Hi!
So this will be probably get locked and I will be banned again
Anyhow I just want to post some thoughts about the whole license / GPL issues here on XDA Developers Forum?
First of all why is this an Developers Forum when I see only posts about announcements of ROM's? Making announcements of roms is for me not really a developers communication forum. It looks more like an forum to advertise your released work. Seriously guys roadmaps of what will come in a dev forum? Post it in your own Forum it is not in the right place here.
Also banning me because I have "Warez" in my roms? What about rom cookers including WMA support and so on? I am sure you do not have any licenses to do that in your illegal roms.
Just making a point, you can ban me now again. Because yes this is an alt of Feeyo.
Why did you take down your whole site?Guilty much?
using an alt while temp-banned ?
Why must you make this so difficult?
We gave you a TEMP 30 day ban and you continue to run around it with Sock puppies.
Just to clarify the OP is Feeyo and since his ban we have been constantly banning sock puppies that he keeps creating to avoid his ban. NOW, a decision has been made to elevate his ban to a Permanent ban because he continues to ignore and disrespect the rules here at XDA.
It's quite sad when you're going through someones For Sale thread and you see people crapping all over it. This used to be such a great site back in the days when it was just Windows Mobile phones. Everyone listened to the rules and no one really crapped on peoples threads just for the hell of it.
I really hope that XDA either,
1.) Implements more moderators into the section.
2.) Updates the rules in the XDA Marketplace.
It's sad to see the kind of state that XDA has fallen to over the years with the addition of Windows Phone & Android devices and the members it has brought to this community.
With that said, I hope someone in the moderation staff / XDA staff can read this and start implementing some changes because it's like a hurricane has hit the Marketplace and looks quite unprofessional.
mbudden said:
It's quite sad when you're going through someones For Sale thread and you see people crapping all over it. This used to be such a great site back in the days when it was just Windows Mobile phones. Everyone listened to the rules and no one really crapped on peoples threads just for the hell of it.
I really hope that XDA either,
1.) Implements more moderators into the section.
2.) Updates the rules in the XDA Marketplace.
It's sad to see the kind of state that XDA has fallen to over the years with the addition of Windows Phone & Android devices and the members it has brought to this community.
With that said, I hope someone in the moderation staff / XDA staff can read this and start implementing some changes because it's like a hurricane has hit the Marketplace and looks quite unprofessional.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We are in the process of bringing in some changes to the MP including a feedback system.
Still, this site is outrageously large, so we need you to report anything that shouldn't be happening. If it's people doing the old "PM sent" thing, just report it. They won't be eligible to use the new feedback system though if they do that...
Any specific issues?
All,
I've decided that rather than start attacking some of the forum users whose conduct I don't agree with, I'd write an opinion and a suggestion.
Let me start by saying, that I love XDA. Before I became a member, I spent countless hours reading through threads on these forums. Admittedly, prior to discovering the Nexus One I was an iPhone user, and apple fanboy. I can honestly say that XDA helped cure me of that.
I am not a developer. I use these forums as a method of learning how to enhance my phone; to build a working knowledge of Android; with a hope to one day I will be able to repay the Devs who helped me with original work of my own. Lately, as many people have already stated, I've noticed that the quality of discussion in many forum threads has gone down significantly. The mods do an excellent job of keeping threads on topic, and cleaning useless posts, however, I think its getting to be too much for them. This is my attempt to provide advice to new users, and to suggest a possible course of action to help correct the conduct that is a cancer on this great site.
I've seen threads where Dev's are threatened if they don't release ROMs, where people demand ETAs. Team Hacksung, who worked tirelessly to release CM7 for the SGS2 actually had to threaten to leave XDA to bring order to their development thread. I've also seen threads degrade into rascism and discrimination, threats of violence and bigotry. None of this is acceptable, and will serve no other goal than forcing developers to leave XDA.
People need to understand a few things:
[*] Dev's work is done on their own free-time
[*] Dev's work is done for no compensation other than the gratitude of their peers and the occasional donation.
[*] Dev's are under no obligation to release ANYTHING to the members of XDA - If they don't feel their work is ready, or they aren't ready to share it, you have no right to demand it released.
[*] Access to Dev work is a privilege that can easily be revoked; NOT A RIGHT.
In addition to the excellent and trying job that the moderators already undertake, I suggest the following apply to anyone not recognized as a developer:
[*] There is a 3 strike rule with regards to posting in each development section. Any posts deemed to be off-topic, not-relevant, hateful, malicious, rascist, etc should be deemed a strike. I would not include obvious jokes, sincere mistakes, attempts to be helpful, etc as a strike. My goal is not to discourage participation, but to discourage comments designed to be harmful.
[*]Strike 1 is a warning, Strike 2 is a one week ban from posting within the development forums, strike 3 is a permanent ban from posting within the development forums.
Moderators would be responsible for determining what is a strike based on a pre-determined criteria.
My 2c, take it or leave it..
C0mbe
"In a perfect world..."
github said:
"In a perfect world..."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is an internet forum, not the world... you can be as punitive as you like...
Sent from my SCH-I510 using XDA Premium App
I think your suggestions are too lenient. In the six years I've been here, the mods have only gotten more and more lax in the rules with the influx of Android users. It used to be that if you said something retarded or offensive, it was an automatic ban. Now, it seems as though it takes an act of congress to get an abusive user removed. Don't worry, though. Their are some changes coming soon that will help out tremendously.
Rule with an Iron Fist!!!
I agree and it's quite simple. Have respect and decency toward others and remember this is a "family oriented" site/community and that needs to be respected. I have stated my advice elsewhere in the forums that XDA needs to start ruling with an "IRON FIST" and keep this site enjoyabe and respectable as it should be. I stand behind that and always will. It is the best way to run the forums otherwise it will turn into a battleground of idiots envoking arguments, name calling, etc. I personally take offense to people who attack others in the forums and elsewhere on XDA. I have probably gotten a little out of line in the past a couple of times but that was due to others' attacks and flaming.
If you feel you should be allowed freedom of speech and explicit visual interpretation/expressionon on XDA, then this isn't the community for you. XDA holds the right to moderate it's site and forums as they see fit. In this case XDA chooses to run a family friendly site instead of a free-for-all slugfest site and I'm in favor of that. This is not directed to anyone in particular, nor do I pass judgement on anybody it's just my thoughts. Leave the hate/foul mouth comments in your world not here @XDA.
I think XDA is the best "go-to" site for all smartphone development needs and resources and that is how everybody should want to keep it. I bet most of you will agree. Do your part by helping and respecting others AT ALL TIMES. Please don't post hate comments, intentional troll provoking/explicit behavior/expressions, hateful/attitude remarks here at XDA.
Thanks for reading.
C0mbe said:
This is an internet forum, not the world... you can be as punitive as you like...
Sent from my SCH-I510 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't want to elaborate, but meh I'm bored. You are not the first to post about this, and won't be the last. It will get buried, and life will go on. I mean, there was already a thread about this in this very forum... and it's one of the top 5 right now.
It's a world wide forum. People will post stuff you don't like. PM a moderator and tell them about it and move on. Or use the ignore list. There are new users both new to phones AND the internet/computers. They will make mistakes and ask questions (ETAs and such). At the end of the day, it's the internet. Does it really bother you so much that someone "demanded" an ETA? Made a disrespectful comment?
An old saying works wonders here. If I had $1 for every "XDA is dying" post, I'd be very wealthy.
P.S. I also heard that the sky is falling.
cajunflavoredbob said:
I think your suggestions are too lenient. In the six years I've been here, the mods have only gotten more and more lax in the rules with the influx of Android users. It used to be that if you said something retarded or offensive, it was an automatic ban. Now, it seems as though it takes an act of congress to get an abusive user removed. Don't worry, though. Their are some changes coming soon that will help out tremendously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, bans! bans! more bans! RAWR BANHAMMER. That's the way to encourage growth. Everyone knows that a police state is what is needed.
github said:
I didn't want to elaborate, but meh I'm bored. You are not the first to post about this, and won't be the last. It will get buried, and life will go on. I mean, there was already a thread about this in this very forum... and it's one of the top 5 right now.
It's a world wide forum. People will post stuff you don't like. PM a moderator and tell them about it and move on. Or use the ignore list. There are new users both new to phones AND the internet/computers. They will make mistakes and ask questions (ETAs and such). At the end of the day, it's the internet. Does it really bother you so much that someone "demanded" an ETA? Made a disrespectful comment?
An old saying works wonders here. If I had $1 for every "XDA is dying" post, I'd be very wealthy.
P.S. I also heard that the sky is falling.
Yes, bans! bans! more bans! RAWR BANHAMMER. That's the way to encourage growth. Everyone knows that a police state is what is needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This has nothing to do with site growth. It never has. If you break the rules, you get punished. It's that simple. You can try ignoring useless or inflaming comments all you want, but all that does is allow the behavior to continue. Obviously, catering to the behavior and becoming more lenient didn't work. The result is that the mods are now beginning to crack down harder again. This is the direction the site is now going. This site is about developers, not troubleshooting.
Users should learn manners and respect or go somewhere else. That's the main point. It isn't our job here to teach people the manners their parents could not. That's why the site isn't named XDA-Babysittingservice.com.
It the world wide web there are bound to be idiots out there. If they start banning these people there be just me and the mods left!!
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA Premium App
github said:
At the end of the day, it's the internet. Does it really bother you so much that someone "demanded" an ETA? Made a disrespectful comment?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, each and every demand for an ETA or disrespectful comment does not bother me that much, and of course I understand that its the internet. Its very easy to behave like an idiot when you are hiding behind pixels. Its really the totality of the circumstances that I am referring to. The object of XDA is for individuals to share development information with the common goal of improving Android phones. If the purpose of the site is lost in all the ETAs and disrespectful comments, then what is the point? Certainly, the point is not to lose developers...
github said:
P.S. I also heard that the sky is falling.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Call me whatever you like, your admission that there are multiple complaints like mine on each sub-forum is proof that there is a problem with member conduct on the site. And I did say that my OP was my own opinion, and my 2c.
github said:
Yes, bans! bans! more bans! RAWR BANHAMMER. That's the way to encourage growth. Everyone knows that a police state is what is needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who says you need a police state? I'm merely talking about adding rules to encourage and enforce order on the forums. And no one wants growth for the sake of growth. A small site that is efficient and has a high number of contributing members will always be better than a large site where the sheer volume of junk posts dilute the contributing members.
Plus, at the end of the day, all anyone really has on the internet is a voice. Thus, the ban remains the most effective method of controlling poor conduct.
It appears you guys have not read the site admins latest announcement...I advice u do
TheRomMistress said:
It appears you guys have not read the site admins latest announcement...I advice u do
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's fine and all. But does it address the time it takes to actually report problem posts (instead of just complain about them)? Having to PM forum mods that either gave up on your forum, or don't even visit that forum isn't exactly encouraging.
Or will the forums stop becoming void of moderators (like over in EVO 4G land, where I can't remember the last time we had moderator participation besides the banhammer here and there, or moved threads that I report). Will we start seeing more moderator participation?
Of course, my last posts here were worded to spark conversation (and that they did). I am happy to see this latest development, but still feel that it falls short of what is needed. Hopefully there is more in the works.
github said:
That's fine and all. But does it address the time it takes to actually report problem posts (instead of just complain about them)? Having to PM forum mods that either gave up on your forum, or don't even visit that forum isn't exactly encouraging.
Or will the forums stop becoming void of moderators (like over in EVO 4G land, where I can't remember the last time we had moderator participation besides the banhammer here and there, or moved threads that I report). Will we start seeing more moderator participation?
Of course, my last posts here were worded to spark conversation (and that they did). I am happy to see this latest development, but still feel that it falls short of what is needed. Hopefully there is more in the works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The report system is being reworked. The site improvements will take some time to roll out fully. Things are going back to the earlier days here. Everyone needs to learn how to act right or reap what they sow.
github said:
That's fine and all. But does it address the time it takes to actually report problem posts (instead of just complain about them)? Having to PM forum mods that either gave up on your forum, or don't even visit that forum isn't exactly encouraging.
Or will the forums stop becoming void of moderators (like over in EVO 4G land, where I can't remember the last time we had moderator participation besides the banhammer here and there, or moved threads that I report). Will we start seeing more moderator participation?
Of course, my last posts here were worded to spark conversation (and that they did). I am happy to see this latest development, but still feel that it falls short of what is needed. Hopefully there is more in the works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cajunflavoredbob said:
The report system is being reworked. The site improvements will take some time to roll out fully. Things are going back to the earlier days here. Everyone needs to learn how to act right or reap what they sow.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What he said
Thanks. I actually moved this into it's own post/question, as it is kind of offtopic from what OP was discussing.
we need an area for general discussion. just redirecting us to an apple fan site won't do. i understand the value of keeping these threads organized but there has to be some outlet. i propose every device has an unrestricted general sub-forum or something along that line.
I understand what you're saying, but iPhone threads are generally closed because there'll always be people who try to start an apple vs android flame war.
We don't need or want those kind of arguments on here because they all get out of hand.
That's why threads of that kind will get closed and the OP be directed to XDAs sister site.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
Why don't you check out our sister site http://iphone-developers.com? You can import your current XDA account and use it over there.
and how they have been censoring, deleting, and banning, for the dumbest reasons (or none at all).
Stop locking threads and pruning the opinions out of your followers and developers.
Things in this part of the web should be open discussion, open minded, and free sharing of Ideas, content (not copyrighted). That's what makes open sourced people who we are.
stop closing things in.
You have already lost some really good developers, and your reputation has lowered.
SMH at how things have been moderated around here.
rant over.
cocokasper said:
and how they have been censoring, deleting, and banning, for the dumbest reasons (or none at all).
Stop locking threads and pruning the opinions out of your followers and developers.
Things in this part of the web should be open discussion, open minded, and free sharing of Ideas, content (not copyrighted). That's what makes open sourced people who we are.
stop closing things in.
You have already lost some really good developers, and your reputation has lowered.
SMH at how things have been moderated around here.
rant over.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Calm down Mate..
I know what you are feeling now. But just think on behalf of XDA too.
Every community have few rules and regulations which must be followed. Coz without of that, structures of that community is like a body without Bones. So, If banning is against the rules you may contact any member of Sr. MOD or any member of MOD committee or direct to Moderator committee after that. Even you aren't fully satisfied with the decisions of both of the above, you may contact Admin directly using PM.
Open Source is Android and to protect the Open source meaning we have GPL.
So, In the last I would say, In XDA, We learn more than sharing. But sharing must not overwhelming than learning.. Rules are Rules and must be followed at any conditions. But I know, Changing is everything, and for any suggestion you may Write here.
Hope I help you.. Pls revert if you are still in fix..
We don't ban, moderate or delete for no reason. It's only done if something or someone breaks our rules.
If it looks like we're doing this to censor opinions, it's usually because those type of threads turn into troll and flame wars. And I speak from experience.
if you think we do it because we have nothing better to do, you're very much mistaken. We try to let things go on their own as long as possible, but too many times, moderator intervention is required to stop things getting out of control.
the_scotsman said:
We don't ban, moderate or delete for no reason. It's only done if something or someone breaks our rules.
If it looks like we're doing this to censor opinions, it's usually because those type of threads turn into troll and flame wars. And I speak from experience.
if you think we do it because we have nothing better to do, you're very much mistaken. We try to let things go on their own as long as possible, but too many times, moderator intervention is required to stop things getting out of control.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seriously? The moderators are closing the best of the threads on OT, but what about this thread?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2412758
Senior mods, admins etc visited here and were spinning comedy. Why isn't it closed???
Sent from my Amazon Otter using xda app-developers app
androvista said:
Seriously? The moderators are closing the best of the threads on OT, but what about this thread?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2412758
Senior mods, admins etc visited here and were spinning comedy. Why isn't it closed???
Sent from my Amazon Otter using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
because its funny son
best of luck
cocokasper said:
and how they have been censoring, deleting, and banning, for the dumbest reasons (or none at all).
Stop locking threads and pruning the opinions out of your followers and developers.
Things in this part of the web should be open discussion, open minded, and free sharing of Ideas, content (not copyrighted). That's what makes open sourced people who we are.
stop closing things in.
You have already lost some really good developers, and your reputation has lowered.
SMH at how things have been moderated around here.
rant over.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have to learn that while most of the moderators here are halfway decent, some have nothing better to do than to piss people off. If you were the victim of that, xda has no sympathy for you. I've seen what you're describing happen some time ago, but you'll just have to fly low and try to avoid it. If your posts are deleted, you'll just have to spend more time re-explaining the context in the thread in question where your posts were deleted. That's just the way it goes.
Best of luck.
b
androvista said:
Seriously? The moderators are closing the best of the threads on OT, but what about this thread?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2412758
Senior mods, admins etc visited here and were spinning comedy. Why isn't it closed???
Sent from my Amazon Otter using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The OT threads were closed because they became a haven for 10 post spammers, not because the mods were killing your fun.