New to Evo. Questions on internals - EVO 4G Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting

New to Evo. Questions on internals - EVO 4G Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting

Hey,
I'm new to the Evo platform, coming from the Samsung Moment. I was able to successfully flash my Moment over to MetroPCS (full data) and plan to do the same with QPST\QXDM. That is not what I come to ask about however.
I was doing some reading on the various rooting guides for the evo, and it's internal structure seems very different from the Moment. I have several questions that aren't fully explained by the rooting guides. If anyone could answer these it would be very appreciated.
1) What exactly is HBoot? Yes, it's the bootloader but is it a partition on the disk or is it stored in non-flashable ROM?
2) Assuming Hboot is a partition what would happen if I were to delete it entirely, or if I were to pull the battery during an update?
3) Can the Evo actually be perma-bricked?
I ask the above three questions because with the moment it is IMPOSSIBLE to permanently brick it. The moment had something known as Download mode. This was a special boot program stored in unflashable ROM that would allow one to reformat and\or flash a ROM to main flash memory. I have corrupted the **** out of the moment to where I was unable to get into recovery or anything, but I was able to ALWAYS reapply a ROM from download mode (Sometimes I had to do a PDA format in ODIN). Is HBOOT similar to this?
4) I hear of people bricking their 4G when flashing ROMS. Apparently they lose their RSA keys. Where are these keys physically stored?
5) Why can't one simply ask sprint to generate a new key pair?
6) What are these keys "bound to"? Why can't one just take someone else's RSA keys. The phone can be sold, so they are not tied to an account. The MEID can be changed so they are obviously not bound to the MEID
7) What exactly is NAND protection and how does it prevent one from writing to cretin partitions
8) Back to the topic of HBOOT, I've read some older threads where people complained about updating and members have stated theres no way to downgrade (as of that time). Why can't one simply delete HBOOT of the flash memory and write the older copy.
I would like to understand my phone's system better. Thanks for any assistance

Finally some thought provoking questions!!!!!
This thread might get you started
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=694034

Related

[Q] DHD android most beginner know how

Finally I got my DHD, the time where everything is rolling out, from perm root, to recovery...
The good thing, I'm very happy with my DHD, the bad thing, I'm not familiar yet with android system.
I revised a lot of android and DHD threads, and I faced many new terminologies that belong to android where I like to have explanation for each.
Please let me understand the following issues the beginner way, allowing me to maybe make a simple guide answers for most new android users coming from winmo.
I-General questions:
1-DHD should be multitouch. Then why games like Gameloft are not multitouch like on ipod or iphone?
2-What are the buttons combinations for the different operations like hard reset & boot loader?
3-I read that android can’t share internet via USB for those with no WIFI at home or office. As I knew it’s due to ad hoc issue so it's impossible to get internet via USB cable from desktop. When I plugged my DHD, I choose internet pass through and I got internet on my DHD, is it a new feature implemented in DHD only, or is it a 2.2 update that will work on other devices?
4-Winmo gives the choice to install applications on either the device or SD card. Android have nothing like this, so when I install applications, where do they go, and is there a workaround to put everything on SD card, or maybe give choice to where to install?
5-My DHD comes with an 8 GB mini SD card where there are some folders and files on it. Are they necessary to run the system, what if I replaced this card with another formatted one, what will happen, or what if I format this card?
II-System info:
1-Baseband version (is it like the radio in winmo?)
2-Kernel version (is it one kernel for the entire device? Does it updates like rom or like radio?) e.g. (kAmMa's OC&GOV&BFS Kernel - Performance and Stability. Is this a rom or just kernel that will update some parts of the rom without losing data on the device?)
3-Build number (is this the firmware?) e.g. (i have 1.32.405.3 CLxxxxxx release-keys, what does release keys means?)
4-Software number (or this is the firmware?)
III-OTA ACE with radio:
1-OTA (is it a rom, does it mean over the air, if yes what does that mean? Can we update OTA with no root?)
2-ACE
On winmo (HD2), I know HSPL will let me unlock ISPL so I can install any custom or cooked rom, languages and applications...
For android, as far as I know there is no one click solution. From what I understand to do everything in android with no restrictions u need to do the followings:
IV-How to root Desire HD install h-boot (S-Off) and Clockwork recovery?
Please identify which one is just a process that we do it once in order to unlock it, which is a boot loader run application and which one is an android application:
1-Root (is it what gives access to the root folders of the system that maybe are hidden by default or encrypted?)
2-Hboot
3-S-off (is it security off? if yes, it is security off for what? installing applications, or read write to some encrypted partitions?)
4-Clockwork (is it something necessary to do in order to install custom rom, no adds, backup and so on, or is it something totally independent and related only to unlock the speed of the CPU where you can leave it intact if you won’t play with the CPU speed?)
5-Recovery (from what I understand it seems that recovery is a system shell command like dos or more like bios for android but named as recovery, what can we do with the recovery other than recovering the device?)
6-Recovery image (is it a rom backed on the form of image and provided by developers, so we can install it directly on the device using only the recovery shell?)
V-More things to know about:
1-What is adb?
2-What is busybox?
2-What is fast boot?
3-What is eMMC write?
4-What is ext2 or ext4 (is it like the partition type of the SD card based on UNIX system? if yes, why should we change or modify this ext)
5-Rom manager (is it a desktop pc application or android device application? is it something like I can put the RUU file of the rom on my SD card and using the rom manager I can install the rom from there, nothing more nothing less?)

vuedesprit said:
Finally I got my DHD, the time where everything is rolling out, from perm root, to recovery...
The good thing, I'm very happy with my DHD, the bad thing, I'm not familiar yet with android system.
I revised a lot of android and DHD threads, and I faced many new terminologies that belong to android where I like to have explanation for each.
Please let me understand the following issues the beginner way, allowing me to maybe make a simple guide answers for most new android users coming from winmo.
I-General questions:
1-DHD should be multitouch. Then why games like Gameloft are not multitouch like on ipod or iphone?
2-What are the buttons combinations for the different operations like hard reset & boot loader?
3-I read that android can’t share internet via USB for those with no WIFI at home or office. As I knew it’s due to ad hoc issue so it's impossible to get internet via USB cable from desktop. When I plugged my DHD, I choose internet pass through and I got internet on my DHD, is it a new feature implemented in DHD only, or is it a 2.2 update that will work on other devices?
4-Winmo gives the choice to install applications on either the device or SD card. Android have nothing like this, so when I install applications, where do they go, and is there a workaround to put everything on SD card, or maybe give choice to where to install?
5-My DHD comes with an 8 GB mini SD card where there are some folders and files on it. Are they necessary to run the system, what if I replaced this card with another formatted one, what will happen, or what if I format this card?
II-System info:
1-Baseband version (is it like the radio in winmo?)
2-Kernel version (is it one kernel for the entire device? Does it updates like rom or like radio?) e.g. (kAmMa's OC&GOV&BFS Kernel - Performance and Stability. Is this a rom or just kernel that will update some parts of the rom without losing data on the device?)
3-Build number (is this the firmware?) e.g. (i have 1.32.405.3 CLxxxxxx release-keys, what does release keys means?)
4-Software number (or this is the firmware?)
III-OTA ACE with radio:
1-OTA (is it a rom, does it mean over the air, if yes what does that mean? Can we update OTA with no root?)
2-ACE
On winmo (HD2), I know HSPL will let me unlock ISPL so I can install any custom or cooked rom, languages and applications...
For android, as far as I know there is no one click solution. From what I understand to do everything in android with no restrictions u need to do the followings:
IV-How to root Desire HD install h-boot (S-Off) and Clockwork recovery?
Please identify which one is just a process that we do it once in order to unlock it, which is a boot loader run application and which one is an android application:
1-Root (is it what gives access to the root folders of the system that maybe are hidden by default or encrypted?)
2-Hboot
3-S-off (is it security off? if yes, it is security off for what? installing applications, or read write to some encrypted partitions?)
4-Clockwork (is it something necessary to do in order to install custom rom, no adds, backup and so on, or is it something totally independent and related only to unlock the speed of the CPU where you can leave it intact if you won’t play with the CPU speed?)
5-Recovery (from what I understand it seems that recovery is a system shell command like dos or more like bios for android but named as recovery, what can we do with the recovery other than recovering the device?)
6-Recovery image (is it a rom backed on the form of image and provided by developers, so we can install it directly on the device using only the recovery shell?)
V-More things to know about:
1-What is adb?
2-What is busybox?
2-What is fast boot?
3-What is eMMC write?
4-What is ext2 or ext4 (is it like the partition type of the SD card based on UNIX system? if yes, why should we change or modify this ext)
5-Rom manager (is it a desktop pc application or android device application? is it something like I can put the RUU file of the rom on my SD card and using the rom manager I can install the rom from there, nothing more nothing less?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Congratulations. You win the "most questions asked in a single post" award.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App

That is a ridiculous amount of questions, and the thread is in completely the wrong area of the forum. I'm sure you'd find the answer to pretty much all your questions if you looked hard enough, but to answer the one about multi-touch. It is multi touch and all the games I've played from your example 'Gameloft' are multi-touch, so I don't know what you're smoking buddy, but ease off.

1. Inb4 "search".
2. Wrong forum.
3. No really, try searching. At least 30% of that is googleable.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App

Ok guys, thank you all for your replies, and yes I knew that a war and flames will go on here, but seriously if you think this is ridiculous or newbie or most dumb questions, do not turn the way of the thread or flame me, my intentions are to make this as a one small guide for most new androids functions, it's not a bad thing to do, in fact I will learn as much as other new users here, no one is asked to answer all those ridiculous questions, just answer what you know about, guys please take it seriously and easy, saying look harder will not help the thread, it may help me personaly, but be sure that I did a lot of search, and it will not hurt to put everything in one place, and as you can see, I answered most of the questions up to what I gathered, you can correct me about my answers, put your thoughts or not answer at all, but please be constructive here, and if you all think that i'm in the wrong forum, or asking too much, or asking ridiculous questions, please moderator feel free to do what you think is better for the forum.
Sorry guys for bothering you. Thank you for your response.
N.B.: just to be more accurate, I tried the prince of persia pre installed on the phone by the dealer, and it was not multi touch, so you cant walk and use any of the right actions at same time.

@vuedesprit: Good thread, and thanks for taking all the criticism from the more experienced users.
@all chimers chiming the "use search, wrong forum" tune: c'mon guys, there's at least 2 of us reading this thread going, it's about time all this information got consolidated into one place! The easier it is to find this information, the easier it would be for more of us to get engaged in the process and thus further development, enhancement and adoption.
While our "friendly" mod is doing his best to keep the forums clean, they're as fragmented as ever and from time-to-time, it becomes necessary to consolidate the information into a single thread. I'm sure most of you started some place too and remember the time not so long ago when it was difficult to find even the most basic info? I think by sharing your knowledge, you will gain a much better following and the platform will gain much better adoption.
My 2 cents worth anyways...I've had my DHD for 3 days now and I too am struggling to perform even the most basic tasks.

We really need a questions and answers sub forum

Fair enough, maybe my first comment was a bit rash, but I didn't mean to appear rude. I shall try to answer some questions here:
GENERAL.
1. From my own experience all games advertised as multitouch are exactly that. I don't know about the version of PoP that you have installed from carrier, but I do find that odd.
2. Hard reset is a little perverse with the new "fastboot" hibernation feature that HTC have implemented. You have to go to MENU>SETTINGS>APPLICATIONS and disable "fastboot" (this is where confusion may arise as this is not the bootloader fastboot that allows images to be flashed)!! Now when you hold down the power button and get the option to power off, you will properly power off the phone. Next if you hold "VOLUME DOWN" and "POWER" buttons you will reboot into HBoot, from here the VOLUME UP/DOWN keys navigate the menu and POWER selects menu options.
3. Not sure about this one.
4. Since the release of FROYO you can go to MENU>SETTINGS>APPLICATIONS>MANAGE APPLICATIONS then select any app and move to either SD or to phone memory.
5. The folders on the SD card are mostly generated by the phone when you first insert it. The user guide and HTC sync software are there to move onto your PC for safe keeping. If you insert a freshly formatted SD card, the phone will make fresh folders such as DCIM for pictures, etc...
SYSTEM INFO.
1. Baseband is radio software.
2. Kernel is the linux kernel that is running below Android, this can be updated separately from the main ROM, radio etc. HOWEVER CAUTION IS ADVISED AS CERTAIN KERNELS WILL NEED NEW MODULES FOR HARDWARE TO FUNCTION CORRECTLY as you will see from the wifi modules bundled with the OC kernels.
3. Build number pertains to HTC's internal software version classification (some are built specific for carriers) they are generally released via RUU (ROM Update Utility aimed at windows) or OTA (Over The Air update received on phone [again sometimes carrier specific]). Release keys pertains to the fact that the firmware has been signed by HTC (I think).
4. Software number, basically as above.
OTA ACE with Radio.
1. As Above.
2. ACE: internal HTC name for Desire HD (also reportedly known as "SPADE")
ROOT DESIRE HD ETC.
Most of what you have written is pretty much correct.
MORE THINGS TO KNOW ABOUT.
1. http://developer.android.com/guide/developing/tools/adb.html
2. http://www.busybox.net/about.html
3. http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=Fastboot
4. eMMC write basically means that you can write to the internal phone (normally protected) memory such as /SYSTEM, this is what S-OFF allows you to do whenever you want. However, the modules that allow the ENG HBoot image to be flashed are what really accomplish this in the first place so theoretically you could just run that module every time you wanted to write to /SYSTEM but that would become very tedious very quickly. I can't really explain further, as I don't have the knowledge.
5. EXT2 or EXT4 are filesystem structures just like FAT, FAT16, FAT32, NTFS, HFS+ etc, EXT4 is newer and more advanced than EXT2 and therefore is more efficient. (kinda general but you get the idea. NEWER=BETTER)
6. ROM manager, find this in the android market, it is free, you install it on your phone and with the addition of clockworkmod it gives you the ability of flashing ROMs etc. USE WITH CAUTION.
I hope that this answers or clarifies most of what you have asked or said, please feel free to cut and paste any of this info into your first post so that we can actually consolidate this.
P.S. I too am a complete android noob and this is my first android phone, I have picked this info up mainly from this forum so all credit for information goes to XDA-DEVELOPERS.COM and not me.
Cheers,
Dok

berek9999 said:
congratulations. You win the "most questions asked in a single post" award.
Sent from my desire hd using xda app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1111111111^2

1-DHD should be multitouch. Then why games like Gameloft are not multitouch like on ipod or iphone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
an application must support multitouch and other gestures. eg, opera doesnt support multitouch (ie you cant zoom in and out) but the browser that comes with the DHD does.
2-What are the buttons combinations for the different operations like hard reset & boot loader?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
boot loader = turn phone off. then, volume down + power on.
4-Winmo gives the choice to install applications on either the device or SD card. Android have nothing like this, so when I install applications, where do they go, and is there a workaround to put everything on SD card, or maybe give choice to where to install?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
application must support running from /sdcard. When you install an app go to settings -> Applications -> manage applications. From here you can uninstall or move apps to the sdcard. Bear in mind if you have not rooted your phone you may not be able to uninstall some apps (eg amazon reader).
5-My DHD comes with an 8 GB mini SD card where there are some folders and files on it. Are they necessary to run the system, what if I replaced this card with another formatted one, what will happen, or what if I format this card?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
some application data is stored on your sdcard, and apps are stored here if you have moved them by using the steps above. if you change sd cards this info is unavailable to the app but the app should still work. any settings you had need to be redone.
2-Kernel version (is it one kernel for the entire device? Does it updates like rom or like radio?) e.g. (kAmMa's OC&GOV&BFS Kernel - Performance and Stability. Is this a rom or just kernel that will update some parts of the rom without losing data on the device?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the kernel is not part of a rom or the radio. It is stored in the boot partition in the emmc (where fastboot(aka hboot)/splash images/boot(kernel)/recovery/ are all stored). It is generally included with but not required by a custom rom. ie, a custom rom builder may choose to include a specific kernel with his rom but it is not mandatory.
1-OTA (is it a rom, does it mean over the air, if yes what does that mean? Can we update OTA with no root?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, you can do OTA HTC updates. but, there are no custom (non signed) updates delivered OTA. An unrooted rom will not be able to flash non signed updates (or roms).
How to root Desire HD install h-boot (S-Off) and Clockwork recovery?[/U][/B]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there is a good thread here - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=841076.
Please identify which one is just a process that we do it once in order to unlock it, which is a boot loader run application and which one is an android application:
1-Root (is it what gives access to the root folders of the system that maybe are hidden by default or encrypted?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
android application. eg, visionary+.
2-Hboot
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hboot is also known as bootloader. it is the white screen with the skating androids when you do the volume-down + power combination when switching on your phone.
3-S-off (is it security off? if yes, it is security off for what? installing applications, or read write to some encrypted partitions?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
s-off stands for security off. you can check the status by doing the volume-down + power combo. At the top it will either say s-on or s-off. If you have s-on then your bootloader (hboot), boot (kernel) /system (android) and recovery (eg clockworkmod) partitions are all read only.
4-Clockwork (is it something necessary to do in order to install custom rom, no adds, backup and so on, or is it something totally independent and related only to unlock the speed of the CPU where you can leave it intact if you won’t play with the CPU speed?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
clock work is the recovery partition. you have 3 possible options before loading android when you do the volume-down + power on combo. hboot, then either fastboot or recovery. fastboot and recovery are both ways to flash images to your phone although through different ways (fastboot uses the fastboot command on your pc to send the image, recovery uses .zip's on your /sdcard). clockworkmod is a custom recovery image which you need to flash after achieving s-off. it's also where nandroid backups can be done. if you select recovery before doing this you will get the phone + red triangle icon. thats the stock recovery. the clockworkmod is the green menu selection one.
5-Recovery (from what I understand it seems that recovery is a system shell command like dos or more like bios for android but named as recovery, what can we do with the recovery other than recovering the device?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
see above.
6-Recovery image (is it a rom backed on the form of image and provided by developers, so we can install it directly on the device using only the recovery shell?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
clockwork mod can backup your phone's partitions (boot/userdata/system) so that if you mess up installing a rom you have a way to recover. this is known as a nandroid backup.
1-What is adb?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
adb is android debug something. It is a way to send commands to the android operation system from your pc (either windows or linux). eg, you can run a single command, or run a shell (terminal session). it is part of the android sdk under tools.
2-What is busybox?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
busybox is a single executable whihc runs under the android OS that provides standard linux commands (eg, ls, rm, cd) to any application. it is so that a script writer does not need to know the partiticular rom you have and then cater for it, but only that you have a certain version of busybox. eg, busybox 1.17.1 provides the same commands whether it is on a leedroid rom or a cyanogen rom.
2-What is fast boot?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
fastboot is a way to flash images to your phone. it is accessed via hboot. you need the fastboot exe from the htc developer site. it can flash the boot (kernel), recovery (eg clockworkmod) and the radio (i think).
3-What is eMMC write?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the emmc is the storage device which holds hboot, fastboot, recovery, /system, /userdata and (not sure about this one) radio. when you switch on your phone the emmc is read-only due to the s-on flag being set by hboot. you need to flash the engineering hboot which does not set s-on when you switch your phone on.
4-What is ext2 or ext4 (is it like the partition type of the SD card based on UNIX system? if yes, why should we change or modify this ext)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ext2 and ext4 are linux file system types. eg, windows is ntfs, linux has ext2/3/4 and others.
5-Rom manager (is it a desktop pc application or android device application? is it something like I can put the RUU file of the rom on my SD card and using the rom manager I can install the rom from there, nothing more nothing less?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
rom manager is an android app available on the market place to help with the flashing process. it can flash recovery partitions (as long as your phone is s-off), make nandroid backups (as long as you have clockworkmod & s-off). it can also flash custom roms. it does not flash these from within the android OS (afaik) but it will reboot into (not sure on this one) the recovery partition and leaves it instructions to flash a particular rom.

This thread is amazing!!
We had a lot threads like this in the HTC Blackstone Board of pocketpc.ch....
Hope to get more threads like this in every device category....
Thumbs up
Perhaps Threadstarter can write the answers in the first post...??

50chickens said:
an application must support multitouch and other gestures. eg, opera doesnt support multitouch (ie you cant zoom in and out) but the browser that comes with the DHD does.
boot loader = turn phone off. then, volume down + power on.
application must support running from /sdcard. When you install an app go to settings -> Applications -> manage applications. From here you can uninstall or move apps to the sdcard. Bear in mind if you have not rooted your phone you may not be able to uninstall some apps (eg amazon reader).
some application data is stored on your sdcard, and apps are stored here if you have moved them by using the steps above. if you change sd cards this info is unavailable to the app but the app should still work. any settings you had need to be redone.
the kernel is not part of a rom or the radio. It is stored in the boot partition in the emmc (where fastboot(aka hboot)/splash images/boot(kernel)/recovery/ are all stored). It is generally included with but not required by a custom rom. ie, a custom rom builder may choose to include a specific kernel with his rom but it is not mandatory.
yes, you can do OTA HTC updates. but, there are no custom (non signed) updates delivered OTA. An unrooted rom will not be able to flash non signed updates (or roms).
there is a good thread here - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=841076.
android application. eg, visionary+.
hboot is also known as bootloader. it is the white screen with the skating androids when you do the volume-down + power combination when switching on your phone.
s-off stands for security off. you can check the status by doing the volume-down + power combo. At the top it will either say s-on or s-off. If you have s-on then your bootloader (hboot), boot (kernel) /system (android) and recovery (eg clockworkmod) partitions are all read only.
clock work is the recovery partition. you have 3 possible options before loading android when you do the volume-down + power on combo. hboot, then either fastboot or recovery. fastboot and recovery are both ways to flash images to your phone although through different ways (fastboot uses the fastboot command on your pc to send the image, recovery uses .zip's on your /sdcard). clockworkmod is a custom recovery image which you need to flash after achieving s-off. it's also where nandroid backups can be done. if you select recovery before doing this you will get the phone + red triangle icon. thats the stock recovery. the clockworkmod is the green menu selection one.
see above.
clockwork mod can backup your phone's partitions (boot/userdata/system) so that if you mess up installing a rom you have a way to recover. this is known as a nandroid backup.
adb is android debug something. It is a way to send commands to the android operation system from your pc (either windows or linux). eg, you can run a single command, or run a shell (terminal session). it is part of the android sdk under tools.
busybox is a single executable whihc runs under the android OS that provides standard linux commands (eg, ls, rm, cd) to any application. it is so that a script writer does not need to know the partiticular rom you have and then cater for it, but only that you have a certain version of busybox. eg, busybox 1.17.1 provides the same commands whether it is on a leedroid rom or a cyanogen rom.
fastboot is a way to flash images to your phone. it is accessed via hboot. you need the fastboot exe from the htc developer site. it can flash the boot (kernel), recovery (eg clockworkmod) and the radio (i think).
the emmc is the storage device which holds hboot, fastboot, recovery, /system, /userdata and (not sure about this one) radio. when you switch on your phone the emmc is read-only due to the s-on flag being set by hboot. you need to flash the engineering hboot which does not set s-on when you switch your phone on.
ext2 and ext4 are linux file system types. eg, windows is ntfs, linux has ext2/3/4 and others.
rom manager is an android app available on the market place to help with the flashing process. it can flash recovery partitions (as long as your phone is s-off), make nandroid backups (as long as you have clockworkmod & s-off). it can also flash custom roms. it does not flash these from within the android OS (afaik) but it will reboot into (not sure on this one) the recovery partition and leaves it instructions to flash a particular rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you very much.

Rooting new Evo 4G - stuck at red triangle - please help!

[Edit: I've now resolved this issue. Thanks to all who helped. Please see end of thread for my solution. I've made some edits below too. When things looked bad, the solution was to remove the microSD card, copy and load a more reliable PC36IMG.zip (there are a huge number out there), and only then could I use adb when the red triangle was present. Note that just renaming stuff randomly or worrying about the USB cable isn't a proper way to come up with a solution even though I did it also (and that may be the case for some units but it can't be the general problem or solution). I'd guess there's a huge amount of misinformation out there and some people may have tried random stuff but it looks like from playing with all this, there is a method to the madness of how phone and the adb communicate, as well as how the phone loads, and once you UNDERSTAND HOW that process, all this stops being so much of a black magic.
Note that the problem I had was because I used an outdated set of instructions. Here are the ones that worked for me in the end:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=829045
Thanks to all who did reply to my message.
]
--------
I've tried literally everything I've read to get out of my red triangle situation so please help if you can. This is not your standard "hold volume up and power button" response.
I was trying to get to root using the method at evo4g.me.
And I got a red triangle after the first application of the PC36IMG.ZIP. I then held the volume up and power button and, I get a blue lettered screen with 4 options:
reboot system now
apply sdcard:update.zip
wipe data/factory reset
wipe cache partition
Well, I've seemingly tried everything but I can't seem to get past this screen. I've pulled the battery out and rebooted, I go back to the above screen. Option 1 above gets me back to the same spot. Option 2 says it can't find sdcard/update.zip. I did option 3 but it does that and turns off and on and comes back to this same position. Even when I try to hold the volume button down. When I try to access this using adb, I get "device offline".
I can take the battery out, hold the volume down button, and then power on, and it takes me the through the same steps as before and I don't seem to have control over the choice of whether it should load the PC36IMG.ZIP file or not (i.e., the menu I see before it doesn't to be controllable by me).
So I'm at a loss. I really would like to finish this process and get to root, which shouldn't be too hard in my view but here I am.
I could move the SD card elsewhere and put an update.zip file on there but I'm not sure what to do here exactly so I can recover (and hopefully with root). Is this the correct thing to be thinking about? Move the SD card to another device, replace the .ZIP file, and then go from there? Is there a way to do this without moving the SD card?
[Edit: this is indeed what I did in the end. I found the correct PCIMG.zip file by trial and error.]
Thanks a lot!
BTW, I backed up all my apps on my sdcard so I should be fine right? I'm not sure what I'd need to do reinstall them.
[Edit: I lost some public keys, etc. with app reinstalls but I just had too many apps doing backups in different places and wasn't matching the right app restore to the right location in part.]
--
Backgrround: I'm new to the Evo 4G and in general new to doing stuff like rooting phones and the like, so please forgive me if my questions (or actions) or too naive. I have been using Unix systems all my life and Linux when there were fewer than 100,000 users of it (back in 1992-1993) and am extremely comfortable with it and do all my science (work) exclusively with Linux.

ramdom said:
I've tried literally everything I've read to get out of my red triangle situation so please help if you can. This is not your standard "hold volume up and power button" response.
I was trying to get to root using the method at evo4g.me.
And I got a red triangle after the first application of the PC36IMG.ZIP. I then held the volume up and power button and, I get a blue lettered screen with 4 options:
reboot system now
apply sdcard:update.zip
wipe data/factory reset
wipe cache partition
Well, I've seemingly tried everything but I can't seem to get past this screen. I've pulled the battery out and rebooted, I go back to the above screen. Option 1 above gets me back to the same spot. Option 2 says it can't find sdcard/update.zip. I did option 3 but it does that and turns off and on and comes back to this same position. Even when I try to hold the volume button down. When I try to access this using adb, I get "device offline".
I can take the battery out, hold the volume down button, and then power on, and it takes me the through the same steps as before and I don't seem to have control over the choice of whether it should load the PC36IMG.ZIP file or not (i.e., the menu I see before it doesn't to be controllable by me).
So I'm at a loss. I really would like to finish this process and get to root, which shouldn't be too hard in my view but here I am.
I could move the SD card elsewhere and put an update.zip file on there but I'm not sure what to do here exactly so I can recover (and hopefully with root). Is this the correct thing to be thinking about? Move the SD card to another device, replace the .ZIP file, and then go from there? Is there a way to do this without moving the SD card?
Thanks a lot!
BTW, I backed up all my apps on my sdcard so I should be fine right? I'm not sure what I'd need to do reinstall them.
--
Edits based on trying to fix this: when I do `adb devices`, I get:
List of devices attached
HT0B6HL05287 offline
--
Backgrround: I'm new to the Evo 4G and in general new to doing stuff like rooting phones and the like, so please forgive me if my questions (or actions) or too naive. I have been using Unix systems all my life and Linux when there were fewer than 100,000 users of it (back in 1992-1993) and am extremely comfortable with it and do all my science (work) exclusively with Linux.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is the stock recovery you are seeing there, does it let you do anything at all in the bootloader? If you can get it into fastboot mode you can fix it from there.

I rooted using regaw's instructions also, and also got that damn triangle, lol. Pretty sure all I did was reboot to bootloader and let it update the PC36.img again to get out of it.

xHausx said:
That is the stock recovery you are seeing there, does it let you do anything at all in the bootloader? If you can get it into fastboot mode you can fix it from there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I believe so. I can let the PC36IMG.ZIP reload again and then AFTER that I can say "no" to the update and then "no" to reboot devices and I can get into a menu that says:
FASTBOOT
RECOVERY
CLEAR STORAGE
SIMLOCK
HSB USB
From there I can select FASTBOOT and head into another menu that says:
BOOTLOADER
REBOOT
REBOOT BOOTLOADER
POWER DOWN
Trying BOOTLOADER gets me through the same HBOOT cycle where the PC36IMG.ZIP is reloaded and asked to be applied. Trying REBOOT gives me a white HTC screen (unless I need to wait a while).
Thanks! I assume I need to pull the SD card out, load it on my computer through another source, and then remove the PC36IMG.ZIP file and then replace it with something else that I can use to get rooted? Or will just removing the PC36IMG.ZIP file do it?
I'm also looking to achieve root so if I am going to the trouble of removing the SD card and putting it back, I'd like to know if if there's another PC36IMG.ZIP that'll let me have a nice version of the HTC evo that is rooted.
--Ram

I know a few people who have recently purchased EVOs and they still have Hardware version 3 and Hboot .97
what versions do you guys have on your phones?
If the hboot is still .97 you can used unrevoked forever for a full root and nand unlock.
if higher there is a tutorial on these forums for Hboot 2.02.

chris66 said:
I rooted using regaw's instructions also, and also got that damn triangle, lol. Pretty sure all I did was reboot to bootloader and let it update the PC36.img again to get out of it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How did you do it?

Tuffgong4 said:
I know a few people who have recently purchased EVOs and they still have Hardware version 3 and Hboot .97
what versions do you guys have on your phones?
If the hboot is still .97 you can used unrevoked forever for a full root and nand unlock.
if higher there is a tutorial on these forums for Hboot 2.02.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have:
SUPERSONIC EVT2-3 SHIP S-ON
HBOOT-2.02-0000
TOUCH-PANEL-ATMELC-03_16ac
RADIO-2.15.00.09.01
Oct 14 2010, 19:14:47
I assume the tutorial you're referring to is here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=829045
But I'm not sure how to get out of this particular PC36IMG.ZIP (gotten from evo4g.me) and replace it with the PC36IMG.ZIP posted in the above URL above easily, since I can no longer access this device using adb. Unless I am missing something obvious.
Well, I'm learning a lot! Thanks!
I do agree having root on these systems will be fantastic. I don't understand why it's not just a ready option. Things like tethering, etc. should be a given and built into the $10 cost or something else of the network. I'd like to port things like csh on there, and have a powerful terminal like I can get in the Mac OS X. Is there any way this is possible at all? We can get bigger and bigger microSD cards right? An entire stripped down Linux system can fit in a few gigs (but I want to be able to use it as a phone too).
--Ram

Went backward in the directions.
This the whole post that I used, pretty sure I just went backward and started again, it did take a seemingly HUGE amount of time the first time thru flashing the PC36.img
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=765496
PULL THE SD CARD and put the image on the root? , lol

chris66 said:
Went backward in the directions.
This the whole post that I used, pretty sure I just went backward and started again, it did take a seemingly HUGE amount of time the first time thru flashing the PC36.img
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=765496
PULL THE SD CARD and put the image on the root? , lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The instructions at the above URL are what I used to get to this place with the red triangle that I can't seem to get out of. I can no longer access the phone using adb so I can't push anything. I can't access the phone through my computer right now once it has become stuck at the red triangle, this is my main issue. No access. Nothing. It just says "error: device offline" no matter what I try.
You don't think the SD CARD strategy will work?

This is where I scared the **** outta myself.....
"If this doesn't work (ie the PC36IMG.zip does NOT load) backup all of your sdcard contents onto your computer, reformat your sdcard to FAT32, redownload the PC36IMG.zip, and drag and drop it onto the sdcard, then reboot into the bootloader and try again. This should fix the issue."
It worked for me, but I don't know what hardware version and all you have.

ramdom said:
The instructions are the URL are what I used to get to this place with the red triangle that I can't seem to get out of. I can no longer access the phone using adb so I can't push anything. I can't access the phone through my computer right now once it has become stuck at the red triangle, this is my main issue. No access. Nothing. It just says "error: device offline" no matter what I try.
You don't think the SD CARD strategy will work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
just pull the sd card out of the evo (behind the battery) and put the new img on the root of the card.

chris66 said:
This is where I scaref the **** outta myself.....
"If this doesn't work (ie the PC36IMG.zip does NOT load) backup all of your sdcard contents onto your computer, reformat your sdcard to FAT32, redownload the PC36IMG.zip, and drag and drop it onto the sdcard, then reboot into the bootloader and try again. This should fix the issue."
It worked for me, but I don't know what hardware version and all you have.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me too, but I pay for the extra warranty that's supposed to cover nearly everything, which I think should cover this.
So from the above instructions, am I to understand that I remove the sdcard out and clean it out in my computer and install a new PC36IMG?
Should I try the one from here? Even here, there are like 3 versions:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=829045
Sorry for all the questions. Normally I'd hack and figure this out without even googling it but after googling it, the amount of stuff out there is enormous which is throwing me off. I think I have like 10 versions of the PC36IMG and not sure which to go with next that'll not destroy everything and give me root! Crazy.

Tuffgong4 said:
just pull the sd card out of the evo (behind the battery) and put the new img on the root of the card.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks a lot. Pulling the evo card was easier than I thought it would be. Which particular one? I'm looking here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=829045
Should I just manually copy all these files over to the sdcard and then reboot and see what happens? I guess I'll try that. Thanks.
Thanks guys!
--Ram

Well, I solved this problem and am now enjoying root. Thanks to all who helped. I followed the instructions here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=829045
But I still couldn't get past step 10. I even read the FAQ and followed the renaming suggestions (this wasn't the issue but I did it anyway) and it still didn't work. Basically the problem was that I wasn't even able to get to the shell even though I was able to use adb to push files (weird?).
So I was playing around with the EVO-recovery.zip (http://www.knowyourcell.com/htc/htc-evo-4g/evo-4g-guides/463925/how_to_root_the_htc_evo_4g.html) and ran the recovery-linux.sh script, which then put me into the green recovery screen. The rest was straight forward after that (as per the instructions at the URL above). So perhaps the difference of which adb to use was what it was, since that zip file comes with its own adb.
I am now rooted. Now what?
My wi fi doesn't seem to work, and neither does the google wireless tethering app, which is one of the reasons I wanted to root. When I run "adb shell" I now get a "#" instead of a "$" so I assume this (among other things, including the S-OFF) means I am rooted. So no wi-fi, did I trash something?
[Edit: I fixed this by installing the fresh ROM; thanks chris66 and others who helped!]
I'm just using the stock ROM provided from the URL above. Not sure what the best one to use is and how to use it.
[Edit: Stil no idea. Way too many ROMs out there. It's crazy. Fresh seems to have a good rep. It works pretty well, after one week.]
I also backed up all my apps on my sdcard, is there a way to restore them in one quick fell swoop instead of opening them one by one?
[Edit: I figured out how to do the multiselection option and apply it apps. A good file manager will do the backups for you. I went from ASTRO to ES File Explorer. Latter looks slightly cleaner. Probably better ones out there.]
Thanks to all who helped! I am excited about playing around with all this further. Only PITA is reconfiguring everything again the way I like it.
[Edit: Favourite apps are ConnectBot; Android Wireless Tether; AndroidVNC; DropBox; ES File Explorer; System Panel; --- from Ubuntu, I ADB to access stuff at the prompt which when having a # is really really powerful. Maybe I was wrong but before I put the new ROM on I didn't think the "more" command was available.]

Cool, try superuser and the wifi app from the market. Flash almost any of the newer roms, and they're already both usable, wifi and usb.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

[Q] Full backup of Gnex

Hello everyone,
First I will apologize if this information has already been posted / asked, however my searches on google and the forums did not exactly answer my question.
I would like to know how to make a full backup of the phone. What I mean is to have an img file for each partition.
For those who might quickly shout "Nandroid...", been there done that. That is actually what prompted me to start looking into this, when I read (after reflashing the phone) that CWM does not backup things like the radio (again, np, I have grabbed the original imgs from the excellent threads, but it made me want to be able to do it myself in the future).
I have seen the posts regarding backing up the EFS partition with ADB and that the method can be applied to copy of the of the partitions, however it requires root access on the phone.
It seems odd to me however that with a tool like fastboot, that we can not back up the entire phone when in this state. The only thing I can think of as to why not, is that the fastboot mode only allows access to certain partitions w/ full permissions (read/write), or it only mounts certain partitions thus making the other ones unaccessible.
I would prefer to backup the phone without rooting it if possible. I am not opposed to the idea of rooting, however I have not really read up on it. As a linux user, I have np with the idea of it and honestly would have loved it if Android had a similar user structure right out of the box. My concern is (and possibly unfounded) that gaining root access could leave security holes in the OS to be exploited.
I also would prefer a "manual" method, not a fan of the idea of a toolkit.
Sorry if this is in the wrong section, however most of the search results yielded threads from this one.

Well, you could always just individually dump any partition with the dd command.
For example, to dump the entire contents of the radio partition to an .img file:
Code:
dd if="/dev/block/platform/omap/omap_hsmmc.0/by-name/radio" of="/sdcard/radio.img"
To restore that radio.img:
Code:
dd if="/sdcard/radio.img" of="/dev/block/platform/omap/omap_hsmmc.0/by-name/radio"
Simply run that through ADB Shell or a Terminal emulator from the Play Store. Of course, you will have to be rooted and have BusyBox installed. It's really not that difficult. Now you can unlock the bootloader without wiping /data, it's a simple matter of rooting and running the commands. If you wish, you can then unroot and relock the bootloader.
Mandatory Disclaimer: I've been awake for about thirty hours now, so you might want to get someone else to check over those commands before you give them a shot. Read up a bit on rooting in general, it will help you in the long run. Also, be careful. Just remember that if you accidentally flash a radio.img on the boot partition, or whatever, you're gonna have a bad time. I'm not responsible if you brick your phone, or if it explodes, or even if it boots into Apple's iOS.

Questions go in Q&A
Please read forum rules
Thread moved

Are you aware of a way to do it without rooting?
My boot loader is already unlocked and I have left it that way.
I have seen in fast boot documentation a "backup" command for fast boot. I am curious if it can be used to flash the radio, why can't it back it up.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Sorry, without root, this is the best you're going to get, and I'm pretty sure it's not what you're asking for:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1420351

[Q] Technical Questions about Boot Process and Partition Handling..

Hi there !
I just registered to this huge forum full of ressources and so many stuffs to dig in.. I own a Z1 Compact I bought last week and got into mods etc.. This is my first Android device and therefore got into it for the first time.. and what a world.. so many things over here..
As a developper, I'm getting interested in this environment so I first tried to gain access to this unix-based system called Android in order to see how this works..
Here my first steps: I needed to be root on this device..okay.. through tutos I read, I needed to unlock bootloader then I needed to install a new boot called ClockWorkMod (I believe this is a boot, according fastboot argument I supplied..) to allow me running the SuperUser script to be root. Afterwards, I backed up my TA partition..
Okay, these steps were done pretty out of the box, without Android knowledge so far.. Now, I'm about to install busybox for tools I'm used to use on every linux platforms.. but I really lack Android knowledge about Android partitioning system (I came across TA partition, /boot, /data what else ??), content, permissions management.. in few words, Android philosophophy So guys, do you know good web ressources around my questionings so that I can start properly and the right way
I'd really like to contribute in a humbly manner, I've already developped upon ARM platforms with realtime OS and many stuffs around linux kernel, so if you guys had any suggestions for low-level dev and Android in-depth ressources etc.. I'd be grateful
Thanks a lot.

PaowZ said:
Hi there !
I just registered to this huge forum full of ressources and so many stuffs to dig in.. I own a Z1 Compact I bought last week and got into mods etc.. This is my first Android device and therefore got into it for the first time.. and what a world.. so many things over here..
As a developper, I'm getting interested in this environment so I first tried to gain access to this unix-based system called Android in order to see how this works..
Here my first steps: I needed to be root on this device..okay.. through tutos I read, I needed to unlock bootloader then I needed to install a new boot called ClockWorkMod (I believe this is a boot, according fastboot argument I supplied..) to allow me running the SuperUser script to be root. Afterwards, I backed up my TA partition..
Okay, these steps were done pretty out of the box, without Android knowledge so far.. Now, I'm about to install busybox for tools I'm used to use on every linux platforms.. but I really lack Android knowledge about Android partitioning system (I came across TA partition, /boot, /data what else ??), content, permissions management.. in few words, Android philosophophy So guys, do you know good web ressources around my questionings so that I can start properly and the right way
I'd really like to contribute in a humbly manner, I've already developped upon ARM platforms with realtime OS and many stuffs around linux kernel, so if you guys had any suggestions for low-level dev and Android in-depth ressources etc.. I'd be grateful
Thanks a lot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Welcome in the exciting world of Android! I am by no means a programmer, but I have been here for a while and will just explain a few things I think are helpful. If it's stuff you already know, feel free to ignore it.
Important things first: I hope you have made a Backup of your TA-Partition before unlocking the bootloader. Unlocking the bootloader modifies the TA- partition. It is not possible to undo it if you d not have a backup. Flashing someone else's TA will brick your device!
If I am not mistaken, the TA is mainly used to verify that the phone is in original condition e.g. not modified.
Unlocking the Bootloader (BL) removes Sony's DRM-Keys from the partition, because unlocking enables you to get root access and copy all the protected stuff anyways. The result is that you loose access to some of sony's services and the use of XReality engine.
Unlocking the BL breaks the Sony Update Service, but if you unlocked with Flashtool, you will be able to relock easily. Do only relock while on a stock kernel, else the phone won't boot because it detects modified firmware.
AFAIK root is a function of the kernel, as is ClockWorkMod Recovery (CWM). they come included in, for example, DooMKernel.
Superuser and SuperSU are apps that allow you to manage root acces, giving it to the apps that need it, and stopping bad apps from getting it.
Recovery and fastboot *for me* something like a secondary boot partition. I don't know if that's technically correct, but even if the system is unbootable, you can boot into CWM and work from there.
TWRP (TeamWin Recovery Project) is another custom recovery that allows you to do interesting things.
Do not mess with the BL and TA more than necessary. A broken TA, aswell as a messed-up BL, can prevent you from booting. As long as the BL is functional and you can get into Flashmode or fastboot mode, the phone can be saved.
If/when you have root, use Terminal Emulator from Google play to find partitions.
for more tecnical aspects, go over to the "Original Android Development" forum for the Z1C. Be aware that you need a minimum uf 10 posts to be able to post there. They are a little picky about the quality of your posts.
LINKS
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/Android
https://developer.android.com/index.html
https://source.android.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_(operating_system)
http://www.google.com :angel:

Hi Coirpre !!
Thanks a lot for the tips
Important things first: I hope you have made a Backup of your TA-Partition before unlocking the bootloader. Unlocking the bootloader modifies the TA- partition. It is not possible to undo it if you d not have a backup. Flashing someone else's TA will brick your device!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unlocking the Bootloader (BL) removes Sony's DRM-Keys from the partition, because unlocking enables you to get root access and copy all the protected stuff anyways. The result is that you loose access to some of sony's services and the use of XReality engine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, this step is pretty confusing, since *they* indeed advise you to proceed to TA backup before any BL unlocking but before running the script that saves your TA, you need to be root.. and thus, to load CWM and guess what ? Need to unlock BL to install CWM.. Unless I missed something, it looks a bit weird..
Anyway, I unlocked through the use of FlashTool utility and apparently it hadn't compromised XReality nor TrackID either.. (I read somewhere TrackID app won't start if your DRM are broken.. true ??)
Do not mess with the BL and TA more than necessary. A broken TA, aswell as a messed-up BL, can prevent you from booting. As long as the BL is functional and you can get into Flashmode or fastboot mode, the phone can be saved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is one of my first questioning.. Usually, if you consider a mainstream PC, you have a piece of code we formerly called a BIOS before EFI system, this BIOS launchs a bootloader (GRUB/LILO whatever.. for linux or NTLDR for Win) and even if you wipe this bootloader, you can always rewrite a fresh one and the BIOS will then start it and the OS to start as well.. You just need to boot upon another medium to restore/install a bootloader, the BIOS is not altered.
But in this device, it appears one can hard-break the unit, solely by messing with BL/TA partitions.. like if there wasn't any BIOS equivalent.. When you say As long as the BL is functional [..] you can get into Flashmode/Fastboot mode I wonder how that piece of code responsible of this feature is not hard-coded in a ROM.. Powering up this device while gently pushing a hardware button is usually processed by a hard-coded system - the BIOS. Just like when you hold pressed the Power button of your running PC, this is the BIOS which interprets this command as a "Shut down right now !!" this is not the role of a bootloader.. I have to know more about Sony system
Thanks for the links, btw

There is a way to root and install CWM without unlocking the bootloader.
BTW Root is allowing us to modify /system and unlocking to change kernel.
/system partition is same as C:/WINDOWS on PC.
Only, on android this is prohibited. And you gain access by rooting it.
So, if you want to root you insert a few apps and scripts to /system. Since it's prohibited developers find exploits to insert those files to /system by various tricks.
That's how you are rooted without unlocking the bootloader. And that's how you can backup your TA before unlocking the bootloader.
And, yeah, CWM can be inserted to /system as well as in kernel. But it's better to be in kernel since it won't be easily wiped out when you screw up something.
Basically, what you did is unlock the bootloader (lost DRM?) > insert CWM to kernel > Use CWM to root.
But don't worry, one couldn't care less about DRM. You don't need that for anything. And I heard Sony fixed removing DRM issues by unlocking the bootloader on latest firmwares but I'm not sure.
And about BIOS, yeah...I was wondering about that as well. But for sure if you mess up with boot.img that you flashed phone won't be able to recover / must go to the service. That's a good question why. Anyone could tell me more about that?

PaowZ said:
Well, this step is pretty confusing, since *they* indeed advise you to proceed to TA backup before any BL unlocking but before running the script that saves your TA, you need to be root.. and thus, to load CWM and guess what ? Need to unlock BL to install CWM.. Unless I missed something, it looks a bit weird..
[...]
I have to know more about Sony system
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As option58 said, you can root using exploits. Unlocking is the official way provided by sony. However, there are always some hacks which can get you root without unlocking. That way you can back up TA without unlocking. On this device it is quite a hassle and involves flashing japanese and english firmwares...
Some of it is Sony, mainly the TA stuff they integrated for security and modification-checking. The boot process however is probably more or less the same on all android devices.
Option58 said:
And about BIOS, yeah...I was wondering about that as well. But for sure if you mess up with boot.img that you flashed phone won't be able to recover / must go to the service. That's a good question why. Anyone could tell me more about that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree that there must be something hardcoded that runs after the power button is pressed, but it probably is not enough. Notice that the device must be acessible (R/W) to restore a messed up BL, which is probably only the case after boot is completed. So:
Buttonpress --> BIOS --> BL (Whichever mode) --> partitions acessible. So If you can not get past the BL, you can not access the memory and thus not fix the BL.
But I am just speculating, so either we get some knowledgeable people in here, or someone has to read it up/google it.
[EDIT:] Oh, and by the way, PaowZ, can you change the topic to something more descriptive, "technical questions about boot process and partition handling" or something? maybe that will attract knowledgeable people...

Buttonpress --> BIOS --> BL (Whichever mode) --> partitions acessible. So If you can not get past the BL, you can not access the memory and thus not fix the BL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm almost sure there must be a way to access to raw flash r/o through addressing.. at least from some pin-outs on the motherboard of the Z1C..
I don't know S1 flashing protocol, maybe there is a way to force writes at a specific address, provided we could know start addresses of each partition..
This is actually what I do when I have to deal with ARM devices through a rs232 port.. I can flash wherever I want and too bad if I make a typo in the address. The device just won't load up anything, but it won't hard-brick anything..

PaowZ said:
I'm almost sure there must be a way to access to raw flash r/o through addressing.. at least from some pin-outs on the motherboard of the Z1C..
I don't know S1 flashing protocol, maybe there is a way to force writes at a specific address, provided we could know start addresses of each partition..
This is actually what I do when I have to deal with ARM devices through a rs232 port.. I can flash wherever I want and too bad if I make a typo in the address. The device just won't load up anything, but it won't hard-brick anything..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, this thread might interest you...
and I found this by chance, you were interested in the partitions:
Android-supported hardware shares some common features due to the nature of the operating system. The Android OS is organized into the following images:
Bootloader - Initiates loading of the boot image during startup
Boot image - Kernel and RAMdisk
System image - Android operating system platform and apps
Data image - User data saved across power cycles
Recovery image - Files used for rebuilding or updating the system
Radio image - Files of the radio stack
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
However: this topic is far beyond my knowledge, at the moment I have just started learning Java to start tinkering with Android on app-level. You will have to find out by yourself. However, I am VERY interested in what you find, because these thingsa are always good to know. There are a lot people from the forums which could help you. Just go read a bit in the "Original Android Development" subforum to find the good people

In the Google's YouTube channel there are quite many deep dive videos for multiple aspects of the Android system.
Use the search Luke ?

As far as I read this thread it is too late to make TA backup.

[Q] Root available for ASUS MeMO Pad 10 (ME103K)?

Greetings!
First of all, I am sorry if this is on the wrong section of the forum. Nevertheless i've tried few rooting applications which are stated to be compatible with this ME103K model, but with no results.. Also many fake sites trying to lure you to purchase something.
Is there anyone who could provide me information on how to root my ASUS ME103K tablet? Should I also try every rooting application available out there or is this useless? Can I verify if they are compatible without all the way installing and running them on the device? (Sorry don't know much about this stuff =)! )
Thank you very much in advance

I rooted ME103K on my own - by compiling a custom kernel
Executive summary: Go to youtube and watch video with ID "gqubgQjqfHw" (I can't post links yet, sorry! ) - or search Youtube for "Rooting MemoPAD10 (ME103K) with my custom compiled kernel"
Analysis:
I hated the fact that my recently purchased MemoPAD10 (ME103K) tablet had no open process to allow me to become root. I don't trust the closed-source one-click root apps that use various exploits, and require communicating with servers in.... China. Why would they need to do that? I wonder...
I therefore decided this was a good opportunity for me to study the relevant documentation and follow the steps necessary to build an Android kernel for my tablet. I then packaged my custom-compiled kernel into my custom boot image, and the video shows how I boot from it and become root in the process.
Note that I didn't burn anything in my tablet - it's a 'tethered' root, it has no side-effects.
If you are a developer, you can read in detail about the steps I had to take to modify the kernel (and su.c) and become root - by reading the questions (and answers!) that I posted in the Android StackExchange forum ( can't post links yet, see the video description in Youtube ).
If you are not a developer, you can download my custom boot image from the link below - but note that this means you are trusting me to not do evil things to your tablet as my kernel boots and my /sbin/su is run
Honestly, I haven't done anything weird - I just wanted to run a debootstrapped Debian in my tablet, and succeeded in doing so. But I am also worried about the cavalier attitude I see on the web about rooting your devices - if you want to be truly safe, you must either do what I did (and recompile the kernel yourself) or absolutely trust the person that gives it to you. I do wish Google had forced a UI-accessible "become root" option in Android, just as Cyanogen does (sigh).
The image I created and used in the video to boot in rooted mode, is available from the link show in the Youtube video details.
Enjoy!

ttsiodras said:
Executive summary: Go to youtube and watch video with ID "gqubgQjqfHw" (I can't post links yet, sorry! ) - or search Youtube for "Rooting MemoPAD10 (ME103K) with my custom compiled kernel"
Analysis:
I hated the fact that my recently purchased MemoPAD10 (ME103K) tablet had no open process to allow me to become root. I don't trust the closed-source one-click root apps that use various exploits, and require communicating with servers in.... China. Why would they need to do that? I wonder...
I therefore decided this was a good opportunity for me to study the relevant documentation and follow the steps necessary to build an Android kernel for my tablet. I then packaged my custom-compiled kernel into my custom boot image, and the video shows how I boot from it and become root in the process.
Note that I didn't burn anything in my tablet - it's a 'tethered' root, it has no side-effects.
If you are a developer, you can read in detail about the steps I had to take to modify the kernel (and su.c) and become root - by reading the questions (and answers!) that I posted in the Android StackExchange forum ( can't post links yet, see the video description in Youtube ).
If you are not a developer, you can download my custom boot image from the link below - but note that this means you are trusting me to not do evil things to your tablet as my kernel boots and my /sbin/su is run
Honestly, I haven't done anything - I just wanted to run a deboot-strapped Debian in my tablet. But I am also worried about the cavalier attitude I see on the web about rooting your devices - if you want to be truly safe, you must either do what I did (and recompile the kernel yourself) or absolutely trust the person that gives it to you. I do wish Google had forced a UI-accessible "become root" option in Android, just as Cyanogen does (sigh).
The image I created and used in the video to boot in rooted mode, is available from the link show in the Youtube video details.
Enjoy!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello ttsiodras,
I had the same problem as OP and didn't want to go the "chinese route" either, especially since there seem to be conflicting reports on whether it works on the ME103k or not so I tried your solution - with mixed results...
Disclaimer: I'm totally new to Android (colour me unpleasantly surprised) and have little experience in Linux, so for further reference I would consider myself an advanced noob. Please keep this in mind when evaluating my claims or judging what I have done so far or am capable of doing by myself in the future.
What I did:
- become developer in the ME103k by tapping the system build repeatedly, then allowing debugging via USB
- use ADB to boot into the bootloader
- use fastboot to boot your boot.rooted.img
What happened:
- I did get root access
- the tab now always boots into the bootloader, even when told via ADB or fastboot to boot normally or into recovery. Pushing buttons etc doesn't seem to work either
- my attempts to do a recovery via the vanilla Asus method has failed due to the same fact that boot never gets past fastboot
Since you claimed in your description that there would be no side-effects since it is a tethered root I am somewhat puzzled as to what exactly happened. From what I understand - which admittedly isn't a lot - what should have happened is that your boot image is loaded, giving me root access until the next reboot without changing anything about the default boot process or image. I read somewhere else that this is how people test out different kernels with fastboot before deciding on which one they want to use on their devices. The whole boot process being changed and corrupted in a way that makes the tablet non-rebootable without having the cable and an adb- and fastboot-capable machine nearby is not really what I would have expected going by your description.
Of course it is entirely possible (and probably even rather likely) that I got something wrong along the way or there is a simple fix to my problem I am not aware of.
As for possible steps maybe you or someone else in the forum could point me to a way to return my tablet to factory settings before risking damaging it beyond repair. I'm assuming that it should be possible and rather straightforward to recover the original setup with the firmware provided by Asus (downloaded the newest version from the homepage) but to be honest I'm a bit scared to go ahead with it before knowing for sure how to do this safely.
One thing seems certain: I won't be able to do it the way Asus says I should unless I can somehow get into normal or recovery boot modes again. I do however still have root access and am able to run fastboot and ADB including shell on the tablet, so it should be possible.
I would certainly appreciate any help very much
Thanks

drsiegberterne said:
. . . From what I understand - which admittedly isn't a lot - what should have happened is that your boot image is loaded, giving me root access until the next reboot without changing anything about the default boot process or image. I read somewhere else that this is how people test out different kernels with fastboot before deciding on which one they want to use on their devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your understanding is correct - that's exactly what should have happened.
I can assure you that the kernel I compiled is formed from the Asus sources with the 2 patches I made that have *nothing* to do with the bootloader - they patch the way that the kernel allows dropping privileges and thus allowing root level access.
Something else must have happened - did you by any chance "burn" the image? i.e. `(DONT DO THIS) fastboot flash boot boot.rooted.img` instead of `fastboot boot boot.rooted.img`?
I did not advocate for burning precisely because it is unpredictable - manufactures sometimes require signing images with their private keys before allowing a boot image to boot (AKA "locked bootloaders") which means that any attempt to burn may lead to weird configurations. . .
If you did burn it, maybe you can try burning the original "boot.img" from the Asus OTA (Over the Air) update .zip file (avaible as a big download at the ASUS site - "UL-K01E-WW-12.16.1.12-user.zip" )
I know of no way to help you with the current state of your tablet, except to "ease the pain" by saying that rebooting to fastboot is always "recoverable" - you can always boot into my own (rooted) kernel or the original (from the ASUS .zip file) with `fastboot boot <whatever_image>`. No "harm" can happen from this - as you correctly said, it's the way to try new kernels and images.
UPDATE - after more reverse engineering:
I had a look into the contents of the boot loader running inside the ME103K, and I am pretty sure that if you execute this at fastboot...
# fastboot oem reset-dev_info
# fastboot reboot
... you will get back to normal, un-tethered bootings of your ME103K.
Thanassis.

ttsiodras said:
Your understanding is correct - that's exactly what should have happened.
I can assure you that the kernel I compiled is formed from the Asus sources with the 2 patches I made that have *nothing* to do with the bootloader - they patch the way that the kernel allows dropping privileges and thus allowing root level access.
Something else must have happened - did you by any chance "burn" the image? i.e. `(DONT DO THIS) fastboot flash boot boot.rooted.img` instead of `fastboot boot boot.rooted.img`?
I did not advocate for burning precisely because it is unpredictable - manufactures sometimes require signing images with their private keys before allowing a boot image to boot (AKA "locked bootloaders") which means that any attempt to burn may lead to weird configurations. . .
If you did burn it, maybe you can try burning the original "boot.img" from the Asus OTA (Over the Air) update .zip file (avaible as a big download at the ASUS site - "UL-K01E-WW-12.16.1.12-user.zip" )
I know of no way to help you with the current state of your tablet, except to "ease the pain" by saying that rebooting to fastboot is always "recoverable" - you can always boot into my own (rooted) kernel or the original (from the ASUS .zip file) with `fastboot boot <whatever_image>`. No "harm" can happen from this - as you correctly said, it's the way to try new kernels and images.
Thanassis.
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Click to collapse
Hi Thanassis,
thanks for your quick reply and your efforts. I'm actually around 85% sure I did not flash the image but since I had no Linux on my computer at the time (I know shame on me) I used a Mac and the command line was a bit different. Since I had never used ADB or fastboot I relied on some guide that explained how to even get into the bootloader and might have gotten something wrong.
On the other hand I later read out the commands I used in the Mac shell and couldn't find anything other than the things I should have done and described earlier, so as far as I can tell this all should never have happened. It may be interesting to point out here that the "stuck in fastboot" mode happened immediately after the first time I loaded your kernel and I most definitely just wrote fastboot boot boot.rooted.img at that point.
As for fixing the problem now it's not only about the inconvenience of the whole thing. I also later (after I was already stuck in fastboot mode) installed some apps for helping me manage privileges of different apps (xposed framework and xprivacy) which turned out to not be compatible in some way or another. So now not only is my tablet not booteable in a normal way but its also cluttered with even more useless stuff than before and I would really like to just reset it before thinking about any other possibilities.
If I flash boot the original ASUS boot image found in the file you described and which i dowloaded already, shouldn't that fix the problem if I accidentally did flash your boot image? Or will there be even more trouble?
Alternatively isn't there a manual way to flash the whole zipped recovery image or am I misunderstanding what this ASUS file actually contains?
And which of the two options is safer to try first or in other words - which one might break the tablet once and for all?
Thanks again and sorry for my incompetence

drsiegberterne said:
Hi Thanassis,
If I flash boot the original ASUS boot image found in the file you described and which i dowloaded already, shouldn't that fix the problem if I accidentally did flash your boot image? Or will there be even more trouble?
. . .
Alternatively isn't there a manual way to flash the whole zipped recovery image or am I misunderstanding what this ASUS file actually contains?
. . .
Thanks again and sorry for my incompetence
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, don't be sorry We are all either choosing to learn in this world (i.e. make mistakes and learn from them), or choose to remain stuck in ignorance. I applaud your efforts in properly rooting the tablet. . .
To the point - remember, you are root now ; whatever apps you installed, you can definitely uninstall them. You don't necessarily need to wipe it.
If you do want to, I'd suggest booting in recovery and doing it the normal way that Asus recommends. Since you said "buttons don't work", you may want to try using the original recovery .img - i.e. "fastboot boot recovery.img". I'd love to suggest a link from ASUS, but they don't host it (which is bad - they really should) - so instead go to "goo" dot "gl" slash "noegkY" - this will point you to a discussion where a kind soul is sharing his ME103K recovery.img.
Booting from the recovery will allow you to install the ASUS OTA update - and probably try cleaning cache partition, etc
Good luck!

ttsiodras said:
No, don't be sorry We are all either choosing to learn in this world (i.e. make mistakes and learn from them), or choose to remain stuck in ignorance. I applaud your efforts in properly rooting the tablet. . .
To the point - remember, you are root now ; whatever apps you installed, you can definitely uninstall them. You don't necessarily need to wipe it.
If you do want to, I'd suggest booting in recovery and doing it the normal way that Asus recommends. Since you said "buttons don't work", you may want to try using the original recovery .img - i.e. "fastboot boot recovery.img". I'd love to suggest a link from ASUS, but they don't host it (which is bad - they really should) - so instead go to "goo" dot "gl" slash "noegkY" - this will point you to a discussion where a kind soul is sharing his ME103K recovery.img.
Booting from the recovery will allow you to install the ASUS OTA update - and probably try cleaning cache partition, etc
Good luck!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem here is that he doesn't seem to have the same version as on my tablet. I have the newest version with Lollipop while this seems to be at least a couple of patches earlier with a completely different version of Android. Won't I risk breaking things even more if I try to apply this - as in trying to recover a recovery that is not on my tablet since certainly the recovery.img doesn't contain all the information needed since it's only 10 MB.
As you can probably guess the whole discussion in your link about what part of the system is broken and how to fix it goes right over my head. It also seems like they did not find a satisfactory solution in the end (short of sending the tablet to ASUS). As you can imagine I'm at quite a loss what to try and what not out of fear to make things worse. At least for now I can still use the tablet to do the things I need it to do.
Thanks for your help anyway, I will try to read up more on the topic and decide what to do next.

drsiegberterne said:
The problem here is that he doesn't seem to have the same version as on my tablet. I have the newest version with Lollipop while this seems to be at least a couple of patches earlier with a completely different version of Android. Won't I risk breaking things even more if I try to apply this - as in trying to recover a recovery that is not on my tablet since certainly the recovery.img doesn't contain all the information needed since it's only 10 MB.
Thanks for your help anyway, I will try to read up more on the topic and decide what to do next.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand how you feel - your tablet is operational now (OK, with the annoyance that you need to boot it in "tethered mode") - so you rightfully fear that you may mess things up with further steps.
Just to clarify something - the recovery img is something that works on its own ; it has no dependency on what kind of Android image is installed in the /system partition.
If you do decide to do it, "fastboot boot recovery.img" will bring you to a spartan menu, showing options that allow you to apply an update (i.e. the ASUS update you downloaded!), clean the /cache partition, etc.
Choose "install update from SD card" (use volume up/down to choose, power btn to select), and navigate to your SD card, where you will have placed the big .zip file from ASUS.
The recovery process will begin, and your tablet will be "wiped" with the image from ASUS. Reboot, and be patient while the tablet boots up - it will be just like the first time you started it (i.e. install from scratch).
Whatever you decide - good luck!

ttsiodras said:
I understand how you feel - your tablet is operational now (OK, with the annoyance that you need to boot it in "tethered mode") - so you rightfully fear that you may mess things up with further steps.
Just to clarify something - the recovery img is something that works on its own ; it has no dependency on what kind of Android image is installed in the /system partition.
If you do decide to do it, "fastboot boot recovery.img" will bring you to a spartan menu, showing options that allow you to apply an update (i.e. the ASUS update you downloaded!), clean the /cache partition, etc.
Choose "install update from SD card" (use volume up/down to choose, power btn to select), and navigate to your SD card, where you will have placed the big .zip file from ASUS.
The recovery process will begin, and your tablet will be "wiped" with the image from ASUS. Reboot, and be patient while the tablet boots up - it will be just like the first time you started it (i.e. install from scratch).
Whatever you decide - good luck!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, a little update from the battlefront:
I tried the recovery image and did get into the menu, however the recovery failed with the same two error messages as in your earlier link ("footer is wrong" and "signature verification failed"). My output from fastboot getvar all is also very similar to the one from that guy except I have a different bootloader version than him (3.03).
Another thing I noticed is that if I boot the standard boot.img found in the ASUS zip it will recognize the internal sdcard normally, however when I boot your rooted image the internal memory doesn't seem to be recognized, at least not through the pre-installed file manager. Downloading a file to the internal storage also failed while rooted but all the apps and the OS itself so far seem totally unaffected otherwise.
My last resort at the moment is the fastboot flash boot boot.img but I have little hope it would change anything since in the thread you linked they proposed just that and if it had worked they probably would have mentioned it.
Can it theoretically break the tablet even more? I would hate to have to send it in because I completely bricked it...

drsiegberterne said:
Okay, a little update from the battlefront:
Another thing I noticed is that if I boot the standard boot.img found in the ASUS zip it will recognize the internal sdcard normally, however when I boot your rooted image the internal memory doesn't seem to be recognized.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not the case for me - everything works fine (including internal and external sdcard), so it's definitely not my kernel causing this.
drsiegberterne said:
My last resort at the moment is the fastboot flash boot boot.img but I have little hope it would change anything since in the thread you linked they proposed just that and if it had worked they probably would have mentioned it.
Can it theoretically break the tablet even more? I would hate to have to send it in because I completely bricked it...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Flashing is always dangerous (from what you've said, I actually theorize that you did, actually, flash already...)
I doubt this will solve the boot issue, to be honest - if I were you, I'd continue to boot tethered (with my image when you need root access, and (maybe) the Asus image when you don't). Myself, I always boot my own bootimage, since I have zero problems with it, and it allows me to run a complete Debian distro in a chroot (thus making my tablet a full-blown UNIX server - e.g. I run privoxy on it to filter all stupid ads in all apps on the tablet, etc).
No matter what you decide, good luck!
Thanassis.

ttsiodras said:
Not the case for me - everything works fine (including internal and external sdcard), so it's definitely not my kernel causing this.
Flashing is always dangerous (from what you've said, I actually theorize that you did, actually, flash already...)
I doubt this will solve the boot issue, to be honest - if I were you, I'd continue to boot tethered (with my image when I need root access, and (maybe) the Asus image when I don't). Myself, I always boot my own bootimage, since I have zero problems with it, and it allows me to run a complete Debian distro in a chroot (thus making my tablet a full-blown UNIX server - e.g. I run privoxy on it to filter all stupid ads in all apps on the tablet, etc).
No matter what you decide, good luck!
Thanassis.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I already tried to flash the original boot.img yesterday but it didn't change anything as you correctly assumed so I guess for now there is nothing more to do. I might write to the Asus support and maybe send the tablet in if it is free of charge for me (which I doubt). The only other option is to spend the next months to get sufficiently versed in Android to actually fix the problems myself but even for that I would probably need some files or source code from Asus. I find it rather disappointing the way these "closed" systems work nowadays, with the advancement of Linux and Open Source I really would have expected the opposite to be true but apparently people care more about convenience than actually being able to use the tools they buy in the way they want to.
Getting these Android devices like buying a hammer that can't hammer things in on Sundays.

drsiegberterne said:
I find it rather disappointing the way these "closed" systems work nowadays, with the advancement of Linux and Open Source I really would have expected the opposite to be true but apparently people care more about convenience than actually being able to use the tools they buy in the way they want to
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I share the sentiment - it's really sad.

Undoing the tethered root
drsiegberterne said:
I already tried to flash the original boot.img yesterday but it didn't change anything as you correctly assumed so I guess for now there is nothing more to do. I might write to the Asus support and maybe send the tablet in if it is free of charge for me (which I doubt). The only other option is to spend the next months to get sufficiently versed in Android to actually fix the problems myself but even for that I would probably need some files or source code from Asus. I find it rather disappointing the way these "closed" systems work nowadays, with the advancement of Linux and Open Source I really would have expected the opposite to be true but apparently people care more about convenience than actually being able to use the tools they buy in the way they want to.
Getting these Android devices like buying a hammer that can't hammer things in on Sundays.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi drsiegberterne - I had a look into the contents of the boot loader running inside the ME103K, and I am pretty sure that if you execute this at fastboot...
# fastboot oem reset-dev_info
# fastboot reboot
... you will get back to normal, un-tethered bootings of your ME103K.
Hope this solves your problem!
Kind regards,
Thanassis.

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