Related
Hi All,
Running rooted Hero with Modaco 2.5.1 rom ( thanks Paul )
Was hoping someone could ( simplistically ) answer a few question for me.
As I understand it - one of the things holding back development of Hero ROMS is that HTC haven't released the kernel for the Hero.
1) What exactly IS the kernel in the greater scheme of things?
2) When are HTC likely to release it?
3) When it is released, what new things will it allow developers to do?
4) Anything else relevant to it worth knowing?
TIA
Look at these:
1. The kernel is the Operating System for the phone, it runs everything.
2. That is the magic question...
3. It'll allow more development in terms of mods. we'll be able to change alot more and get more out of the phones.
I'm sure others will have more detailed explanations.
Regarding question 2:
I've gotten response from HTC support the other day that the release is planned but no sure date could be given.
Date: 5th of October
My question:
Hello there, I realize that this might not be the normal kind of request you guys get, but here goes. This is probably not your average request and might require escalation. I was wondering when the source code for the Hero kernel was gonna be available at developer.htc.com?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Answer:
Hello
This is quite a normal question we get here at HTC. The source code is something that will becoming soon. We have had contact with those far higher than my self or are planning on adding the source code as soon as possible. I have not been given a time scale but bases on the code for the two other handsets i should expect it in the next couple of weeks.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, educated guess would be around the release of the Hero in the US.
Some if I have this right -
The kernel is the basic underlying OS of the phone, and a ROM sits on top of this end gives us the end user experience ( and Sense UI is within the ROM ).
Am I right in thinking the kernel is linux based?
And a big magic question - when the kernel is released, will people be able to modify it and get the bluetooth working properly?
Sorry if it's a bit basic - but interesting to me....
The Kernel is not the OS (As most people understand an OS to be) (OS meaning Operating System)
It's at the core of the OS but is not the OS. You can keep the same build of an OS but update the kernel and vica versa. It is (put simply) what converts the hardware calls from the OS into something the hardware understands.
So (using current issues as explanation) The OS tries to load the GPS and the kernel isn't configured with the right settings the GPS won't load. Similarly if you try and use the trackball and it's not setup in the kernel then it won't do anything.
The OS will still work fine with other things but until the kernel has the right settings put into it it just won't see the parts of the phone it's not set up to.
Here is a technical description of a Kernel.
http://www.linfo.org/kernel.html
I'm sure I've just made it as clear as dishwater but if not I hope it's helped.
J-Zeus said:
Some if I have this right -
The kernel is the basic underlying OS of the phone, and a ROM sits on top of this end gives us the end user experience ( and Sense UI is within the ROM ).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly. To add to what akirainblack has said already...ROM stands for Read Only Memory. In this context it is a bit different as it is the complete package that makes up the Kernel, the OS and anything that is pre-installed to the phone. When you run the RUU (Rom Update Utilitiy) on your PC is completely refreshes the system software in your phone - Kernel, OS and any pre-installed apps - just as if you had bought it from the shop like that.
J-Zeus said:
Am I right in thinking the kernel is linux based?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes.
Hmmm...
simple question... when the kernel is available... would we be able to get a white taskbar on the Hero?
//Nik
When the kernel source is available, we should be able to rebuild Android completely from the source code repositories and do practically whatever you want.
Regards,
Dave
foxmeister said:
When the kernel source is available, we should be able to rebuild Android completely from the source code repositories and do practically whatever you want.
Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Including getting Bluetooth working?
J-Zeus said:
Including getting Bluetooth working?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In theory, yes. In practice, the situation is a little more complicated, but at the very least I'd imagine it would be possible to get BlueX, or something like it, working on rooted Heros fairly quickly.
Regards,
Dave
Given that this is a Linux kernel, aren't HTC required by the GPL to make the source available to all Hero owners?
This is covering the same ground, but is another way to look at things regarding the kernel and the OS. The kernel abstracts the specifics of the hardware from the Android system. For example, when the Android system requests that the bluetooth hardware be enabled, the kernel can translate that request so that it works with the particular hardware of the phone - as the bluetooth hardware of the Magic may be different from the bluetooth hardware of the Hero. So the kernel, is an interface that translates and Android call to the specific hardware level controls necessary. The kernel sits between the hardware and the Android system.
It also means that releasing the kernel will not allow us to make changes to the Hero Android user interfaces. If we want to change colours, icons and so on in the Hero ROM, we would need the source code for their "tweaked" Android and maybe to some degree their TouchFlo software. I doubt they would give that away. It would allows us however, to tweak the kernel, or transplant the driver code for specific hardware pieces in the Hero, to a newer version kernel.
I understand that the release of the hero kernel, could help me with my cause (getting 1.5/1.6 'clean' android on my hero without any htc apps/front ends).
Somebody suggested contacting HTC and asking for it to be released.
I have a few questions regarding that:
1) Has this happened before? That HTC released an android kernel?
2) Did this happen after the request?
3) Who should we contact to get it? (which HTC division)
4) Is there a possibility that they don't want to release it, because it would allow people to copy parts of the proprietary interface?
E2K said:
1) Has this happened before? That HTC released an android kernel?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Take a look at http://developer.htc.com/
The Dream and Magic sources are available.
E2K said:
4) Is there a possibility that they don't want to release it, because it would allow people to copy parts of the proprietary interface?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The HTC Sense UI won't be included in the kernel source.
They dont have to release the source of them.
New question
Is it possible to create a new donut kernel (2.6.29) with the changes they made to the 1.5 kernel (2.6.27)?
Looks like they send you the hole kernel, not just some patches and new drivers...
mopodo said:
Take a look at http://developer.htc.com/
The Dream and Magic sources are available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So this means that we could compile or 'cook' a working vanilla android 1.5 for the HTC hero, with everything working fully?
HTC HAS to release the kernel source as required under the GPL license that the kernel was released under. It is indeed a linux kernel and it contains the necessary parts to work the hardware along with extra drivers and modules (stupid monolithic kernels).
Here's what I don't get (and hopefully somebody will clarify this for me). Why hasn't anybody tried building android with the current kernel available? Android has the ability to be built around a pre-compiled kernel (it does this if you do a straight make right after repo sync with the pre-compiled dream kernel). You'd only need to re-build the wlan.ko module for the new kernel and the gps module would be compiled against the specified kernel, so it should work.
If I had Hero, I'd test it (if you want to trade your Hero for my G1, hit me up ), but there's no reason it shouldn't work.
Up to now, I've only seen ports, and those are hard to make work because of the pre-compiled files, so that leads to loads of file-swapping and finger-crossing, but an AOSP make should still work. Anybody wanna try it (or post me a hero kernel and I'll compile you a stock donut build to test).
jubeh said:
HTC HAS to release the kernel source as required under the GPL license that the kernel was released under. It is indeed a linux kernel and it contains the necessary parts to work the hardware along with extra drivers and modules (stupid monolithic kernels).
Here's what I don't get (and hopefully somebody will clarify this for me). Why hasn't anybody tried building android with the current kernel available? Android has the ability to be built around a pre-compiled kernel (it does this if you do a straight make right after repo sync with the pre-compiled dream kernel). You'd only need to re-build the wlan.ko module for the new kernel and the gps module would be compiled against the specified kernel, so it should work.
If I had Hero, I'd test it (if you want to trade your Hero for my G1, hit me up ), but there's no reason it shouldn't work.
Up to now, I've only seen ports, and those are hard to make work because of the pre-compiled files, so that leads to loads of file-swapping and finger-crossing, but an AOSP make should still work. Anybody wanna try it (or post me a hero kernel and I'll compile you a stock donut build to test).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, thank you for this information. You make it sound like it's possible
I tried searching for the Hero Kernel, but I could only find this:
http://developer.htc.com/
The hero is not listed (maybe it shares a lot with the magic kernel?).
edit: this post dating from september 10 stated that HTC would "release the kernel source soon".
This was more than a month ago though..
edit2: calling HTC Netherlands right now..
edit3: after explainig the need for the kernel, I've been on hold for 10 minutes now..
edit4: more than 18 minutes now
edit5: after 26 minutes I hang up
Well I have a Hero running Modaco 2.2. I could post this kernel (where?) Or it surely could be extracted from one of the ROMs available on this very site
SquiffSquiff said:
Well I have a Hero running Modaco 2.2. I could post this kernel (where?) Or it surely could be extracted from one of the ROMs available on this very site
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I could be wrong, but I believe there is a difference between the 'kernel', and the 'kernel source'. The second one is needed when you want to compile the kernel.
Speaking as one who has compiled kernels in the past there are three components required here:
The kernel source- this is typically available from http://kernel.org/ If HTC have made any changes to the source of the kernel itself then these should be apparent in their distribution of the kernel source
The relevant configuration file '.config' which should accompany their distribution of the kernel source and permit you to compile any other kernel as a drop in replacement.
Source code and makefiles for any custom kernel modules ('drivers' in windows terminology) In Linux these have to be compiled together with the kernel.
To use a cookery analogy:
The kernel source is the raw ingredients. It can be set up for anything from a supercomputer to a DVD player depending on how you use it. The kernel config is the method which will allow you to bake the type of cake you intend. The modules sources are any of HTC’s own custom ingredients required for everything to work. THe kernel is the finished cake which you eat.
Hello developers,
I'm starting this thread because I'm interested in designing a development environment for the Samsung Galaxy Tab so that developers, like myself, can have an easy environment for modifying the Android OS. I'll be aiming this environment at all Android Devices but I want to start with the Samsung Galaxy Tab.
At the moment I don't have much of a structure for this project, nor much direction, so if anyone has any ideas for what tools etc I should include in this please let me know. If anyone wants to get on board with the project it would also be appreciated. Send me an email.
tool ideas:
- integrating the GCC and Javac compilers into the environment.
- integrating a way to generate make files and to build from these files.
- GUI for editing files from the kernel and application framework.
- easy to use way of setting up branches for projects with the Repo and Git included in the Android Source Code.
Count me in. I am getting a Tab tonight and I plan to develop for it. Currently, I have got the froyo source on my machine and want to integrate the open source code that Samsung released for this device.
Has anyone successfully built a custom ROM using the Samsung source code? Any help on this will be appreciated.
Awesome!
I've got Froyo working on the Tab, which I built from the source code from the android open source project website but it's just a generic build from the straight source, nothing special. not with the samsung code though. do you have any links for it?
I've put a small amount of stuff into the Dev Environment, most just shell files etc to make installing everything easier. One click sort of thing.
My first task though is going to be to try and fix the failure that is the Samsung display driver. Most noticeable are the 4 by 1 widgets that don't stretch across the whole screen.
After that I'm going to start work on a GUI for the environment and the iOS Emulator.
thoughts?
Whats wrong with Android SDK and Eclipse?
It's not the most straight forward thing. I'm looking to make something that includes its own libraries too. It's aimed at beginning developers mostly, so you can literally download one file which includes everything you'll need then start editting and then one click to compile and have it all work. Simplicity
I'm also interested in this... The SGT is my first android device, and my company will want android apps for internal and external uses... and a one click dev environment would be a most welcome option!
DevShroom said:
I've got Froyo working on the Tab, which I built from the source code from the android open source project website but it's just a generic build from the straight source, nothing special. not with the samsung code though. do you have any links for it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Straight up AOSP? Could you have a crack at CM?
Anything you need, including testers, I'm in.
I have programmed some programs in android. If you need my help, i will be glad to help,
Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk
i'm currently setting up a new galaxy Tab ubuntu 10.10 VM but I always fail at installing java5-jdk, but when im ready i'm going to have a look at the CM and AOSP source and i !try! to port CM to the tab!
I am working on a custom rom , if you need any help do not hesitate
yann06 said:
I am working on a custom rom , if you need any help do not hesitate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
are u building from source or are you modifing a stock rom?
DevShroom said:
Hello developers,
I'm starting this thread because I'm interested in designing a development environment for the Samsung Galaxy Tab so that developers, like myself, can have an easy environment for modifying the Android OS. I'll be aiming this environment at all Android Devices but I want to start with the Samsung Galaxy Tab.
At the moment I don't have much of a structure for this project, nor much direction, so if anyone has any ideas for what tools etc I should include in this please let me know. If anyone wants to get on board with the project it would also be appreciated. Send me an email.
tool ideas:
- integrating the GCC and Javac compilers into the environment.
- integrating a way to generate make files and to build from these files.
- GUI for editing files from the kernel and application framework.
- easy to use way of setting up branches for projects with the Repo and Git included in the Android Source Code.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll be interested in getting involved in a community driven project for the SGT. I'm a unix admin with lots of experience in the OS and system development field. Interested in what ideas you have on this.
Try using openjdk. It works for me.
Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk
Thanks everyone for the positive feedback on all this! it'll be good to have as many people on board as possible.
if you have troubles downloading the sun-java5-jdk there is a good tutorial on it on this site, it doesnt come as part of the repository by default so until you add it in sudo apt-get install sun-java5-jdk will not work.
atm i am only working with AOSP not CM, i am trying to set this dev environment up for a nice simple build and then i'll start working on more complex builds so we can start developing custom roms.
@paulshields - do you know much about linux/android drivers? i wanna fix the widget sizing problem on SGT but my driver knowledge is limited
HI,
I am a developer and have allot of experiance to contribute here (and i'm inrested in that ) i have saw that current latst source code is here:
http://developer.sonyericsson.com/wportal/devworld/downloads/download/402a058tarbz2?cc=gb&lc=en
i wanted to know if is there a tutrial/guid for getting started compiling the code for a specific device and understanding the source hierarchy/top level desing etc.
Thanks,
LaBBa.
There is a tutorial for compiling the kernel, it's in the dev website for sure, but I don't know if it had its own thread here.
labbala said:
HI,
I am a developer and have allot of experiance to contribute here (and i'm inrested in that ) i have saw that current latst source code is here:
http://developer.sonyericsson.com/wportal/devworld/downloads/download/402a058tarbz2?cc=gb&lc=en
i wanted to know if is there a tutrial/guid for getting started compiling the code for a specific device and understanding the source hierarchy/top level desing etc.
Thanks,
LaBBa.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just so you know mow. There is no good tutorial for compiling source. I searched for weeks for a reliable guide but never found one. I only had help from another Dec who explained it all to me.!
Sent from my LT18i using xda premium
Read through the cm wiki and android x86 they both have good tutorials
\.|.. -_- ..|./ I am chuck ****in norris \.|.. -_- ..|./
I just sent them this
Code:
Hello,
kernel source for 1.29 and 2.05 for HTC One X is still not available.
These delays are hindering community efforts to fix your inept software and are in breach of GPL. Please provide me the link to the source to to those 2 kernels and make sure that you release the source at the same time as the binary form.
I am ready to escalate this via gpl-violations.org unless your response satisfies me.
Regards
Jan Schermer
If anybody wants to chime in, you're welcome.
Samsung is just better at this.. look at the SIII it was released after the OneX but it has many many more custom truly cocked roms!
And i'm sick of such useless posts. They will release it when they will release it. Get a life.
Why would they publish the source for a test RUU? 1.29 OK but not 2.05 yet
zvieratko said:
I just sent them this
Code:
Hello,
kernel source for 1.29 and 2.05 for HTC One X is still not available.
These delays are hindering community efforts to fix your inept software and are in breach of GPL. Please provide me the link to the source to to those 2 kernels and make sure that you release the source at the same time as the binary form.
I am ready to escalate this via gpl-violations.org unless your response satisfies me.
Regards
Jan Schermer
If anybody wants to chime in, you're welcome.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you forgot one main thing
2.05 is unreleased and leaked
And now no more leaked test releases lol.
Well done!!! Demand source codes for versions that aren't even released yet.
Lmao what is going on here
Sent from eXoDiZeD rom
They have to provide source code for every binary to those who got the binary. So I assume those 2.05 testers have the source for their kernels, don't they? if they did, it would leak, and we would profit from it (it's our right because so does HTC!).
Also, what devs here do is illegal - I could demand the source code from them but they don't have it - is it okay to force them into illegality just because HTC are being ignorant?
And those posts are not meaningless, they are violating GPL and withholding source code for no real reason. All source-built kernels are still based on 1.28, but they fixed a lot of stuff on 1.29, and for me (a linux professional) those hacks show in lots of places.
What are you doing here if you really want HTC-built Sense then? Do you want to run slapped-together binary ROMs because there is no source for the latest update? This is called Android Development for a reason.
zvieratko said:
They have to provide source code for every binary to those who got the binary. So I assume those 2.05 testers have the source for their kernels, don't they? if they did, it would leak, and we would profit from it (it's our right because so does HTC!).
Also, what devs here do is illegal - I could demand the source code from them but they don't have it - is it okay to force them into illegality just because HTC are being ignorant?
And those posts are not meaningless, they are violating GPL and withholding source code for no real reason. All source-built kernels are still based on 1.28, but they fixed a lot of stuff on 1.29, and for me (a linux professional) those hacks show in lots of places.
What are you doing here if you really want HTC-built Sense then? Do you want to run slapped-together binary ROMs because there is no source for the latest update? This is called Android Development for a reason.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you can not demand anything from an internal leaked file! in fact your possession of the leaked rom might be illegal lol
hamdir said:
you can not demand anything from an internal leaked file! in fact your possession of the leaked rom might be illegal lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That might be true. But AFAIK the 2.05 RUU was provided to some public testers as well.
I just opted to demand 2.05 as well in case it takes them a month to respond and it will be released by then, it did no harm in any case.
Also, we wouldn't have to have this debate if the development was actually transparent (that means - HTC working with community, not just pushing uncompilable sources for their old kernels). But I guess most managers can't grasp that concept without the proper buzzwords.
Sorry, I'm pissed at many more things than just HTC right now, but I directed my anger here
zvieratko said:
They have to provide source code for every binary to those who got the binary. So I assume those 2.05 testers have the source for their kernels, don't they? if they did, it would leak, and we would profit from it (it's our right because so does HTC!)....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can demand open source codes not closed source and to get open source android, simply get AOSP sources. HTC will publish their sources when they want and after they finish.
EOT.
AdamLange said:
You can demand open source codes not closed source and to get open source android, simply get AOSP sources. HTC will publish their sources when they want and after they finish.
EOT.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know that kernel is GPL and what that means, right? Or are you just trolling? HTC is obliged to provide source code - it's not a goodwill gesture, and they consistently fail to do that.
Or are you talking just about 2.05? In that case, the first tester outside HTC should get the source code and would be free to release it to us - closed beta or not.
Some parts of kernel may be closed (for example modules). They can post kernel without them. Its like AOSP android, you can download it, and compile and use, but you will not get Android Apps (gmail,youtube etc) included. cause they are CLOSED.
AdamLange said:
Some parts of kernel may be closed (for example modules). They can post kernel without them. Its like AOSP android, you can download it, and compile and use, but you will not get Android Apps (gmail,youtube etc) included. cause they are CLOSED.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but they don't even post the sources without blobs...
sorr932 said:
Samsung is just better at this.. look at the SIII it was released after the OneX but it has many many more custom truly cocked roms!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pmsl
TRULY COCKED ROMS
pro tip, if you don't act like a self-entitled brat when asking for something which they are required todo you are more likely to get an informed helpful response.
if that really is the email that you sent I wouldn't be surprised if it was just moved to the email bin
AdamLange said:
And i'm sick of such useless posts. They will release it when they will release it. Get a life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1:good:
Patrick Volkerdings: Its finished if its finished
sorr932 said:
Samsung is just better at this.. look at the SIII it was released after the OneX but it has many many more custom truly cocked roms!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Frankly ,they can have x3 more custom rom`s but we have one who is better then all SIII ROM`s together , we are so lucky and really need to be proud with our original developers like Venom Team , so S3 performance without ROM like our ViperX is in vain.
Don`t worry be happy! :victory:
Thread now closed. This thread has become off topic. I have had to remove a couple of posts that had bad language. Remember people to follow XDA rules when posting.
Is building lollipop rom from source for nokia x possible? Or there technical difficulties. Some months ago some developers posted things about planning it. Yet no Lollipop rom avail for this nokia x ? feeling sad.. :crying:
vrp_pradep said:
Is building lollipop rom from source for nokia x possible? Or there technical difficulties. Some months ago some developers posted things about planning it. Yet no Lollipop rom avail for this nokia x ? feeling sad.. :crying:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi....so here is the answer...
Yes,its possible and therefore some difficulties..the main problem is Nokia hasnot released the sources of the device or atleast the kernel source.so,why we need those sources...good question.because these contain all the things related to the mobile OS or simply rom.using the sources of nokia x we can create other roms...but good thing is we dont need all the rom sources,all we need is the kernel source and the device tree from the Nokia x sources.the device tree is the important thing that helps for building the whole rom...it works like a ATM card...we just need to insert it and press the code the machine does the work and gives the money.this migth look difficult but lets hear the good news....we have kernel source thanks to Null kernel dev.we can use those sources for the kernel and the important thing the device tree...we also have that,thanks to AOSP/vanilla rom from dev.but there is only one problem here and that is,the device tree is for jellybean and we are talking about lollipop...I will give you a example,now this time its like drawing the money from bank not from ATM.we have fill the form and stay in line and ultimately we will get money.the result(money) is same but the process gets a little delicated or problematic.lets get this clear...all we have to do is,to hack the device tree(from vanilla or AOSP) to build for lollipop thags it and after a little effort we will get the lollipop...hope this helps you....I think this is the way...if am wrong I am sorry....I am a nOOb