Develop Bugs

Worth it to get apps2sd setup ?

Been debating whether to setup the apps2sd feature on my phone but after searching about it, not really sure if its worth it from what I gather?
is there any benefit from setting this up?
Also, will there be any negative effect if my SD card is partitioned, and I flash a ROM that does not support apps2sd?
Just thinking ahead. don't want to set my phone up for failure once I get ROM crazy (new to android).
Running DC 3.2.3 btw.

You should have at least a class 6 SD card if you're gonna do it. Basically it just frees up internal memory. You probably won't notice a speed difference on a phone this fast. However, it did improve app loading on my G1. Haven't used it on the EVO yet.
Sent from my EVO using xda App

dglowe343 said:
You should have at least a class 6 SD card if you're gonna do it. Basically it just frees up internal memory. You probably won't notice a speed difference on a phone this fast. However, it did improve app loading on my G1. Haven't used it on the EVO yet.
Sent from my EVO using xda App
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I've use it on the stock 8gb havent had not one problem also just upgraded to16gb class 2 using now not one problem running damage control 3.2.3 also when I had HTC Touch Pro ran all my apps on SD card no problem just back up your cards on hard drive disc whatever always upload your pictures via flicker dropbox
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

[Q] Write speed of the internal memory?

As I prepare to purchase a Gnex from Google (lets hope its not one of the defective ones!!) I found out that the phone does not have a micro SD card slot. As such I will be limited to the 16GB that comes on the GSM version I plan on buying. My question is related to the write speed of the internal memory, since I know there are different classes of SD cards. The higher the class the better the write speed which is very important for recording HD video at high bitrates. With regards to internal memory, what "class" is it comparable to? I would hate to buy a GNEX only to find out it struggles recording 40Mbps HD due to a limitation of the built in memory.

Records HD video fine. But theyre hacks to improve it. Large files transfer to it at a rate similar to my class 6. On my evo4g.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

When doing a benchmark I get a write speed of 8.7 MBps which is comparable to a class 9 (Doesn't actually exist) SD card. The highest class you can get is 10, so you should be fine.
Edit: This is using the Verizon (Toro) Galaxy Nexus.

Malibu,
Technically any SD card can record HD, the problems start when you get above 20Mbps. If the write speed isnt high enough you will get stuttering and choppiness. This is further amplified if you modify your camera to record at 40Mbps (obviously much better picture quality) and that is where my concern lies. You mention your other phone has similar to a class 6 write speed, would you mind testing the internal memory on your Gnex? Also, do you have a GSM or CDMA version of the Gnex?

miketoasty said:
When doing a benchmark I get a write speed of 8.7 MBps which is comparable to a class 9 (Doesn't actually exist) SD card. The highest class you can get is 10, so you should be fine.
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Click to collapse
Ok great, this is exactly the data I am looking for! Have you modified your HD video settings, and if so, how were the results?

[Q] pathetic I/O score from quadrant standard

Ever since OTA update from 4.0.2 to 4.0.4, my quadrant score has been consistently sucky. 1957 overall, the worst being database write scores of 950 or so. So I rooted and flashed CWR and GLaDOS (v1.34) kernel to see if that might do anything. Nope. I screwed around with the SD cache and increased it to 1024KB, and that didn't help any either.
I don't know what I'm doing Anybody know how to make this better, or if I even should care... I mean, maybe Quadrant Standard is broken, idk. I tried SD Tools to see if maybe a different app would get a different score but it got a buffer error and refused to run or do anything. Sucks.
GNex 4.0.4 stock IMM76K (CDMA) 3.0.8-GLaDOS-V1.34

You shouldn't care.

Test it with another benchmark to confirm That low of a score will bottleneck performance (if its real). Normally I say ignore it, but in this case you might want to investigate further.
Stop playing with sd readahead. If there was ever a worthless tweak on Galaxy Nexus, this takes the cake.

Does your phone seem laggy. If not don't worry about it.
Sent from rooted Jitterbug running ICS

Firstly, pay no mind whatsoever to benchmarks. They're not fair since they show the best results in perfect conditions such as just rebooted, unrealisticly high overclock, few apps installed and so on so forth.
Secondly, do not use SD readahead like adrynalyne said. The Galaxy Nexus has no external storage. Only the internal storage partitioned and mounted as external, but it's still the internal NAND flash memory.
On phones with an actual SD card in an SD card slot, that tweak would maybe be good.
Real-time use diverts from benchmark use.

I thought tweaking the SD cache would work for the internal SD card too, but considering I had to google readahead imma go ahead and defer to your obviously superior knowledge :3
I just ran AnTuTu and got 647 on I/O, 5615 overall I'm not too sure how this score matches up to Quadrant Standard, but it shows poor me being much lower than the average GNex.
It does seem laggy sometimes and runs hot... 42C sitting there idle, on the charger...

stompsfrogs said:
I thought tweaking the SD cache would work for the internal SD card too, but considering I had to google readahead imma go ahead and defer to your obviously superior knowledge :3
I just ran AnTuTu and got 647 on I/O, 5615 overall I'm not too sure how this score matches up to Quadrant Standard, but it shows poor me being much lower than the average GNex.
It does seem laggy sometimes and runs hot... 42C sitting there idle, on the charger...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats just it though, there is no internal SD (and even if there was, the tweak wouldn't affect I/O scores).
647 is a decent score on Antutu for i/o, so I would say you are fine.

adrynalyne said:
Thats just it though, there is no internal SD (and even if there was, the tweak wouldn't affect I/O scores).
647 is a decent score on Antutu for i/o, so I would say you are fine.
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Click to collapse
k thx. I thought the folder called mnt/sdcard was like a fake SD card, except with MTP instead of FAT or whatever normal SD cards have... I don't quite get this lower level stuff still, and I been trying to be smarter about it for a while. Every time I learn something they change it

stompsfrogs said:
k thx. I thought the folder called mnt/sdcard was like a fake SD card, except with MTP instead of FAT or whatever normal SD cards have... I don't quite get this lower level stuff still, and I been trying to be smarter about it for a while. Every time I learn something they change it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google was kind of clever with the sdcard. It is actually a symlink to the data partition. Specifically, /data/media is the same directory as /sdcard.

symlinks, I heard of those! I been putting Linux on everything I can get my hands on recently. I'm still in the "breaking everything" stage but I got as far into regex as ln -s.
and it turns out, the heat was from 4G. I forgot about that.
thanks bunches adrynalyne.

As long as its not laggy or slow, you shouldnt care, unless its a competition for you
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

Quadrant is a joke of a benchmark. Don't worry too much about it unless you notice slow-downs in actual use.

Some kind of SOB got a score 8617 clocked at 1200mhz with 4.0.1.
Can anyone explain how this kind of **** happened???

stompsfrogs said:
Ever since OTA update from 4.0.2 to 4.0.4, my quadrant score has been consistently sucky. 1957 overall, the worst being database write scores of 950 or so. So I rooted and flashed CWR and GLaDOS (v1.34) kernel to see if that might do anything. Nope. I screwed around with the SD cache and increased it to 1024KB, and that didn't help any either.
I don't know what I'm doing Anybody know how to make this better, or if I even should care... I mean, maybe Quadrant Standard is broken, idk. I tried SD Tools to see if maybe a different app would get a different score but it got a buffer error and refused to run or do anything. Sucks.
GNex 4.0.4 stock IMM76K (CDMA) 3.0.8-GLaDOS-V1.34
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I got the same...
Looking at the results, everything looks the same as the example Galaxy nexus, but I got an I/O around 1024, when a friend of mine with a galaxy note had around 4000... :S
Overall results are lower than the nexus one because of this lack of IO???
Did they put the results wrong on the Quadrant app or they tested with another ROM? I have rooted stock rom.

Worth upgrading from c6 to c10 sd card

Hi,
i have the problem of not enough memory OR a slow system. Currently im using a class6 16gb microsd with default app2sd from the rom (JB spazedog), but the app data fills up the internal memory nonetheless. If i move everything (not just apps) to the sd the system is getting slow and unresponsive.
It is worth getting a faster sd (class 10) and moving everything to sd or do i have no choice but keeping apps to a minimum?
Thx

drdoomgod said:
It is worth getting a faster sd (class 10)?
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No, but it would probably be worth to change to some rom which is not in beta and fits in /system small enough to have /data big enough to keep dalvik on nand and give more space for apps.

When using 6class and 10class i feel no significant changes in speed of app2sd area.
running speed test, write speed is usually about the same, read gives little higher results.
attachment below 16gb Transcend 10class vs Adata 8 gb 6class

I'm using ICS Spazedog and DiskManager is working fine. Sometimes I have to switch pages when looking at app storage to get it to work. Maybe it didn't install properly, maybe your partitions need to be aligned, maybe the SD card needs to be reformatted. Could be quite a few things doing it.

Nope

Class 6 -> 10
If you use App2SD, definitely no.
If you use Data2SD, it is possible to see some differences.

oxyg3n89 said:
When using 6class and 10class i feel no significant changes in speed of app2sd area.
running speed test, write speed is usually about the same, read gives little higher results.
attachment below 16gb Transcend 10class vs Adata 8 gb 6class
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Click to collapse
In terms of memory, you have to keep in mind that using a2sd means sending the dalvik (if you choose so) ans the app to the sd-ext. While it allows to more internal space, it still decreases.
The sd-ext partition is practically limited to 1024mb by the desire inter storage size too, meaning that going over 1gb of sd-ext size wouldn't be better.
Now like erklat said, it is better to switch to more stable ROM as JB ROMs offer few space and their behavior have not yet been standardized.
Recap: In terms of memory, it is not necessary to change to an upper class, but it is always a nice harmless improvement.
In terms of speed, I have seen that changing to class 10 gives great speed changes in terms of massive gaming:
Due to the higher read speed and also with the read ahead bumped I was able to increase greatly the loading time of such games as Modern Combat 3 and Nova 3. I was surprised since I thought that it was because of the processor mainly that it was so slow. There is an increase in performance when switching to an upper class, but frankly you cannot notice it unless you benchmark the results by testing with a ressource eater app.
To recap: It is worth the change only for the read speed. I'm not sure but I think that write speed is somewhat limited somehow by the hardware. (I'm thinking about windows here, if someone could confirm that please. )
________________________________
Please press thanks if I helped you in any way.
Sent from my HTC Desire using the xda app.

..

I am using class 10 transcend 8gb for spazedog JB rom and class 6 transcend 8gb for cm7 rom. No issues.
Sent from my HTC Desire using xda app-developers app

Yep, 633x does work!

OK, after searching for a good SD card... I found 100mb/s reads from top shelf SD cards made for high def recording to work well on our Note 8.0 devices.
Though I did the mistake of moving a few 500+ MB apps to SD, yes they were quick to transfer... just as slow at backing up to SD as before my tests.
One thing that is a hidden bonus... before, when I disabled saving cached images in a xposed module... there was considerable lag in showing album art from mp3 files. Now it is barely noticeable when scrolling at a fast pace. I had over 300MB of cached images before disabling android's built in feature. Now I can have my cake and eat it.
Since many are moving apps to SD, I recommend the fastest speed you can get, not the fastest you can afford.
remember write speeds will very, by burst mode and read/write verification, as with TI Backup. I would assume dumping data would be greater, just have no way to measure quantitatively, just seat of the trousers.
Here is a list of compatible ultra high speed SD cards.
PNY Elite 100MB/s (Able to get them in the UK, US is low availability)
Sandisk Extreme (Plus/Pro) 95MB/s
Toshiba Exceria 95MB/s
Lexar 633x 95MB/s

gooberdude said:
OK, after searching for a good SD card... I found 100mb/s reads from top shelf SD cards made for high def recording to work well on our Note 8.0 devices.
Though I did the mistake of moving a few 500+ MB apps to SD, yes they were quick to transfer... just as slow at backing up to SD as before my tests.
One thing that is a hidden bonus... before, when I disabled saving cached images in a xposed module... there was considerable lag in showing album art from mp3 files. Now it is barely noticeable when scrolling at a fast pace. I had over 300MB of cached images before disabling android's built in feature. Now I can have my cake and eat it.
Since many are moving apps to SD, I recommend the fastest speed you can get, not the fastest you can afford.
remember write speeds will very, by burst mode and read/write verification, as with TI Backup. I would assume dumping data would be greater, just have no way to measure quantitatively, just seat of the trousers.
Here is a list of compatible ultra high speed SD cards.
PNY Elite 100MB/s (Able to get them in the UK, US is low availability)
Sandisk Extreme (Plus/Pro) 95MB/s
Toshiba Exceria 95MB/s
Lexar 633x 95MB/s
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I forgot to add... I have done extensive redirection of files and folders to SD card. I only moved apps over 200mb in size as their data was a bit large to be taking up system ram.
All my downloads, media, backups and internet cache are stored on SD card. About half of the apps allow default folder redirection, so an xposed plugin was used to set redirect system defaults for all media types and downloads. So far I do not see any noticeable lag as before using my old SD card. Though it was 20mb/s read/write capable. I am now at 95MBps / 45MBps
I am using Trickster Mod to push my cache to 2048 for added speed improvements.

gooberdude said:
I forgot to add... I have done extensive redirection of files and folders to SD card. I only moved apps over 200mb in size as their data was a bit large to be taking up system ram.
All my downloads, media, backups and internet cache are stored on SD card. About half of the apps allow default folder redirection, so an xposed plugin was used to set redirect system defaults for all media types and downloads. So far I do not see any noticeable lag as before using my old SD card. Though it was 20mb/s read/write capable. I am now at 95MBps / 45MBps
I am using Trickster Mod to push my cache to 2048 for added speed improvements.
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Click to collapse
Are they actual speeds, or speeds claimed by the manufacturer? Big difference. I'm not totally convinced the SD-interface itself is capable of such high speeds, but I would love to be wrong on that.

thany2 said:
Are they actual speeds, or speeds claimed by the manufacturer? Big difference. I'm not totally convinced the SD-interface itself is capable of such high speeds, but I would love to be wrong on that.
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Click to collapse
I have no real data as android does not have a good set of tools for proper testing.
I do know the speeds given are maximum. Given that doing random read/write functions will be much lower.
Though I did test a UHS-1 64gb that had 30mb/s read - 20mb/s write. It took 30 minutes to perform a full Ti Backup to SD.
On reading mp3 files, I noticed lag bringing up album art in Samsung music player with cache disabled.
With the 633x chip, and same full backup, I got 17 minutes backup time in Ti Backup.
On reading mp3, hardly any lag with album art in Samsung music player and cache disabled.
I assume the biggest issue is write speeds on the Ti backup test. As the 633x chip has 2x the speed for writes.
Seeing how my chip is working well, you may find a 600x chip will work just as good for less money. After all there is not much difference in speeds between the 600x and 633x chips at this time. Mostly due to write speeds. Getting a 65+ MB/s write speed is more critical than getting 90+ read.

OK, it has been some time since I posted...
Here is my update!
Ti Backup has been my sole source for testing, as my backups have been timed and consistent.
As for placing apps on the SD card, speeds are much better than expected. In some cases faster than having them loaded to the system.
Just there is no way to beat the speeds for backing up from system as there seems to be a bottle neck with the internal data channel and SD card. It shows up even more so with OTG connection. Could be the driver not hardware for SD slot, the USB2 connection will be limited as seen in OTG testing. Once I have 4.4.x installed from OTA, I can make a better run at testing SD slot performance.
GT-N5110 & GT-N5120 - 64GB 633x on board, Status Official on SafeRooted OEM ROMs with Wanam Xposed and RootCloak. The only way to fly 8+ hours!
This badboy don't play with Play & Triangle away!

gooberdude said:
I have no real data as android does not have a good set of tools for proper testing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android has several great tools for testing SD cards. SD Tools, A1 SD Bench, SD Card Tester. You can test a number of different ways. They're definitely better than just timing a backup.

dontsurf said:
Android has several great tools for testing SD cards. SD Tools, A1 SD Bench, SD Card Tester. You can test a number of different ways. They're definitely better than just timing a backup.
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Well if you place a full back up on SD and also have apps and large files on SD as well, you are getting the best test as far as I am concerned.
Real world performance vs synthetic benchmarks has always been a pain in my side.
Giving such a review should hold up over numbers from bench mark apps. I scoff at numbers, as they are skewed into one thing or another. Just like Intel getting bigger numbers over AMD, Yet, AMD ran faster for my real world experience.
I'm old school, real world or no world for me! Its a wonder why I bother with the internet, as it is too virtual for any existence. HA!
GT-N5110 & GT-N5120 - 64GB 633x on board, Status Official on SafeRooted OEM ROMs with Wanam Xposed and RootCloak. The only way to fly 8+ hours!
This badboy don't play with Play & Triangle away!

gooberdude said:
Well if you place a full back up on SD and also have apps and large files on SD as well, you are getting the best test as far as I am concerned.
Real world performance vs synthetic benchmarks has always been a pain in my side.
Giving such a review should hold up over numbers from bench mark apps. I scoff at numbers, as they are skewed into one thing or another. Just like Intel getting bigger numbers over AMD, Yet, AMD ran faster for my real world experience.
I'm old school, real world or no world for me! Its a wonder why I bother with the internet, as it is too virtual for any existence. HA!
GT-N5110 & GT-N5120 - 64GB 633x on board, Status Official on SafeRooted OEM ROMs with Wanam Xposed and RootCloak. The only way to fly 8+ hours!
This badboy don't play with Play & Triangle away!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The point of benchmarking is to put the system through the same tests under the same circumstances and give equipment and equal footing. That's probably not what you're doing with titanium backup. There's a bunch of variables that could skew your results when you just time it like that. Without a proper benchmark is probably as valuable as reading the max read writes from the packet.

dontsurf said:
The point of benchmarking is to put the system through the same tests under the same circumstances and give equipment and equal footing. That's probably not what you're doing with titanium backup. There's a bunch of variables that could skew your results when you just time it like that. Without a proper benchmark is probably as valuable as reading the max read writes from the packet.
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Click to collapse
Wha??? Now freak'n way dude! I know I have been in the business for 40 freak'n years. Cache, and background services always screw up benchmarks, and there is no way to make equal be equal.
As for my tests... I have 3 gb of apps and data on system. 1 gb of data on SD, and 300mb of apps on SD. Do the math, a full backup on Ti making the backups on SD, will allow both random read writes which are critical, and sequential read/writes as a mix. What I stated from the beginning all being equal moving from a fast 30MB/s card to 633x allowed for cutting my time almost in half.
I have done, 5 tests back and forth and the times are all the same. Seeing is believing since I have already noted, disabling cache made Samsung music player slow at reloading album art, while the 633x chip acts like cache is enabled.
Again do the math... I doubled write speed from chip specs, and got results along with showing reads are much faster by how the apps function.

A whole industry disagrees with you, but whatever.