so excited. Happy times ahead!!

Actuality there will be a phone released at the end of the year that uses Ubunta as an operating system. The Android Ubunta when docked system is a first step. Ubuntu will compete with all the existing phone operating systems within the next 12 months.
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It looks good in theory. As a long time Ubuntu pc user this is something exciting for me but the are few issues having this on note 2 even in the future. I am sure it will have note port down the line. But the os is heavily gesture based. And most gestures are designed to work from edges of the screen. For big device like note 2 this rules out seamless one hand passion for doing even basic things which you can still do on Android with Samsung customisations.
I understand appeal in gesture based OS, but in real world day to day use, point and click approach is most of the times faster.
But o would still like to try it out.
From my Note 2, in your face.

I had Ubuntu on my N2 with Linux Installer. Just C**p.
Edit: Damn... I just watched the Keynote. Looks pretty amazing
Pozdrav
Croatia1

With something as close to perfect as the note 2 + a few tweaks, why would anyone consider using a new mobile Os?
For the hundreds of dollars in apps I would lose, it would take the most amazing mobile os to convince me to change and right now Android does it all for me.
Sent from my Galaxy Note 2 using Tapatalk 2

The only thing that worries me is applications. If ubuntu is able to use apps for Android it world be great. But I doubt it will have access to play store.
Sent from my GT-N7100 using xda app-developers app

But if it's using Android Drivers and Kernel, would it not be possible to tweak it to allow compatibility for Android Apps? Or at the very least the possibility to dual-boot it with a Siyah (or similar) kernel, so you get the best of both worlds, who knows perhaps they will even work out some sort of deal with Google to use the Play store by the time the first Ubuntu devices hit the market

Great clip of it in action
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoXpLUr5WB4
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God, that just looks so sleek!

Man I cannot wait! Please post if you know of a way to get the ball rolling on this.

Yeah i know how to get the ball rolling....first you need a flashable image, and since that hasnt been released yet....good luck with that
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speedyjay said:
Yeah i know how to get the ball rolling....first you need a flashable image, and since that hasnt been released yet....good luck with that
Sent from my GT-N7100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I think I'm going to break my F5 key....

Therev86 said:
But if it's using Android Drivers and Kernel, would it not be possible to tweak it to allow compatibility for Android Apps? Or at the very least the possibility to dual-boot it with a Siyah (or similar) kernel, so you get the best of both worlds, who knows perhaps they will even work out some sort of deal with Google to use the Play store by the time the first Ubuntu devices hit the market
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Click to collapse
I don't think it would be in googles interest to give a competing OS a helping hand.

baileyjr said:
I don't think it would be in googles interest to give a competing OS a helping hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Next you know, Googlux is the biggest player around
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Ubuntu for note2
there are a few devs working on this port... nothing other than the interface works right now... but there's steady progress... so expect it in a month or so...